This was a very information dense topic, and some of these rates came in and out of existence at different times. If you'd like this same info in a written format with all the abbreviations and footnotes clarifying some things we couldn't fit in the video, Justin Broderick's website Uniform Reference has a great article series which we sourced from: uniform-reference.net/insignia/usn/usn_ww2_enlisted.html Also, the Master Chief's Sea Chest has a good video on the history and evolution of the rate badge: kzread.info/dash/bejne/qoKquqaTqLnKmNo.html

@pyeitme508

3 жыл бұрын

Cool bro!

@shwalkingmeme485

3 жыл бұрын

Watched those before this video, I agree that it is a great watch!

@jb76489

3 жыл бұрын

12:44 all of the officer steward are listed as being 3rd class

To the non-Navy personnel out there, this all may be confusing but to everyone in the fleet this all makes fairly good sense. There's a lot of pride in every rate.

Navy warrant officer and commissioned officer ranks please.

@therues7071

3 ай бұрын

navy officers do not work. only enlisted matter

How many rank titles do you want by their ratings? Navy: Yes

You revealed a lot of history that's not typically talked about, thank you for that respect.

More navy video pls!!! Great job

Ah, the non-crayon eaters.

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

Someone has to transport the crayons

@pyeitme508

3 жыл бұрын

@@BattleOrder seems so lol

@kaimetsa-tokila1252

3 жыл бұрын

Yep, the seamen....

Something my CO told me a few weeks ago is that the petty in petty officer is derived from the French word petit rather than the English meaning of petty. This is best translated as junior rather than the literal meaning of small size. It was adopted by the Royal Navy back in the days when the French Navy were considered the cool guys that everyone wanted to emulate. And obviously the US Navy picked it up from the Royal Navy. I guess that makes sense, it was just something I never thought about.

BZ Battle Order! Wonderful documentary as usual. You’re doing a great service for the military history resource community and your efforts will not go unnoticed. As an aside, I really appreciate the care you put into laying down the facts of what Black sailors faced in WWII as “second-class citizens” from everything like the lack of Chief representation to non-uniform rank insignia with the rest of the Fleet. Again, wonderful video and I can’t wait to see what you’ll come up with next. With this nitty gritty format I’d love to see something similar for the U.S. Air Force with a slightly less messy, but still fairly strange enlisted rank structure, and for the general British Empire and Commonwealth conventions.

Definitely need to cover the officers and warrants. And how on a few occasions during the war "SC" officers ended up commanding ships (which isn't supposed to happen).

My grandfather went in as an Elctrician's Mate 1c in 1948 recognizing his service in WW2 in the Merchant Marine when he was too young for enlistment. He served 20 years and would often wear his red chevrons as an extra layer in colder weather, despite never being busted down for discipline.

Awesome. Waited for this. Grandfather was Signalman 1st Class WW2, Pacific theater.

Very late in WWII (if memory serves) 6 years' Good Conduct (and award of the medal) allowed PO to have silver bullion stripes. At 12 (second GCM award) the gold bullion was used. Disorderly Conduct lost the billion braid entire. There was an unofficial (bu much used) term, "Striker" meaning a non-rated sailor having been approved to attend Rating School (what we would now call "A" School. Initially only 1/c could wear rating badges as Strikers, but later, 2/c were allowed if pre-qualified in their career field.

Recently the Navy talked about doing away with Ratings. The howling could be heard for miles including from my wife who is a retired Chief Yeoman. They quickly backed off.

You didn’t mention naval mobile construction rates (CB) which was a huge part of the navy during ww2. The video was interesting!

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

That may be a future video, but this was more about insignia than unit organizations.

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

To clarify, the CBs didn't have different rates. So they'd be staffed by Carpenter's Mates, Gunner's Mate, etc. same as the rest of the Navy but organize them into specific roles, like Surveyor or Builder

@patrickmclaughlin3484

3 жыл бұрын

@@BattleOrder they had a combined rate (normal navy rate plus CB) most of the rank insignia had unique CB specific designators. They created the Rates in 1948. This is similar to the way the BMMA rates worked prior to the designator of the MA rate as an independent rate. Maybe do a whole video on CB’s? It’s pretty dense stuff. usnhistory.navylive.dodlive.mil/2016/03/04/the-u-s-navy-seabees-rates-to-remember/

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

Fair

@jakebu85

2 жыл бұрын

Watched to the end to learn where the seabees fit in and which rates they held before they received their own designations. Would definitely enjoy a seabee specific video.

From a Navy Cold War Veteran job well done. As we say Bravo-Zulu

It's almost ridiculous how often the ratings in the Navy change. Half the ratings from WWII don't exist anymore or have been combined with other. And half the rating today didn't exist back then. I was in the Navy '75-'95 as an AT (aviation electronics technician) and saw the AQ (fire control tech) and AX (anti-sub tech) get combined into the AT rating.

