Philosophy nerds: tu quoque is an informal fallacy (not a logical fallacy) and a version of ad hominem

@siberiansteiner

Жыл бұрын

tu quoque is a fallacy nonetheless, and one used very often by people who are very weak argumentators.

@Kunjesvari

Жыл бұрын

"Nuh uhhh. Tu quoque" i swear I heard my ex say this a thousand times. 😂

@Sophiedorian0535

Жыл бұрын

Too kwoe kway. That’s how you pronounce it.

@nunyabeezwax6758

Жыл бұрын

Yes, And like all psychobabblers, Grannon is guilty of it.

Narcissists are NEVER sorry for their mistakes. We all make them of course, except for them, and IF they do, we caused it🙄

@tammyfitzgerald5336

Жыл бұрын

😂😂😂😂🎉🎉🎉

I normally don't bother to watch videos on Narcissism anymore because I feel like I'm overly educated on the disorder after having a lifetime experience with all the varieties of narcs in my life. I usually just read the comments because I get to see that other people can actually relate to what I've suffered through and I don't feel so alone lol

@jonathanclayton9107

Жыл бұрын

I agree u can take in too much and go in a big circle.

@melissacole1821

Жыл бұрын

@@georginadoll6372 I plenty of examples and not enough time. Yes, I definitely know what abuse is and watching the same videos on the same exact thing can be unhealthy when you're trying to move on. I know the constant cycles and obsessing over a past relationship doesn't do ME any good.

@melissacole1821

Жыл бұрын

@@georginadoll6372 thank you. I think I'm just a narc magnet lol so I'm just going to be happy alone. Wishing you the best though.

@csc8697

Жыл бұрын

I found out mine died recently. I have mixed emotions, after all I did love him at one time. I guess he lived a full life, sure went thru plenty of relationships? (If you want to call using ppl that) lots of hearts in a jar...he smirked at that.

@tammyfitzgerald5336

Жыл бұрын

❤❤❤❤❤

I have a ton of family members that are narcissistic and its very exhausting to be around them bc they end up roping you into an argument when all you wanted to do was have a normal conversation

@rfoley402

Жыл бұрын

This is my experience as well. Very, very frustrating! The simplest conversations turn into a heated debate or argument. And what is most frustrating is how they will go back and forth between positions as long as it contradicts something I have said. And, yes, I think that grandiose and vulnerable narcissism exist in the same person. It just depends on what suits at the time.

@CursedWheelieBin

Жыл бұрын

Do you find yourself listening and just waiting for these beliefs to be confirmed though? Like 🛎️ “there she goes again” 🙄. That kinda mind reading can be, in and of itself, a narcissistic cliche 🤷🏻‍♂️. I’m not trying to catch you out. It just sounds familiar to my situation. I’ve actually severed ties with my family completely because I find it too stressful, painful, embarrassing, and utterly hopeless to interact with them. I can’t put 100% of the blame on them though. They’re just being themselves, right or wrong, and I can’t expect them to meet the expectations that I carry around with me, even if those expectations are basic decency, respect, sobriety, and civility.

@amandaroberts5111

Жыл бұрын

@@CursedWheelieBin Recently did the same, feels strange and sad but l already feel my body relaxing,...being near my narc brother was hopeless, draining and l had to go NC. I wish you all the best in future

@Mynarcissistfamilyexposed838

Жыл бұрын

@@CursedWheelieBin I dunno I think we as codependents and family scapegoats are way to forgiving of our family. You say they cannot help treating you like crap. But then at the same time u wouldn’t see them treating a random person the way they treat you. So maybe they can help it. But we just put up with it. And carry on going back for more. Instead of putting a boundary down.

@Mynarcissistfamilyexposed838

Жыл бұрын

@@CursedWheelieBin because everything they say is predictable because they want to demonise you. That’s why you sit there and predict what they will say next. It’s sad. They cannot just love you for who you are. But as you said. Maybe they are just programmed to behave a certain way and it’s from the unconscious so they don’t even realise they are doing it. Is that an adequate excuse or not. I dunno.

One of the worst narcs I've ever known absolutely loved telling people "oh grow up"!😝🤢🤮🥴

@jenbodhi1133

Жыл бұрын

Yes lol

@enricomiceli8704

Жыл бұрын

So true

@KatErina-ii6ru

Жыл бұрын

Oh goodness my BF has said this to me alot 🥲 I think we broke up last night. He got very angry when I told him ‘no’ and he needed to accept my answer I gave to his question about why I didn’t want to go to church with him. I wasn’t feeling well when he asked and I wanted think about it. Zero empathy

@SallyRyder777

Жыл бұрын

Yes!!!

@1zebracrossing

Жыл бұрын

That's what the narcs say........

My mother always said, "oh, so now you're rewriting history" if ever I called her out in her lies.

The “oh poor you” one really hit me hard. Spending years suffering and you finally say something and that’s when you get that. “You’re so sensitive you’re always complaining”

@opticalman6417

Жыл бұрын

your hyper sensitive is a comon comment made by narcissist the reason why they say this is their trying to get you to drop your defenses their feed you a lie befor carrying out the very action they said they wouldn't do my old extreme narc probation officer was like this he would say we are not about breaking people down here other wise this wouldn't work other wise then do exactly that

@opticalman6417

Жыл бұрын

my heart bleeds for you was the one i got from my mother as a child i haven't got time for this she would say this while watching a prerecorded copy of brook side that was considered important to her i wasn't and why would i be after all listening to me doesnt give her supply

@gingerisevil02

Жыл бұрын

My narcissistic mother was exactly like that. "Oh you're such a victim!" Clearly how she viewed HERSELF, while she stood by complicitly and allowed her husband to abuse me. Somehow my father could abuse me sexually, and both parents abused me emotionally and physically and verbally, but I was "spoiled and privileged and ungrateful." makes me sick. She thought she was a victim who was unappreciated, scape goating me for her unhappiness while her husband viewed her as a maid and fuck object, just like he viewed me... except she chose to stay with him, and she failed me as a mother by allowing him to abuse me. I was a victim, she was an abuser

@brendaplunkett8659

Жыл бұрын

@@gingerisevil02 It is a double betrayal, hard to gauge which is worse isn’t it?

