I hope batman 89 will team up with superman 78 also them teaming up with wonder woman 75 and the flash 90 would be cool too

Sam Hamm also wrote a storyline in Detective Comics called Blind Justice.

@anen9332

2 жыл бұрын

Blind Justice is a wonderful Batman story. And a kind of secret extension of the Burton/Hamm deconstruction of Bruce Wayne from the first film. A criminally overlooked book.

@dominic4414

2 жыл бұрын

I hunted multiple comic shops to collect all 3 parts of the single issues. Haven't read it yet but I got it because I'm a Denys Cowan fan. Gonna read it this weekend!

@evanzaremba4722

Жыл бұрын

I'm definitely going to get that comic one day.

I'd argue that the Red Berets are less a reference to the Sons of the Batman, and the real life Guardian Angels that patrolled NYC's subway system around the time Sam Hamm made his draft.

@traviscarey

2 жыл бұрын

Check out Batman:LOTDK #21-23 written by the great Mike W Barr for a storyline from 1991 called 'FAITH' which prominently features red beret wearing 'Batmen' gang! Wonder who inspired who, Barr or Hamm?

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Excellent point about the real life origin of the "red berets." It could also be Hamm using the Guardian Angels as a more grounded take on the idea of a Batman-inspired vigilante gang.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

@@traviscarey yeah I'd say the order is the real life Guardian Angels, then Hamm's script around 1990-early 1991, then Barr's storyline starting in August 1991.

@evanzaremba4722

Жыл бұрын

That's right.

so basically i was right about christopher nolan's BATMAN dark knight trilogy was a remake of cancelled scripts used in BATMAN tim burton's universe

@MKL3165

2 жыл бұрын

Yes and this is not the first time this happened. Justice league mortal ideas helped and damn near built the DCEU.

@kaviarkicks840

2 жыл бұрын

like every movie version of a comic book

@evanzaremba4722

Жыл бұрын

Also Schumacher's with Batman Unchained and Batman: Darknight.

1:13 those illustrations are to art what Spanish Inquisitors were to comedy.

Always appreciated Sam Hamm for one particular attention to real-world detail regarding the theatrical cut of 1989 BATMAN. The actor who portrayed Mayor Borg was chosen for his resemblance to then NYC Mayor Edward Koch. You can catch Hamm's sense of humor by giving Gotham's Mayor a 4-letterd last name akin to Koch. He even honors then Manhattan Borough President David Dinkins by having Harvey Dent be portrayed as a Black man! As if he were predicting the future, Dinkins himself would become Mayor of NYC, the first Black Mayor in its history!

Batman ‘89 and Returns are the only Batfilms I recognize.

I wasn't blown away by the first issue, but I appreciate what this is trying to be (and what it isn't intended to be): basically a comic book adaptation of Burton's films through Sam Hamm's eyes. The fact that Gordon isn't really the Gordon from the two films -- instead playing as some form of amalgamation of Pat Hingle with post-Crisis and Animated Series Gordon -- underlines this. As far as Batman/Bruce Wayne in this, again, it's like it's something like a third of Keaton/Burton rather than their view of the character fully extended and expressed. I always remember the anecdote from Daniel Waters about how Keaton's demands for the character -- dark but not talkative, standardized as depressive and internalized -- forced much of what he called "bitter rants" by Bruce Wayne and, especially, Batman to be excised. Owing to Expressionism, the Burton films are very much about implying Batman's psychological nature through production design, Keaton's eyes and overall mise en scene. From my perspective, the comic doesn't really capture that Batman. Batman working so closely with Gordon and even discussing his duaghter's engagement is very un-Burton. The Burton version -- from Wayne hanging upside down on the chin-up bars after sleeping with Vale, to being shown utterly alone and in darkness in Returns' reintroduction of him -- was about loneliness and alienation. More to the point, as Burton said, it was about depression and mental illness. Both Burton's films are about this, and express it as an unease -- its own presence -- in performance and production design. Thus, Expressionism is the-world-as-Wayne's-broken-mind. I sensed next to none of that in the first issue of BATMAN '89. I also think the inevitable introduction of Robin truly goes against what Burton wanted; as Waters said, Burton "hated" the character and thought he ruined Batman as a psychologically complex and tormented figure. All that said, this is a kind of nostalgia piece that simulatenously pushes away from Burton's assumptions as much as it embraces them. I can accept that, as it's not really trying to hide it. What I find most interesting is how little the book reminds me of Hamm's own Blind Justice. And, ironically, much of Blind Justice felt like a dark deconstruction of Bruce Wayne and, because of that, it also works more like a companion piece to Burton's film than this does. Anyway, sorry for the rant.

