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@harveywabbit9541

3 жыл бұрын

An easy refutation of the biblical madness is revealed in The Science of the Bible or Hebrew Mythology, by Milton Woolley.

@elminster298

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, I watched it as well. I don't remember exactly where I realized he was not an atheist, but I think it was his answer about the origin of the universe.

@nicolasandre9886

3 жыл бұрын

@Ryan Flynn : it might not be a promising lead, the point of god is to be eternal, so that by definition he would escape the question of his own origin.

@_Tp__

3 жыл бұрын

which would be a special pleading fallacy would it not?

@nicolasandre9886

3 жыл бұрын

@@_Tp__ : it absolutely is. God is just a placeholder to avoid answering 'I don't know' to the question of the origin of the unvierse.

After i declared myself an atheist, my father said that he finally understood when a friend of his said that she would have preferred that her sons died than seeing them going further away from God. So basically my father told me that he wished that i died early as a christian, rather than live longly as an atheist. So much love in christianity.

@DrFouFou

Жыл бұрын

Some Christians are cult-like…

@clevernamerighthere9240

Жыл бұрын

i dont think he should have said what he said. but you have to see it from his perspective. to him there is life after death. to him he'd rather youd stop living now and experience bliss for eternity over you living through the ups and down s of life and then living in unimaginable horror for eternity. he rather you be safe sooner, then in pain longer. that is love.

@sebasblos1

Жыл бұрын

@@clevernamerighthere9240 but in anyone else eyes is just a big f*ck you

@htran18

Жыл бұрын

@@clevernamerighthere9240 that is not love.

@sloanekuria3249

Жыл бұрын

@@clevernamerighthere9240 No child has to see it from their parents perspective, that's called PARENTING. The OP's father abandoned his role as parent when he treated his child with this hateful cruelty. Actually, according to Eli Weisel, the indifference the father shows to his child's life is worse than hatred. I agree.

Imagine a debate between an atheist and a christian, while both playing the role of the other without knowing the opponent does the same.

@Dianasaurthemelonlord7777

3 жыл бұрын

Funny it would be

@benwil6048

3 жыл бұрын

Lol

@humphryshan9494

3 жыл бұрын

it would probably be better than a real atheist and christian debating lol

@vishvarupa7948

3 жыл бұрын

Hey, that's a good idea, someone should do that.

@independentRestorationServices

3 жыл бұрын

You sound high. But seriously, that would be awesome; I’d watch that.

Him: uses a ton of atheist arguments One of the Christian students: that actually makes sense, I think I’m an atheist now. Him: wait-

@AC_memes

Жыл бұрын

Mission failed

@oof9762

Жыл бұрын

Mission failed successfully

@nathanlabrador7664

Жыл бұрын

*Task failed successfully*

@1mol831

Жыл бұрын

Emotion is used mainly for solid believers.

@25dollarbill24

Жыл бұрын

LOL @ your nonsensical phrase, _"atheist arguments"._

I’m a closeted atheist in a strict Muslim household. Thank you for your videos, they really inspire me to keep going on :)

@SMAB2007

Жыл бұрын

fellow closeted atheist in a Muslim household here; my closet is a bit translucent at this point but I'm just trying to ease my parents into the idea that they won't go to hell because I wasn't Muslim myself. I wish there were more atheist content about Islam from ex-Mus.

@Router-we2eh

11 ай бұрын

@@SMAB2007 I believe there is one channel called the Apostate Prophet, if you haven't already seen his videos.

@SMAB2007

11 ай бұрын

@@Router-we2eh thank you!

@SMAB2007

10 ай бұрын

@@jouglexander my parents are extremists who have repeatedly said that apostates should be stoned to death.

@wbwam7710

10 ай бұрын

Christian household here, my parents wanted me to join a conservative or christian club at my college when they saw all the liberal and LGBT stuff

The one thing Sean couldn’t do that an atheist will, is to say “I don’t know.” He *had* to give an answer to everything, no matter how cringe-worthy was the answer.

@aazhie

3 жыл бұрын

yes this is so annoying... both religious and atheist scientists can say "we don't know and we may never know" but Sean really cant?? so wierd

@justincarroll1836

3 жыл бұрын

I like knowing how things work but I'd rather be honest than wrongly assert things. That's a very succinct point that I can appreciate

@Salsuero

3 жыл бұрын

I believe he was attempting to give answers so they could be rejected... debunked... countered. If you only say I don't know, which is an entirely acceptable answer, you don't give anyone fuel to defeat you with a counterargument. Christianity, among other religions, refuses to say I don't know itself because that's an open door to criticism since they have to know or else their beliefs break down under scrutiny. There must be an answer for everything so it can't be undercut. But that's not how atheism works. Atheism doesn't have to know any answers. It just refuses to agree with terrible, incomplete, inconsistent, illogical answers in an attempt to provide one. They can't reconcile that. And that's why it's so difficult to change their minds -- because they aren't open to change -- they have all the answers already.

@justincarroll1836

3 жыл бұрын

@@Salsuero I think that is a great point. Very Aron Ra but I agree

@benbae5530

3 жыл бұрын

sure , atheist Just give in to where the evidence points? Ignorance is bliss my friend. Ciao

The students should have known this guy was a Christian. He never says "I don't know".

@TheConvivialCopywriter

3 жыл бұрын

Without context, or as someone in that audience, I'd like to believe I'd smell his bullshit from a mile away.

@vincegonzalez2171

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheConvivialCopywriter I would just be confused. I think one or two of his answers were fine, but the majority of them didn't really make any sense. As an atheist, I had no idea what he was talking about.

@TheConvivialCopywriter

3 жыл бұрын

@@vincegonzalez2171 just his vocabulary alone would have tipped me off that he was full of shit.

@AWindy94

3 жыл бұрын

@@TheConvivialCopywriter Also, his voice, with a lot of his answers, sounded like they ended in a question mark. You know when you have that upwards tone your voice when asking a question? He had that at the end of a lot of answers. Definitely a red flag.

@TheConvivialCopywriter

3 жыл бұрын

@@AWindy94 exactly, and let's not forget his body language, he looks really uncomfortable "roll playing" as an Athiest.

Can we mention how disturbing it is that there are essentially anti-atheism classes at some high schools.

@mpleandre

Жыл бұрын

Just like there are anti religious ones. Why don't we just open the gates for eveyone to have debates? Oh, true... Everyone is unreasonable.

@iduncareanimore

Жыл бұрын

wait you had anti religious classes?? education in america seems fun

@25dollarbill24

Жыл бұрын

_"Can we mention how disturbing it is that there are essentially anti-atheism classes at some high schools."_ What do you mean by your phrase, _"anti-atheism classes at some high schools"?_ Please name and cite the locations of some of the high schools you are talking about, so we can look up whatever it is you are talking about. Please tell us whence you came up with the idea of saying _"there are essentially anti-atheism classes at some high schools"._ Merely from your imagination? Have fun with your inability to respond rationally to this request, and further demonstrating that your OP is a pile of trash and product of illiteracy that even you know you have no hope of defending! 🤣

@MorganHorse

Жыл бұрын

@@25dollarbill24 literally every high school that teaches “apologetics”…you acted like that was going to be hard

@25dollarbill24

Жыл бұрын

@@MorganHorse I asked you: _"Please name and cite the locations of some of the high schools you are talking about, so we can look up whatever it is you are talking about."_ You: ** Why can't you answer my request?

Every time I watch this video I always have the same two thoughts a second after each other: 1) that's actually pretty dope! They're trying to represent the other side as best they can without actually inviting an atheist! 2) wait... why not just actually invite an atheist?

@MrVeps1

10 ай бұрын

Obviously you can't expose those impressionable youths to an actual atheist, because then there wouldn't be a happy denouement where the guest basically goes "Ignore every argument I put forth for atheism, it was all disingenuous and false!"

@soliniv1411

10 ай бұрын

A real atheist would open their eyes

@user-pc7hb9hi9j

10 ай бұрын

why would he feel the need to be so subversive? my only explanation is to completely control the narrative because he could not defend himself without the strawman.

@mrpop9725

8 ай бұрын

Answer to 2, their answers might be a bit too convincing

@REDACTED-USER

7 ай бұрын

To be fair an not every atheist is the best representative for atheism so I am glad they're at least trying to cover that gap with a single mock atheist that can answer most of their questions, but I would rather them just bring in a well spoken one

His atheist arguments still sound like he is a Christian. It’s odd.

@SgtD85

3 жыл бұрын

Not odd. Can't trully protray someone else unless you can actually understand them. Wolf in sheep's clothing.

@kateofone

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah but at least he does not sound simple minded like Christian Sean

@adrenochrome_slurper

3 жыл бұрын

His body language screams preacher.

@christaylor9095

3 жыл бұрын

It doesn't seem that odd to me. Pretty much what I would expect.

@SgtD85

3 жыл бұрын

@benji X cool story bro. Prove it.

If a Christian ever figured out how to convincingly portray an atheist I’m pretty sure they’d just be an atheist lol

@lockevalentine997

2 жыл бұрын

Lol, and this is why we have yet to see one.

@douglasdixon8027

2 жыл бұрын

Spot on!

@MyNameIsChristBringsASword

2 жыл бұрын

I was an atheist so I know how you think already fool - and by the way, you're going to hell without faith in what Jesus did for us.

