Comment for corrections: Dome of the Rock is actually not a mosque but a shrine. My bad!

@ailediablo79

Жыл бұрын

Abasised and Ummayads where way more powerful incomprisen to the Ottomans. Also interms whom can win then first Caliphate still moreover regardless of technology.

@novalarifin9703

Жыл бұрын

so does Taj Mahal, that is actually a mausoleum

@ailediablo79

Жыл бұрын

@@novalarifin9703 yes it is Muslim.

@novalarifin9703

Жыл бұрын

@@ailediablo79 u know mausoleum, right?

@ailediablo79

Жыл бұрын

@@novalarifin9703 you mean Museum ?

Fun fact : Minaret architectures are actually much richer in diversity compared to actual Mosques. Ottoman, Mamluk, Abbasid, Seljuk, Timurid Minarets are just some of the many iconic structures

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

some beautiful examples around

@thedstorm8922

Жыл бұрын

I like the Andalusian style its the best one by far

@naisa9705

Жыл бұрын

@@thedstorm8922 it’s umayyad style obviously

@AdamAzzr

Жыл бұрын

@@naisa9705 nah, omeyad style is like the omeyad mosque of damas which was an ancient byzantine church.

@naisa9705

Жыл бұрын

@@AdamAzzr do you study architecture?? Also what you called moroccan architecture is also Umayyad architecture. Even architecture buildings in europe, genuinely speaking, they are highly inspired by Umayyad architecture

The 'traditional' style of mosques in Indonesia/Maritime Southeast Asia are marked by having a distinct pyramid-shaped roof. A good example of these is the Great Mosque of Demak in Central Java province, along with mosques in more rural areas of both Minang and Banjar people as well.

@tivo3720

Жыл бұрын

The pyramid shape roof !!! Is not it's from hindu - Buddhist history and architecture?!

@XsimD

Жыл бұрын

Yes, exactly! Most mosques in Indonesia looked like the one in Demak up until the Dutch conquered Aceh. They destroyed its Grand Mosque, which looked like a traditional Indonesian mosque, and when they wanted to rebuilt it, the Dutch architects who were hired to design the new mosque used their own interpretation of what a mosque looks like, which was an amalgam of different Islamic styles. They combined Mughal domes with Ottoman minarets and Persian ornaments. After it was built, mosques in Indonesia slowly started to mimic the one in Aceh.

@NateVDZ

Жыл бұрын

*The Malay archipelago. It's not just Indonesia, also Malaysia and the Philippines (though I'm not sure if there are still mosques left in the Philippines that were built in this traditional style)

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Yeah it's something completely different!

@Mrityormokshiya

Жыл бұрын

@@XsimD shouldn't matter, the Dutch colonisation consolidated Islam in the Malay archipelago, pushing non-Muslims further to the corner. Indonesian Muslims should be happy about this

Another huge Turkish impact on Islamic community as a whole is its symbol. Many people consider crescent (sometimes with a star) to be the symbol of Islam. However, it has no religious roots. In fact, it is the symbol of Islam because Muslims around the world adopted the flag of the Ottomans, who were also caliphs, de jure leaders of the entire Sunni community. When you look at the flags of Muslim countries, you can see that countries that didn't want much to do with Ottomans don't have crescent on their flags. Arab countries except Tunis, Algeria and Libya don't have crescent on their flags, because they were founded by rebellion against Ottomans, while Tunis, Algeria and Libya has because they were taken by force from Ottomans by European colonists. Ottomans failed to conquer Morocco multiple times, it doesn't have crescent on its flag. Iran is a Shia country that fought Ottomans for centuries, again, it doesn't have crescent on its flag.

@Zaid-vs2zz

Жыл бұрын

i dont want to take away from the turkish impact on the islamic community as it surely was immense. But the crescent was already in use by muslims before the ottomans were even founded at the end of the 13th century ad. Two examples are the flags of the mamluks and the kingdom of tlemcen. also, there are many modern islamic countries that were never part of the ottoman empire and still have a crescent in their flag like pakistan, mauritania or the maldives.

@abedmarachli7345

Жыл бұрын

@Царят на мрака Not from the eastern Romans, but from the origin of the Turks from the Oghuz and the regions of northern China and Mongolia, even the Mongols, their symbol was the crescent, if the matter was mine, the symbol of Islam would be a circle.

@naisa9705

Жыл бұрын

Not really. It is considered as architectural style (islamically speaking). Many star styles are used in islamic architecture. Even before the Ottomans, Crescent was also used in Andalusia. I don’t against our turkish brothers and sisters. We love you for the sake of Allah

@naisa9705

Жыл бұрын

@@Zaid-vs2zz true. You can also find in andalus

@naisa9705

Жыл бұрын

@@abedmarachli7345 that’s not true. The origion of that symbol is from Mesopotamia civilization. The byzantine, arabs, even persia have this symbol

Mosque in Batumi, Georgia is an old building and never had a dome, but few years ago they added the golden dome.

