Comment for mistakes and additional nuance. When it comes to apologies, many people think individual Dutch are being asked to apologise for the slave trade. This is not the case. It is the Dutch government apologising. As representatives of the state that has existed for hundreds of years. Portugal wasn't part of the yougov poll, so I unfortunately don't have data for that! At 02:40 I say the Netherlands was the first country to legalise abortion. This is false. It should have said, 'one of the first countries'.

@Giftedbryan

10 ай бұрын

While I agree that individual Dutch residents shouldn't have to apologize, and it should be more on large companies that had the most benefit of slavery, I, A Dutch citizen, will apologize anyway. (and yeah, I know this is not the platform for that, but if prompted, I will apologize again if need be.)

@lars4357

10 ай бұрын

This might be a grey area which you are pointing out. It is true that individual Dutch people don't have to apologize. However, the Dutch government wanted to apologize by sending ministers to former colonies mainly Surinam and Carribean Islands. One minister who was a descendant of a slave he wanted to apologize for the Dutch government in Surinam. The people from Surinam and Surinam activists didn't want him to apologize because he was a descendant of a slave. They preferred a white minister apologizing. Therefore, he was not recognized as a representative of the Dutch government. This makes apologies very personal and less governmental.

@Schurkie505

10 ай бұрын

@@Giftedbryan Why apologize?, you didn't do anything wrong, no way i will apologize for something only a few wealthy families did.

@kimashitawa8113

10 ай бұрын

​@@Schurkie505Exactly, most regular people here were poor. Even had people living in mud huts in the east, what reason do their descendants have to apologise?

@HelloWorld-dv2tg

10 ай бұрын

Just wanted to point something out, in English the decimals are written with a point and thousands are separated by commas. I know numbers are written differently in mainland Europe, but in English, one thousand dollars and 25 cents would be written as $1,000.25 and not $1.000,25.

7:47 For non-Dutch viewers, 'liberal' in the Netherlands is mostly associated free markets (and corporate welfare), rather than social-liberalism.

@BedroomBully88

9 ай бұрын

It’s social liberalism The VVD literally went from very right to very left in the span of 10 years

@KarlSnarks

9 ай бұрын

@@BedroomBully88 No they didn't, they're still very clearly right-wing.

@erik7853

9 ай бұрын

@@KarlSnarks als ze echt rechts waren zaten we nu niet in de immigartie apocalyps

@jamesschutte7984

9 ай бұрын

​​@@erik7853ls jouw brein echt functioneerde zou je deze comment niet hebben geplaatst

@jamesschutte7984

9 ай бұрын

​@@BedroomBully88 they are about as left wing as the amount of grass you touched in the past 10 days Spoilers! it's zero

I'm Indonesian and even though colonization is better just not exisiting, the Dutch has treated us better in their 300 years of colonization than the Japanese in their 3 years of occupation edit: it seems the reply section has turned into an active warzone

@Kenneth_James

10 ай бұрын

The Japanese paid many times over for their crimes in flames and nuclear bombs.

@driesvanoosten4417

10 ай бұрын

What I will never understand, is that after being occupied ourselves, we went back to Indonesia and committed terrible attrocities...

@tymanung6382

10 ай бұрын

@@driesvanoosten4417 Many people, individuals + groups,.are in in--- between poaition--- at same time, oppressed + oppressors---the attitude of freedom + independence ONLY for SELVES----- they demand freedom to destroy others' freedom.

@TricaGamer

10 ай бұрын

imagine saying that slavery under one country is better than slavery to another

@nyxiebrizto

10 ай бұрын

Japan stole nothing --> "evil" Dutch sucking your blood for more than 300 years ---> "omg, they're so nice"

The reason German colonial history isn't talked about much is because their colonial empire only really lasted 3 decades before their territories were seized during WW1. It was really the shortest lived colonial empire of any significant size.

@MisterKackhaufen

3 күн бұрын

I also want to add: In the german school system we talk excessively about the crimes of tha nazis. If there is any time left it is usually spend on the crimes of the communist eastern half. There is basically no time left in the german curriculum to talk about colonialism.

@cosmosyn2514

2 күн бұрын

i imagine this is a topic that will be discussed more in the future where the nazi period is far enough behind that it wont have as much of a central focus in german history & education.

@MisterKackhaufen

2 күн бұрын

​@@cosmosyn2514 I dont think so. The period of german colonozation was very short and limited. We do mention it in the history classes but we talk much more about other colonial empires. The system was the same in german colonies but the scale is just too small to really show all the effects of colonization. German colonozation is something that affected hundreds of thousands but WW2 and the holocaust affected tens of millions of people (all victims + soldier + civilians) and WW2 shaped the way the modern world works today. Its much more relevant.

2:40 Actually the Soviet Union was the first country to legalise abortion

@darias.4440

2 ай бұрын

Yep, also noticed that

Why wasn't Portugal included in the poll? That's odd, considering that country was one of the first, and last, European colonial powers to exist. And I would bet a million dollars that if the same poll was done on the Portuguese, up to 70% of the respondents would be "proud of their former colonial empire".

@avantelvsitania3359

10 ай бұрын

Of course we are proud. We can't judge the morality of those times. The small isolated nation that "gave new worlds to the World"

@robto

10 ай бұрын

@@avantelvsitania3359 Portugal implemented a policy of forced labor upon Black Africans until the 1960s. This is way within the timeline where such practices were considered immoral worldwide.

@avantelvsitania3359

10 ай бұрын

@@robto yes, there were immoral practices, and those should be condemn, after careful analysis. But that doesn't mean we have to condemn our Empire as "intrinsically evil". That's not the way to look at things

@robto

10 ай бұрын

@@avantelvsitania3359 by the same token, I also don't think anyone should feel "proud" of having a colonial Empire either.

@YouTubesucksdix

10 ай бұрын

Too small, not worth mentioning

I think it comes from the perspective the Dutch saw themselves as the under dog when it comes to the age of colonialism. Like fighting for your Independence from Spain (the superpower at the time) and being able to rival bigger powers greater than themselves such as England and France. While make a success of it. I think the fact you mentioned it as "cherry picking" the best bits is part of it because it's hard bitter pill to swallow. Many people rather be proud of something than be shameful it.

@roelofjacobs5807

10 ай бұрын

Good point regarding the Dutch viewing themselves as the underdog! As to the cherry picking, no doubt that this plays a role. However , I am also convinced that this cherry picking happens on the other side of the debate as well. Cause to me it feels strange that it appears that only the West is supposed to apologize for slavery. How do you look at the latter? Do you feel that other nations aught to apologize for slavery as well? If so, why or why not? ____ As to be proud instead of being shameful, on a national level I suspect it is also necessary to some degree. These days ideologies appears to want to divide us, putting us in different boxes. This I think is harmful because why would you care about a person in another box?.. well, there is this larger more important box called 'nationality', and inside that larger box we aught to treat people fairly as they are fellow citizens and that is how fellow citizens should treat each other.

@Potjandorie

10 ай бұрын

It is also true that all sides are cherry picking, even this video has a lot of cherry picking. As many facts about Africa's part in (black) slave trade are rarely mentioned, how Europeans were enslaved in huge numbers in Africa and Asia, or how Europeans were the first to not only end slavery in their own countries, but also forced nations worldwide to do the same. Furthermore, there is not a country in the world that can truly be proud of their history, most can't even be proud of their present. You can be proud of a country and still acknowledge all that went wrong, which the vast majority does. Anyway, I truly believe we are heading in the right direction and lets hope that a generation sooner rather than later will finally be able to live together without worrying about the color of one's skin.

@fongangamassana6034

10 ай бұрын

@@roelofjacobs5807you are right that other nations have bad history too, and history with slavery. But in all honesty, very little know about slavery in other parts of the world due to the recent history of western slavery and imperialism and most importantly, it’s scope and ideology. This channel already made a video addressing that. The scope of western slavery ( global ) and the ideology behind it ( that the others weren’t human ) truly put it in a class of its own , and that largely overshadows the history of slavery in other parts of the world , slavery committed by other groups and nations . That’s just it . There’s no doubt others did it , and at some point it should be addressed , but western slavery still has a bigger impact today than anything else and the ideology that drove it still persists.

@roelofjacobs5807

10 ай бұрын

@@fongangamassana6034 I think I disagree with you. I do agree with: When you argue that there is a link to thinking that people from Africa are lesser people and slavery, in the west this indeed happened. My suspicion as to how that came to be; in Western Europe slavery was frowned upon. The way to justify the buying and selling of slaves was done with some mental (racists) gymnastics. Some caveats to your position: 1) The idea that other people are lesser people, is not something typical Western. The link with racism and slavery might be typical Western, but neither racism nor slavery is. 2) To the best of my knowledge, the Arab slave trade was more gruesome than the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. It also involved roughly the same amount of Africans, albeit over a much longer period of time (know that the men were usually castrated). So I reject your notion that the Western slave trade overshadowed the rest.* 3) Know that "It are Christian dogs" was a way that Northern Africans justified putting people from Europe on galleys. This by the way was also a more gruesome form of slavery than the Trans-Atlantic slave trade. *Know that the British played a large role in dismantling this slave trade. Also, Europeans were still being made slave and sold in the Arab slave trade long after Europe and the United States abolished slavery.

@SEAZNDragon

10 ай бұрын

@@roelofjacobs5807 I suspect the pressure is on the West due to many of the political and business entireties that benefitted from slavery. I can't name any Africans companies that got there start as slave traders. Not to mention the lack of a pan African identity during the time of the trans-Atlantic slave trade. Even then I do think some of the academics is turning on that. Case in point the movie the Woman King got flack for portraying the African female warriors as freeing slaves when in reality they captured other African tribes to sell into slavery. Apparently when Lupita Nyong'o found this out while doing a documentary on the warriors she dropped out of Woman King.

Dutch king: we bring back colonialism. Dutch people: yaaaay King: Now we are colony of Spain

9:30 I love how addressing the value Dutch people hold for the remembrance of WW2 helped remembrance of slavery and colonialism hit home for the prime minister. Sometimes there is a clear truth that is hard for people to acknowledge, but using good parallels in the things they already find important can help bring them into that place of effective sympathy. Excellent work by that spokeswoman there!

@urhunn7778

7 ай бұрын

Problem is, the trans atlantic slave trade was done by Jewish traders.

@drewgehringer7813

6 ай бұрын

@@urhunn7778 No, it wasn't, the few jewish people involved are not enough to magically outweigh the european christian majority they were surrounded by. cute attempt to redirect blame onto europe's favorite scapegoat group though, I'm sure you've at least fooled yourself!

@urhunn7778

6 ай бұрын

Can you tell me what was the reason why there were no slave markets open on Saturdays in America?@@drewgehringer7813

@vaporware4099

5 ай бұрын

@@urhunn7778 ah man blaming the jews a classic trick 🙄

@user-tz5wj3ez7u

5 ай бұрын

Don't let it fool you. This is the only non-racist thing she has ever said. She was the only seat her BIJ1 had and their only views are racist claims like ''black people are by percentage less often police agents so when sollicitating they must be priorised above white men'' and that kind of shit. She never had real arguments, could only talk about skin colour and when a member of her party supported ''Kill the Boer'' (South-African movement to kill white South-Africans) she did not openly distantiate or something. Biggest racist in our parliament in many many years.

My grandmother who died a few weeks ago at 99 was born and spend her childhood while Indonesia was still a Dutch colony. It is all not that long ago as a lot of people think.