@anen9332

2 жыл бұрын

I would add (because why the hell not?) that one piece of the story's structure, so far, that I appreciate is Harvey having the love interest rather than Batman himself. After two films with major love interests, it's a positive to see Batman/Bruce Wayne freed from this. It becomes too Brosnan Era Bond-like for Batman to "fall in love" in each entry. Though, I have always believed that this was a studio mandate that extended through the Nolan entries.

@protolegacy9184

2 жыл бұрын

I can appreciate your insight on the issue.I personally felt the art was mediocre to weak and really hurt the issue.There are so many good artist out there that can bring this Gotham and tone nd its detail to the page and it failed.Plus Keatons Batman has such a stoic,cool look and his visual pressence is not felt here.I get the need to want to include Robin as hes part of the Batman mythos but he really does not fit this version of the character.I just dont see this series reaching its potential.And why is Batmans cape purple on the inside?It looks odd and not in design of the 89 version.

I've seen some people suggest that Barbara looks as much like Sean Young as she does Winona Ryder, and bearing in mind how desperate Young was to be in a Batman film (a horseriding accident denied her the part of Vicki Vale in Batman 1989, and her attempts to be cast as Catwoman in the sequel are infamous), and how much more age-appropriate a fit she is for Billy Dee Williams (Sean Young is 'only' 22 years younger than BDW, rather than 34 years his junior), I kind of like that idea.

@JaredPresleyExperience

2 жыл бұрын

You make a great point. Also, I always thought Billy looked younger than he was. He was over 50 when it came out. I see that character in the film at least 10 years younger. So I don't think it would be as much of an age gap. I don't know what the artist has said on that but I like this theory.

@GregOrCreg

2 жыл бұрын

@@JaredPresleyExperience If I was hypothetically casting Barbara for Burton's 'Batman 3' using the various actors Burton had worked with, or had at least considered, I think I'd choose Annette Bening. She's reasonably age-appropriate for BDW (especially if, as you suggest, he's playing 10 years younger), and she projects the intelligence and drive that this version of Barbara has so far displayed. The only 'issue' is that circa mid-90s, she wasn't a 'girl' but in view of Barbara's status in this comic-book series (i.e. a high-ranking police officer), it wouldn't make sense to cast someone who was very young/early 20s. I can see Bening as Hingle's daughter, and as BDW's fiance (she also gives Gilda Gold vibes, and this version of Barbara is like a combination of Barbara and Gilda).

@JaredPresleyExperience

2 жыл бұрын

@@GregOrCreg That would be really cool. She's a great actress. I believe she was in the running for Catwoman at one time? Regardless, from what I've read, I don't see Burton or the studio really going in that direction circa 92-95. Even if they kept Burton, Hamm wouldn't of returned imo. Studio definitely wanted a more family friendly and bright version. Once I see the series as a whole, I'll be able to fully judge how this plot, etc would of worked/been approved in the 90s.

@GregOrCreg

2 жыл бұрын

@@JaredPresleyExperience Agreed. So far, as enjoyable as it's likely to be, I don't see this comic as something that would literally translate to screen, at least not via Burton's hands, but I still like to fancast, and were I casting this Barbara Gordon, I'd be inclined to pick Annette Bening. I like Winona Ryder too, but I think she'd have been too young for the part during the 1990s, and in terms of playing BDW's girlfriend.

