Yes, I find it interesting how small the house batteries are. We were told for 85% of our house use we'd need a 5.5kw/h battery. Our little Zoe sits outside with a whopping 52kw/h battery. It certainly makes sense to connect everything up.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

kWh. No slash. Uppercase W. Lowercase k and h. That being said, car batteries are MASSIVE, and these V2G applications are also quite low power compared to fast charging or accelerating a car, so the wear on the batteries should also be minimal.

@Flickerbrain

2 ай бұрын

@@geirmyrvagnes8718 Thanks for the kWh correction, never quite sure what is correct.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

@@Flickerbrain What "everybody knows", everybody has to learn for the first time at some point. At least once. 😅

@flodjod

2 ай бұрын

why would anyone get a battery that fails to supply 100% of needs

@Flickerbrain

2 ай бұрын

@@flodjod Some times the sun doesn't shine.

In my view V2G cannot come fast enough, I have 2EVs sitting on my driveway more often than out on the road and I have a time of use tariff, all perfect for lowering the cost of energy in my home.

@hugovale6360

2 ай бұрын

The only reason it has not come sooner is because some car companies also have home battery products to sell. In Tesla's case, it directly competes with their powerwalls, so they made up the excuse it would degrade car batteries, which is a dumb excuse since a house has much less power intensity needs than a car. So in other words, we don't have this yet because greed.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

​govale6360 good point

@tomstdenis

2 ай бұрын

@@hugovale6360Even under lower power loads of a house the energy loads are enormous meaning you'll go through far more charge cycles quicker than if you just used your EV battery to drive.

@tomstdenis

2 ай бұрын

The amount you save on your electricity bill won't offset the cost of replacing your battery if you're daily deep discharging it unless your grid provider has some sort of surge pricing which many grids don't have.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

@@tomstdenis you'd just get a nio and rent the battery, degradation be da*ned, 😂😆. China and Europe have huge differences between peak energy and overnight energy. For v2g you'd want to sell it during the day not bother with your home I wouldn't think. At least if you go to work each day

I have hooked V2L from my BYD Seal to my home solar system giving me access to 82kWh of extra battery storage equivalent to 6 Tesla Powerwalls. Here in Thailand I am not allowed to feed power back to the grid so I given back my electric meter for now and gone completely off-grid with 2 EVs and an electric motorbike. Videos on my channel for the doubters.

Also, don't forget that Schneider Electric and SolarEdge plus others are selling systems to add V2G to your solar system. Since the solar inverter is already grid interactive, their new systems just treat your EV as a huge battery, if the vehicle is compatible.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

For now, that is a big if. But that is clearly one way of doing it.

@flodjod

2 ай бұрын

to get solar installed without full use battery storage is leaving yourself open to be robbed by the grid

@jankoodziej877

2 ай бұрын

Regular solar inverters do not allow adding batteries. You need a hybrid inverter, which is typically a few times more expensive.

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

@@jankoodziej877 They are no longer expensive and barely any more than plan PV inverters now. a 5kW hybrid inverter can be had for a grand and a 3kW one for £800.

Great review, and really insightful. Makes you step back and rethink this whole transition in a different way. Every day is a learning day. Especially liked the summary “We can stop thinking of electrons like petrol to be consumed and more like data to be traded, swapped and gamified”.

@simonhenry7867

2 ай бұрын

Most EVs have a one way flow out of the inverter. Early model 3s definitely do.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

For all the above reasons and more V2G, makes far more sense at a variable capacity battery pack swapping station.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

E-motor does it need or use an inverter (AC motors do need a rectifier, which is sometimes misled labeled as a power inverter) and Tesla has nothing to do with this .... (Except for the battery swapping FUD that comes from the Elon sycophants) But no matter how it is rationalized, battery swapping is still the best option...

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

Avoiding the key fact that battery swapping is just the better option.... doesn't change that fact... Plus most of the reasons why, have nothing to do with electronics... For example it makes more sense logistically.... To have the excess battery capacity of an EV at a battery swapping station for most trips.... Via the use of modular or variable sized swappable battery packs.... Plus battery swappable packs are leased, so EV owners don't have to worry about v2g degrading the battery.... The list of advantages for the use of battery swapping just keeps going on.. 'Just because your only tool is a hammer, doesn't mean everything is a nail' it's not just about converting DC to AC...

Wow, I'm so early 2/3 of the comments are bots... is that a good grade or bad? Maybe it means you are popular? Anyways, yes, batteries on wheels need to identify as stationary storage when they are... stationary 🙂

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

😂😆 well said

@JayCreates

2 ай бұрын

How may I ask are you recognising bots in this AI era, genuine question

@jamesderrick8201

2 ай бұрын

Generic comments with no relation to the contents, but full of emoji. These seek engagement to reduce the chances of a future strike. Not quite like xhittrer letters+numbers accounts, but the same result.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

​@@JayCreates I'm not a robot. Beep. What?

@JayCreates

2 ай бұрын

@@geirmyrvagnes8718 caught you! But do you know the difference

Thanks, Imogen! -- maybe good to mention that the Utrecht experiment showed signs that batteries used for V2G actually were either not or surprisingly positive influenced by this usage. Kia announced that all their models shall be V2G enabled both AC and DC, and they want to bring their own chargers. So yes, I guess we might see uptake soon, though I believe more as V2H. V2G asks for so much additional changes in norms and laws, it might take a bit longer...

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Nio is actively doing it, but just China. Europe is horrific red tape everywhere. It'll take forever.

@nickiwelchering8090

2 ай бұрын

That sounds very interesting. Can you provide a link to the information that V2G has surprisingly low or positive effect on the battery? It would be interesting to know how this affects the lifetime of the battery.

Thanks, a very clear exposition of quite a complicated topic. Proper V2G, without the need for another 'static' battery, is a must-have. Not only can it benefit the house owner directly, but it offers significant grid benefits at the national level. Last but not least, it's a more efficient use of key raw materials. Why (as many do) have a static *and* a mobile battery, when one will do.

Very nicely produced episode- very clear!

We’ve got a V2X bidirectional charger. We charge the car (2014 LEAF) with off peak electricity and use the car’s battery to power our home (Vehicle-2-Home). The Distribution Network Operator (DNO) has export limited our charger to 3.68kW if it’s used for Vehicle-2-Grid. The charger is capable of exporting up to 6kW.