@Steef_Lee

2 жыл бұрын

@@MyNameIsChristBringsASword well at least you got the hatred and immaturity down like a true Christian.

@MyNameIsChristBringsASword

2 жыл бұрын

@@Steef_Lee poor thing your feelings are hurt. Did my free speech upset you?

I'd honestly be so upset if I was talking to someone claiming to be an authority figure in a subject I am trying to understand more only for them to reveal it was an act and they didn't believe a thing they were saying. I came to the class with trust and now I'm going to not only have less answers to my posed questions, but I'm going to be skeptical about speakers and that class going forward. This only has the opposite effect of what he wanted.

@seand.g423

Жыл бұрын

It... it _really_ didn't... This was just another Wastelander Fundie shitboot tightening the anti-intellectual trap even further and letting their own bullshit self-righteousness pat them on the back where their own """piety""" would supposedly forbid them doing even _that_ much themselves...

@yannickm1396

Жыл бұрын

Don't ideas stand un there own? Can't you separate the massage from the messenger?

@bskinner22rianna

11 ай бұрын

​@@yannickm1396ideas don't stand when created disingenuously. I don't think a dude that admits using word salad is being genuine about the ideas they're talking about.

@hankschwiebert1457

5 ай бұрын

@@bskinner22rianna From what I have heard, Sean presented the atheistic arguments better than most atheists would. Tbh, I think peoples jimmies are getting russled a bit too much over this. Sean did a good job of not just presenting strawmen arguments, he clearly stumped his students

@Mehki227

3 ай бұрын

​@hankschwiebert145 No he didn't. He didn't sound like an atheist at all.

Something that stuck with me was how when that girl said "I didn't understand anything you were talking about, why would they go through all that instead of just believing in god?" And I'm floored by it. Instead of taking it as an opportunity to study something they don't know about... they think "it's so much easier to give up and just believe in god". Congrats... that's exactly why you're stuck in a cult. This is why your own bible calls you sheep.

@toekneeheadless2393

3 ай бұрын

I do want to point out that a cult is a religion that worships a man instead of a God. Christianity believes in a God, not a man. Be careful using words that could be insulting, there is no reason, even if the other person is wrong or mistreats you.

@Othique

3 ай бұрын

@@toekneeheadless2393 Jesus is a man. As much as christians want to scream otherwise. Not to mention the millions of christian cult leaders who proclaim to be prophets they've had over the centuries. Furthermore - you're wrong. You might want to look up what defines a cult... and yes it can be the veneration of an entity such as a "god". Cult = a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object. Christianity is a cult.. the deadliest one on earth to date. And deserves to be insulted.

@pandamandimax

3 ай бұрын

100% wrong. The definition of cult is "a system of religious veneration and devotion directed toward a particular figure or object." With the added pejoratives of generally being destructive or controlling. Has zero to do with whether the cult worships a god, a person, a person who is also a god (Jesus), a tree, an idea, etc.

@uzuwi9782

3 ай бұрын

its unthinkable for some religious people that people want to believe the truth instead of believe the most convenient lie

@HungryWarden

2 ай бұрын

@@toekneeheadless2393that isn’t in the definition of a cult. And even so, Jesus was a man at one point.

"The beginning of the universe would imply God exists" said no atheist ever.

@hopeahooper

3 жыл бұрын

Omg, I thought I was the only one thinking that 💀💀

@matthewhenry9044

3 жыл бұрын

You recorded the accounts of every atheists ever? May I see?

@adamx9793

3 жыл бұрын

If a beginning implies a creator, then a creator with no beginning implies a creator too. God is an infinite regress argument that doesn’t work in the real world. Atheism wins.

@matthewhenry9044

3 жыл бұрын

@@adamx9793 Who's to say that the beginning didn't start by properties coming together to create something completely New and now we argue as to what we call this and what's it capable of and Why don't we know?

@TorianTammas

3 жыл бұрын

@@matthewhenry9044 Who created that thing? It doesn't answer anything it creates a billion more questions. Was it a five year old playing on her mother's computer create universes?

Pretending to be an atheist: Nonsensical arguments Revealed as a christian: See, atheism doesn't make sense.

@onedaya_martian1238

3 жыл бұрын

A christian lies...jesus took the punishment... that's how they "win" in their mind.

@PraiseTheFSMonster

3 жыл бұрын

@James Patrick That was his point. To be believable enough so that the Christian kids would think he was actually an atheist, but still bad arguments and nonsensical if you actually think about them.

@digitalian99

3 жыл бұрын

i would change "nonsensical arguments" into "not using the actual atheist argument but trying to pose as one to deliberately mislead people" argument yup, too wordy but more accurate

@digitalian99

3 жыл бұрын

@James Patrick they were nonsensical in the sense that they are not actual arguments by atheist, he actually "uncleverly" misrepresents the arguments

@covfefe_drumpfh

3 жыл бұрын

The way this pretend atheist described this phony path to atheism should've been an easy way to tell that this man was not a real atheist. It just sounded way too cliché to be believable.

"Sometimes it sucks to be an atheist here." Tell me about it! Quite often I just pretend to be a Christian because I don't want to start an incredibly annoying debate about it. I just pretend to be Christian and never talk about it because I don't like being on the receiving end of ridicule and hate. Even though Sean can never truly 100% represent an atheist, it is refreshing to see a Christian who can treat us with respect and empathy, and at least tries to understand.

@DRKLRD-kv4cm

8 ай бұрын

Does people around you gives a damn about your belief system so much?🫠🫠🫠

@stephenpowstinger733

4 ай бұрын

I’m not sure how enthusiastic Sean’s “pretend” atheism is. As pointed out, his “atheist” arguments are weak and diluted from the philosophical original argument.

As a Christian, I have never watched a atheist video and it was very interesting. Thank you

@ddiamond1572

Жыл бұрын

You know what? More comments like this please. Just because people might not agree with you doesn't make you an enemy. Good man.

@Arquea_Lucus_Wolven

7 ай бұрын

Hope ya enjoyed and are doin' well! ^-^

@bradiedean7466

3 ай бұрын

Thanks for being respectful about it!

@uzuwi9782

3 ай бұрын

watch more. challenge your faith

@wingdinggaster6737

3 ай бұрын

Just here to kindly remind you that if the next word starts with a vowel, you use “an” instead of “a” You have “a belief” but you have “an idea”

The biggest problem with the “fine tuning” argument is that the universe is very clearly NOT fine tuned for life. 99.99%+ of the universe is extremely unsuited for life. Even our tiny planet has vast regions that are unsuited to life. I don’t get how anyone thinks this is a good argument.

@cfromnowhere

3 жыл бұрын

There are examples of not-so-fine-tuned worlds at our doorstep. Venus, Earth and Mars are all in Sun's habitable zone, yet only Earth has conditions that allow complex lives to exist and evolve. There may have been very simple lives on Mars, but that's all.

@XavierGobble

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly another reason why I don't think the fine-tuning argument works is that if the universe wasn't fine-tuned then we would have no way to perceive it meaning. Our perception would lead us to believe that all universes can support life because those are the only ones that we can observe

@EskChan19

3 жыл бұрын

Right. It's like someone once said: We're a puddle of water, fitting so neatly into that sinkhole on the road that we think someone must have created this sinkhole specifically for us, because how could we fit so perfectly into it otherwise? They think that the human is the end of all means and everything was made to fit us, when in reality, we were just the most successfull in fitting into surrounding we were thrown into. We just adapted to life on earth the best, that doesn't mean the earth was made for us.

@kornclown7815

3 жыл бұрын

right these people just want to believe what they want to

@jtveg

3 жыл бұрын

Yes indeed, the universe seems to be *NOT* finely tuned for life at all but what is even worse for the theist is that they are by implication admitting that a universe can *only* exist in this one precise way which limits an omnipotent god that theoretically could make a universe with any constants or any way he wanted. If anything fine tuning is perfectly consistent with naturalism and is something the theist needs *to explain away.*

"If Christian Sean can't easily debunk Atheist Sean's argument, maybe Sean would actually end up being an Atheist." This gets to the core of the problem with this exercise.

@isidoreaerys8745

3 жыл бұрын

Our little man’s all grown up now

@Nerobyrne

2 жыл бұрын

I actually used to be a Christian and have the same objections to Christianity that I do now. I used to think "well I'm sure all the big Christian thinkers know the answers!" But when I found out that they actually didn't, I stopped believing.

@ianrose6218

2 жыл бұрын

@@Nerobyrne What I like to say is that so many sects of Christianity hijacked the idea of universal respect, made it so someone had to believe in every story from an ancient book alongside following those standards, then failed to reconcile those two things when contradictions arose. It's one of the most common reasons I see people abandoning various forms of Christianity when they look at it with a critical eye. If belief helps someone feel like they're not alone in a universe that doesn't care about them, that's great! I just wish the die-hard ones would realize that some of us believed at one point, then felt as though we were being left in the dark when we dared to ask a question with no clear answer that we were simply supposed to "have faith" about.