@daingermouz2077

2 жыл бұрын

@@JaredPresleyExperience I think Benning was cast as Catwoman but had to give it up when she became pregnant.

Great review. Great finds. I noticed penguin and the mutants but the characters from other Burton movies, incredible. The whole episode is spot on One of my favorite moments is with the penny scene which totally reminds me of Indiana Jones and Temple of Doom opening. One of my favorite movie openings.

@SeasideDetective2

2 жыл бұрын

Was the guy on the far left of the Halloween party panel supposed to be dressed as Max Shreck? I couldn't be sure, but that tuxedo and opera cape looked awfully familiar. I'd be willing to wager that's supposed to be either Max or how Ra's Al-Ghul was portrayed in the animated series.

This is very thorough. Great stuff. I'll only add one point that simply confirms what you've already said, and that's to say that Pat Hingle confirmed as much with respect to Gordon being the first cop to comfort Bruce following the Wayne's death, in the Batman Returns Making Of Book, so, I think we can assume this scene is canon to the Burtonverse.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! He also confirmed it in the Batman 89 featurette on Gordon.

@JaredPresleyExperience

2 жыл бұрын

What I'm looking forward to is more Gordon in this. We never got enough of him.

@kidzoki

2 жыл бұрын

In Hamm's first draft screenplay Vicki passes out during the Batmobile ride to the cave and dreams about the photo with young Bruce and Officer Gordon. The cut sequence fills in more of Batman's origin.

@evanzaremba4722

Жыл бұрын

Yeah. Very canon.

@evanzaremba4722

Жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast oh right.

Excellent coverage, thanks!

Was looking forward to hearing your thoughts! Looking forward to the next issue.

I really enjoyed this video, extremely well written and researched. It is so rare to find similar quality videos on KZread. Well done.

The Onstar commercial is a REAL atention to detail.

I just stumbled upon this, thanks to this video. Thanks a bunch! I love all your references and thoughts!

At 2:24 , Barbara Gordon looks more modeled after Sean Young (who was originally suppose to play Vicki Vale in the first Batman film but had to cancel due to an injury and she attempted to try out for Catwoman for Batman Returns but it didn't go well for her). That's definitely more Sean Young than Winona Ryder.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

While other commenters have pointed this out, Quinones himself has confirmed that it's Ryder in a tweet sharing pics of his dream cast of the project: twitter.com/Joe_Quinones/status/1403837198248693762

Great video! 🦇

My only complaint with this book is that it feels like its going too fast the main plot already starts without giving us an idea of what’s normal and the first time we see commissioner Gordon and Batman interact it’s the end of there partnership and Batman’s already getting hunted down I still like it but there should of been a prologue or something before the main story

Awesome video!

Great job

Glad to hear this was not a cosmetic feel to a traditional Batman comic. Batman '89 was the first I saw as a child in that theater. Will you be reviewing Superman '78 also? I imagine there will be a tribute in that one.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for this comment. We responded in our latest ep: kzread.info/dash/bejne/lKphtLuFeKXLhag.html

Definitely interested to see where this goes. You got a subscriber.

Now That Is an Epic Video!!!

The short answer is absolutely it does

Ben, I would love to see you interview Sam Hamm and Daniel Waters... can't imagine anyone who would do a better job! Great episode and looking forward to your thoughts on the rest of the series.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks Coriolanus. Would love to interview both! And stay tuned for coverage on the rest when it releases.

@JaredPresleyExperience

2 жыл бұрын

This series is interesting in it's after Returns but sans Waters. For better or worse. I definitely expect a different vibe with it being just Hamm writing. However I definitely prefer some of his more traditional character touches. It's after returns but I definitely feel Hamm will not really reference it outside of Catwoman.

My new favorite comic book!! Can’t wait for #2!

I would have loved to have seen Billy Dee William's Two Face.