@neilhollow1937

2 ай бұрын

Nick are you on the trial? We've bought a leaf and are still using the granny socket partly since I don't want to buy a one directional charger for a year or so. Could power the house overnight in summer easily and charge from our PV. Octopus have launched a tariff so I guess we are getting closer - sigh.

@nick52525

2 ай бұрын

Yes we are on a trial with Indra. We still have our 7kW wall charger installed.

@neilhollow1937

2 ай бұрын

@@nick52525 Lucky you been alright?

THANKS FULLY , for sharing this and the future🤗💚💚💚

The new Renault R5, and also the future Renault 4 on some higher trims will be natively compatible with bidirectional AC V2G and V2H. It may require the new Mobilize charger for it to work, and it should allow to send back electricity to the grid and earn a bit of money…

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Good news. Very few vehicles with it right now.

@SchwuppSchwupp

2 ай бұрын

Do you have a source? I ready this annoncement and was thrilled to get a R5, but sadly, in the most recent R5 presentations the v2h capability was not mentioned any more.

@nicolasdujarrier

2 ай бұрын

@@SchwuppSchwupp I didn’t check fully but I didn’t find any mention of V2H on the Mobilize website. I guess we will have to wait the end of this year to know if indeed support the V2H but, it was theoretically something talked about a few years ago… Really hope that the Renault R5 and Renault 4L will support V2H because I liked the idea to store peak solar production, and also that it would be possible to use the car as a back-up generator…

@nicolasdujarrier

2 ай бұрын

@@SchwuppSchwupp On the last few days, I watched a KZread video in which one of Renault person states that V2H won’t be supported at launch :(… They are considering it and reviewing it, but V2H is not even officially planned at this stage : really, really disappointed about that !!!

Glad to hear that nod to Chademo being ahead of it's time with V2L tech. It's a bit like the Betamax vs VHS video tape format saga. Betamax was the better format but VHS was the one that became universal. Of course, they are now both pretty much defunct. Chademo is still supported but CCS became the much preferred format and now the NACS format is set to replace both of them. However, the idea of exporting energy from your car is here to stay. The one massive advantage of V2L is that it takes strain AWAY from the Grid as opposed to increasing it as the EV trolls like to incorrectly state at every opportunity.

@trevorberridge6079

2 ай бұрын

@@OskarHersch It DOES matter because other standards have been capable but not active. ChadeMo has always been capable AND active.

@t1n4444

2 ай бұрын

😂😂😂😂 I despair. The EV batteries have to be recharged at some stage. Does it ever occur to the wilfully blind that by pushing this V2xxx nonsense is simply a way of conning people into buying EVs. Of course it doesn't, the poorly educated within the realms of technology simply don't understand how they're being gulled.

@watcher24601

2 ай бұрын

​@@trevorberridge6079exactly it's the protocol standards for the communication. The physical socket and cable just make the connection. Never heard of NACS, maybe in the wrong part of the world, can't be any more clunky than CHADEMOs two charging port system

What an excellent explanation of the challenges and alternative solutions to implementing V2G. 👏👏

Nice graphics guys! Roberts place gets a nice shot at 6:32 😎

The problems with conventional V2G, besides the technical and cost issues. It is logistics. EVs are parked at various locations, bidirectional charging would have to become ubiquitous It is a very long way off at best. And who knows if it will ever happen? Plus that 10 to 20 percent, when you're driving tends to be when the grid needs it. So it still will just be a marginal option at best. A far more effective option is V2G, utilizing modular (or variable sized) packs, via battery swapping stations. Since the excess battery capacity is at a swapping station, where it can do V2G balancing. Which is already being done at battery swapping stations in China. Conventional V2G is just a niche feel good option, that's just not scalable in most cases.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Well said. Nio also is live with v2g charging piles for all their vehicles. China 2024 energy policy is stressing v2g in a massive way for grid stabilization. Nio's swap stations in Germany and Denmark are live with v2g/ energy arbitrage.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

​@@reginald7214 That's another advantage of BAAS, no fear of V2G battery degradation. When EV owners, don't own the battery pack... I wonder where they place the V2G units? And if owners have any fears of not being able to get home in an emergency? I guess you can swap it out at a battery swapping station. After thinking about it, they tend to be synergistic options. Actually there are far more interesting battery swapping networks, than what NIO offers.... For example, CATL's modular battery swapping network.... But since NIO is rolling out in Europe it tends to be the only one that gets coverage In Europe.... But the competition is forcing NIO to become more innovative, such as agreeing to create a battery swapping standard with Geely and other automakers.... So even if the detractors are correct and NIO goes bankrupt eventually.... The technology will just be absorbed by another company.... Thank you for your salient points....

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

@@nc3826 well said

I love the red vespa model in the background!

Thanks for another informative video! I can't wait until all of this V2G, V2L, V2H just work no matter what you buy. I've been holding off on buying an EV and solar for my house until this is worked out and standard (along with some of the newer battery tech). My dream is that when it is all working, can add solar to my house, a smallish home battery, and use my car as a battery too, at night. We have lots of sun each day where I live, so everything can charge during the day, and then the batteries can be used overnight. I doubt I would furnish battery energy back to the grid because of the impact on the battery's life UNLESS the local utility paid a premium for it. But I'd be happy to sell them any excess energy I generate during the day after my battery and car are topped off. Most of my neighbors that have solar work during the day away from home. They don't have batteries, so most of what they generate from their solar is sold to their utility at wholesale prices. At night, they have to buy energy from the local utility at retail peak prices and then charge their vehicles in the wee hours at retail off-peak prices. So they are still buying lots of electricity from the local utility each evening and night, and getting a little money back due to the energy they are selling the utility at wholesale prices. WHEN V2Everything is available, I don't need my local utility as much, and a lot less energy will be racing around my neighborhood. Lots of people mention how our grids are undersized for the future. I think this technology will mitigate some of that as people like myself become more self-contained and use the grid less and less.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

For all the above reasons and more V2G, makes far more sense at a variable capacity battery pack swapping station.