@burakahmettr8193

Жыл бұрын

nice

There is an architecht in Indonesia that has a modern view on mosque architecture. His name is Ridwan Kamil. He designed many mosques across the country and some across the world. Examples of mosque designed by him are Asmaul Husna Tangerang, Al Irsyad Padalarang, and Al Safar 88 km. All of his mosques have design that completely artistic and modern yet have so many islamic value that conscripted through its architecture. The Al Safar one is a controversial one for the conservatists since it adopts so many triangles in its design that viewed as "illuminati". There's also an open debate between an islamic scholar and Ridwan Kamil about how mosque should be properly designed. Despite of that, he has build mosques everywhere. He is now governor of West Java and he is stil building mosques. Two mosques that is in his works right now. The one is Al Jabbar as a grand mosque for West Java (I personally love this mosque architecturally), and the most recent is Al Mumtadz as a tribute for his son who died in Switzerland while swimming. Really, you should see mosques designed by him. They're majestic!

@bars2225

Жыл бұрын

thank you !

@nizarb.arsantaka2740

Жыл бұрын

Just checked them out, super cool imo.

@xXxSkyViperxXx

Жыл бұрын

they look like art deco museums

@Zibonnn

Жыл бұрын

I Googled the mosques you mentioned. All three of them look phenomenal! Whatever you do, there will always be backlash, especially on religious issues. I applaud him for his courage to take a new approach to Mosque designs. His works are not just a mosque that looks like 9999 other mosques in the world, each of them is a piece of art!

@dvmas

Жыл бұрын

@@Zibonnn more like 99999

Bro very nice and respectful video. As a Muslim i love the way you spoke with no stereotypical or satire comments about mosques or Muslims.

You are my go to history trivia channel now. It's honestly unbelievable how such a new channel has got this much "professional" content presentation. I really love your videos man!

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

appreciate it man!

@thefuryofthedragon8715

Жыл бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ Bro Ottomans arent thte biggestt islamic empire, the Umayyads are, think before you speak. Also Islamic architecture is mainly Persian influencedd not ottoman, even the Muqarnases which are in the "pencil minarets" are from the Persians and so are the domes.

@originalsusser

6 ай бұрын

@thefuryofthedragon8715 Well, your version of this history goes against EVERY historical reference regarding this subject I've ever heard... you may be right, but I wouldn't bet any money on you being so

@berdigylychrejepbayev7503

3 ай бұрын

ottomans might be strongest islamic empire since they lived more than abbasid and umayyads combined. but I think greatest was abbasids since science was developed at those times. but military might of ottomans were unparalleled for centuries on earth and sea. and second domes arent from persians. persians were not only nation to use domes in their designs. @@thefuryofthedragon8715

Hi Jochem! Just wanted to say that you spoke in a good amount of nuance in a relatively short amount of time, so great job! I'm a uni student who volunteers in the Süleymaniye Mosque every week. I got the opportunity to talk about the mosque, Islam, and Turkish culture with many visitors from all over the world. Just yesterday I enjoyed talking like 2 hours with a Czech guy who lived 10 years in China and we also had this exact same topic. We compared the pictures we took from mosques in China and Istanbul and other places and it's pretty interesting to come across to your video after that discourse. You had a sub my friend👍 And if you visit Istanbul again, I hope I can come across you in Süleymaniye!

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

That is great to hear!

In Morocco the minarets are all square towers. Even the bell tower of the Cathedral of Sevilla, called La Giralda, started off as one.

@antoniousai1989

Жыл бұрын

Even the towers in the Alhambra palace are like that. Or better, the towers built before the Reconquista are like that. Cause some circular towers were added later by the Spaniards

@bless00

8 ай бұрын

Almohads and Amoravids built those amazing mosques in Andalous which they became churches ... just llike the ones they built in Marrakesh and Meknes...

Nice video, but there's a minor mistake at the beginning: the Dome of the Rock is not a mosque, the mosque of the area is the Al-aqsa, which is useful as an example of a non ottoman mosque.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

woops, thanks for point that out.

@antonio0apv

Жыл бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ I'm happy to help, I think I was not successful in my wording and it ended up sounding a bit assholeish, specially because the extremely minor error didn't defeat the point you were making. Anyway the dome of the rock is a fascinating building, one that symbolizes identity politics for a community trying to figure out what they were and were not. The history of aesthetics of early and ummayad islam is fascinating, both an affirmation and a confrontation of ten prevalent roman/christian aesthetics of power. That dialog went on for some time, specially in ummayad spain where the mihrab was decorated by roman artists with roman material sent all the way from Constantinople as a consequence of geopolitics. You might have loads of fun researching that for a future video, let me know if I can help. And of course congratulations for the channel, I am a massive fan 💜

@mimimusa757

Жыл бұрын

The dome of the rock is and al masjid al qibili and al masjid al marwani are alqsa mosque the whole area is called al aqsa mosque .

@mightykimo

Жыл бұрын

The picture was for Dome of the Rock mosque.. It was built during Ummayed era in the seventh century by Abdul malik ibn marwan.. It is a mosque and people did and still do pray there.. It is still different from the Aqsa mosque..

Many Chinese mosques have the same architectural exterior design as other traditional Chinese buildings. Ive been to the mosque in Beijing and have seen many more in Yunnan

What a great video once again! I’ve been subscribed for a couple of weeks now, and I’ve liked all your videos, but somehow this one jumped out to be me as having particularly high production value. The street interviews, the animations, the facts and the narrative are all top notch. But above all, I think, for lack of a better word, your ‘vibe’ is just outstanding. It’s genuine, curious, humble, attentive and understanding. I feel like you explain enough for everything to be clear, but not so much as to be over-explaining. In other words: I feel like you take your audience seriously, and don’t talk down to them. You expect us to pay attention, to already know something about the world, and to be curious as well. I think that allows you to make videos that are challenging and interesting, without being snobby or overly pretentious. Keep up the good work!

