“Created in the image of God means you wrestle with potential” Jordan B. Peterson

@roshinvarghese6879

Ай бұрын

I love JP but he keeps putting God as an EXAMPLE of the highest good. He is THE highest being and must be worshiped. God is not just a philosophy.

@praisebegamecocks

Ай бұрын

​@roshinvarghese6879 You think maybe his argument is that too much points in that direction in psychology, meaning, instinct, etc. Therefore there is a transcendent conscious principle that orders these things, and ordered them in such a way that conscious beings must align with him to properly function, and in effect his only issue is either he presents it withinthe argument he found compelling, or that he can't make the last leap to say he knows for sure that this being is 100% portrayed correctly in the Bible, but rather that his conviction is close enough to what would be recognizable as the true deity, that he concludes that it must be the most accurate reflection, but given that his reasoning grants the difference between faith and knowledge, he only argues it in so far as he can make a strong argument rather than forcing the last leap of faith on a person? Maybe you should just let people come along at their own speed, which is either what he's letting others do, or the journey he himself is on. Just because he won't say definitely that he knows what God is while making in argument that there is one doesn't mean you know his own private convictions beyond what he feels he can argue with sufficient certainty to argue publicly.

@jakechilton1066

Ай бұрын

@@roshinvarghese6879I think he is already Catholic. While he is hitting Truth, Bishop Barron is simultaneously hitting the Beauty front drawing people to the church. I could be wrong but it seems that way. It might be intentional he is using the abstract language to bridge the gap because he goes in and out of direct language consistent with our theology. To play devils advocate I get tired of our Catholic brothers and sisters painting him as “dangerous” because that seems to be trendy at the moment, it’s a Protestant mindset. Know and find comfort in truth and to your point yes correct him with the correct order of delivering truth.

@waffleman1299

Ай бұрын

Typical JP psychologizing word salad. The truth is that JP is as much of a materialist as Marx or Freud

@sweatincowboy4692

Ай бұрын

​@waffleman1299 quite a bit off, he's chewing. His worldview/paradigm was psychology and now it's shifting to metaphysics and eventually he will balance out with faith. Pray for him he has brought many to the faith and will continue too.

Pints does a great job pushing back, not in a destructive way. But in a way that invites Peterson to explain his thinking further. This is great.

@coolcat23

11 күн бұрын

"explain his thinking further" or, more accurately, expose that Peterson has nothing. Worse, he not only has nothing but insults those who refuse to be convinced by fairy tales and mysticism. Disappointing.

@bobon123

11 күн бұрын

I think Pints was trying super hard not to laugh or sigh after the third round of nonsense.

@eidiazcas

10 күн бұрын

True, unfortunately, Peterson doesn't follow at the same level

@joshdelagarza231

10 күн бұрын

Surprised he didn’t start with “Well that depends what you mean by argument. And what do you mean by atheism. It’s complicated.”

@micpie9480

8 күн бұрын

Which Jordan completely failed to do

"A sugar daddy gifting me a theme park if I stop masterbating" is probably the funniest thing Ive heard in months

@robberlin2230

Ай бұрын

George Costanza!!

@mjfraser04

Ай бұрын

*masturbating

@MavMelodic

Ай бұрын

Might be the best line I’ve ever heard in a JP convo, and I’ve listened to many. 😂

@mjfraser04

Ай бұрын

*masturbation

@JagadguruSvamiVegananda

Ай бұрын

Kindly repeat that in ENGLISH, Miss.☝️ Incidentally, Slave, are you VEGAN? 🌱

“The object of life is not to be on the side of the majority, but to escape finding oneself in the ranks of the insane.” ― Marcus Aurelius, Meditations

@user-yx9se1wl4j

14 күн бұрын

Dead on! Thank you!!

@user-yx9se1wl4j

14 күн бұрын

I love our beautiful wise Ancients.

"Evidence.. meh..!" lmao

To believe is not by forcing u to believe, it is to surrender all

@HockeyRiveNord

27 күн бұрын

But if you don't, you're damn... that is called 'under duress' 🤔

@korvonfrancis6552

27 күн бұрын

What happens to criminals when they break the law, they no doubt get sent to prison. Same when we break God's laws, we all deserve hell because we've all failed to keep his laws. However, God is offering us a presidential parden if you will, we can either accept the conditions of the parden, or we can face the full weight of God's justice on ourselves. That's not a choice under duress, that's a willful choice of your own choosing, it's not forced on you in any way. Christ has plans to flulorish you, not to cause you to parish. But if you don't want him then that's what hell is, eternity without him.

@harrykane_

24 күн бұрын

​@@korvonfrancis6552 The equivalence is a little different. How about unlike judiciary system God by definition can do anything, therefore God can also be held accountable for not getting rid of the root cause of evilness? I honestly think the answer to this would be "God has a plan". Which is really nothing to argue against we probably would have to circle back to whether or not a God exists.

@cirqueyeagerist5641

24 күн бұрын

@@HockeyRiveNord But the same is happening with Atheism 🤣💀Atheist are so darn hypocrite that they claim that if you believe you are a fool , Join us have no belief and you are smart 🤣

@willi-ams7798

24 күн бұрын

​@HockeyRiveNord you live in a world bound by rules... break the laws of physic and see what happens... it's simple. you are free to break those laws but don't cry when you see the repercussions.

"Why isn't your solar plexus conscious" said with such a force has got to be the funniest thing I heard in ages

@ArielIsaac8111

Ай бұрын

He’s spitting though

@chomnansaedan4788

29 күн бұрын

Let him cook! 👩‍🍳👩‍🍳👩‍🍳

@kirnbby

27 күн бұрын

Still a BS argument. Nice try christians. (If I can even call this nutcase a Christian) Why isn't the solar plexus conscious?? Well, why isn't it conscious under YOUR VIEW of "spirit from God"?? It seems like "the spirit of God" can cause something to be conscious only when there is a SPECIFIC TYPE of neural activity. Why can't this magical spirit cause anything else to be conscious?? Why isn't your palms conscious? Why aren't your kidneys conscious? Why isn't you solar plexus conscious ? Why isn't a rock or a table or a chair conscious ?? It seems like your all powerful God's spirit can work ONLY under very specific orientation and working of the nervous system. Hmmm WEIRD. OR the simpler answer is that consciousness is the result of a SPECIFIC TYPE of neural activity.

@kirnbby

27 күн бұрын

BS argument. Nice try Christians. (If I can even call this nutcase a Christian). Why isn't you Solar Plexus conscious?? Well let me turn it around and ask you why isn't your solar plexus conscious in YOUR view of "spirit from God"?? Seems like this magical "spirit of God" requires SPECIFIC TYPE of neural activity to work......Weird. Why isn't your palms conscious? Why aren't your kidneys conscious ?? Why isn't a rock conscious?? If it is a result of the spirit of an all powerful God. The simpler answer is that consciousness is a result of a specific type of neural activity.

@roberthawthorne147

26 күн бұрын

It might be. He doesn't know that

I saw Jordan Peterson in concert recently. The best part of the event was when his daughter said, she was born again.

