If master duel had retro formats I’d play it a lot more

@ModRocker94

5 ай бұрын

This. There are many days I think to myself “man I wish I didn’t stop playing when they started releasing the GX card series.”

@corbinkendall6330

5 ай бұрын

Im saying the same thing... and it doesnt make sense that they dont MTG arena and pokemon online tcg both have standard, draft and alternative formats... why does konami only give us advanced ranked ladder? Why isnt there a goat format ladder, edison format ladder? The answer is simple its konami they are lazy... have you seen the silent hill remake? Laziness

@Terry.M.I.

5 ай бұрын

or other creative formats like i love the team battles on masterduel if you ever get a match its fun having restrictions actually makes games fun contrary to what yugioh would have you believe but slowing down a game is just good because it adds room for counter play

@handlebar4520

4 ай бұрын

If master duel banned maxx "C" i'd play it a lot more

@rynobehnke8289

4 ай бұрын

​@@corbinkendall6330na it's not laziness. It's just that master duel is f2p and as such makes money by annoying people into buying for faster access to new cards. If they world have stable retro formats would that mean that player's that play them won't need to constantly buy new cars to stay competitive meaning the changes of making micro transaction money of them good down the drain. Can't have that so no retro format so that everyone constantly has to get new cards with buying more packs with real money being the fastest way.

Trying to play any deck is going to get curb stomped by the user experience of waiting six minutes for your first turn.

@FaeQueenCory

5 ай бұрын

Six minutes? Someone must have been heavily caffeinated and moving at 10x speed.

@JosePerez-fw1dm

4 ай бұрын

Only to start your turn having your card effects negated by your opponent.

@Japaneseanimeguy

4 ай бұрын

​@JosePerez-fw1dm assuming you even have a hand. Trickstar was designed to be nasty when Reincarnation is played alongside Lycoris but was not intended to be used with Droll. This interaction that was not considered before release of the cards meant that you would go second with no hand, so you were screwed unless you played a deck that can trigger from banish, which would then likely lose to everything else. I've felt the itch lately and returned to Duel Links and master duel but left the game proper a few years back at this point and I don't regret stopping. Was never particularly good and floodgates are apparently more prevalent than ever so I would still be having no fun while wasting hundreds in a year on product.

@youcanthandlemyname7393

4 ай бұрын

my friend is a meta lover and is always playing the most combo heavy decks. its gotten to the point where when its his turn i get up and do things like make food or scroll the internet while he is doing it because it takes like 10 minutes for him to get done lol. like i dont even care if he is making shit up anymore, im not going to just sit their for 10 minutes and read/remember all of his cards to make sure he is not cheating xD.

@user-lh7mt7zo7l

4 ай бұрын

@@youcanthandlemyname7393 It's literal solitare lmao. Honestly if I play with friends I'd just some basic structure decks and that's it.

Yugioh is one of if not the MOST unwelcome to new players of all major TCGs. Prices, new player experience. All of this is just bad.

@yoastertoaster8306

5 ай бұрын

They just reprinted every staple lol What do you mean? Are you talking about buying the best deck? Rogue and local competitive decks have never been cheaper.

@Xenonfuji

5 ай бұрын

Vanguard might be worse at this point. Sure the starter decks are cheap, but the game relies on expensive promo cards, stores rarely host tournaments for it anymore, and there are 3 different formats due to having to reset due to powercreep

@gerritnolte2320

5 ай бұрын

prices are really fine lol. The rest is super true

@Xenonfuji

5 ай бұрын

​@@yoastertoaster8306rogue decks still almost always require s:p little knight. local competitive maybe, but this depends on your local.

@kenpatchiramasama1076

5 ай бұрын

@@gerritnolte2320 bonfire, S:P: are we jokes to you

Imagine EVER calling Konami commendable. Coming from someone who's experienced failure time and time again from this company, it frustrates me to no end seeing Yugioh players not realizing that they deal with a company that treats ALL of their franchises like this. Allow me to explain. 1) The likes of Castlevania not getting anything outside of collections and a Dead Cells collaboration for the past decade. Oh, but they'll release Castlevania NFTs! 2) Metal Gear where they completely stripped Hideo Kojima of any agency he had with the company, literally taking internet access from him to force him out of the company (which thankfully he held on until MGS5 was finished) and now we get nothing of quality from that series. 3) Suikoden where we haven't had a release since 2006, with excitement coming from an announcement of an HD remaster of the first two games in 2022 only to be delayed into obscurity if not cancellation. 4) Contra which has been of poor quality since the PS1 days outside of exactly Contra 4 on DS and re-releases of older titles in a collection. 5) After purchasing Hudson Soft, basically killing off every single series they ever produced outside of Bomberman, meaning we'll never get anther Bonk game, another Star Soldier game, heck, even with their acquisition they took away these developers from MARIO PARTY as they developed the first 8 titles, hence why 9 was a complete departure and utter crap in comparison to the first 8 titles. 6) Most of all, Konami is literally the reason fangames are shut down by most developers. They went to court twice in 1997 about Tokimeki Memorial, one for a save file editor and one for an erotic VHS that applies precedent to modifying and creating games based on pre-existing IPs (hence why companies like Nintendo can cease & desist a game like AM2R or Pokemon Uranium into dust) 7) PACHINKO MACHINES IN GENERAL! Overall, for people reading this, know that Konami has a VERY extensive track record for being anti-consumer and pro-profit for most of its life, and that we likely won't see a change in the TCG to accommodate new players as long as this practice is continued. Hopefully it will change, but considering the entire gaming industry is coasting on this sort of thing and has been for around 10-15 years now, it'll continue to affect Yugioh as a whole and continue to be anti-consumer and anti-new player. Wish it was different.

@PathBeyondTheDark

5 ай бұрын

Anyone that even passively followed the Kojima debacle and what happened immediately after with the MGS playerbase knows it's just Konami being Konami. You don't get called out in front of tens of thousands at an award show, you know the shows that desperately need advertising money and so they don't shit on companies lightly, and be a decent company. They have no shame no matter who confronts them, investors included. They are an anomaly really because even though other companies are anti-consumer when the press itself is pushing back on them they cave. Not Konami. They literally pivoted from being primarily a gaming company to mostly a pachinko manufacturer just so they didn't have to answer to their customers and journalists (they were slowly moving in that direction, but really ramped it up after that). What the actual fuck?

@B1ACKMAG3666

4 ай бұрын

TLDR: Konami Bad, stop expecting anything good from them.

@mrhalfsaid1389

4 ай бұрын

​@@PathBeyondTheDarkyep, a great company that causes problems for literally everyone including themselves yet somehow profit from this shit

@jackatlus666

4 ай бұрын

Side tangent, I've always found it weird when video game people talk about Konami and all their failures with video games and lack of innovation and always end up saying "How does konami even make money? They can't be staying afloat due to pachinko machines alone!" And I'm always like "??? Um they got Yugioh that's like the #2 card game in the world." But yeah as a whole Konami does what companies do best, nickel and dime their customers while laughing atop their ivory towers.

@luigifan4585

4 ай бұрын

based on the stuff I see that Konami still releases, it's a case of Konami being anti-western rather than being anti-consumer most of the time, or else Yugioh in Asian territories would be just as bad as here. which is still extremely stupid, don't get me wrong. case in point, a lot of their good games that still exist are either arcade-only or smaller console/mobile titles that are almost always region-locked or geographically-locked in the case of arcade cabinets. Pachinko doesn't even make them money anymore.

I tried to return to Yugioh this year and I can tell you right now, the game is terrible for new players. It was dreadful for me to try and get back into the game, to the point where I actually came away from relearning the game actually liking it less, and kind of soiling the nostalgic love I held for it. The game has evolved into a new breed of power creep that I can’t even describe. The fact that I watch players at my LCS flip for first, then compare opening hands and move on to the next game, deciding who won just based on the draws. It doesn’t even feel like a game anymore; it’s 2 turns (maybe) of playing show-and-tell with your entire deck, and then seeing if your opponent has enough extenders to get through your endless pile of negates, all for the amazing prize of getting to go to game 2, where it’s your opponent’s turn to play show-and-tell while you sit and contemplate what life choices brought you to this moment.

