That bundle of spaghetti looks like an attempt at a homemade Octovalve using the ENTIRE parts bin and all the clamps, elbows, hoses and pumps. And an extra gallon of coolant.

@bluetoad2668

8 ай бұрын

Just what I was thinking too. Not what I'd expect to see on a Porsche costing twice what a better performing model S does. Nice interior but badly engineered and terrible software - for Porsche fans only.

@MaurizioLattuada

8 ай бұрын

COTS FTW

@switzerland3696

8 ай бұрын

That is what happens when you get pushed to get it done, but you are just out of the prototype stage, so a refined prototype is what you get.

@peteravolio2695

8 ай бұрын

​@@bluetoad2668Define better performing

@ronn4061

8 ай бұрын

Lmao😂 @homemade

If you follow any of the mechanic channels that work on German cars, they warn people to stay away because of the plastic fittings tendency to harden and break. That bowl of spaghetti is a land mine waiting to happen....

@AirzonesBlasters

8 ай бұрын

To be fair though, you're not getting the same heat cycles as you would in an ICE engine bay

@capn_shawn

8 ай бұрын

​@@AirzonesBlasters The heat cycling is primarily from the liquid temperature... not so much the under-hood air temperatures. With the exception of a few "Hot V" connections and turbo coolant lines, which are mostly metal in the hot zones, the plastic is the same temperature as the liquid inside... which is hotter than even the hottest engine bay. This is why heater hoses inside the cabin and hoses in front of the radiator (in cool air) fail just as often. I drive a Porsche and can guarantee that cluster of hoses, valves and connections is a 100% guaranteed problem to whoever owns that car after 3 years.

@tomwojcik7896

8 ай бұрын

@@capn_shawn I think you're right that, ultimately, the Porsche spaghetti will fail, but I think @airzonesblasters' point was that EV coolant runs at much lower temps than ICE coolant, which is almost always true.

@capn_shawn

8 ай бұрын

@@tomwojcik7896 You may be correct, as I know next to nothing of EV cooling loops. I do, however, build quite a bit of IGBT cooling systems on large electric motors and I can say confidently that with a Permanent Magnet Motor (a motor that has no magnetizing current), the temperature swings on the coolant are directly proportional to the amps going to the motor. Full load = max heat No load = zero heat If it is the thermal cycling that gets the FRP connections to break, I would think an EV would have worse thermal swings than an ICE vehicle that gets hot once and stays hot. But that is just a guess. That and the fact that I own both a Mercedes and a Porsche and don't trust Germany's ability to make plastic cooling parts.

You need to get a hoist that goes higher, or shorter employees

@MooseOnEarth

8 ай бұрын

... or a recessable walkway unter the hoist. 😀

@theagentsmith

8 ай бұрын

A foot garage 😄

@aaron___6014

8 ай бұрын

@@MooseOnEarth that's the most expensive and dumb approach. Do you work for Porsche.

That almost looks like what my landscaper Pauly did with my sprinkler system when I wanted to add a few zones

"Very INTERESTING EXECUTION. I've never seen anything like this. It's very.... uh mmm... INTERESTING. So unique and.... ummm intersting execution." Engineer jargon for "What the F*CK am I looking at???"

@rogerstarkey5390

8 ай бұрын

I literally 😂😂😂😂😂'd at your post. 👍

@Tschacki_Quacki

8 ай бұрын

I'll never forget Sandy saying: "Uhm... seems like the people who designed this, uhm.... didn't have their brains... uhm... functioning in the right way."

Imagine the mass of the rat’s nest once it’s full of coolant 😳

The lack of small overlap counter measures is really disappointing, especially in such an expensive vehicle.

@ClockworksOfGL

8 ай бұрын

Sounds like Porsche assumed nobody would test it.

@georgepelton5645

8 ай бұрын

From the video, it sounds like the expensive vehicles are the least likely to get SORB countermeasures. Due to their low volume and therefore not likely to be tested by IIHS.

@user-rs1fo2dd9b

7 ай бұрын

ironic, you'd think an expensive vehicle would go above & beyond to keep occupants safer in a crash

Very informative. Incredible mess at the front. It looks like it was designed by an arachnid *Rube Goldberg.*

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

well VW fired Herbert Diess , thats why. now VW group is controlled by Porsche guy.......lol. can we say MAFIA.