@mach7479

23 күн бұрын

And he responded: “YOU HAVE TO BE PRECISE” and the audience erupted in tears and a frenzy of applause.

@rogindaUP

14 күн бұрын

Well praise God for that -- and good for Makahla!!! (or however she spells her name!)

@Timorio

11 күн бұрын

What would Jordan Peterson say about that comma you used after the word "said?"

@jordanbtucker

8 күн бұрын

Does JP sing? Or do you mean "in concert" as in multiple versions of him agreeing with himself. Because either option is a scary thought.

“The price for Life is Death”

@CameronRabie

Ай бұрын

"The wages of Sin is Death."

@WarPoet-In-Training

29 күн бұрын

​@CameronRabie this is why, in christian theology, hell and the lake of fire are also referred to as "the second death". Because no matter how good or bad you are, no matter whether you're saved or not, you will pass from this life through death to the other side. So the verse saying, "the wages of sin is death" *could* be referring to physical death (as in, some sins will lead to death) but can also be understood as the final death. The second death. The eternal death. A death that, once passed through, is the end, rather than a doorway into what lies next.

@vladgor4099

28 күн бұрын

@@WarPoet-In-Training Yes, this first death is just relocation. Its the true death in the lake of fire that people need to worry about. The wages of sin is death, easily applies to both the body and the soul. As both were corrupted. When Jesus came, he did not come to save the body, he saved US, our souls, and filled those who believed with the Holy Spirit. We are protected from the second death and do not have to fear it, it has no power over us. Neither do we fear the first death, since it brings us to our Lord, our long awaited reunion. But while we are alive, we have work to do, which the Lord has ordained for us to do.

@martinscrapp7166

28 күн бұрын

@@WarPoet-In-Training yes. the 'wages of sin is death'. It is not referring to physical death, but spiritual death. The physical things around us, the planets, the stars, are all temporary. Spirit is eternal. Physically, we all die once. If you happen to be a believer in Jesus the Christ, then you'll be with Him in Heaven for eternity. If you are not a believer, then you'll be subjected to the second death - the spiritual death. Revelation 21:8 - _But the cowardly, the unbelieving, the vile, the murderers, the sexually immoral, those who practice magic arts, the idolaters and all liars-they will be consigned to the fiery lake of burning sulphur. This is the second death.”_

@enriquewahn

27 күн бұрын

Its useless, in the surface Peterson words seem kinda dumb and Not easily understandable but he is right💯

you guys are killing me with these teasers. I'll have to join the locals at some point!

Absolutely loved every bit of this. Thank you Jordan.

@markwilson2421

26 күн бұрын

What do you think Jordan thinks an atheist is. I am pretty sure 99 percent of his followers have no idea

@TheDoctorProfessor

24 күн бұрын

​@@markwilson2421Reddit is that way sir

Are you going to post the full podcast here in KZread? I know it is available in Locals, but Locals is unavailable here in Brazil... They didn't accept our government censorship so they were removed from our country and now I can't access the full episode 😅

@TLgeek

Ай бұрын

I think they said it would eventually be released here ;)

@jgr7487

Ай бұрын

It already was released

@Riokosu

Ай бұрын

It looks to be posted now 🙏🏽

@youtubejpb

22 күн бұрын

Censorship in brazil? What a pitty news

Matt. Really well done. I definitely like your approach.

@anamari9434

29 күн бұрын

Agreed!!!

@MJArcilla-nn1ct

24 күн бұрын

I guess he is doing it like Aquinas would? Setting up counter-arguments, but for his guests.

Beautiful discourse and exchange!

damn that last statement about consciousness being the Spirit of God brooding on the face of the water was 👌

@Kezia_kaye

24 күн бұрын

Agree and it’s so beatiful. First time I’ve heard it.

@draedon_

23 күн бұрын

If consciousness is nonphysical, then why does general anesthesia work?

@caseycampbell1

23 күн бұрын

@@draedon_ because you affect it's container - the brain.

@danj9339

22 күн бұрын

Thank you for saying. I didn't understand what they said in that last bit.

@sisaytekle6621

22 күн бұрын

Let me add something more on conscious: everything we do on earth is recorded in our conscious, and one day, when we die, we will see what we have done throughout our entire lives in front of Jesus with big screen.so be careful with your actions on earth!

When you acknowledge that you don't know anything it's an illegal chess move for Peterson, but it's the foundation for a philosopher.

Every clip of this pod I’ve seen have been straight bangers

@JagadguruSvamiVegananda

Ай бұрын

Kindly repeat that in ENGLISH, Miss.☝️ Incidentally, Slave, are you VEGAN? 🌱

@jaylaw.7660

Ай бұрын

💯💯💯💯

@Alepap.

23 күн бұрын

Yes very funny

Prof Peterson would argue that this is an "illegal chess move," Prof Dawkins would respond that Peterson is "copping out," Regarding the question of proving God's existence. Either he is there as a divine entity that got the universe started or he isn't.

Why does atheism need an argument? I just dont believe a gods real cause no one has been convincing enough to persuade me. I can't help that. I can't pretend, i believe.

Why would my rational position of atheism - to suspend any acknowledgment as to the reality of any particular god until sufficient credible evidence is presented - require an argument?

@Maorawrath

Ай бұрын

Did you see how he deflected the question asked at 2:52? He basically asked why would a person believe in god, if there is no evidence for it. And Jordan Peterson deflects the question by deliberately misinterpreting it and answering it as if asked what belief in god is.

@Theo_Skeptomai

Ай бұрын

@@Maorawrath Exactly.

@alexanderryan1176

6 күн бұрын

go back to 2010 youtube

@Theo_Skeptomai

6 күн бұрын

@@alexanderryan1176 Huh?!?

@jamestyler3606

Күн бұрын

​@@alexanderryan11762010 youtube is sure as hell better than 2024 youtube

He's coming around! I am enjoying his journey. Sail on!

@DestinyAwaits19

Ай бұрын

He's not coming around to Christianity. You can forget it. The Bible is wrong. God is real and so is Jesus. But professing faith in the Bible alone does not guarantee you a ticket to Heaven.

@emmanuel8310

Ай бұрын

​@@DestinyAwaits19 Nonsense. You want him to believe a random anonymous Internet guy over an age long book of wisdom. Sorry but we're not all idiots.

@barrywhite36

29 күн бұрын

@@DestinyAwaits19what are you on about ??? Bible is wrong ? But Jesus and god is real. That does not make ANY sense.

@ciscornBIG

29 күн бұрын

​@segagenysis6918 please stop and attempt humility. What a narcissist!

@ryanziegler1410

29 күн бұрын

Which one?

Freaking brilliant, Dr. Peterson was critical for my reversion process back to Catholicism in 2016-17.

@JagadguruSvamiVegananda

Ай бұрын

Brilliant and lacklustre are RELATIVE. 😉 Incidentally, Slave, are you VEGAN? 🌱

@angelbrother1238

Ай бұрын

If he was here 15 years ago he would saved me 4 years of atheism lol

@smellincoffee

Ай бұрын

It's interesting how often that's happened, how close he's come to crossing the line into Christian belief, and yet how he resists the final jump into grace.