@Phinnigga

3 ай бұрын

There's no point in playing real Yu-Gi-Oh. I recommend speed duels.

@ScottyWiard

Ай бұрын

I feel this as a returning player. It’s why I’ve decided to just play Goat Format.

This feels like the back half of the article was written by a Konami Ai. The first half was the honey pot to get us in.

@MOORE4U2

5 ай бұрын

"The commendable actions taken by Konami..." Wow. Just wow.

@laforestadeimillepugnali3865

5 ай бұрын

@@MOORE4U2 I' m gonna be honest, I kinda feel the article was right. Sure, some of the competitive stamples are very costly, but Yu-gi-oh is full of low cost products to introduce people, on top of being able to bring a lot of decks to what could be cnsidered a competitive level, with a reasonable cost. You have stuff like speed duel, rush duel, Master duel and Duel link, the new starter set, the very cheap structure decks,ecc.ecc. The barrier for entry is very low, in comparison to other games. If you look at MTG pricing, you just laugh at it lol. Cimo does the example with pokemon, but pokemon has 3 different things going for it, that keeps the prices low: 1. The game is fro mthe most popular Ip on the world, leading to people always buying everything a LOT 2. The game is principaly a collector' s game, thus leading to a lot of inflated prices for specific cards, and creating an abundance of others 3. The competitive pokemon scene is basicaly non-existent for the card game, on top of the same card game being very simple in its rules and not very interactive ( on top of having a mechanic that costantly helps the player with advatange, instead of creating a status quo).

@timmyreobed5043

4 ай бұрын

​@@MOORE4U2 The only people I have ever seen call Konami's actions "commendable" are shareholders who want more of a payout on their investments.

The best way I have found to teach new players is to do a format progression. Start with duels with vanilla beat sticks and big walls. Every other duel introduce a new mechanic to not overwhelm.

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

That's basically the 2 Player Starter Kit in a nutshell. Just in one scripted duel, rather than having to have playsets of DM era vanillas and other ancient cards.

@nmr7203

4 ай бұрын

That seems very unintuitive

@wickederebus

4 ай бұрын

@nmr7203 start from vanillas with big numbers. Then removal spells/traps Then removal creatures Then recursion spells/traps Then creatures that go +1 on summon Then protection effects on creatures Then combo/synergy effects.

@markcoroneos7811

4 ай бұрын

@@nmr7203had similar experience. I went: - just vanilla monsters to teach card values, positioning, levels and tributes - effects and special summoning - spells - traps - deck building - fusions - rituals - synchros - xyz's - pendulums - links

@Aros-pr2xr

4 ай бұрын

That’s kinda what I do with my friends… I start with a normal summoning deck like Monarchs or Archfiends and work my way through the different summoning mechanics over time; after they understand the most basic summoning mechanics I show them how different unique effects work

Straight up, you gotta practically make an entire new format, use online sims, and have the fabled book of freaking Legends with you just to get 1 friend or family member into Yugioh. At least that’s how I did it.

@ducky36F

5 ай бұрын

I just taught my wife and a couple friends Edison lol They really enjoyed it

@Emberrs

5 ай бұрын

What do you mean? they made a product with 2 decks and a manual on how to use the cards

@eleonarcrimson858

5 ай бұрын

@@Emberrsnaaaah you are not serious.

@ZadeKirian

5 ай бұрын

@@Emberrs Who’s gonna let bro know?

@pedrofelipefreitas2666

5 ай бұрын

​@@Emberrsthat is some nice irony you got going there

When I used to run a games shop I noticed a major problem with player retention was the players You would have young children rock up with a deck they have spent a while building at home Then they would sit across the table from an experienced player who.wpuld rush through thier combo at full speed assuming everyone knows what every part of thier deck does Needless to say very few of thoes kids stuck around Many jumped to pokemon or MTG

@matasa7463

4 ай бұрын

... yeah, I feel that. My was playing with a newbie player, and I swapped to a fun deck I had, that challenged them without frustrating them. Some people just aren't able to raise disciples. I would've been throwing my spare cards at the kids, and showing them the ropes, so that one day, they'll bloom into a beautiful salty AF duellist.

@RockR277

3 ай бұрын

I mean, that sounds more like an asshat problem. Not to say that everyone needs to have a child/new player friendly deck on hand, but they could learn to read the room a little.

@Lotusmustdie

3 ай бұрын

This happened to me as a kid, it SUCKS.

@PsychoMantisss

3 ай бұрын

I went from Pokémon to Yu-Gi-Oh back to Pokémon…Pokemon is far less complicated and easier to read the text on the cards.

@Raindropp23

9 күн бұрын

When I was a kid my mom took me to a card shop nearby when I had my yugioh phase as a kid (Zexal killed it for me) and I literally walked up to my first tournament with a duel disk on my arm that my mom got for me on ebay. Needless to say I did not win but the adults and experienced players would always let me win the first round, teach me the rules since it was clear I was coming from just watching the show, and even one time changed a bracket cause I got matched with like the best player at the shop and they changed it so I went up against another kid. It was the perfect way to keep someone new engaged in yugioh and wanting to learn especially if they're a kid and I have fond memories of those days :) Hope this made you smile

Cimo, you silly goose. Forbidden Memories was made before Yugioh knew what being Yugioh meant.

@SHADOMEGA7569

4 ай бұрын

i feel forbidden memories captivates duels as they were depicted in the manga/anime in ancient egypt hence why you could just drop an ultimate dragon from the hand turn 1 and why a dark magician can beat a blue eyes (dark field + guardian star advantage or what not) and honestly taking the YGO image and slapping it on alternate genres like tactics with CMC, DoTR, and FK as it gives us something to familiarize with so we can adapt to the gameplay. obviously a monster like the blue eyes white dragon is going to be a good pick/drop so why wouldnt i use it. DoTR gave monsters different effects and some switch from effect to vanilla and vice versa making some cards just broken (swordsman from a foreign land) just being the best bait card or even the immortal types that guarantee both parties will pay the cost when destroyed. good times

@PyckledNyk

4 ай бұрын

This is true. It was released legit before the OCG

I’ve tried multiple times to teach someone new this game and it never sticks. There experience and feedback is it’s just not fun and very complicated. Now take that same person and show them the Pokemon TCG they’re hooked and it’s easily accessible and fun. Plus way cheaper. Sad state.

@vivienjoly7617

5 ай бұрын

Just let them play old Yu-Gi-Oh, it's way easier to understand, it's cheap af, and it's a lot of fun, i'm sure they will love it

@randomprotag9329

5 ай бұрын

pokemon legit rewards actual mastery better. its simple to play but hard to optimise moment to moment.

@UMAtronic

5 ай бұрын

​@@vivienjoly7617 or they could show them video or something. Yugioh players are horrible at teach others how to play yugioh from my understanding.

@bugking1413

5 ай бұрын

Literally, this. Tried to teach my friend yugioh, and while he did like it, it was still overwhelming for him (and that was without showing him card prices). I showed that same friend pokemon, and he jumped in with little to no problems and instantly wanted to play more. I love yugioh, but pokemon is probably the card game I'd point new people to due to how accessible it is.

@619ver1

5 ай бұрын

@@UMAtronic Yes and no. The problem is, Yugioh is an incredible hard game to teach. Where do you start? The super basics "Green are spells, purple are traps and the rest monsters. Ohh you can summon traps? And use monsters as spells? And activate spells on your opponents turn? Also why are there so many colors for monsters?" Its super hard to explain given the mutation the game made during the last 20 years.

