Comment for mistakes and nuance: For all the military affectionados. I know the b-29 is called a SUPERfortress. Noticed it too late in the editing game. My bad. At 10:04 I say Guernica was the first city bombed by airplanes. This is incorrect. Depending on your definition this happened in 1911 in Libya during the Italian-Ottoman war. Or in 1914 in Liege during WW1. Nuance: Some of you feel I glossed over Japanese war crimes. In the video I mention the axis power inflicted atrocities on a scale not seen before. I could have put more weight on the extent of war crimes by the Japanese army in China and Asia. As these are maybe less well known. However, personally I am not convinced that if the army perpetrates war crimes of any extent, that the civilian population of that nation deserves to suffer as result of that. Even if their nation is the aggressor. Do Russian civilians need to suffer for the current war in Ukraine? I don't think so. But you are welcome to disagree with that sentiment.

@mageshpandian2544

Жыл бұрын

"US ALMOST nuked Tokyo" would be a better title imo

@pyeitme508

Жыл бұрын

It's fine.

@joshuataylor3550

Жыл бұрын

Always bizarre to me that war should develop any morals or ethics. Fees like you already left that behind by declaring war.

@ailo4x4

Жыл бұрын

@@joshuataylor3550 Ah, not so. War is an extension of politics. It's purpose is, arguably, to get them back to the table. With the Laws of Armed Conflict (LOAC), Geneva Convention, etc., we would be no better than the raiding hordes of the Mongols.

@Tethloach1

Жыл бұрын

There is no solution, pain, and suffering is reality. I don't know anymore.

It's crazy that the city of Kokura made the list and was originally one of the two intended targets. Heavy cloud cover prevented the allies from bombing it and instead they diverted the raid to Nagasaki. The fate of thousands of people sealed by a weather system.

@Exocool

9 ай бұрын

"How clouds saved a city"

@JarateHunter

9 ай бұрын

@@Exocool "...and doomed another"

@danielwijoyo

9 ай бұрын

​@@RaviKBT98-fu6bkwhat the name of the cities you've mentioned? Is it still a good vacation until present?

@DawgDanger

9 ай бұрын

​@@danielwijoyoI think the spared city was Kyoto

@licharcanist1702

9 ай бұрын

@@RaviKBT98-fu6bk this was referenced in the Oppenheimer movie

There was manufactured 500.000 purple hearts in the months leaning up to the invasion of mainland Japan. This should be a good estimate of the US military worst case scenario.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Yeah that's an insane stat

@Julianna.Domina

Жыл бұрын

In fact, the US Military is still giving out purple hearts from that massive order today, since they haven't given 500,000 since WW2.

@Gillan1220

Жыл бұрын

It was used in later U.S. military conflicts and recently saw use in Iraq 20 years ago.

@Ballin4Vengeance

Жыл бұрын

Conservative estimate

@NBrixH

Жыл бұрын

@@Ballin4Vengeance The large estimate is 1,5mil, and the conservative estimate is 500k. So yeah, it really gives a good picture of how many casualies they were expecting

I watched Oppenheimer and there's a scene of them deciding which japanese cities they would drop the bomb, one of the guys reportedly spare Kyoto because he spent his honeymoon there. its insane how things are random, due to his personal connection Kyoto wasn't destroyed.

@ICICESTPARlS

9 ай бұрын

är du svensk

@reguluscorneas3046

9 ай бұрын

He also said Kyoto was an important cultural site before he mentioned the honeymoon thing

@raymondpaller6475

9 ай бұрын

The once of prevention is worth the pound of cure. The prevention is don't go to war with the United States, and the randomness never has to get pondered or addressed.

@itsjayswelly

9 ай бұрын

​@@reguluscorneas3046yeah but the reason he knew it was a cultural site is because he went there

@TomFynn

9 ай бұрын

That was Secretary of War Henry L. Stimpson, and yes, he intervened with Truman to take Kyoto off the list because he spent his honeymoon there so knew that it was an important cultural center.

My grandfather was a bomber pilot who flew a Lancaster over Dresden. Despite receiving a prestigious medal, the guilt destroyed him. It's the darkest moment in my family's history, and echoes of its impact still persist.

@Sad-jd9lp

9 ай бұрын

😢

@Theoneandonlyearthhuman

9 ай бұрын

As it should, scum

@rajveerkanojiya2985

9 ай бұрын

so your grandpa is the man who nuked japan?

@sentinelav

9 ай бұрын

@@rajveerkanojiya2985 Dresden is in Germany. He wasn't even told it was a civilian town when heading in.

@justapleb7096

9 ай бұрын

They don't teach about Dresen in history class... Unless the teacher was free styling the lessons.

My much beloved dad was a Navy Lieutenant in WW2. He served as the gunnery officer on a destroyer. His ship was in the East Atlantic (European theater) when Germany surrendered. He told me he thought: "Wonderful - now I get to go home." Much to his dismay, however, his ship went back across the Atlantic, through the Panama Canal, and kept going west. He was in the Pacific while the Japanese were using kamikaze suicide pilots on our ships when the 2 atomic bombs were dropped and Japan surrendered. His ship then anchored in Nagasaki Harbor 2 weeks after the bomb was dropped there. He said they were not allowed to go ashore, but he went up in the top of the ship and could see what was left of the city. I asked him what it looked like, and he described it in one word "Flat". He died of cancer in 1991 after a couageous 5 year fight. I always wondered if his exposure to the Nagasaki radiation may have contributed to his death.

@every1665

Жыл бұрын

God bless your father. Ordinary servicemen seemed to be utilized as human guinea pigs during the early years of nuclear weapons and of course, just followed orders.

@anandpandit6763

Жыл бұрын

How many german women your father r@ped..... its karma he died due to cancer...

@hhvhhvcz

Жыл бұрын

You haven't said how old your dad was when he died but above 65, it's very hard to tell if radiation had any impact on his life spam. My own educated guess would be very little since it was an air detonated bomb and there'd had been very little radioactive particles in the air even a day after the detonation. Moreover, USA suffered a lot worse from industrial chemical pollution in the coming years, just all the leaded gasoline and lenient limits on heavy metals in agriculture produce (still an issue to this day btw) or even as simple thing as smoking and stress would be larger factors.

@TruthSeeker-yb2lm

Жыл бұрын

My grandfather was a cannon cocker, artiller, in Africa fighting Rommel. Two of my unles were Vietnam vets that lost their live to agent orange. God bless your father. I not only appreciate your fathers service but your father, just as my grandfather and my uncles, your father and them are my heroes!

@georgehawes5308

Жыл бұрын

@@every1665 Thank you, and I agree with your comments. At least Dad survived and came home to live out his life. A lot of good people didn't. I was born in 1948, after he returned from the war. If they hadn't dropped the bombs and the war hadn't ended when it did, there is a good chance I wouldn't be here today.

It's crazy to me how the Japanese can get firebombed and lose 100k people, have dozens of cities razed to the ground, with tens, or hundreds of thousands of additional deaths, and they STILL wouldn't surrender.

@michaelliu8196

10 ай бұрын

Is a pride thing.

@scentedcandle5949

10 ай бұрын

The Japanese people wanted to surrender, the Japanese elite (who weren’t being firebombed or razed) didn’t want to surrender. They were holding out hope that the Russians would come support them.

@mnpd3

10 ай бұрын

I was born shortly after the War. What you say is exactly what the WWII generation said - they were astounded by that fact. In Europe German resistance grew progressively weaker as the end grew nearer. But with Japan the war only became more intense. In fact, the worse U.S. casualties occurred in battles near the end of the Pacific War in places like Okinawa and Iwo Jima.

@tutowo7304

10 ай бұрын

@@michaelliu8196 As proud as the Nazi

@AD-jq7ow

10 ай бұрын

Culture they prefer to kill themselves instead of deshonnor

Thank you so much for this video. I am really shocked at how perspective and narrative can change history.