@sunnyjohnson992

2 жыл бұрын

Oh yes, me too! 😃

This needs to be a cartoon movie

@walter_the_wobot2349

2 жыл бұрын

That would be excellent

9:30/ Just caught 2 crazy Easter Eggs here. It would seem that the Jerome Otis character might have precedent. BTAS did an episode called THE MECHANIC where we meet Earl Cooper, the man who helped designed the Batmobile in the animated version. The AUTO BODY signage clued me to that reference. Another interesting Easter Egg has a duality worthy of Harvey Dent. The part of town Otis works at is named Burnside. Native New Yorkers, especially those who grew up in The Bronx, will catch that as a reference to Burnside Avenue, a thoroughfare on the west side of The Bronx near the area where Bob Kane and Bill Finger grew up. Obviously, we know who they created back in the 1930's! General fans of the BATMAN mythos might think the neighborhood name BURNSIDE is a cryptic hint of what will eventually happene to Harvey Dent. Tak it as you wll....

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Burnside is also a neighborhood in Gotham since the New 52 in 2014, which probably has the same Bronx origins as you mentioned.

I wanted to think on it a bit before giving my thoughts. I liked it. Not perfect but I enjoyed it. I know some who really don't. Some don't like the characterisation of batman in this. Too talkative and too close to Gordon, etc. I think you hit it on the head. This is Sam Hamm's project. Tim Burton's visual style is taken into account but the story ideas are all Hamm. Great point on it being more traditional in ways. That's how Hamm's scripts were. I feel like more Burton die hards may be turned off by that, but this is still the first issue. Batman Returns in many ways was different than Batman. I think it'll be referenced but it's clear from the title that Batman 1989 and Sam Hamm are the driving force of it. In reading his draft and hearing this podcast really gives insight on that, regardless if I like or dislike certain portions of it. To sum it up, I like it. We'll see how it holds up as a whole. I'm not crazy about the white eyes. I really think for this version the regular eyes are important. I would of preferred more internal dialogue or just less from Batman. Besides that I'm game so far.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

You do bring up a good point about the white eyes as so much of Keaton's performance came from them. Also it does feel like this comic was given the greenlight once they brought Keaton back for the Flash, with this comic serving as a story in between Returns and Flash. It's really unlikely that they'll have the white eyes in the Muschietti movie.

@JaredPresleyExperience

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast I would prefer the regular eyes. Maybe have a panel where he goes in a dark tunnel and turns on these white eyes for it. That would be a cool nod. Besides that I'd just prefer the regular. That's more an artist choice than Hamm I imagine. I hope you are able to interview these guys on their thought process on this series!

@Viking_Luchador

2 жыл бұрын

okay, I was under the impression that this was taking place either BEFORE Returns or IN PLACE of it Batman is wearing the same costume from the first film, with sculpted abs, not the one from Returns, with the plate-armor abs In issue #2, we get a reference to "the Waynes and the Schrecks" running Gotham; now based on what we saw in Returns, I can't imagine Chip Schreck being considered a power player like his father, so to me it would suggest that Max Schreck would still be alive also, while it would make sense that corrupt detectives would hate Batman, Bullock tells Dent that ordinary beat cops regularly go to the top of police headquarters to destroy the Bat-signal; what happened to turn everyone except for Gordon against the Bat?

@JaredPresleyExperience

2 жыл бұрын

@@Viking_Luchador The events and framing of Batman, along with continued issues despite his presence?

@Viking_Luchador

2 жыл бұрын

@@JaredPresleyExperience are you talking about Penguin knocking the Ice Princess off the roof, and then remote controlling the Batmobile? I'd think that after exposing the Penguin the very next day (and then saving all their children and preventing an army of penguins from suicide-bombing Gotham) it shouldn't have been to hard to convince people that he was in fact framed I always felt that it could be inferred that by Returns the city was definitely pro-Bat (he's talking with the Mayor and the Police Commissioner out in the open) and they only use the Signal in case of emergencies

okay, I was under the impression that this was taking place either BEFORE Returns or IN PLACE of it Batman is wearing the same costume from the first film, with sculpted abs, not the one from Returns, with the plate-armor abs In issue #2, we get a reference to "the Waynes and the Schrecks" running Gotham; now based on what we saw in Returns, I can't imagine Chip Schreck being considered a power player like his father, so to me it would suggest that Max Schreck would still be alive also, while it would make sense that corrupt detectives would hate Batman, Bullock tells Dent that ordinary beat cops regularly go to the top of police headquarters to destroy the Bat-signal; what happened to turn everyone except for Gordon against the Bat?