As someone who plays and competes in speed duel, I think this format is vastly underrated. I actually feel like I am playing yugioh, a feeling which I don't get when I play the regular format. I think a lot of the speed duel community have a deep love for yugioh and we would all like to enjoy the regular format but it just isn't enjoyable for a wide variety of reasons (not dissing the regular format, it just isn't for me)

A game that even the existing playerbase doesn't enjoy in it's current state for like half a decade doesn't attract new players? Color me shocked!

3:08 Considering the fact the pendulum era gave rise to drawn out turns having to wait for people to cycle through their extra and main decks and as well annoying levels of redundancy and intricacy for decks it understandable especially when you have to deal with a unbreakable board with a non meta deck. It’s really not fun to realize that you can’t do anything after waiting five to ten minutes for your opponent to finally finish their turn.

@impermanence4300

5 ай бұрын

This is what drove me away from the game back in 2015. I was a non-meta player and I got a full time job. The combo of those two things really locked me out of the game. I no longer had the time to invest in learning how to out a tier 1 deck with my rouge decks. But also the tier 1 decks just grew in power and in annoying combo bullshit exponentially. In the space of about a year we went from Bujin and Geargia being tier 1 and 2 decks. Stuff that I could beat even with X-Sabres and Nordics. To Djinn lock Nekroz. I just quit the game wholesale and didn't return until Master Duel. Watching some dude play solitaire and then not being able to play while the fanbase cries for cards that could stop this shit being banned. That's just not very fun.

@Phoenixoflife56

5 ай бұрын

@@impermanence4300 the worst part is that the unbreakable boards formed by most decks are less interactive than the cards that they complain about and the only reason why they complain is because they are forced into lowering consistency by having to use se generic spell/trap removal

@xiaoyuwang3106

5 ай бұрын

That was way before pends. Arguably started in 2010 with X-Sabers.

@619ver1

5 ай бұрын

The problem is that the issue of "Draw the out or scoop" basically became the modus operandi of the game.

@eraclese5638

5 ай бұрын

I say pendulums really just made people realize the game was having that problem. It wasn't the cause, just the spark.

For me it was a combination of duel links, watching various youtubers, and master duel to even get a vague understanding of modern yugioh. Even with that, I still don't get a lot of the more complex rulings and things happening.

@duyknguyen

4 ай бұрын

I think that complexity also work as the attractiveness of Yugioh itself..? an only TCG game of infinite exploring even for experienced players, we find new weird interaction everday essentially (It does throw newbie off to a big world though) 😅

@jhonviel7381

4 ай бұрын

try the DS games, though they dont have the new cards, but WC2009 is a goat game

@matasa7463

4 ай бұрын

Dude, I've been around from the start, and at no point did people fully understand the rules, because the way the game works, some rulings are just... kinda up in the air.

@user-lh7mt7zo7l

4 ай бұрын

I'd personally recommend the tag force games.

@PyckledNyk

4 ай бұрын

I’ve basically taken a three months long crash course in YuGiOh through MD and KZread and now I can at least make and pilot a competent deck. Even then, there are a TON of things still to learn because of the massive card pool.

The easiest time to get into Yugioh was 2002 with the Yugi and Kaiba starter decks. It's only gotten tougher as more time has passed.

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

True. Entering someone into the game and explaining spell speeds and timing and trigger effects is so extra to someone just trying to learn the basics

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

​@attentionduelists spell speeds There are carts you can use only on your turn. These are spell speed 1. There are cards you can use on either turn, these are spell speeds 2 and 3. See these Magenta cards with a little arrow icon? These are spell speed 3 only. See these Magenta cards that say "Normal Trap" these are spell speed 2. See this card "Super Polymerization" this card is spell speed 2, but it also has this effect where neither of us can respond to it. In yugioh, if I use a spell speed 1 card on my turn, and you respond to it with a spell speed 2 card, and I respond with a spell speed 2 or 3 card, and neither of us have anything else to add on, then the whole chain/stack resolves. This is not like MTG's stack where you can respond to card A after response card B has resolved, but before Card A has resolved.

@scoutbane1651

4 ай бұрын

@@attentionduelistsSpell speeds are the easiest thing in the world to explain to new players. Like its incomparable to explaining most of what yugioh is now.

@attentionduelists

4 ай бұрын

@@scoutbane1651 it was example.

To be fair to a couple of the oldest Yugioh video games, many of them were in development at the same time as the physical card game. They didn't have a solid set of rules to work off of besides the manga.

@XDoggStrafe

5 ай бұрын

I was just about to comment this, since Forbidden Memories released in December 1999, while the first OCG cards were released in February 1999, so barely a year's time to develop a whole ps1 game, kind of makes sense why the rules are sort of janky and all over the place.

@ellieg8773

5 ай бұрын

ironic considering they're doing history of the ocg

@True2ChainzLilWayne

5 ай бұрын

@@XDoggStrafe The forbidden memories rules are the original ocg except You can only play 1 card per turn period, traps auto activate when their conditions met, and you auto draw to 5 cards and can throw away as many cards as you want from your per turn to attempt fusion.

@younasdar5572

5 ай бұрын

@@True2ChainzLilWayne It did get sequels past the release of the physical TCG, but I still give those a pass because they are still sequels to a game and therefore it is reasonable to use the same rules to keep it consistent.

@True2ChainzLilWayne

5 ай бұрын

@@younasdar5572 I like Duelists of the Roses better anyway because you can outsmart the ai on the 7x7 grid instead of bigger number always wins

Competitive Yugioh players: It is so hard to get new players interested ): Also competitive Yugioh players: Duel Links is not actually Yugioh, Rush Duels are not actually Yugioh, Dungeon Dice Monsters or any other game from the first Manga are not actually Yugioh, ... the only "real" Yugioh is competitive Yugioh! A game, that requires you to study 22 years of History, memorise a few hundred cardeffects, relinquish every social link you currently have and sell your soul to the highest bidding Demon to even stand a chance against someone playing a "fun" deck!

Didn't a Canadian proplayer just hard quit due to being priced out of competitive?

@shakeweller

5 ай бұрын

Yep

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

Who?

@eggsat9291

5 ай бұрын

​@@wickederebusSkyhawk, he quit the game a few weeks ago.

@r3zaful

5 ай бұрын

​@@eggsat9291nah he still playing in master duel, he just quit buying cards.

@SuperYoshi1213

4 ай бұрын

​@@eggsat9291he probably isn't going to be the only one either

Yu-Gi-Oh is absolutely the most unwelcoming tcg in existence, between the overly complicated rules, mechanics, word salad on each card, and an insanely toxic playerbase. I've never been happier to play TCGs than I am now after having moved to Pokemon. Prices are outrageous too. I built 2 Tier 1 decks in pokemon for about $100. That will get you 1, maybe 2 cards in yugioh. It's a god damn joke. Dont even get me started on the balance. Yu-Gi-Oh is absurd, with games being decided during the coin toss more often than not, and the 2nd turn player's opening hand as well. Sad part is, the playerbase is OK with this garbage. I just dont understand, our game could be so much better but they refuse to reject how bad it is and embrace it instead, letting it rot evermore. Change in this game begins with you, playerbase. And it needs to if you want it to survive.

Expensive staples, trashy community and difficulty for players to learn mechanics.

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

Worst community in tcgs.

Tag force was the best Yu-Gi-Oh game series to me

@alonsoarana5307

5 ай бұрын

Tag Force was like Smackdown vs Raw, at least the first few iterations of it, it's why they were some of my favorite games

@kish45

5 ай бұрын

Shame that Tag Force 3 never got a release in the USA.

@invertbrid

5 ай бұрын

Agree. Duelist of the roses is prob my fave childhood YGO game (forbidden memories too hard and tedious). But yea fave YGO game of all time will def falls into tag force series. It basically what keep YGO video games slive in PSP era.

@erickkisreal9398

5 ай бұрын

I miss the DS games

@RandallHidalgoS21allas96

5 ай бұрын

I love FM, Duelist of the Roses, Capsule Monster Coliseum and Tag Force. I'm far of being a competitive player but I enjoy those games. I also played Duel Links and I like it but is my least favourite format. Love MD too.