My father was a marine at just 17 and fought in the south Pacific then ended up landing in Japan. He then went to China and was the personal body guard for General Marshall and General Mitchell during the negotiations between Mao and Chiang Kai Shek. He then went to Korea. May he rest in peace.

There were a number of Japanese cities that were never targeted. Nara, Kyoto and Kanezawa. They were deemed cultural sites important to the Japanese people and would be important in their rehabilitation.

@emiliovicente7138

Жыл бұрын

Pure bullshit, killed millions of civiliand and razed millons of buildings, but take care of cultural sites? No one gonna believe that bullshit. The important thing about the rehabilitation of Japan was they forgvige all Japan's war crimes and never talk about it. Also forgiving the emperor itself

@user-xo8mr4hf4r

Жыл бұрын

There were a few military figures at the Pentagon who had classical educations, and knew where NOT to drop the bombs. God bless America.

@SawdEndymon

Жыл бұрын

And LeMay liked Nara. Seriously, he visited there and loved it

@faccebookk3704

Жыл бұрын

Charles Burnham , ??? rehabilitation ??? Do you really believe that the Japanese have forgotten and forgiven Hiroshima and Nagasaki?

@wyattbreymeyer4033

Жыл бұрын

@@faccebookk3704 they have not forgotten but they have forgiven, japans atrocities towards china however, may never

My late grandfather was in bomber command and involved in the fire bombing of Dresden. This was a much needed perspective on the motivation of the allies and one that needs to be discussed honestly. I do know this - those who flew those missions might have believed in the justness of their cause, but they also knew the hell and the horror they were inflicting with those fire bombs, because it haunted my grandfather for the rest of his life. Thank you.

@Movingforward2000

Жыл бұрын

To bomb Germany was totally uneccesary & stupid of the americans.

@eyejswije8860

Жыл бұрын

Thank you for sharing

@timcory4455

Жыл бұрын

In 1945 Japan's Council of War wanted to continue fighting to the last man. Japan left the Allies no other option but to destroy whole nation!

@swaggerog7284

Жыл бұрын

Allies view of Dresden was of disgusted how could there bomber plans be cause this must damaged in non military zone

@FeralFox1

Жыл бұрын

My great grandma made b29s so there's a chance she helped make the enola gay

Great editing and fascinating video! Keep up the great work! New sub. Cant wait to watch more videos.

Your videos are really interesting and informative. Thank you!

TLDW: Tokyo was already destroyed by firebombs. They wanted to nuke cities that were mostly still intact because that would better showcase the nukes' insane power. Edit: The video is still worth watching imo.

@michaelplunkett8059

Жыл бұрын

Additionally, it was feared that decapitation and eliminating the Emperor and leadership would delay a surrender. You need them to make and enforce a decision.

@michaelmo2218

Жыл бұрын

Yes. It appears Japan was mostly "toast" these were the remaining high populated locations . Once America had a presence/ residence in Japan, they started up programs that merely analyzed the human wounds from the A bombs. Not to provide medical assistance .

@Steve_Takes

Жыл бұрын

The Japanese were hated. Americans were incredibly racist at the time. Even racist against American Minorities fighting for America. They had no problem experimenting both versions. Today America is the greatest because of TODAY'S Americans. Americans back then were racist murderers. These bombings are a dark stain in American history, no different from the gas chambers in Germany. Nothing worth Celebrating.

@remy-

Жыл бұрын

And they wanted to showcase it to their friend Russia. One for the effect, two to show there was more. Klaus Fuchs made a world saving decision.

@Guacamole.

Жыл бұрын

Thank you. Holy f*** this guy took 20 minutes to talk about something that could have been said in 5

I live in Berlin in that 8km radius. And it just shook me to the core, because it made me realize not only how I am literally sitting on history, but also how the area you take for granted for your daily life, where most of the things you do on a daily basis are located is just...a map to a military leader. I mean we all played video games before and it is not about killing, but rather winning with skill and tactics against an opponent. But this is what real war is - playing games with people's lives. Just imagine you find out your home area is now targeted for carpet bombing. I just felt vulnerable immediately.

@ASonce2129

Жыл бұрын

I realised just now that if anything happens to new delhi, my city would also be devastated.....

@marcuscicero9587

11 ай бұрын

scary thought brother

@johnkelly1198

11 ай бұрын

Grow some balls

@saintburnsy2468

11 ай бұрын

Imagine how more vulnerable you would be without America and the protection she provides. Would you feel safe if Germany had only itself to rely upon in a war?

@olzhastortpayev8053

10 ай бұрын

​@@saintburnsy2468russia would've ruled all of Europe after 1945 had the us not existed

Quality video. Good job 👍 you speak well and your are good to listen to and smart analysis.

Love the delivery style and nicely fit background sounds!

Well. Of all the videos I've watched regarding air raids and bombing of Japanese cities during the latter part of WWII, this is actually the first video I've watched where the narrator talks not only about the bombings, but FIRE bombings. It's interesting how this fact is rarely brought up as firebombing is the worst kind for the victims to deal with and extremely difficult to put out due to the chemicals used in these bombs. I rate this video with high scores for It's presentation and narrative.

@dennisweidner288

10 ай бұрын

@MatAK49 What he does not mention is that Japan began bombing civilians in 1931 and did not stop killing civilians until the two atomic bombs were dropped. In all the Japanese killed some 20m million Asian civilians more than 20 times the number of Japanese civilians killed. The Japanese killed to conquer and enslave. The American bombing was to stop Japnese aggression.

@imonit4272

10 ай бұрын

@dennisweidner - Thank you! The apologist tone of the clown who made this video makes me sick.

@dennisweidner288

10 ай бұрын

@@imonit4272 There is no doubt that the bombing was horrific and the photographic images show that. Unfortunately, there are no photographs of the millions of Japanese who were saved by forcing the Japanese to surrender. War is a terrible thing, but it was not America that began the War. The important fact is that America fought the war and forced Japan to surrender with only one goal in mind, to end Japanese aggression and brutal murder of civilians throughout Asia. Once the Germans and Japanese launched the War, it could only be won by the application of American industrial power on a massive scale. This was Germany's and Japan's choice, not America's choice to go to war.

@fellknight

9 ай бұрын

respectfully, any discussion of whether or not to drop the bomb that ignores the 1944-1945 situation of firebombing entire cities into the ground is simply intentionally incomplete. I'm not saying who is right or wrong, I do lean on one side, and I believe that if we hadn't used them in 1945, we probably destroy civilization in the 1950s once everyone has enough nukes and nobody knows how bad an actual (very low-yield, btw) nuke is.

@PriscinaSkyy

9 ай бұрын

@@imonit4272 have some empathy. Yes, those bombs ended the war.. But they were literally designed to kill civilians. They weren't even made to kill the Japanese military or government because they weren't in a centralised location. They were literally made only to kill Japanese civilians. And they damn near didn't work. I'd say, anything created purely for civilian deaths deserves apologies, no matter how much good they did. You can do something good and still be apologetic for it. I'd bet the soldiers then did feel sorry. Unless you're a psychopath, you'd feel sorry for civilian deaths.

My grandfather was a tail gunner on a B-17 before being shot down and captured. He always said remember, we didn’t know at the time what the outcome was going to be. We were in the present looking at the future. You’re in the present looking at the past.

@caydcrow5161

Жыл бұрын

Woah that kit hit heavy…the greatest generation truly was the greatest!

@captnjd

Жыл бұрын

My grandfather piloted a B-17 and it was shot down too! I wonder if they knew each other.