@angelbrother1238

Ай бұрын

@@smellincoffee JP is a deep thinker and most of the time free thinkers end up coming God kicking screaming . Took me 4 years to come back to belief in Gods existence again because I was the kind of person that questioned everything and what-if’ed everything to death . For me the hardest thing to do is to get my brain to just stop at night 😂 I think sometimes God looks at me and says “”does he have to make everything so frikin difficult all the time “” 😂

@wiffleballer28

Ай бұрын

it's a funny idea of "atheism" and "reversion" though, don't you think? you and Dr. Peterson and all other Christians are atheists in regards to all gods except yours. instead of "reverting" to the god you grew up with, you can apply Peterson's logic to *convert* to a different religion entirely! try Hinduism on for size, why don't ya?? and if not, why not??

"This is an all in enterprise" ought be on a billboard in front of a Church somewhere in Middle America.

Thank god i learned to be smart enough to understand conversations like this😅

@jonahwaring

28 күн бұрын

So true😂

@jaybee9269

25 күн бұрын

Indeed!

I think he just gets better and better, more and more clear, confident, wise, truthful... how can history not say that he was one of the great minds of our age...? So excited to see what wisdom will come in the future I him.

@Theactivepsychos

Ай бұрын

What’s his best bit of wisdom from the last few months?

@mcable217

Ай бұрын

Yes, very clear.... the best definition of conscience is the spirit of God brooding on the water. That makes a lot of sense and will be useful I'm sure in further research on animal conscience and human cognition. Just check to see if the spirit of God is brooding somewhere.

@criticalthinker8007

Ай бұрын

Really. He likes to use conflated words that do not actually mean anything. His idea of a God is just a conceptual best not an intelligent creator; creating an all encompassing definition which ends up being meaningless because it has no exploratorily depth. He is very knowledgeable on a relatively small are of Psychology, you can always tell when he is being knowledgeable because he speaks plainly and does not get flustered which is therefore very rare. He likes to quote various philosophers but nearly always get them the wrong way round or mis-quotes them.

@waffleman1299

Ай бұрын

@@criticalthinker8007 exactly, his advice basically boils down to “live as if God exists” (but actually doesn’t) and it’s self-refuting and nonsensical.

@TheGeneralGrievous19

Ай бұрын

I actually don't think so. I think he recently have went too far into one extreme of the political debate. I pity his involvement with the Daily Wire.

The best argument for atheism is there's no reason to believe in god. And Peterson couldn’t work that out?

When an author writes a book, he has an end in view before it is written, and all of the characters in the novel have a purpose which is gradually unveiled by their interactions. Sometimes the interactions of the characters change the understanding of those involved and help to bring about the envisioned end. “Let us make mankind in our image, according to our likeness” (Gen 1:26).

Atheism is the understanding that you are the only moral authority in your life. There is no one who judges you but yourself in the end.

When you are a phd and dont know that atheism is lack of belief ...

@302indian

16 күн бұрын

Atheists believe in lots of things….just not God. Atheists love lots of things…just not God.

@302indian

16 күн бұрын

People who don’t believe in God will believe in anything.

@sadsongs7731

15 күн бұрын

@@302indian I don't believe in god. And I definitively don't believe in "anything". Your argument is not persuasive unless you are only preaching to the choir.

@victortesla4198

12 күн бұрын

@@sadsongs7731 He means the other sheep like himself. And he's not wrong. Most atheists just wind up clinging to some other kind of loopy dogma, like the woke cult. Free thinking atheists are really hard to find. It takes a certain amount of mental/emotional stamina to refuse to give up one's faculty of reason when surrounded by believers. I've had the most luck in Japan, but their culture is a whole other nut to crack as an outsider.

@Malakith

11 күн бұрын

@@302indian Projecting much are we?

Atheism is the rejection of a claim. Saying "There's no good argument for atheism" is utterly nonsensical.

@englishgator2629

22 күн бұрын

🤓☝🏻

@ericdavis1660

22 күн бұрын

Having no idea is a negation, not a rejection. So, making no affirmative claim is nihilism at rest, materialistic determinism the moment after.

So I guess we shouldn’t require evidence before we believe in something?

@RCGWho

27 күн бұрын

No. There's a process in faith. Seeing creation. Seeing truth, beauty, and goodness. Seeing miracles. Seeing evil and sin. Making sense of all of it....and concluding there is a God of order who makes it all make sense. But then there's faith to receive Christ. The leap of faith from seeing, contemplating, logic, etc, to choosing to believe in the things you can't see. The spiritual realm. Logic then faith.

@id9504

26 күн бұрын

@@RCGWho Where's the evidence though? Stop hiding behind the word salad like your JP does.

I cannot wait for this

I liked the "ordinary guy asking dumb questions" approach. Sometimes the "dumb" questions are the most pertinent ones. And they're sometimes precisely the ones that academics strategically avoid. "But my wife exists." It's a good point. It's a very good point.

@swish007

29 күн бұрын

In that analogy, imagine a guy who is being given ALL the signals that a woman loves him dearly and he’s too clueless to see it. (Or he thinks he’s too good for her or something) She may as well not exist to him. THAT’S atheism imo.

@teks-kj1nj

28 күн бұрын

@@swish007 Well, if the the only sign of her was stuff written in a book and nobody has ever seen, communicated with, or knows where she lives or how to contact her, then yeh, she might as well not exist.

@swish007

28 күн бұрын

I'd argue there's FAR more evidence for God's existence than there is that the girl (in the scenario I mentioned) was actually into you. but neither she nor God really exist to someone who is clueless

@theamalgamut8871

28 күн бұрын

​@@swish007With the difference that god's writings are closer to the ones of a crazy stalker. He's a keeper!

@theamalgamut8871

28 күн бұрын

@@swish007 How FAR is zero? Praise jeebus.

Mutation is random, but while evolving we come up with a strategy to preserve certain part of the the gene. This does not change the fact, that we are built by a random process.

I love this!!! So wonderful to stop lying and believing in lies!!!

Athiesm is not a claim that requires arguments & evidences (except for Strong Atheism they make a claim ) , Atheism is reaction to the God claim

It brings my heart unbelievable joy to see the towering, discerning, penetratingly thorough intellect of Jordan Peterson turn to Jehovah and Yeshua.

@JagadguruSvamiVegananda

Ай бұрын

I'm not sure why any thinking person would give heed to the imperfect opinions of some ignorant psychology professor. There are a handful of EXTREMELY wise sages currently on this planet who can logically and completely answer practically any question that an intelligent soul is likely to ask regarding morals and ethics. The fact that Jordan supports men buggering each other (by which I mean, that he supports homosexuality and other criminal activities, such as the unnecessary consumption of poor innocent animals) is MORE than sufficient proof that he is not as religious as he claims, and that any decent, holy person ought to shun his inane teachings and flee into the loving arms of a teacher of Truth. Furthermore, in a recent interview on Benjamin Shapiro's KZread channel, he admitted that his wife figuratively (and I'm sure also LITERALLY) wears the pants in his household. 👖 I would be more than pleased to provide you with links to the KZread channels of a few enlightened beings who will quickly set you on the path to perfection, as opposed to the DELUDED moral subjectivism professed by "Doctor" Peterson (pun not intended). Please find below a couple of such ENLIGHTENED masters to which I referred above: Professor Alan Watts (now deceased, so he doesn't have his own KZread channel - just search for his videos on numerous extant channels) Swami Sarvapriyananda ( kzread.info or search for "Vivekananda Samiti") Jagadguru Svāmī Vegānanda ( www.youtube.com/@TheWorldTeacher )

@benjisandk

29 күн бұрын

I think you will be thoroughly disappointed in his true views.