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

It makes sense since they’re tied to jobs. MOSs in the Army and Marines change all the time but no one really notices because they don’t change their titles normally, except for perhaps the Marine Gunner whose title has its origins in the Navy Gunner

@BigTrain175

2 жыл бұрын

My wife is a retired Chief Yeoman which seems to be one of the ratings that hasn't really changed.

My grandfather was a GM3c, if I recall correctly he had briefly made it to 2nd class but got busted back down after he told an officer to piss off when he was told to paint the inside of a gun tub in a combat area (Okinawa) which was against the regs.

You are confusing rate with rating. A rating is a sailor's occupational specialty, Ship's Cook, for example. A rate is the sailor's "rank." I place rank in quotes because historically sailors have not held rank. Naval officers hold rank, but not enlisted sailors. When you read World War II Navy muster reports on Fold3, when a Ship's Cook 1c was advanced to Chief Commissary Steward, for instance, the transaction was called a "change in rate." A side note: the Quartermaster worked for the Navigator, not necessarily the Executive Officer. However, on many of the smaller ships, the XO was the Navigator, along with a myriad of other duties.

Excited for this one!

I'm joining the Navy in about a year! Can't wait to watch this.

@Drew-vv9ef

3 жыл бұрын

Good luck in the future

@robertdean1929

2 жыл бұрын

Go in with a rate in mind.

@SomethingSpecial.

2 жыл бұрын

@@robertdean1929 already done.

This was very well done!

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks mate

How about doing a video on the Seabees?

@windwalker5765

3 жыл бұрын

Construction Battalions is an okay name, but real missed opportunity: the Marine Corps of Engineers!

@jonahd9895

3 жыл бұрын

For real he just left out the whole line up of seabee rates

Pls more Navy videos. You guys do amazing work and I would love to see more about my branch.

Very complex, excellent video!

Excellent content as always.

My Grandfather was a Postal Clerk 2nd Class.

Very good video. Keep up the good work.

My grandfather was an Aircraft Chief Machinist’s Mate on a PBY Catalina at the start of WWII earning a Navy Cross for action on December 27th, 1941. Now I know what his rank insignia looked like.

That’s really cool seeing the different insignias on people for different jobs and stuff like radio man etc. it’s really cool looking

A rank specifically for demotion. Lol I bet many considered that "mark of shame" to be a badge of honor worn with pride!

Great video!

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it

Seabees used the fleet rates they had been recruited from. Later we got new insignia. I was a Construction Electrician and had a power pole with a lightning bolt through it. The rate did everything electrical, power generation and distribution, telephone exchanges, shop work like motor repairs and building wiring. There were the odd ball jobs like repairing washer machines and dryers, hanging anodes in a water tank 120 feet up to reverse static electricity and stop the paint damage. Being attached to the telephone exchange which were the Navy's Motion Picture Exchanges I also fixed projectors and damaged film. I also worked on the sound systems. A very technical rating combining parts of the fleet ratings like Interior Communications Electricians, Electricians Mates and others. In addition we had military duties as small arms company members. Small arms was the pistol, M16, Grenade launcher. We were more like an infantry battalion. You guessed it. I don't know anything about ships.

You should cover ww2 Seabees. Excellent video

My grandfather who served in WWII as a S1c aboard PT-108, 5th Motor Torpedo Squadron (or RON-5) was both a Barber and Torpedoman. But Pt-boaters did not have, nor did the Navy ever make an Insignia/badge such a Surface Warfare Specialist. But the Elco and Higgins boat companies had made-up at their cost always a set of Silver-PT badges for crewmen and Gold for Officer's aboard every new PT-Boat, to be awarded by the boat captain when they'd meet their training requirements. He was always prouder of that badge than any other awards given.

This was great!! My grandpa AND great uncle (never met till my parents wedding in ‘73. Quite the coincidence) were on the Saratoga and I’ve tried to get as much info as I can. They both died before I was old enough to really ask them about it.

Thank You.

Great video! Though some of the structure has changed over the years, and because there are so many different jobs to be done in the Navy (and Coast Guard) the system may seem complicated, but it is really very simple. As far as insignia is concerned, your RANK is shown by number of chevrons for petty officers, and hash marks (after WWII instead of the piping) for non- petty officers or non-rated personnel. When you made 3rd class, it incorporated a specific RATING which defines your specialist training and represented by the symbol under the crow. You can easily look at any sailor and tell what his rank is and, when rated (3rd class and higher) exactly what their training is. It really is that simple. Ratings were assigned to different departments on a ship which in turn are made up of individual specialist divisions. But the division assignment has no impact on the way the insignia is shown or the training the sailor would have received to have earned that rating. You could be an Engineman or a Machinist Mate in ‘A’ Division, for example. Depending on the propulsion system, either Machinist Mates or Engineman could be in the engine room....and so on.