@jengable4888

Жыл бұрын

You probably have a lot to complain about or state..and they do NOT want to hear it !

I was recovering from brain surgery and was labelled lazy throughout my recovery and whilst I was in hospital hours after having my head opened!! It was downhill very quickly after this and it took a further 12 years for me to see how I was being abused by my covert narcissist partner thanks to people like you I am healing from this trauma day by day

@steadypace1262

Жыл бұрын

This is the one thing that really gets under my skin about narcissist's, the absolute callousness they show to their injured or ill partner's. This shows what despicable people they really are. When you are physically weak these creatures called humans think they can have more power and control over you. Keep well.🕊

@corymiller7203

Жыл бұрын

I will pray God will heal you. I can relate to your story. Jesus loves us , stay in faith and stay strong.

@donnamaco1

Жыл бұрын

I hope your life going forward presents you with health and happiness. Your story physically hurt me. Unload that Horrible partner if you can.

@pjnix5618

Жыл бұрын

Same with me ! Except mine was breast cancer / chemo …. So happy you are free now !

@Mynarcissistfamilyexposed838

Жыл бұрын

They always say that. They have no sympathy. They will somehow make themselves the victim when your the one who is ill and suffering. You can never try hard enough to get better and will get frustrated with you. They will do this if it’s a mental issue or physical issue. The mental issues they will often induce it themselves and then complain when you go into crisis. At that point after they abused you or made you ill they can become your saviour. This is my mum 101. It’s crazy inducing because you cannot work out if she’s there to help you or hurt you. they are completely careless, sorry you had to deal with this. ❤, We deserve and deserved better.

Yeah, Ive heard the "you are perfect for me" phrase....just to be discarded every time we had a minor disagreement. Threathening "im moving out". And after the 6th "im done", I replied with " please do". Best decision of my life!

@user-jq8tg4fq4f

Жыл бұрын

Hello, how are you doing ?

@KatErina-ii6ru

Жыл бұрын

Oh goodness this sounds familiar 😮

@janmolekula3900

Жыл бұрын

I'm no expert, but I would add that to the list. Changing opinions like a lightning. One second you are the worst and everything is your fault and in some cases few SECONDS later they behave like nothing happened. Sometimes it makes them look like actors more than persons.

@extrastout1741

Жыл бұрын

Same here, in the beginning I was "perfect for him" and the girl of his dreams but with something as small as me being 5 minutes late to come over to his place he would be ready to break up. And mind u, I was always coming over to his place and we were just having sex, there was just traffic and we weren't late for anything geeze

@csc8697

Жыл бұрын

@@extrastout1741 That the only thing they are good for ..sex.

I wish that the courts and social workers would get trained in recognising this in parents. It's absolutely incessant, the assaults on me and therefore on our young son ... Not physical assaults, but mental and emotional.. court applications, false serious accusations against me, etc...just never stops

These cliches have become red flags for me. These days I tend not to wait around to discover whether or not they are NPD. I don't expect change.

Yes! I used to be told my thoughts feelings and intent regularly. Very boundary breaking

I've thought that a lot actually. Almost every narcissist, sociopath and generally toxic person I've ever come across seems to have the exact same phrases and playbook. It's weird

@djangoapple8230

Жыл бұрын

It's demonic. The same demons that colonize them colonize us. That's why there's such an emotional , mental and spiritual battle in us. They want our soul.

@Stardusted1

Жыл бұрын

Because it IS the same entity.

@zackzues4830

Жыл бұрын

@@Stardusted1 real shit

@KatErina-ii6ru

Жыл бұрын

Yep it’s spiritual in nature and is most def an entity. They can enter through trauma

@fire4myChrist

Жыл бұрын

Legion of demons 😈

I‘ve had a narcissistic family member, actually say, “I know you better than you know yourself”🤢 Thank you for sharing this knowledge for people to help with discernment.

@eagleeye2300

Жыл бұрын

My narc mother used to say that to me, and I knew it was just bizarre. In reality, she didn't know me at all.

@karenk2409

Жыл бұрын

My ex said this too, often. It is intended to absolutely silence you.

@mrjozo-pr6ih

Жыл бұрын

Ì ve seen this pseudo expertise on so many levels from so many people in any connection it is mind boggleing, it actually follows trends. This is what many people take out of some therapeutic settings they were in, that now they are in the know way ahead of someone who has not had the experience, and probably that is sometimes the only thing they took from that.

@rebeccaryan2441

Жыл бұрын

oh my gosh my husband uses this!

@karenk2409

Жыл бұрын

@@rebeccaryan2441 It is incredibly demeaning, Rebecca, as it assumes that you cannot speak for yourself, you have no agency, and since he has already figured you out, you cannot grow beyond his fabrication. If he's just being thick, tell him, no, you don't, and next time you think you know all about me, ask a question. If he is using this as a means of confining you to what he has decided you are, you need to think long and hard about this relationship.

I had a narcissist father and 4 narcissistic partners therefore all this is v familiar. Now I am narc free and sorting myself out. Listening to this is just exhausting. Brings back all those tedious discussions and endless bs I listened to over these relationships. Narcs are exhausting and they make me want to have a good nap and never deal with them again in the future. Wish they could just all live together in a giant narc commune (it would never happen or work out) and exhaust each other. Eugh...

@malwads1836

Жыл бұрын

I'm going to guess the homicide rate in a very large group of narcs would probably be sky-high😳🤗.

Thanks again, Richard! They are ALWAYS the victim! And they accuse those around them of the very issues they struggle with. When you try to point out their hypocrisy, look out!!! I guess it is too threatening to their fragile ego. I'm so glad to be on my own, after 40 plus years of marriage to a man w full-blown NPD. You, and others w similar understanding have helped me so much! God bless!!

Ones I kept being told was.."stop personalizing!" "you are too sensitive!" even when calling out the evidence of destructive behavior is right in front of them..like shaming or humiliating. They gaslight and make you feel you are the crazy one. They act as though they are victim. No apologizing of their behaviors or defending the real victim.