@barrywhite36

29 күн бұрын

@@benjisandkyou know him personally do you ?

@benjisandk

29 күн бұрын

@@barrywhite36 I don't have to: kzread.infoq39wOXbZ65M

@Dutchbrother07

29 күн бұрын

A thorough intellectual wouldn’t totally ignore the question he’s being asked as he does in this video. Intelligent though he is, I really wish he weren’t so dismissive of that question

The guy said evolution is below us. Seems narcissistic to think that we're better than evolution.

@allenanderson4567

15 күн бұрын

Its clear that what he meant by that was that one can chose to obey or disobey the dictates of a purely evolutionary "morality" (e.g., if we've evolved to be cooperative, one can still choose to be antagonistic).

"The visible world, in and of itself, cannot offer a scientific basis for an atheistic interpretation of reality" Pope John Paul II

@este4955

Ай бұрын

Najlepszy Papież ever.

@CatholicismRules

Ай бұрын

- the Pope who had two PhDs in Philosophy.

@TheGeneralGrievous19

Ай бұрын

​@@este4955 Z papieży posoborowych to: Benedykt XVI >

@George-jd6fz

Ай бұрын

@@CatholicismRules the issue with modern catholics, to be self-critical, is that many of them have a fundamental materialist ontological worldview. A lot of them presuppose materialism and then insert God as an extra person in their worldview. This in my view stems from protestantism bu originally Cartesian Scepticism, which fundamentally misunderstands God as Being itself and misunderstand Thomism. We need new essentialist thinkers (similar to Heidegger) to revolutionise and correct these material errors in order to overcome our materialist trap. Glory to Rome!

@JagadguruSvamiVegananda

Ай бұрын

In your own words, define “REALITY”. ☝️🤔☝️

What do you mean by “there”? What do you mean by “isn’t ”? What do you mean by “a”? What do you mean by “good”? What do you mean by “argument”?

@ambe4825

26 күн бұрын

What do you mean by "what"?

@franciscomijniewich8964

23 күн бұрын

🤣

Wow. It is a chore getting through this interview. Jordan is just hysterical and incoherent. His certainty and fanatical belief in nonsense is chilling. I deeply hope I am never so arrogant as to not even consider opposing views, as he is. A real shame for someone with such intellect to be so utterly lacking in integrity.

@pod0phy

17 күн бұрын

well why don't you wanna be arrogant? is it something bad? If yes, why?

What is the best argument for not believing in space unicorns?

@739jep

28 күн бұрын

There is no good argument for not believing in space unicorns ;) 😂

@jonde-cent4897

28 күн бұрын

@@739jep It’s an illegal chess move!

@meb280

27 күн бұрын

What does a unicorn explain? Does it have the ability to create like intelligence does?

@739jep

27 күн бұрын

@@meb280 they’re space unicorns you blasphemer! And they’re all knowing and all powerful - so of course it can create anything. Says so in the space unicorn bible.

@meb280

27 күн бұрын

@@739jepMuch more logical to think everything came into being out of nothing. Don't need intelligence to create order, design, complexity and information. Why, I'll bet there is no 'person' behind this response of yours, it's likely a parrot randomly pecking at a keyboard. Polly want a cracker?

As an atheist, I agree with Dr. Peterson when he says there is no good argument for atheism! The thing is though, I don't need to have an argument for atheism. Atheism is the default position. If you believe in the existence of God, you adopt the burden of proof. It is not up to me to disprove God.

@HonestJohn4TW

27 күн бұрын

Really? I think if you applied your discerning thinking skills to the matter you could come up with a few options: enhanced scientific and technological advancement, potentially a more harmonious civil and social society, a more rational legal system, etc.

@indigo3977

26 күн бұрын

so are you saying you believe that by avoiding the burden of proof, you effectively find a loophole? im a little confused. either way, i believe your thought process is a little shallow. all this bible stuff could be fake, along with Islam and paganism and any concept of a supernatural being, and there really could be nothing beyond the physical. however, were you to not believe in something beyond the material, and something really is beyond the material, you would be wrong. by this logic, you lose nothing other than some of your time and effort by believing in something, but you take a chance at losing everything by believing in nothing at all. if you value that time and effort of believing in something over a potential eternity in a great place beyond the physical, then that is up to you to decide for yourself, but if you are merely going off logic, you are standing in the shallow end of the theological pool. reconsider. look at all religions and what they offer. I have personally, and the one that makes the most logical and historical sense is Christianity. Jesus saves. look in the Bible, and if you look closely enough you will find it.

@coolcat23

11 күн бұрын

The good arguments for atheism are the thousands of arguments against theism and the fact that one makes better decisions if one is not misled by some baseless fairy tales.

@creed3500

11 күн бұрын

There is no default. There is either a cause that caused the construct of space, time and matter or no cause that brought them up. Possibly being agnostic as in not really knowing of either is the default

@coolcat23

11 күн бұрын

@@creed3500 Even if a creator is granted, a Christian still has pretty much all of their work ahead of them to argue that the creator of the universe also cares about on what day of the weeks humans work, in which positions they have intercourse and with whom, etc. How inflated must one's self-importance be to think that the creator of the universe pays attention to one?

So many eligious discussions involve free will. The snag is that there is no such thing as free will. Just the illusion of choice.

@slimynaut

24 күн бұрын

Wrong

@roberthutchins4297

23 күн бұрын

@@slimynaut çYou think with your mind. Where is your mind? It´s in your brain .A product of your brain. You have no control over your brain and what it decides. Your brain is what you were born with plus what has happened since you were born. It is YOU!. Yo . Your brain cannot decide to be another Shakespeare, though it might decide to have a go.

@morganpauls1873

9 күн бұрын

no actually thats only applicable to two of the three kinds of universe finite fractal infinite lacking gravity and the one with gravity where four causal systems/time space are distinct from each other and growing the one with gravity where the two causal systems act like one excludes time travel intersection with other strings of time and the authorial function by lower entities so it places that universe directly under source that one has free will the other two dont except for in short periods where they do

The change in jordans demeanor from jokingly laughing to intense thought at the very start of the video cracked me up 😂

@jordanbtucker

8 күн бұрын

Does JP remind anyone else of the farting preacher when he tilts his head back and closes his eyes like he's thinking of something profound?

Every person alive is an atheist when it comes to every other god but the one they believe in.

Everything in life leaves a blatant trail of evidence of truth, but it is so blatant we never even pay attention it, and that is the magic of life

This is a far cry from "i don't believe God exists, but i live like he does." Praise God.

@josephthomas2226

28 күн бұрын

clearly there has been evolution in his views, right?