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

Right this is how it should be working already. It already does in various trials and a minority of cars, 'chargers', software and power companies. There is a big fight to end up in control of this so it's important we all insist on open protocols so it works _everywhere_ not various proprietary systems that only work with a particular car/'charger'/inverter/power-company. Too many companies are trying to own the space at the cost of interoperabilty.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

Conspiracy logic usually has a grain of truth... But more often than not, It's just the fact that standardization and incentives are needed ... Since there are a plethora of ways to do this, so without compatibility and incentives.... it will never become widespread.... But battery swapping is still the best option, in terms of implementing it... Since it becomes so much simpler for everyone...

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

@@nc3826 How does battery swapping help me use my car battery to run my home? Battery swapping can only happen at a swap station. An EVSE at home which can take power out as well as put it in means the battery can be filled and emptied some every day to minimise grid costs. In our case it would stay plugged in for a month or more at a time in winter. Battery swapping is only relevant to fast charging on road trips.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

​ @xxwookey Battery swapping stations, do bidirectional charging energy arbitrage, much more effectively, based on a database algorithms, than any home bidirectional charging. Plus it allows much lower capacity battery packs, to be utilized most of the time... And just swap in a higher capacity battery pack when needed. While conversely having an EV sit at home for months at a time is a relatively inefficient use of that technology and its carbon footprint. An appropriately sized stationary energy storage system would be a much more efficient use of resources. And is offset by that lower capacity swappable battery pack, which normally can be used to power a battery swappable electric vehicle. Battery swapping has a plethora of advantages, which tend to be overlooked in the West.

Pionix and EVrest have been making this work for more than a year now. And it's totally generic, not tied to any particular car manufacturer, charger manaufacturer or grid supplier. This is the right way to do it. It already works on the Kia/Hyundai vehicles, and it would work on all the MEB cars if the software just stopped erroring out when the charge rate goes negative (which is presumably what the OTA update referred to in the video does. .

We live in Maine, US , and were able to lease a plug in hybrid finally.

Good project

very interesting

A car, is a daily depreciating asset starting from the first second you sit in it and drive 1 centimetre, with an immediate drop anywhere between 5% and 20%. Having this in mind along with battery degradation, makes it an even odder choice to use a V2G service, while counting that EVs whether we like it or not have internal soft counters for everything. Having said that, it will be an interesting game to see being played out in the future, how these perform, and how they hold their value for resale, along with the costs in between that might arise.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Fair point.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

If you accept that a car is a depreciating asset with a limited "lifespan", it would only make sense to get a bit more out of it while you have it. Some cash if you want to play it that way, or some energy backup security if that is your thing, sounds good.

@davidcottrell570

2 ай бұрын

The next step is widespread LFP batteries or similar tech, with sufficient power density that renders battery life a non-topic and makes V2G viable. Given how FC is reporting progress, I can see this being standard on most cars in the coming five years. It would be crazy if it wasn’t.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

@@OskarHersch ...or later. Or earlier. And in the future, who knows? But this is not even about distance.

@PandaKnight52

2 ай бұрын

I don't think depreciation would be a consideration in this case. V2L/G would make it deprecate less as you can keep your battery in optimal ranges. Also you would want to keep the car because it's more useful to you.

Fully Charged Team; Please can you address some more current issues, V2G etc is very interesting but I see countless articles about how EV manufacturers are cutting production because of poor sales; is this true ? Your channel advocates the use of EV vehicles, and you have convinced me that my next car should be EV but I am getting “nervous”…. Articles report poor charging infrastructure, cost of electricity, battery life, I could go on…. You have a powerful channel, please will you counter the rhetoric ….

@Stephen-Jones

2 ай бұрын

Recommend you watch some of their other vids, they address a few bits a pieces around the myths and truths of EV ownership (or go along to one of the Everything Electric events, the people there are super friendly and will tell you the real pros and cons for your situation as best they can)

You can go with nio. You can rent the battery and use v2g at home or at the mall or work or wherever to make a few bucks. Obviously they have limits to home much you can use it but then u don't need to worry about the battery health strictly speaking. Just swap in a new one if there was an issue..easier for recycling too. The software between your car and the local electric provider is buit in. Obviously there lots of providers to get on board so not live everywhere ( yet).

@JohnR31415

2 ай бұрын

Home use is such a lower power draw that it would have virtually no degradation implications…

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

​@JohnR3141 cool, even better

Thanks

Nio has 1 battery swap station in Denmark. From just that 1 with energy arbitrage thru v2g they expect to earn 10s of thousands of euros annually with no high loss of energy in the packs themselves. Pretty good gig if you can get it. Also has a Solar roof for power production. Since the cars also do v2g years u can rent the battery and not worry about deterioration.

@MrKOenigma

2 ай бұрын

Degradation?

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

@@MrKOenigma ahh that's the word, 😂😆. Thank you!

@flodjod

2 ай бұрын

outsourcing is never a cost positive

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

@@flodjod outsourcing what?

@t1n4444

2 ай бұрын

Outsourcing? Almost all of us outsource our electricity supply from a company outsourcing it's own supply from the grid sort of thing. In UK we've been outsourcing electricity for at least a hundred years or so ... and gas ... (pipe or tank) ... or water. You might say we "outsource" the contents of our septic tanks as well as. If you added a power wall and/or V2L and solars (not quite so useful in UK) where's the cost saving if you include the equipment? Even in really atrocious weather UK doesn't suffer that many outages. Hospitals, say, sit on a generator(s). Some defence stuff might have two completely separate incomers off the grid from entirely independent connections, and a genny if Armageddon does arrive. Mind you most of us would have been exposed to a touch of gamma radiation and probably not too bothered about much after that anyway. Those in their own fall out bunkers will only be delaying things by a couple of weeks anyway.

Was on a V2G trial with my Leaf and an Indra product. While the wall charger worked, over 18m I saved/made over £1000 owing to the business model of selling back dear and buying cheap. As someone else has said it’s mad having a small 5.5kWh battery at home when you’ve got 30kWh sitting on the drive. That battery just happens to have four wheels on it. Roll on V2G and thanks for the episode. Where can we buy the tech featured?

Interesting tech, we definitely need more V2G and V2X capabilities

1:46 Sono motors had the Sion that could also load V2V

Nice. But in Western Australia the Electric provider still will not allow V2G or V2 H. Shame as with the roof top solar I generate is 8 times what I use for my domestic household usage. And still drive a dirty Diesel.