@ThePresentPast_

10 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing, it is very recent still

@franknwogu4911

10 ай бұрын

RIP

@KarlSnarks

9 ай бұрын

Yeah in historical terms it's incredibly recent.

@rey_nemaattori

9 ай бұрын

I have various friends whose parent were born in colonial Indonesia, just as my dad was born in colonial Surinam.

@leviturner3265

9 ай бұрын

I watched a video and somewhere in Africa they are still widely using a road the Germans built over a hundred years ago. The present day occupiers of that nation should be grateful The Germans colonized the area so they could have a road. Same for most places that were ever colonized. South Africa is no exception, it was the most heavily colonized area, and was the most developed part of Africa. Until the end of Apartheid South Africa was a developing nation, unfortunately now it is an undeveloped nation. Although it still is the most developed in Africa.

There is a difference between "colonial pride", and not feeling the need to apologise for something you had absolutely nothing to do with.

@vanguard1346

9 ай бұрын

"yeah and even though the state today benefits from it doesn't mean we should have to get on our knees and appreciate it since WE told them to do it!"

@EduardoSilva-yp7ob

9 ай бұрын

Citizens don't need it, state representatives do, there's nothing wrong with that, a random person has nothing to do with what happened, but the state recognizing the horrible things employed by it is a necessary thing.

@shankieinthefridge

9 ай бұрын

If you had absolutely nothing to do with any of it, why would you be proud of the one and refuse to acknowledge the other?

@sebe2255

9 ай бұрын

@@shankieinthefridgeBecause being proud > being ashamed That is what it boils down to for all people. It is the same reason why you’ll never hear Africans apologize for their role in various slave trades but they will be proud of their nations or tribes

@TheSaintArmando

9 ай бұрын

@shankieinthefridge I think that you misunderstood my statement. The title in the video claims that there is a huge amount of colonial pride in the Netherlands because they did a survey, and 50 % was not willing to apologise for it. Just because people don't want to apologise for something does not mean that they are proud of it. Also, "VOC mentaliteit" has nothing to do with colonialism in the way that people talk about it today. It is hinting towards our traders' mentality.

Still waiting for the Turks to apologize to every Balkan country

@Sava.S

6 күн бұрын

They dream of invading again

@Natalietransfem

Күн бұрын

Turks wouldn’t even apologize to themselves if they colonized themselves.

As an Indonesian, most of or frankly all of the apologies from the Dutch are about the War Crimes they've committed trying to retake and stabilize Indonesia after Japanese Surrender and won't take a formal Independence as an answer. While that was bad, we're chill now, the Colonial days may be bad but the actions known as "Agresi Militer" (Military Aggression) was frankly more brutal.

@LucvValen

7 ай бұрын

Are you talking about the politionele acties?

@krackokrag

7 ай бұрын

@@LucvValen Yep, I was talking about that.

@blue.berry.

6 ай бұрын

This could potentially change with our new government after this years elections. We have had the same prime minister (Mark Rutte) for the last 13 years. His father and mother are Indisch (Orang Indo, Indo European). His father had been in a Japanese camp during WW2 (interestingly losing his first wife there, and his mother is the younger sister of the first wife). So it is a very personal topic to him. I personally believe therefore apologies were first made to Indonesia instead of to Suriname, and also why its mostly focussed on the moment after WW2. It could also be because most Indonesian and Indo descendants in the Netherlands left Indonesia after the Agresi Militer and fought on the Dutch side, so its very important for them because they left the country because of it. So there are a lot of personal reasons for the one sided apology, but I notice people start to also focus more on the colonial past in Indonesia after this focus on Suriname. Maybe with a new PM the apologies for the colonial past will be made.

@teaser6089

5 ай бұрын

​@@blue.berry.hahaha no, there is nothing to apologize for? The people that currently live in Surinam have not suffered and at the same time are opressing en population of the land...

@blue.berry.

5 ай бұрын

@@teaser6089 I'm not saying that individuals should apologise to other individuals. But our government should definitely apologise to the former colony countries. Its not about the present day population, but acknowledging that what a former government did was wrong and as the new government you will learn from those mistakes and make sure it wont happen again. Just ignoring what happened makes it seem like you approve, while apologies show that you disapprove. It is bad for the relationship, and we share a lot of history and culture with these countries. We are stronger as friends, than as enemies.

Would love to see a video on the Dutch relationship with South Africa in the 20th century, especially with the emergence of the system of apartheid.

@Larsino2000

10 ай бұрын

Good. after the rule of the british in 19th century the dutch supported equality in south africa and fought as allies in WW2. The netherlands was the only western country to support anti-apartheid.

@Airmee

10 ай бұрын

​@@Larsino2000 Interesting. Considering the fact Dutch established class-system in their own colonies in the Indies, with First-class citizens were Europeans, the Chinese and Arabs became second-class, while indigenous were third class.

@Intel-i7-9700k

10 ай бұрын

@@Airmee If you are trying to compare a fairly typical colonial class system to Apartheid, as you seem to want to imply without actually saying it, then that is a comparison that will not go very far.

@Airmee

10 ай бұрын

@@Intel-i7-9700k Well, apartheid originates from the same underlying cause and within the same temporal framework/timeline.

@randar1969

10 ай бұрын

@@Airmee Nelson Mandela said thanks to the Netherlands for their support against apartheid that should should be enough. Our dutch decendent settlers caused Apartheid that's very true as well! There is no denying that fact. And we were one of the first countries that helped the ANC to get rid of it. We still till today have colonies but those colonies where all given the choice if they wanted to stay with us, became semi independed own government and currency own police and soldiers but the Netherlands still responsible for governmental issues , or break away and go independent. If one of them no longer wants to be part of us they only have to ask and have a referandum for it.

As a Dutch person, I think when people celebrate the Golden Age and talk about the VOC mentality they are not specifically talking about slavery. But rather about the trading, the conquest and the go-getter mentality. I dont know much about mongolia but they probably are very proud of Genghis Khan even though he did a lot of bad stuff. Or the Greeks with Alexander the Great. This is just my thought on this, if anyone has a different perspective I'm open to hear about it

@KL-zt6jx

9 ай бұрын

As another Dutch person. And Dutch people like to dismiss black and brown peoples experiences and the bad parts of the VOC history. They only pay attention to the money and not where the money came from. I've got plenty of experiences with people overt and hidden racism. And it's still current unfortunately.

@DrTheRich

9 ай бұрын

Little fact for you, dutch slavery started at the end of what is commonly considered the golden age. I think it's more appropriate to say that the dutch went the route of slavery to make up for the dissapearing wealth and power that came with the century long downfall of the dutch empire after the period of fortune ended. in short, the golden age, the VOC and the country itself weren't founded on slavery, but turned towards it in a time of moral weakness, to eventually realize the error of their ways and ban it.

@willjapheth23789

9 ай бұрын

Genghis Khan has his own holiday, so I don't know that they do have any issue with what he did. But it's understandable for them to celebrate Mongolian success. The Dutch however can't do such things because they are wealthy or something.

@KL-zt6jx

9 ай бұрын

@@DrTheRich Ik heb het niet alleen over de slavenhandel, maar ook over de kolonisatie en het verleden in het algemeen. De regering (en dus de vertegenwoordigers van de huidige en verleden staat) hebben jarenlang gezegd dat excuses niet hoeft. En dat gaf natuurlijk het signaal af aan iedereen (en de Nederlandse bevolking) dat zwarte piet als slaven afbeelden goed en normaal was. Dat is waar het om gaat. Gelukkig komt daar de laatste jaren verandering in, maar het heeft wel heeel lang geduurt voor een land dat zich als tolerant probeert te presenteren. Het is niet alleen het verleden, maar juist de effecten ervan. Maar we zijn in ieder geval op het juiste pad.

@MinisterPresident

9 ай бұрын

@@DrTheRich “moral weakness” the only moral weakness I see is nowadays, with mental health crisis, and the pretend victimhood. Men acting like females and women acting like males. That is moral weakness, bUt wE hAvE To AccEPt tHEm FoR wHO tHeY ARe.

As a black Jamaican-American, I think it's important to learn about the past, but quite stupid to expect present day Whites to apologize to me, or anyone else for that matter, for the actions of their ancestors. I'm no more a victim of slavery than they are perpetrators of slavery. The only persons owed an apology are the actual victims that suffered, and since they've been dead for centuries, making a big public apology spectacle is nothing more than a silly and futile exercise in virtue signaling. I am not a victim, I am not oppressed and I'm not aware of any advantages, rights and privileges white people have that I do not likewise enjoy. The best possible reparation is not cash, but equality. We need to stop wasting time weeping about the past and just get on with life. Be the best, be the most brilliant and be most accomplished person you can be - that's the true legacy of our ancestors.

@roejogan2693

9 ай бұрын

Based

@TSERJI

9 ай бұрын

well said

@ddjt8457

9 ай бұрын

As a Jamaican-American this person does not speak for us. Totally ignorant and sounds like a kiss-up and apologist for White Supremacy.

@ATGC256

9 ай бұрын

😅

@andrewwesterman7827

8 ай бұрын

Mate, you may have black skin, but you are a white colonialist if you think that intergenerational trauma doesn't exist and that countries like the Netherlands are not privileged as a result of slavery. If you suffer in any way because of the slavery of your ancestors or have less advantages in America, the fact is you are still the victim, regardless of whether you accept this fact. The first step in decolonising is telling the truth.

Much like the Dutch, the Portuguese also are proud of their past. Back in the day those travels could be compared to going to the moon and returning.

@user-ln6fz4dk6j

7 ай бұрын

I get your point, but Neil Armstrong didn't murder any moonmen.

@lindabb7064

5 ай бұрын

@@user-ln6fz4dk6j I'm still stunned how some people are blind to atrocities.

@beasley1232

5 ай бұрын

So they are proud of their Brazilian Mills ? 🤨

@PressA2Die

Ай бұрын

@@user-ln6fz4dk6j Eh, I've seen protests of disenfranchised minorities in America in the 60's complaining that money on the space race was wasted and not funnelled to welfare, thus letting their children starve. Anything can be spun into a guilt trip narrative if you try hard enough.

@Sxntii11

Ай бұрын

@@user-ln6fz4dk6j lol

"The highest number off ALL european colonial empires" Portugal after starting the discovery age, ruling the indic ocean and defeating the otomans various times but still not apearing in the map: bruhh

@roejogan2693

10 ай бұрын

Also conveniently only mentioning the European empires, and not the other big ones in Africa and Asia

@iattacku2773

10 ай бұрын

@@roejogan2693nobody else really had an overseas colonial empire except for maybe Japan and the US.

@timobrenn

10 ай бұрын

@@iattacku2773 Does it have to be overseas to be colonialism and slavery? Slave trade is a part of every empire in history. I find it absurd that the west is almost solely getting the blame for slavery when we were one of the only regions that stopped practicing it.

@abcdefg91111

10 ай бұрын

@@timobrenn we forget one thing: we abolished slavery in the 1800s but not even 10 years later we colonized Africa. So i wouldn't be proudly saying "we abolished slavery thus we're good" or something like that.