@booqrdoit9138

Жыл бұрын

Very intelligent take from your grandpa, a wise hero

@SimulationT-900

Жыл бұрын

My grandfather was the one who captured your grandfather

@corneliusmcmuffin3256

Жыл бұрын

@@captnjd I don’t wanna crush your hopes and dreams but there was a heck of a lot of b17’s produced, and so bombers getting shot down is not really that unusual. So yes they knew each other :)

My first time seeing your channel, excellent! well balanced and intelligent, keep it up you are a pro.

I could listen to you talk all day, with that particularly beautiful soothing German accent! But the history lesson that you gave in this video was phenomenal and I learned some things. Thank you. I lived in your beautiful country for over a decade in the 80's/90's and miss it still to this day. Thus, the complete enjoyment of your accent.

@ThePresentPast_

9 ай бұрын

Thats a very generous comment, thank you! It is a Dutch accent however ;)

@BK-qp8zp

9 ай бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ Oh,dear god, I am so very sorry! I truly couldn't hear the difference, but that would explain why it was so enjoyable to listen to. While living in Germany, I did learn not to make the mistake of assuming that Dutch and German were the same. But, on a lighter note, I visited your beautiful country, as well. Thank you so much for letting me know of my error so I can hopefully try not to make it again! 😔

A superb analysis. I wish I had the ease of talking to a camera like you do. From historian to historian, your work is of perfect historiographic content. And it demonstrates very well, in a short amount of time, how history is an interdisciplinary discipline and, above all, human.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Thanks Gustavo, that means a lot!

@ralphebrandt

Жыл бұрын

If I was someone who wants to see the sensational, this is great. As a historian, a piece of crap.

@haydnlovie3855

Жыл бұрын

History is remembered threw the Victor's eyes This will not be the real reason just the reason 2 justify American tyranny like every other country they invade My grandfather was there after the bomb to help japan recover His words don't align with anything America has 2 say

@peternilsen5134

Жыл бұрын

A lot is left out tho. 1 year ahead of the bombing. Spies traveled across the country to find the most suitable cities. Hiroshima was chosen coz of its historical military meaning in Japan but above all of.... it was the perfect target because the city is surrounded by mountains so the blast will have the most impact. Nothing about this bomb was left to coincidences. As an example the bomb was designed to go of 60feets above ground. Nagasaki is also surrounded by mountains and have in many ways the same topography.

@truthadvocacy

Жыл бұрын

😂😂😂

The strategy used by the allies was known as one of "Total War". Its always easy for those looking back on history to pick and choose the history they want to remember in order to justify what they believe. In Japan, you spoke of the fact that Tokyo had been fire bombed and 100,000 people were killed. When you add up all those minus those killed in the two atomic bombings, one thing that isn't discussed is that Tojo and the military that was ruling Japan still would not surrender. They wanted a warriors death. It took the atomic bombings to prompt Emperor Hirohito to force the military leaders to unconditionally surrender. My Mother remembers when the Emperor addressed the people of Japan after it's capitulation. For them it was the first time they had heard the voice of the Emperor. To them, he was a God. The fire bombings killed many Japanese and destroyed their cities, but it was the atomic bombs that forced them to accept defeat.

@bryannicholas2130

Жыл бұрын

Yeah I guess don’t think of your “Emperor” as a “God” 😂

@abc0to1

11 ай бұрын

Then, if there is an enemy that does not surrender easily, we can use nuclear weapons.

@gus91343

11 ай бұрын

Indeed. My coworker's mother is Japanese and has memories of being trained at 4 years old (!) to use sharpened stick weapons to kill any Allied soldier that would land on the island.

@gus91343

11 ай бұрын

@@abc0to1 As opposed to what? The Japanese army used biological weapons in Manchuria in the 1930s against an enemy that wouldn't surrender easily.

@abc0to1

11 ай бұрын

@@gus91343 If someone else has done something similar, is it ok for other people to do it too? Is it okay to judge the war crimes of the Japanese people while not judging the war crimes of the victorious people? If international law protects only the winners and not the losers, how can there be justice? If justice is not about upholding international law but about winning wars, why are the attack on Pearl Harbor and the use of weapons of mass destruction condemned?

That has to be a very controversial ad for brilliant I suppose

For anyone interested in seeing how harsh WWII was from Japanese civilians' side, watch the movie "Grave of the Fireflies" (1988).

@kawaranai9743

9 ай бұрын

The craziest and most difficult to watch Ghibli film I've seen.

@menaceclan

9 ай бұрын

Thanks man, will do !

@shadowmonarch3155

9 ай бұрын

barefoot gen

@ottomellar6774

9 ай бұрын

I've got it, but still can't bring myself to watch it. I will, one day, but I have to be in a really good place before I do. The first five minutes are sublime brilliance.

@totorosghost

9 ай бұрын

For anyone interested in learning about Imperial Japan's colonization and plans for complete obliteration of Korean language and culture read ''When My Name Was Keoko'' by Linda Sue Park. (2002) It's a well written and researched novel from the perspective of a young Korean girl and her family. Complete with academic references. Try to read it and not cry. I can't.

Historical questions of morality aside, it's interesting to consider that without the atom bomb, the US may have rained an equal amount of destruction on Hiroshima and Nagasaki with fire bombing, with little to no effect on Emperor Hirohito's intransigence. In effect, it's not the actual deaths of Japanese civilians that won the war; rather it was BRANDING. Prior to the atom bomb, the US military was seen as a formidable, but costly force to be reckoned with. Capable of overpowering Japanese forces, but doing less damage per dollar than the Japanese could do - despite the fact that Japan had little defense about the carpet bombing. Fire is fire... its been used in warfare since the earliest warfare. The Atom bomb didn't actually take more lives than could have been claimed by fire, but the nature of it... the unleashing of new forces of nature never before seen on the battlefield, the almost godlike demonstration of not just financial might and military strength, but also technical dominance rebranded what it meant to go head to head with the US, what the stakes could be. It is a bit like the iPod effect. Digital music players had existed for years already, but they were never presented in such a way as to fundamentally change how people thought about listening to music. The atom bomb didn't fundamentally change the might of the US military or it's destructive capacity (that came later with the cold war arms race) - what it did to is fundamentally change how people saw the difference between the military might of a large nation and one of a small nation. It was the rewriting of David vs Goliath. It was the eradication of the idea that an underdog has any reason to fight. Of course, then there was Vietnam, which proved that in order for Goliath to win, the objective has to be a military objective. It cannot be a social, economic, or political objective.

@tjen7929

Жыл бұрын

The atom bomb was more than just 'fire'. It's radiation had lasting, generational, genetic effects that were felt for decades.

@madensmith7014

Жыл бұрын

​@@tjen7929 studies were made, or more like of course the US would observe the results while they were in control of the country during the post war occupation. The US monitored the pregnant women who came from nagasaki and hiroshima while handing out rations, only less than 10% experienced birth defects, around 1% was correlated to radiation (rerf.or.jp). Birth defects is surprisingly pretty common, especially in poor countries, which post-war occupation Japan used to be. Don't mix up the bombs which just caused a big ass explosion, where the dangerous radiation levels only lasted for a couple months at most, to disasters like Chernobyl and Fukushima.

@tjen7929

Жыл бұрын

@@madensmith7014 according to Columbia University studies, there were dramatic and long lasting effects. Aside from the nearly 200k people that died within the first few months after the bombing (as per the Radiation Effects Research Foundation) leukaemia rates skyrocketed over the next 6yrs, predominantly in children. For all other cancers, the effects from the bombing were noticed 10 years later. The problems facing the generation after the bombing (in utero during the bombing) include small head size, mental disability, and physical growth impairment.

@gordonpeden6234

Жыл бұрын

Damn right!

@sanjsha7963

Жыл бұрын

IF THE BOMB WAS TO STOP THE JAPANESE FROM FIGHTING WHY WAS IT USED ON INNOCENT CIVILIANS? IT WAS A EXPERIMENT AGAINST A NON-WHITE POPULATION AND HAD LITTLE TO DO WITH WAR!!! COMPARED TO AMERICA THE NAZIS WERE ANGELS!