@isidoreaerys8745

2 жыл бұрын

@Truth Inquisitor there is no rational version of a creator. No one believes that chemicals randomly collided together to magically create fully formed life. The first life forms were little more than small bits of replicating polymers called ribozymes. Actually the only reason we cannot say for certain how life began is that we now have so many scientifically demonstrated chemical pathways for abiogenesis to take place. We can’t Pick just one.

@Nerobyrne

2 жыл бұрын

@Truth Inquisitor if reality really proved God, then why wouldn't people who build things to interact with reality be honest about it? They would need to tell the people at uni that God is real and how it works, because otherwise they won't be able to do science. But the fact that I've been there and we always worked without any regard for God means that God isn't involved in science.

Even his take: "Don't be trash towards Athetists" has only one reason: To defend Christianity and to gain more influence. That's it. Maybe it has positive effects, however that's rather normal outside of the U.S.

@vermilion6966

Жыл бұрын

This. Its baffling that so many in the comments cant even see it

@skycastrum5803

Жыл бұрын

It's pretty much the same as when coming from the other side, to create the best possible outcome. Only thing is that the Christian believes the best possible outcome would be for as many people to get into heaven as possible. An atheist "best outcome" could take more forms. It could pretty much mirror the the Christian's fixation on conversion, since "the world is a better place without religion." Or it could be more of a live-and-let-live position.

From Alabama and currently in Texas just turned agnostic atheist after years of slowly realizing the truth. It's very hard in the south for non-believers and my whole family is extremely Christian I could never tell them the truth at this point. I just found your channel I just wanted to say that I really appreciate what you're doing it helps a lot.

@elgooghosent7080

Жыл бұрын

kill em

@pug8714

10 ай бұрын

Maybe I'm too northern in the south, not sure where Tennessee fits there, I haven't seen many bad Christians or anyone harass anyone for religion, then again maybe I need to go around more

@Nick-sg2gw

10 ай бұрын

@@pug8714 they're definitely a lot of good Christians to, I guess for me it's just more my close family is super Christian and very hateful but they don't even seem to realize that they are. Of course I've tried to have conversations with them about this but like I said above it's not always easy. I'm happy your experience is different from mine.

@jamesnewman8011

2 ай бұрын

The Christians who are decent toward atheists are the only Christians I see as being actual Christians. It comes down to what would Jesus do... Would Jesus be rude and mean to people who were honest about their lack, or absence, of faith? Not according to how the Bible portrays him. I have no problems with Christians and the ones who make the biggest stink about people not believing are the ones struggling the hardest to believe it themselves.

This is such a terribly stupid exercise. “Here’s what an apologists thinks an atheist sounds like.” They’d be so much better off actually having an atheist come and speak to the class. What a waste of time and back patting exercise.

@themousethatroared3371

3 жыл бұрын

Why the charade? Why not invite an actual atheist to speak for themself? Maybe because they're afraid the athiest might make more sense than apologetics and actually encourage critical thinking.

@AJenbo

3 жыл бұрын

It even sounds like they have done this before, but with the students knowing that it was role play. I wonder if they would believe that it was for real at this point if an actual atheist where to come to the school

@matthewhenry9044

3 жыл бұрын

@@AJenbo it even sounds like? He clearly says that every time before this time he does it that way but the person that invited him asked him not to...

@matthewhenry9044

3 жыл бұрын

@@themousethatroared3371 or maybe not. He doesn't even like to go in without telling him he's not really an atheists first. These kids clearly didn't like him being there very much. If a real atheist wants to do this, let them find their own way in. Why would someone that seemingly really believe in God bring in someone has the potential to lead people astray. Jesus clearly states that everyone will stumble but the ones that causes his children to do so is in for a bad time.

@zemorph42

3 жыл бұрын

@@matthewhenry9044 Why would someone who really believes in God be afraid to examine those beliefs, or allow them to be examined? Truth welcomes scrutiny; it doesn't condemn it.

"Atheist Roleplay?" Seems dishonest at best and cowardly at worst. Like, just invite an actual atheist speaker. Those exist.

@Skogles

3 жыл бұрын

Someone asked this on his video, and he states that he usually does, which like, why not just let that athiest talk?

@TorianTammas

3 жыл бұрын

They should invite a scientist and get a proper education instead of this indoctrination of fine tuning.

@icecremer

3 жыл бұрын

@@TorianTammas I think you misunderstand the intentions. They don't want to educate, they want to indoctrinate. Think about it like this. Say you want an advertisement for a your new burger. What approach would you take? A commercial with a juicy burger falling on some primo buns and it makes your mouth water. Or do you let a scientist sit there and tell you the truth about it, telling you the risks it poses, the global ramifications etc?

@clocked0

3 жыл бұрын

@@icecremer I'm certain he understood their intentions just fine. He just believes they should've actually educated, instead.

@UltimateCheetah-zs2iw

3 жыл бұрын

Unless it's a kink. "Say EVOLUTION, you sexy sinner!"

I was legitimately shocked when he brought up that story at the end. Like, I thought it was going to be a clearly fake story about how he converted someone who was coming out of the faith. But him addressing that and just letting that hang, makes me think he was telling the truth in not trying to set up a strawman, but legitimately just did it on accident.

@ichabod1370

Жыл бұрын

*By* accident; *on* purpose. English is and always has been extremely weird.

@CraftingMenace

Жыл бұрын

@@ichabod1370 Huh. Never made that mistake before, it was like 2 AM when I made that comment though.

@ichabod1370

Жыл бұрын

@@CraftingMenace Not surprising -- young people have been "correcting" the oddity of that pairing lately in their speech and writing, so I expect that "on accident; on purpose" will win out in the end, ugly as "on accident" sounds.

@CraftingMenace

Жыл бұрын

@@ichabod1370 It doesn't really matter either way, they honestly sound the same to me.

@ATTACKofthe6STRINGS

Жыл бұрын

I’ve been in church long enough in a variety of places to where I can say that stories like this one are told because they’re true, and a painful reminder of how we often fail. I think I know of 2 or 3 stories that I’ve heard told about situations regarding the way people leave or view the church. The infrequency with which the church as a body ever talks about this with this level of candidness is, to me, evidence of how these stories end up sticking with the people who have to live through them. As a Christian who has asked himself all kinds of questions regarding my faith, how I want to live it out, how the values I’ve been taught do or don’t match up with the way I’ve been taught to live them, etc, my time since college has been filled with meeting people outside the church, interacting with them, building friendships with them, etc. I don’t have any stories that stand out to me anymore, other than the ones I carry with me from my childhood, because I have my own experiences with being marginalized by the loudly religious, and because I’ve met so many people that it doesn’t stand out to me anymore. Whatever you believe about religious people, the one truth they share with normal people that applies to this situations are that the stories they tell that demonstrate how they suck tend to have the vivid detail they do because the moment stuck out and stuck with the person. An easy example on a lighter topic, with me as the subject: I was helping out with Vacation Bible School as a teen. I was playing my guitar for one of the activities and, when it ended, a girl who couldn’t have been more than 7-8 years old came up to me and asked me why I was using a pick. Not being sure what she meant, and not really thinking much of her question, I said because it just sounds different than playing with my fingers. She said something like “I know that, but why?” Unfortunately, I didn’t have time to clarify what she meant, as we had to move on to the next activity, but I will never forget feeling so embarrassed that I didn’t take her question seriously. I’m 30, now, and that experience, along with my own experiences with adults not taking me seriously when I was a kid, almost entirely shape the way I talk to kids today. I refuse to allow myself to speak to kids in a way where they might feel that I’m dismissing them or their problems almost entirely because of that single interaction I had as a maybe 15 or 16 year old boy.

We are, as atheists, okay with not knowing an answer. We follow the evidence. The best line is by you! You said something along the lines of, “The Christian Sean is presenting arguments as atheist Sean in a way that only Christian Sean knows how to refute. If he actually believed what he was saying then he’d be an actual atheist.” Love this! Lastly, I used to be a Christian too and studied the Bible up and down. I honestly don’t think I’d be able to play devil’s advocate (pun intended) on the part of a Christian apologetic without a good amount of bias. It’s like taking the one color pill in the Matrix (I forget if it’s blue or red) that shows reality; I can’t unlearn such logical thinking that I’d be able to convert back to Christianity. When I was a Christian, I really had a lot of questions, however. There was a part of me that thought, “this all sounds like bull sh|t.” That’s because it is. Now, there may actually be a god! I just DON’T KNOW. There’s isn’t any (not little, or even minute) evidence for a creator that can be proved. Why would an all loving god create me and others to exist then? That’s a cruel god.

I like how they couldn't get an actual atheist to come in because he/she might have some valid objections that turn people away from the faith.

@ChefMimsy

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah. It's like wanting the class to hear about someone's personal stories of racial discrimination, then hiring a blackface-wearing white guy to tell them.

@Bas-TB

3 жыл бұрын

I think they just want to show of their dishonesty.

@gregfakerson6998

3 жыл бұрын

@@ChefMimsy that is perfect example of what’s going on here 👍 respect for the analogy

@harrycooper5231

3 жыл бұрын

@@ChefMimsy That is a great analogy.

@erikfreeman45

3 жыл бұрын

When I watched Sean's video unaware of him before, I was really surprised that this class was an actual apologetics class and they had terrible arguments and misunderstandings towards faux Sean.

"We wanted to teach what atheists are, so here's not an atheist"

@FabbrizioPlays

Жыл бұрын

Wouldn't want to be too convincing, might actually lose a few christians.