@timobrenn

10 ай бұрын

@@abcdefg91111 I'm not saying the west hasnt done bad things or hasn't been hypocritical at points. However i think being the only real region abolishing those acts should not be completely disregarded. it might not have been good but it is definitely alot better than not abolishing slavery. (if there were other larger regions that did the same i'd love to know about them btw)

Super interesting video, but just a correction: the Netherlands weren't the first to legalise abortion. The Soviet Union legalised it as early as 1920. This was later reversed by Stalin, but it began legal again in the 1950s. This was still far earlier than in the Netherlands, where it was more or less tolerated (gedoogd) from the late 1960s onwards and officially legalised in 1984. The 1970s saw other countries such as Denmark, West Germany and France legalising it as well. So no, the Netherlands weren't the first!

@zimriel

9 ай бұрын

Stalin wasn't ALL bad.

@ekesandras1481

9 ай бұрын

They didn't only legalize it, they promoted it as the prefered form of birth control. Soviet women often had five to ten abortions in their life or even more. Stalin only stopped this policy for some years, because he needed higher birth rates to fill the ranks of the Red Army.

@pejo620

9 ай бұрын

In Spain, abortion for any cause until the 12th week was legalized in Catalonia (1936) and the rest of the Second Spanish Republic territory (1937) during the Spanish Civil War. It didn't last much though, as when Franco won the war, abortion became illegal again. It wasn't until well into Franco's death and the restoration of democracy when it was legalized again (1985), but even then the law only permitted abortion in very specific circumstances. It wouldn't be until 2010 when we would have a regulation regarding abortion as progressive as the one from the Second Spanish Republic.

@sch4891

9 ай бұрын

yes. stalin made is illegal because the ussr lost 27 million people and needed to increase the population of the country again

@arazatliyev6564

9 ай бұрын

Wow,l wouldnt really know this😳 İt is very interesting for me.but l asked you: "Why?" Why at first time ussr and socialist government in spain tried to doing this? What was cause?"

"Top 5 Slaver traders" Somehow doesn't include any non-western country.

@cosmosyn2514

2 күн бұрын

maybe we’re better at record keeping

5:52 this black man is from the Ashanti tribe, whose tribe made slaves, had slaves, and sold slaves first to Arabs later to Europeans. This person had a big mouth to the Dutch about slavery but his tribe became very rich from selling slaves. And in fact he was proud of it. His name is Akwasi

1:00 to be fair. That wasn't much of a pro-colonial statement in the context of the full debate at all. He was more so using the VOC as an example for out of the box thinking and taking risks. Was it insensitive? Maybe. (You can hear a large part booing against that statement a moment after he said that, which was cut from the video.) But I feel like it's a tad misleading to couple that quote with the message of the video. Otherwise fantastic video. Your production quality is really, really high.

@JABN97

10 ай бұрын

I wanted to say the exact same things

@kykale

10 ай бұрын

True, Balkenende was referring to the entrepreneurial spirit of the VOC and how the Netherlands should economically be more confident. But this view is indicative of how ignorant the Dutch are about the VOC and that there's a blind spot when it comes to the knowledge about how the wealth was only possible by the subjugation of people.

@JABN97

10 ай бұрын

@@kykale indeed a demonstration of ignorance, which is lamentable. but not a demonstration of imperialist sentiment, which is abominable. an important distinction to make, when you are making sweeping statements regarding an entire country

@MtJochem

10 ай бұрын

​@@JABN97 It was not ignorance. The man studied history, so he was absolutely aware of the negative history of the organisation. At that time this wasn't of any concert to the public at large and the PM knew this. That is why he could make this statement and be celebrated for it as well.

@daarom3472

9 ай бұрын

the creator of this video is a complete amateur who has basically copy and pasted fragments out of context to paint a picture.

I'm from Portugal and we should just own up to what we did in the past. You can show pride towards your countries achievements, but the darker parts of history shouldn't be ignored or repressed. Propaganda already did a number on us in the past, and we can't let that happen again.

@thiagovidal8972

10 ай бұрын

É isso, muito mais honesto. Os colonizados só querem respeito e reconhecimento. É justo as pessoas tirarem foto da Torre Eiffel e sequer saberem quanto sangue haitiano custou ela? O que a frança e os EUA fizeram com Haiti e a Bèlgica com o Congo, foi genocídio.

@themongol1263

10 ай бұрын

Ive never heard an African apologise to Portugal for colonising your country for 700 years.

@themongol1263

10 ай бұрын

and it is going to happen again. as every year goes by, your country will become more African just like it did in al andalus. by 2060, u will be the minority in ur country and ur country will be majority Angolan and moroccan. as it was In the 1400s

@JohnCoolRoblox5754

10 ай бұрын

​@@themongol1263Yeah because Africans didn't conquer Iberia, Arabs did 🤦 Portugal didn't exist either it was the Visigoths.

@thiagovidal8972

10 ай бұрын

@@themongol1263 i don't remember to buy portuguese people, so we're are comparing a way different thing. One thing is the legit war, another is genocide and slavery. Which already was abolished in europe.

Well, actually the USSR was the first to legalize abortion.

@muhammedjaseemshajeef6781

Ай бұрын

So that's why some American politicians hate abortion

Black Dutch citizens who want to see money these days is not for recovering or emotional damage, it´s pure greed.

"top 5 slave traders" and you didn't include a single Arab country?

@luckyluciano1584

9 ай бұрын

Yeah Oman definitely never did anything in Africa, just the Europeans

@jaspervanhoudt2675

9 ай бұрын

All those slaves came from African countries aswell, shouldnt that fill the top with African countries if you add up all those European numbers. Selling is also trade after all xD

@asdawasda

9 ай бұрын

Africans also were the ones selling their own people to slavers

@mitch8072

9 ай бұрын

good point i dislike the video for that reson

@abdelkariml

9 ай бұрын

Cry harder

if your not from the netherlands, i would honestly just disregard this entire video. There are ofcourse allot of thrue points in the video, but allot of the things he says are twisted to further his political views.

Why should anyone apologize for something they had no part in, to people who did not have a part in it to?

Being from the UK i've always viewed 'Empire' as something impressive and awe-inspiring but at a cost. Many amazing things came out of it and for the UK it was great but someone out in the world had to foot that bill, literally but also in terms of their life and suffering. You really have to think about that.

@Hfil66

10 ай бұрын

The point is also to compare against historic empires. How would you compare more recent Dutch or British empires to the Roman Empire, over which we can have a more distant and detached perspective, but was very similar in so many ways?

@classicallpvault8251

10 ай бұрын

How? The lives of former colonial subjects of Britain dramatically improved. The British exported a common law system (which supplanted vastly morally inferior and often arbitrary tribal customs and facilitates peaceful resolution of conflicts rather than resorting to violence), built infrastructure, introduced irrigation technology allowing farming in formerly non-arable land, brought medical technology and motorised transport, and this allowed both for a dramatic increase in population numbers as well as a dramatic decrease in mortality and suffering. Colonialism was beneficial to the colonised people. And of course, they didn't have self-rule but they didn't have self-rule before, because either they had their own aristocracy exploiting the peasant classes (like in India) or were tribal in nature, where might made right and conflicts were usually settled through (genocidal) warfare.

@bruhbutwhytho2301

10 ай бұрын

@@classicallpvault8251have you ever heard of the famines caused by the British in India of Ireland? Or the genocide of the natives in the America’s or Australia? Or the slavery in the new world? The careless boundaries drawn in the Middle East and Africa? The Zulu or opium wars?

@Hfil66

10 ай бұрын

@@classicallpvault8251 what you are saying could as easily be said by Roman imperialists of the people they referred to as 'barbarians'. It is human nature to believe ones own culture is superior to everyone else's culture, but that is mere hubris. Irrigation of some sort has been around for millennia. They would have had as much self-rule as we have today (just ask the Scots or the Catalans if they think they have self rule; and even the Brits of the 18th century would not have had that much better. Many cultures did have some sort of monarchy, but often that monarchy would have been subject to oversight by some sort of aristocracy, much as would have been true of Britain at the time (so called 'democracy' in Britain of the day only applied to a small land-owning class, and then only males). It is true that Europe at the time was technologically superior to the people they colonised, that is what gave them the ability to impose their will upon the people they colonised; but it is total arrogance to assume just because we had the technology that makes us somehow culturally superior.

@kingofhearts3185

10 ай бұрын

​@@bruhbutwhytho2301The Irish potato famine was caused by blight and made worse by British policy, but it wasn't caused by them. Most natives died of diseas on first contact. Slavery is older than history, the Europeans were just the first to do it on a large scale.

As Indonesian i appreciate the acknowledgment of our shared history. With the recent acknowledgment of Indonesian independent in 1945 instead of 1947, i hope it will open reconcilation of the victim of dutch invasion of Indonesia during the independence war. This definitely a great move to move forward as society

@fikrirahmatnurhidayat4988

10 ай бұрын

Don't forget that Soekarno forced repatriation upon Indo or Indonesian Born Dutch people.

@FauzyGamerz

10 ай бұрын

yeah but our "suffering" from dutch colonialism in this video are overshadowed by these "enslaved" people sufferings

@rexglucksburg

10 ай бұрын

@@FauzyGamerz it's not a competition. There's no need to compare horrible stuff

@SNH1305

10 ай бұрын

@@rexglucksburg yep there is no need, that is why we are moving forward and fight for better things with our own feet and hands, regardless of outside help, we Indonesian never embrace the slave and victim mentality. Be proud of that.

@ronaldderooij1774

10 ай бұрын

@@SpoonfedPig War crimes were committed by all parties. It was a different time. I had numerous discussions about this with especially my (rather racist) father when I was young. The older generation (pre war) pointed to the war crimes committed by the Indonesians as a legitimation of the invasion. My point was that that was not the point. It was colonialism. Then the reply came that the Dutch were needed to rebuild Indonesia. I then said that was besides the point. The Dutch wanted to earn money there over the backs of Indonesians. And so it went on and on and on.

Je kan trots zijn op een maaltijd die je hebt gemaakt, ondanks dat er een kip voor is doodgemaakt. Je kan trots zijn op een mooie reis die je hebt gemaakt, ondanks de hoeveelheid CO2 die het vliegtuig uitstoot. Je kan trots zijn op een mooie set kleren die je hebt gekocht, ondanks dat de makers ervan onder beroerde omstandigheden werken.

Great video and appreciating your approach. As Austrian, the WW2 victimhood narrative sounds very familiar. In Austria it is utilized a lot to not speak about Austrias own collaborators’role while completely ignoring the Binnenkolonialismus of the Austrian and Habsburg Lands. Binnenkolonialismus loosely translates as internal colonialisms and refers to Austrian colonialization of Eastern Europe. Unfortunately, Binnenkolonialismus is neither framed as negative nor addressed sufficiently in schools or public.

@jasonhaven7170

10 ай бұрын

Also, Austrian slave trade of Black people.

@almendratlilkouatl

10 ай бұрын

The Austrian monarchs in Mexico were great almost tho, Von Humboldt was a collector of ancient mexijka artifacts and I think the descendant of Motekujzoma the last mexijka king lives in Austria

@TORLBC

10 ай бұрын

That's wild to me, considering the reason why WW2 happened was a certain Austrian and his ... "solutions." Hopefully people talk more about it

@Continental27995

9 ай бұрын

Well, that's because Binnenkolonialismus is more of a terminus technicus coming from Medieval Studies (and I think you actually refer to the Habsburgian Landesausbau) and it's not quite comparable to modern colonialism (we also normally don't frame Greek or Phoenician colonization as "bad"). That has two reasons: First of all, Binnenkolonisation does mean a lot of things, it can adress enlisting Saxons to move to Transilvania as well as settling 5 kilometers upstream and clearing the thick forest there. The modes are very different and heterogenous. Secondly, we discuss colonialism as a phenomenon resulting in todays inequality between global spheres and peoples and the many lasting problems of colonized and marginalized groups. Without such people, it's pointless to frame it negative. We don't collectively frown upon the disappearance of the Old Prussians (through assimilation or genocide), because no plaintiff no judge.