@RossShelton-fp3vf

27 күн бұрын

He says belief is substantiated by actions and therefore he shows his knowing of Gods existence thru his actions. Unlike most Christians who think it’s just by saying a few words. His point is that you’re gambling with eternity so you don’t just get off that easy.

@georgesimon1760

27 күн бұрын

But then he says that God is commitment, admitting that he doesn't believe in an actual god

@danieltransvant3933

27 күн бұрын

He never said he doesnt believe but he explained what believe mean by saying he lives as if He does.Clearly you misunderstood

@georgesimon1760

27 күн бұрын

@@danieltransvant3933 of course he doesn't say he doesn't believe. But he refers to God as "commitment" here. In other places he uses other nebulous terms for god that don't mean anything close to a god that people pray to or assume exists. I don't understand him because what he says simply doesn't make sense or is so ambiguous as to be meaningless.

"Asking for evidence for god is an illegal move" If god gave us the ability to ask for evidence, and since asking for evidence is a prerequisite for coming to the truth, how can he ask of us to not do the same for his existence? And if rationality should not be applied on him, then why do we try to logically explain his decisions? His actions would be nonsensical to us, but instead we seem to only want to apply logic wherever it makes god look good.

@zaclovesschool2273

10 күн бұрын

that still implies that god is a rational, thinking being. Its possible to understand god as not conscious like we are, more as an intrinsic force. many different ways to interpret it, but its just easiest to argue against the typical Abrahamic view because most Christians dont explain it very well to begin with, if they understand it at all.

@MarioTsota

10 күн бұрын

@@zaclovesschool2273 Saying you understand it better than others implies you have ways of proving to me that the others are wrong, no? And I mean prove, not theorize.

@zaclovesschool2273

10 күн бұрын

@@MarioTsota I'm not saying I understand all of it better than others, I'm just saying there are many ways to understand complex texts like the Bible, and some end up missing the initial ideas behind it due to not understanding the structure of the text itself. That it's made of different types of writing, some poetry, some narrative, some in descriptive passages, etc. And therefore needs to be carefully read. But if people don't do that, or believe completely in the words of someone who doesn't bother to think for himself, then I'd argue people set themselves up for misunderstanding. I like the way Jordan interprets it personally, maybe many others would say it's blasphemous or whatever...but I enjoy the way he thinks about it. Unless you mean for me to prove the existence of God or angels or whatever, then sorry I can't do that without either an essay or a long honest talk, but even then it's still a belief I have and it's not even in the way most western people would think of God. So unless you were wanting to explore the spiritual stuff already, not much I say would convince you. I can say that my views align ~the God of Spinoza, but I've explored things like Nondual Saivist Tantra, western esotericism (arguably born from mostly left current Tantra), but am also someone who loves learning science, and I don't see conflict between the sciences and spirituality. Though depends, if you believe the world is 6000 years old that's rough. Also to note, again I've not read the Bible myself so I'm not an expert, I've just taken courses on it's composition and history.

@MarioTsota

10 күн бұрын

​@@zaclovesschool2273 That's good and all but arguing that I or others are wrong because you "believe" something to be true, doesn't disprove our theory. Either use logic 100% or don't use it at all. There is no inbetween where feelings should take precedent when it comes to arguments. Either you can prove your claims or let me believe what I want and don't argue with me based on feelings.

@zaclovesschool2273

10 күн бұрын

@@MarioTsota I'm still unsure what claims you want me to prove. I already explained why I can't give you empirical evidence for God, though if I were to, I would point to all things in the natural world and cosmos which are so ordered and follow laws of the universe, or to the origin of our universe still being such a contentious subject. The problem is that you're essentially asking me to prove the existence of love in the human heart with hard logic (and by the way, a person can argue a logical concept without hard evidence, it's called reasoning in the realm of ideas). If you're referring to my comments about people misreading the Torah or the Bible, then that's another story, I didn't use my feelings or beliefs for that. But my point on beliefs is that whether you choose to believe in something is up to you and what evidence you choose to see as lining up with that belief. We believe in scientific theories because of the evidence they provide not only for their theory, but also the evidence used against that theory. But while the study of the divine can be undertaken with a scientific spirit, it does not have defined parameters aside from the laws we already understand, and yet there are many we don't. Abstract ideas are inherently harder to explain in a defined way than observations of a material phenomenon. I'm not arguing that God is supernatural. I'm arguing that we embody that force called God through everything all the time, but especially through our ability to be conscious in the first place. It's essentially the all pervasive consciousness working through biological machinery to interact with itself. That's my understanding so far, but I was a hardline atheist for about a decade so I understand the skeptic view as well. I've just found it to be stale at a certain point because it blankets all of these potential experiences with an air of cynicism or skeptical judgement. But again, it's about personal experience and belief just like anything is. Just depends on how you wish to look at things.

JBP defies atheism: Actually not a single atheist: yes, thats what atheism means for me

What is of spirit is spirit. What is of flesh is flesh. Enjoying Jordan's scriptural grasp. Thank you folks. Praise Elohim.

I thought I had heard it all until "Evidence is like an illegal game move"...

@CircumambulationMaedia

28 күн бұрын

He's taking about the paradigm. The Bible isn't a scientific text.

@joshpetermann

27 күн бұрын

It’s a categorical error. “Show me a square circle.”

@prometheus1438

27 күн бұрын

@@CircumambulationMaedia Then we shouldn't take it that seriously as to dictate our life

@AMH793

27 күн бұрын

@@prometheus1438”we don’t need evidence” “Why not?” “Because we said so”

@j.vdubois5074

27 күн бұрын

Show me the evidence for that odd ought claim.

Thought we were supposed to steel man the opposition

I’m not smart enough for this conversation 😂🤪

@ricco48219

Ай бұрын

I don't know you, but I disagree. Take the challenge.

@kwh1142

Ай бұрын

Sounds like it's something you can learn from.

@gato_gc821

Ай бұрын

Sometimes I pause ⏸️the video. And process what I had listened to and meditate and play ▶️. Again 😅

@RealTrentertainment

Ай бұрын

That's Peterson's schtick. He takes you into a rhetorical hedge maze until you forgot why you were in there in the first place.

@Rojofro

Ай бұрын

Neither of them are either.

I'd say the fact that none of the thousands of gods humans have worship have ever been proven to be anything other than characters in books of myths and fables Is a pretty good reason to take an atheist position on the question of deities existing.

@willcruikshank7972

25 күн бұрын

That’s a logical fallacy. A lot of wrong answers doesn’t prove that there isn’t one correct one

@Hobohunter23

16 күн бұрын

@@willcruikshank7972 you can, however, have a logical fallacy and yet still be correct. lol.

Wouldn't the 100% lack of any supernatural evidence be considered a good argument?

@seeingeye14

18 күн бұрын

Argue that against unseen gravity when you walk off a cliff.

@lanesmith1465

16 күн бұрын

What do you define as supernatural and how do you know that their is 100% lack of it?