Is that bowl of spagheitti made with PVC pipe, it looks like my last DIY plumbing job

@radicalrick9587

8 ай бұрын

*Don't sell yourself short, I'm sure your DIY was made to last whereas Porsche was designed to fly apart when it's hit by an everyday road hazards.*

The Taycan has been out for over 3 years now. And the snake's nest of coolant pipes hasn't changed. Will be interesting to see if they change it for the upcoming refresh.

@radicalrick9587

8 ай бұрын

*I doubt it, while Tesla moves at lightning speed, Porsche moves at molasses speed.*

@deadbeef16

8 ай бұрын

Will be interessting to compare with the next Gen of Taycan :)

OMG, I thought the Mach E was bad. Even calling it a bowl of spaghetti is being much too nice.

I DARE someone to own this after warranty! 💰💸💰💸💰💸💰💸

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

No issue at least this base spec. Nothing much to worry about.

@GTO33

8 ай бұрын

History has proven you wrong. Tesla on the other hand…

@memertmemes2586

8 ай бұрын

Every piece of plastic on the cooling system will need replacing before it's even 10 years old. Junk.

@truthseeker111

8 ай бұрын

@@computercrack cracks what u smokin’

@truthseeker111

8 ай бұрын

@@GTO33 history and personal experience proves me correct. U even own a Porsche Brah?

All that pipe work so close to the front of the vehicle makes for an expensive repair even in a minor front on crash.

@Robert-cu9bm

8 ай бұрын

The Porsche badge makes it an expensive repair no matter what.

@lennyvalentin6485

8 ай бұрын

If you buy Porsche, the cost of repairs should be the least of your concerns. If you worry about cost, you should buy something else.

@memertmemes2586

8 ай бұрын

​@@lennyvalentin6485people love saying that but there's no reason consumers should be buying products with such shitty, cost cutting engineering.

@radicalrick9587

8 ай бұрын

@@Robert-cu9bm *Exactly, VW logo and it's a $200 job, take off the VW logo and slap on a Porsche badge then all of a sudden it's a $2,000 job.*

@clu4u

7 ай бұрын

Teslas are no cheaper to repair, aluminum body work makes it an instant write off.

That spaghetti is going to end up on a curb...

I figured it out. . They built a test rig on the bench, someone said "That would actually fit IN the car!" And a beancounter heard them!

@abraxastulammo9940

8 ай бұрын

It is like the exhaust piping out of the ICE motor, carefully bended and twisted to match the lengths 😅

Low under the front end is a dangerous and costly place to locate such a maze of cooling valves. Seems like any minor interaction with common road debris could be catastrophic to many systems affected. Here’s hoping they move that system up higher and further back.

That reminds me of the DIY sprinkler pipe I saw at an electrical engineer’s house 😂 engineers always do the goofiest stuff at home

@MooseOnEarth

8 ай бұрын

But this "bowl of spaghetti" can be repaired with standard parts, just like a DIY sprinkler pipe, even in 20 or 30 or 40 years from now. In contrast, a broken or malfunctioning Octovalve will set you back big time in terms of money, availability and waiting time. When you really think about repairability, the proprietary super-integrated parts are rarely a good choice.

@boredKiwi

8 ай бұрын

@@MooseOnEarth totally agree. My Kona has numerous high-quality solenoid valves comprising the heat pump system, any one of which can be disassembled for repair if needed.

@Alhussainba

8 ай бұрын

@@MooseOnEarth forget about 40 years, this thing will malfunction in a few years, if you keep this vehicle for 40 years then you probably would repair this system A LOT.

@esbrasill

8 ай бұрын

yup, I'm an electrical engineer and my swimming pool pump house looks like that

@funbarsolaris2822

8 ай бұрын

​@@Alhussainbait doesn't seem to be though, is there any evidence of taycans and etron gts breaking down all the time? Not that I can see, they're everywhere where I live, never seen or heard of them breaking down. They've already been on the road for years now

The coolant plumbing was relatively tidy compared to the mess around the rear drive unit. Such a dog's breakfast could be due to poor interaction between engineering groups or overbearing management.

@bobmcnulty3500

8 ай бұрын

Here is the bin of parts we have, make it work!

[Editing Team] Thanks guys for continuing to expand the acronyms into the appropriate words - it helps greatly when I misinterpret what is spoken due to speaking speed/accent/pronunciation differences between various English speaking nations 😄

That cooling system looks to be in a very bad part of the car in terms of possible damage from road hazards.