This was a great comic .The only thing I had a problem with was that they shouldn't have change Pat Hingle's James Gordon .But overall I enjoyed it.

I know that Summer Gleason was only used in "Batman:TAS". However, I know that Vicki Vale was in the original comics. It would've been nice to see Vicki in the 1990s cartoon.

So, they split off the Joel Schumacher films into another universe now? Does this also include Batman Forever? I actually like Batman forever and would like it to be part of the Burton continuity as well.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

This comic (and Keaton's appearance in Flash) pretty much splits the Burton films from the Schumacher ones, with this story taking place after Batman Returns. We're also fans of Batman Forever and acknowledged that the writers' and Schumacher's intentions were that Forever was a sequel (with several cut scenes referencing Joker, Penguin, and Catwoman). Given the new resurgence in the "Burtonverse," this seems to be getting retconned. The way I see it, the Burtonverse is now Batman 89, Batman Returns, this Batman 89 comic, and then next year's The Flash (plus whatever appearances Keaton makes as Batman afterwards). The Schumacherverse is Val Kilmer's Bruce going through the same events as Batman 89 and Batman Returns (think Kilmer's Batman fighting Joker, Penguin, and Catwoman in Schumacher's Gotham, with TLJ as Harvey in the first movie) before Batman Forever.

"Tell all of your friends about us..." (I see what you did there.)

I love the two Batman films directed by Tim Burton, but I think they succeeded in spite of Sam Hamm, not because of him. His ideas only shine through in those films after they were filtered through the visions of Burton, Furst, and the incredible cast. This book has great pencil work, but the inking and especially the coloring doesn’t reflect the aesthetic or mood of those films, which is really their whole appeal. Some of the covers look great, but the content inside is not what the audience is looking for.

Your analysis was very good and to the point, Ben! Love Batman '89 and I can't wait for more! What altered story/character element did you like most in the first issue that wasn't in the movie?

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

I'd say everything involving Harvey Dent here. We finally got to see the Harvey-Bruce friendship in an arguably better way than we would have in the original 86 script. I was a little thrown by the Harvey-Barbara pairing but it does potentially give him an interesting dynamic with Gordon that he haven't gotten elsewhere. And the scene in Burnside with Mr. Otis was a REALLY cool inversion of the usual abusive father take.

@freebatman4everyone

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast I probably loved Harvey Dent the most, too. Billy Dee deserved better, he should've been the main villain that steals the show, like Heath as Joker. All the subtle touches like the white lenses, Alfred having a moustache etc are very welcome, but it's the characters that make it all shine. Like the brand new Robin, who looks phenomenal.

I would have loved to see this on screen.

Brilliant as always Ben! I was going to wait until the omnibus came out in October for this, but I couldn't wait until then and I have ordered the first issue lol. Hopefully I'll receive it soon. I hope its good and they don't stray away from the essance of what made Batman in 1989 great. Its my favourite interpretation. I'm not too thrilled about Robin being introduced - Im near certain Burton wanted to totally stay away from that in his universe - and I'm worried there's too many characters being introduced like Barbara Gordon instead of focusing on established characters already in the movies like Dent, Commissioner Gordon, Selina Kyle, Vicki Vale, Chip Shrek, Mayor Borg, even elements of the Jokers Gang as seen in the movie, the red triangle gang even, the aftermath of their deaths, the remanents of loyal Carl Grissom soldiers etc I'm worried it'll lose the dark gritty grounded fantasy element of the original for a more over the top cartoonish vibe with all new characters we can't connect with from the movies we love.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks, Shamrock. And honestly, I'm not missing Vicki, Chip, or the Mayor at all, haha (though I was wondering if they'd show a Michael Murphy-looking Mayor after the reporter mentions a Mayor). I think if there's any story of Vicki's left to tell in this universe, it could be an "in between-quel" of what led to her breakup with Bruce before Batman Returns and it'd be interesting to see if Batman fought a minor Batman villain between Joker and Penguin. Other than that, Chip was never an interesting enough character to replace his dad and, as Max says in Returns, "Mayors come and go." You'll find in the issue that Barbara seems pretty connected to Harvey's story as well as her father's, so I don't feel that she's taking away the focus from them. If anything, she's led to more insight into Harvey and Gordon's characters in this first issue already than we got in the films. The leftover Joker and Red Triangle Circus Gang MIGHT be explored further than here, but with only six issues, I'm much more interested in Harvey becoming Two-Face as well as how Hamm's bringing back Catwoman. Robin's the main wildcard here. I'm curious to see where this goes.