@Wow-hr1gl

15 күн бұрын

@@seeingeye14 gravity is measurable god is no where

@seeingeye14

15 күн бұрын

​@@Wow-hr1gl God created gravity and can be seen everywhere in His creation. ROMANS 1: 20 For the invisable things of Him from the creation of the world are clearly seen, being understood by the things that are made, even His eterna lpower and God head; so that they are without excuse. 21Because that, when they knew God, they glorified Him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish hearts were darkened. 22 Professing themselves to be wise , they became fools. This directly addresses you from the Creator thousands of years before you were even born.🤔🤐

@Wow-hr1gl

15 күн бұрын

@@seeingeye14 all of what you said literally means nothing you have no good measurable evidence for the existence of god today idc what you say

For god not being a belief system based upon a set of facts, it uses an awful lot of “facts” to describe itself, and certainly proclaims to know a lot of them.

Has anybody asked him something like "you're in Joseph's tomb on the first Easter Sunday, what do you literally see with your physical eyes?"

He redefines everything in his own way, but his definitions are fluid and almost no one else adheres to them. He literally may as well be having a chat with himself. But he claims to know what God is, pretty arrogant for someone who can't answer a simple question without redefining every other word

Let's say you arrive at belief in God, OK - which God? You need to do some logical accounting to make that choice. You can't just throw logic out of it.

This is the greatest ever…I can’t wait to listen to the whole thing.

he's really stern on this topic for someone who was atheist most his life...

“You’ll take no solace in your accomplishments, if they are of second rate quality” That is an absolute truth. To me, it’s a source of guilt when I let that happen. (Which is try like hell not to, but often fail)

@jordanbtucker

8 күн бұрын

I'm sorry you feel that way about yourself. I used to be like that too, and it almost drove me to end things. Eventually I discovered that I'm okay with not being perfect all the time, and I'm much happier for it. It's actually okay to feel good about something you didn't put your entire being into and is just "good enough".

The problem with the atheism vs religion argument today is that both sides simply do not understand the other on a fundamental level. They don’t understand where they are coming from, their belief system or their way of viewing the world. It’s like two people who speak different languages trying to communicate. They can both keep talking but neither will ever be understood by each other. It only ever works when you leave your own mindset behind and adopt the other person’s mindset on a fundamental level.

@Leroy0070

25 күн бұрын

One of those is belief system, the other one is a rejection of the belief system.

@Nickers19

19 күн бұрын

Many atheists have been theists and many of the ones who haven't been have studied it to different extents. Some theists talk with atheists and some of them know where the other side is coming from. So, what do you mean? It's true for some, but not all

@jordanbtucker

8 күн бұрын

That makes no sense. This would imply that there are no atheists that have converted theism and there are no theists that have become atheists. Also, this "debate" wasn't atheism vs religion. It was a religious person asking weak questions and getting self-contradicting answers with presuppositions that have no backing evidence.

As an atheist, I am _so_ glad Jordan Peterson is no longer an atheist. I mean, we have no pope, no priests, no dogma, no magic book, and _no required beliefs, whatsoever,_ so it really doesn't make the slightest difference to me what some other atheist thinks. Nonetheless, I'm happy. You guys can _have_ him!

Jordan Peterson: transcendentally is the new ultimately

God, i dont know how i ever listened to JP he pretended to be smart but at the end he was another social scientist.

This is great, just joined, and worth it

The problem with Cain's sacrifices wasn't that they weren't the best he had. The problem was he didn't sacrifice because of love and fear of the Lord. They were prideful. He expected because he was first born that his sacrifice was sufficient and deserving of reward. He expected God to accept his sacrifice because of his lineage.

@shaulkramer7425

Ай бұрын

Both can be true... because he felt entitled, he gave his second best to God.

@johndoh795

Ай бұрын

@@shaulkramer7425 But it's still not the real reason why. Those who pray to God and boast of their lineage find no favor with him.

@ronaldorivera4674

29 күн бұрын

​@@johndoh795It wasn't because of Cain's lineage that he expected God to accept his offering, he and Abel were from the same parents, it was because he wanted to earn it through his works, whereas Abel understood that it's only by grace. Cain started the religion of works, trying to bribe God.

@jon6car

29 күн бұрын

​@@ronaldorivera4674That doesn't really make sense. If Cain wanted to earn God's favor by works then he would've given the best he had in order to "bribe" God.

@ronaldorivera4674

29 күн бұрын

@@jon6car Well let's take a look at what scriptures say he brought, Genesis 4:3 And in process of time it came to pass, that Cain brought of the fruit of the ground an offering unto the Lord. Verse 4: And Abel, he " also" brought of the firstlings of his flock and of the fat thereof. And the Lord had respect unto Abel and to his offerings. I think the key word here particularly is " Also", which to me indicates that he also brought what Cain brought, which was the "firstlings" of his flock and the "fat thereof" meaning the first, best, and fattest of his offerings to sacrifice to the Lord. To me this seems pretty clear, that it wasn't because Cain's offering wasn't good enough but because his heart was leaning on his own self righteousness and not on God. Righteous Abel brought a sacrifice to atone for his sin not to be rewarded. I have to point out that if it was because of his lineage, that doesn't make sense because Abel and Cain had the same parents. Either way I'm sure there are many many ways people interpret this passage, regardless, may the triune God open our hearts and reveal the truth to us, filling us with his spirit, edifying us daily and conforming us into the image of his Son.

I think Jordan's problem is he's beginning to assume that atheists are rejecting the metaphors and morals of religion Although we do reject many of the stories. There's still the general metaphors and morals. It's when you start getting into the magic associated with religion that we have problems

The change in jordans demeanor from jokingly laughing to intense thought cracked me up 😂 0:00-0:03

Materialistic Determinism is itself a loaded statement. With an end goal in mind, there has to be a Mind.

@este4955

Ай бұрын

Determinism was debunked long time ago by double slit experiment.

@silversxm2609

Ай бұрын

Yeah but that's the point there is no really good argument for Atheism.

@JagadguruSvamiVegananda

Ай бұрын

Don't believe everything you THINK. 🧠 Incidentally, Slave, are you VEGAN? 🌱

@Critter145

Ай бұрын

@@silversxm2609 yeah, I kinda reiterated what he already said🤣

@thefuturist8864

Ай бұрын

What ‘end goal’ is in mind? There is a very good argument for atheism; it’s the same argument for not believing in a million invisible, intangible kestrals, or for rejecting the idea that water is liquid sin. We have no reason to believe that for which we have no evidence; if we believe in one non-evidential thing we must of necessity believe in every single other non-evidential thing. Put more simply, if you believe in a god, why not also the kestrals, or the sin-water? Out of all the many thousands of gods that have ever been posited, Christians seem to believe that they chose the right one. Atheists simply believe in one fewer.

Our not understanding of something (as a premise for God) = God of the Gaps. 3:03 "Belief in God [doesn't require evidence]. It's commitment." Now I'd call that an illegal chess move, myself... I love JP, but we part ways on this very subject rather quickly.

@sadsongs7731

15 күн бұрын

JP is like a fairy tale. Some of his quotes are applicable to real life but it's written as fantasy, because he writes for an audience that believes in fantasies and desperately wants to have worldview validated.

That mutation bit about the hierarchy of mutational repair was interesting.

@drooskie9525

28 күн бұрын

Right? Never knew that, but makes perfect sense. Reality really is fractal.