Thanks for this ..it explained by grandfather's rate during the time..went from AS to a SF2C in only 2 years and 2 mos..and then discharged..They moved up quick back then

A friend of mine was in the US Army. At one point in time, he (retired as E-7) worked alongside some Navy guys in an office. Well, he was a bit of a prankster. So he took the jacket of a Navy guy without his knowledge. Then proceeded to the tailor shop where he had them remove the rank/rate patch and invert the patch. This way, the chevrons pointed in the "correct direction." The Navy guy didn't notice, but his commanding officer sure did.

LET'S FUCKING GOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO. Finally a navy video babyeee

I love this stuff

My dad was a Yeoman second class before becoming a 90 day wonder officer during WW2. This was in Coast Guard that became part of the Navy during the same period. USCG today has many of the same petty officer symbols as Nav. My uncle was a first class Electricians Mate on USS Louisville. He saw some heavy action towards the end.

Please do Navy officer ranks

Do more videos on Corpsmen please!!!

Please more rank videos. Maybe some for commonwealth nations as well

Hooyah Mineman!

He keeps saying "seamen" and "duty" and "coxswain" and I'm chuckling every single time.

I was an Aviation storekeeper enjoyed my time in the Navy 20 good years.

If you can make more video's about the Navy, that would be enjoyable

Have an incredible friend who was Bosun’ CPO IN. Destroyer during the Cold War. He said the Bosun was also throne who kept the Foscle from heading to the Quarterdeck after a particularly stupid or dangerous order was sent out. 🦅⚓️

I was navy 1998-2006, my chiefs told me you used to have at least 1 njp and 1 dui to make CPO. My first LCPO was a red crow master chief. It's not like that anymore. Also the navy has the most confusing and colorful enlisted rank structure of all the branches.

That's nice but can anyone explain how shipwreck from gi joe be wearing a chief petty officer rank while wearing dungarees.

@rwboa22

3 жыл бұрын

It was common for "below decks" CPOs during WW2 to wear dungarees instead of khakis as the former were made of a heavier weight cotton denim (and thus could handle taking the rigors of heavyweight work duties) instead of the lighter-weight cotton for the khakis, which would be more suitable for the bridge or in areas of higher visibility (thus one of the reasons why the Navy tried to phase out the khaki uniforms and replace it with the dark gray uniforms). That is why in the Navy of today, you'll see Officers (Commissioned, CWOs, and WOs), CPOs, and other rates wear the dark blue coveralls instead of the "work khakis" for Officers, CWOs/WOs, and Chiefs or dungaree-type "utility" uniforms for other rates.

@Lupinthe3rd.

3 жыл бұрын

And now we know

The musician's insignia isn't a harp. It's the ancient Greek stringed instrument, the lyre.

Wow and literally first! Wish for video about Cold War era or 21st century era US Army Special Forces AKA 'Green Berets' rank, structure, equipment and other things in the future, please 🥺🙏?

please do a video on british motorized infantry

One fun thing... the EM speciality mark is a screw-up. When the rating badge was developed, light bulbs were called globes. Supply ordered a group of badges with globes on them... and the manufacturer gave them just that. Oops.

You left out the Seabees

I remember in the month leading up to me going to Marine Corps boot camp, I studied Navy ranks. I learned how to tell the difference between Chief, Senior Chief, and Master Chief by the rocker and the stars. I get to boot camp and go to medical for the fun fun vaccines and see Sailors in khakis with gold anchors on their collars...I was like "WTF is that even???" 🤣🤣🤣 *Edit: I do know Chief khaki collar ranks now...lol.

This was vary good but you did leave some out, you left out the sea bee mark, and the UDT mark.

Could you do a video on machine gun MOS’s?

Great video. I.Y.A.O.Y.A.S.!

Me: wonders why there was a difference between foodservice personnel for officer's and enlisted galleys and messes. BO: "Mess stewards were racially segregated..." Me: "oh, of course..." :-(

They would also call seamen apprentices to seamen/fireman/ect "strikers" because they had yet to strike (start earning) a rating. They would be able to try different jobs until they strike for the rate.

My grandfather served on the uss Salt Lake City from 1941-45 and retired as gunners mate 2nd class. He sadly died 12 years before I was born due to cancer caused most likely from the ship it’s self or them being to close to the bombs.

Small pick here: the symbol used for musicians is technically called a "lyre" not a "harp."

WOW! As I’m watching this, and being an incurable Trekie, I can’t help but apply this to Starfleet. Both divisions (Command, Medical/Science, Security) and the specific duties within each division.

My grandfather was a Machinist Mate 1st Class on the USS Juneau (CLAA-52). Sadly he went down with the ship along with but 10 of his ship mates. Interestingly, this was same ship as the Sullivan brothers.