To be fair capsule monster coliseum is based in the game in the manga that was present before the card game became the final point

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

One of the best, and my personal favorite!

On the subject of duel links, I think the best way to describe it is actually simplified yugioh - because it's the exact same cards, with the exact same mechanics (- halved burn cards) just in a simplified format, which is actually a GOOD THING. yugioh is so complicated, so having something that's simple and easy to get into is a huge step in the right direction

@xiaoyuwang3106

5 ай бұрын

On the other hand, Duel Links is pay2win and VERY unbalanced. Skills are so overtuned that a terrible archetype can be T0 with a broken skill.

@AuratticStride

5 ай бұрын

@@xiaoyuwang3106 I mean the way I see it, modern yugioh is also pay2win 😅

@GG_Nowa

5 ай бұрын

It's currently in yet another tier 0 format. Ye it's simplified but it's also somehow had more tier 0 formats than paper play in 1/3 of the time paper existed

@NostalgicOccultist

4 ай бұрын

@@GG_Nowa It doesn't help that Konami specifically pushes tier 0 strategies to get people to spend money gambling for the new meta cards

Glad to see Duel Links highlighted, it really was the vehicle for my return to the game. Master Duel wise,y best guess is that they figured it would be simpler to maintain a single player.

Speaking as someone that WAS formally introduced to paper play Yugioh via the Rarity Collection and the fire King structure decks, I think what’s going on is that the price “floor” (I.e. lowest price to get a somewhat competitive deck) is the lowest in at least a long time, but the price “ceiling” (i.e. highest price needed to (consistently) compete at a top level) is the highest…if not ever, then at least since TeleDaD. I certainly thought that this was one of the best times to enter the paper version due to what I mentioned before, until I got a closer look into the price discourse, or did if it wasn’t apparent already. I think that’s where the discrepancy is coming from.

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

You can also just buy 3x Dark World reloaded structure, one Dark Corridor, and maybe $50 for the mandatory Fiend extra Deck pieces. Just hope you don't get Drolled, and solitaire with your pile of non-HOPT effects.

@PathBeyondTheDark

5 ай бұрын

Getting into YGO was never a price issue because you can get into YGO with a random assortment of 40 cards you find lying around. The problem comes when, as now, you could be doing just as well with those 40 random cards as you do using 98% of the card pool because the only competitive deck or two cost a thousand dollars. Yes with a few structure decks you can sneak into your top cut at locals every so often. But you can do that with the right 15-18 hand traps/board breakers and put whatever else you want around it anyway. So saying "it's cheap to get into" is nothing new. The only side of this debate that matters is the competitive side because that is the only side that is inconsistent when it comes to cost.

@mariosplaysszz6261

4 ай бұрын

Well yugioh has competition. Issue is even tier 2 and tier 3 decks are much more expensive than tier 1 decks in other card games. I think this is what driving people off.. why spend money on a tier 2/3 deck when with much less money I can play the BDIF in another card game.

@EMICIME

4 ай бұрын

That’s actually a good way of looking at it, with the floor and ceiling examples

@PyckledNyk

4 ай бұрын

Same here, although I used to play way back in the early days from 2002 to 2005 or so. The TCG is insanely expensive for someone like me who wants to play with the most competitive cards. I have three of the Fire Kings deck in paper, but I need to buy at least $750 of cards, which is insane for only 10 cards maybe, to make it top tier. MD has its flaws, but you can at least use gems to make a half decent enough deck to at least make it to Silver. I got all the Snake-Eye and Singul Spoils cards for nothing but grinding some duels.

So with Pokemon vs Yu-Gi-Oh, like you can teach someone both games. But the difference is Yu-Gi-Oh has a lot of information overload, and in terms of modern the game is combo heavy. Not to mention the cost, the real difference is how the power creep is handled. Pokemon has power creep, but that's in the HP and Attack values. Otherwise the staples you use today are literally the same exact ones back when it first came out. Like Yu-Gi-Oh they just keep adding on more bonker effects to cards with already bonker effects, like the card is already not bonker enough.

@TheLordTash

5 ай бұрын

I think the bigger issue with Yugioh is that you don't just have to learn how to play the game. You also have to build up a lot of meta-knowledge about what different decks do. There are a LOT of decks in the game that you just can't win against if you've never seen them before and accidentally waste your interrupts on things they can casually get back.

@Azaytio

4 ай бұрын

Pokemon is a very combo heavy game, like churning through 7-14 cards played or interacted with a turn is not uncommon, I think the real difference is the base mechanics of pokemon are just more simple to understand like instead of extra deck you gotta evolve which is basically tribute summoning. The trainer cards that you mostly use a turn have simple but powerful effects and are worded as simple as possible. Yugioh has a paragraph to explain 1 effect.

@TheLordTash

4 ай бұрын

@@Azaytio The only combo in Pokemon you really have to know is the one in your own deck. It really doesn't matter what the opponent is doing their turn most of the time, only the board they end on.

@Azaytio

4 ай бұрын

@@TheLordTash Kinda, knowing what your opponent combos is still relevant, you have to plan how you wanna take your prizes so knowing how much of x or could they run y card left in deck is is still important or what potential attackers may be problematic for you in a future turn. I just pointing out that "combo" isn't so different of yugioh vs pokemon.

One of the things that got me into Yugioh was the 2009? DS game, which was basically the OCG format until Crimson Crisis, so I can understand the writer in that aspect.

Funny. Anytime I show my friends something new from yugioh. It makes them go from tempted to try it again. To immediately wishing Konami's yugioh department would go bankrupt lel

@Emberrs

5 ай бұрын

Why? Do your friends only show interest in the top most expensive cards and strategies?

@GG_Nowa

5 ай бұрын

@@Emberrs most expensive cards are good cards and people want to play good cards especially when in Yu-Gi-Oh they're what let's lower decks attempt to do something

@SuperYoshi1213

4 ай бұрын

​@@EmberrsYugioh is a pay to win game. Especially in the modern game, people who throw money at it have a way better shot than those who don't.

I'm mid on Speed Duel, but I like Rush Duel's existence because it's a new game focused on being comprehensible from a fundamental level. It feels like YGO needs a reboot at some point, and seeing how YGO has developed and the relative success of a reboot of Cardfight Vanguard (at least the second reboot), it makes me feel like card games without rotation will naturally power creep over time and a reboot is inevitable for them.

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

Or go the MTG route via Modern and Pioneer. Have a "last 10 years of cards: and a "last 20 years of cards" formats to let the boomers/power creeping go into. Then start a new Standard Format using only cards from POTE onwards, with problem decks like Kash and Tear limited/banned from the get go. The problem is, Konami is about 23 years too late to that issue.

Duel monsters was a manga about different games being played under the yugioh umbrella yugioh hasn’t really gotten that far away from it routs when you really think about it

Forbidden memories existed before the official rules. Duelist of the roses as a sequel follows the same. Capsule monsters existed in the original manga but played like D&D well before the card game existed. The ds games follows the anime while using real card pack sets. Same for the game on the Wii while basically everything after that became just a basic dueling sim with your real world wallet.

Meanwhile I just want another capsule monster or duelist of the roses game

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

PREACH

I am a 2002-2008 yugiboomer, and I used the last console game, link evolution, to get back to the game. It lets you play the anime duels with each persons deck, or use your own that you’ve built. By playing decks from each era I was able to embrace pendulum and pick up link summons. It was perfect, but it was a single purchase instead of micro transactions, so we’ll likely never get a game like that againx

@NightRaven5568

3 ай бұрын

Never again sadly it is also why Link Evo is stuck in march 2020 back then there used to be the yearly world championship series but Konami would never make those again because they wouldn't make a lot of money

I lived on Campus at University from 2012 to 2016 and a group of student I later befriended founded a Yugioh club my first year there which I ended up help running for most of my time there. One of the challenges we had is we would get students who were interested in the club, who maybe stopped playing around GX or even 5ds be excited to player but when they played the current format they became completely discouraged. You could see the excitement leave them the second they played someone with a combo deck. I had separate lower tier decks that I played so I didn't discourage newer players from joining the club. Link monsters its gotten way worse.