@AZDC99

Жыл бұрын

Classic SHAMING TACTICS that they'll classically reframe as you supposedly being "unaccountable" as a last ditch FLIP THE SCRIPT maneuver

@Mynarcissistfamilyexposed838

Жыл бұрын

Yet they personalise everything that u say. even if what you say isn’t personal or directed toward them. that whole , ur being over-sensitive thing is a projection of there own over-sensitivity. When you emotionally reacted or got upset to what they did you probably had a good reason.

Oh snap! I am a child in an adult body too! I’m here to understand my parents, but I see my own messed up behavior too! I am insecure about my worth, so I have used philosophy and psychology to keep from talking about my dull life of insane pain and crushing fatigue from cancer. Not like I can talk about what I have been up to lately. I have dominated conversations with a speech about something I have learned to avoid being asked to talk about my messed up self. I was severely isolated, neglected and used as a slave as a kid, so here I am at 58 trying to cut the chains with the past, with no clue how it keeps showing up in my present. I am so grateful to Richard for spelling things out for me so I can cut the crap that I was unaware I was doing! He gets my vote for medal of honor for his service to the shattered.

Stay classy Richard! I’ve been listening to you since 2013 and you’re presenting your best work to date. You’re a gem!

Oh every time I tried to sit down and logically and kindly communicate about his behavior and how it was affecting me and yep... All I heard was oh and you're so perfect! You're such an angel aren't you? Then of course I was defending myself like always. Every conversation ended up with me defending myself. It's like a conversation with a toddler and I can't believe I engaged in that conversation for years. Over and over the same arguments the same accusations. Still mad at myself for that.

@sweetie8207

Жыл бұрын

Exactly the same with me! Couldn't have put it better.

@susangatcom

Жыл бұрын

Blue in the face defending myself constantly! They bait you over and over

My mom called my dad "Patty perfect".... now he's dead from a very rare disease. His immune system couldn't handle the non stop abuse.

@Mynarcissistfamilyexposed838

Жыл бұрын

That’s terrible , I’m so sorry, Gabor mate often talks about this. it can cause physical illness and all sorts.

Some of this describes me as I have CPTSD and borderline / narcissistic traits. Childhood emotional abuse and abandonment was perpetrated upon me. I am trauma therapy to get reintegrated. I do think we are different sides of the same trauma “coin”, our empathy makes our path to healing slightly less arduous. I have fleas from my family I need to clear. 💜

@Xandoscritters

Жыл бұрын

Well,you have enough self awareness to make this comment! Kudos and glad you’re getting help. I have borderline traits,but haven’t been diagnosed. Could be PTSD? Or perhaps just a very aware empathetic borderline 🤷‍♂️ I’ve been in a relationship with someone who has almost all of the NPD traits. It’s been absolutely hellish for me. No self awareness. Every action,all of her behavior comes around to me. Never apologizes. Everything is a double standard. All values and moral code seems to be negotiable depending on weather it’s her or someone else. I’m sad I ignored all the red flags and opened myself up multiple times,but perhaps it’s a lesson that I had to learn eventually to heal myself,or at least start the process.

Wow! That described both my parents - each playing the 2 roles. This actually made me laugh and see them for what they really are - 2 kids!

My spouse, he does't deserve the title of Husband, he broke my Heart with cheating and acts like there's nothing wrong to cheat, And your video is spot on on everything they say. You start hating that person.

@MadalenaKC

3 ай бұрын

Mine did the same. He even laughet at me speaking with new "love", while was in next room. He didn't even bother lock the door. After 17 years of marriage Devils

Sometimes I cried from him purposely hurting my feelings and he'd say I was trying to manipulate him.

And with my narcissistic mother, I felt like I was the parent and the one that had to be the adult.

@karinesavard2016

Жыл бұрын

Same here. 🙄

@quasimodo614

Жыл бұрын

Yes I have this with my mother 😢

@parrymylogicthen290

Жыл бұрын

Their emotional intelligence is that of child. So yes, you will have to play the role of a parent with narcissist mom or dad sometimes.

@malwads1836

Жыл бұрын

Basically by the time you're in 1st grade you're already starting to surpass your parent's emotional development...It's definitely not easy.

I just read your book and I’ve gotta say it: in the description of Salome waking you up at 3 am screaming at you; man would I like to hear her version of that story. People with NPD are more likely to withhold and give the silent treatment as a form of emotional torture. This includes turning over and going to sleep when they have caused pain and distress and won’t discuss it or help resolve the problem. That very cold, heartless, selfish act can cause a trauma reaction in empaths that causes them to explode in frustration and pain at which point the narcissist says, “wow look how crazy they are-they are the narcissist”. Jus sayin.

On the psychoanalysis bit. My (soon to be) stalker ex roommate had made comments implying I was a narcissist a few times and I would file that away silently as he'd continue on yammering about himself and indignantly comparing himself to any man (literally any) man who got other women's attention over him. He'd brag constantly of his good deeds and how unworthy everyone else was. Ironically, he fits most of the criteria I think he was qualifying me with, so I just kind of silently rolled my eyes when he'd imply those were my traits. He started "accidentally leaving" books on narcissism around the house so I approached him calmly in the kitchen one day, book in hand. "Hey _____ , are you trying to tell me you're a narcissist? It's okay." That really annoyed the f out of him. I told him things in confidence before I knew how vindictive he could be and he'd later use those vulnerable admissions against me when he was mad. I quickly learned never to share anything with him I didn't need to. He'd frame he knew me better than I knew myself and his conclusions about my motives for anything were often completely left field and downright exhausting to keep track of. The scariest part about untangling myself from that whole living situation was how smart and admired he thought he was and how little support network he thought I had. He tried to choke me the night before I left so my fears regarding him are not out of nowhere. I made it very clear there are people who care about me and how his asking everyone prying questions about me was making mutual friends uncomfortable and that it wasn't going unnoticed... He was wealthy and popular and known for being philanthropic in the community. I still occasionally have nightmares about him. I worry for other women, but have no proof of anything. His attempts to isolate me from friends and family were palpable, until I was gone, then he would shower those people with gifts and "friendship" to attempt to have access to me. The stuff of nightmares.