@1511mlh

9 ай бұрын

@@Continental27995 thanks for this elaborate explanation. I was not aware that “clearance of thick forest” can mean Binnenkolonialismus too. So would the allocation of lands, e g HREmperor assigning a border land to a vassal, count as Binnenkolonialismus? We went through the word in Austrian history at university in regards to post-Napoleonic conquests in Eastern Europe. Though, -now stretching a bit far here, and thinking out loud here- we could think of the economical inequalities that exist between Binnencolonies and their centers. For example austrian banks or petro-agri companies owning large market shares in former lands?

I think there are two other historical factors that make the Dutch view on colonialism and slavery different: - Slavery was officially outlawed in The Netherlands itself, meaning people were not allowed to hold slaves in the country. It still happened on occasion, but most slavery happened in the colonies themselves or by exporting to other countries, like the American continent. This made it far less visible to the average Dutch citizen of the time and reflects in how that period of Dutch history is written. - Despite the above, eventually the poor treatment of slaves reached the country and citizens were distraught about this. Eventually due to public pressure things like basic education was introduced to the colonies and limited forms of upward mobility were introduced for the slaves. This lead to this false sense of being "benevolent overlords" that permeated into the history books. I remember myself that this was a significant portion in the school history books. While the segments about the horrible massacres that occurred to take the colonies in the first place were brief, for example. As for the hesitation to make an official apology: Many feared this would open The Netherlands up to lawsuits or reparation payments. This made both officials and sections of the public hesitant about offering an official apology, especially since the economy isn't doing so hot for a few years now. This was an the argument I heard often whenever this topic was talked about. Most Dutch people won't deny that slavery was bad and a dark chapter of our history. However offering an apology makes them feel like it was their fault personally. It gets really murky with the whole debate on how much current generations profited from the slavery of the past. So it's not simply dismissed as "We had nothing to do with it." yet it's also not like current generations of ex-slaves are directly accusing them. It adds to this struggle between "It wasn't me who committed slavery, it was my ancestors choice." and "I want them to recognise the damage they caused to us and our ancestors". Hopefully recent efforts will allow people to give it a proper place in history, culture, etc.

@fij715

10 ай бұрын

Wrong debt slavery of white Europeans was still practiced. Most sailors onboard the VOC ships were white slaves.

@Ned-nw6ge

8 ай бұрын

Yeah, the creator seemed to have missed a few things here and I’m glad that you pointed them out. Everyone here learns about the horrors of Dutch colonialism and slavery. Not since “the past few years” but more like the past few decades. We aren’t proud of slavery and colonialism in and of itself, and it sucks that museums nowadays falsely claim that these were the main two factors that made the Dutch Republic rich. But the sudden demand for an apology indeed made us feel like we were accused of being responsible for what a couple of tens of thousands of people did in the past (so not even “our” ancestors in most cases). This lead to kneejerk reactions on both sides of the matter, which lead to missing the point of indeed _recognizing_ the full story. Within the school system they’re on their way to nuance our heroes of old; people like Michiel de Ruyter. I don’t think if I agree with it, but I think it’s good that instead of destroying statues, we instead add the rest of the story and context to the person. For example, Michiel de Ruyter was a hero in our eyes because he stopped an English- French invasion in 1672 and furthermore helped us keep our trading position on the seas. But he also defended slave ships off the coast of Ghana if I’m right. The children are hereby allowed to form their own opinion about him, instead of getting told what to think. It’s a shame that they don’t really do this in our museums and very rarely in tv documentaries.

@Carewolf

7 ай бұрын

This was the case for most of the European slave trading nations. Slavery was outlawed in the country, so the colonies counted as different countries with different laws, which included the otherwise illegal practice of slavery.

@blue.berry.

6 ай бұрын

Just wanted to add that slavery in the Netherlands itself was forbidden by law for Christians. So interestingly when a slave would be brought from the WIC or VOC, they hacked the system by baptising in secret to free themselves. So slavery was not completely forbidden in NL, but in practice it wasn’t really done because of this hack.

@teaser6089

5 ай бұрын

If we have to apologize for our slavery, northern Africa has to apologize for their slavery of millions of White Christians that they enslaved during the last 2000 years...

The history of the world was built on colonialism, nearly every country in the world was colonised at some point in history, some multiple times. people only ever take issue with colonialism when it comes to Europe nations between the 16th to 20th century.

Great video, it can be tough to talk about these topics but they're important. Sind note: what's the music playing at 14:20? It's a beautiful tune.

@ThePresentPast_

7 ай бұрын

thank you! The song is Living Room Tales by Thomas Fox

Dutch elites (probably while rubbing nipples idk): We're sorry. Sorry. Sorry. Dutch citizens: G E K O L O N I S E E R D

@werren894

10 ай бұрын

lmao

@jingex7816

9 ай бұрын

Dutch elites: We are sorry for our past and we shall make sure such horrors will never happen again. Dutch citizens: We'll meet again, don't know where, don't know when. 🎵

@van0tot100

9 ай бұрын

Hey that was exactly what I said

as an indonesian, we dont really care, we barely even gave a thought about the dutch now

@jellees

10 ай бұрын

Damn and I was here thinking we lived rent free in the minds of all indonesians.

@Dutch-McLarenJk82-

9 ай бұрын

⁠​⁠@@jelleesWell at the least the Indonesians do live rent free in your head.

@jellees

9 ай бұрын

@@Dutch-McLarenJk82- lmao true

Its interesting you go from the Dutch to the Germans with colonial past. And I can tell you why it isnt talked about a lot (in my schools history lessons this was definitely a topic btw), its partly bc for the past 80 years we have dealt majorly with our Nazi past, reparations, remembrance etc. Colonial past is being discussed more and more but it is also important to check the scale. In Germany we had Otto von Bismarck in these times. He didnt like and didnt want colonies, he wanted a cohesive, functioning Germany first before looking outward. This is also why Germany was very late to the "colonial-sphere" and only joined hesitently because businessmen had set up their own private colonies and demanded safety from the German navy after increasingly being harassed by the big colonial powers and their Navies. Now mind you, this turned also into state run atrocities being committed which also have to be talked about, for sure. But it is a much different history to the Dutch royal family, the Belgian royal family, the British royal family etc. systematically working towards colonial practices. Again, this isnt to absolve of, diminsh or discredit any of this history but Germany has had bigger history to deal with and I would say it is all done a lot and very visible, Nazi history is very visible, East German history is very visible, and all the rest. In Colonialism Germany really wasnt that big of a player, it was always more interesting gaining land adjacent to our borders than somewhere in Africa or Asia. It was also done but on a much different scale and managed a lot different from actual colonial powers. Not to mention Germany's colonial history was comparably very short. Joined the scramble for Africa very late and due to First and Second World War was out of it very early as well. Its like with Americas Slavery history. Germany has its history with Jews and America with African Americans, former Royal colonial powers like NL, UK or Portugal with slavery and exploitation there. We also have things like the Artifacts from Museums (the example of the Benin Bronze's recently returned were like much of German museum artifacts bought from the British who had stolen it) being returned and generally an awareness thats growing which is also very important.

@Ass_of_Amalek

4 ай бұрын

lothar von trotha 👎

@karolinakuc4783

4 ай бұрын

True. Mixed luck in case of management. Askari were doing good under German rule they could be generals in army if they proved themselves. But there was one colony with very racist management in which black people were nothing but a prey hunted for sport.

Hey, Do you have a good book recommendation for the history of the dutch east India company? I really would like to learn more about the matter. Thx in advance!

Would be worth mentioning too that there was an outcry against the apologies too because they were seen as not being done in conversation with descendants of those enslaved / hurt by colonialism. Many perceive the apologies as a ticking of a box - and another 'first' that the Netherlands can tout to promote its progressive image - rather than something designed to sensitively address the concerns of many descendant communities.

@LancesArmorStriking

10 ай бұрын

Yep. It's similar to American liberals who put a strange priority on progressive identity politics, but couched within imperial framing. They get mad that trans people are banned from the military. Who cares? "Trans people should be able to drone strike Iraqis, too"? They choose to focus on the trans rights aspect instead of criticizing the past and present actions of the military.

@brbapappa

10 ай бұрын

You saw how the prime minister had a change of heart did his research and sincerely apologized. Describing this as ticking of a box for brownie points is a very cynical view imo.

@worldeconomicfella3228

10 ай бұрын

People were more against it, because of people think they can get free money while history could have been rewritten unfairly. We've seen what happened in the US and UK with statues getting torn down and replaced, reparation bills so huge they only made sense in bolivars and Zimbabwean dollars or that one BLM America leader who bought a nice villa from the money he got through BLM meant to repair the damages of slavery. (Dutch BLM leader is a millionair rapper BTW, being from the people who sold hostile neighbor people to the Dutch as slaves). Fortunately, a good compromise has been made in the Netherlands in which a lot of research has been done fairly and balanced. Rutte applied some silly tricks though. For example, it was just too tempting for Rutte to not send the ethnic Surinamese MP with slavery heritage Franc Weerwind to Suriname to let him make the official slavery apology to Suriname on behalf of the Dutch government. Also, Rutte has had no issue to force the Dutch Antilles to solve the Venezuelan migrant crisis on their own while - if their governments show any sign of corruption - the Dutch government has no issue to replace the local governments by direct rule from Den Haag to restore order like in the good old colonial days.

@driesvanoosten4417

10 ай бұрын

​@@brbapappawe're talking about Mark Rutte here. Nothing is too cynical when ascribing motivations to that man.

@JABN97

10 ай бұрын

@@worldeconomicfella3228 While I agree with a lot of your points, I don't agree that taking down statues is a bad thing. Statues are an inherently political message, about what kind of people or values the builders of the statue want celebrated and imitated by society. Leaving standing statues of people who did things we now consider horrible, who's statue was put up precisely to celebrate that horrible thing, is sending a bad message. For example, if you have a statue of King Leopold 2 of Belgium for the 'succes of his civilisational mission in Congo' you have a very bad statue you should take down. If however you have a statue of Leopold 2 for mmm, let's say his commitment to protect Belgium neutrality within Europe by having strong military defenses, or donating his personal estates to a Royal Trust owned by the State instead of inherited by his various children, that is a statue you could keep. Though in the second case, it's a good idea to ad an information plaque explaining what percentage of those estates he bought with the blood money of Congo. And when you take down a statue of Leopold 2 that celebrated his role in Congo, replace it with a statue of someone who was early or crucial in the campaign to end the Congo Free State, or decolonize it. Because that is the kind of person you want to celebrate in the modern day, not someone that had children's hands cut of by the thousands in order to get rich

Thank you for bringing light to this dark history. I do have one remark though. The title of this video claims 50% of the Dutch people support colonialism, but the research you show asks a different question. Should the Dutch government apologise for the role in the slave trade? I don't know if you did this to create a clickbait title but it at the very least disingenuous. I very much doubt even a tiny percentage of the Dutch people actively support colonialism.