AC coupling is complicated in North America because the car interface is single phase but homes and grid connections are split phase. You need at least an autotransformer to get split phase from single phase. 😢

@robinbennett5994

2 ай бұрын

The car's speed controller is probably has at least 3 phases though. Those are independent solid-state switches, so you could use two of them with slightly different programming.

@pfunk768

2 ай бұрын

@@robinbennett5994 In Noram, there's only two high power conductors connected to the vehicle through the charge port, in both J1772 and J3400.

@ElectraFlarefire

2 ай бұрын

I thought most cars there charged from 220v, so that is using power across both phases? I could understand it complicating 110v V2G at high power however due to imbalance, but no more than USING a single 110v appliance would.

An obvious question to me is why isn’t Tesla leading the way with V2H & V2G? When you consider that they have the knowledge, and equipment already with their Powerwall and Gateway 2 to integrate a battery with a homes electric system (including solar) and a means of isolating the house from the grid if there is a power outage. Plus they have developed the Gateway 2 so that it satisfies the requirements of grid operators in many different countries. Add in that they make their own AC & DC chargers, produce some of the best software and user interfaces available, it seems odd that with all this technology they haven’t yet made a home bidirectional charger? Seems like a good reason for Imogene to go knocking on their door to find out.

@Dankflamio

2 ай бұрын

I’m also curious why they chose not to worry about that feature. Is it just a software update and an adapter? Or will they need new hardware for it. Either way, I’m happy to just live in the car if there is a power outage 😂

very clever solution. i woul'd suggest not only to make v2g mandatory for every new car, but also a small home battery storage for every new building.

🔌🔌AC or DC voltage from the power source is a minor issue compared to getting the 3000+ utilities in the USA to approve a closed transition to their grid. A 5-millisecond bumpless power transfer can take five months for utility approval. It took years for utilities to approve closed transition solar inverters for residential base loading. Even now some utilities only allow open transition so no solar or V2G.🔌🔌

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

That is the peculiarly restrictive US with its crazy array of state rules and multitude of power authorities. Most countries have agreed grid sync standards for PV which can just be used for car batteries too. Power transfer management is a separate matter. We can already do this in the UK, and, I presume, most of Europe.

My local municipality in California will not allow me to install a Powerwall to go with my solar system. I would love to be able to use my EV’s as battery backup.

@ianwhitlock1920

2 ай бұрын

yes, utility suppliers hate this idea which tend to free their customers from their grip

Sounds great - but how does V2G impact the expected life of my EV-battery? Will it loose capacity faster or is there no change? Just curious to know!

@robinbennett5994

2 ай бұрын

In theory, the impact should be minimal. The car's motor (and rapid chargers) can run at over 100kW, while V2G will be limited by your house wiring to 3 or 7kW. And you'll probable only ever export for an hour or two. Most modern batteries are expected to outlast the rest of the car, so a little extra use will probably make no difference.

@EcoHouseThailand

2 ай бұрын

I use V2L from my EV to supplement my home solar system. If I used my EV for 8 hours at night at 1kW/hr I would use less than 10% of the car’s battery which I can charge back from my solar system in about an hour the next day.

my 1970 model has been sat in the garage for 2 years waiting for conversion but until companies stop quoting more than the price of a brand new model y, the conversion industry is doomed to fail when it runs out of super wealthy customers

@Obvsaninternetexpert

2 ай бұрын

custom car jobs... electric or v8 swaps... were only ever for wealthy customers, and probably will only ever be for them

@rogerstarkey5390

2 ай бұрын

Needs Battery prices lower (coming) A universal adaptable cradle for motors, or a set of specific "off the shelf" bolt together cradle units per vehicle model (shouldn't be too hard with CNC modelling?) . A "standard" plug and play loom. . The other issue is you DON'T want to be playing with 400vdc packs as a DIY mechanic. . You'd have to buy the kit. Strip the vehicle, mechanically fit the cradle and motor, plus wiring if you're confident. Then trailer to a qualified technician for the battery. Then type register/ MOT.

@jolive3743

2 ай бұрын

@@rogerstarkey5390 just gonna do it myself tbh bud. P.s. inspector from DVLA said if he was me he'd just do it and not bother involving the authorities

@jolive3743

2 ай бұрын

@@Obvsaninternetexpert even when you find customisers, they just want to use off the shelf upgrades anyway mate.

@Obvsaninternetexpert

2 ай бұрын

@@jolive3743 cos doing things actually custom costs more then most people understand and is prohibitively expensive for most Unless you do it diy

CCS is the standard (in Europe) for plugging your car into something, so surely the only thing you need to do is to update the CCS standard to include V2G...

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

Indeed, although the CCS people have been astonishingly slow to actually agree a spec for this. We've had a draft for about 3 years, but I don't think it's actually official yet. I'm not quite sure what they are waiting for. Bidirectional AC already works on some cars, and is much cheaper to implement than DC. Given that 7kW is enough for most purposes it seems to me that doing this the AC way will be much more cost-effective.

I have an ID Buzz, how can I use VTG and VTH? Are there any chargers that can offer this as I haven't had mine fitted yet?

@craggy4749

2 ай бұрын

Currently No CCS V2H chargers are on the market yet (uk at least)

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

The Buzz won't work until they enable it (promised mid 2024 at the moment). For working 'charger' hardware there is the Wallbox Quasar 2 and the Pionix YETI+YAK kit. I'm not aware of any others yet, but I expect various announcements of more kit soon.

Will this not wear out your battery quicker as a battery has a finite number of charge/discharge cycles ?

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

That was a worry initially, but it turns out no. House load is very small compared to car load. Trials done by Nissan a few years ago found that the gentle exercise around the mid charge zone actually improved the battery lifetime slightly.

Can we please have a link to the company interviewed?

Please bring this on. In the darkest heaviest but happy days in winter my demand is 27kWh per day. My Powerwall has 75kWh of storage sat on the drive.

Although if people have range anxiety as things are, we can't really count on much of the baterries capacity to be actually loaned to the grid, so the potential comes with this big caveat. I'd guess something around 30% of EV batteries would actually be surrendered, and then there's the logistics of it all and the practical necessity for middlemen to come in and take a cut, making the prospects less convincing to the end user. Also, people would probably have to charge by day while they're at work and then V2G in the evening. This would make it harder for overnight level 2 charging to suffice for people's comfort. So, probably a step forward, but not a game changer.