@mint_soup9743

Жыл бұрын

Sorry that got intense lol

@ZLLi661

Жыл бұрын

eww. Sounds like a real charmer. Stay safe, avoid at all costs and record any conversations if you have to have them with this perverse person. Good luck!

@mint_soup9743

Жыл бұрын

@@ZLLi661 thank you I appreciate it. I've kept all emails after I told him never to contact me again, though I dont read them and rarely check that account anymore. I got a new number and email. Moved. Filed to have my voters address taken down before I moved, which they did. So many things. Anyway, thank you. I've been thinking lately all the ways I could use therapy that I don't even realize but other people might. Looking at it from that direction there is a very long list and resolving issues around that "connection" would probably be wise.

My soon to be ex-husband subjected me to many, MANY HOURS, and as long as 2 days straight (I was NOT allowed to get up/leave the room) of talks, which was him talking and talking and talking... A few times he made me take notes, as he continued talking NON-STOP. Ofcourse I could not. After 3-4 hours of this at a time, he wanted me to read my notes back. Practically every single time, he decided my notes of him talking and WHAT he was talking about were not good enough, so he would start all over again. That left me brain fogged, sick (due to lack of food, because he would not allow me to eat during the time he was talking for hours, all night long,..) and absolutely exhausted. What saved me was that little voice in my head, that constantly told me I had to get out, even though I had not yet understood I was dealing with a sick narcissist. He also subjected me to HOURS LONG of him reading scriptures, telling me that the Bible said and demands that a wife is SUPPOSED to be subservient to her husband and to ALL his wants and needs. I experienced PURPOSEFUL EXTREME sleep deprivation. All that happened in the first three months of getting married. The physical abuse and assaults started on the 4th month of marriage. I left the marriage after 11 months. I am grateful I got out, and it was not 11 years. I've been studying and learning about narcissism since I left him 2.5 years ago. I am still astonished, as to how the narcistic brain works, and/or doesn't work...

@user-jq8tg4fq4f

Жыл бұрын

Hello, how are you doing?

@hope46sf

Жыл бұрын

I'm so sorry you had that happen to you! I'm glad you are out! Take care of yourself!

@rebeccabriggs2982

Жыл бұрын

He is a very very very sick man who the devil resides in.

@izzyfox7575

Жыл бұрын

Made you take notes?? Holy shit 😆 I'm sorry to hear that. Sounds awful.

I just made the connection that I do #1 and #3 A LOT. And I am embarrassed by that. I didn’t know it was wrong because I grew up around it/having it used on me. While I give myself grace that I’m not going to cease doing it overnight and will take me time to heal what’s causing me to behave this way, I understand now that it’s wrong, is a form of abuse, and is my responsibility to address. Part of what I’ve identified in why I *think* I do it is because I’m trying to understand myself. While probably not all that helpful in the long run, philosophizing and psychoanalyzing myself and my abusers is how I coped with what was happening to me. This realization allows me to feel compassion for my “self” and also allows me to accept being more than okay with allowing these parts of me to die to be replaced with much healthier coping skills. And hopefully authentic self-love and relationships. Your videos are super helpful and eye-opening. It’s not easy to go down the path of self-realization and “individualization” as you put it, but whatever is on the other side has got to be better than living in this personal hell. It’s not my fault that I ended up with these (childhood) wounds/trauma, but it is my responsibility to fix it and grow the heck up!

So right, its actually predictable & amusing when you let it float over you & really listen in a detached way.

"I'm a very spiritual person..." The minute you hear that, you know they are not. They are setting up for a false comparison. You can see it coming.

@saraliburd7752

Жыл бұрын

Yep every they say they are they are the opposite

@1008md

Жыл бұрын

My Nex says “I am an empath”

@silvermoonuk

Жыл бұрын

@I Love Tapes yeah, I find some narcissist ppl make out they are apparently so called empaths - but they really not

@1008md

Жыл бұрын

@@silvermoonuk empathic vampires maybe lol

Loving the grandiose transition to vulnerable theory. I’ve watched the flip like a light switch.

@fire4myChrist

Жыл бұрын

Yesss !!!

@williamtiffee3799

Жыл бұрын

Indeed... They will play the hero, victim, or martyr... depending on the appropriate "acting script," to feel "validated," or "vindicated..." like a Hollywood hero, or heroine. It's quite, bizarre. Perhaps that's WHY Hollyweird (and the Platinum Triangle) is many a narcster's... chosen, "fantasy land?"

He would tell me my thoughts, feelings, and intent all the time. But if I said I thought he was intending to manipulate me with a certain behavior of his (he would throw these temper tantrum like a 2 year old and call it a panic attack, but I realized they only happened when I told him "no" and kept a boundary), he would become very angry with me and accuse me of having a problem assuming peoples intentions. Classic projection. Saying they have no original thought and need to absorb and replicate other's ideas is so true. There was nothing real about him. Everything was a lie.

1st minute into this.. I don't want to blame I want to heal. I watch Richard Grannon everyday. I'm exhausted from my personal experience, but I'm trying hard to get over this damage. It's awful 😢

@robynmarler1951

Жыл бұрын

🌾🌾🌾

@fainitesbarley2245

Жыл бұрын

Try Sam Vaknin

All 5 of these were in a horrible final text from my daughter before I blocked her,it’s early days but after years of her games I’m starting to feel better,Thank you for explaining it so well

@robynmarler1951

Жыл бұрын

God bless you sausage x

Numbers 1,3, & 5 showed up yesterday all at once. Thanks to videos like yours, it was very apparent what was happening so I could be much more prepared. Always keep sharpening your awareness skills.

"Is the juice worth the sqeeze?" Love it! I'm going to use it! It's good to see you smile and laugh in your videos.

It gets all confusing when the reactive abuse comes in and both parties are screaming the narcissist word - I feel

Talk about the Vaknin situation

They will try to justify or neutralize their abuse, or crimes they have committed ! Thank you for posting this video !