@mking9446I

8 ай бұрын

Designed to fail

@crazydrifter13

7 ай бұрын

That would be €10,000 Sir

@CaneBTC

7 ай бұрын

I assume they have removed a underbody pan

Great vehicle to drive, never to own and what now looks like assemble too. Thanks for sharing.

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

Taycan drives like a old lady , Compared to PLAID S .

@mrm1885

8 ай бұрын

@@markplott4820 How do you know?

@DimitarStanev

8 ай бұрын

@@markplott4820 kzread.info/dash/bejne/eqJts7mjqKm2e7A.html 9:35 you don't know what you're talking about.

5:25 - Perhaps the designer has stock in a fitting/hose/pump company??

@rogerstarkey5390

8 ай бұрын

PVC for the win!

@Tschacki_Quacki

8 ай бұрын

That's closer to the truth about legacy automakers than we wish...

Good team, yes I see the likeness! Really appreciate the pop-up notes onscreen too! Thank you.

I like the use of an antenna (I'm sure they're lying around) as a pointing device.

The value of giga castings really make sense when you look at the bottom of the Porsche. So much opportunity to eliminate parts, suppliers and labor. Additionally, think of all the engineers required to design hundreds of those parts! That’s the hidden cost that is difficult to capture on a BOM comparison analysis.

@austinpowers1999

8 ай бұрын

The excitement on the bowl of spaghetti is overwhelming my natural senses.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

No it doesnt make sense at all from volume perspective. The Taycan was planned and still is a low volume car (40k or sk sold a year, planned with maybe 20k) so no extremely expensive tools wouldnt have worked cost wise.

@kylekleman

8 ай бұрын

@@computercrack it’s a system level change. It probably wouldn’t make sense just for the Taycan. But if you have the machines to produce multiple cars, I see no reason why the capital cost for two large die castings would be more than the hundreds of aluminum extrusions, stampings and welding equipment. Those are not cheap.

@lennyvalentin6485

8 ай бұрын

Porsches are low volume, high cost vehicles - the case for a gigacasting which trades some overall strength/weight efficiency for a major reduction in cost and increase in speed of manufacturing doesn't make as much sense as for a high volume, lower cost vehicle. It would be more beneficial for an expensive sports car type vehicle to have a multitude of bespoke parts to give exactly the strength/stiffness/weight desired, even if it means more efforts required to assemble during manufacture.

@hugegamer5988

8 ай бұрын

Heck yea, that way when you get some damage you have to replace half the frame and completely disassemble the vehicle turning a 2k repair into a 40k repair. Save on production, screw em on repair. I love it.

This thing is the epitome of a “warranty car”.

*That Bowl of Spaghetti looks like it was designed to get hit by road hazards and spring a leak thus forcing you to bring it into the dealer so they can charge you $$$$$.*

wow, thanks for showing us this!

@MunroLive

8 ай бұрын

Our pleasure!

$10,000 in plastic elbows with fiat wiring connectors at road level . i wish the ceo's would let the engineers engineer .

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

if it works it aint stupid. do you think little Children work at Porsche?

@linuxxr

8 ай бұрын

no, i think ceo's have the engineers Hamstrung to the point their own innovation comes to a standstill because ceos want things to break,,, like those 10,000 dollar plastic elbows right there in the perfect spot to be broken , Children would expect better of a company@@computercrack

The best Tay-Tech video I have seen yet !! Thanks

Thanks! Interesting to see the design considerations, all the best

@MunroLive

8 ай бұрын

Thanks for watching!

This just reminded me.... I need to do some plumbing over the weekend.

EV People: "I don't have to worry about all those traditional car problems like water leaks" EV Manufacturer: "Lets add 50X the amount of water connections that a regular car has"

@TheReal_JG

7 ай бұрын

*ICE* Manufacturer when manufacturing EVs.

gona tell those pipes 2 take the staircase! a bunch of interesting aspects in engineering.. just kidd'n.... crazy great video guy's!! thanks so much! super job!