@ComradeAart

10 ай бұрын

You can tell this is a radical left youtuber. Rushing to conclusions as you mention, but also taking quotes of context. This is a person who is partially responsible for polarization.

So I respectfully disagree. I’ll talk about the introduction of the video because I think that is what most of your arguments are based on -correct me if I’m wrong-. I am Dutch btw. In the video you stated that Balkenende claims the dutch need more of a colonial mindset, but in the video he stated the VOC mindset I haven’t looked up the original speech or his writings, but I doubt he literally said “colonial mindset”. I think he is not referring to the colonial mindset, I think Balkenende is referring to the entrepreneurial spirit. I feel like you are conflating the issue by implying that he is actively saying that The Netherlands should be pursuing slavery to become a global superpower. When I was younger and I was following history lessons about the VOC I was also impressed by the grandiosity and felt proud of the idea of having created a global trading monopoly because it is impressive, just like the Rockefeller empire was impressive and just like start wars viewers might think the death star is impressive but the idea of grandiosity and being proud of it is distinct from thinking that slavery is good or bad, then you might say well they used slavery to get to that grandiosity. I think you cannot judge the concept of slavery in our present context because it was considered “normal” in the 17th century, because if you do you need to put it in perspective and when you try to put it in perspective you’ll find that every country depending on their position of power would have applied slavery, I believe that if Suriname had a superior navy, trade structure and entrepreneurial spirit they would apply slavery just the same and Suriname just like other. Don’t get me wrong I realize the role The Dutch played, my history teacher called the golden age both the greatest age and the darkest page of our history. Me personally I don’t like to apologize for slavery, it’s like fighting over an offense I did not give, against those who were not alive to be offended, I would be apologizing for something I don’t feel sorry for. How does making a population apologize for something like this help progress the issue? You imply that 50% of the Dutch population has colonial pride, but I don’t think 50% of the population is proud of colonialism, I think they are proud of the grandiosity of the VOC and the impact they were able to make on the world as such a small country. Which is wholly different from saying that 50% of the Dutch populace supports slavery making the implicit argument that they then are evil. I just think 50% of the population does not want to apologize for something they didn’t do.

Heel belangrijke uitleg. Toch is er een verschil tussen koloniale trots, en acceptatie van slavernijverleden. De trots begrijp ik, in het lesmateriaal uit mijn tijd op basis- en middelbareschool ging vooral over de goede momenten, slavernij en de effecten ervan zouden daarin meer plek mogen krijgen. Er mag best laten zien worden dat voor al het moois, een grote groep mensen de prijs hebben betaald.

@nocomment00

9 ай бұрын

Hij wilt nederland and nederlanders in een slecht daglicht zetten. Hij is gewoon bij1 sympathisant

@Ned-nw6ge

8 ай бұрын

Ik heb een jaartje de geschiedenis lerarenopleiding gedaan en ik kan je verzekeren dat de nuance er aan zit te komen (de Canon van Nederland is aangepast: mensen in de ‘Gouden Eeuw’ die we vroeger als helden zagen worden nu meer weggezet als genuanceerde personen die soms ook slechte dingen hebben gedaan of verdedigd. Bijvoorbeeld wordt Michiel de Ruyter nu beschreven als een held voor ons, omdat hij ons beschermde tegen een Engels- Franse invasie vanaf zee, maar hij heeft voor de kust van Ghana ook slavenschepen beschermd en verdedigd tegen concurrerende landen). Het is alleen een beetje jammer dat in musea tegenwoordig het foute statement wordt gegeven dat Nederland _voornamelijk_ rijk is geworden door slavernij en kolonialisme (dit is onzin- de meeste Nederlanders waren en bleven straatarm in die tijd, ondanks het feit dat er wel een welvarende middenklasse ontstond), en dat steeds minder kinderen geschiedenis überhaupt interessant vinden. Maar ik vind deze video wel een beetje misleidend; alsof we pas sinds drie jaar praten over de misdaden van de Nederlanders in Indonesië (en andere koloniën) en tijdens de slavernijtijd, en alsof we trots zijn op de onderdrukking en uitbuiting van andere volkeren puur omdat ons land in die tijd een ongeëvenaarde culturele en academische groei kende, en omdat we één van de meest open en tolerante samenlevingen waren vergeleken met de rest van Europa.

why apologies for something we had no part in doing?

@grissee

10 ай бұрын

because we are still feeling the effects and in contrast, you can enjoy living in a developed country due to the riches stolen from us

@sn0lder

10 ай бұрын

@@grissee so i should apologise to Mark, because Timmy stole a cookie from Mark back in grade school?

@patriot9487

9 ай бұрын

@@grissee boo hoo

@xXWesterlingXx

9 ай бұрын

​@@grisseecry some more

@NaSaSh1087

9 ай бұрын

​@@sn0lderTimmy's cookie doesn't affect Mark's life in any way, but colonialism does.

As far as I could see the 50% was not about being proud about the colonial empire, just the empire in general. Maps like the one you showed at the start are tricky to interpret because getting data with a vague question will net you with vague answers. There is a good chance that Dutch respondents might've equated the Dutch Golden Age with the Empire and therefore think of the Moedernegotie in the northern european trade as something to be proud of, and think of colonialism as a sideshow in that era. The questionnaire also does not elaborate on what era they talk about. Let me say this first: I am not a historian so I might be wrong in my reasoning, but I think it would be better to make it clear whether the questionaire aims at 1600-1750 or at 1880-1945 for example because you might get very different results. I say this because I am Dutch too and I can see this easily being misinterpreted.

@DrTheRich

9 ай бұрын

Most Dutch people, as most people in the world, know very little about their history, it's just not very interesting to them, and can't blame them. But it makes it easy for activists to plant the lie that the Golden Age was build on slavery. While the fact is (and you can research this) the first slave ships started sailing near the end of the period commonly considered the golden age. And slavery was becoming a successful enterprise half a century after the collapse of that period. Heck, until 1667 Suriname wasn't even a Dutch colony, it was a British one. And it's funny that on his map he shows Manhattan and Suriname to be a colony at the same time. While they were exchanged for each other, so that never happened.

@KarlSnarks

9 ай бұрын

Tbf, most of us equate the Golden Age with the VOC, so I'm pretty sure in most people's minds colonialism must've at least come up when thinking of an answer.

@k1pp225

9 ай бұрын

@@DrTheRich Not just this, colonialism was almost universally seen as an economic necessity.

@Benny_000

9 ай бұрын

@@DrTheRich And most of the money was made in the Baltic Sea region. But these journeys weren't exotic and far away so don't get a lot of attention.

@DrTheRich

9 ай бұрын

@@Benny_000 not if you include the Vikings their colonialism stretched all the way to the Spamish coast and the Balkans, and even North America

"Why the Dutch" You referring to me and fellow Dutchmen in present tense? I hope not.

thank you so much for sharing this important topic!

Always find it funny how channels like these are dutch made, while only dutch people discuss the topic of the video in english together in de comments😂. (Im also dutch)

@matthijstermeer611

10 ай бұрын

Grappig? Hoogst irritant, bedoel je zeker. Waarom 'we' dat doen? Omdat de Nederlanders altijd iedereen terwille willen zijn in een andere taal (lees: Engels), totdat het Nederlands straks niet meer bestaat. Doen de Duitsers dat, de Fransen? Neen, enkel de Nederlanders. Waarom? Omdat ze erbij willen horen of iets te verkopen hebben. Zo is ons volk. Zijn 'we' dáár trots op? (Ja, het Engels is de 'lingua franca' van deze wereld. Ik weet het. Dat maakt het niet minder irritant.)

Interesting video. Can't wait for you video on German colonialism. I notice that today history becomes politics more and more. For the right reasons perhaps, but not always accurate and well-balanced. Something I note in your video and activist claims is that a picture is painted that before the apologies there was never anything on the topic: not in the media, nor in school books. This is not the case. When I think back of my school time we definitely talked about it and for sure were nor proud of it. I still own my old school book of the early 2000s and the colonial past is not celebrated. Perhaps this was in the 1950s but change already occured in the 1970s. It is a process. Where it will end? I am not sure. I think todays racism (or acts like vandalizing memorials) partially comes due to todays hardships (first covid, then inflation). This leads to polarization. People turning against each other. Apologizing for slave trade may be a noble act, maybe a good act but perhaps is just fighting symptoms of a society falling apart. I hope I am wrong. Keep up the good work.

@ThePresentPast_

9 ай бұрын

Thanks for the measured response. I think history has always been influenced by politics. Not writing about a certain topic is also a political act. For this video, I based most my research on the most recent academic publications on the topic, for instance the Staat en Slavernij publication. They paint a balanced picture of what colonialism entails. This is a different picture from what has been presented to the Dutch for so long. In the video you'll hear how I talk about people going to school in the 50/60s/70s didn't learn about the other sides of Dutch history. I don't claim there was nothing presented on the topic, but the way the history was presented was still overwhelmingly sided. So no wonder this is what Dutch citizens experience. Look at how little the people actually know about what the Dutch did in Indonesia. When it comes to racism. I think the mental archive western societies built from 1650s-1900 about race relations still reverberate to this day. Take a look in the comment section, it is a case in point.

@sebe2255

9 ай бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ Acting like the concept of race didn’t exist before the 1600s or even that it was radically different from what came before is also a bit ridiculous. Ethnic-group specific law codes and privileges existed for centuries before the 1600s in many societies. And it makes sense that as people interacted more with other races that they’d develop a new framework for that. But it isn’t like the concept itself changed much. Where previously it was ethnic or tribal a racial element was just added

@cheesycake5879

9 ай бұрын

@@ThePresentPast_ you need to read this: ''The title in the video claims that there is a huge amount of colonial pride in the Netherlands because they did a survey, and 50 % was not willing to apologise for it. Just because people don't want to apologise for something does not mean that they are proud of it. Also, "VOC mentaliteit" has nothing to do with colonialism in the way that people talk about it today. It is hinting towards our traders' mentality.'' This is absolutely right. You portray the entire thing in a way that is just not accurate thus you portray the whole thing in a bad light and you demonize the dutch.I hope you read this because this (ur video sources) is so misinterpreted.

@nocomment00

9 ай бұрын

​@ThePresentPast_ you paint the Dutch in a bad daylight with BIJ1 psuedo arguments by the race hater sylvana simons. Race relations will become worse because of people like you

@nocomment00

9 ай бұрын

​​​@@ThePresentPast_you act as if colonial history is the same as being proud of slavery. You made more mistakes such as not acknowledging that ZP has pagan roots, it was a combination of many things but you simply added it to your hateful ideology by making it another colonial symbol. It fits your outrageous hatred towards European people and their culture like we are the new racial scapegoats Ideologies like yours have caused BLM riots which are Kristallnachten against white people. We are the new scapegoats of this world blamed for a revisionist version of history that unilaterally puts events together without the historical context nor nuance

Misleading premise. Not perceiving a colonial past as the plight of modern people, or believing in the political neccesity for public apologies on historical matters is not supporting colonialism. While this attitude can definetly lead to a dismissal, at least in degree, to current issues stemming from this past, it is not support. You can argue for a claim that its ignorance, not claim support.

My dad was born in the Dutch East Indies we are proud of our Dutch background greetings from the de Vries family in Adelaide Australia

A lot of indifference is also rooted in the fact that only a small upper class harvested "the fruits" of imperialism. Racism, religion and discrimination are tools of the upper classes to divide and rule the lower classes. People do all kinds of stupid things for the illusion of being considered a slightly better person. This is also greatly illustrated in the movie "Mississippi Burning".