@jonathanclayton9107

Жыл бұрын

They also back down from what they said as well seen that a lot when they lure u back.

@jengable4888

Жыл бұрын

@@jonathanclayton9107 they will LIE and gaslight as to what they have done. When you see how they are the FIRST time, knowing what has already been done to you..believe it !

Your videos have really helped me a lot, especially the "dual mother dynamic" explanation of the narcissistic relationship, really helped me understand my relationships... Thank you for these videos!!

They’re all out to get me!! Spot on!!!

Richard, I have watched you since you talked from your couch in Singapour, in your undershirt, Asian traffic noise in the background. The topic of narcissism was not new to me, I was already ten years into it, but the way you presented it, raw and eloquent at the same time, was a revelation. I learned so much from you and felt validated. You feel like an old friend. Currently I learn to respect you even more because you show human decency by not starting your videos with a rant about a "former friend", throwing more vitriol at another person - as Sam Vaknin cannot get enough of. I only click on his latest videos to check if he is still at it...."they never give up, don't they...", my therapist once said and made me laugh. It is "cringe-inducing" at the least, eye-opening at best, to see how nasty a narcissist can become, out in the open, with no shame. Thanks for staying on your course - modeling adult behavior for all of us.

Right on, knew someone like this that caused quite a bit of damage peripherally. Also a little bit of me mixed in, great to see it explained in an easy to comprehend manner so we can all grow thanks !

On spot - Mr. Grannon. Your info is so valid for my work (physician in forensic context). Without your contribution, i would have had a burnout long ago. Since the decade that I follow your channels, they have been a boost to help overcome my own issues....like to say: you are a healer (a term which i use the rarest).

My Narcissist did this to me, a few weeks before the discard! Thank you for all your videos Richard. Getting through this one day at a time I never knew anything about NPD, so I’m learning and coping and trying to get through this one day at a time

I am so ashamed but I did some of this too the last 4 years after being for decades in narcisstic relationships. After working nearly 4 month with your course this behaviours have dimished and I can see how horrible this. Thank you so much ♥

Richard I agree. The ex Narc was grandiose, vulnerable and victim when ever it suited the situation. I was left 😮many times thinking 🤔 who does that! When i came across narcissism and the traits and the different types of Narcs I would think 🤔 that the narc I know is every single one of them! It is mind boggling! Better without !

Thanks Richard. Very good info.👍

Thank you for your videos Richard. So very helpful

You made me laugh all through the video ! Not only is the content of it excellent, but the way you present it is just irresistible ! A Shakespearian actor on stage... thank you, I had a really good time ! 🥰🙋‍♀️

This was absolutely spot on! His bs was absolutely exhausting!

It's like you were storyboarding my little brother before a casting call. Another great session.

I simply can't get enough of listening to you! Oh, my! You might possibly be the only one that can HEAL me. What great information you give me. It makes my mind sing! Great job 👏

I really enjoy your videos. They help me to understand all the things that happened in my relationship.

A few others I have had thrown at me: "I know what you are like", "You don't like it when others have opinions", "If there is no evidence, it didn't happen", "You are such a do-gooding crusader" and, the most memorable for me, "Tell a woman the truth and she won't believe you".

This was such an eye opening video. The five points suit so very well a certain couple, who's been in the media lately.

Thank you Richard.

You are correct & above target as usual mate. Thank you!

Richard, you are brilliant!

That was really good, thank you.

Thank you Richard you teach us with what we are dealing ,I cant imagine that level of abuse and like nothing happened very sick

Heard this all of the time! I could never have any problems. Certainly none as bad as theirs.

All are so accurate! I personally experienced these so many times... Some of their "precious messages" I enjoyed over the years: 1. I didn't say that. You got me wrong. You always misunderstand. I know better than you what I said. 2. You don't remember correctly. You have a memory loss and even though you were there, you can't recall what exactly happened. 3. You are very sensitive. You must grow up and stop acting so childish. I didn't say/do that to offend you/someone else. I have all good intentions. 4. I am the only one who cares about you. Stop seeing this friend/relative of yours. They are wasting your time and using you. 5. You are emotionally immature. Emotional intelligence is something I am very good at, but you obviously are not mature. 6. You are so negative. Say yes and stop saying no to everything. I know better than you. 7. You are socially awkward because you don't socialize like I do. 8. Be more proactive (=pushy and rude the way they are). Don't be so careful and respectful around people. (Ask them about their personal life and salary from the very start). I could go on...their minds are wired with the same mindset that produces these messages for the world to enjoy. Once away from them and for good, I am sure nobody misses them even a bit.

Brilliant video yet again, and the grandiose v victim strategy makes perfect sense! Thanks for explaining that!

Excellent video.

Fascinating people. Thanks for the information.

Thanks Richard... I recognized and had a good laugh 😂

This has been very interesting. They love to put their cliches on placards. I enjoy how you have a large bit of an entertainer. They are so rude at accuse you of it. They always complain and look like they are dying when they do it. Unless they are complaining to people they need supply from. And never let you complain.

Confession: While blind with rage/despair from the secrets, deceit, indifference, contempt and all the rest and not a clue how to cope, I was overpowered by impulse once and hissed/snarled a most caustic "poor you" when he said with a little sad face "It hurt me too"

Very interesting...it's crazy how that fits a certain person that has been in my life for a long time. It's funny how much of this narcisstic behavior has not only been accepted but even supported by my mother for said person. She actually told me very frequently to just give in, to not fight against it, to let said person mind-read me and so forth. Personally working on not psychoanalysing my mother anymore, which I think I'm doing as a weak defense mechanism for what she puts me through. Thank you Richard.