This car encapsulates all that is wrong with German response to Tesla, but it’s amazing what advertising can do.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

What's wrong? Porsche has much better build quality, more options to choose from, much better ride quality and driving performance (like going around corners), a working brake system and much more. Tesla does provide a good experience for less money. that's fine but clearly not the best engineering

@Holeyguagaamoley

8 ай бұрын

Err.. weight size efficiency they did a good job of trying to hide the bulk but this car is not better built it is a sad reflection of business as usual in Germany. They need to get with it before the Koreans and Chinese eat their lunch.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

@@Holeyguagaamoley lol

@Holeyguagaamoley

8 ай бұрын

Lol? Well it’s right there in front of you.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

@@Holeyguagaamoley choosing a design you dont understand the reasons for doesnt mean it's got bad build quality. quite the opposite. it's very solid and has been put to millions of miles of hard test driving before getting released to the customers.

I think you gave the car an easy ride. It’s difficult to believe the transmission tunnel is for performance and rigidity, and more likely a hang over from the Paramera platform. Also the parts bin thermal system, and two speed gearbox to get the performance from their motor give the game away. It’s a nice prototype but have to wait for the real version. Maybe the new 718 will be better.

i was WAITING for a teardown of the taycan! I was really thinking what to choose between this and the model s. thank u guys for this!

@FutureSystem738

8 ай бұрын

Simple. Are you a total masochist? If so, buy the Porsche.

@Timeless_Essence

8 ай бұрын

@@FutureSystem738 u see those hoses? That screams coolant leak. Checking repairbility is very important. U don't want headaches, regardless of brand.

@FutureSystem738

8 ай бұрын

@@Timeless_Essence I have a friend with a fairly new ICE Porsche. His reliability and maintenance costs are absolutely horrific. He loves my Tesla Model 3P, and is very envious- says his next car will DEFINITELY be a Tesla. He’s about to order a YP any day now. We can’t get the S & X downunder 🇦🇺 any more 😢 This electric Porsche seems very little better than it’s ICE brethren. It looks as though it’s been cobbled together from the parts bin.

Yes! Thanks guys.

@MunroLive

8 ай бұрын

Our pleasure!

Thanks for explaining this guys

I was the lead engineer for this "bowl of spaghetti" and my father owns a hose and clamp shop. These two facts are unrelated.

@KyleHubb

8 ай бұрын

🤣🤣🤣🤣🤣

39% denser 😂. That rear end reminds of a first version of model 3's rear. I can't believe Porsche is getting away with such a hodgepodge

It is called "the snake's nest" ☝️

This first generation Taycan could be a nightmare to source parts in the future!

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

why ? parts are Sourced from ICE Panamara.

@markjonz

8 ай бұрын

Looks like it was cobbled together from existing parts. A lot of parts

What is the white precipitate/residue that splatter the under belly of the car? Is it coolant?

Shocking how much structural bonding Porsche is using on the body, where larger presses & extrusions would save weight and complexity in assembley.

The hose chaos immediately reminded me of the Porsche 944 Turbo! One of the first production cars with a turbocharger and a similar mess under the hood. It was also Porsche's first car of that kind, analogous to the Taycan.

In my opinion, the tunnel brace with the casting and four bolts shown at 13:40 is made to keep the tunnel sheet metal from flexing too much. The top pin is able to slide into the opening in the casting at the top. This is a Porsche so they probably did the FEA and spent 1M on that assembly.

Base • Electric From $90,900 4S • Electric From $111,700 GTS • Electric $139,300 Turbo • Electric $160,800 maybe this spaghetti is the gift with purchase.....

Plumbers delight!

The girls want to know, are Munro doing a calender to pay for the CT teardown? 😉

@martingardens

8 ай бұрын

I'll pass on seeing Sandy in bathing trunks.

@aayotechnology

8 ай бұрын

@@martingardensbut I WOULD pay to NOT see it

Kevin is so polite! I love how he says "there is room for more integration in the future"!

How many hose clamps can be used in one area, holy moly, that is bizarre...

"Honey, I *think* I scraped the front of the Porsche today when I dropped off Madeline Kaitlyn and Hannah: there is s strange smell now and something is dripping in the garage can you go see?"

I know it's very very unlikely, but it would be amazing to see Munro Live look and as a bigger dream dismantle a Rimac Nevera. Rimac now helping and being part of a lot of other cars manufacturer, seeing how they do would stuff would be amazing. Maybe Jay Leno could let you look at his ? ;)

Jordan has really bulked up 💪🏻

@jrb_sland

8 ай бұрын

He {& his wife} might consider implementing some version of the keto [high fat, low carb] diet - he's got the beginning of a classical spare tire which over time may result in premature death. Stop all-day eating/drinking 'fast' food snacks & soft drinks. Eat only when hungry, drink only when thirsty. Your body will tell you what it needs if only you'll take the time to listen.