@ab-tf5fl

2 ай бұрын

Depends how the person uses their car. For people that work from home or take public transit to work, but own a car for weekends, the car actually is sitting at home, day and night, most of the time. Of course, V2G actually making economic sense will depend on the cost of the equipment to hook everything together not costing more than it's worth, an assumption that, at the moment, seems far from certain.

I have a 2020 Nissan Leaf sitting on my drive that I'd love to use for V2G and V2H. Can anyone tell me where I can get the necessary kit to make that work? I can't find anyone selling Chademo bidirectional chargers, which is a real shame.

Me, I prefer the system in my citroen 1.6hdi. It's less complicated, has no hustle, cheap, no loans, and is easy to fix. I just go to the filling station and top it up, that's all.

What about battery degradation. There are only so many cycles a battery has. Does vehicle to grid reduce the life of the battery, significantly, for its main purpose, powering the car? Also, home batteries are very expensive I was thinking what about a small home battery of say 5 kw that can act as a 6 hour buffer in a black out but can also link with the car for days of emergency power or years of extra overnight or winter power.

@rogerstarkey5390

2 ай бұрын

Deg isn't a problem. Vehicle location is.

@markumbers5362

2 ай бұрын

@@rogerstarkey5390 By location do you mean how far the energy has to travel from the car back to a substation?

Here in the states, our grid operators are commercial for-profit companies and are fighting renewables and V2G with everything they have. Half of our two party political system is trying to prevent the forward progress on all fronts penalizing EV drivers with higher registration fees, preventing net-metering, and even, in some municipalities, changing ordinances to make home solar installations virtually impossible. 🤬

V2G is an exciting area of EV's and will surely encourage more ownership . It would be a perfect addition to my Tesla Powerwall.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Indeed

This would be great to have but I don’t have a home storage battery. If I buy one I wouldn’t realistically need this solution, although I’m sure it will benefit many. 👏🏻

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

Even if you have got a home battery doing arbitrage on 70kWh of car battery makes more money than doing it on 10kWh of home battery. This situation may not last long, but right now a bigger battery makes you more money.

I think just nio and the ev9 from kia do vtg commercially. V2g/ energy arbtration is live in china-sell energy back during high loads, charge cheaply at night. And of course nio swap stations have been balancing the grid for years, the newest in netherlands. Chinas newest 2024 energy policy stressed v2g on a grand scale.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

The swap stations perform: . Virtual power plant project cooperation. Promote charging stations, battery swap stations, energy storage stations, adjustable loads and other aggregated resources to access the virtual power plant platform to provide peak shifting, frequency regulation and demand-side response services for the power grid.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

** and Nissan leaf and f-150

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

All the kia/hyundia E-GMP cars work SFAIK.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

@@xxwookey no idea, nio is the only one I know of that has dedicated v2g public chargers but who knows. Meaning the only one that can currently earn money directly from the grid.

Don't need an AC inverter in the car or any other special equipment outside the car. Just about any solar PV inverter can take in the 400 volts from the car battery and feed it to the grid and/or home battery. Just need to tell the car to connect its battery to the charge port (which it does when it DC charges).

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

Which is still an external inverter.... Which is what was stated in the post... And in the real world it's far more complex...since everything has to be compatible and additional equipment is required to keep it safe such as a transfer switch... Which ends up being complex and costly... For all the above reasons and more V2G, makes far more sense at a variable capacity battery pack swapping station.

@MarkSpohr

2 ай бұрын

@@nc3826 My point was that you don't need a special V2G inverter. Most bog standard solar PV inverters will work and many people already have these installed in their houses. You do need a communication box to tell the car to connect the car battery to the charge port but that is a simple protocol circuit. You don't need a transfer switch since the DC voltage goes to the solar inverter which takes care of the grid connection and (optional) house battery management. The solar inverter just thinks it's connected to a solar PV string.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

@@MarkSpohr But the post didn't specify a "special inverter" or an "AC inverter in the car". So your comments are not applicable to the post. But in the real world it is extremely complex and costly and it has numerous logistics issues. We've been hearing about V2G for over a decade. If it's so simple why doesn't it already exist on a widespread basis? The truth is current established V2G and V2H systems do require a specific inverter and transfer switch, such as for the Ford Lightning and is usually over 10,000 USD after labor costs. And protocols alone do not establish a standard for example there's more than one CCS Plug and Play charging standard in the US. So not all inverters will necessarily adhere to a particular set of protocols. V2G ie Pack2Grid, makes far more sense at a variable capacity battery pack swapping station. That is completely done behind the scenes. Which is already a proven technology in China. And is just starting to be done in Europe. (Even if it's not as fun for the backyard tinkerer.) Let's check it out in another decade,to see what form is dominant? I know what I would bet on....

@MarkSpohr

2 ай бұрын

@@nc3826 My point is that it doesn't need to be complicated or expensive.

@nc3826

2 ай бұрын

@@MarkSpohr good luck with that dream

The new Renault R5 E-Tech will have V2G and a 52kW battery (sadly it is NMC chemistry). Will be for sale around September this year for around €27k. That V2G is the reason we consider buying it. (NMC is the reason we consider NOT buying it.)

Charging and discharging your battery whilst it's connected to the grid will surely reduce the life of your battery?

My charger has a CT (current transformer) so it knows how much power is being consumed by the house and EV. So you don't necessarily need the grid to be controlling things if you just want to be powering the house to net zero usage. The charger should just ask the car for a certain number of kW up to a limit.

"Electrons" don't move back and forth betweeen the storage and the grid - energy does.

V2G is great, for now. I suspect that soonish there will be bountiful, affordable utility scale grid, and residential home, storage available. The question is whether there's time between now and then, to make the technology a general standard. Or, if by the time that comes to pass, it will be redundant. It's certainly not the simplest solution to increasing grid storage. V2L is just plain useful. For any car. I doubt that will ever change.

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

V2G will remain useful for years - it's not about to become redundant. It's daft to buy a lot of house battery if you have already bought a large battery in the car (and it's at home often). And we do already have standards for all of this - people just need to start using them (and not adding proprietary extras to subvert things).