@kdot78

Жыл бұрын

@@FabbrizioPlays lol

@CallmeOzymandias

Жыл бұрын

@@FabbrizioPlays Can't have that...

@donaldhanning1359

Жыл бұрын

@@FabbrizioPlays You know what though, I bet they DID lose a lot of Christians that day. Some of those kids REALLY wanted to be debating an atheist & seemed very frustrated by the answers "Atheist Sean" was giving. I'm betting the reveal that he was lying to them and playing a character did more to hurt their faith that day than any of the non-answers he actually gave.

@1mol831

Жыл бұрын

@@donaldhanning1359 it doesn’t matter much. What benefit does he have to have more or less of ‘Christian’s’

as someone from the uk i am actually rather shocked that there is such a thing as a class in "christian apologetics" in any school or university. perhaps i have led a sheltered life!

@catherinegrimes2308

10 ай бұрын

Like you, I am from the UK. I find the religiosity of the US to be puzzling and quite scary. The interesting thing is that our country is the second most institutionally religious country in the world, the first being Iran. In our schools we have compulsory religious assemblies, religious instruction/knowledge. We have unelected lords and Bishops in the House of Lords. Yet hardly anybody goes to church. I watched the coronation of King Charles on TV and found the church service to be really bizarre. It is high time that the institutions of our state became secular.

@ack7956

9 ай бұрын

Hey ho, a silly American here. This sort of class is *not* the norm in my experience; they typically exist in specifically theistic private schools, not in forms of public education. We do often have theology classes, but that is evidently quite different than an apologetics class. Believe me, even though I already know it happens: I'm shocked too. Each and every time.

@CampingforCool41

8 ай бұрын

This is a christian private school, not a public school.

@GruntDestroyarChannel

6 ай бұрын

True, but the religious studies in my experience in high school, were quite objective and just studied the practices of the most popular religions in the world. Mostly to raise awareness of peoples difference in a melting pot like the uk

@cutienerdgirl

5 ай бұрын

There are theologians that study all or many religions in university.

This is awful 😂 those students should feel completely coddled at that point. Even when they are exposed to a real opposing worldview it has to turn out to be faked.

As an educator, it would be really weird for me to bring in a speaker who was pretending to be who they say they are. Why not just bring in a real atheist? His students were asking questions in good faith and were being gaslit by an impersonator.

@alisaurus4224

2 жыл бұрын

To assure them they’re actually right in the end and all the atheist’s claims have solid refutations.

@bobbun9630

2 жыл бұрын

I found the guy to be a completely unconvincing atheist (based on this video), though I'll concede that since I knew up front that he wasn't, that was an easy finding. It's not just that his choice of responses follows Christian lines of response, just inverted as to reasoning. The problem for me was that I would expect an actual atheist speaker to have better responses altogether. An actual atheist speaker with such low quality answers wouldn't be speaking at very many venues. I don't know that I have ever observed an atheist speaker drag the multiverse idea into the discussion, at least not as anything but pure speculation.

@robertabarnhart6240

2 жыл бұрын

I came down here to ask the same thing.

@timq6224

2 жыл бұрын

thou shalt not bear false witness -- in trying to trick others into his version of salvation, he condemned his soul to hell (according to the tenets of his own religion!)

@michaelmorris1741

2 жыл бұрын

This guy wasn't following Christ when he lied to them.

“I’m not trying to set up a strawman” “Also multiverse”

@ChefMimsy

3 жыл бұрын

No shit!

@erin1569

3 жыл бұрын

Even if we count the comment sections, I have seen a total of 2 atheists quoting the multiverse as an explanation. I guess "We don't know, but adding a personality to whatever started the universe is unnecessary and unevidenced." would make too much sense.

@erin1569

3 жыл бұрын

Also StRiNg ThEoRy

@Leszek.Rzepecki

3 жыл бұрын

Most atheists I've come across don't use"multiverse!" as an all-purpose excuse. I find myself that a simple "we don't know" is good enough. It's religious apologists who are arrogant and cocksure enough to be 100% certain how the universe began.

@creativerealms

3 жыл бұрын

He probably thinks that's an atheist's strongest answer.

As if a Christian school would ever invite an atheist to speak.

I’m very fortunate that my parents, who have been christian missionaries my entire life, are still willing to have dialogue with me about religion, politics and existential questions. I first told them I was not a Christian when I first got to college, but the seeds for the deconstruction of my faith had been there as early as middle and high school. Even when I came out as bisexual to them, they did take it personally, they cried and said they “fear for my soul”, but they didn’t cut ties with me or shame me for leaving the church, which I’m told by most of my friends is an extremely uncommon reaction. It’s so tough to talk with them sometimes because they are both well educated, loving people, but they have absolutely committed their entire lives to Jesus and spreading Christianity to the world that it seems impossible that either of us will change our minds. The best thing I can say about them is that they value their connection with me as their son more than their faith or any ideologies they posses, and I think that’s worth celebrating at least.

Despite his poor ability to make atheistic arguments, Sean deserves credit for acknowledging hardship an atheist might face when coming out in a deeply religious community

@TheConvivialCopywriter

2 жыл бұрын

I do appreciate that.

@TheBeauyHome

2 жыл бұрын

I also give props to the organizer of the event for telling the students to follow truth even if that means they won’t be Christian

@Conserpov

2 жыл бұрын

His goal is clearly to convert atheists with "Christian love", though.

@gauteterning420

2 жыл бұрын

And this, of course, was the point with the whole speech + Q&A. Still, GMM chooses to critique the speakers' mock atheists. I actually found it disingenuous and bad faith to start to argue back, knowing that this professor had this speech in front of high-schoolers to learn them the lesson of listening to arguments from the other side.

@Conserpov

2 жыл бұрын

@@gauteterning420 _> to learn them the lesson of listening to arguments from the other side_ Nope. To learn to dismiss the arguments from the other side with more confidence, to become more fundamentalist and less susceptible to reason.

Imagine an atheist doing this as a "Christian." The uproar would be deafening.

@mysteriiis

3 жыл бұрын

I demand this be the plot of Borat 3!

@Cecilia-ky3uw

3 жыл бұрын

no no I would like us to set up a new religion teapotism based on teapots lets make the doctrines and copy most if not all arguments for christianity and make some of our own to demonstrate the flaws of christianity

@TheConvivialCopywriter

3 жыл бұрын

I'd love to do that, or at least see it.

@martifingers

2 жыл бұрын

I am not so sure. It would be an acid test in a way for atheists ability to steel man the argument..

@queerlibtardhippie9357

2 жыл бұрын

Lemme guess... you also think that people would get in an uproar if the genders were switched in a even more trivial matter

The comment on existing in a conservative context as an atheist is very true. I grew up in a rural community in West Texas and as I realized I was an atheist in my teens it was pretty brutal. Add to this that I'm a pansexual and a socialist (which may be in large parts a result of knowing how conservatives treats atheists and LGBTQ people) and it wasn't easy and has given me a deeply rooted understanding of christians as some of the worst human beings in existence. Now living in a Scandinavian country it's so liberating to know my views on the divine is the norm, not a rare exception.

It's almost like this conversation would be better served for both sides by having an actual atheist do the debate with the students. Crazy thought.

WHen I was like 13 I had a debate with myself where I was my normal Christian self and then I responded as an atheist to ask myself questions. I wasn't an Atheist but my caricature of an atheist literally ended up winning the debate

@carlroza102

2 жыл бұрын

LOL😂

@Amoth_oth_ras_shash

Жыл бұрын

that must have caused some moments of ''doess not compute'' for your young brain... i be curious if your still theist or gone atheist when older.. but either case you at least sound like you got a decent critical thinking development as young and thats whats important ;)

@jmlightning8045

Жыл бұрын

That is quite literally how I became an atheist. I debated myself, and found the christanish argument (I was like 6-7 so it probably wasn't a fair assessment of actual Christian) lacking compared to the new science stuff I was watching on youtube and nova (mainly nova i think).

@RiskierGoose340

Жыл бұрын

The way I love to try to solve anything that wasn’t as simple as “how to fix the table” was to argue with myself. I like to take the sides of all my options, argue for their positives and negatives, and see which wins out. Usually works somehow.

@taynahibanez9952

Жыл бұрын

Ok, this is adorable XD.

he might be roleplaying an Atheist, but he still argues like an Apologist. Apologist Arguments usually only come in one of three flavors: based on false information, based on logical fallacies, or based on pure semantics.

@TorianTammas

3 жыл бұрын

So true!

@thomasmaughan4798

3 жыл бұрын

"he might be roleplaying an Atheist, but he still argues like an Apologist" As does Sam Harris, Dawkins, Hitchens et al.

@flutterwind7686

3 жыл бұрын

@@thomasmaughan4798 Awww did this video ruffle your feathers?