@classicallpvault8251

10 ай бұрын

Stop spreading communist agitation propaganda, because you're fooling no one who hasn't fooled himself into believing this shit already. Religion is an evolutionarily adaptive mechanism allowing individuals to unite as a collective and sacrifice themselves for the common good. It is organic - not a creation. Racism is just a loaded politicised synonym for ethnocentrism, a basic human (and non-human - chimpanzees and baboons are ethnocentric too) instinct required to succesfully compete for territory and resources with other groups of people, and as a way to do character assassinations of ideological opponents. Discrimination is differentiating between various things and again is something completely normal, we differentiate between things in order to make a terribly complex world simpler to understand and to make decisions that our lives may very well depend upon. Again, the term has been used just as a smear against ideological opponents without having to refute any of the content of what they say. Your comment shows a total lack of understanding of basic human nature and a shocking degree of intellectual dishonesty. You turn completely normal innate instincts into an ideological weapon to spread your darn communist beliefs with, because you cannot do so without resorting to intellectually dishonest means. You should be ashamed of yourself.

@BillyBasd

10 ай бұрын

Propaganda plays a big part. When Kipling wrote the 'white man's burden' He relied upon imagery of whites colonizing countries to end slavery in thosr countries (true in some places), ending human sacrifice by Christianising (partly true) and spreading scientific knowledge (partly true) Colonialism was sold to the underclass as doing good, when the results(and upper class motivation) were far from pure.

@indfnt5590

10 ай бұрын

@@BillyBasdI saw a documentary about this. They hardly give a fuck about the skin color of the people they deal with. Weapons are weapons. There will always be those willing to get civilians killed to enrich themselves. It’s the sad truth. No matter where it is.

@DrTheRich

9 ай бұрын

Kinda but not really, in the Netherlands, everyone's lives, even that of beggars improved somewhat from the Golden Age. Yes the upper class benefitted the most, but even the lower classes benefitted. Racism, religion and discrimination, aren't just tools, they are also inherent to the human condition, as they stem from survival mechanisms throughout the millions of years humanity existed without societies.

@zimriel

9 ай бұрын

Bringing in foreigners is the sharpest tool of the upper classes to reduce the lower classes to peonage.

I would have liked to see which age groups think the government should apologize and which age groups don't. because there you can see the biggest shift. In the older generation the slave trade was never mentioned at school and only recent became part of the education system. this shows how important knowledge and education is in the believes of people.

@roelofjacobs5807

10 ай бұрын

Well,.. the older generation also have more fresh stories about the German occupation during world war II to consider. And be aware that labor was more harsh in the past. A current day civil servant investigating labor rules would start crying when they see how people worked in the sixties on the fields, or in the twenties in the mines. Things that happened during slavery feels a lot more alien to us today, than a century ago when live was harsher. So,.. I am not convinced that knowledge and education is the most important factor. As to the importance of knowledge and education... do you think only the West aught to apologize for slavery? Or to make it even more narrow, do you think only the West aught to apologize for the Trans-Atlantic slavery? Why or why not?

@user-xi6nk4xs4s

10 ай бұрын

I wonder what you consider as the older generation. The slave trade has been a significant part of the education system, at least since the early 1980s. We were also taught were the word slave comes from.

@roelofjacobs5807

10 ай бұрын

@@user-xi6nk4xs4s In all fairness,.. with 'the older generation' I am thinking of my parents who were from the silent generation (before the baby boom). I guess some might consider that to be 'the ancient generation' now that I think of it.

@DenUitvreter

10 ай бұрын

Nonsense, the older generations had much better history education. Now young peopel who know absolutely nothing about Dutch history act like they have to teach and lecture them. But no, if your parents had to do slave labour in Germany government paying 200 million in subsidies to black peope, descendants of slaves or enslavers, is not the highest priority.

@user-xi6nk4xs4s

10 ай бұрын

@@roelofjacobs5807 I sometimes get the feeling that anyone born in the previous century is considered old these days. It's not new that the youngest generation think themselves better than the previous ones. Fortunately we know one thing for sure. In not so many years this generation will be the "ancient" generation.

2:39 "first country in the world to legalize abortion" - uuuuuhm what? that is pure fiction. abortion was first partially legalized in the netherlands in 1984, much later than in some other countries. the first country to legalize abortion was the soviet union in 1920.

black pete has nothing to do with slavery, he wasnt even a slave. but i do get how its portrait nowadays and we could use it as an example of how beautiful our past was, yet how bad certain parts were. how we should celebrate it like sinterklaas, but also remember there were parts like black pete

@aheroyaheroyalproductions7631

9 ай бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/qWigpLClicjckps.html

@maaikevissers6534

9 ай бұрын

There is actually a story about Saint Niclaus freeing black slaves, and them serving them freely from that moment on. Even so, that is not the actual story behind Black Pete. Black Pete originates in Afrika. It's a very long story how he came to be as he is now. Racism was not involved. But it's easy to get confused. I suggested in the past a few changes that Dutch would be fine with. They were shot down, with the words 'that entire holiday is racist, saint Niclaus is racist and it should be eradicated.' That is when I gave up.

Why should I apologize neither I nor any in my family had a hand in? Honest question. this apology all seems like political virtue signalling with no substance.

@anoukk_

10 ай бұрын

Because even if it was a few generations ago you still benefit from that past. Its not like the harm and the benefits of slavery just disappears when the next generation comes along. There is a reason we are still one of the richest countries in the world. We personally are not accountable for the tragedies of the past but we as a country should still acknowledge that past and how it still benefits us.

@kimashitawa8113

10 ай бұрын

​@@anoukk_Most people were piss poor in the Netherlands though and our biggest revenue was through the Baltic Sea Trade, not even the slave trade which was overall only a few percent.

@Helvianir

10 ай бұрын

@@anoukk_ maybe do some research, most people in the Netherlands were poor, or were part of serfdom themselves. My family didn't benefit. hush.

@driesvanoosten4417

10 ай бұрын

You don't have to apologize, but the Netherlands as a country does. We have benefitted greatly from injustices that our country has committed and economically, we still benefit.

@DrTheRich

9 ай бұрын

@@anoukk_ The reason we're still one of the richest countries in the world, was not because of slavery... You've been lied to. The golden age was not build on slavery, as that only started at the end of that age, and without slavery in the period after, we would have been basically at the same spot today as we are now.

Not completely true, there were 2 seperate companies, the VOC, which didn't really use slaves, and the WIC, which actively used and traded slaves. Part of the reason we love the VOC and never mention the WIC.

@Limburg92

2 ай бұрын

Well the VOC didn't trade in slaves but they did take slaves from their African trading posts as personal slaves or for the workers on their Asian plantations. The WIC was indeed the slave trader, populating the American cotton fields. But the VOC did use slaver for their own spice and rice plantations. Also the Africans were allready using and trading slaves before the white man came into Africa. Before that the only known slaves in Europe were Christians by the Nordic and before that we had Ceasar who also used slaves.

It has to do with how historiography is taught, which in turn has much to do with whom was in power late 19th century and got to write+who was not forced to review it after the WW. There was a poll on nations agreeing with " your country is exceptional" and it had a smilar pattern of results for people agreeing

Im Belgian, I will never apologise for something I didnt do. Go ask our leaders in the graves for an apology

@kermit6237

7 ай бұрын

jij moet geen sorry zeggen. het land wel! het heeft niets met jouw te maken.

@mojolmao1752

7 ай бұрын

@@kermit6237 why should the country apologise? None of the current leaders engaged in colonialism

@bpj1805

2 ай бұрын

@@mojolmao1752 While in general I'm opposed to this current fan of apology grifting (I don't think any of it is demanded genuinely - it's instead a lever the activist-industrial complex will use to pry out more concessions, should you be stupid enough to create the gap by offering the apology they demand), one can validly argue that some of today's *states* still carry the moral debts accrued during the colonial and slavery eras. These modern states are legal and practical successors to the states active at the time of the events. Ironically, the German state, popularly held as maybe "the most evil of evil", is perhaps unusual in that it is *not* a successor to the NSDAP regime. It is a sort of revolutionary state - a characteristically German orderly one - with a break of legal and practical continuity with the state that committed the evils. The only continuity is in the name.

The relationship between the dutch and the English in South Africa is interesting because both colonies did not like each other. You should do a video of South Africa

@chesterdonnelly1212

9 ай бұрын

Also the Dutch in South Africa are more racist than the English. But I don't think we can deduct anything from that because the Rhodesians, who were British, were also super racist.

@Felixdeaap

9 ай бұрын

@@chesterdonnelly1212 maybe you are forgetting the netherlands only controlled the territory of the cape, The netherlands lost the colony the the english. the english expanded it. Also the "dutch" you are talking about is south africa dont have a connection to the netherlands for over 200 years and dont even speak the dutch language. So how is the netherlands to blaim for them?

@chesterdonnelly1212

9 ай бұрын

@@Felixdeaap I don't blame the Netherlands for them. The Dutchmen of South Africa are their own ethnic group. Their connection to the Netherlands is through the VOC hundreds of years ago.

@Felixdeaap

9 ай бұрын

@@chesterdonnelly1212 Sorry i misunderstood you.

@chesterdonnelly1212

9 ай бұрын

@@Felixdeaap no problem. I'm talking about different white ethnic groups in Southern Africa. But worse than the Afrikaans Boers was the Germans of Namibia. They were full out genocidal. Of course things are much better now.

You seem to completely forget the largest of the slave trading nations, the Ottoman Empire, in the modern day Turkey, in that list of slave trading nations. It transported almost as many slaves as every other nation on that list combined, and is still completely proud of that fact and history.

@rice4550

Ай бұрын

Read title of video

I think a large portion of respondents voting for not apologizing do so because they feel like it's incorrect to own up to something that you (personally) didn't do, especially if it's under pressure. Much like making a false confession under 'enhanced interrogation techniques'. It is of course about our government and not about the people, but that distinction is lost on many because any kind of apology that's not purely symbolic (read 'empty bullshit' in the eyes of the average dutchmen) would entail a cost to the current inhabitants of the Netherlands.

Being proud of an empire isn't the same as supporting it. I personally think it's impressive That Great Britain, a small island nation, managed to take control of half the planet. That, however, isn't to say that I think it's a good thing that it happened. That can't be too difficult to understand. Another thing - the apology. It's no use making young people say sorry for things their ancestors did. If anything it's insulting and come across as insincere as they didn't commit the deeds themselves. Imagine asking African people if they feel guilty about Africans enslaving Africans first and then selling them to Europeans, they would all say no.

2:14 Little resistance? The Netherlands had the 'februaristaking', which was brutally suppressed. It is estimated that 10.000 people joint the protests, of which 9 people died.

@roejogan2693

10 ай бұрын

Didn't the Germans also carry out mass executions to threaten protestors?

@DrTheRich

9 ай бұрын

it's just how you look at it

@Ned-nw6ge

8 ай бұрын

Our organised resistance group was also the largest out of all Western European countries, in ratio to population numbers. It’s said that the Germans needed more manpower to control the Dutch resistance than they did to control the French resistance. And yeah, most people weren’t and aren’t heroes who will risk their and their family’s lives for strangers, go figure… I hate that this ‘new’ perspective on wwII and the Dutch Resistance is that if you didn’t actively protest against the razzias or German occupation it means you supported it. Most people knew that the fate of the Jews would be terrible, and through personal letters and diary entries it is proven that they felt for them, even though the holocaust itself was a well- kept secret. And especially after the February Strike people didn’t openly protest anymore, which is why the Resistance moved underground.