Kevin "Itself" Hardy is getting really good at these kinds of presentations. The whole team has come such a long way as content creators. Also, what's Armin's favorite protein?

@Harrythehun

8 ай бұрын

Trenbelone sandwich?

@h57s

8 ай бұрын

Itself!

@619duke

7 ай бұрын

Itself is a stop word in the Munro Live vocabulary 😂

I've never seen so much major league automotive engineers in the comment section lol.

You are not being clear imho. Being subtle and kind doesn't help anyone in engineering. Being honest and blunt like Sandy is why I'm here.

@markjonz

8 ай бұрын

This vdo needed Sandy’s fireworks. This was a damp squib

My specialty is electronic instruments for the geophysics community, but I'm also a small retail buy/hold investor in $TSLA, & this Porsche clearly looks like it was designed by non-EV engineers. Too many bolts, too little integration.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

it is a very low volume car. planned with 20k units, now around 40k

@shazam6274

8 ай бұрын

@@computercrack in other words, about 1 weeks worth production of Tesla.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

@@shazam6274 you need to compare sales of Model S vs. Taycan not all Tesla Sales. Also Porsche has a saying like this: "Porsche will always produce one car less then there is demand" Nobody at Porsche cares for millions of sold units.

@shazam6274

8 ай бұрын

@@computercrack You are right, Tesla makes about the same number of Model S as the Taycans. Yet they don't have all the excuses mentioned in this video for poor design decisions based on "Low Volume"! And while not having the Porsche and Turbo logos, are significantly less expensive and more reliable.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

@@shazam6274 What poor design decision? The cooling section may look weird, but the Taycan could do as many hot launches as your stomach could take while the Model S would significantly slow down with increased number of launches. Anything else? I dont think you can give me one more example. The Taycan is very well build and we just dont know what requirement lead to this kind of construction. Build quality is way beyond Teslas, it's a complete different universe and dont tell me anything about Tesla reliability, in Germany we are required to have technical inspection after 3 years, then after every 2nd year. Tesla M3 is the worst car in the statistic, every 7th car fails to pass. Model S engine failures are legendary or the infotainment system issue, where the system would brick itself --> Exchange thousands of Dollars. you can lie to yourself, but not to the public.

Engineering wise is only a Potemkin village at my opinion. You definitely see that it’s no Tesla!

Cheers guys

@MunroLive

8 ай бұрын

Cheers

I think either Rimac or Koenigsegg have a 2-speed gearbox. About the design choices - a lot of opportunities left on the table, especially with the excessive use of mixed fasteners and brackets.

Wow !!!! My 1964 Chevy impala SS had a big ass steering wheel with no air bags, a lap belt only and a non padded steel dash !!!! 😊😊😊 God i loved that car !!!! So simple and so cool 😢😢😢😢

Please continue using the physical and laser pointers!

that look Armin gave when Kevin said “Porsh” 😂

@markjonz

8 ай бұрын

This one’s a Porker

MUNRO - at end of the day , the Taycan is an Irrelevant ICE based EV w/ a Vibrator sized battery. its not an Effective vehicle SALES wise.

that spaghetti monster looks like those sentry bots that attacked neos ship in the matrix.

To summarize, “essentially” 😂. Love the video, that word may have been a tad overused ❤

Compliments to the fact that you are not intimidated by a (historic) brand like this 👌 I am looking forward to Porsches progress in the al new E-Macan comming soon !

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

Porsche , no longer RELEVANT in 2023 , less LESS than Model X.

Hey, just a correction at around 19:30 I believe the Audi RS E-tron gt has 2 speed Gearbox for the EDM but to my knowledge it is the only other EV that does this (besides the Taycan in mentioned in the video)

@saff226

8 ай бұрын

The first couple of Tesla roadsters have a two speed gear box and also the rimac C2

By the time the rear motor was revealed, it was clear that this vehicle was a compromise thrown around a _kludge_ wrapped around an accretion of disparate components. No wonder a _Porsch-uh_ († Pronunciation matters,) costs so much. It's not so much designed as evolved by blind and deaf mechanics. Repairs must be hell to execute. †) *Sia* pronounces _Porsche_ correctly [ kzread.info/dash/bejne/laye2LaRn5y9h7A.htmlsi=tKOZEjggf-u913XE&t=48 ] 😉

$500 rims selling for $5,000 ???