The QMs are the helmsmen of ships not the Boatswains. My stepfather was a QM. From my understanding, QMs drive ships, boatswains drive boats. He said the best part of being a QM is that you always know what’s going on with the ship.

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

Coxswain is kind of a generic title for someone piloting a small boat. Quartermasters were definitely the rate more focused on navigation and steering, but at least during World War II, boatswain's mates were also meant to be trained on steering and plotting courses. There was a degree of overlap between some of the rates with regards to duties and skills

@fathead8933

3 жыл бұрын

Oh no doubt on the overlap. It was just a small critique. Not even really note worthy. I find it interesting that the more martially formal a MOS, be it QM to BM or Infantryman to Engineer or Armor(which retains its Cavalry heritage) or Artillery, you tend to find that there is quite a bit of overlap in jobs in the broad scheme. As opposed to the newer MOSs, where you have highly segmented with hardly any bleed over to other MOSs, except in extreme circumstances. This is evidenced currently by the Navy SMs being absorbed by the QMs (and the fact that most times they both became Damage Control under fire), and in the Army with pretty much every combat arms battalion in Iraq, with the exception of a few Artillery batteries and Engineer companies that retained their primary MOS taskings, acting as Infantry.

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

Fair point, I should've emphasized the steering part more for the Quartermasters. I think it probably comes down to what is important for a unit in a serious situation. When a ship is in combat, the situation is serious for everyone on board no matter what job they are and it becomes necessary to abandon low priority jobs. For ground warfare could argue that there seems to be more stratification in the threat level. So combat arms and their direct support directly in harms way being used to hold ground makes sense while the more technical/specialist/high value MOSs away from the danger are more free to just do their normal jobs.

Please, could you explain the composition of the squads Afghan police and ANA army? Thank you.

WOW.... You really missed the SEABEES!!

I would recommend yu to do a video on indian army aswell.

Please make a warrant officer and officer one, Navy officer should boards are my fav ranks of all time.

This is more important than sleep.

Where can i find the stock footage you used

When did the pattern maker get its own rating symbol?

Should do British Naval ranks (ww2)

I thought the Sea Bees came about during WWII, if they did what was their branch and badges?

can you do the IDF

Where did SeeBee's (Construction Battalions) fall in this structure?

Interesting about which way the eagles head faces for seaman type rates vs non seaman rates. Interesting!!!

I don't know what's more prestigious an E-8 or 9 with red stripes or gold stripes. I have meet both an E8 and E9 with red stripes (active) when I was in the reserve. Let just say both of them were badass dudes.

1:38 and would last for over 500 years, so that one Master Chief Petty Officer could become the most famous of them all.

World's Greatest Navy!

Master bugeler that would be a cool rate.in my Navy we had some of the same rates.i was a AO.

My Goodness. While I'm watching this video; I'm trying to figure out how to get an actual copy of my birth certificate. Now was my Father a Tech Sargent, Master Sargent, or Senior Master Sargent in the Air Force when I was born? Lol

What non -rates, rates, Petty Officers would CB Survey(ors)?

Please do the navy warrant officers and commissioned officers!

pls do commissioned officers

Dad made FC3c on 8 February 1944 aboard DD534 USS McCord according to his diary. He was a plank owner.

As a former food service worker I'm offended that they didn't use a crossing of a chefs knife and a spatula for their insignia.

Even in WW II there were Navy Seabees. Where is the insignia for those rates?

why didn't you cover the "Navy Divers" ?

9:50 what does the V stand for, is it a Roman Number?

@evilguy920

3 жыл бұрын

If I had to guess, the V stands for voler. It comes from the latin verb volo, volare which means to fly. Hence, denoting them as working on aircraft. This precedent stems from the designation of aircrafts carriers as “CV” for “Cruiser, Voler” since they couldn’t do “CA” as that meant a heavy cruiser. However, I could be wrong completely on this!

@BattleOrder

3 жыл бұрын

I think you’re right

As an EM3 i cheered when EM came up. Gods im a nerd

@Freya_the_Valkyrie

3 жыл бұрын

@Support_Israel 1. fuck your name free Palestine. 2. im an active duty US Navy sailor. Not a submariner.

The NAVY does it ALL, and does it ALL at ONCE! Proud U.S. NAVY veteran PO3 '73 >'77 🇺🇸✌

@parrot849

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly the same period of time I was in the Navy, Admiral Elmo’s Fleet! 73 - 77🇺🇸👍🏽

OMG! What a *_nightmare!_*

Turn on the subtitles

You missed the SeaBees

The newly established US Space Force may adopt Naval rank for its enlisted personnel as well as officers

@homeonegreen9

26 күн бұрын

They went Air Force.