Check out mosque architecture in Indonesia. They range from classical domes to impressive contemporary, futuristic designs. Southern Philippines have adapted some mosque designs such as pagoda style.

Hopefully one day we can get our Church back one day.

The Taj Mahal is however not in any way in the Ottoman style, it is Mughal style, with strong Safavid inspiration

@OshinAttari

Жыл бұрын

Taj Mahal Built by Persians for A Persian Woman

@infinityxtanishq8712

Жыл бұрын

@@OshinAttari not really, no

@OshinAttari

Жыл бұрын

@@infinityxtanishq8712 Taj Mahal Built By "Ostad Ahmed Lahori" Who Was Persian From Afghanistan and Taj Mahal has Built For Shah Jahan Wife " Mumtaz Mahal" who was Iranian

I was a fan before watching this...now I'm an entire AC unit 💯 Really unique and less talked about topic that definitely needed some light shed on. Keep it up Jochem

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Hahaha I'm gonna steal that line

@abaan8911

Жыл бұрын

Very Haris moment

Brilliant use of one very visual item to weave together history! I also really appreciate you highlighting the cultural exchange - not just clash - between religions and cultures.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

thanks man :)

@sRazor96

Жыл бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ "cultural exchange" is a funny way of covering up genocide and hundreds of years of oppression.

Great video, I also like that you're a curiosity stream partner now. Usually I see that being advertised by other, bigger educational creators like Tom Nicholas, LegalEagle,ReallifeLore etc. Glad to see you establish yourself in such a group of high quality content creators.

In Java, Indonesia the oldest Mosque architect was assimilated and acculturated with traditional Java architecture influenced by Hinduism and Buddhism. especially in Kudus, Central Java they built Minaret looks like Hinduism Temple

If you had been my history teacher I would have gotten a novel or something already! I love how you started with architecture went through politics, religion and still included the view of a bystander in a video full of information with some funny remarks.

You could argue the same for the typical gothic style of church however, I visited china and Japan before and was quite bemused to see protestant churches which were relatively common built to look like they had been plucked directly out of the English or German countryside, sitting smack dab in the middle of a brutalist megalopolis, it was very strange to see, especially given they had the visual trappings of a European structure but abstracted from the reasons such architectural choices were made, for example the steeple was usually just a long thin concrete box placed on top of a wide flat concrete box and then plastered to look like it was medieval, I would have loved to see more ambitious cultural translations rather than just shallow copying. My favourite religious structures I saw whilst in Asia were instances where Christian churches had been reformatted to conform to the local vernacular religious style, where they followed the traditional construction aesthetic of a typically Chinese or Japanese temple buildings, using dogong and wood with hipped roofs etc, but the actual plan of the building still followed a Christian format with a nave, narthex and whatnot. This style of construction is more common in South Korea, a great example is the Dojae Catholic Church, sadly this way of doing things is still in the vast minority, most Christian religious structures in Asia are still built in a very overtly shallow western style. When you travel, you want to feel like you've actually gone somewhere, so seeing carbon copies of things that you can easily find back home is always a bit of a let down.

@AlbertAdamsLincoln

Жыл бұрын

But you know unique western-style building in eastern nation could be a good tourist place for local people. There's several churchs in Taiwan are famous tourism place because of it.

Subscribed after your Johnny Harris vid, knew your research/edit/presenting skills were great, but this video is next level! So interesting, so professional. Super keen if you choose to do a deep dive into history through an architectural lens.

This channel is a gem. Thanks for the analysis. I enjoyed a lot and will look forward to your next content.

Loving your channel! Makes learning history so much fun.

I'm so glad to find your channel. Its nice to finally find a youtube channel that has a similar perspective and approach to what history should be treated like and what kind of ideas can be worth pulling from it. "KZread history" always seems to be plagued with the typical prideful "epic" story telling, superficial dramatization, or immersion in political narratives. Its mildly frustrating when so many people seem to have their entire perspective of history built from these types of media.

This youtube channel is a hidden gem! I just checked this video out of curiosity, thought I'd skip it in a few minutes, but I really enjoyed watching this, so much so it felt like a 2 minutes video. I'm subscribed.

Highly recommend going to the Islamic Art Museum in Kuala Lumpur. They have an incredible collection of miniature versions of famous mosques all around the world throughout history. You'd see a very diverse range of architecture details and philosophies, not just the "onion" dome. For example, a Chinese mosque adapted traditional Chinese courtyard designs into the praying area of the mosque. Those miniature models attempt to be as faithful to the real things as possible, with very intricate details. They also explain the meaning of each detail and how it was developed in the first place. You'd be able to see some back and forth architectural influences among the mosques from all around the world over time.

@rajeshsoundararajan

11 ай бұрын

I visited KL recently and we were planning to go here... But we couldn't find the entrance to the museum. We tried asking around but nobody seemed to know or nobody spoke English.

Traditional Islamic architecture (mosques) is very diverse, like the Sudanosahelian in West Africa, the Maghrebi & Moorish in N.W. Africa, the classical Arabic, the Ottoman, the Persian-Central Asian and Central Asian-Indian (mungul architecture) and at the end the Omani, Yemeni and Swahili architectures that are so alike (+ Somali).

1min in and I'm overly excited for this episode!!! Soooo many amazing shots of Istanbul btw

love your style of videos, dude! keep up the amazing work

Great video man! Love the topic!