I was on board with the vid until je ripped Balkenende’s VOC quote out of context and used it in a undeserving slavery frame. Propaganda at it’s worst.

I have a friend from Suriname, who told me he is proud of his dutch heritage.

0:33 Barbary Privateers took over 1,2 Millions slaves from Europe... Dutch Government only took full responsibility of the Colonies since 1790, before that time it were companies, owning colonies. In The Netherlands, serfdom was banned in 1781.

VOC mentaliteit does not mean colonialism was good. It's about the trade mentality. I see the confusion, but you missed the meaning of what people say making the country some kind of rasist natiolalistic colonial power. At the moment people coming to the netherlands do not have to learn Dutch exept for refugees, higher educasion is not in dutch, saint nicolas festivities have been destroied because of the guilt from the colonial era and a small group of people threathening people and munisipalities. People do learn about colonialism and slabe trade and they did in the 70's.

Maybe two nuances in your story. 1. One of the reasons why many Dutchies were against apology of slavery was because they are afraid for reparations. After the Dutch government apologized for slavery, the call for reperations for descendants of slaves has increased. Some descendants demand large sums of money. This is a bit problematic if you consider that they are not directly harmed by slavery since they are more emancipated then their ancestors ever were. This isn't widely discussed unfortunately. 2. Anothere nuance to this story. The Dutch government has apologized for slavery but they were eager to send a minister to Qatar for the World Cup (because Qatar has a lot of gas). Those stadiums were build by migrant workers that worked in horrible conditions (it has been considered modern day slavery). Besides media coverage and some political parties opting not to go and/or not to send a minister. The activism on the other hand stayed relatively quiet (if you compare it to the activism of the transatlantic slavery). It is interesting to see that the transatlantic slavery is worthy of more attention by activists and the dutch government while modern day slavery recieved far less attention.

@Helvianir

10 ай бұрын

because money. people smell money.

@evertonbarbozasilva6824

10 ай бұрын

And rightfully so if you consider that most if not all of the prosperity in The Netherlands was and still is directly or indirectly connected to the exploitation of brown peoples of South hemisphere of the planet .

@annekekramer3835

10 ай бұрын

​@@evertonbarbozasilva6824Do you have any evidence to support those claims? And second, ask yourself the question, if the Dutch traded in slaves, where did the slaves come from? Did slavery exist before the 17th century? Have there been European slaves, and if so, should those descendants also get money? If you are a descendant of a slave, but also a slave owner, do you now need to pay money to yourself?

@anoukk_

10 ай бұрын

To your first point. Its not like damage to a country, its culture and resources gets reset the moment a next generation comes along. It's not like the benefits to a country, its culture and resources get reset the moment a next generation comes along. The Dutch still benefit from the fruits of slavery and the Colonized still suffer the harm done just a few generations ago. Reparations are still necessary if done well at least. I generally agree with your second point.

@DavidJonRandom

10 ай бұрын

@@evertonbarbozasilva6824 Exactly. Not only should our country apologize for the colonial past, we should also pay reparations and make an effort to end neocolonialism.

3:46 shows a map that shows what we now know as Australia to be "New Holland", we held some presence there, yet its not noted on the map, neither are a lot of trading ouposts scattered across the african, south american and indian coast

Wait a bit, is there no percentage cited for Portugal’s colonial empire in the beginning?

0:31 Prince Albert made an apology for British involvement in the slave trade in 1840, through his speech to the Society for the Extinction of the Slave Trade, expressing the support of the Royal Family towards the British anti-slavery lobby. This is well documented, the Netherlands was not the first of the large slave traders to apologise.

@peterdevalk7929

9 ай бұрын

In MODERN times they ofcourse where the first who did apologize and MEAND it! LOL. AND expressing a support for a british anti-slavery lobby is by far NOT an official apology, even if it came from god himself! Oh wait, it's a BRITISH prince, my apologies! Typical example of british megalognia, it's exactly the same reason GREAT britain is in decline for already decades on about every level. Your ignorance and arrogance are proverbia!

@GodofGamesss

9 ай бұрын

Well this video was so overly cherry picking to push for a 'certain' narrative that by that point you cant really expect him to have done proper research lol.

@gankbank789

3 ай бұрын

@@GodofGamesssyeh, the poll was literally about people who refuse to apologize for something they probably didnt partake in (colonialism) and the narrator says that “the dutch love colonialism” etc

@robertortiz-wilson1588

3 ай бұрын

@@gankbank789 typical garbage from partisan KZread creators like this.

Imagine leaving the first and longest lasting empire out of the conversation 🤦‍♂️

One of the best videos about the legacy of Dutch Colonialism. Exceptionally well made. I wish it was longer

Yes, you apologize for something you haven't done to someone who it hasn't experienced it because someone in the past did it to someone else, that doesn't sound mental at all.

4:22 those people were made slaves by their own people not the Dutch.

It is impressive to see the short exchange between a member of the parliament and the prime minister have such an impact. Cudos to both - the lady who addressed her ask in such a short yet clear way and the prime minister who, instead of answering at once by playing it down, admitted that he heard something that lasted an effect.

Spain is still waiting for an apology for being occupied by North Africa Bulgaria is still waiting for its apology for being occupied by the Ottoman Empire Europe isn’t the only one

@doo2786

10 ай бұрын

Although nobody really asked for apologies for past conquests here, you might have a point in slave trades. The Mediterranean was a common place for trading slaves and piracy from both Christians and Muslims. Western Europeans even enslaved Eastern Europeans here. Going back even further, the Romans enslaved a bunch of different peoples as well, such as the Dacians. In history, there were numerous genocides and instances of targeted enslavement of peoples. The important thing to pay attention to with regards to the trans-atlantic slave trade is the fact that this has had a massive legacy and profound impact that still can be seen to this day, and how recent it was. The purpose of these apologies is to recognize this impact that is still here to this day. And just because other countries such as Turkey aren't apologizing for their past injustices does not mean no country should. I don't really see your point.

@martinmcmartinezface4243

4 ай бұрын

​@@doo2786the effects of the Mediterranean slave trade by Muslim can also still been seen today, so how is there any difference? It is also as recent as trans-atlantic slave trade, it just started earlier. About the trans-atlantic trade, I also wonder why the ones asked to apologize are the ones who bought the slaves, but never the ones who enslaved them.

it´s funny even tho Portugal was one of the colonialist power in the begining togehter with Spain, they dont appear on this graphic 0:02 ? (i was actually curious to know the percetange maybe it was the same as the Dutch)

That's why we Indonesians never think to apology to Dutch for Masa Bersiap and Pemoeda tragedies. We even hail Bersiap and Pemoeda fighters as our heroes, made their statues, monument, even our "Day of Heroes" every 10th of November is based the battle during Bersiap period. Because these people deserved it. We praises Bung Tomo to eradicated these pests children. Even when Dutch king apologized, we never will. As we are the one who in the right track of history. 🇮🇩🇮🇩 I am still love Netherlands tho, beautiful country.

@maaikevissers6534

9 ай бұрын

I work with an old lady. One parent from the Netherlands, one from Indonesia. As a little girl, she saw women and children getting raped and murdered. Her parents were killed, her mother also raped. She managed to escape, fearing for her life, only 8 years of age. In the end, she came onto a boat that took her to the Netherlands; a land she didn't know, to live with people she didn't know. Not apologizing for atrocities is one thing, saying this lady deserved this as a child, or the other children deserving this: quite another!

@Eza_yuta

9 ай бұрын

@@maaikevissers6534 I don't care tho. We only care the atrocities that our people got, and that also the same for Dutches.

0:07 what about 🇵🇹Portugal - they literally had like the 4th biggest empire of Europe! 😂

@ToastieBRRRN

10 ай бұрын

Same for Sweden and Denmark. Albeit a lot smaller. With islands in the Caribbean and trading posts from Africa to India.

@HildeTheOkayish

10 ай бұрын

the source he has didn't reference Portugal. it only had data about Britain, France, Italy, Spain, Netherlands, Belgium, Germany, and Japan. bit of a miss I agree but you can only work with the data you have

@ae-jo5gc

10 ай бұрын

​@@ToastieBRRRNlol we sweds killed 1/4 Poland population 1656-1660. We never apologized to them and never will so dont expect us to give a shit about some stupid island because the people who lived where black.

@sirhopcount

10 ай бұрын

Same goes for the Kingdom of Kongo (although not European but by far the biggest "supplier" of slaves in those days) which always gets left out conveniently.

Personally I think its important to be ok with a grey view. As a descendent of British aristocratics and colonists I simultaneously feel connected and proud of my history while simultaneously understanding the blood that history is built on and how lucky today. I think its not mostly helpful to make people feel really guilty and disconnected from the sins of there fathers but it is a problem when its white washed.

@pedrocruz-ds6bj

10 ай бұрын

I think this is not to insight guilt on westerners, but to acknowledge that it happened and the empire and your country was build on that. I also think that reparations is a topic to be discussed.

@pedrocruz-ds6bj

10 ай бұрын

not because a single person 100 years ago enslaved someones great father. But because the effects of slavery and racism are still on effect today, it's not on the individual it's on the social/macro scale. Is like having a race that someone is hadicaped for half of the race and than expect them catch up. but it's even worst because they were benefiting from the handicap in the first half of the race.

@marcus7564

10 ай бұрын

@@pedrocruz-ds6bj agreed. Though things like reparation and power changes i think are more difficult. I do note that many people have many different views, autonomy, symbols, language, and cultural revitalisation maybe sufficient for some. However i think most people would not be satisfied long term without a reduction in inequality. The trouble is systemic and targeted reductions is a formula we have not cracked. Short of that how much is enough, unless its a symbolic amount?

Very good video, thank you ! From a franco-german history student

Being proud of a colonial empire is not the same as being proud of the slave trade. You have to understand that the Netherlands is a very small country that has fought a lot for its right to exist (occupied by the Spaniards, the French, the Germans). The Netherlands was the inventor of the multinational and the stock market. That is why there is more pride around the world trade of the VOC, which was 95% of the income (exclusive trade with China, for example). The small 5% was the slave trade, in which the Netherlands certainly played its part, but is not the reason why it was once the richest country.

"Top 5 slave traders" Funny how there is no mention of Arab slave trade that was ongoing for centuries before Dutch even started buying slaves Also where is mention of Kingdom of Kongo? If it wasn't for them Atlantic slave trade would not have been even remotely as big as it was.

@roejogan2693

10 ай бұрын

Exactly!

@samuelboucher1454

10 ай бұрын

Because the whole 'colonialism' debate is just a cash grab by activist intellectuals. Note how it didn't start until BLM arrived in the Netherlands (which noticeably does not have the same problems of police brutality as the US). Honestly, it's all a farce.

@ComradeAart

10 ай бұрын

Europeans wouldn't even make the top twenty in slave trade. In the transatlantic slave trade of course they would. What else would we expect from radical left youtube videos?

@slbdnkrmpc9951

10 ай бұрын

Lol dude exactly, they were selling their own people into slavery

@werren894

10 ай бұрын

focusing on europe maybe? since we talking about the leader of EU

from what I remember, most of the slaves were sold to Europeans by African kings, werent they?

