16 move solution for proof game number 3, it was quite tough (and fun) but I got there in the end 1. Nf3 e5 2. Nxe5 Ne7 3. Nxd7 Nd5 4. Nxb8 a6 5. Nxa6 c5 6. Nxc5 Nf4 7. Nxb7 Nh3 8. Nxd8 Ng1 9. Nxf7 Ra5 10. Nxh8 g6 11. Nxg6 Rg5 12. Nxf8 Bh3 13. Nxh7 Kf7 14. Nxg5+ Ke7 15. Nxh3 Ke8 16. Nxg1

That last one is my proof game! I realized it a day after I submitted it; Yes, it’s possible with 8 moves. The key is to capture both h pawns. Here’s one solution. 1. Nf3 Nf6 2. Ng5 Ng4 3. Nxh7 Nxh2 4. Ng5 Ng4 5. Rxh8 Ne5 6. Rg8 Ng6 7. Ne6 Nh8 8. Nxg7# 1-0 My initial gimmick is time wasting. I overlooked this possibility when I’m making it. Anyway, thanks for playing my puzzle!

@eriksteffahn6172

2 жыл бұрын

Starting with h4 g5 Nf3 gxh4 Nxh4 also works well for a 8 move solution (just move the pieces to the right squars afterwards with Nf6-d5-f4-g6-h8 for black and Nf5, Rh7-h8-g8, Ng7# for white).

@SnowyFreight

2 жыл бұрын

1. h4 g5 2. Nf3 gxh4 3. Nxh4 Nh6 4. Nf5 Ng4 5. Rxh7 Ne5 6. Rxh8 Ng6 7. Rg8 Nh8 8. Ng7# 1-0

@Kat-dp4rh

2 жыл бұрын

1. h4 Nh6. 2. Nf3 Nf5 3. Nd4 Nxh4 4.Nf5 Ng6 5. Rxh7 Nf4 6. Rxh8 Ng6 7. Rg8 Nh8 8. Nxg7# That's very close to what Nelson had, the only "trick" was to waste a time with the knight, so that you could waste another time without problem

For the solo king one, 18 moves is the best. Unless you can get a black knight to g1: First, we realize that the knight changes the color of square it is standing on with every move. Thus getting back to g1 will always take an even number of moves. We have 15 pieces to capture, so that is 15 moves. We must waste 1 move on our first move, where we don't get a capture. So that is 16. We might have to waste 1 move to get back to the g1 square (unless we have gotten a black knight there). That is 17 moves The solution cannot be an odd number, because it is impossible for the g1 knight to be on a dark sqaure after an odd number of moves. Thus we need 18 moves. We can conclude that if a solution exists with 16 moves, it must include getting a black knight to g1. (or b1, in case we use the other knight)

@amaarquadri

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah good point. Getting a black knight to g1 seems tricky...

@marioparramurciano4363

2 жыл бұрын

1. Nc3 d5 2. Nxd5 Nf6 3. Nxe7 g6 4. Nxg6 Ne4 5. Nxh8 Nc3 6. Nxf7 Qg5 7. Nxg5 Bd7 8. Nxh7 Nb1 9. Nxf8 a6 10. Nxd7 b5 11. Nxb8 Kd8 12. Nxa6 Kd7 13. Nxc7 Ra3 14. Nxb5 Kd8 15. Nxa3 Ke8 16. Nxb1 that's with only 16. I think getting it to b1 is easier because you don't have to deal with Nf3 being check

@theredalarm1977

2 жыл бұрын

I had the same thought and was able to make it in 16 moves 1. Kc3 d5 2. Kxd5 Kf6 3. Kxe7 g6 4. Kxg6 h6 5. Kxh8 Be6 6. Kxf7 Ke4 7. Kxh6 Bg8 8. Kxg8 Bc6 9. Kxe7 c6 10. Kxc6 b5 11. Kxa7 Kc6 12. Kxc6 Qd4 13. Kxd4 Ra3 14. Kxb5 c3 15. Kxa3 Kb1 16. Kxb1