Hats off man what a video 💯🙌🏼.

Talking about the invasion, there is a great Australian documentary on youtube about the occupation force that was based in Kure near Hiroshima. High recommend it. Anyway, all the soldiers said they did not want to invade Japan due to the cost and key point here: They were sent into the countryside to decommission after the war and the weapons they found stockpiled there hidden, shocked them.

According to National Geographic: "U.S. Secretary of War Henry Stimson wanted Kyoto removed from the target list, on the grounds that the city was too culturally significant to the Japanese to be destroyed. Some say his personal fondness for the city-he visited in the 1920s and may have honeymooned there-was the real reason he appealed to President Harry Truman to remove Kyoto from the list."

@discoverkenya

Жыл бұрын

**Arnold Schwarzenegger voice** you son of a b*tch… that was actually a really good read. Self scribed or could you sight your sources and or a reading list. Interested to read more on the subject. Never read a persons comment ( and one so long) and obligingly continued 👏🏾

@sakn415

Жыл бұрын

@8866 Panda have this known somewhere that is more accessible than a youtube comment. Like the other person said, you include sources. Good read

@Aikinai

Жыл бұрын

Skipping this fact was a huge miss for the video. And he actually states the opposite, claiming that the decision makers didn’t care about the shrines.

@FaitCeQueVeut

Жыл бұрын

Our planet is a place of desperation; yet, we're still here hoping for happiness. Well, some of us are...

@seriouscat2231

Жыл бұрын

The point was to make an ordinary firebombing look like an atomic bomb. So you had to pick a city that was mostly made of wood and paper, with as few concrete structures as possible. Ergo the two that were chosen. Then simulate radiation sickness using chemical weapons.

The bottom line is that a Total War cannot be civilized, and a Total War on one can only be defended by a Total War on the other.

@Weavileiscool

Жыл бұрын

That is the sad truth

@hxhdfjifzirstc894

Жыл бұрын

We didn't start the fire...

@Nonamelol.

Жыл бұрын

@@hxhdfjifzirstc894 But America is a strong nation, and is very powerful, and since Japan is now much smaller that subconsciously makes people go against the US. It’s psychology. If a grown up and a kid are fighting people will usually side with the kid, pretty stupid but that’s how things are unfortunately.

@deboogs

Жыл бұрын

That would be very thoughtful and poetic if it weren't complete horseshit.

@Mylo-gy7sh

Жыл бұрын

Especially in the 40s

Really good documentated. Nice work

Excellent insights and commentary

One forgets another reason why Tokyo was not targeted. In order for the Japanese to surrender, they needed some leadership to survive to effect the surrender. If Tokyo was destroyed then there would not have been anyone to make the decision to give up. Then the full invasion would have been required to bring and end to the war (which really is what happened in Germany). Yes the firebombing had a tremendous effect, but it did not bring about surrender.

@maynardburger

Жыл бұрын

Specifically, they really wanted to keep the Emperor alive, as they knew it was primarily the military leadership around him that was ultra gung-ho and would encourage fighting to the last man. They really did not want the country under such ultranationalist rule.

@user-xo8mr4hf4r

Жыл бұрын

You make a good point. I'll look into it.

@staringgasmask

Жыл бұрын

It was different with the Germans. The US didn't want anyone from the NSDAP to make peace outside of inconditional surrender, since they would keep the party in charge. In fact, when Hitler was bombed, US generals deemed his survival more benefitial for the German defeat, since they wouldn't have to deal with the OKW as "The good guys who killed Hitler", while they also were pretty bad (throwing Rommel under the bus due to envy and trying countless times to get Manstein removed from command, in addition to general incompetence, for example)

@kkeelty64

Жыл бұрын

@@user-xo8mr4hf4r Additionally, the US didn't "start with the firebombing of Japan". The first B-29 missions over the Japanese mainland were conventional HE bombs dropped in daylight from high altitude. Only when these missions had a significantly worse outcome than daylight bombing in Europe (due to the effects of the then-unknown jet stream) did LeMay come in and change tactics.

@brucepoole8552

Жыл бұрын

It sure helped with the surrender

Quite actually a good time for KZread to recommend this video, as Oppenheimer just came out a couple of days ago, exploring the same scenario

@lpc9929

9 ай бұрын

Yes It's the reason the algorithm is recommending it

@snubnosedmonke

9 ай бұрын

yes and it sucks that people don’t know the full scale of the severity of these events, instead choosing to believe a one sided hollywood movie is just retelling history. i’ve even seen alot of jokes made about the bombing, in horrible taste :(

Thanks to all the commenters who recommend relevant books, movies and podcasts to us people who are not history buffs and wish to learn. Not to mention the personal stories re-told by children and grandchildren, shared in the comments section, to further educate us on the horrors of war. I have an interest in this part of our history, but I'm terrible with dates and there's so much cause and effect. I admire people who know details about the history of our world, especially those who see the world wars from different perspectives and the motivations of the participants.

2:35 An often overlooked or ignored point, overlooked in this video too, is that the Pacific War was one of Japan's making. And it didn't start in 1941. Japan had been on the make since the late 19th century and started its conquest and subjugation of Asia in 1905 when it acquired Korea. Thirty six years later it was Japan that brought the war to U.S. shores. Again, a war wholly of Japan's making. And what a war! Here in Indonesia, the real bitter memories of foreign oppression is not 300 of Dutch colonization, but rather the four years of Japanese occupation.

@abc0to1

11 ай бұрын

It is estimated that 4 million Indonesians died as a result of forced labor, food extortion, and logistical failures by the Japanese military. Food shortages were particularly severe on the island of Java, where 2.4 million people died of starvation. Having caused so much damage, it is only natural that the Japanese should be resented by the Indonesians. I personally can only pray for the repose of the souls of the victims.

@michaelchevreaux7780

11 ай бұрын

@@abc0to1 Thanks For That Post. Many Here Have NO Concept How Ruthless And Evil Imperial Japan Was. Most Know Of Rape Of Nanking, But Few Know About Unit 731, Started Years Before Pearl Harbor. UNIT 731 Was a Highly Secret Bio-Weapons War Project In China, That China (To It's Credit) Stil Remembers, And Has a Museum Dedicated To.

@keamu8580

11 ай бұрын

@@abc0to1 In many ways, the Japanese people were also victims of their emperor and his cabinet. Too much power in too few hands.

@southern04man

11 ай бұрын

Woke Americans seem to forget what the Japanese did to millions of people.

@jeraldbottcher1588

11 ай бұрын

And even today, ask the average Korean how they feel about Japan. When I was stationed there in the 70's and 80's there was still real hatred for them

High quality as usual, I appreciate the perspective you took in this video. also wasn't expecting to be reminded of my time playing battlefield 1943 back in the day.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Twas a quality game

@matpk

Жыл бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_what about Nazi Chi Na ?

@IndyJay53

Жыл бұрын

That theme got me

@totorosghost

9 ай бұрын

Playing Resident Evil and Evil Within reminds me of Unit 731.

excellent points mate thank you.

Thank you for this vid.

I remember in a lot of japanese documentaries and books they told stories of the tokyo bombing being way more destructive and killed way more than the nukes they experienced, the civilians told of the 'fire tornados'. I was wondering why it was so bad but now it makes sense.

@ayanomar1408

Жыл бұрын

hello thank you for sharing, can you share some of those documentaries? I always saw the pove of the allies but never the Japanese pov.

@keifuchan7265

Жыл бұрын

"The Firebombing of Tokyo." The same method was used in hundreds of cities across Japan. Almost every prefecture has a memorial to people lost to these incendiary bomb raids. My grandfather's house in Utsunomiya was burned to the ground.