@shamrockballs1066

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast You're welcome buddy, and thanks for the response! I can't wait to get into this, obviously I'm jumping ahead because I haven't read it yet and I'm only going on the snippets I've seen. I agree about Harvey's story, because us 89 fans have all been wondering how Billy Dee's Two Face story would have panned out, so I'm glad we are getting something! As far as I am concerned Joker is dead in the Burtonverse, and I'm happy with that as no one can do Jack! I am quite content with how the film ended with his death. Yes, I'm also intrigued about Catwoman! That's what I love about the Burton movies too, it doesn't have to answer every detail and we can let out imaginations take over, something I think is lost in today's generation! Every focet needs an explanation! Though wouldn't it be cool for Chip to seek revenge thinking Batman killed his father? Lol And don't forget, blue bloods tire. You think you can go 15 rounds with Muhammed Shrek!? 🤣 Ps I just read that Danny DeVito has penned a penguin story for an up and coming Batman villian anniversary comic!

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

@@shamrockballs1066 I just don't see Chip being that much of a threat to Batman, haha, unless they turn him into a drastically different character. I'm interested to see how Hamm writes Pfeiffer's Catwoman, though, since that was all Waters but another character that I'm curious about is Knox since that character is his own creation. Sure, he intended Knox to be killed in 86, but I'm wondering if he would bring him back in this to cover the inevitable Harvey Dent transformation.

@shamrockballs1066

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast Well that's a possibility about Chip lol Ohh yes, I forgot about Knox! I'd love if he came back into it. And yes, that's something I'm looking forward to how they continue Selina and Bruces story, especially since she knows his identity! Will they be friend, or foe? 🤣

@GregOrCreg

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast I agree. As much as I love the various Batman 89 and Batman Returns supporting cast, my concern would be that any reference to individual characters might dilute them. What I like about the direction of this new comic is that it carries on the tradition of Returns by being true to Burton's vision in essence, but without directly referencing the preceding film too often from a narrative perspective. Seeing as the Mayors changed between films, and we didn't hear about Shreck in Batman '89, or get any references to Grissom in Returns, this approach makes sense.

I don't think it was a good idea to give Bruce Wayne white hair on the sides. This is 1989, essentially the same year as the original Batman film, and being so close after the death of the joker, they should've kept the hair completely brown.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

It's not the same year, though. The comic's called 89 as the designation of that world, like the upcoming Superman 78 comic, not the year that it's set. The soonest it could take place is a year after Batman Returns since Returns is Christmas and this first issue was set in Halloween.

@Artisan1979

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast ok i stand corrected

@GregOrCreg

2 жыл бұрын

@@SuperHousePodcast Assuming Batman Returns took place in 1992, or 1991 (I'm going to be a nerd here, and say it was 1991, seeing as there's a Maxquerade Invitation Prop for sale at one of the online auctions that gives the date as Saturday December 21, and December 21 fell on a Saturday in 1991, the year the film started filming), then I'm guessing this story picks up the following Halloween (i.e. October 1992 or 93).