Oh man! The tiny puns, the background music, the animation where should I start?? This is SOOO BRILLIANT! I think this could be my new favourite episode of yours~~ also learned SO incredibly much from this episode already and I'm only 5mins in xD

2:51 the tower does not have a Big Ben vibes. It is inspired from the Ummayed style minarets. It was 1300 years before the Big Ben was even built.

@ihab_7

10 ай бұрын

Moorish architecture original to morocco

Stumbled upon your Johnny Harris video and I can’t stop watching your work. Fantastic! I appreciate the research and effort you put into this.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Great to hear mate!

For me, this was the best recommendation from KZread! Love your Video

Byzantine Christians like to model churches after Hagia Sophia as well. The Cathedral of Philadelphia, my metropolitan center, is an example.

@arolemaprarath6615

Жыл бұрын

Is Philadelphia a Greek city?

@wes4736

Жыл бұрын

@@arolemaprarath6615 - nah, it's in Pennsylvania.

@arolemaprarath6615

Жыл бұрын

@@wes4736 did you mean transylvania? Is the Dracula castle there too?

@wes4736

Жыл бұрын

@@arolemaprarath6615 - no, I mean Philadelphia. Liberty bell, cheese steaks, that city 😅. Lots of Ukrainian Catholics in Pennsylvania, so the Cathedrals there in the City. It's the Ukrainian Catholic Cathedral of the Immaculate Conception, if you search for pictures you'll definitely be able to see Hagia Sophia's influence.

@arolemaprarath6615

Жыл бұрын

@@wes4736 wow 👌 That seems interesting. I want to go to this mysterious pensilvania place 😍

Building a mosque is considered the best of sadaqa jariya (charity and deeds that will continue after you die) I.e the rewards one recives in the after life for every prayer done inside. Not only politicians but there are also wealthy individuals who develop a lot of them world wide. It isn't just a turkish drive its quite every islamic. In the US you can find a lot of communities that are Somali Bosnian/ Afghani mosques that aren't very turkish inspired and more prevalent. They're just noticed more in Europe I think.

Beautiful video! It's great to learn about different cultures and religions

Great video! Another bit of trivia to add about minarets is the number of them also mattered. You can see all the big mosques being built today can have 4 to 6 minarets. But earlier only the mosques commissioned by the sultan had the privilege to be built with up to 4 minarets. And these mosques had the be inside the capital Istanbul

Hey firstly just want to say I'm really enjoying this channel! You have a really calm yet engaging presentation style and your videos are clearly well researched and nuanced. Also really cool to see you ended up collaborating with Jonny Harris- I'm off to watch that video next! I wonder if I may offer some constructive feedback on 2 points, just from a viewers perspective? 1. You don't need the memes- your content is entertaining and engaging enough. It feels a little incongruous with the measured but witty dialogue and so throws off the momentum of the video somewhat. 2. I personally would prefer a clearer demarcation between the educational content and the sponsored portion of the video. Totally understand that you need to get paid! But I think it would enhance your credibility as an educator if you were to avoid segues like 'you know what else is interesting? Today's sponsor!' etc in favour of something clear and honest like 'The work of this channel wouldn't be possible without funding from today's sponsor...' Even better if it's visually distinct too- different framing/location/lighting or even just a different angle would make it feel less influencer-y. That may not bother you at all but I personally feel it's best practice particularly with educational content as your voice carries authority. I hope this doesn't come across as rude or patronising 😬! Keep up the good work, I'm looking forward to seeing what you create next.

@19382q

Жыл бұрын

This is why you don't have an engaging KZread channel

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the nuanced critique! I'm still developing my style and sponsor messages. I like memes tho :)

Calling the well known type of Moroccan mosque minaret, that has been prevalent in the country for centuries, as having Big Ben style completely missing the chance to mention that Morocco has never been occupied by the Ottomans and has had its own separate and different architecture.

That was quite interesting. Thanks for the new information.

Very insightful and well made video

I love the Moroccan mosque style

Thank you for this amazing explanation. I applaud you!

A very informative and helpful video !! Tanks

4:00 I think that's misleading. The Ottoman empire ruled over Budapest for 150 years, Algiers and Mecca for 300 years. Anyway great video.