@thomasmaughan4798

3 жыл бұрын

@@flutterwind7686 " Awww did this video ruffle your feathers?" It did, but a good shake of my tail sorts things out ;-)

@hossamtarek2272

3 жыл бұрын

Peace, blessing, and mercy of our Munificent creator be upon you, my beloved reader😊. I am inviting you to worship our creator by accepting Islam and to study the evidence of his existence. The scientific, metaphysical, historical, and linguistic miracles presented in the heavenly book (the Holy Quran ) that has been sent by our creator are sufficient pieces of evidence. Study the challenge of creating 1 chapter like the Quran. check out the reason that made all the attempts failed. The scientific miracles in the Quran that was revealed more than 1400 years ago include the chemical composition of the human, the expansion of the universe, the knocking star, the rotation of the earth, the gender determining factor, the orbits, the chronological comparisons of developments of the zygote and the fetus, the origin of the universe, the function of the mountains, the movements of the sun and the earth, the vision in the deep seas, the forbidden breeding ( between some relatives ) , and other scientific miracles. So, raise your hand to the sky asking your Limitless creator who created you, fed you, and put his mercy on you to help you in finding the truth. ask him for everything. www.islamreligion.com/category/33/evidence-islam-is-truth/ quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en kzread.info Thanks, My beautiful researcher for the truth ❤️.

46:10 Beautifully said. It really was very nice to hear an apologist acknowledge this, and I hope Sean sees this and takes it to heart.

Those closing thoughts though. Man, powerful. I am so glad I found your channel. Gives me hope. I have been really thinking about what you and Holy Koolaid and Paulogia talk about on some of the vids. So many feels!

He sounds like he's promoting Christianity even when he's posing as a Athiest.

@Xarai

3 жыл бұрын

Personally the way he talks and walks is pure preacher.ways

@madams3478

3 жыл бұрын

He certainly is a serious fellow. And asking people to believe only if it’s true is his way of saying, Don’t be a luke-warm Christian. It’s a “stack the deck” choice, I mean, these are teenagers in a Christian school for crying out loud. Instead, I want people to be luke-warm and loosey-goosey about whatever religion they’re in. For example, I’d love to have a Pagan wedding! No, I don’t really believe in it. But I like the ritual and I love the fact that it takes place outside in nature. It would be an “open source” Pagan wedding as it were. Of course, something to negotiate with my eventual spouse! Cheers. 🌈 🚴🏾‍♂️ 🚴🏽‍♂️ , 🚴‍♀️ 🚴🏽‍♀️ , 🚴🏾‍♂️ 🚴🏻‍♀️

@coolguy9709

3 жыл бұрын

@@madams3478 he sounds like he is using reverse psychology.

@alex-qd6of

3 жыл бұрын

He is.

@thomasmaughan4798

2 жыл бұрын

"He sounds like he's promoting Christianity even when he's posing as a Athiest." As will an atheist promote atheism even while posing as a Christian.

The thing with the fine tuning argument, is that the environment we live in has never changed for life, life has always changed for the environment. The reason we "fit so perfectly" into our environment is that those who do not fit so perfectly did not survive and life has evolved and adapted to the environment.

@Nai_101

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah. I don't get how people don't get that

@apollo6326

2 жыл бұрын

I saw a funny thing that was like “if god isn’t real, then why do shoes always fit perfectly?”

@TheOJDrinker

2 жыл бұрын

My favorite response to this is the pothole filled with water, the water thinks the pothole was made perfectly to fit its shape.

@hamsarris8341

2 жыл бұрын

@@apollo6326 that's a joke. Has to be.

@hamsarris8341

2 жыл бұрын

The fine-tuning argument is usually about the constants of the universe, not environment. Maybe Sean said that though, idk.

Great video. I could only wish to have this as a teenager coming out of the Christian circle.

The world is not fine tuned for us, we are fine tuned for the world as it is.

@Thatchxl

5 ай бұрын

Yeah I’m surprised that Sean McDowell didn’t go with this response. I feel like it is the obvious response, and I’m sure Sean has been exposed to it before. His response definitely feels more like a straw man because he didn’t mention this.

@bmacthecat

2 ай бұрын

Like if we weren’t specifically perfect for the world, we wouldn’t be here to observe such fine tuning

"How can you not believe in God? The universe is fine-tuned for human life!" he said, as he put on his hat, coat, & gloves for the walk out to his car.

@realstreetjesus1953

2 жыл бұрын

For real, it’s he universe is not fine tuned for our existence, most of the universe is completely inhabitable. We have simply adapted to our surroundings according to our needs.

@conspiracycolumbo1047

2 жыл бұрын

Almost every part of the universe is tuned to make life impossible. And deadly to any life that went anywhere near it. If there is other life than us in the universe (there has to be I'm sure). Its very rare and going anywhere other than their own planet is deadly to life. The universe was not fine tuned for life. Even the term "fine tuned" suggests it was the product of some conscious decision and there is no way of knowing that to be true. Life adapted to some tiny fraction of the universe. It came about in spite of the hostile nature of the universe to life. And nature can easily cause any life to become extinct at a mere crash of an asteroid or eruption of a super volcano at any time. Life is fleeting. The universe does not require life in any way shape of form.

@justanotherhomosapian5101

2 жыл бұрын

Why did i find this poetic👁👄👁

@AzureViking

2 жыл бұрын

Kinda like when you're looking for something you lost and it's always in the last place you look. Because obviously you would stop looking at that point. Its not some great miracle or coincidence.

@MaDPuPPeTgames

2 жыл бұрын

@@AzureViking I'll respectfully reject that analogy. "last place you look" generally means you've looked in every place conceivable and the last possibly place it can be is where you find it, as opposed to finding it on the table before you've even looked in the cupboard. it doesn't mean literally the last place you looked before stopping.

“I’m not trying to set up a straw man” *Becomes the straw man

@justincarroll1836

3 жыл бұрын

Bruh he's so full of straw that a farmer could line a horse pen with him

@bluedragonfly8139

3 жыл бұрын

Dude should be skipping down the yellow brick road with Dorothy and Toto.

@procrastinator99

3 жыл бұрын

I'M THE STRAWMAN NOW lol

@stylis666

3 жыл бұрын

I think that's an unfair assessment. Sean came really close to understanding the arguments and he just really doesn't understand them better than that. Genetically Modified Skeptic explained and showed that with footage of Sean making the apologist arguments. I think that Sean honestly tried his best and he is just sincerely wrong.

@Joelkiioncharles

3 жыл бұрын

What a chad

Loving your videos. And kindness displayed through your gentleness. Thank you Drew.

I’m so glad you made this response. That video came up in my feed as well. I didn’t make it to the reveal at the end, because his arguments seemed too embarrassing. I couldn’t stand it.

When I can out as an atheist at age 15, my mom cried and said she feels like she failed as a parent. While I do think she failed as a parent by raising me as a christian in the first place, I don't think that me becoming an atheist is evidence of that. Mom, you taught me critical thinking since I was in preschool. In 7th grade, you made me take a course in logical fallacies. You taught me to be open minded and question everything. And most importantly, you gave me access to a child safe search engine and a precursor to KZread Kids in sixth grade and later free range of the internet and KZread. Those are things a good parent does. Yes, it was because of you that I became an atheist. But it's not your fault. It was the best thing that could ever happen to me. That is not a failure as a parent. That is a success.

@thomasmaughan4798

3 жыл бұрын

"When I can out as an atheist at age 15" Perhaps you would be the first on this page (or even all of KZread) to say what is an atheist, that you can come out as one!

@carminegiaquinto7426

3 жыл бұрын

in a book which over 2,000 years ago said that in the end, the moon will turn red which is happening now the moon is literally rusting, also in that book Jesus says towards the end times people will claim to be him AND deceive many, and there's multiple people who did that recently. It also says the bottom of the ocean has mountains and valleys while scientists back then believed it was flat. Jesus stated that he's aware people hate him and his followers, even to the point of them being tortured and killed so it's not like he was trying to be a favorited celebrity to the entire public, also there would be no point into creating a fictional figure to target that hatred away from the writer because the writer states that the followers will be hated too, Jesus also stated that in heaven there is no marriage and no one will be given into marriage in heaven so I doubt that's man-made and if you think it's because we say we're all children in the eyes of God that's not a valid argument because what's the difference if we're on earth? I can keep on going but I think you get the point, why live off the assumption that there's no God when there's evidence for so much more? At least look into it more and sorry some "Christians" mistreat you

@spiceforspice3461

3 жыл бұрын

@@carminegiaquinto7426 The moon turning red likely referred to a lunar eclipse, which literally makes the moon appear red, and not rusting, as there is not enough iron on the surface of the moon for any significant amount of rusting to be noticeable from earth. There have been people who have claimed to be the second coming of Jesus since he died. If you could point me to any verse about the bottom of the ocean not being flat, I would appreciate it. I literally could not find a single verse about the shape of the ocean floor. But overall, there is no reason to believe that "the end times" are coming any time soon.

@Bill_Garthright

3 жыл бұрын

@@carminegiaquinto7426 _why live off the assumption that there's no God when there's evidence for so much more?_ Evidence? Really? OK, I'll call your bluff. How about *one piece of good evidence* that your god is real, rather than just imaginary? Alternately, I'd accept *one piece of good evidence* that _any_ of the magical/supernatural stories in the Bible actually happened. (Your choice.) I'm not interested in a Gish Gallop of vague claims, but you claim that there's evidence, so can you demonstrate that your claim is true with even *one* example?

@schoo9256

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, growing up my parents constantly reinforced how important it was to question every message we received from the world, then were surprised when I couldn't help but apply those critical thinking skills to our religion...