The thumbnail would've been a little funnier had Billy D's afro been present on his right side. ☺

wait why is the redhead reporter not vicki vale? lol

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Vicki was neither redhead nor a TV reporter in the 89 film.

I enjoy it, but I miss Burton's vision in the project, i really prefer his version of this universe than comics accuracy.

I wouldn't mind seeing Billy d as two face

I don't think Batgirl fits in the Burtonverse, she's more fitting for the Schumacherverse The "entirely different concept just cause it's genderswapped"-concept is redicoulus even in the comics and Batgirl has never been a brooding character, which deconstructs the bat-motif and why Bruce Wayne dress up as a bat, it's almost like she's poking fun at Batman

Not really a fan of this book. I was REALLY looking forward to it, but visually and narratively it incorporates too much of the Animated Series designs and concepts. And Gotham doesn't look like the Stuck in Time Gothic hellscape that Anton First designed. Overall this had potential, but throws it away for a lighter tone and references to TAS

Christopher Nolan and Joel Schumacher: Eat Your Hearts Out!!!!

I have GOT to get my hands on this comic now!

I loved seeing the different Easter eggs - and I recognized most of them, too! But I was disappointed that, aside from those Easter eggs and the likenesses of Michael Keaton and Billy Dee Williams, I didn't see much that strongly evoked the Burtonverse for me. Where was Alexander Knox? Where was Axis Chemicals? (Yeah, it was blown up, but can't we see it burned?) Where was the Flugelheim Museum? Where was Shreck's Department Store? And isn't Batman still (falsely) wanted for the murder of the Ice Princess? Why aren't people saying anything about her? Also, why is everyone going out in costume on Halloween like it's no big deal? This is Gotham City, where I'd think any celebration of Halloween - or almost any other holiday - would trigger PTSD in most of the population! These people have had to endure poisoned parade balloons, a giant Christmas package full of criminal circus performers, penguins with missiles on their backs, etc. These people should be nervous wrecks! And yet only rarely does any incarnation of Batman seem to address this issue.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Honestly, the absence of those didn't bother me because this first issue alone had more references to the 89 film and Returns than Returns ever did to 89. Outside of Batman, Alfred, Gordon, and things like the Batmobile and the Elfman theme, there was very little of the story or characters of the 89 film referenced in Batman Returns- just the Vicki Vale mentions. Part of that is Burton not wanting a connection between the two due to his own feelings towards the first one but if he had done a third one, we don't know how connected it would have been to 89 or Returns either. It's also the first issue of this story and Gotham's a big place- Knox and Flugelheim can still be out there along with a Shreck's Department Store if it didn't shut down from Max's death/Chip's management.

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

As for the Ice Princess, Batman Returns does feature a Commissioner Gordon who doesn't buy Batman being a criminal and the Bat Signal shines like normal at the end. It's not explained, but you could say Batman's name got cleared before the last shot of the Bat Signal with Catwoman. (There was also a deleted scene with Gordon and the Mayor hinting at it on whether Batman would forgive the city for turning on him). The earliest this could take place is the Halloween after Returns, so we're looking at a good 10 months for the city to move on from the incident (though I suspect there's an even longer gap between Returns and this storyline).

This takes place before Batman returns?

@SuperHousePodcast

2 жыл бұрын

Nope, after, given all the Returns references we pointed out.

Artwork is a bit too cartoony and unfaithful to the film for me. You have Batman jumping around and leaping etc....when in the film's he moved more like Frankenstein, very upright and movement every shoulder based due to lack of movement of the cowl. I think the art should've been more faithful to the movie comic adaptation and more Anton furst-ey. The robin costume should've been lifted straight from the 89 movie concept art too