@Sq7Arno

2 ай бұрын

​@@xxwookey I understand V2G as the car battery hooking up to the public grid. The public grid can draw from it, and you can be paid for the service. You sure powering your home (alone) qualifies as V2G? As opposed to V2L..

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

@@Sq7Arno Well, if your house is already powered (e.g from your PV or your battery), then adding power from the car is identical technologically to when your house is connected to the grid, because the important technological feature is syncing with the AC in order to deliver power. If your house is dead and disconnected, than yes it would just be V2L, because there is no existing AC frequency to sync with. Also it's not really right to say the 'grid draws from your battery'. The controlling device in terms of whether power flows in or out is the inverter. That could be in the car, in your 'charger' (actually EVSE) or in your house. And (ideally) you can control that, or you can choose to hand over control of it to the power company so they can decide when to flow which way. I hope that makes sense. At the moment the power company or car company tries to sell you 'black box' paired device so that only they can control what happens. What you really want is your own device, and you let that choose (e.g. using signals from the power company and a weather forecast) when to charge and when to discharge. This means you can change providers/cars/batteries in the future without having to get different hardware.

@Sq7Arno

2 ай бұрын

@xxwookey The two terms still mean two different things. I'm a great big fan of the idea behind V2G at the moment. But, as was pointed out. It's no simple thing to implement the standards effectively and widely. My entire point is that I suspect we'll have extremely plentiful grid storage in the form of banks upon banks of up and coming economical and fit for purpose batteries - By the time we've even started approaching effective V2G standards adoption. I do follow the news, and things are looking extremely promising on that front. Even for purposes like Steel and Aluminum smelting energy demand. If your concern is V2L on the other hand. As I said this will always be useful. Including for purposes such as powering your home. And many more cars support V2L already, than V2G. It's a major selling point for many EV buyers. And, it's simply easier and cheaper to do without the world, including your car's manufacturer and the electrical company, having to reach a universal consensus.

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

@@Sq7Arno Yes of course V2L and V2G are different things. One requires a sync with an existing AC frquency, one doesn't. Yes there is quite a lot of battery going in on various grids at the moment (certainly in the UK), but that pales into insignificance when you add up all the cars: that is a _lot_ of storage (about 1 TWh). Given that the world is likely to be battery-minerals and/or manufacture constrained for the next few years at least, it makes a lot of sense to use the car batteries for grid balancing rather than make all the batteries again. And it's not really hard to make it work at all. It already works for Kia and Hyundai. It works for MEB once a small software change is pushed later this year. We already have the comms standards. We don't need a 'universal consensus' on anything beyond the comms standards, and those already exist. There can be plenty of different business and control models given open standards implemented in connection equipment. You are right that there is potential for other, cheaper, more static-appropriate battery tech to go on the grid, reducing the need for expensive mobile-optimised batteries to be use for this purpose, but the demand for storage is already very large in dunkelflaute periods, and will continue to grow as nearly every house gets a heat pump and nearly all the cars go electric. I'm fairly sure we can use all the storage we can get for the net decade.

I have a concern with V2G. How do we ensure that the Grid never reduces the car's battery below 75% capacity or, maybe in my more generous moments, down to 50% of capacity? I can see sharing elwctrons back to the Grid but I don't want to find a dead car when I need it if, say, a blackout hit but we didn't know it because the Grid acted like a vampire, sucking the power shortfall from all of the EVs in the neighborhood. I also want to be paid for every electron pulled from my vehicle since I was billed for every electron going in and by paid, I mean at the same rate as the electric company billed me AND I want that money deposited into my bank account NOT as a "credit" on my bill.

Having EV's offer V2x as DC output makes most sense, as should only require a software update to enable. Prior to the Nissan LEAF offering V2G option, the Mitsubishi iMiEV offered V2L option using an external "PowerBox" the size of an A4 paper ream (500 sheets). In 2012, this a great option for home power outage, camping, etc. Cost was reasonable, and the 1500 watt PowerBox was was portable at ~9 kg. An option to offload/charge via DC port could also transfer energy to an external energy storage, or too the EV. Once grid connections, come into play, particularly with AC, things get complex quickly. eg: AC signals need a way to manage and keep in-sync. The raw technology for converting DC to AC via an inverter is exactly the same as a solar inverter. Just slightly different management software.

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

Using the DC port requires your EVSE to manage 400 or 800V DC which is currently expensive (although it probably wouldn't be if it was standard). Doing it over 240V AC is a lot simpler and cheaper and still gives you 7kW (single phase) which is enough for most houses. 3-phase 22kW is enough for any sensible house. I think AC is the way to do for most people,but this is currently a subject of much debate with various companies invested in the 'one true way' on both schemes.

@AerialWaviator

2 ай бұрын

@@xxwookey When you say "currently expensive" you don't mention what part of the system is expensive? You probably skipped over the 1.5 kW portable option I mentioned. (above) Such would be under €1200 (the price the PowerBox sold for in Japan in ~2012) You're welcome to opinions, but there are many ways to interconnect, no 'one true way'.

@xxwookey

2 ай бұрын

@@AerialWaviator Sorry - yes I did miss your mention of the iMiEV 1.5kW V2L inverter. I was thinking of the various home Chademo bi-directional chargers which have been used in trials Those were 5-20 grand devices. Ultimately all these things are just inverters and cost primarily depends on power throughput. None should cost more than current PV inverters in reasonable volume. Do it the way the E-GMP platform (and the Zoe) does (re-use the motor inverter) and it's really cheap.

With all EVs currently coming with long battery warranties, manufacturers will likely not want to encourage this additional use of EV batteries which can only wear them out more quickly and without exceeding warranty mileage. A move to LFP helps but a more sophisticated form of car battery warranty that takes account of V2G is probably needed.

Aren't all EVs equipped with DC-to-AC inverters to drive the motor? Why is an extra inverter needed?

@MrKOenigma

2 ай бұрын

There also needs to be sensors to sense the exact grid frequency, and a filter to another out the sine wave.... Feeding to grid is a bit more complicated than driving a motor. But to be honest, not that much as there already is the inverter with every small solar system ❤❤😊

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

It is an excellent question. And the short answer is that it is not that easy, but I would like to hear the long answer of what exactly it would take, and if it could theoretically be better than a build in inverter just for this application.