"I'm trying not to set up a strawman." Well he's right. He isn't setting up a strawman, he is becoming the strawman.

@corberus3119

2 жыл бұрын

i'd say muppet with the way he flails his arms around whenever he talks

@universenerdd

Жыл бұрын

@@BobSmith-ew5oi This is unreadable

@liranpiade4499

Жыл бұрын

I do believe that his attempt, although unsuccessful, was genuine.

@marthaworc7873

Жыл бұрын

The scare crow, made of straw, in the Wizard of Oz: "If I only had a brain".

@Dalek59862

Жыл бұрын

@@BobSmith-ew5oi was this the love child of a monkey and a typewriter?

I really appreciate both the excellence of your content and the spirit in which it is presented. Thanks.

My sisters’ first acknowledgment of my atheism/agnosticism was to present the fallacy, “You know, for someone who doesn’t believe in god, you sure say his name a lot,” after I said “oh my god,” once too many. This shit is why I don’t trust people.

How is the universe "fined tuned" for us? We have one tiny speck of it and outside of that we will literally die. It's almost like we adapted to the surroundings or something.

@EskChan19

3 жыл бұрын

It's the puddle, saying the sinkhole in the road conforms so well to them that the sinkhole must have been specially made just for the puddle. I also don't get the cosmological argument. Why does the universe need a creator "because nothing can be eternal and just exist", so it needs to have been created by god who "is eternal and just exists"? Why move the goalpost like that? Why does god not need to play by the ultimate rule they just established? If something can apparently just exist and be eternal, because god apparently is, then why can't we just cut the middleman and say the universe is eternal and just exists?

@shridharbiju7370

3 жыл бұрын

Also the fact that we literally had to destory and rebuild our environments to make it habitable for us.

@cnault3244

3 жыл бұрын

Earth is fine-tuned for cockroaches.

@shridharbiju7370

3 жыл бұрын

@@cnault3244 I guess we found God's most beloved species. All Hail Our cockroach overlords.

@cnault3244

3 жыл бұрын

@@shridharbiju7370 Did you know that a cockroach can live a full week after its head has been removed from its body? While the cockroach can only survive a week without water, it can live without food for an entire month. As soon as a cockroach is born, it can almost run as fast as a grown cockroach. Some believe that cockroaches lived through the Carboniferous era over 280 million years ago. In other words, they've lived through it all, so make sure your strategy to eliminate them is more intimidating than the dinosaurs. The cockroach can hold its breath for about 40 minutes. Did you know that there are over 4,000 different species of cockroaches around the world?

I thought he was an atheist until he took the glasses off. Such a great disguise.

@fedoraspeaks8962

Жыл бұрын

I mean hey, it worked for superman.

@25dollarbill24

Жыл бұрын

According to the God-despising fools who like to say _"I'm an atheist, but Christians are atheists too; I just happen to believe in one less god than they believe in!"_ he is an atheist.

@bororobo3805

Жыл бұрын

He just needed a spandex underneath some Victoria secret panties and a cape

@xyzedits1

Жыл бұрын

@@25dollarbill24 And according to the science-denying bozos who like to say, "I'm a Christian, but Atheists are just 1 step away from agnosticism and then 1 step closer to Christianity!", all atheists are just 2 steps from being Christian.

@robertrissearbeobie5612

11 ай бұрын

It's a bird, it's a plane, it's Superchristian!!!

I really appreciate this guys' goals for the debate, we need more stabilizers and less catalyzers between theist and non-theist public discourse

Thank you for making these videos. I live in Oklahoma and it's a constant battle to separate church from anything. I personally am a de facto Athiest, but the only person that knows this is my wife who is also Athiest. My entire family and extended family are predominantly Southern Baptist (I've seen many ppl speak in tongues). I have attempted to ask questions, but just from my inquiries I felt it was always going to be a challenge if I told my family I was Athiest not to mention my friends and community. Therefore, I still have only told one person in my life. I'm 35 now and I suspect I'll never be comfortable telling anyone I'm Athiest in my lifetime, at least as long as I live here and I think it's sad. I appreciate you highlighting that topic.

I once tried having a logical debate with a preacher when i was young. My dad brought him to my house to "change" me. He asked me if I would read some of his books and it would make me have a new outlook on life. He said I would have to do it without thinking I already know the answers. I said "sure why not, but only if you read some books I have with out the preconceived notion that you are right and i am wrong." He flat out refused. He said "I can't do that because I am right and you are wrong". I said "then we can't have a intellectually honest conversation and this is pointless." It ended with him screaming at me lmfao.

@rogueninja185

2 жыл бұрын

You live in a country of mentally deranged people. I didnt know people tried to "cure" family members from atheism over there. I thought this was only depicted in some science fiction or dystopian novels/ tv shows. effing scary

@l3unnies

2 жыл бұрын

@@rogueninja185 correct, it’s terrifying

@kevinramsey417

2 жыл бұрын

@@rogueninja185 You have no idea how deranged.

@gustercc

2 жыл бұрын

Alyssa: How bad could it have been? Holden: Put it this way: have you ever heard a nun call an eight year-old boy a f***ing c*nt rag? -Chasing Amy

@timq6224

2 жыл бұрын

my religious journey ended with a preacher telling me "you must take it on faith" -- If I have to believe something that is contrary to logic and reality, then I want no part of it.

As a former secret Atheist Science Teacher at a fundamentalist Christian school I guarantee you that there were many students in that crowd that were secretly atheists. At my school they flocked to me like moths to a flame because honestly I’m terrible at hiding my beliefs and because I was the only person in their lives that made them feel able to ask questions. Even despite that small story of the atheist girl at the end, I would expect that a number of them were crushed by this bait and switch. For the first time they were being acknowledged and then they had that ripped away. Just awful.

@firephantom115

2 жыл бұрын

"I would expect that a number of them would be crushed by this bait and switch. for the first time they were being acknowledged and then they had that ripped away." EXACTLY. that's partially why what he did annoys me.

@treacherousjslither6920

2 жыл бұрын

I was fortunate enough to never have to hide my atheism. Was still forced to attend church though.

@bullscott12

2 жыл бұрын

@@treacherousjslither6920 To be honest I have never had to hide it either besides the 2 years I worked at that school. I frankly lied about my involvement in religion to get that job in the first place to land the position as it was the first teaching job I got out of University so in the end it was probably my own fault lol

@treacherousjslither6920

2 жыл бұрын

@@bullscott12 Yeah sounds like it was lol

@An_Idiot_in_the_Wild

2 жыл бұрын

Absolutely, yep, it's a pathetic and revolting little tactic, on many levels.

Woah. The ending where he said those things about treatment of atheists really spoke to me. He seems like he has his heart in the right place, but because of our personal biases (which all of us have, and which are incredibly difficult to fully put aside), he misstepped in some areas. I think he’s a good guy that intended for the best, but human psychology did get him in some places. All that aside, he seems like the exact kind of person I’d like to be there whenever there’s a discussion on these topics. Which is shockingly profound to me. I adore seeing good role models like this, and it’s great to find one which isn’t in my sect, because it humanises them so much more. I hope he heeds your advice, Drew. As a role model yourself, who does similar things and does really good work in holding biases aside, I’m sure your words would ring strongly Edit: I should also add I came into this video ready to see Sean showed to be a terrible person for the impersonation he’s done. And while it wasn’t a good method to take, I’m really impressed by how drastically my view changed

I love it. A stunt like that, about 55 years ago, caused me to realize that it was actually possible to ask the question in the first place. I've been working on the answer ever since. Other students mentioned it to their parents who promptly had that teacher fired... life goes on.

It's not easy to take on 90+ minutes of content in 47 minutes. Well done! Proud to contribute a part.

@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic

3 жыл бұрын

I couldn’t have done it without you, my friend!

@onedaya_martian1238

3 жыл бұрын

@@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic Great shout out to Paulogia !

@onedaya_martian1238

3 жыл бұрын

The community grows !!

@ckcnkc

3 жыл бұрын

Perhaps a misleading 12+21=33 on the Josephus references?

@jacobvictorfisher8256

2 жыл бұрын

Paul’s channel is probably my favorite on KZread right now. He offers thoughtful, clear analysis and the perfect tone. Along with Drew, I couldn’t recommend him highly enough.

Those poor students :( And that poor girl who literally went to him and told him she was an atheist :( Hope they're all doing well.

@Name-ru1kt

Жыл бұрын

I mean there is a reason why atheist are a minority in Texas. If you are not a Christian then pack your bags and leave as soon as you can.

@killeanmcchesney5138

Жыл бұрын

Just screams closeted something we just won’t ever know until he winds up on a list lol

I was listening to this while playing a game, and then started hearing audio from another of GMS' videos that I had recently watched, and then thought I was going insane because his speech patterns are so consistent

Sean came to an Awana Bible Quiz competition and did his "act". I've never seen so many kids who though they knew the answers to everything Bible and Christianity related be so dumbfounded. He wiped the floor with us and I've never forgotten it

Imagine his plan backfired and he actually convinced a few of them to leave their faith lol

@Bill_Garthright

3 жыл бұрын

That might actually happen. Who knows? Once they realize he was lying to them about being an atheist, they might start wondering about what _else_ he's been lying about.