@kennyg1358

8 ай бұрын

a fool and his money are easily parted.

What's strange to me is there are companies converting ICE vehicles to electric (I'm thinking Electric Classic Cars here on KZread) that seem to do a much cleaner build than this. I get that there are issues like collision safety that aren't even considered in EV conversions but i doubt that collection of valves, especially down by the front where they're vulnerable to even a minor collision with a curb when parking, wouldn't fly.

What would be great is if they voiced their opinion when doing these reviews on how it compares to a Tesla model S. Which they believe is superior in build engineering and tech etc....

@RickyLourenco

8 ай бұрын

true. these guys need to grow some balls and voice their true opinions. I really miss Sandy

Whooo Kev!

I’m waiting for the Taycan Mk2 before i seriously consider buying a Porsche ev.

Wow please talk more about Porsche!I cant get enough of it!

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

Ummmm, Porsche is IRRELEVANT in 2023. not even a Contender.......lol.

@rp9674

8 ай бұрын

Nice car

@GTO33

8 ай бұрын

@@markplott4820really? On what planet? Porsche makes som of the greatest drivers cars in the World , and has huge margins on them…

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

@@GTO33 - the STOCK Tesla model S is a Better TRACK car than any BASE model Porsche.

@GTO33

8 ай бұрын

@@markplott4820 That must be the stupidest comment in KZreads 20year history.

Everyone on youtubes an expert now

Hi Team, you may want to explain what SORV is?

omg my comment got a shoutout lmao

Does Rube Goldberg work for Porsche??

The more you know about cars the more you realize simple is better. Too many people wasting money on cars to impress other people. If it gets you where you want to go in relative comfort that is really all you need. Everything else is just ego.

@MooseOnEarth

8 ай бұрын

So what is "simple" and "relative comfort"? A Ford Model T? The challenge of car engineering is, that "simple" or "relative comfort" means different things to different people. And even simple is non-defined: is a PCB simple or complex? An integrated circuit? 1 GB of code or data? An automatic transmission? Is a mechanical solution more simple or an electrical one? The opinions and positions on these terms vary widely.

@rbfarrell1

8 ай бұрын

@@MooseOnEarth Sorry you find life so difficult. And your ability to understand also seems immature. But good luck to you.

@DimitarStanev

8 ай бұрын

Or you could maybe consider the possibility different people are looking for different experiences from their cars. If you don’t get it that’s fine, but not everyone sees cars as just appliances. Unless you’re really planning on driving a 1990s Camry until the end of time, I’d say you’re a hypocrite, because all new cars are heavily over engineered for what most people would ever do with them day to day.

@bryanwarm2471

8 ай бұрын

My sentiments exactly. But you will have a hard time selling such a practical view when so many people are so willing to overextend themselves in pursuit of status or being cool. In case they haven't noticed, the economy is doing terribly and this is an extremely poor time to consider buying an endless money pit. Stay with the boring internal combustion engine or hybrid and you will be glad you did.

What is the train tunnell thru the center of the car, they need alot of engineering help...

Surely the more parts and complexity, the less likelihood of reliability?

This is the problem. I look at a Porsche or the i4, Audi gtrs etc and think, ‘they look nice’ but when you examine it, it’s a rushed, poorly engineered PoS. Every time I think about changing my car, I come back to the same brand, Tesla. Once the m3p upgrade comes out, I’ll change my current m3p for that one. I just don’t see any other option once you look at how it’s all stitched together and integrated.

@FutureSystem738

8 ай бұрын

THIS! 100%

Do we see the quality reflected in the price?

How much would this car cost used and out of warranty ?

"Interesting and unique" is a polite way of saying it's a overly complicated mess.

A friend of mine has a Taycan that he loves. I don’t think I’ll forward this to him.

@user-ep3ug9ry3p

8 ай бұрын

why should a driver care if the car performs well? This is mainly for the manufacture on how to reduce cost etc.

@rogerstarkey5390

8 ай бұрын

DO IT! (Then report back 😉)

@rogerstarkey5390

8 ай бұрын

​@@user-ep3ug9ry3p This is TOTALLY due to the manufacturer trying to get a product out of the door.