Finally something I can really chip in on (did some papers on Ottoman architecture in Uni). If you want a comprehensive book on Ottoman architecture, I would suggest Doggan Kuban's Ottoman Architecture. The narrative that all Classical mosques are a copy of Haghia Sophia is not entirely wrong but for a different reason than you might think and in general way to rough of a cut - do you consider all Western-christian churches to be copies of the Roman Basilica because that's their origin - the best example of this being the Aula Palatina in Trier which is literally an old Basilica. Pragmatic as they were, the Ottomans just enrolled many different Rumeli ('people of Roman descent' basically the whole of the Balkan) craftsmen who very often referred back to their own culture - even Mimar Sinan is actually a devshirme - a Rumeli (non Turk) enrolled into the Ottoman military and or administration. A scaled down version, but with (nearly) the exact same floorplan is known to have existed in Athens and been built at least 50 years before the Süleymaniye and designed by a Greek. Besides that domed architecture was already pretty popular among the Seljuks, which were the persian overlords of the pre-Ottoman Anatolian Turks until their empire collapsed. Before they became this mastodont of a state another typology was much more prevalent than the equi-rectangular ulu-cami's you present as the now dominant typology (which is not really true): the Zaviye or Imaret (served a somewhat similar public as modern day homeless shelters provided, while also serving as a place of worship). Many of these buildings still exist. Then on the real point of this video: The Ottoman Classical Ulu-cami as the prototype of all contemporary mosques. This is hardly true. Most camis are relatively small covered spaces owned and manage by local communities in anonymous looking buildings. Although their is something to be said for Islam as a (political) unifying force for Muslims all over the world who feel disenfranchised and that their are state actor that want to use this to their advantage, tend to use certain references. The same can be said for nearly any category of buildings though. Houses of democracies more often than not refer to Greek Temples and cathedrals have Latin plans. Do we have to worry about the Greeks and Romans having had excessively exported their for-long culture during the Renessaince? The real problem is not that the Turks are exporting their culture, but that government in all these countries the Turkish (but also Saudi's and Emirates) are financing the construction of mosques are failing to emancipate their local Muslim communities and create the propper funding and taxation frameworks as they have in place for other religions. If we are worried that the Turks are building mosques in Turkmenistan, maybe we should start funding the construction of libraries and school or create opportunities for people of these countries to come study and live in our countries. Instead we've been reducing foreign aid and are ever more tightening the flow of emigration. Even worse we, are still, making geopolitical blunder after blunder in dealing with the Middle East, completely distabelzing the region to the point that it is very hard to blame the average Muslim living in the broader region to look at the West with disdain. We should not blame other states for taking advantage of the (collective) failing by Western states to exert soft (or hard) power abroad and integrate foreigners. This is much more on us than on Erdohan.

@TheMagicJIZZ

Жыл бұрын

The Haghia Sophia as you called it originally was a pagan temple to Juno before a Church or mosque. It's domes come from the Roman pagan faith

@furkankaya2144

Жыл бұрын

Selcuks are not persian

@nevermindname8741

Жыл бұрын

Sinan is actually a Karamani orthodox Turk 👌( a Turk, not Roman).

@Polo-rn8ly

Жыл бұрын

@@nevermindname8741 yok. Devişirme olduğu kesin bilinen biri. Türk değil.

@nevermindname8741

Жыл бұрын

@@Polo-rn8ly üzerine ciddi çalışmalar yapılmış. Devşirme evet ama Hristiyan Türk yani karamanlı Türk. Devşirme olduğu kesin bilgi. Kanıtlar da Karamanlı Türk olduğunu işaret ediyor.

Great video man!

interseting video! my personal favourite mosque design is the ' Faisal Masjid ' in Islamabad, Pakistan. It does not consist of a regular dome; instead a unique pyramidal dome surrounded by four towering minarets. The white concrete shell it is made up of really ties it all together. And yes, the mosque is equally beautiful from the inside!

There are many styles of mosque, many mosques look completely different from Turkish-style mosques. Every style has its own charm.

Hope you can read this: Actually, you are a bit mistaken here. Its not just because og haghia sophia. And to point out haghia sophia was never built with minarets it a completely later addition* But you can see dome be prevalent even before, and one of the many reasons is because the sound. You see in the old days, you didnt have loud speakers and microphones. The dome helps with sound tranfering more easily through the mosque, from iman to those present in the mosque. I would say that was the main feature. And minar the pencil style was never there before ottoman conquest. It was added in 15th -16th century by no other than ottomans. So minar its there from very beginning because og sound transfer, you needed a higher place to stand and call muslims to prayer. You would see domes from arab/indian built before ottoman empire where more like a bigger dome that bent innwards. So more a full dome that was prevalent, but not half dome. So if its specially half dome you are referring too then yes you are rigth but not any dome. The more full dome than bend innwards is prevalent much before and thats why muslims assosiate every mosque with a dome. But again acoustics are really important here for dome just distributes sound more even throughout the building and that why its was something prevalent from quuite eraly in islamic empires. Ottoman came much later. Ottomans did invent the pencil minar but its not the only one it exists and, you can again. see mosques with minar in a maybe dome on top. But here a weather plays a big part its gets much more colder and you also start to see mosques more closed in a sense because the weather also comes into play, it becomes more colder, and the mosque building need to retain heat, rather than desipate, which was the case in more hotter arab areas, and minaret had a more open roof. Unlike ottoman pencil ones who needed to be closed bacause of weather and rain .... Faisal mosque totally different its more a modern arquitecture, and sound acousticts are not that important with modern technology, otherwise that would be horrible, in terms of sound. Now you would say that there are mosques without dome from old days. Of cource that there are, but Im referring to mosques ment for bigger audiances of people, in many thounsands. And built by good funding from king and khalifas so it maked only sense that it would go for the dome route. Islam was spread not just by conquest but trade was a major part (indonesia, mali zanzibar etc..) to thats why when traders went to some place and maybe some people converted the would simply make/buy a building and form that into a mosque so thats why you see many old mosques is local style. but when people traveled to mecca for piligramage and islam was more bigger in that area they would build mosque resembled more the mosques at the time. To sum it up dome its prevalent in mosques before ottomans, because of mainly sound acoustics which is important for bigger mosques. The dome distributes sound more evenly throughout the building But half dome can I agree that might be influenced by hagia sophia, but not pencil minar. Its was never a part of hagia sophia but an later addition. I understand that its easy to make mistakes but appreciate that you tryed to make a video in topic that its not easy but hope it clarifies somewhat. And the important thing is that we learn.