One of the big problems with sets from a new player perspective is that you can't pick up a box or two from a set and be able to build a playable deck from that. The approach of sets just having pieces of sets that can't form a coherent deck on their own makes the secondary market the only viable way to get into the game, and that turns a new player off right away. Structure decks help but a brand new player isn't going to know that they need to pick those up instead of just picking up that shiny new box on shelf.

2:48 Yeah, pendulums and link monsters made it more complex, but as a Yugiboomer, I would say xyzs were the real turning point. Synchros were certainly a bit of a power creep, but they were kind of like just a better (aka playable) form of fusion monsters: Rather than needing a separate spell card, some monsters just had an innate ability to fuse with others. But it wasn't too out of hand, because you still needed tuner monsters, along with whichever particular tuners or non tuners your synchro monster required. With xyz, almost all restrictions were gone. That's when the game started to revolve around ways to cheese out multiple little monsters with matching levels, and convert them into boss monsters, all in the same turn. Though I never played with synchro monsters, when I'm watching the progression series, it still feels like the same game I used to play. Once you get properly into the xyz era, I just lose interest in the series and stop watching it. It's just a different game.

@Wizard_Lizard_

4 ай бұрын

I've talked about this with a lot of friends who quit. 9/10 of them thought Synchro was just fine. When I asked them about XYZ 7/9 said it made them quit because of how outlandish the power creep was just by design.

@N12015

4 ай бұрын

It's less because of XYZs as a concept and more because they made their summoning too easy. Summoning a boss monster in MR1 is not something you will get reliably, even going first despite being when you have a draw going first. Nowadays it is to be expected to have 3 or 4 boss monsters who negate 3-4 actions of the opponent if they lack any sort of handtrap.

I wish they'd really invest in speed duel. There's just nowhere to play it or anyone to play with locally.

Having spin-off games and side games is healthy for the brand as a whole. I know people hate the comparison but look at Pokémon. You have the TCG, Pokémon GO, Spin-off games, and the Core games from Game Freak. Not only that but within the Core GF games you have sub-series like Let's Go, Legends, old school (BDSP), and then the mainline new Gen games (SwSh / SV). Having Master Duel, Speed Duel, Rush Duel, Duel Links, etc. is good for capturing a wider market for Yu-Gi-Oh! I think hardcore players forget there's a much wider audience out there that is and could be interested in the brand but on their own level that's not necessarily competitively focused.

While I haven't played the physical TCG in years. I will say that keeping up with the anime helped me when Master Duel first released so I didn't feel as overwhelmed when it came to learning the Pendulum and Link mechanics, however I understand that, not everyone followed the anime past GX or 5D's.

@ayumikuro3768

5 ай бұрын

The new types of special summoning aren't that difficult, I stopped playing and watching around the 5D's era. The problem is more how specific some rulings get nowadays, because we have cards from 25 years ago interacting with rules they were never planned around.

@spicymemes7458

5 ай бұрын

I only watched 5Ds last year because I didn't finish it. Otherwise, I dont care to sit through another spinoff

5D's format where synchros and fusions are the only extra deck monsters, and any card that explicitly cites a later extra deck mechanic is banned. Otherwise new product can enter the format, but it retains the spirit of that era. Could do the same with zexal and arc v and so on

Master Duel is very welcoming and much easier to play than paper Edit: imagine crying about grinding for gems when a playset of bonfires irl cost ~$300. With the amount of money a top tier paper deck costs you could craft every single top tier deck in Master Duel up to next year

@kish45

5 ай бұрын

Sure if players enjoy grinding gems for hours and not receive any gems as gifts like in Duel links.

@spicymemes7458

5 ай бұрын

Better tutorial, cheaper on average if you know what you are doing, no secondary market, good graphical interface, casual and competitive events on a frequent basis, opens access to those who don't live near locals, full refund on cards that are limited or banned. It's one of the best products I have seen from Konami in a long time, and I have no reason to go back to paper, other occasional games with friends.

@AljoschaW1993

5 ай бұрын

​@@kish45events are fun 3k Gems are 30 Packs, that's sometimes enough to build a deck And you play it anyway

@standardobjectives

5 ай бұрын

The "custom" hands and forced interaction from a lack of a decent deck randomizer are the BEST part of MD too

@AljoschaW1993

5 ай бұрын

With Ai this will be much more easier in the beginning I am hyped

I think at first the easiest way to teach somebody how to play would be through prog open-up packs (not IRL because I'm not going to spend 100 dollars on some boxes) and then teach them slowly getting more and more complicated as time goes on its a slow process but worth it

@619ver1

5 ай бұрын

Thats sorta what the 2 player decks are doing? Like they are SORTED decks which basically run your through all the mechanics.

The most popular Yugioh videos are about problems with Yugioh. Doesn't that say something? Sorry but standard Yugioh is a busted, broken, mutant of a game. Konami knows this. It's extremely complex and requires a lot of start up to even play. It's like needing a degree before you get a job. Is this inherently bad? No! There's nothing like Yugioh and that by itself is very cool. But is it bad for new players? Yes! Konami will never admit it is impossible to get new players into this game because it is inherently broken. You know what their answer for new players is? Rush Duel. Someone once said, "Yugioh was designed by a writer to write cool stories; Rush Duel was designed by game designers to make you feel cool".

Stop hating on the existence of alternate formats

I’m very grateful for duel links. I joined back when it first started and as someone with 0 TCG experience, it was a great entry point. I felt like I had missed out on the yugioh experience with how advanced the current TCG was so to get an opportunity to start from the beginning with a new yugioh format and progressively advance to something akin to modern yugioh was very helpful. What really boosted my yugioh knowledge after that was watching Dkayed’s DL tournament streams explaining the thought process behind the decisions being made and the breakdown of what was going on in the duels. Once masterduel came out, I already understood most of the mechanics, and rulings. It was just a matter of learning the new meta and adapting to a few changes in the format (additional monster zones).

Imagine using the competitive scene as an argument for new player, the average person doesn't care about that, he play casually, those nerds are out of touch with new and casual players

For Duel Links, so many people are into it because it is a watered-down version of the game. Less power (at first, lol), just about every notable character you could ask for, and its free (also lol). It is a Weenie Hut Juniors yugioh for those that are desparaged with the TCG and “20 minute combos,” so DL is an easier alternative with story-based events. I myself sooner play DL because I just am just not skilled enough win as often in the TCG with the decks I like. But in DL, I have a higher win-loss because everyone is on the same level as I am with the limited card pool, which makes rogue decks (i.e., nostalgia decks) stand a chance. Even though Ive been collecting since 2009, and playing since 2015, only DL has really continuously satisfied me competitively. Its the yugioh platform Im the most successful on, followed by Master Duel. So I will be sticking with alt formats; as much as I love *watching* TCG stuff, I will not be playing.

Master Duel is unironically a better experience than the physical game. Its free for one and maki g dozens of decks is not that hard or even ti e consuming, plus ,as limited as it is, it does actually teach new players the basics. All the problems with introducing new players to the game are inherent to Yugioh as a whole.

@jhonviel7381

4 ай бұрын

it got me back into the game, i stopped paying for cards in like 2010, if anything yugioh wiki is the only reason i continue to play.

I am only on Master Duel now. Better tutorial, cheaper if you know what to do, no secondary market, frequent events, visually appealing, and I can play it on mobile. There is no reason for paper play other than occasional games with friends, but it's not how I want to invest in the hobby going forward.

"Ash blossom $3 a copy." My magic the gathering friends laughed at that amount. They have spent more on land cards that are basic functions to their decks than a core denial mechanic that is now almost required in competitive yugioh.