@aliross2720

Жыл бұрын

". She actually told me very frequently to just give in, to not fight against it, to let said person mind-read me and so forth" the narcissist who takes over control of your life "for your own good" because they are so concerned and helpful..this is very common among certain types of narcissists as a way to gain power and contrl. different narcissists attempt to exercise power over othersin different ways, but that doesn't change the end goal. Whether they use emotion, intelligence, concern or force, it's all the same. They are attempting to force others into doing what they want them to do, without any consideration for what the other person wants or would like to do. The only needs that matter are their own. The means they use to try to control others will usually be dependent on what their particular strengths are, the kind of person they are and what they have learned is effective. For example, some narcissistic people will use violence or threats to try to force others into doing what they want. This is probably because this is what the narcissist has learned will work for them, and is likely a reflection of their particular type of personality. Other narcissists may use guilt or concern to try to control others for the same reasons, and some may use both or neither depending on who they are dealing with or the situation they are in. The concept of power is very important to narcissistic people. They often seek power for it's own sake, and dealing with them can be just one nightmare power-struggle after another. They create contention and conflict over everything. Everything becomes a contest and a competition where, if they are not the winner, there is a huge blow up or some other type of punshment. Most narcissists do not like their power or authority being challenged, because this creates the fear in them that they don't really have any. It gnaws at them. People with no power don't matter, and this is the ultimate death for the narcissist: death by insignificance. This is why there are narcissists who may have everything they want, yet fall apart because one thing happens that they could not control, or one situation occurs where they feel like they lost. Pathologically narcissistic people feel very weak and helpless inside. They are not able to regulate their own self-worth and they are not able to fulfill their needs on their own. They need to dominate and control others so that they can be assured their needs will be fulfilled without interruption. People who are not being controlled follow their own agenda. They do whatever they want, and this may not include attending to the narcissist's many needs. So the narcissist endeavors to make sure that people are as preoccupied with their needs as they are. They do this by creating an environment where their needs are the most important thing. The various tactics and manipulations they use are all employed to this end. If they feel it is not working, they will often rage at the slight until their needs are firmly seated in the position of top importance once again. When you are dealing with a pathologcally narcissistic person, it's important to remember that they cannot feel comfortable or secure in the relationship unless you are under their control. If they had their way, you would do nothing but what they want you to do, 24 hours a day. Narcissists live with a huge amount of stress and fear because so much of their survival is predicated on controlling the behavior and emotions of other people. They cannot exert even basic control over themselves, yet they somehow believe they will be able to control others. Of course, they are not and people generally find this out pretty quickly and leave the situation. Those that don't often end up hating the narcissist and in the end, the narcissist still loses. They want to be loved, admired and respected but the best they usually end up with is someone who feels too trapped to leave. This is the difference between you and a pathologically narcissistic person. You can understand the true concept of power, even if they don't. You can learn that the only power anyone really has is over themselves, and you can also learn that is the only power anybody needs. You can be free from the emotional bondage that tortures narcissistic people every single day, and you can earn true love, admiration and respect by being a person who gives these things to others, rather than attempting to force them to fulfill your needs because you can't do it yourself. Theres also the matter of the narcissists cognitive distortions. These are are thinking errors. Emotional reasoning is an example of a cognitive distortion where a person believes that their emotions reflect the way that things really are. We sometimes use the phrase "feelings are facts" to refer to this cognitive distortion in narcissistic people. Another example of a cognitive distortion would be mind reading where a person attempts to interpret what someone else is thinking or feeling despite having little or no evidence to support that. Cognitive distortions can affect anybody but they are often extreme in narcissistic personalities, Many people might have some difficulty with one or two cognitive distortions such as catastrophizing or disqualifying the positive, but narcissists often have massive difficulties with most or even all of the examples of this kind of thinking. Also whereas a non-pathological person can usually take a step back and examine their thinking to see where it's faulty or skewed (especially if it's been pointed out to them) narcissists generally don't. Perhaps they can't. They may believe they do in fact have evidence to support these faulty conclusions but it often involves misperceived events, ignoring evidence that disproves their perception or the incorrect interpretation of someone else's motives, thoughts or feelings. For example a neutral or even kind behavior or event becomes sinister and proof of maliciousness when it's viewed through a distorted and skewed emotional lens. Someone who is not a narcissist for example might believe they know how someone feels about them based on how this person behaves towards them. This is not a hundred percent accurate all the time of course but it's usually a conclusion based on objective events and that weighs all the evidence not just the evidence that supports the conclusion. Narcissistic people come to conclusions about how people feel or what they're thinking based on how they themselves feel even if this is contradictory to the evidence. Rather than change their conclusion to match the evidence they reinterpret the evidence to match their conclusions. So it looks like i feel that you feel or think or believe this so it's a fact that you do and everything you do and say only serves as evidence of this fact. That's why their " evidence" in these types of things usually includes a misperception of the event and of your feelings or your motives. It usually involves things that can't be disproven. An unfalsifiable hypothesis is one that cannot be proven false, which means it cannot be tested for validity. In other words, it cannot be proven wrong. When the results of testing invalidate our hypothesis - our conclusion, this tells us that we are wrong. If that cannot happen, then we can never be proven wrong. t