The only reason I’m on my spiritual journey into Christianity is thanks to Jordan Peterson. Ten years ago I was a hardcore atheist, the obnoxious kind, and if you’d told me then where I would stand today, I would not have ever believed it. Looking forward to watching this whole episode. Thank you.

@shadyd2544

Күн бұрын

You gave up on facts for a convinet lie. Nothing more obnoxious than that.

@MrD3000

Күн бұрын

@@shadyd2544 if you think theology is about facts, you’re completely missing the point.

Asking for evidence is an illegal move lmfao ok mista!

@davidbell2547

18 күн бұрын

You misunderstood. It's circular reasoning to think that evidence proves God doesn't exist. God must be outside of creation to be God

@coolcat23

11 күн бұрын

@@davidbell2547 No rational atheists claims that "god" does not exist. Any rational person has to be agnostic about the existence of entities who's very definition defy existence or non-existence proofs. For instance, you cannot prove that garden fairies do not exist if I claim that they cease all activity and turn invisible, the moment you try to establish their existence. Atheism is just the refusal to accept religious claims on the basis of bad evidence. Here's an example for true circular reasoning: "In order to believe, you have to believe.". Apparently, the absence of any evidence to belief is by design, so that you can truly "belief", purely based on faith as opposed to being convinced. This is nothing else but telling someone "In order to be belief X, you have to belief X". I'm sure Peterson could read some "wisdom" into that, but it is just circularity in its purest form.

@Thatguy99991

10 күн бұрын

Okay, so you can give direct evidence for evolution? I have looked at the fossil record or rather studies of the fossil record since no normal person is allowed to directly view except through pictures and I can tell you, the way I saw it without the dogma of evolutionist thought, I couldn't for the life of me see the "evidence" for evolution. All we can say without a doubt from looking at fossils is that something was alive and now it's dead. Evolutionists or better yet modern darwinist atheists look at things from the assumed position that everything on earth came from a single cell that evolved into everything else. Ask a child who hasn't learned evolutionist scripture what a fossil can tell them, many would likely say that's it's a dead thing, a rock or I don't know. In the end there's no concrete evidence for evolution only belief. How many science articles I've read and the honest scientist will tell you they believe or from what they can tell so not actual facts basically.

@micpie9480

8 күн бұрын

@@davidbell2547so you basically came up with a concept that you claim is true because you won’t accept any evidence that says otherwise

"no good argument for atheism" is a non sequitor. Atheism is not an argument...it is simply not accepting a claim. You say you have a magic coin in your pocket that is invisible. I say "I dont believe you". How daft a 3rd party observer would have to be to lean in and say "what is your argument for not believing that?"

@Hobohunter23

16 күн бұрын

I think the benzos fried his brain. unfortunately.

@sadsongs7731

15 күн бұрын

@@Hobohunter23 As much as we would like to blame his behavior on his literal brain damage, he was like this before he suffered that. The truth he is just pandering.

@m11_m11

15 күн бұрын

@@sadsongs7731he moved all the way from being a psychologist in canada to a televangelist in america. he’s just following the money. change my mind.

@sadsongs7731

15 күн бұрын

@@m11_m11 come on! you can't say that. It makes you look close minded. I like the "change my mind" slogan because of its intellectual integrity. I agree he is partially following the money. But I do think he has another, more noble purpose. Jordan seems to think people are weak, stupid, superstitious and manipulable and will *inevitably* to Communism and/or Islam without American-Christianism.

@sadsongs7731

15 күн бұрын

@@m11_m11 it's still dishonest. Even with good intentions.

Wow, you really managed to pull more depth on this out of the good Dr than I anticipated. We've heard him go after atheists before, but this was succinct and scathing at the same time. Home run!

We expect discussion on Theoretical and Practical Spiritual science and philosophy of Abrahmic Religions on the basis ( Religious literature ) Sadhan Marg , Sadhan Padhati , experiences , cosiousness , physical-mental-spiritual changes in human body , Mukti for Self realisation , iternal spiritual awareness , peaceful life . Towards the Truth . * On above subject we expect discussion with Chinmaya Mission Vedanta NewYork Sarvapriyanand Papaji *

goes from a Canadian psychologist to be a tele-evangelist in America

@samuelcharles7642

23 күн бұрын

That’s where the money is

@jessewallace12able

22 күн бұрын

Yes it’s total baloney

@NotAffiliated

12 күн бұрын

He could make more money doing other things if he's so calculating and dishonest. He once said that he spent the first half of his life living more or less as an atheist so now he is spending the second half of his life repenting by slipping preaching into his speeches about psychology. If you don't believe in God or believe Jordan's arguments that's fine but I believe that Dr Peterson is sincere.

@Eigelstein

11 күн бұрын

@@NotAffiliated I think he is sincere, but I also think that he would not be doing any of this if it did not pay his bills. And he may be even more "sincere" in his positions exactly because it pays the bills for his extravagant jackets. "He could make more money doing other things if he's so calculating and dishonest." How do you know that, and like what?

@NotAffiliated

11 күн бұрын

@@Eigelstein Nobody has the luxury to do anything other than what pays their bills. If you rob people for a living your a bum. If you heal people for a living then you are a good man. I'm tired of people suggesting that J.P. is "doing it for the money" when he has been a dedicated healer and shrink his entire life. Every once in a while people strike it big because they are exceptional. J.P. is more wise and insightful than everybody else so he's on top. That's the natural order of things. People just like to try to tear him down because they don't like his message. Some people would rather bitch about their dirty room than just clean it.

So these people believe you can exist outside your body? Love the psychedelic shirt Jordan, and the word salad is great as always

If someone said that there was a super powerful invisible man in the room with us and that I had to obey him should I believe it without solid evidence that it is so?

@Sekaisansen

28 күн бұрын

Your example isnt quite fitting. Because he wants us ti believe Not obey. He wants us to obey because of love and consciousness. He chose and formed the world for us like he wanted. If he has shown himself in the way you described then this life makes no sense in the realm of it being a test. As if every thing in this world can be seen. Or how do you know whether someone loves the other.

I enjoy listening to Jordan when he's in this mood the most. He's treading a hirewire between tired /irritable and educational and guiding...

Dr. Word Salad is at it again

Atheism doesnt need an argument. Its our default state. The burden of proof always lies on the one making a positive assertion.

More, please! I’ve said it before and I’ll say it again, Dr. Peterson is on his way home. Next Easter, Sir? 😉🕊❤️‍🔥

can anyone provide links for 'hierarchy of of mutational repair' that JP talks about?

@jordanbtucker

8 күн бұрын

I don't have a link, but I can tell you that his argument is a strawman. No serious biologist thinks that evolution is purely random. JP even said himself that "part of [the mutation process] is random". This isn't news, and this isn't the gotcha he wants you to think it is.

Well of course not. The best/only arguments for not being convinced that a deity exists, is the lack of good arguments that a deity _does_ exist. Also, even after all these years and all these talks, I _still_ don't understand Peterson's position on whether or not a god exists or does not exist. It's almost like he doesn't want to lose the favor of all the conservatives/people on the right that do believe in a god, yet at the same time seems to recognize that the arguments for a deity existing all fall short, so(like he often does on all sorts of issues), he delves into metaphor, and imprecise language to the point that nobody knows what the hell he's talking about.