100% agree with the videogame thing. My introduction to the game was Dark Duel Stories on the gamboy color, which, for anyone here that's played that knows that outside of a few basic rules is a much different game then the actual card game at the time

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

But still fun

@BridgetGX

3 ай бұрын

Same. That version of Yu-Gi-Oh I could play the hell out of. Also in DDS you could make cards, that was fun

This is why I'm basically online exclusive when it comes to Yugioh because right now it's like $500 for 3 copies of Bonfire like $110-$120 for S:P Little Knight then maybe $100-$150 for the Diabellestar/Sinful Spoils package as to where if you're playing on an online simulator like Dueling Nexus, EDOPro, Omega, and Dueling Book you have access to every card in the game and even can test some cards coming out later like in Legacy of Destruction and Infinite Forbidden and they're absolutely free

After some frustrations with WOTC, I figured I'd give yugioh shot, so I dipped my toes into duel links. I hated it. So, looking for an alternative, I found the original mention of yugioh masterduel, it was like a week old at the time. So I waited and waited, playing duel links because I didn't know what else to do. I wake up one day, and master duel had dropped on steam, but I was busy that so I had to wait til the next day to play it. Being a complexity junkie and coming over from MtG, I adapted quite quickly and it has been one of my primary pass times, love this, hate stun ❤.

@zeroofthekings

5 ай бұрын

This is by no means a common or relatable story, but I thought someone would enjoy it.

This smells like a paid/yugioh fanboy article.

It really is a tough balance on sealed since so few cards drive values. Boom sets are decent sellers for retailers and bust sets end up heavy bags.

I bought one of the 2-Player Starter Decks and my baby sister (She's 12) enjoys it and is learning the game quite well. But she is still going to be far from being even a rogue competitive player. But I'll be introducing her to Goat Format soon.

as a guy who never touched ygo until master duel, its honestly not that hard to learn as long as you play the tutorial and simply. read. EVERYTHING. Also archetypal decks are much easier to deck build, and they aid in comprehending ex deck summons. As a side note, i didnt just learn the game, but i climbed all the way to plat 1 (back in the days when plat was the highest rank) only using rogue decks

@toazzy9336

5 ай бұрын

And honestly, i think free digital simulations like master duel are ideal to get someone to play analog (you make a deck online for free, you have a cohesive decklist that youve tested and understand, you buy the specific cards and head to a local). The cards costing like 5 bucks a pop for a 40-50 card deck is a real disincentive admittedly, especially with shipping costs.

@robin2934

5 ай бұрын

"Not that hard to learn" and "yugioh" Should NEVER be in the same sentence. If you genuinely believe that master duel's bare bones tutorials help in any way to actually learn the game beyond the basics you must be out of your mind.

@baronlightyt965

5 ай бұрын

@@robin2934at least it helps for new players to learn the basics Of course beyond that, thats when learning becomes harder because interactions becomes more complicated

Konami has been so commendable with their lowering of prices lately

@shigesohma

5 ай бұрын

Took me a minute to realize the sarcasm. ngl

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

Truly brave

@hachibidelta4237

4 ай бұрын

Komoney

I love Yu-Gi-Oh and it's my favorite card game , however it is not even close to being new player friendly , if anything it's even harder to learn and takes much more time than most other card games that I've played in the same genre

19:37 Dude, you were talking for like 5min and i actually space out I had no idea what you were talking about and you just said "its not that complicated". I laughed out loud

I started playing dueling nexus simulator inspirado by the series of Cimoooo as a way to catchup the gameplay. If you play starting with smaller card pools as lob or mrd with the most recent banlist, you actually start to underdtand the game without the presion to understand new summoning mechanics. You loose a lot, sure but every lose helps you understand the cards you are playing against, also is funny ti defeat current decks spamming cards as torrencial tribute and raigeki when you are lucky

@InvaderWeezle

5 ай бұрын

There's a simulator that helps players catch up to modern gameplay? I need this tbh

@r3zaful

5 ай бұрын

​​@@InvaderWeezleit's a terrible fan simulator to duel against people, but acceptable for deck building and testing combos alone. Playing a real time duel against people? No no way its not made to duel with people, you will understand how it plays once you jump into it, clunky and ugly.

Every so often I get a thought in my head to try out Yu-Gi-Oh again, then remember the time when I played Duel Links and got turn 1ed and the thought goes away. Then I see shorts of the same thing happening and apparently being a norm then all interest goes away. I like something slower and more methodical than solitaire.

I remember how Konami scummy tactics drove away 3 friends from playing yugioh. They grew up with the show and in 2021 they noticed i still played the game and asked me to teach them how modern yugioh worked, i did was and they got hooked with the game and we played 2 or 3 times per week they got some structures and we had a lot of fun, they asked me about buying a booster pack box and i told them that i didn't think it was a good idea, but they still wanted to do it, so they got one each behind my back, they got the one where libromancers where released, their logic was that they would complete new decks are if they combined their boxes content, but when they finished opening the boxes they just got crap and really couldn't form a full playable decks and where really disappointed and never wanted to play again

Sorry Cimo, but Speed Duels and Rush Duels existing are a good thing whether you like it or not. Just like how Commander existing for MtG is a good thing

@alonsoarana5307

5 ай бұрын

Eh

@FaeQueenCory

5 ай бұрын

Commander was infinitely better when it was EDH.

@GG_Nowa

5 ай бұрын

Speed duels existing would be good if they actually made an attempt to actually market it to people outside of the guys who already play Yu-Gi-Oh. Because not only is it a fun draft at kitchen table but also a fun format to play with a construed deck. Rush is pretty much dead in the western eyes though because konami gave us a dog ass game and refuses to even do anything outside of duel links which is currently so far behind and so bad for a format no one barely plays it so yes it is bad.

@PapaPodo

5 ай бұрын

@@GG_Nowa not listening to haters

I think its important to address all the problems Yu-Gi-Oh has (and theres a lot of them lol) in the hope Komoney ever takes note. But for me, the biggest problem of this game is the community. As long as the community keeps spending trucks of money in mediocre products, Konami will keep ripping us off and thinking "oh this game works so well, people is loving it". Im just amazed listening to people complaining about Bonfire but buying a playset in presale or people saying Phantom Nightmare is trash just to buy 2 cases of boxes. Mediocre products, artificial shortprinting, rarity upgrades from the OCG beyond imagination, usually the side sets are a complete waste of money (except Rarity Collection and MAMA, both great products) and a community that doesnt really care about what happening.

I've been trying to get into yugioh ever since I played Earth Machine(best deck) in Master Duel. The only thing preventing me right now from going into the TCG is a lack of money, because just to build some decks I need a plethora of cash, which sucks, because I'm rather poor by average standards. I soooo badly want to play different types of decks (some of which aren't really represented in MD or outright missing critical cards) :(

The only way Yugioh gets new players or returning players is by recognizing more official formats like MTG does. Master Duel and YCS needs Goats and Edison. Maybe even a new format to curb the powercreep and mechanics. I barely tolerated XYZ, pendulums made me quit, and Link made sure I'm never coming back

I started playing yugioh with master duel and even that was awful, Master duel is cheap yes but it is so hard to learn and the community was so unhelpful and aggressive it made the journey even worst. I love this game but I don't know how are there new players still appearing.

@spicymemes7458

5 ай бұрын

TCG side is toxic and cutthroat, drunk on teenage shitposts. OCG side is a bit better

@Honest_Mids_Masher

5 ай бұрын

Can't disagree with the toxic side or else I'd be a hypocrite but yeah the game is absolutely difficult to learn. I'll admit though I did start playing with Master Duel and managed to learn the game properly so It's not impossible but yeah it's very difficult because you're trying to learn a game that has 25 years worth of huge updates and additions of mechanics.

This article wants to be react to...100%. But one thing I want to say about a argument you made... I do not believe that "starter" deck products should get rid of normal monsters. Not because I do not agree with their application in the main game, but more so because I think they are a part of the game you need to know exist. I wrote the following so many times: I do think that the 2 player starter set is a great idea, but extremely bad handled. In regards to the vanillas I would have loved to see some of them and also fitting for the decks (only lvl4s for the xyz and some low level tuners for the synchro). What is problematic is when the amount of normal monsters is too high.