@robinbennett5994

2 ай бұрын

Probably because it's easier for a retro-fitter to slap in an inverter that's designed for the job than it is to modify the car, especially as every model of car will be different.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

@@robinbennett5994 True. I was thinking more along the lines of an OEM. It does sound vaguely like something Tesla would do to not have to install an extra expensive component.

@zapfanzapfan

2 ай бұрын

I suspect the inverter that drives the motor is not a pure sine wave inverter.

If you have solar, could the inverter be part of the solution? 7kw V2G or V2L would be more than enough for most homes, most of the time. V2G seems a pretty obvious solution and ought to be mandated.

Cheers Imogen

Octopus have very recently sent a communication out to do this

V2G will put extra wear on the car battery. Difficult sell for a customer based on the cost of battery packs. True they last much longer than they did but still a cost to the end user. I have an Ioniq 5 and unless there was a major benefit to me I wouldn’t do it.

Your efforts and modesty are reflected in every video. Congratulations.

There's no mention of pricing. If I charge my car at grid price, 30p/ kWh, and then feed it back to the grid, what will I be paid as compensation? My solar exports are only paid at 15p/kWh, so how would my differently costed exports be dealt with?

@robinbennett5994

2 ай бұрын

That's a business decision, not something that you can predict from the physics. I guess you'll get somewhere between Octopus Agile Export, and the Saving Sessions. They'll have to pay enough to make it worth installing, but they'll keep the rest to themselves!

@markthomasson5077

2 ай бұрын

Eventually it should be that when they need it you get a good price, when they don’t need it they won’t accept it..and everything between

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

It would depend on the V2G scheme you signed up to. The pricing - and other - details would be known to you prior to you signing up.

I think you could have perhaps used this as an opportunity to explain that v2l is actually enough to make a difference, since you can always use this to charge directly a house battery with a low power inverter and battery charger, meeting the average power requirements, and the house battery and inverter provide the higher power output for peak loads. It also solves the problem of split phase in North America

Can’t believe you missed the fact that octopus now offer a V2G tariff?!? Only available on chademo chargers such as the Nissan Leaf, NV2000 and Mitsubishi Outlander.

MG5 has V2L and the Cupra Born most definitely Doesn’t.

Very good.

In Japan I believe all cars are to have this system.

They will make tons with a Tesla converter

public ev chargers price is 3 times more than petrol plus wait time V2G 2EVs driveway road use tariff, cost of energy home. house batteries . r 85% of our house 5.5kw/h battery. Zoe s52kw/h battery. connect everything up.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

You can reduce the cost of using public charging (by up to 50% depending on the network) by subscribing to the network. Non-subscribers will pay full price. My local charge network is priced at 38p to 48p per kwh, depending on which of the 3 subscription rates you use. At 38p per kwh, if you got 3.5 miles per kwh (which many EV's would) it would work out at probably less half the cost of using petrol.... I charge at home almost all the time, and it costs me 7.5p per kwh. For me, this works out at around 2p per mile, or less than an 8th of the cost of using petrol. I haven't needed to use a public charger for over a year.

Unless you live in California where it costs in both directions

Wouldn't it make sense to just piggy-back the SOLAR INVERTER to feed your vehicle's DC back into the grid? The solar inverter already converts DC to AC to feed back into the house & grid, you'd just plug your car's DC output inplace of the solar's DC output instead 🤷🏻‍♀. It's also pretty common for EV owners to have solar on their house.

Wouldn't that shorten the life of the battery having the grid drawing on it every night ?? Eg charge - recharge cycles

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

I think the consensus now is that not all cycles are equal. Very quick charging at high or low temperatures is bad. That probably goes for discharging (acceleration or top speed) in the car, too. Empty and full battery is often not super healthy. But relatively slowly charging/discharging when the battery is reasonably half-full is probably not a problem at all. Car batteries are HUGE compared to normal home batteries.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

The system would not necessarily draw on your battery every night. It would depend on the amount of energy you had agreed to sell back to the grid, at certain times etc. The details would be in any agreement you signed. There would of course be the facility to override the system manually....

I don't get why we need to do V2G, isn't it better to do V2H?

Hmm ... if we see cars feeding into the grid when they are parked at home then when do they find the time to get themselves recharged? Given the time taken to charge the battery at home then how long will the battery be supplying power to the home or grid? One other thing ref the notion of an onboard car inverter then that output would only be supplying the house mains phase (in UK). Google will help on the topic of how properties are connected to the grid in order to balance the phases. If a battery was charged away from the home on an "expensive" tariff then it would be an expensive way of doing the battery to home thing. All in all it looks as if most people are clueless on this topic and the entire nonsense is a case of technology looking for a home to solve a problem that doesn't exist. In fact it might be said that buying all this equipment to run a jome from a car battery simply shortens the life of said car battery. And increases the cost of running the home when the cost of a battery is factored into the equation. Nothing is really for free. This notion of battery backup is a bit silly in countries with a reliable mains supply. Perhaps that's why some car manufacturers steer clear of this "V2H/G/L" so the car battery isn't on such a brutal duty cycle working itself to death driving a home as well as the car? People who have researched why lithium ion batteries self ignite will know by now that there's an issue with "electrolyte degradation" which can cause heat to build up. For all we know that's what caused the three London buses to self ignite. Probably best to wait until hydrogen arrives before lashing out on power walls and the like. Google might be useful to discover how much CO2 is produced and released in the manufacture of lithium based cells. Plus the amount of water used in the lithium processing. Eventually the penny will drop as to how green lithium batteries aren't.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

It would depend on the amount of energy you had agreed to sell back to the grid. A V2G system is intelligent, in that it "learns" your normal daily EV requirements, and will not take anymore energy than you would need for the following day etc. You would of course be able to override the system at anytime, and set your own lower limit.....

Smart charging will mitigate most of the charging-related grid impacts in the short term, but I'll be very disappointed if this kind of bidirectional charging is not a standard feature in all EVs 10 years from now.

I’m puzzled why they reinvented the wheel. V2H has existed in Japan for over a decade and it works. Many households have already implemented it. There is no magic to it with Chademo. For it to work with CCS/NACS the car manufacturers need to agree the required communication protocols and then device manufacturers will surely provide the necessary inverters like in Japan. That said people overlook one big issue and that is that EVs consume a lot of power when charging or discharging on DC. This overhead is so big that V2H isn’t a great replacement for a home battery which is much more efficient in this respect. Most V2H owners in Japan have been badly disappointed by how little power they actually save - in some cases even losing more power by being permanently connected to the car than their solar systems produce. So EVs need not only the right communication protocol but also some reengineering to run as efficiently bidirectional charging as home battery systems mostly do.