@aliross2720

Жыл бұрын

This is often what you see with narcissistic personalities. The type of conclusions they come to and the arguments that they make involve unfalsifiable hypotheses. They are based on things that essentially cannot be proven wrong. And contrary to their apparent beliefs, these things are not impossible to falsify or disprove because they are so true and correct. They are impossible to disprove because there is no way to test or prove them. For example: you cannot prove you are thinking or not thinking something, you cannot prove you are feeling or not feeling something, you cannot prove you believe or don't believe something, you cannot prove you meant or didn't mean somethingm you cannot prove you did not do or say something. in many contexts These things are often the crux of arguments with pathologically narcissistic personalities. For them, the fact that these things can't be proven wrong is proof that they are right. This kind of illogical thought process is one of the things that makes dealing with narcissists so frustrating and ultimately pointless. They insist that you need to prove the unprovable. They want you to convince the unconvince-able, using examples they won't accept and facts they deny. It's useless. Narcissistic personalities have all the evidence stacked up on their side. They seem to think that they have proof of what they believe. They will tell you what you think, what you feel, what you believe, what you meant and nothing you will ever say convinces them otherwise. They add 2 and 2 together to get 5, and will not listen to or even consider anything that does not validate that. You cannot prove them wrong, which automatically validates these things as true and correct. The problem here is that you are arguing facts and they are arguing feelings. When they state their feelings as facts, you attempt to address their unsupported conclusion by bringing up the actual facts. This may be perceived by the narcissist as you trying to manipulate or convince them out of their feelings, or as trying to control what they think. These conversations are extremely confusing and frustrating for people, and it's because, even though you might not realize it, you are actually talking about 2 different things. You are talking about what actually happened, and they are talking about what they have interpreted the event to mean through an emotional, distorted lens. Because of that, these things may bare only a passing relationship to each other. Maybe it was Wednesday and you were both at the movies, but that is where the agreement of the two perceptions ends. There is no way to get together on this, because narcissists will not listen to you. They can't. If they listen to or even entertain your side of things, they seem to view this as giving up ground and losing the power position. For the narcissist, everything depends on them being able to keep that position, and they will fight like crazy to do it, even when it makes no sense at all and even when it causes them to lose important, valued positions or relationships. In fact, this kind of ignorant, unintentional self-sabotage is very common for narcissistic personalities. Even if they did listen to you, there is every possibility they would not be able to understand what you are trying to say. Their perception of things is very different from yours and they see things through an affected lens. Simply trying to present objective facts to narcissistic people is often very difficult, because many narcissists really don't have a way to see things objectively. They cannot take their feelings, conclusions, and interpretations out of the equation. They cannot view things through any other lens. Asking them to do so is pointless. They can't do it, so what you are left with is a person who cannot see things as they really are. You cannot prove their conclusions or interpretations wrong, which means you cannot prove them wrong, and therefore there is nowhere to go with any of this. They will simply keep repeating the same wrong thing over and over again, completely convincing themselves that it is the truth and bolstered even more so by your inability to prove them wrong. This should not be confused with lying. Narcissists also lie just like everybody else in the world of course, but this is something different. This is about genuinely perceiving something incorrectly but believing it to be true. You can't argue against the cognitive distortion, the way this person is perceiving and interpreting events is not reality, they are experiencing a thinking error which means that their conclusion makes sense to them. Trying to convince them to see it differently does not work and even if it were to work in the moment it doesn't stick. This is a problem with the way the person automatically interprets information and events and it's very hard to change when it's this extreme. if someone genuinely believes they have real evidence for their conclusions what can you say to counteract that? nothing that's going to matter that's for sure. Trying to convince them otherwse convinces them that you are unsafe and untrustworthy because you are lying and attempting to manipulate them. This is hard to stop trying to do this because many times what they're saying is just blatantly not true, it's a complete misinterpretation of objective reality, sometimes to the point of seeming delusional. it's very difficult not to argue against that or try to correct it but you can't stop them from thinking that. We can't control what other people think about us or anything else and continuing to try to control it causes an enormous amount of stress and pain. if someone wants to believe that you're a bad person when you aren't, If they see evidence that you're a bad person when you're not, it doesn't matter what you do you cannot change that. If reality does not speak for itself you do not have a chance in hell. Sometimes this behavior is gaslighting to take the focus off of them and whatever they did wrong, but sometimes it is truly sad. The narcissist will sit there, smugly believing they've caught yet another evil liar in a gotcha! moment when in reality, they are doing nothing but assigning malicious motives to people who care about them and destroying the most important relationships in their lives for what is literally no reason, simply because they misunderstood due to their own fear or self-loathing and then wouldn't listen to anything that said they were wrong. It's really a shame to watch, and even harder when you realize that there is nothing you can do about it except move on with your life because this person has a delusional, fantasy image of you and it's not going to change.

When I was a child, I thought like a child, talked like a child, acted like a child, but when I became a man, I put childish things away.

Thank you!

Excellent video!

I was told " that's the "id" and then something else was the "ego" stayed silent in response. Spot on video👍

Oh the self- aggrandising lectures…sat through these missives for hours every night for yeaaars and couldn’t get a word in! If I interjected just to try to agree or comment or try to induce a reciprocal conversation, he’d say I never listened to him and was always controlling him. You just cannot have an even, peaceful, mutually supportive relationship. Ever. One night my inner voice said very clearly to me “Enough”.

Damn ! This episode is gold!

Really appreciate the perspective you share at 11:13 re: the strategy being different but to fulfill the same need of the maladaptive personality disorder. It also, seems to somewhat coincide with a persons sex, but definitely experienced both strategies being used by the same person.

I lost count how many times I heard “Little Miss Know It All” and how ungrateful I was in our relationship. He told me how other people would “love” to be in a relationship with him, and how his best friends would say what a catch he is, with ZERO regard for this emotional and physical abuse and how his actions created a toxic relationship. The night he stole my garbage and tried to plant a tracker on my car, that ended up being my fault. “Get over it!”

Excellent, thank you. From Brisbane Australia 🇦🇺

Hilarious. I was like where is the "they are jealous of me" and it was your following sentence.🤣 Yes my man everybody is jealous of you who doesn't like you. Makes sense.

After listening and watching many videos of you and Sam Vaknin about narcissism, I really have the impression that I started to see the toxic dynamic in my relationship : the love bombing (grooming) phase, shared fantasy, the way he became my perfect mother and made me addicted to the selflove I felt for the first time in my life, the way he wanted me to become his perfect mother who loved him unconditionally despite all the abuse and devaluations … the emotional distancing and avoiding me completely, also sexually…. I always felt as if he was projecting the hatred he felt for his mother on to me (and I told him that on a few occasions too). Seeing this video makes me wonder if I am the narcissist because what I do is kind of psycho analysing, isn’t it ? This video confuses me and makes me wonder if I have it completely wrong 😏 … ?

@tulinkhalidazim9756

Жыл бұрын

I feel the same way a lot, but I wonder if that is "reactive abuse". Till I finally walked away and before I knew what any of this was, I was constantly finding ways to survive, and one of them after many years was, I will put exactly the same effort and energy as I receive. Not proud of it, but it was impossible to make sense of my life at the time.

@ashlynann8169

Жыл бұрын

I felt very similar to what you described because, i would find myself explaining what a good person actually does for him to see how wrong he was being. How hypocritical. Then once I learned why he was doing what he was, i wouldn’t just expect his explanation because it never made sense. So i was constantly trying to find the true motive behind it. I’ve become so exhausted and completely different from who i used to be. I just want off this ride!