@randomprotag9329

5 ай бұрын

normal monsters could work for a lower power format product but that would require supporting more than the main format

I've always found it very strange how draft formats have had so little support from official products. I had to track down the battle city speed duel set only shortly after its release, and I'd pick up a goat format draft box immediately as it hit the shelf.

@majoojavkoo7715

3 ай бұрын

Well, there is the Legendary Collection 25th Anniversary Edition if you want something akin to GOAT Draft, but keep in mind its literally just 5 old boosters, and the product was not deliberately designed for draft purposes.

I would actually like to see Konami create and support newer and more varying formats. some very blatant anti-consumer practices aside, if there was more use for the fluff cards that were added into new sets, it would drop the prices of the chase cards. take the new Flame Swordsman support for example, there is no real format to play with these cards in. they are too week for competitive play and you can't retroactively add them to older formats where it could possibly do something. so, they just sit as bait to get nostalgic players to buy into. if there was a market for these cards however, sellers wouldn't have to over compensate by listing the chase cards much, much higher prices because they could make it up by selling to players that enjoy different formats

There is only one good way to introduce people to Yu-Gi-Oh, let them play old Yu-Gi-Oh, way easier to understand, cheap, back and forth gameplay etc... Then you introduce them to the more complexe formats and introduce them to the more "recent" summoning mechanics, and you have a new Yu-Gi-Oh fan, easy

@attentionduelists

5 ай бұрын

You almost have to, unless they make this game their obsession

Dissapointed to see Cimo's take here on the topic of alternative formats to play the game, specifically duel links and rush duels, i think it's dissapointing that he writes them off as "not real yugioh" just because it's not the same format as the TCG/OCG format, sure it has alternative rules because it's an alternative format, but it's still a version of yugioh that uses those rules to create a fresh and new experience, and i think it sucks when people write them off just because they're not into it. It's like if you went and tried to play one of the many alternative formats in magic that change the rules of the game to provide a different experience and then someone went and said "That's not real magic, you should play modern instead" disregarding the fact that people LIKE alternative formats and we should encourage that more often, not disregard them.

@ryuuohdeltaplus7936

5 ай бұрын

He's pretty much wrong about Rush Duel, it's a completely different game created because OCG is too high power to attract younger audiences

@Anotherbaka999

5 ай бұрын

Also it's kinda weird how he says it when he's as much of an edison fan as he is Edison also has different rules, erratas that you have to learn or check constantly, and it plays so different to the current TCG that the amount of differences is comparable to what we have with the other formats I love edison, but I find it weird how you can be into it without also at least understanding why those other formats are attractive for other people

21:25-22:10 that, right there, explains EVERYTHING about my feelings about this article.

Thankyou for talking about the normal monster pull, as some who loves structures and trying to introduce my friends to the game hence strutcures again when we get normal cards that aren't even the biggest beatsticks it's a mega turn off.

Realistically, the biggest barrier preventing more people from getting into YGO is sheer volume of cards you need to learn before you can even TRY to play at a competitive level. Like, you can netdeck a competitive deck, but you can't begin to pilot it well unless you know your opponents deck as well. I can have a few negates on board, but unless I understand their combos, I have no idea when to use them. And the only way to learn a deck is to play against it several times, but the variety of archetypes available means that I could play for 2 hours on Master Duel and not play against the same deck twice. I've tried several times to get into 'real' YGO, but ultimately I've decided it's just not in the cards (pun intended) for me. I feel like the only way you're playing YGO in 2024 is if you've played throughout the years, so your card base knowledge isn't starting at 0.

@arobnugzo6818

5 ай бұрын

I will be honest, I don't think even that was enough for me to learn a deck. Like, I actively have to look up combos of decks I feel like I wanna beat, sometimes matches with/against those decks from dbgrinder or what not, and even "where to handtrap" vids for those relevant decks at times for TCG. Which kinda helped me learn new decks and enjoy more playstyles, but I 100% understand it is an investment most ppl would not be willing to make.

@Angelite1209

5 ай бұрын

That's what i thought too. Konami needs to do somewhat like a Reset and start again from the beginning. They need to slow down on creating new archetypes and instead revisit weaker older archetypes and make them better. Releasing too many new archetypes can overwhelm competitive players and especially new players. Also, Konami shouldn't create another summoning mechanic for a Very Long time until YuGiOh can get back up on its two feet. In doing so, it won't further complicate the game and stabilize the game. Current and beginning players can catch up and hone their skills.

I just want physical TCG Rush duels. Goat and Edison draft boxes would be wonderful

@SirFailsalot91

5 ай бұрын

You and me both, we've got Rush Duel format digitally TWICE, but just like the DLC for "Dawn of the Battle Royale," the physical Rush Duel card game is stuck in Asia with no signs of being released globally.

I think another aspect that many people don’t consider very often when getting into yugioh is that certain deck builds are more fun to play than others and what a player interprets as fun changes drastically from player to player regardless if they are “meta”. For instance I still love using and editing my Branded Despia deck, pre banlist tear was also pretty fun. These decks were both part of the meta when they were constructed. On the other hand I still keep around my old dragon maid deck simply because I find it simple and fun to use regardless of how much it would be destroyed at locals. Heck my Blue Eyes chaos max dragon deck (which I sometimes combine with my dragon maid deck) has seen some of what I would consider the most fun duels I’ve ever had despite the fact any blue eyes deck build has been far from competitively viable.

I have this game as new comer, i only just watch the anime when i was a kid and wanna try game for the first time a as newcomer but some of the veteran called me "yugibooomer" and not understanding "modern yugioh" at all while all i want is play simple yugioh using Dark magician / Blue eyes deck. They summon everything and anything in one turn and i never got a chance to play any single card. Like about 20 summons in one turn and set up every negate possible and yet they somehow can interrupt it and summon monsters again when it's LITERALLY MY OWN TURN to play. It feels like most of the gameplay is like solitaire where they play the card by themselves. But i still find good things that there are others wanting me to help and understand the game better but it was very overwhelming from the summoning mechanic (ritual, synchro, xyz, link, pendulum) to hidden ruling for a card (like if vs when) that can cause a miss timing, etc and decided to stick to the goat formant and learn more yugioh from there.

Technically speaking, Yu-Gi-Oh is one of the TCGs most available to new players, and that's Only thanks to the different entry options. You can start With Master Duel, Duel Links, The physical card pool, unofficial simulators like EDOPro, and even other official videogames It has more options than other Trading card games like Vanguard, Digimon, Pokenon, One Oiece, Magic the Gathering or the new Disney one Lorecana. If we talk about only the physical card game, that's another story entirely

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

I'll take YGO Omega or EDOpro over MTG's Cockatrice any day.

@IrrelevantOaf

5 ай бұрын

I generally dislike every other tcg besides yugioh because they all follow some kind of mana system. I would love to see an actual new tcg that isn't just a Magic or Hearthstone clone.

@Nephalem2002

4 ай бұрын

@@wickederebusyeah that’s my biggest problem with Magic. NO GOOD FAN SIMULATORS

@wickederebus

4 ай бұрын

@@Nephalem2002 I am continually flabbergasted that the game (Magic) designed to work as closely to code in a computer program utterly fails to have players devoted enough to code their own simulator.

@Nephalem2002

4 ай бұрын

@@wickederebus might be a case of WOTC not allowing them to. You remember what happened with the Pinkertons right?