@Sacto1654

Жыл бұрын

The 9-10 March 1945 firebombing raid may have killed over 100,000 people because the city was still at that time mostly made of wooden structures. The combination of the fires plus the onshore winds that spread the fires in a deadly flame conflagration leveled 16 square miles of central Tokyo.

@PK-tu9kz

Жыл бұрын

We now can bomb Moscow and Beijing.

@truthadvocacy

Жыл бұрын

There were no civilians left in the two nuked cities to "tell" about their "experience".

Really enjoyed this. I've read about Dresden a long time ago but had no idea about Tokyo's state and how that influenced the nuclear bomb drops. Good and nuanced too - nobody comes out of a war without dirty hands.

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

It was a new topic for me too, super interesting

@KlodFather

Жыл бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ - Tokyo was not bombed because it is a bad idea to cut the head off the chicken... with No leader you will have a crazy war with small groups and never get control.

great video, Johnny

Thanks for the information. It answers some of my questions on why the Japanese attacked Pearl Arbor .

My father was young enough to be in the Army in time to stage in California for what would have been the invasion of Japan. He ended up as an occupation troop. He said they were told one million casualties. Now that I'm old and get to watch history shows a lot, one on the war in the Pacific said a goal of the Japanese general on Okinawa was to create a river of American blood so large that we would not invade the Japanese main island.

@kirkbrown2605

Жыл бұрын

The Japanese general as well as the leaders of Japan got their wish. When Truman considered the river of blood the Japanese would inflict, he chose not to invade and dropped the bomb instead.

@michaelchevreaux7780

Жыл бұрын

​​@@kirkbrown2605 2 A-Bombs, With #3., On The Way, Target 🎯 Tokyo!

@seanbrown9048

Жыл бұрын

Lol; don’t wanna get nuked? Don’t join Hitler and launch a sneak attack on Pearl Harbor!

@Burchie_

Жыл бұрын

whats crazy is that its 1million casualties for just a beach head and a bit more. The entire island would be about 2-3million, the japanese would've lost 6+million too.

@ninja.saywhat

11 ай бұрын

I read a book which estimates the overall casualties on both sides including Japanese civilians could have possibly gone as high as 15 MILLION! The Japanese were insanely fanatical at the time. They were planning to arm women even elementary kids with spears or whatever they could provide and send them to their deaths. Whenever someone tries to guilt trip someone over the US nuking of Japan, I always bring this up. The casualties would have been exponential and the war could have possibly dragged on for another year or two. To make matters worse, the subsequent occupation and rehabilitation of the country would have been bloody and extremely difficult. Guerrilla warfare and terrorism would have gone on for decades or so. Nuking them into submission and forcing the Emperor to sought for peace and having him acquitted of responsibilities and allowing him to retain his position greatly helped the occupation of the country.

The bombing of Dresden was a military experiment to see if fire bombs would destroy the fire fighting capabilities of the locals. In this it exceeded expectations because the fire storm melted fire hydrants and destroyed fire fighting equipment as well as all the cities fire fighters.

@LordZontar

10 ай бұрын

Hamburg had already taught that lesson in 1943. Look up Operation Gomorrah.

@freneticness6927

10 ай бұрын

It was also due to the fact that the russians had just lost hundreds of thousands of men to take budapest so the allies were just trying to stop casualties on both sides.

@dennisweidner288

10 ай бұрын

@brucesummers7448 Nonsense. The Dresden raids were a response to a Soviet request to restrict the movement of German troops and supplies. Dresden was a transportation hub. And by the way, just who began the war, who killed 10s of millions of civilians, and who began bombing civilians?. Harris was absolutely correct. "The Nazis entered this war under the rather childish delusion that they were going to bomb everyone else, and nobody was going to bomb them. At Rotterdam, London, Warsaw, and half a hundred other places, they put their rather naive theory into operation. They have sown the wind, and so they shall reap the whirlwind."

@chipsawdust5816

9 ай бұрын

@@dennisweidner288 My understanding as well, the Soviets requested Dresden to be leveled. So the Allies did.

@dennisweidner288

9 ай бұрын

@@chipsawdust5816 I am not sure that the Soviets requested that Dresden be leveled, but they certainly did request the Allies prevent German troop movements through Dresden. There is much that the critics of America and Britain in their rush to condemn simply ignore. 1. While the NAZIs were defeated, Western and Soviet forces were still taking substantial casualties. 2. There was no city in NAZI Germany and Imperial Japan that was not supporting the war effort. 3. The NAZIs and Japanese Militarists had caused America and Britain to ramp up their military power to an unprecedented level. It is not easy to change such a development on a dime. And the responsibility for this rests firmly on German and Japanese shoulders. 4. By the time of Dresden, knowledge of NAZI atrocities had begun to become more fully understood. And this was far beyond the military atrocities such as bombing Rotterdam and English cities. Protecting German civilians was not high up on the Allies' list of priorities, largely because of German and Japanese conduct of the War. No thinking person wishes that Dresden had not occurred. But only the mathematically challenged make it a huge issue. World War II death tolls probably reached 70 million people, even low-ball estimates are about 50 million. And 90 percent of the civilian deaths were the work of the Axis powers. Killing civilians was actually a PRIMARY Axis goal. Read about the NAZI Generalplan Ost. The Allied strategic bombing campaign was hardly the major factor in the Civilian death toll.

dopest video i seen, im in okinawa japan rn on deployment. very cool to learn the histroy

Love your balanced approached to history

I think one important factor that needs to be remembered is that Japanese culture didn't allow for surrender as an easy option. Dan Carlin's Hardcore History podcast series, "Supernova in the East", provides some excellent context for understanding both sides.

@nikolai522

10 ай бұрын

Exactly. It’s one thing to fight a military that fights to the death, but it’s another to fight an entire civilization willing to do the same. Japanese civilians would’ve taken up arms to fight Americans with as much ferocity as their military. Especially since the idea that bombing a population would weaken the populous’ resolve was false. Add boots on the ground to mainland Japan, and the entirety of Japan would feel like their entire existence was at stake. As much as I hate that it took the atomic bombings and countless lives being lost leading up to that decision, I feel ultimately the decision to use the atomic bombs weren’t just a means of preemptively saving American lives, but also that of countless Japanese civilians who would’ve defended their homeland. It’s almost a question of would you rather take 100,000 lives to end the war, or have 100s of thousands, if not millions of lives be taken.

@freneticness6927

10 ай бұрын

Considering what japan did to countries which surrendered maybe they were just expecting the same treatment.

@astoriastestkitchen

10 ай бұрын

Supernova in the East does a much better job approaching this subject than this video. This video isn't bad but there are a lot of small inaccuracies and things left unmentioned that paint a somewhat distorted picture of the circumstances the allies were in, ie how it came to the point where nuclear weapons and strategic bombing were seen as the best course of action to end the war as soon as possible

@0j00n

10 ай бұрын

dan is the man

@counterculture10

9 ай бұрын

My grandfather served as a doctor on the Pacific stage. He said that there was so much hatred and suffering between and among the Japanese and Americans during the war that when the decision was made to drop the two big bombs, the American soldiers thought Truman was a hero. They were just so focused on ending the war. Good and bad is all a matter of perspective.

Your comments on the morality of firebombing are definitely worthy of more discussion. I would guess that when you have entered Total war (as opposed to a limited conflict), then all the population are considered combatants. It would also have been almost impossible for any US president to argue that a more humane way to end the war was to sacrifice US men's lives in hand to hand combat. That would be an even more insane solution.

@IXMatthew

10 ай бұрын

right, thats the thing. They pretty much attacked civilians and attacked our soil initially. We gave them that same venom they had for everyone else lol, why keep sending teens on boats

@dennisweidner288

10 ай бұрын

@cunninr2 The simple fact usually not mentioned is that there was not a more humane way to end the War, Those that criticize Trumn's decision never provide a possible alternative.