@bluetoad2668

8 ай бұрын

​@@user-ep3ug9ry3pyou're right but the Model S Plaid out performs it and is about half the price - I guess the customer does care about that.😂

@peteravolio2695

8 ай бұрын

​@bluetoad2668 how did your Model S plaid compare with your Taycan? Have you ever driven either car?

What ever happened to the K.I.S.S principle?

Really looking forward to next years Macan and Audi Q6 on their new PPE platform.

@userscott

8 ай бұрын

Why? They’ll be shit just like all the other German EVs. 😂

I was fooled! I thought Jordan got taller suddenly! 😂

@MunroLive

8 ай бұрын

Lol

Afternoon guys

Dogs dinner! Sack the design engineers!

I'd totally love to hear you guys about the question what Porsche could do to shed 300 kgs from a car like Taycan without cutting into their margins too much. Production volume on their EVs is bound to rise, so they can afford more efforts at integration and lightweighting. It's weird that a Model S Plaid is significantly lighter than the smaller battery lower power more cramped Taycan Turbo S. Yes, brakes and luxury matter. But how heavy is that? Could Taycan and 911/Cayman EVs get a carbonfibre tub and hempfibre body? Common carbon battery case? Lighter motors and converters, like Lucid and Koenigsegg work on? Omit the rear gearbox with better spec'd rear motors?

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

make it a SKATEBOARD bev platform and save 500 lb automatically.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

according to Wikipedia the cars are almost identical in weight and size. Taycan 2125-2395kg, TMS 2045 -2402kg. What was your point again? @other dude: it already is a skateboard platform. minus the foot garage.

@markplott4820

8 ай бұрын

@@computercrack - NOPE, Taycan NOT a Bespoke EV Skateboard platform, its still using ICE Panamara as BASE & has Vestigial transmission tunnel. Taycan also using very CRAPPY pouch cells.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

@@markplott4820 No it's not dude. Taycan has almost nothing to do with the Panamera except the suspension setup with double wishbone. They choose to have the "Transmission" Tunnel for packaging reasons. Just look at photos from the whole setup and you see why, the, put the electronics on top, otherwise they wouldnt have a frunk.

@computercrack

8 ай бұрын

@@markplott4820 also pouch cells are not crappy, they have an excellent volume to energy density ratio

Armin is in good shape. How much benchpress?:)

If we compare it to the Model S, with many people complaining water leaks, that “spaghetti bundle”, hidden and protected by a panel, looks a minor detail.😊

Mind-boggling complex structures of this Taycan make my fingers intertwine like that "spaghetti bowl"! Wonder what we'd see if something like Koenigsegg Gemera would be on that hoist! But Christian von Koenigsegg won't ever let us, I guess, hehe. 🤣😂🤣😆

@donswier

8 ай бұрын

👍All the excitement over Gemera, Ramcharger & Edison must make the teams behind the departed Volt & i3 REx feel smug.

Worth noting that "integration" which seems to be the buzz word of the moment is actually counter productive if without it you still make a suitable profit margin. Porsche are a company famed for contrinuous improvement and a low integration level allows that, ie individual parts can be imnproved, or simply retuned to suit, without a huge expensive tear up. ie once you get your Gigacasting tooled up, that's whaty you are stuck with. If you find that a small camber gain change at the rear wheels delivered by a change to BIW or subframe braces improves the dynamics of your car, with a hghly integrated solution you can't make that change. For Porsche, at low volume (way way low compared to Tesla) and with a much much higher sign off standard for vehicle dynamics, massively integrating is NOT the way to go! The "fake" rear antiroll bar will be to prevent the rear EDU from moving fowards on one side in a rear impact and hitting the battery. Removing a structural load spreading part like that would have mean't a second crash cert for that model, simply not worth it at these volumes compared to simply fitting a $10 steel bar on the few models necessary. BTW, if you really want to see the best bit of packaging on the Taycan, check out the front wheel house to bonnest / inner arch zone. How Porsche have fitted such a large wheel and tyre packaging under such a low bonnet line is genuinely world class

@KyleHubb

8 ай бұрын

😂😂😂😂. You’re a comedian.

@waynerussell6401

8 ай бұрын

Tesla has on site sand casting for molds that enable very quick changes to be made cheaply and tested and remade with the Gigapresses.

That mess looked like a DIY yard sprinkler install, where they didn't have the right parts and just kept going back to Home Depot.