@jasondumas3612

3 жыл бұрын

@@Bill_Garthright I really hope so

@nayanmalig

2 жыл бұрын

@@jasondumas3612 LOL same here - the irony

@MyNameIsChristBringsASword

2 жыл бұрын

That's the beauty of salvation. Once saved always saved. You cannot lose it. Nice try Satan. Nice try.

@iamfilleg

2 жыл бұрын

@@MyNameIsChristBringsASword Does that go for all the atheists that once were “saved”?

"We know this because of philosophy" no we don't. That's not what philosophy is for

@crawbug8932

3 жыл бұрын

If you think really hard, you'll eventually get to the right answer.

@zenithquasar9623

3 жыл бұрын

Like, somehow philosophy is universal truth or something! Christian apologists rely so heavily on it!

@Grantalope10

3 жыл бұрын

What is philosophy for if not answers?

@crawbug8932

3 жыл бұрын

@@Grantalope10 For philosophy to get you the right answers, you need to start with the right information. Saying "We know this because philosophy" is akin to saying "we know this because of logic". Both are just processes.

@Marniwheeler

3 жыл бұрын

@@crawbug8932 yet that is considered a legit argument by many I have interacted with. Logic exists - Therefore God

Thanks for this video! I felt the same way when I watched his video

Love your videos, man. Seriously. Well done. Also, have you ever considered becoming a preacher?

Nothing says "defending the faith" like bearing false witness.

@onedaya_martian1238

3 жыл бұрын

Ironic "Amen" brother.

@onyxtay7246

3 жыл бұрын

Lying for Jesus!

@spiritbx1337

3 жыл бұрын

Good thing that there's nothing about this in his book that would mean that he is going to suffer for eternity. Wait... What was that last part of you comment again?

@brotbrotsen1100

3 жыл бұрын

It's not a problem, whenever Jesus is angry you just say "sorry for the sin and stuff J.C" And your good again.

@seand.g423

Жыл бұрын

Well it benefits them, and locks the uncertain down that much tighter, so, _of fucking course_ it could never _possibly_ count...

Students should have known he’s an apologetics professor based on his use of spiked hair, fully buttoned untucked plaid shirt, and trendy glasses. He’s hip.

@m0j0b0ne

2 жыл бұрын

If we're splitting hairs, he didn't button the top button.

@DrCbass123

2 жыл бұрын

@@m0j0b0ne lol very true. He tried to low key play it off.

@hellkat2285

2 жыл бұрын

@@DrCbass123 Maybe he did it "ironically".

@IAMTHELION622

2 жыл бұрын

Visit The Book Of Life Project on Instagram

@jaya1000

2 жыл бұрын

I'm a real atheist and can confirm we dont use hair gel or wear fancy shirts. We also dont fly across the country to speak to a room full of christian children during a global pandemic. The fact these students couldnt call bullshit immediately is exactly why they are the way they are. No street smarts.

It would be NICE to see a panel of 1 person of every religion to speak / discuss on their belief - it's just too bad that it would end it a fight / war....all because every one would get - how he stated "get defensive" because they don't understand why they believe their own religion.......Keep up your good work my friend. I really enjoy your videos!!!!!

Great work 👍

"I believe in the multiverse, and that is the beginning of our universe" I don't know any atheist that LEADS with something like this.

@aninsimone

2 жыл бұрын

He's the first.....its so dumb. Very condescending

@JeroenDoes

2 жыл бұрын

as an athiest I would just say : "i do not know" Where does the universe come from? Wel I hold 2 contradicting believes 1. The conversation of energy 2. Everything has a beginning and an end. These 2 believes do not work together but both make logical sense in 99% of the cases. There is the big bang but conversation of energy demands something before the big bang so it is not the start. In the end I must simply admit that I do not know everything, no one does. God has the same problem btw, conversation of matter also demands god is made from something by something.

@adashofbitter

2 жыл бұрын

I've never come across an atheist who even uses the concept of the multiverse as an argument against god at all... I know some people who tentatively believe in the multiverse, but are also well aware that it's at the fringes of theoretical physics and not supported by any data whatsoever, only that it's a mathematical possibility. But even people who believe in it don't think it either proves or negates the existence of any god. It's just irrelevant to the discussion.

@haurenox7686

2 жыл бұрын

Yep, since when atheism was about cosmology? The best scientists in the world who study these complex questions don't know yet but believers in a book about talking snakes and zombies know exactly how the universe formed...

@ditzfough

2 жыл бұрын

@@JeroenDoes conversation LMFAO!!

I'd have been extremely disappointed if this had been my experience: there would have been students there experiencing doubt regarding their beliefs with associated relief that finally an athiest was speaking up - only to feel duped by the very school that has imposed and enforced their rules & regulations up until that point.

@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic

3 жыл бұрын

YES. This was my first thought when I watched this. I just imagine feeling like, “Finally, a safe person. Maybe I’ll be able to tell someone.” and then finding out they were an apologist who might talk to my teacher if I tell them. It’d be awful.

@austinlincoln3414

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah thats uhh.. thats uhh.. cancer

@SuperCraft1999

2 жыл бұрын

I thought the same yeah. Allthough that is to no discredit to Sean. I think he's a genuine person that's trying his best to make Christians more accepting.

@thestraycat907

2 жыл бұрын

@@GeneticallyModifiedSkeptic Its gaslighting...hiring a fake atheist, a poser. I would like to see these schools hire real atheists who have the ability to answer students questions accurately. Do you do any public speaking?

@Maladjester

2 жыл бұрын

Great that he tells them to be nice, but he still reveals himself as a professional liar who fears the opposition far too much to ever actually face it. To me, typical. To the students, we can hope it's disillusioning.

Keep up the great work ❤

I just came across your channel today, and have been really enjoying it. I appreciate how empathetic and even keeled you are. I didn't grow up particularly religious, though it was just kind of accepted that God existed. When I was in college, I was so desperate to find some meaning to life that I fell into a Christian Cult. We're talking fundamentalist on steroids. After 12 years in the cult, I finally got out. Unfortunately, while I was in the cult, my family got serious about religion and joined another church. I've told them all that I am an atheist and that I do not believe that if the God of the Christian Bible existed the way the Bible describes him to be, he would not allow for such evil and hurt that I and others in the cult were exposed to to happen in his name. Yet still, they persist in telling me, "Well you just went to a bad church. You were on fire for God once, you can be again." Thank goodness for my brother, who never believed in God in the first place, he's been a great support.

You can always tell a Christian by the way they say and pronounce “God” and “Jesus”. It’s subtle but pay attention.

@swolejeezy2603

3 жыл бұрын

It’s like airy and mystical and drawn-out

@kdarkwynde

3 жыл бұрын

Yep.

@pascalsimioli6777

3 жыл бұрын

It's like they cream their pants everytime.

@quirkyredpanda7201

3 жыл бұрын

Also using adjectives like 'holy' and 'almighty' I dont think I've ever heard an atheist refer to a God as 'holy' God.

@hossamtarek2272

3 жыл бұрын

Peace, blessing, and mercy of our Munificent creator be upon you, my beloved reader😊. I am inviting you to worship our creator by accepting Islam and to study the evidence of his existence. The scientific, metaphysical, historical, and linguistic miracles presented in the heavenly book (the Holy Quran ) that has been sent by our creator are sufficient pieces of evidence. Study the challenge of creating 1 chapter like the Quran. check out the reason that made all the attempts failed. The scientific miracles in the Quran that was revealed more than 1400 years ago include the chemical composition of the human, the expansion of the universe, the knocking star, the rotation of the earth, the gender determining factor, the orbits, the chronological comparisons of developments of the zygote and the fetus, the origin of the universe, the function of the mountains, the movements of the sun and the earth, the vision in the deep seas, the forbidden breeding ( between some relatives ) , and other scientific miracles. So, raise your hand to the sky asking your Limitless creator who created you, fed you, and put his mercy on you to help you in finding the truth. ask him for everything. www.islamreligion.com/category/33/evidence-islam-is-truth/ quran.ksu.edu.sa/index.php?l=en kzread.info Thanks, My beautiful researcher for the truth ❤️.

The first rule of apologetics is probably: If you weren’t dishonest you failed.

@cy-one

3 жыл бұрын

- Abe Lincoln, probablx

@atheistsfightclub6684

3 жыл бұрын

It's apologetics, making the irreconcilable appear reconcilable, that's why whoever created the practice had a brief moment of honesty and apologised for it by calling it apologetics.

@Bas-TB

3 жыл бұрын

@@jarrodpurvis2611 It is probably the first application of the first rule.

@jamesoverholt878

3 жыл бұрын

@@cy-one I was going to say George Carlin

@angelman906

3 жыл бұрын

@@atheistsfightclub6684 pretty sure it was dubbed by people that weren’t practicing the apologetics.

I love that you (GMS) have the watermark place so apropos.

My problem with Christian apologetics is that they try to convince atheists of the existence of God by saying we can't explain certain phenomenon of the world. But when you ask them why that is an argument for the existence of God they can't answer you...

"I thought I'd bring in someone who does what I do to you, but this time, he's not pretending...." *a few 30 minutesses later* "I was totally pretending". Way to build trust with your students, lol.