@chipsawdust5816

9 ай бұрын

@@dennisweidner288 Agreed - war is inhumane. We sit here at our computers with running water and air conditioning and hand-wring about two bombs dropped towards the end of a world-wide war (OK except Antarctica maybe), judging people from what happened 80 years ago.

@dafyddthomas7299

9 ай бұрын

Not just the UK and US that did above total war and firebombing, Q Germany Airforce destroying lot of Poland, UK, Norway cities - this Video is tainted in this regard only considering Allies of doing wrong

@dennisweidner288

9 ай бұрын

@cunninr2 Absolutely correct. It is important that it was the Axis which1) started the War and 2) started bombing civilians. It is absurd to think that the Allies should not respond when the Axis did these two things. It is also important to note that killing civilians was a major Axis war goal. And as a result, over 90 percent of the civilians killed in the War were killed by Axis forces. Focusing on the bombing is misleading. The bombing was responsible for a relatively small proportion of World War II civilian deaths.

I like your stance. And you managed to extrapolate a topic without making it obnoxious. Thumbs up.

Thanks for video, I have always wondered too

German here. Thanks for tackling these ambiguities within the rationale behind warfare. Sadly these topics are taught with an intentional aura of taboo (say false dichotomy) here. In the end the question remains: war, what is it good for?

@gavinathling

Жыл бұрын

As I get older, the words of John Lennon's songs get more and more poignant...

@strasbourgeois1

Жыл бұрын

Yes

@QuantumRift

Жыл бұрын

It's good for stopping pricks like Hitler and Tojo. Unfortunately, INNOCENT people get caught up in it. Unfortunately, unless the ENTIRE worlds stands up tp Putin and Xi, it will be repeating history all over again.

@personman8404

Жыл бұрын

How is it taught?

@XmarkedSpot

Жыл бұрын

​@@personman8404 Where to begin... I'll try summarizing to my best ability, for what it's worth. The good: the core principle of all lessons being the sentiment "Never again!". The bad: no acknowledgement of the anti-semitic zeitgeist as a global phenomenon. The ugly: no matter the particular epoch (be it antiquity or industrial revolution) every year from 5th grade on there will be at least one chapter about the Reich... after the 10th it's all there ever will be. tl;dr: the curriculum commands a collective responsibility of vigilance yet fails to illuminate the underlying human condition. Thus it regrettably renders itself another - admittedly rather civilized - dogma.

My grandfather was an engineer with the RAF and went on alot of the raids over Dresden and other civilian targets. His journal spoke of so much regret and apparently he spent his last year's praying each day for forgiveness. I didn't realise the mortality rate was so low for them, that was interesting to know.

Thank you for this documentary. I actually learned something today. Sure, I knew about Dresden, but I had no idea how widespread firebombing was at the time in both Germany and Japan. This is a real eye-opener.

@dafyddthomas7299

9 ай бұрын

Apply that to UK, Polish, Norweagan cities as well - widespread destruction and death + also V1-V2 program conducted by Germans

@TheNelster72

9 ай бұрын

@@dafyddthomas7299 The counter-argument, which is not mine incidentally, is that the demise of the Nazi regime was certain when Dresden was bombed and it was not a militarily important city.

@rationalgazer

3 ай бұрын

​@@TheNelster72 ahh well... pay-back is a bitch.

Interesting that city selection was which were still intact. I never heard that before. I always wondered why those two? I thought it was primarily an industrial decision. Very interesting video. I would be curious how many didn't know just much Japan was bombed into practically non-existence, before the A-bombs.

@red2977

8 ай бұрын

These were military targets as well. The video puts soo much emphasis on needing to make sure it is a city that wasn't already bombed. That is kinda a silly thing to say. If a city was mostly rubble then why the hell would you attack it vs a city that is actively producing a military threat? Obviously you wouldn't use a weapon like this out in an isolated area for a single target. They didn't go after Tokyo because they needed the top japanese leadership to try to stop the war. It was questionable if the military would even listen to the emperor to begin with but without top people to speak with the war would drag on.

This video is as sobering as it is interesting and very well done. It's led me down a WW2 rabbit hole for the last few hours and I must say there are some brilliant "what if" questions and answers on Quora which make for an interesting read. "What if Germany & Japan won the war?" and "Why did Japan keep fighting after Germany was beaten?" for instance. Anyway, brilliant video concerning a very dark time in human history. It's interesting how you have to keep inserting disclaimers because the viewers are most likely prominently Americans.

My father in law boarded a ship headed to Japan to be part of the invasion force. Fortunately by the time it arrived the war was over and he became part of the occupation force. He wound up liking his time in Japan.

@patrickbrady519

Жыл бұрын

Well makes sense, I bet downtown was lit up at night, for the next 50 th yrs

@michaelchevreaux7780

11 ай бұрын

​​@@patrickbrady519 Oh Yeah! And Soon 🔜 American GIs Were Bringing 🔙 Back Cute Japanese War Brides. Japan Was a Soldier's Paradise For At Least 25 Years.

Japan attacked Pearl Harbor on Sunday morning when the sailors were chillin

I love the fact that the segway to brilliant ad this time is “do you want to make atomic bombs” 😂😂

Nagasaki was a secondary target that day. Kokura the main target, was known as having a large arsenal

Rather interesting take on the subject matter. It's nice to hear something refreshing that it wasn't all as easy and rosy as historybooks make it seem. Lekker bezig Jochem, ga zo door jongen!😉

The production of historical narratives is always a fascinating topic. If anyone wants to read more about this, I'd recommend Michel-Rolph Trouillot's book "Silencing the Past: Power and the Production of History"

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

This sounds like 100% what I love to read, thanks!

Great work and video, your country is beautiful. Greetings from Mexico.

A book I read many years ago, the author fought the Pacific war all the way to the end. So inspite his personal involvement, I was surprised his opinion was the bomb wasn't necessary to effect a surrender. But Russia had just started fighting Japan and a quick surrender was needed to keep Russia from occupying Japan. In fact some of Japan's home island were not returned to Japan until the 1960s. We were already preparing for the next war with Russia

@f556784q3

3 ай бұрын

bro a random soldiers opinion of a theater wide war encompassing millions of people and deep cultural differences is not an especially reliable source of how necessary the bomb was in effecting surrender.

@TUMARK2

3 ай бұрын

@@f556784q3 the navy captain ( I forget his name now) said we controlled the air and sea around the home islands and that they were dependant on inter island commerce to just survive. That we could have waited them out. We needed to rush the surrender to keep Russia from taking any more control than they did. This seems credible, we were concerned about Russia in Europe. Results on both fronts was the iron curtain across eastern Europe and some of Japan's home islands were not returned to Japan from Russia until the 1960s. I think the actions of Russia validates this navy Captain's assessment. I was just surprised because he had such a personal involvement .

Firebombs are crazy. My great grandmother told me that the front neighboring building was bombed and it burnt for two weeks. Also my grandma was born in the middle of the siege of Budapest and the hospital was in the middle of the front lines so she had to sneak across both sides.

I wish history was always presented in such an easy to understand and objective way. Thank you for this video

@milesgreb3537

10 ай бұрын

It is not objective, he does not really explain the other side very much at all

@corbinjehl6563

10 ай бұрын

There’s like nothing objective at all about this video? The literal point of this video is just to see one angle of the moral question of the bombings

@dennisweidner288

10 ай бұрын

@jakegreen2409 This video is hardly objective. It glosses over the 20 million Asians the Japanese butchered in their war of aggression including the use of weapons of mass destruction. And he fails to explain just how America could have ended the war in a more humane way with fewer civilian casualties.