Now if we had a government that really took this seriously we would mandate V2G. What she had not explained fully is the issue with connecting a private power source to the grid is there is a safety issue. They shut off the grid for repair..and find electricity still coming from the wrong side.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

They thought of that. Safety is built into the inverter to prevent that happening.

Why should we have broadly available V2G? Because it makes tremendous sense. The only people who could possibly oppose it are those who are making too much money from any existing energy infrastructure.

Thanks Bruno... 😂

Thanks Imogen for such a comprehensive answer to my question asked at Everything Electric Sydney.

So basically the same of the Wallbox Quasar that is available since 2020... Nothing new. The only problem: expensive and nothing is really appearing except for small pilots... V2G is not moving fast enough

I don't see the point of V2G. I don't want to have my car depleted when i need it. I don't want extra wear and tear on my expensive car battery. For home storage/time of day arbitrage/ it's better/cheaper to get purpose built batteries like sodium Ion chemistry. V2L for rare blackout or camping trip sure, but that is niche, and cheap lawn mower batteries/solar generators do same deal for less.

@jontallon73

2 ай бұрын

Exactly leaves me absolutely cold

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

Your car wouldn't be depleted when you needed it..... Only the energy you agreed to sell back to the grid would be taken. Plus you would still have the facility to override the system and set your own minimum for particular scenarios.......

@jeremytine

2 ай бұрын

@@Brian-om2hh yes it would be ...this is basically arbitrage. Buy low, sell high and the times when it is high are the times when you are most likely to need to use your car the most. I keep my car at 80% charge normally so it's ready to go when I need it. Doing energy arbitrage is going to significantly reduce the range on an already slow to refuel limited range vehicle... Just not worth it for most people.

Can we please stop confusing people buy calling a EVSE a charger when it is not.. THX

The electricity supply companies in UK do not want this tech widely adopted and have strong armed government to supress it. Same battle being fought in the USA.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

One UK energy provider is already offering it.......

I'd say all EVs are V2G capable. The automaker does not want you to use it.

As Elon said: Batteries have limited cycles. Spend them on the car.

@uwekoenzen2272

2 ай бұрын

Elons batteries: 1500 cycles.....Classic_ecars batteries: 5000 + cycles LiFePo 😊

Disappointing video, tempted me in with talk of v2h but focused on v2g. I don't want to buy a power wall battery when I have a 40 kwh battery sitting on the drive.

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Good point

@charleshill7184

2 ай бұрын

You do, actually. At least, you do if there is a power outage and you want people at the home to still have some power if you need to drive away. As the interviewee said, you can get a small battery for the home and supplement with the car battery. Powerwall? No. Something smaller, like an EP Cube in the minimal configuration.

@keschris

2 ай бұрын

@@charleshill7184 I've not heard of ep cube, just looked it up, not sure it's available in the UK yet. Interesting concept of backing it up with the car, will investigate further. Thank you

The rapidly falling price of batteries , esp stationary batteries, is IMNSHO making the use of the car as a battery redundant. A battery that will do my whole house for a day is around £3k and could be £2k by end of this year. IOR £4k for a battery that will manage double my house load. Sure a car has far more storage but how often is that needed?

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

Probably very infrequently. V2g during the day out and about or at work is good for earning a few bucks.

❤🎉

The main impediment is that battery chemistry in the vehicles. I wouldn't try to do V2G with NMC battery packs. It really has to be LFP battery packs. Otherwise you are spending an enormous portion of your vehicle's battery life on playing around with the grid. In anycase, the only decent solution is to DC-couple and put the AC grid-tie inverter in the home. It doesn't have to be big. Adding extra weight to the vehicle just for V2G functionality makes very little sense.

Wouldn’t solar on the cars help? I’d like to convert my 2000 VW Cabrio to EV in the future if there’s great kit options.

@robinbennett5994

2 ай бұрын

Not really, a car roof is tiny compared to your house roof. Put the panels on your house, where the weight and aerodynamics don't matter as much.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

Waste of time. To get any meaningful amount of charge into an EV in a relatively short time (such as when you were parked), you'd need a solar array the size of a tennis court.

Drinking game with the number of time V2G has been mentioned in this video 😅

Tesla Cyber truck can be put in a your list. Oversight?

@reginald7214

2 ай бұрын

I think this was supposed to be for v2g or v2h but I'm not sure. Everybody has v2l. I imagine you could do it with the cybertruck easily enough, they do bidirectional charging. But they don't do v2g that I'm aware of.

It powers your house ... *When it's at your house* . If your power cuts at 0830 and you left for..... "somewhere" in the vehicle at 0820, no battery.😊

@MrKOenigma

2 ай бұрын

Oh Captain obvious is here

@markburton8303

2 ай бұрын

She said the car would be used to bolster your houses battery storage, so if you have a Tesla Powerwall etc, the car would work as additional battery storage on the basis the majority of journeys are 10-30 miles a day, so well short of the kWH of the onboard battery.

@geirmyrvagnes8718

2 ай бұрын

If you have a small house battery, you could drive and bring home enough electricity to last you over the weekend. Nice.

I once encountered a vehicle that ran out of battery in the motorway. Have I had V2V (a form of V2L) I could have helped that person as I had plenty of battery available at that time.

@robinbennett5994

2 ай бұрын

Or you could have towed them, if you'd had a length of rope. With regen that could even have given them some charge.

@peterthomas4335

2 ай бұрын

Current V2L usually only supply 2kw, so you have to stay for more than an hour for him to get 2 kwh (10km of range probably).

@tpmiranda

2 ай бұрын

@@robinbennett5994 I believe that kind of practice is illegal in Portugal. Only a certified towing truck can remove a locked vehicle in a motorway.

@Brian-om2hh

2 ай бұрын

The AA and RAC encounter hundreds of ICE vehicles on the roads each day that have run out of fuel. They recently stated that the ratio was around 20 to 1, compared to EV's with a flat battery.....