@ChristiaanHW

10 ай бұрын

shhhh, those kind of facts have to be kept quite. don't you know that all bad things in the world are the fault of the white people. i'm so sick of these kinds of videos and people that only pick certain facts that fit their narrative and handily forget the rest. history isn't black and white.

@presphinethepure5919

10 ай бұрын

yeah correct

@mr.takethingstooseriously

9 ай бұрын

Incorrect. It’s a white washed history to make it more digestible

@jbak87

9 ай бұрын

Yes, but some say that Europeans' demand for labor led to and/or created a reason to start or increase slavery.

@kiroo886

9 ай бұрын

Why would they sell slaves in the first place?

Why is it always about "Europeans should apologize for slavery"? In that case, most of the Muslim world should apologize to basically entirety of Europe for it's slave trade and conquest.

Germany paid €1,000,000,000 to Namibia as compensation.

@nocomment00

9 ай бұрын

It's never enough. People like this guy will always feel the need to start race wars over petty 1 sided history

I'm looking forward to the videos on German Colonialism. Most fascinating for me was the lack of government control in many cases and the military ignoring direct orders. It's exactly what Bismarck did for the 1870 war with France and there are many examples of Prussian military saying "Yes, sure" but omitting the "but honestly, not really, nah mate." or straight up saying "You're just a civilian - talk to the hand"

@gerdiealbers7788

10 ай бұрын

And what about the Belgium colonialism in African KONGO......??

@sybrandwoudstra9236

10 ай бұрын

@@Aleksandr-1920 The Belgian government was outraged at the poor living conditions in the Congo. Leopold did something wrong.

@MrAlen6e

9 ай бұрын

​@@Aleksandr-1920Leopold was at part with Hitler and Stalin when it comes to genocide.

@Nate14567

9 ай бұрын

@@Aleksandr-1920are you fucking kidding me

@ZERU818

9 ай бұрын

​@@Aleksandr-1920literalmente o cara matou mais que Hitler. E pior, os que não morriam eram torturados.

Why should the Europeans be ashamed of their colonial empires? Ask the Arabs in the Middle East if they are embarrassed of the empires they created, that enslaved people from Spain to India. Ask the Mongolians if they are ashamed of Genghis Khan and what his soldiers did from China to Russia to Iran. Every empire is built on the backs of millions of dead souls. But only the Europeans are told they must be ashamed of their empires but no one else is asked to do the same convientiently enough

@Astyanaz

9 ай бұрын

A comment by someone who understands history. I applaud you.

@MagnificentMaimonides9797

9 ай бұрын

History is bad a lot of bad things happen I don’t like the term shame but acknowledgment

@_RedRightHand_

9 ай бұрын

Finally, a man with a brain

@nothere4089

9 ай бұрын

what makes you think that all arabs and mongolians venerate their past like you and make excuses for it?

@savioblanc

9 ай бұрын

@@nothere4089 I'm generalising, you wet stain. There isn't a collective movement in either of those two places, funded by their governments, to tell their citizens they should be ashamed of their past.

Slavery is a dark page in history. When the politician said that she hopes that nobody would forget the second world war in the future, I understood what she meant. The thing is that lessons learned in the past when big (terrible) things happened will fade in time. People can connect to historic events to a certain extend. People who live today did not experience, nor are responsible, for terrible things that happened very long ago. I think that is why a big group of Dutch people did not feel the need to apologize.

@GodofGamesss

9 ай бұрын

It's all about who people can blame for their current misfortunes and to alow them to claim for reparations even though their only experiences from these events came from the story's that their grandparents told them, while others dont even have that but jump on the bandwagon because of the color of their skin. And this is one of the big reasons the Dutch people dont want to apologize. Apologizing means accepting guilt and there for opening yourself to these claims.

@teaser6089

5 ай бұрын

Slavery is a page in history that too often focuses on the last few hunderd years, but forget the suffering of the last 3000 years, cause African slave trading was a thing all the way back in the Roman era... Also the focus is too much on black slaves and not on the millions of white Christian slaves that were enslaved by northern Africans over the last 1000 years... The history of Slavery is nuanced and complex, yet the political left tries to Black Wash it and it disgusts me

@songbank2619

5 ай бұрын

As someone said in the comments its just a big spectacle to stroke everyone's egos.

@rusgun99

3 ай бұрын

​@@teaser6089Belanda Bajingan kamu anggap wajar perbudakan?

I'm Belgian, so I'm obviously not so proud of our past, but if I were Dutch, I'd consider our empire as pretty cool.

@Kanukosan

7 ай бұрын

Read about their atrocities in Indonesia, for example. Be aware of self propaganda videos like this.

@maarto936

5 ай бұрын

Well, as a Belgian too. It's not that we should be proud of the atrocities done by the few (mostly the king and the rich). But what we were able to accomplish. And Belgium didn't do much on the empire scale in comparison to the Dutch. A small nation, able to have a multiple continent spanding empire. It's impressive. And just to be clear, nothing is black or white, it's all grey. Also, everything is bound to perspective. Thank you for listening to my Ted talk

@Kanukosan

5 ай бұрын

Of course it's grey, but your video is not so grey, that's the problem... And the Portuguese empire was more impressive. They were the pioneers in Europe, a small and poor nation (which became very rich for a while). And were able to go to so many places around the Earth for the very first time. They also had the longest colonial empire in history. Lots of southern countries are still speaking Portuguese, they left behind a huge legacy. Also committed atrocities, of course. @maarto936

@Killerwale-hk4wy

5 ай бұрын

@@Kanukosan The portugese empire was the first, but besides Brazil they didn't have that much colonial legacy. They just built factories on the coasts. Portugal was not poor, the end of the reconquista brought huge amounts of wealth to fuel naval trade and colonosation. The empire went into decline as soon as the bigger European nations joined in. The Portugese were good navigators and merchants, but once the others started to also profit of their discoveries they quickly went into decline. I mean, look at French or English or Spanish legacy. The Dutch didn't influence as much because of their similar approach as the Portugese. Their economy was very good though the VOC still remains the richest company to ever exist.

@Kanukosan

5 ай бұрын

@@Killerwale-hk4wy Besides Brazil, Angola, Mozambique, Cape Verd, Guinea Bissau, São Tomé and Prince, not to mention others. Their legacy is huge compared to the Dutch! The most spoken language in the southern hemisphere is Portuguese. They were able to secure all those territories in spite of the later involvement of other European nations. The Portuguese achievements were really remarkable and its importance cannot be diminished no matter how you try

As an Indonesian, I am glad that you're basically saying that Not Just Bikes Channel would not exist without blood, sweats, tears of our ancestors. Lol.

@alexplaze802

10 ай бұрын

I thought he was canadian but just living in the netherlands

@BrancovdBoomen

10 ай бұрын

I hate to break it to you, but it would.

@classicallpvault8251

10 ай бұрын

Indonesia under Sukarno and later Soeharto murdered 2 million of its own citizens, mostly left-wingers and minorities striving for independence. At no point did we come close to such a body count during colonial rule. The Dutch were much less brutal to the inhabitants of the East Indies than the Javans, who have been running Indonesia since its founding. Ask the Papuas in New Guinea or the Moluccans on Ambon or the Chinese who experienced several pogroms since Indonesia became independent.

@hirsch4155

10 ай бұрын

Yes and you colonized Papua, congratulations … everybody’s a bloody colonizer in world history, get over it. Nothing would “exist” if not for the past events. History is one long blood, sweat and tears among all peoples. But hey, thanks Indonesian ancestors, if that makes you feel better and proud lol

@kiripiksimping

10 ай бұрын

@@classicallpvault8251 I have met many Papuans, I grew up with a Moluccan as siblings, and I have been in Ambon. Here is the verdict: The Javanese might not be good enough, but Dutch was way worse. P.S. Do you not see the lol at the end?

As a dutch person. I have the honest opinion, that I dislike the changes to Sinterklaas that happened over the years. Sinterklaas was someone who saved slaves back then. Keeping the coloured helpers in the holiday isn't racism or about supporting slavery. It's about the exact opposite.

I don’t understand this whole agenda of looking negatively at European nations when everything was done at a different time period where it was all considered normal and all done to get ahead and advance the nations which is why we have the advance and we’ll built infrastructure and society’s we have today we owe it to our ancestors for having that get ahead attitude and being the strongest and smartness in the world. Nothing to be ashamed of to me it should be celebrated. Everyone today is enjoying the fruits of this past including people that claim to be from slavery even tho they know nothing of it and never been themselfs yet act like victims not all but some.

It continually amazes me how often people will take a complicated and nuanced subject, laser focus in on one aspect that suits their narrative, address that aspect alone, and ignore everything that doesn't fit with the narrative. To be against colonialism is to be against collective administration. Colonialism encompass everything from when the first homes came under a collective administration of a village, and everything since.

Huh weird how they didn’t also poll Austrians, Portuguese, Danish, Swedish, and Russians about their empires

@okene

10 ай бұрын

Did the Austrians have slaves?

@roejogan2693

10 ай бұрын

​@@okene Yes

@carloslx

10 ай бұрын

Arab and Asian empires laughing.

@NaSaSh1087

9 ай бұрын

Russia was not colonial, all the ethnic minority provinces were equal parts of the empires and not second class colonial subjects.

Not wanting to apologise for slavery has nothing to do with liking colonialism, it's got everything to do with logic and justice- the same reason you don't apologise when you aren't guilty but someone else is. The call for an 'east india' mentality is out if context and you have to be very facetious and pretentious to misinterpret the melodramatic rally call for an ambitious, global approach as something that's pro-colonialism.

@Deczx

10 ай бұрын

I think it is disingenuous to suggest that pointing that comment out was meant to imply that Balkenende was in favor of colonialism. You can easily acknowledge that that is not the case while still examining that statement with a critical lens.

@daanvanderrol5627

10 ай бұрын

Indeed, with calling for a east india company mentality Balkenende was referring to a positive 'can do' attitude, not calling for the establishment of a colonial empire or reinstituting slavery. Showing that clip without context is a bit disingenuous.

@Alias_Anybody

10 ай бұрын

I mean that's about as tactful as if a German called pan-European politics thevstrife for the Wehrmacht-mentality. Those clearly aren't the type of associations you want to have.

@liam-398

9 ай бұрын

@@Alias_Anybody If we're going down that road 'deutsche gründlichkeit' is now also banned.

@DavidMulderOne

8 ай бұрын

The thing that made me think was the example where if my parents had stolen a bunch of money and then I had inherited that money, would it be okay for me to keep that money? Absolutely not. The sensible thing would be to pay back everything that was taken, but as that's just not going to happen, apologies and acknowleding where our wealth comes from would be the absolute minimum we could do. Not too long ago I was in a museum about the Dutch invasion and occupation of Indonesia, and seeing that whilst I have (distant-ish) family in Ukraine just hit differently.

i don't get where this number 45 billion comes from: How much were the slaves in America worth? Figures will vary according to source but in 1850 a commonly quoted figure for a good, healthy male slave is $40,000 in modern currency. This figure would vary greatly over time and location. Prices were highest at the time of the secession. It ends up to be 20 billion considering the best price ever...

No one should apologize for something they never did

@AntiDegenerate1971

7 ай бұрын

Well the dutch did colonise so it's ok for them to apologize

@Heinz1903

7 ай бұрын

@@AntiDegenerate1971 everyone did...we dutchies are not special.