@cabakazack

10 ай бұрын

@@corbinjehl6563 Yep, also: Was Guernica really the first city ever bombed??? I have absolutetly no idea but some quick googling tells me bomber planes were first created around 1913

@imonit4272

10 ай бұрын

The BS presented by the degenerate in this video may have been easy to understand, but it’s about as far from objective as it gets.

my grandparents fled dredsten and moved to western Canada when they were young during the war. i can now see why 🥺

Jochem and his group project analogies 😄In NL, everything is a group project

Dad was Combat Camera (not the same as photo recon, think more like newsreel footage) with the B29s flying from Saipan, Guam, and Tinian. Along with all the photos of bombers' nose art and the people living on the islands he brought back a couple of aerial photos of Tokyo after it was firebombed. Just as grim as Hiroshima.

@jessallen7756

Жыл бұрын

My grandfather was the navigator of a B-29 Superfortress at Tinian..The 500th bomber group...I've seen alot of pics of the flight crews and planes at Tinian....I wonder if your father took some of the pics of my grandfather at Tinian.?

@shorttimer874

Жыл бұрын

@@jessallen7756 Landscapes, planes, and natives are all that I've seen, sorry. If you know what nose art was on the plane I can try to find that, there's probably about 20 of those. Not much considering how many planes there were, but you never know.

@kv4648

Жыл бұрын

Tokyo had more devastation (casualties) than both atomic bombs combined

this is a really fantastic companion piece for shaun's video on hiroshima and nagasaki. similar moral questions, but coming at it from a new angle. this was such a great vid!

@becauseimafan

Жыл бұрын

I forgot about that video! Thank you for sharing and reminding me of it

I never knew that, thanks for the good video

Uau, so interesting My grandmother (Portugal) told me everybody was exhausted with the war and impatients to end it. From her and many people of her generation, I heard many complaints because was very dificault to the japonese to surrender. I saw in the 70´ many documentaries about that. But about the atomic bombs, there were always many doubts since they were used.

Firebombing could leave cities ablaze or smouldering for weeks, not just days. There’s cases of smouldering rubble reigniting nearly 2 weeks after the initial bombing (depending on local weather/season and humidity) although most of these small fires where generally contained quickly, some of them would start to spread again. For me it goes to show how terrifying living in a city where you could step through rubble and into a pit of embers days or weeks after you thought it was safe to walk around.

@seanbrown9048

Жыл бұрын

WWIII with the new nukes in service will cause the extinction of mankind.

@Skrenja

10 ай бұрын

Fires can burn underground for a very long time.

It's wild seeing a city I live close to in Germany represented on the German map because it's never mentioned even though it was heavily bombed and very historical.

My grandfather flew 171 missions in P-39 / P-47 / P-38's in the Pacific theater against the Japanese pushing them back. I imagine it's inevitable that some of those for sure were escorting bombers while in a P-38 at high or medium altitude. kzread.info/dash/bejne/f6uKy7Vtg8m3g8o.html I was oblivious to it for the most part until after my grandmother died, and he had no where else to go next with his life but look up really old contacts from his past. High school sweethearts and old fighter buddies. Literally, alone in a house trailer by the side of the road, after a life time of working in a paper plant making the Mead lined notebook paper you used in school and the packaging your honeybuns came in.

If Chuck Sweeney hadn't been totally incompetent on the second atomic mission they would have bombed Kokura instead of Nagasaki. Sweeney was ordered to wait no more than ten minutes for the observation plane at Iwo Jima. Instead he circled for almost an hour which meant cloud cover moved in at Kokura and he had to divert to Nagasaki. After the bombing run they barely had enough fuel left in the plane to get back to Okinawa and he almost lost the plane and killed the crew because of it. Totally incompetent. Even Tibbets was upset with Sweeney's screwup.

This is the first video of yours that I have watched and I must say that I really like how you emphasize that everything wasn't/isn't black or white. I think that is a very important distinction that a lot of people don't understand or utilize in our very often polarized world and viewpoints. It's "good" when this group of people do x but "bad" when that group of people do x. It was very enlightening to see McNamara make this exact point as I had never heard that quote from him before. As I haven't seen anything else of yours and that you are a newer channel, I hope that you keep up using this narrative device (for a lack of a better phrase as I am not sure what to call it) in your future content. We can't ever begin to understand one another as people and to work together to create a better future if we continue to look at the world, each other and events, as strictly good or bad, with no shades in-between. Sure people might do "bad things" or "good things" but the reasons behind the decisions are just as important as the actions themselves. Anyways, enough ramblings from me on a dreary Saturday. You have earned a new subscriber. I can't wait to see what you create in the future. Thank you.

@tylerfb1

Жыл бұрын

McNamara’s got tens of thousands to hundreds of thousands if not millions of people’s blood on his hands. His policies, that had this sentiment on them, led to the direct death of thousands to tens of thousands of people, and the eventual fall of south Vietnam, and the surrounding areas. There is nothing dignified about warfare. Winning is all that matters.

@tylerfb1

Жыл бұрын

@@1982nsu yup

4:05 Thank you for the Battlefield 1942 reference! I played this all the time for PC in the early 2000s when I was in high school!! Loved playing online in the war in the pacific maps!

"Japan is the 'Wet Dream' of the bomber" (12:39) Sorry, but that was really funny in a bittersweet way !! Thank you for ALL your hard work. ut one thing I do want to say is you did not mention the unprovoked attack by the Japanese on Pearl Harbor in December 1941. Can you do a vid on the Andersonville Prison in Georgia, during the Civil War in American History. THANK YOU VERY MUCH !!

Surprising why THIS is not considered an act of Terrorism Because victors don’t commit war crimes

Thanks. Great coverage of both sides while focusing on the two nuclear bombings.

They bombed those cities because Tokyo and Osaka have been bombed by raids And the nuclear team feared that when the bomba made the impact japan would think that the damage was not done by the atomic bombs but by the raids The point was to see the full damage of a single atomic bomb

@joelsalinas6905

Жыл бұрын

They didn’t bomb Tokyo because if they did they wouldn’t have anyone to negotiate with to end the war

@hansgruber9685

Жыл бұрын

For Russia to see the full damage of an atomic bomb.

@truthadvocacy

Жыл бұрын

The claim that those monstrous acts were to "save" American lives and put an end to the war, is a fraud, as during the whole war up to 1945, only a paltry 100,000 US servicemen died in the Pacific war, far less than in Europe. And Japan was close to surrender.

This was pretty good stuff. I could'nt help teer for the many civilians that died and the millions left without homes. Ouch, that hurt. When wars get costly, nations become more vicious. War is horrible. Civilians living out their everyday lives of any country should not have to be casualties of war. No one people is greater than another. How sad. How sad and painfull war is.

My biological father was a Gopher (go get the coffee etc) at Hanford. They were making plutonium for the bomb. He really didn't know what they were doing, but knew that it was top secret. Later he knew and realized that he was a part of that, but really a very small part. He went to College in Walla Walla and later went back, but this time more involved as an engineer and realized that the next step was the Hydrogen bomb. He left with my Mother, my sister and me (1 was 1 year old) and went to Concord ca. where they were working on developing computers. My mother and father divorced in 1955 and my mother remarried in 1959 to my step-dad. my step-dad was on one of the ships (airforce) and witnessed the testing of the bomb on Bikini island. I am a nuclear child and not the better for it. History is told in all its glory by the winners, the real truth is that there are no winners. As George Carlin said- the earth is going to be fine- it will heal eventually- the rest of us will be gone.

@anna-gt2mu

8 ай бұрын

Eareaeareaeareaeareaeareaeareacool.era

I really like your videos and learning more about different parts of history! But I just had to note, that the placement of most cities on the map at 09:42 is quite a bit off. But it's a great video and I like that you also use some animations as you did in that scene!

@ThePresentPast_

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the comment. Are you sure? it's done with a mapping program that takes geodata into account.