4:55 All the examples you list here came out in the first 5-10 years of the franchise existing. All the games you listed are from 20 years ago, of course they're going to be weird. Doing a quick google search, this is what I found: Sacred Cards: July, 2002 Forbidden Memories: December, 1999. Duelist of the Roses: Septermber 2001 Reshef of Destruction: June, 2004 Compared this to World championship 2006, every example I listed came out at most 5 years after the franchise was made. Nightmare Troubadour (A game a bit more like the actual card game): July, 2005. Tag Force: September 2006 Not to mention the other types of Dueling Simulators on consoles, there was even one on the Game Boy Color, so there were games like that. Most Modern Yugioh video games are dueling simulators, so... yeah, not helping your point. I think Yu-Gi-Oh is a bit complex for new players (and can sometimes be expensive to play a viable deck, not everyone can afford 80 bucks on a bunch of cards even for a "mostly" viable deck), but the examples you gave for side-games being gimmicky and "Yugioh-flavored" are bad because of their age and being from the game's relative infancy, they were experimenting with things and figuring out what worked and what didn't. Not to mention, some of them aren't even the same genre, are thus Spin-offs. Capsule Monsters Colosseum, Dungeon Dice Monsters... not good examples to use here. Franchises do that all the time. Pokémon (Mystery Dungeon is a Rogue-like, Ranger is more like an Action-RPG), Mario (Mario Party, Kart, Mario+Rabbids is an X-com like tactical turn-based game), Digimon (RPGs, Fighting Games, Monster Raising Simulators), Mega Man (RPGs), Pacman (Platformers), Final Fantasy (Racing) Dragon Quest (Monster Capture, Mystery Dungeon, crossed over with Mario and made something like Monopoly) Crash Bandicoot (Racing, Party) They aren't the same as the main series, and might get people invested in that type of Genre, but it's more about spreading the franchise out into different genres to make more profit in that area. They are bad examples for this video and probably didn't even need to be mentioned. They aren't Yugioh, but they were either not intended to *be* Yugioh, just have a Yugioh coat of paint, or were from a time when the Franchise was really young. Or both.

@Anotherbaka999

5 ай бұрын

Also yugioh started as a manga about games in general so it makes sense that the first iteration of the card game didn't had rules set in stone (as it was meant to appear like once or twice) or that the game designers would have taken creative choices when approaching it Or just straight up adapt one of the other games from the manga

@N12015

3 ай бұрын

Isn't Yugioh the franchise and the game Duel Monsters?

They had a good thing going with the legendary decks series, where they had 3 character archetypes per box for something like 30 bucks. Would love if they brought it back

Gotta be honest im far less likely to play the TCG with master duel out. I cant possibly expect to play as a novice and know my opponent is following the rules correctly....missed timings, spell speed, chain blocking?.....yeah i need a digital client to hold my hand 🤣

I like when you speak your mind about topics like this in a video

One thing about yugioh that kind of turns me off at times is that the game can feel very samey and repetitive. As someone who plays both yugioh and magic the gathering, often times in yugioh, because you're tutoring (searching) so much, a lot of times your decks become so hyper consistent, your gameplan can be the exact same every time. And its not just combo decks either. I think another thing is master duel is even moreso samey due to the existence of a certain bug that makes the game feel almost like a chore at times, where in magic the gathering, for example, tutors are kind of hard to come by, and are balanced by mana costs, and I think it opens up a lot of different playstyles and games can play out completely different even in the instance of a best two out of three match. I initially quit mtg and came back to yugioh because of mtg's over saturation with pumping out new products like once a week (a problem konami seems to mimic these days funnily enough) and also i was not enjoying the universe's beyond crap they were doing, but i've been kind of leaning back in to magic the gathering as of late and been having more fun playing it than i have yugioh.

5:30 man i love Falsebound kingdom I enjoyed that game so much

Yes, the competitive solitaire game where you have to spend more time learning to play a deck than actually playing it is a super enjoyable new player experience.

xyz is what got me into learning the rules of yugioh

LMAO, almost all the Yugioh players that I used to play with are playing Pokemon TCG now, including myself.

@Mr_Mistah

4 ай бұрын

I quit Yu Gi Oh for Weiss Schwarz

I will say, I got back into yugioh cause some friends had downloaded and started playing Duel Links back in 2017. Then started watching Doug and Rata's videos, and then when you started the progression series, I got back into the TCG. So I think there's merit to Konami using "Yugioh Lite" to at least get returning players back in

The problem with Yu-Gi-Oh is that there is no fundamental cap on what you can do on a given turn. Sure, you only get one draw and one normal, but every deck gets a billion searches and specials The other problem is that every card reads like a novel

@geek593

5 ай бұрын

The modern game is built around breaking the game's basic rules completely. Every other problem flows from this design ethos.

@ducky36F

5 ай бұрын

No we don’t need mana. Being able to play what you draw is part of the fun of this game. We just need actually balanced cards instead of the game being broken again every 6 months.

@geek593

5 ай бұрын

@@ducky36F Cards can't easily go plus if you can play them all out of your hand. Making everything go plus on resolution has led to the situation we're in now.

@ignisbad9158

5 ай бұрын

@@ducky36F At least cap the summons or something. If you can just do everything turn 1 all of the time games are solo. That being said, I think, on hindsight, cards reading like a novel is far worse

@randomprotag9329

5 ай бұрын

other card games apply a mechanical brake like pokemon has once per turn supporters and only 1 atk per turn, magic has mana. its technically possible to regulate the game with an card specific brake but it requires hyper awareness that's easy to mess up even its not konami doing it. card specific regualtion is even less possible with external formats since theres no in built brake to rein in interactions that were exetremely easy to miss.

YGO's all easy to explain until you get to Pendulums. And until you actually play it.

if an article says things like " more welcoming than ever" you know it's the oppossite

12:57 i want turbo duel format because the only thing that needed is speed spells you can use everything else (monster, traps) and just have be edison format and i think it would be a fun game mode similar to world champ 5ds games 2009-2011

speaking of formats, I wonder what would be cimo's thoughts are on a yugioh singleton/highlander style format, I think it would promote more skill/knowledge in card choice, and alot of fun if it were multiplayer like MTG commander (3+ players)

@stefanokic406

5 ай бұрын

Multiple people would be very unbalanced. Cause whoever goes last is just doomed cause everyone gets a bp before them. In magic its fine because its slower and takes time to build your board. In yugioh even non archetypal cards can be easily put on the field for hugeee damage

@onryu

5 ай бұрын

@@stefanokic406 easy fix- no attacks on each player's first turn

@stefanokic406

5 ай бұрын

@@onryu well yes of course but the next turn you also go last and everybody has a battle phase before you. I just dont think it works well in ygo

@onryu

5 ай бұрын

@@stefanokic406 I played tag duels & free for alls at locals, seemed fine, the first person to attack also has one less card than everyone else, you have 3 opponents, so if someone tries for a big play, high chance someone has a counter if not all 3 opponents, it felt balanced, versus one sided 1 v 1 matches

I'm an old player and the complexity of modern Yugioh stops me from ever returning. Walls of text, countless long-winded combos and games that are decided by turn 1. I'd rather watch Lithium or the Prog Series to get my fix.

I have been thinking about a way to make it easier for new players to come into Yugioh without it being too stressful and be put against some of the modern best decks. A pick up and play format for master duel I think would be really helpful for new players and a good way to take a break from the current format if you are feeling really tired of it. Learning the game in the best of worlds should be fun. The best alternative to learn Yugioh should not be needing to go into retro style of the game and be shocked when the actual game is extremely combo heavy. Having a second step between a basic understanding of all the summoning mechanics and the competitive version of the game is at this point is a must have.

I come from MTG and I've been playing for a couple days on Master Duel and its a blast. Solo mode really helps make the game more digestible. For those not experienced with card games I think format progression would do wonders in making it even easier to grasp. I tried getting into yugioh via a friend a long time ago and it was just hard to understand.

Current game yugioh is not new player friendly and i'm happy with people starting with low powered formats. I would preffer someone started at edison than current time yugioh because ain't no way you get to know all interactions of the rip.

@duduvec5971

5 ай бұрын

Also yugioh lite is more than enough yugioh to get someone started.

@wickederebus

5 ай бұрын

​@@duduvec5971yeah, watered down drugs are usually strong enough to get someone to be an addict.