Red Berets always based on real world groups

So happy that this is the official sequel to Batman Returns. This cures how bummed I was back in the 90s when I found out Burton was booted and none of his ideas came through except for the one that Joel Schumacher took and made in his own crappy image and so happy that's been erased and they're going back to the Burtonverse, even though this is the only story they're going to make. The original Batman 3 movie cast was perfect. Didn't like what we got in Forever. Personally I don't like the Schumacher films at all, but the only reason why I dislike Batman Forever the most is because it reminds me of how Schumacher (no disrespect to him), McDonald's, Warner bros, and the parents who complained about Batman Returns caused us to not get one of Tim Burton's and Sam Hamms ideas for Batman 3. Tim Burton's final product idea with Michael Keaton, Marlon Wayans, Renee Russo, Robin Williams, and Billy Dee Williams, plus Michelle Pfeiffer cameo at the end with the Burton style setting would have been excellent. But this is the closest we'll get as far as this comic book and I'm extremely happy. Excuse the long comment lol. Great time to be a Batman fan.

@boomstickcritique902

2 жыл бұрын

Well, Keaton is returning as the Same Batman in the new Flash movie which will be the official third continuation of his version of Batman even though it's not directed by Tim Burton.

@Terminatorfan-2016

2 жыл бұрын

@@boomstickcritique902 oh yeah. That I definitely knew. Flash is an official sequel to Batman Returns and I definitely love that. I'm excited for it. But as far as seeing an idea of Tim Burton's Batman 3, this is very satisfying.

@boomstickcritique902

2 жыл бұрын

@@Terminatorfan-2016 It makes you wonder though if Keaton is loved in the Flash movie maybe he and Burton might get to reteam for another Batman movie with an older version of that Batman I mean you never know.

@Terminatorfan-2016

2 жыл бұрын

@@boomstickcritique902 I think Andy M. knows what he's doing with this Flash movie. Plus Keaton said that his entrance as Batman will definitely get fans going. I think they're definitely going to use him wisely. Keaton wouldn't have signed on if it was going to be a shitty representation. As much as Tim Burton wants to stay away from Batman, especially after Batman Returns and him not being able to do Batman 3, I feel like he wouldn't be interested, but it would be cool if he did make a third Batman film. I can see them getting some of the actors. Keaton of course would be back, I can see Marlon Wayans finally being able to get his role but not as Robin but Nightwing, an older Michelle Pfeiffer as Catwoman, and they would just have to bring in some new fresh characters otherwise. I like your idea of Keaton and Burton returning and that would be awesome if they went through with it.

@boomstickcritique902

2 жыл бұрын

@@Terminatorfan-2016 Rumor has it Keaton wants to stick around in the DC film universe but wants to make a Batman Beyond movie with Tim Burton directing with Keaton as the mentor to a new Batman. Don't know if that will happen or if Flash will be Keaton's last but if it does that would be very interesting.

Twitter didn't exist back then

Batman '89 is so great that beat crap out Joel Schumacher Batman Forever and Batman and Robin and I hope the make Batman '89 comic into a animated movie with Michael Keaton, Billy Dee Williams and Michelle Pfeiffer reprising the voices Bruce Wayne / Batman, Harvey Dent / Two-Face and Selina Kyle / Catwoman please.

Wait ...hold up.... Marlon Wayans as robin and Billy D Williams as 2 face and Gina Davis was in it??? 🤯

geez, with all the easter eggs one might think the easter bunny wrote this story, were they all needed?

Fun concept for a comic. BUT too many easter eggs/fan service and not enough original visual storytelling. This is becoming an issue in modern entertainment. We need higher quality work with longevity.

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I don't like this chapter

Ugh. Hated every second of this rewind to a time that the host wasn't born and I was just about to move to Key West at age 11. It was all downhill from there, until, and then it was a drop off again.

Ugh, pretty disappointing. It doesn’t even seem like what Billy Dee described how he viewed his character (most notably, a playboy raconteur)… instead he’s dating commissioner Gordon’s daughter for some reason. It reads like some woke ass fan fiction. And Batman is in like 3 panels. I was only 5 or 6 when Batman 89 came out. Keaton IS my Batman (Bale is a bum). And this doesn’t remotely feel like the world built in the Tim Burton movie at all. I’ll give it another issue, but it basically feels like one more opportunity to insert some modern social politics, and grab some cash on the backs of otherwise awesome black characters.