@Lea_S

Жыл бұрын

​@@ThePresentPast_ ​Actually, now that I checked all of them, it's not most of them but only some. If you look at Stuttgart, Marburg and Scheeinfurt for example, they are too far north east and the red dots southwest from their cloud of dots look closer to their actual position. Munich on the other hand is positioned too far west on your map. Hamburg is probably also too far north but I don't know where exactly the bombings where so if there were a lot in the north of Hamburg and north of Hamburg, the programme probably just placed it as close as it could while still placing it above the city but without placing if into the dots. It's probably just a picky thing and most people won't notice as the cities are roughly in the correct region (and most non-germans probably don't know about it anyways), but as a German working with maps I just noticed it.

One of the longest papers I wrote in highschool was about Dresden. Not very long ago, it was actually pretty difficult to get information besides from Kurt Vonnegut and used bookstores. I was surprised by that, considering the scale. It certainly wasn’t mentioned in our WWII textbook curriculum. I had to do actual “research”. On the other hand, I guess a lot of highschoolers read Vonnegut.

I miss when the questions in video titles were answered without drawing it out for 20 minutes.

I don't remember where I heard this quote but watching your video reminded me of it. "History is written by the winners" As an American I grew up learning about these "historical" events in our nations history. Never once were the fire bombs discussed as a part of our war in Japan. They over simplify it down to Japan attacked Pearl Harbor, so we dropped atomic bombs in response. It wasn't till I was living down in Brazil and discussing American history and the war in the Pacific that I learned more about what truly took place in the Pacific. That Japan did not just simply decide one day that they were going to bomb the US Navy in Hawaii. It's much deeper than that. People would be wise to seek understanding of both sides to every story and not simply what you grew up learning.

@TomFynn

8 ай бұрын

There are no both sides of the story. Japan, from 1931 onwards went on a murderous rampage throughout East Asia, costing millions of lives. When the Russians drew a line in the sand at Khalkin Gol, they turned south. Their invasion of Vichy-France held Indochina earned them an oil embargo as now their bombers were within striking distance of allied bases like Singapore. They could have curbed their enthusiasm for conquest or carry on regardless and in the process picking a fight with the US. They chose...poorly.

@postmasters6453

3 ай бұрын

Churchill said it, somewhat recently the old modern warfare 2 used it lots.

A great video and very informative. One technical detail, the B-29's that dropped the bombs were called 'Superfortress' not 'Stratofortress'.

it's crazy how some people were unlucky enough to be in both cities, one after another, and also be lucky enough to survive... at least they were recognised for it. i heard one man jumped into a ditch and watched a girl he was walking by and the bridge he was on both get melted or vaporised by the initial blast and still survived

Rumor is that when a mainland invasion of Japan was still on the table the military commissioned a mass quantity of Purple Heart medals for the anticipated casualties. The number of medals was never disclosed, but after the bombs the military used this surplus of PH medals for the next 50 years. Through the Korean War, Vietnam, and numerous smaller conflicts, finally running out of the stockpile of medals during the Iraq war.

Fantastic video.

Thank you for the video. I do remember briefly hearing about firebombing in Japan during WW2 lessons, but there was little detail and most of the focus was on the atomic bomb and the fights on the pacific islands, including okinawa & iwojima. I've lived in Japan for 10 years, been to both hiroshima and nagasaki multiple times, visited the atomic bomb museums, talked to japanese peopl about this topic, and even they seem to only remember the atomic bomb. So this was a really interesting topic. Cheers

@fenrir309

Жыл бұрын

I also lived in Japan for several years and occasionally spoke with Japanese about the war. Several in their 20's and 30's said, and I paraphrase, that it wasn't taught in school and all they know is that they were minding their own business and the US up and dropped two atomic bombs on them. I felt really sad for them as they were missing such an important piece of their history. Edit : I am not suggesting those experiences are indicative of the attitude of all Japanese or even that age group.

@adameve2647

Жыл бұрын

@@fenrir309 I can't believe the japanese govt didn't tell the truth to their young people maybe theyll be afraid of the result

@ludofax

Жыл бұрын

​@@fenrir309 Crazy how each country whitewash their history when teaching their young.

@therealspeedwagon1451

Жыл бұрын

Really goes to show how such a powerful bomb can completely overshadow any other tiny but far more numerous bomb. We basically nuked Japan off the map already with napalm firebombs already destroying much of their wooden cities.

@g76agi

9 ай бұрын

@@fenrir309 so why did you comment this?

My cousin twice removed was a POW in the mines at Nagasaki when the bomb dropped. He recalled coming out of the mine and all the coal lit on fire and seeing charred corpses everywhere.

Tokyo was not targeted for atomic strike for two reasons: it was far from being a "virgin" target i.e. so much of the city had already been destroyed in the LeMay Fire Raids so it would not provide a definitive demonstration of the atomic bomb's power. The second reason was we needed an intact Japanese government and a living Emperor with authority to issue the surrender orders to bring about the immediate organised capitulation of all Japanese fighting forces everywhere and end the war in one stroke. The political risk of killing the Emperor, an event guaranteed to fire Japanese determination to not surrender as well as to destroy the authority structure necessary to bring about the object of surrender, would defeat that purpose. So there were strong practical and political reasons for not hitting Tokyo with an atomic bomb.

9:00 "Well at the start of the war, the British were shit at aiming"

I think it's odd that the estimates of invasion casualties were sort of glossed over. There were estimates of up to 10 million if I remember right. That was based on the projections from Iwo Jima, and it brought on a logistical nightmare. They would need an invasion force of over a million men and Japanese casualties would be calculated in the millions as well, billions in bonds (that they already struggled to sell), food for that amount of men and those employed to get them to the island (it was possible they would have to resort to farming cat tail weeds for their starch content just to feed everyone), another year or two of war that everyone was mortally sick of, and somehow keep their holdings they were negotiating with the Reds in Germany. Ultimately, it was a numbers game, and they even ruled out Kyoto knowing that it would fortify their resolve. So they opted for Kokura as the primary target with Nagasaki as secondary. That wouldn't indicate the target were civilians primarily, but they were trying to get a surrender before USSR intervention, so they wouldn't have to split Japan like Germany. Imagine a traditional invasion between the US and the USSR, and half of Japan was subjugated to the Communist atrocities like China or East Germany. Things could have been a lot worse for the Japs, especially given what they had done. I honestly wish they hadn't been so stupid and attacked the US Navy in the first place.

@lafeeshmeister

Жыл бұрын

Check out the changes in what Truman said about those estimates. In the President's own words, after the war, they vary significantly. Some figures are astronomically high, others much more moderate.

@samm4258

Жыл бұрын

It's against the video's narrative. "sure the nazis did some bad things but..." sure they were trying to wipe another population off the face of the earth but... It's like self defense, neither option is preferable but once you cross the line its the better of two evils

@raymondswenson1268

9 ай бұрын

The estimate is based on the US pkan to throw Americans at Japanese kamikaze defenders as cannon fodder. A SMART invasion would have done a feint on Kyushu, but focused the real invasion on Sendai in the northeast wherr defenses were thin. Sendai is closer to the US mainland than Kyushu. It could be supported by B-17s launched from Okinawa and planes from hundreds of carriers plus battleships. Stupid, unimaginative US planners were careless about US soldiers' lives.

"We were at war, and it was total war, and we HAD to win, because heaven known what would have happened if we hadn't" - british bomber crew member from Ewan McGreggor's bomber documentary

I haven't watched this video yet but I always thought 2 of the reasons were because Tokyo had already been bombed the hell out of and they wanted an relatively untouched target to assess the capabilities of the Little Boy and Fat Man

My Great Step Fathers in laws son was a pilot in the Navy for US Air force during the Cold War and he had never flew a plane before. He drowned in the Pacific Ocean in 1704. I still remember his last words like it was yesterday.