@lambert801

Жыл бұрын

There were many mistakes in the video as you pointed out. Another thing that bothered me was how the author hugely overestimates the influence of Ottoman architecture. Ottoman architecture was only confined to the borders of the Ottoman Empire. Architecture to the east of the Ottoman Empire-anywhere from Iraq to Kazakhstan and Azerbaijan to Bangladesh-was based on Persian architecture, and had little to no Ottoman architectural influence. Southeast Asians had their own mosques built based on Buddhist architecture. North African architecture took little influence from the Ottomans. And on my own personal opinion is that most people around the world would associate mosques with those iconic onion shaped domes (except maybe in Europe which mosques are usually based on Ottoman architecture) which are a signature of Persian-style architecture, simply because most historical mosques around the Islamic world were built in that style.

@Sandouras

6 ай бұрын

Are you actually denying that all these mosques are copies of the Hagia Sophia?

Bro, with your production quality, I would expect 930k subs, not 93k. Great vid. You earned another sub. Hoping you reach 1 mil soon

Leuke video, Jochem! Ik moest erg lachen om de foto's nadat je vroeg wat jij op je 21e deed, want dit is ook precies waar mijn hoofd naartoe ging - "Oh, ik weet dat wel hoor" :') Weet me te vinden als je ooit wat meer wil doen met interreligieuze uitwisseling. Ik denk zelf namelijk dat je niet helemaal kunt stellen dat de Bijbel hiervan een voorbeeld is, maar er zijn talloze andere, super interessante voorbeelden! Zeker een onderwerp dat meer besproken mag (moet!) worden.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Haha ja dat waren mooie tijden ^^ mocht ik binnenkort weer een reli onderwerp maken weet ik je te vinden! Zag dat je je ook voor de lijst had aangemeld, vet leuk!

In Malacca, Malaysia, the masjid shape have influenced by chinese merchant dated from 15 century

I am a Turkish guy from Istanbul and I can tell you that you described the case better than I ever could :) A very informative and well prepared video. Thank you!

Very unique. In Bangladesh our mosques are usually box shaped with multiple gates instead of one large gate. Dome and minarets are more inspired by Mughal architecture than Ottoman but recent mosques are more modernised with no dome or minarets.

@nevermindname8741

Жыл бұрын

Mughals were in contact with Ottomans a lot

@YouKnowMe0666

Жыл бұрын

@@nevermindname8741 when and which period.

@invoker7826

Жыл бұрын

@@YouKnowMe0666 Babur had Ottoman engineers during his conquest of India

@YouKnowMe0666

Жыл бұрын

@@invoker7826 😂😂😂 so can you give some proof of your information.

I might point out that the mosque that you seem to display most is the Roman Emperor Justinian The Great’s Cathedral of Holy Wisdom (or Hagia Sophia, in Greek). All that the Turks did was build the minarets at the corners and claim it to be converted to a mosque by painting over the Roman frescos.

@Zaid-vs2zz

7 ай бұрын

Wrong. The body of the mosquee was expanded greately (and the minarets were added of course as you mentioned already), as well as the dome entirely rebuilt. the only thing that remained of the original hagia sofia is the large hall at the center and a few blocks surroundinig that hall.

Hello, I think you need to improve your sound quality production. For example, make the volume more consistent. Anyway, your channel is great and going in the right direction.

egypt have several mosques that are older than ottman empire ever existed and they had domes amr ibn el aas , el refaay , sultan hassan mosque and school

The video title is not correct.. it should be ottoman style of mosques … because manarat and domes are there before the ottomans.. check the Umayyad mosque in Syria it has a manarat and doom this mosque was built in 715 . 2nd example Al aqsa mosque and the doom of the rock … and they are more and more in Iraq Syria and Egypt.. you need to do more research 🧐

What about mosques like Shah Faisal mosque? Samarkand mosques? Many many other modern mosques in Pakistan. Domes are not just a part of ottoman architecture. They have been adopted in Islamic architecture from Central Asia as well. Your assertion that the Turkish style is the originator of most modern mosques is a very Eurocentric view. Many many numerous examples of other architectural styles exist and adopt the dome. Not just from Turkey, but from Persia and Central Asia as well. Additionally many modern styles exist too. So I think you are speaking about a minority of mosques that are Turkish inspired and making them out to be all mosques in general. Quite a biased video.

Cool video Jochem!!

Great vídeo! Love your style and how you speak. Don't you Buy a microphone with the logo of the channel? Regards from argentina

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

i did! Hadn't arrived yet for this video

Ah i Love Cultural dialogue where you brutally conquer a Christian kingdom and make it Muslim 😫😫🤩

Btw, you might want to look at how Tatar mosques look like cause their architecture is very different from Middle Eastern ones.

@nikolasmacedonites917

Жыл бұрын

Tatar onion domes where pesumably influenced by the Persian ones that were prevelent in central asia and the caucasus at the time.

@OshinAttari

Жыл бұрын

Central Asia Mosques are Persian method

@thedstorm8922

Жыл бұрын

Central Asia: Persian style North Africa: Andalusian style East Asia: mughal style Europe: Ottoman style Sub Saharan African: Malian style The ME: Fatimid+Umayyad+Abbasid style South east Asia adopted their own style

Great video!

Cool video mate

Cool video, your pronounciations are actually very good. Best I have seen from a Foreigner. Greetings from Turkey 🇹🇷. Edit: Also your knowledge of Turkish politics and information about tensions between Secularists and Islamists is very accurate.