@geoffstemen3652

21 күн бұрын

Just say you can’t keep up with him and go.

Peterson adheres strictly to the scientific method in all of his other areas of study; psychology, sociology, etc. follow the data and see where it leads. And then in the area of religious belief he just throws that out the window. Very strange.

@TheEternalOuroboros

28 күн бұрын

It's a cope

@skylinefever

28 күн бұрын

I thought he had something when he suggested the bible is metaphorically true. However, this stuff sucks. Joker is metaphorically true. Joker did not exist. However, that doesn't mean if you cross mentally loners with a society that treats them like trash, you won't end up like Murray Franklin or Thomas Wayne.

@CartoonistDave

28 күн бұрын

When delving into different fields of study some rules won't apply. I don't understand how atheists only want to use one ruleset to discern the reality around them. Even when I was a child, I knew that reality was so much more than what is observed measured and repeated.

@RCGWho

27 күн бұрын

When you see beauty and wonder and order and goodness in the universe but also evil, you start to wonder why about all of it.

@dp2791

26 күн бұрын

You exactly pointed out your issue. You rigidly demand scientific evidence to believe everything, and that's what makes you think you're one of the smart ones.

Could I love Jordan more? No, no I could not. What a fantastic summing up this is.

This was Matt’s best episode as a host and thinker

I feel sorry for the host trying to be civil in the face of JP's rampant irritability. I feel more sorry for all the people who are unable to distinguish this from smartness, and especially those predisposed to being persuaded by the kind of venom that he's practically spitting.

@Bigdogshaving

27 күн бұрын

Sketch

@jaybee9269

25 күн бұрын

He’s disagreeable at worst, not bitchy, or irritable. And it’s wisdom, not smartness.

@Nyghl0

25 күн бұрын

@@jaybee9269 which bit is wisdom though? He outwardly dismisses what amounts to the scientific method: evidence, materialism and determinism - all the things that directly led to the technology to enable him to broadcast his objections to the world at the touch of a button... simply because things look a little bit more complicated at the quantum level. And as we've all seen countless times before, here comes the Jesus smuggling - the "God of the gaps" to fill in the ever decreasing realm of things we don't yet fully understand: instead of "illegally" trying to prove what's real, just commit yourself to a tale because you have an instinct to act socially (conscience), and religious tales often condone acting how we already were. He mistakes correlation with causation - the classic religious error (along with confirmation bias). "And you think well that's not God, well have it your way, like y'know, you're playing games". The game playing is making the jump from the verifiable and falsifiable to all the religious mysticism, for literally no reason than to make it match up with the story you were taught as a kid because you it to be true, which is where the confirmation bias comes in. Perhaps he's saying it in a way that sounds like wisdom to you, but pick it apart and it most fundamentally isn't.

@jaybee9269

25 күн бұрын

@@Nyghl0 >> The aggregate is wisdom. And he doesn’t dismiss evidence; if anything his academic corpus is intensely evidence based. It’s his conclusions in conversation that are often inductive. But inductive logic is valid. I wish I’d had Jordan as a therapist. I know Jordan’s religious philosophy is like nailing Jello to a tree for some very bright and callow young people. But he wants the best for us, after all. I can’t help but wish I’d seen Jordan debate the late Christopher Hitchens.

@Nyghl0

25 күн бұрын

@@jaybee9269 2:57 "Evidence, euargh. Like I said, it's an illegal game move". He literally dismissed evidence in this very video, I wasn't simply falsely accusing him - everything I've said has been backed by evidence or reason. Given his academic background, don't you find it odd that he is quite happy to go along with scientific method, except when it comes to God, when suddenly it's all nonsense? Religious logic is abductive, which is an invalid form of reasoning, it's not inductive. I've no doubt that he means well and does want the best for us, he probably would have made a good therapist for you - I reckon he does believe every single word he says. That's what gives him the conviction in his delivery - same as Hitchens. I'm unsure how well the dynamic between them would have gone though. They both have/had high levels of disagreeableness, Hitchens probably moreso. He tended to run down his opponents like a ruthless but calm and collected juggernaut - I think he exhibited psychopathic traits similarly to his brother, whereas Jordan still retains instincts of a listener underneath his relative aggression. Combine that with their different approaches - Hitchens would moralise politically, but Peterson is much more postmodern with his treatment of truth. Similar to your nebulous "the aggregate is wisdom", he seems to view truth as an emergent quality of action and customs, reasoning something along the lines that the bible "must mean something" given its historical pole position in western literature. It doesn't really mean anything, but it sorta "seems like it should" - and he places this as more true than things you can actually prove to be true. Perhaps Hitchens could have adapted to this, but mostly I think they would have been talking past each other like every other debater of note does with him.

I pray for the day when Jordan finally professes his faith in Christ. Keep praying for him everyone. We're ready for him to marry the psychoanalytical and the literal together.

@donkler5476

Ай бұрын

When's he coming back btw? It's been 2,000 years. Ever think that your religion is just as false as all of the other 4,000+ religions throughout history?

@themanufan8

Ай бұрын

@@donkler5476 not from my experience brotha... God speaks very clearly if you are opening to listen

@kbobdixie1829

Ай бұрын

Jesus is the only verifiable historical deity. ​@@donkler5476

@Tyler-iv7po

Ай бұрын

​@@donkler5476 "This one will get them for sure!!" 😂😂 🤡

@donkler5476

Ай бұрын

@@themanufan8 Yeah if you dig a big hole of confirmation bias, you’ll find anything you want to find at the bottom. That’s why there have been over 4,000 different religions throughout history, each with followers who were just as committed as you are now.

"youll take no solace in your accomplishments if theyre of second rate quality" 🔥

Dang. Never thought I'd see Jordan Peterson be wrong about something. Notice their conversation only concerns fully conscious able adults.

@saracenrush2010

18 күн бұрын

Who knows what challenges those who are mentally handicapped have to overcome that may seem mundane to the regular person. Being your best is not the same as being the best. It's your best, your highest self, whatever that may be. And I feel this could apply to any intellectual capability, in all sorts of ways.

@qersy127

9 күн бұрын

Jordan is generally a wise man, but no one's infallible. He crumbles under pressure so badly when challenged on his literal beliefs on theology.

@multiversalkarma4868

3 күн бұрын

Remember all humans are, well, human. No one is 100% right some are more right than others but no matter how wise and smart an individual they will never be 100% right about everything.

lol Matt's face says it all. Poor guy is trying to get an answer out of Jordan Peterson. It's like herding squirrels! Who's playing games now?

Am I correct in understanding that Jordan Peterson considers science amd religion to be non-overlapping magisteria? (NOMA as defined by Stephen Jay Gould)

I don't think Peterson even knows what atheism is

11:00 minutes of blather by Peterson

Matt you are a fabulous interviewer! ❤ ...and Jordan is one of my favourite type of people - they don't mince words. They start at the beginning & do the work 👍

@Rojofro

Ай бұрын

They are both grifters. Jordan got famous for bm telling others to make their bed with a hint of transphobia.