@liamfarranree4433

3 жыл бұрын

If the students take any lesson from this stunt it should be the need to question everything told to you by authority figures, most especially when they insist you can trust them.

@jarrodpurvis2611

3 жыл бұрын

If only the Bible said something against lying, then they probably wouldn’t do this stuff. Oh well.

@crono276

3 жыл бұрын

@@jarrodpurvis2611 If you're talking about bearing false witness, they already have an answer for that.

@NissaMaezHartman

3 жыл бұрын

"Ok, I'm unenrolling now, and transferring to a REAL college!" 😂

@NissaMaezHartman

3 жыл бұрын

@@liamfarranree4433 Absolutely! Question everything!!!

It would almost seem a person who was previously Christian would be better at playing a Christian than Sean, who has never been an atheist, is at playing an atheist.

@betadecay6503

3 жыл бұрын

Sean has been an atheist. Everyone has.

@laislyra5512

3 жыл бұрын

I can't even pretend to be a Christian anymore. Last time I pretended to be a Christian to a member of my family I deliberately said I accepted evolution, because it was the only way I could still retain some of my intellectual integrity.

@TorianTammas

3 жыл бұрын

@@laislyra5512 A lot of Christians accept evolution, most of them are outside the US

@laislyra5512

3 жыл бұрын

​@@TorianTammas I think Brazil is unfortunately not one of these countries XD This cousin I talked to went on saying "there's little hope for a Christian who believes in evolution" and literally admitted he wouldn't accept any scientific evidence if it didn't support the Bible and that it is devil's work. But I mean, what can I do? Pretend I didn't go to school and that I didn't have to remove my wisdom tooth?

@jakeand9020

3 жыл бұрын

@@TorianTammas Funny, so many people have a hard time grasping how vast and diverse the US really is, especially Americans. I'd say at least 50% of christians in my area believe in evolution, there are very few literalists around here.

When I came out as an atheist to my family they just accepted me, and I'm lucky for that. I wasn't surprised that they were very accepting as my sibling had come out as an atheist before me and freely accepted them, and actually before that happened I didn't even know that there were people who didn't believe in god. That experience is actually what led me to questioning my faith and ultimately led to me becoming an atheist. However my friends asked me questions about why I was an atheist, and I could answer many of them very easily, and it was far easier to disprove their arguments against me than to answer their questions. Most of the people in my life who somehow don't know that I'm an atheist attempt to challenge my atheism and I can usually easily tear apart and counter their arguments.

Sean's demeanor and phrasing makes it completely obvious that he is pretending to believe something that he does not. It bugs me that the adult leader of this group blatantly lies to his students at the beginning. If you have to lie to make your point, your point is not worth making.

I LOVE how he takes his glasses off for the big reveal. Peak camp.

@egg_bun_

3 жыл бұрын

Lmaoooo

That schools should have simply invited an actual atheist with some intelligence... But that would be a danger to them, so they had to merely "pretend" with a safety switch (a Christian merely pretending to be atheist).

@mrfink-lf5pq

2 жыл бұрын

Atheist Sees Unimaginable Levels of Torment in Hell (Bryan Melvin NDE) - KZread

@Sunaki1000

2 жыл бұрын

Currently beeing Atheist means your rejected by 40% of the People in Elections. A Americal would rater vote for a Muslim then an Atheist. Only Socialism is less popular. So it was likely bias.

@thenotsoamazinggracetnsag3463

2 жыл бұрын

@@Sunaki1000 I wouldn’t see a problem with voting a Muslim as long as they keep there religion separate from their job (as any theist president should). But yeah it’s a problem when people won’t vote for others just because of their religion.

@Sunaki1000

2 жыл бұрын

@@thenotsoamazinggracetnsag3463 Yeah, thats a good Philosophy. I share that. (I was not implying anything negative about Muslims, but they usually face a lot of Prejudice, so seeing Atheism lower was surprising, and worrysome)

@ilovecookiesization

2 жыл бұрын

@@Sunaki1000 Imagine needing to have your countries leader be of a certain religion to be president instead of proficiency and actual skill I can solve America's debt and create a surplus but I'm an atheist

The quality of this video is off the charts

As a Brit now living in Florida, i see its so important to get the message across to younger people that science offers so much more than just an enemy to religion. The UK doesn’t really “do religion” very well, we can thank past kings ;) It probably helps that Darwin was from the UK and that Brits also have a sense of humour around self deprecation, no doubt in part coming from a country that is still young enough to witness its own world decline. I think what I am saying is that the less you believe you are the centre of the universe the less you are inclined to look for a higher importance and embrace the majesty of what science is revealing about our world everyday. It doesn’t mean throwing your values away, but it does free you up to not judge others. I appreciate what you are doing on your channel. I hope that the Children (of USA in particular) fully use the wonderful sources of information they have today to find their way and don’t limit it too much to the local and easier to accept view.

If you turn down the volume and just watch him move his arms and walk, it's just obvious he's been preaching for years.

@slevinchannel7589

2 жыл бұрын

Know Atheist Hbomberguy?

@Killerbee4712

2 жыл бұрын

@@slevinchannel7589 That's a funny one tho lol, he's a youtuber

Christian apologetics is a really weird thing. Imagine a college having a science apologetics class or a health apologetics class.

@kirstencorby8465

2 жыл бұрын

The first time I heard the term, I thought, "That is something I never want to be called." If you have to apologize for something, it's bad.

@ProsecutorZekrom

2 жыл бұрын

@@kirstencorby8465 That’s not what apologetics means. It comes from the greek word meaning ‘speak in one’s own defence’, and means ‘constituting a formal defence or justification of a theory or doctrine’.

@SemiPerfectDark

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly! I've often asked the question, do you "believe" in mathematics? What an absurd question. If there are any gods, and they want humans to know about them, wouldn't it be clearly apparently to all?

@irwinshung809

2 жыл бұрын

YES.

@andystokes8702

2 жыл бұрын

Why would a Christian college have apologetics lectures? What are they being taught in this class - How to confidently argue in favour of the Christian position regardless of truth?

5:02 When they says that it is so fine tuned to fit us, I immediately think of the survival bias. But even without thinking of that, I don’t see how it is fine tuned just for us given that more than half of the earth is oceans.

I'm quite literally obsessed with your channel

I like this saying I heard - "God is not an answer to any question. God is just another question masquerading as an answer"

@aazhie

3 жыл бұрын

That's a great one!

@goldenalt3166

3 жыл бұрын

They define "God" as "the answer" and that answer is "shut up!".

@vincegonzalez2171

3 жыл бұрын

So then, what created god?

"This is a problem science can't answer, it doesn't have evidence, but it isn't a problem for Christianity, because we don't have to prove any of our assumptions!"

@Dozav7

2 жыл бұрын

Someone had to create the universe, but since god is outside of space and time and has always existed, we don’t have to explain what created god.

@deesott5123

2 жыл бұрын

Hhahaha You say presumption we say welcome to knowing a God who is just that amazing and can do all things. Jesus loves you and died for our sins amen beautiful day to serve the Lord Jesus

@SenhorAlien

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dozav7 go ahead and explain how something can exist outside of time and space, first of all, and then explain why the universe didn't come about by itself. Good luck.

@SenhorAlien

2 жыл бұрын

@@deesott5123 ridiculous.

@maxuwl

Жыл бұрын

@@Dozav7 i dont think the bibble says anything about space and time

Drew, I don’t know how you’ll feel about me saying this, but you’re one of the most Christian people I’ve ever met, and you’re an incredible atheist that every christian should learn from. I don’t really know how to express how amazing this video, especially the final minutes, were. I know you’ve already come to terms with your deconstruction, and I really don’t hope to be so forward with my comment, but I just wanted to be a Christian that validated the faith you did have, because it’s clear to me that it was more real than the faith of many I’ve met who still call themselves Christian, while also admiring the atheist you’ve become. You’re a damn good person, better than I often am, and finding this channel makes me happy.

Thank you!!!

My god these questions from students absolutely breaks my heart. "Why you do hard stuff like science? Ain't God easier?"

@SillyRoneo

2 жыл бұрын

I'm disturbed

@gamingguard1an167

2 жыл бұрын

Nice quote. However, I couldn't seem to find that anywhere throughout the hour-long full debate video. Where'd you get it from?

@imfamoushippo0423

2 жыл бұрын

Second on gaming guardian

@josephmatthews7698

2 жыл бұрын

@@gamingguard1an167 No problem we all make mistakes. I'm paraphrasing obviously but it's the young lady at 9:00 who asked what I simplified.

@josephmatthews7698

2 жыл бұрын

@@imfamoushippo0423 9:00 young lady. I paraphrased obviously instead of writing the several sentences she said.

A Christian doing deception, oh the humanity.

@carlose5751

3 жыл бұрын

😂😂😂

@alenasenie6928

3 жыл бұрын

"You shall not lie"

@cobalius

3 жыл бұрын

@@alenasenie6928 iT wAs JuSt RoLeplAYinG

@aazhie

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah, we've certainly never seen that one happen. XD

@xaenon

3 жыл бұрын

@@alenasenie6928 "It's in the name of Jeebus so I'm exempt." Words Christians base their entire lives on.

Im glad you handled the “distraction” part because that bothered me in the video. Really the only part that did to me personally.