I don't have time to draw, but I had time to smoke a weed, what a Dutch culture indeed

Great video🎉

The mosque in my neighborhood, Liendert, Amersfoort. isn’t like that. There is a small tower for the muezzin message on Friday. And there are some small light domes. So I would have draw two adjoining blocks with a chimney thing on it.

I am glad that someone can debunk one of the features of this religion because mosques are places of worship for many Muslims. However, suppose the intention is to describe only the face of modern mosques, similar to the Turkish description of mosques; in that case, it seems to be missing the more significant part of it. It is of what is the actual mosque. I understood that the Ottoman Empire influenced how modern Europeans and First World perceive Islam and Mosque architecture, considering how intense the Ottoman Empire was and their political ties with them. Later, the Turkish Republic struggles to define itself in the nation-building process as the remnants of the Ottoman Empire and the diaspora of the Turkish population around the globe. Since we are talking about this title there, "Why All Mosques Look the Same?", then the description in the video did not answer directly to the question. I applaud the explanation of how the Ottomans got their mosque style, almost copied from orthodox Christian churches in Constantinople then. Then, the cause went further to describe the intense works of the Ottomans and, later, the Turkish Republic defining their national identity as an important Islamic civilisation. Due to this national identity through immigration and foreign affairs, they "exported" the concept of Turkish mosques to many parts of the world. I did not want to exclude the crucial historical moments in how the Ottoman Empire shaped the Islamic civilisation nowadays, considering thousands of years of their influences in the past and now in the future for the world. However, let us see the bigger picture. There are many parts of the Muslim world where the mighty influences of the Ottomans for centuries were almost non-existent. Such places exist in Southeast Asia, the Far East, and many parts of Africa. For centuries Islamic and mosque architecture in Southeast Asia mimicked the local architecture, particularly in how local Hindus and Buddhists perceived places of worship. The Great Kudus Mosque, for example, strikingly combined two different types of architecture: the Javanese Hindu temple and, much later, added dome and minarets. However, there are also local mosques in Java that employ only terraced roofs than domes. These mosques are Banten's Great Mosques and the Royal Kauman Mosque in Yogyakarta. In Sumatra and the Malay world, mosque architecture adapted to the local Minangkabau and Malay architecture with distinctive walls and roofs. This style also spreads to nearby Malay worlds, such as Malaysia and Southern Thailand. Again, this video does gives the audience an understanding of how Ottoman Islamic architecture spreads across the globe, but with the current title, it does not entirely represent the whole description of it. Nevertheless, you did a fantastic job, and I want to see more videos with this strong and powerful messages like this. Thank you.

To be honest I don't like the dome-minaret design, it is so uniform and typical by now that it no longer holds any aesthetic value for me. I much prefer the older more creative designs with the open big yard in the middle and a wider, shorter square minaret. Like my favorite, The Omayyad Mosque.

love ur videos hehe

You need to check mosque in Indonesia, it generally follows local architecture or modern contemporary architecture. Ottoman architecture is very rare here.

A mosque was built in a school in Padang, indonesia. It was a nice modern minimalist style building with no dome. After a while, the parents protested the design, and said that mosque should have dome to be a real mosque, so they just stick metal dome to the flat concrete roof.

To be frank I was a little bothered by your including that interaction with the guy smoking weed. Seemed a little mean to include that; he obviously didn’t want to filmed from what we could see.

@____-pb1lg

Жыл бұрын

Yeah like stop the passing agressiveness

Some of the mosques in Indonesia are post-mo (postmodernism). You can look at them particularly in greater Jakarta.

Super interesting!

Domes and Minarets predate the Ottomans, look at Mamluk Mosques in Cairo they have large domes and minarets with outstanding intricacy and details

the Hassane 2 mosque is build without a dome not because it is modern. But because is the moroccan style of building a mosque. You can see it in evry city in morocco.

@ilyasbouriaz1767

Жыл бұрын

@𒂢 the style do not exist any other place except Morocco.

@ilyasbouriaz1767

Жыл бұрын

@𒂢 It existe in Spain because of the moroccans. The style in algeria and tunisian is different from the moroccan style.

@ilyasbouriaz1767

Жыл бұрын

@𒂢 exactly pre Islamic architecture is what caused the difference because it was differente. Roman-cartagian was different from numidian and was different from mauritanian.

In Malaysia you can see that many local mosque here (especially in the countryside) is built like traditional way with pyramid as the roof and the top of it has a small dome.

Great video, keep it up!@

Fun fact, it's quite likely that even the star and crescent (☪) as a symbol was adopted by the Ottomans from the Byzantines. Mehmed II didn't just conquer Rome, he saw his state *as* Rome, and the change in iconography and adoption of the 🇹🇷 corrolates to this change in self-identity.

@husted5488

Жыл бұрын

Didn’t the Mamlukes use the crescent before 1453 tho?

@Forlfir

Жыл бұрын

@@husted5488 it's an ancient symbol, not muslim or christian

@Handle0108

Жыл бұрын

@@husted5488 Mamluks were also Turks, and the Crescent is an ancient Turkic symbol that predates Islam.

@Forlfir

Жыл бұрын

@@Handle0108 it's not a turkish symbol either lol

@Handle0108

Жыл бұрын

@@Forlfir you’re right, well, then the mamluks probably used it because it was a popular symbol across the Middle East which even the Byzantines used, and the Byzantines did control Egypt.