@romygarcia3782

Жыл бұрын

@@tulinkhalidazim9756 I think you can indeed call that what we do ‘reactive abuse’ … as Sam Vaknin says : it is contageous ! And I am not proud of it, but after 20 years, you have no choice ☹️ …. i want out of this situation !

@tubefreakmuva

Жыл бұрын

These 5 clichés are not exclusive to narcissists.

@romygarcia3782

Жыл бұрын

@@tubefreakmuva so who else does ?

A million thanks for this video Richard. I have had a good laugh with this one. I really do like your style. I absolutely agree with your theory of using different strategies. I see my male NARCISSIST do this switch if he is not getting the intended feedback from me. What has made me laugh is that although I am conducting my deal with a Spanish NARCISSIST in the Spanish language, being native English and fluent in Spanish, I can translate his words directly into English and they are the same as yours on the board!!!! Yes, I know no.1 and I always think, "If only you were all of that because that is the person that I signed up with!" Full-bodied, full-minded, capable, intelligent, resourceful (well, too damned resourceful in truth, although using my resources for lack of his own!), humourous, affable, generous, caring, etc. No.2, I have heard this one with so much frequency that I know even as I start to speak that this one will shortly be coming my way. My two sisters and the male partner are guilty of this one any time that I try and make a suggestion to them. No.3, I am always stunned that he is painting this picture of me and thinking, "Hey, wait a minute, that is you that you are describing; not me!" And yes, he can go some twists and turns on this one!! I usually end up laughing as I think he even gets confused himself at the absurdity of his accusations! No.4, like I should not have any needs at all because of course, he cannot meet any of them! "Poor you, what about ME? You don´t even consider what I have to go through each day, do you? No, it is all YOU, YOU, YOU and YOU! Can´t you see just how selfish and self-centred you are! But you don´t ever give a thought for me, do you?" A typical reply to any tiny request of mine for a basic need to be met. No.5, yeah, like he is the only vulnerable person in the world but why is he in a vulnerable state? Because of ME of course! It is ME who is out to destroy him! It is ME who brings him down! It is ME who has made life so difficult to navigate! It is ME who gives him no support! And of course, in the working arena, like there haven´t been those who have sorely "UNDERESTIMATED HIM!" (Seen him for what he is and shown him the door, in truth!) Thank you for helping me to have a good laugh Richard, sat where I am right now, I know that laughter is a very powerful tool. Do you know the excellent Guns and Roses song entitled: "They´re Out To Get Me!" I find this song comes to mind when he goes down no.5 street! Which for me induces a smile and reminds me that whilst I have got my phenomenal musical supply, although he has been "Out To Get Me" since we met, he will never finish me off. I haven´t had enough of my musical supply yet!!!!!! Great work!

Funny cause I remember observing my ex oscillate between the grandiose and covert, then being the victim, everyone is out to get them, paranoia nonsense. Now that I think about it, he was in a constant state between getting a lot of attention to none at all, feeling insignificant. So exhausting.

That was very helpful. Thank you. :)

Richard, this is my boss. Spot on.

That was fantastic

This video really triggers me. With everything you said, I was thinking: Is that me? Oh, that’s me… I’m really a bad person. I started to punish myself for all the things I’ve said of thought. But at the end I started to realize that is exactly what you’re talking about. My father said all these things to me. I integrated it in my system as if it’s me thinking it, but it is the narc-voice! Thank you so much for clarifying!

He'd always say "oh stop with the victim stuff" 🙄 whenever I brought up my feelings or called him out on anything

I laughed out loud at the part where he says “oh unconsciously? ; I guess you’ve got Carte Blanche to accuse anyone of anything then” Oh how I WISH I’d heard that Al long time ago. It’s a brilliant thought that brings SO much perspective after having heard someone try to accuse you of being someone you’re not STRAIGHT AFTER the words “oh so you think you’re perfect” Thankyou Richard. I can feel the anger these comments would typically invoke just disappear ..:

💯 I think your content are amazing tools!

soooooooooo true... for every thing. They are a 5 year old inside. Hilarious if I had not fallen for him. Just bought your course, Richard, Thank you so much for the work you do.

Thank you Richard 🙏 keep laughing! Personally I’m not there yet but can see a time coming when the wtf absurdity becomes medicine of the best kind.

Just as you said on Trigg I haven't been getting you in my recommended. I thought you'd gone dark for a bit taking a break after your book but turned out you'd been posting. I just didn't see it until I searched specifically

I’ve done a lot of active work in my life over the past six years to heal and navigate through these types of relationships. Setting up boundaries with family members only after her behavior had “improved“ which can only be for a short time and that is because I spent very little time in the presence of certain family members anymore. I call it quality time now :-) because it seems genuine and it is quite polite when it is in short duration. i’m not angry or frustrated anymore and that was so I could feel and live my own life in peace.… It has come to my attention now after a 37 year friendship, that I did not want to see this type of behavior in a person I have love so dearly since childhood. over the last 48 hours, I have been swept up in a whirlwind of abuse, chaos and just outright toxicity. After the contrast of having spent so much time in isolation and healing it was painfully obvious that I didn’t recognize her anymore and she was extremely narcissistic with mostly borderline traits. after witnessing a narcissistic rage and meltdown while being a passenger in her fast driving car, I later packed my things and left her house without much of even a goodbye. I had come to help her during a crisis (which she is always in) and realized she want to know such a help just to feel the chaos and a lot of attention. she is self-destructing and fast. It is the last of what I am willing to put up with in my life. extremely heartbreaking. Thank you Richard for all your help along the way in the last six years of my healing journey.

Everything is so on point its scary

BANG ON, Richard...the virtuous twaddle is flapping drivel.

Oh wow... SO straight and accurate. My family member is horrid about all this and shocked me with the mask drop. Am saving this vidya

Great point at 11:15 👍🏽 I recognized the narcissist I was dealing with could be either grandiose or covert depending on the situation. I watched a video by Dr. Todd Grande that first brought this to my attention, I believe he referred to this as “oscillating”.