Great video, I love Islamic architecture. The Hagia Sophia is one of my favorite buildings, but it too was inspired by the Pantheon in Rome. It's incredible to think how one building inspired architects for almost 2000 years and places as diverse as India to the USA; even Tsinghua University in Beijing copied the Pantheon.

@yavuzselimkaraoglu3168

Жыл бұрын

I would suggest you to check architect Sinan, He built amazing masterpieces. Greetings from Istanbul. en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mimar_Sinan

@qefewfwdcwdc

Жыл бұрын

the hagia sophia and domes are not islamic aritecture.

@user-xv9rf2ll3m

Жыл бұрын

@@qefewfwdcwdc domes existed in Islamic Architecture even before Ottomans...

@qefewfwdcwdc

Жыл бұрын

@@user-xv9rf2ll3m no they didnt lol

8:06 the switch: "why do we have so many modern mosques" this man calmy enriching us with other information based of facts.

@lennard3993

Жыл бұрын

-(based of off facts)- based on facts*

Orthodox Cathedral "Sfanta Treime/Holy Trinity" of Arad,Romania looks like a mosque with short rounded minarets. Was build in a Byzanzine style and it kind of looks like a modern version of Hagia Sophia

It is indeed interesting how a orthodox Greek church cathedral influenced the public images of mosques all around the world and became the most popular type of architecture when it comes to making mosques

@pomeoxfl

7 ай бұрын

Yep, because Turks/Ottomans seized seized the biggest and the most significant Greek churches. In any imaginary world they'd captured Latin/Gothic, we'd probably have spires and pointed arches.

@mehmetsahsert3284

7 ай бұрын

yeah that would be funny western roman style mosques haha. truly facinating the history and how one even majorly effects the way we build things for hundreds of years to come @@pomeoxfl

TL;DW: Muslims plagiarized the Christian, European, decidedly non-Muslim design of the Hagia Sophia, a cathedral dedicated to the Holy Wisdom of God which actually predates the existence of Islam. Seriously, Islam dates to the 600s AD, while the current Hagia Sophia (the building seen today is the third version of what was once a church) dates from the 500s AD, built by Eastern Roman Emperor Justinian the Great.

Very interesting topic. I didn't even consider the question until this video.

I think what is interesting is you are pointing to a kind of globalisation in mosque architecture. Where once mosques had unique styles and designs throughout the world, the neo-ottoman architecture is really taking hold. What is unique about mosques in the subcontinent and as far as I can see traditional mosques in Afghanistan/Uzbekistan, is that they have large courtyards, and only a small amount of the mosque and only the first row or two is roofed with a small dome, almost just there to make it recognisable. Most purpose made mosques in the UK are also interesting. Usually a red brick building with arched windows, a dome and a minarette. Really speaking to a fusion between your Victorian factory aesthetic and a mosque one. What is interesting is to look at the shift from more Indian mosque aesthetics to one more centred around the middle east (again i think a sign of globalisation). This I can also see in dress, once the imams would have dressed in more traditional Indian clothes associated with imams, but increasingly people are wearing more middle eastern clothes

Surprisingly the mosque in Ljubljana doesn't have the domed roof, just a minaret tower.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Interesting!

Indian mosque are totally different to Ottoman mosque

For salath prayer need plain clean ground to accommodate persons in line. Dome provides good shade ,Ligting ,air circulation ventilation, acoustic, less pillar more spaces

Good video!

I wonder if part of this is due to Western cultural expectations that have been exported to the rest of the world. The stereotypical images of the mosque we see at the beginning of the video derive from Western movies and cartoons from the early and mid 20th century, which come from Ottoman styles. Europeans were far more aware of the Ottoman world than the rest of the Muslim world due to 19th-century European tourism. You note the power of the Ottomans, but the Mughals were arguably a more powerful empire. But the Mughals did not have as much impact on the European imagination. I'm glad to hear someone noting the continuity between the Byzantines and Ottomans. That is definitely underappreciated in modern perceptions of the Middle Ages.

If you go to Spain and Morocco you can see how the mosques have got this Moorish style, but the more east you go to nations like: Algeria, Tunisia, etc (regions that have fallen under Ottoman rule) You'll see more of the Ottoman style. Its interesting how it transistions, eventhough the nations arent that far apart from each other

@shrekwithawillsmithface465

Жыл бұрын

its actually called the moorish-andalusian style not the arab style

@__Man__

Жыл бұрын

It's Maghrebi-style mosque, real Arabic-style was cubical, no dome at all. The real one was like during the Prophet PBUH era. Now, mosques in Muslim countries are either dominated by Maghrebi-style, Ottoman-Byzantine style, Indo-Persian style or South East Asian archipelago local style. The last one is contemporary style, although it doesn't belong to the traditional styles

@abcdefg91111

Жыл бұрын

@@shrekwithawillsmithface465 ty for correcting

@sakurakou2009

Жыл бұрын

@@shrekwithawillsmithface465 true the masjid nabawi prophat mohammed s.a masjid didnt have dome originally

masjid is not pronounced "mashid" (or not pronounced masjid in the Dutch reading) the s and j are two different consonants with the j standing for ج which has the sound the letter represents in English, not Dutch. Similarly the verb sajda (really, sajada but whatever) is pronounced with the "English j" not the Dutch, which in the transcription of Arabic is nearly universally indicated with .