@darkphoenix146

2 жыл бұрын

There's the solution with 16 moves and black knight on b1: 1. Nc3 d5 2. Nxd5 Nf6 3. Nxe7 g6 4. Nxg6 Ne4 5. Nxf8 f6 6. Nxh7 Qd7 7. Nxf6+ Kf7 8. Nxd7 b6 9. Nxb8 c6 10. Nxc6 Rh3 11. Nxa7 Nc3 12. Nxc8 Nb1 13. Nxb6 Ra4 14. Nxa4 Rc3 15. Nxc3 Ke8 16. Nxb1

@keymasta3260

2 жыл бұрын

@@darkphoenix146 from definition of Proof Games if white gets to move 16 times vs 15 moves by black that means it's PG in 15.5

Can you show some longer proof games ? Like i know that there is a position where you can get to in around 180 moves, I think that some proof games with 50+ or 100+ moves can be interesting to showcase (you dont have to try to do them, only showing the solution)

@tctrainconstruct2592

2 жыл бұрын

*500-move proof game incoming*

@rainerausdemspring3584

2 жыл бұрын

Apparently postings with a link are often deleted: Therefore: Search for ceriani fabel 183.

@keymasta3260

2 жыл бұрын

I have my Proof Game in 77 on lichess study user keymasta. An interesting fact is that in move 78, White has 1 out of 205 possible moves to choose from. I think 205 moves is the maximum number of continuations from a given position in chess

@rainerausdemspring3584

2 жыл бұрын

@@keymasta3260 In 1964 Nenad Petrovic - a well known retro analysis guru - found a legal position with 218 possible moves: R6R/3Q4/1Q4Q1/4Q3/2Q4Q/Q4Q2/pp1Q4/kBNN1KB1 Note: "Mathematics and Chess" is by *Miodrag* Petkovic :) A position is legal if it can be reached from the starting position. A position with 30 Queens is not legal.

@keymasta3260

2 жыл бұрын

@@rainerausdemspring3584 yes, that's right

The best part of proof games must be analyzing them with stockfish

6:09 you could have played rook to d8, then rook to b8 then rook to a8 or something to waste a move.

I like these more than your regular videos. Might even be better than Stump the Chump! Keep up the good work!

16 move solution for proof game number 3, I was lucky, It was my fifth go. I did it by 1.c3 1. Nc3 d5 2. Nxd5 Nf6 3. Nxe7 Rg8 4. Nxg8 h6 5. Nxh6 Ne4 6. Nxf7 g5 7. Nxg5 Be6 8. Nxe6 Nc3 9. Nxd8 c6 10. Nxc6 Bb4 11. Nxa7 Nc6 12. Nxc6 Ra7 13. Nxa7 b5 14. Nxb5 Ba3 15. Nxa3 Nb1 16. Nxb1

The problem with proof game 3 is, that if you want to do it in 16 moves, you have to capture in EVERY move except the first one. You can only do this by bringing a black Knight to g1. Btw: you can't do it in 17 moves, since a Knight always changes field color and has to end on his starting position. One solution in 16 moves: 1. Nf3 e5 2. Nxe5 Nf6 3. Nxd7 Nh5 4. Nxb8 c6 5. Nxc6 Bg4 6. Nxa7 Rc8 7. Nxc8 b6 8. Nxb6 Qd7 9. Nxd7 g5 10. Nxf8 Rg8 11. Nxh7 Nf4 12. Nxg5 Nh3 13. Nxf7 Rg5 14. Nxg5 Bf3 15. Nxf3 Ng1 16. Nxg1

Last one in 8 moves :) 1. Nf3 Nf6 2. Ng5 Ng4 3. Nxh7 Nxh2 4. Ng5 Ng4 5. Rxh8 Ne5 6. Ne6 Ng6 7. Rg8 Nh8 8. Nxg7#

Imagine being in a classical tournament and your opponent says "Let's do a proof game"

For the last one, you can do it like you did, but waste two moves with black's knight near the end instead of moving their rook to get it to 8 like so: 1. h4 Nh6 2. Nf3 Nf5 3. Nd4 Nxh4 4. Ne6 Ng6 5. Rxh7 Nh4 6. Rxh8 Ng6 7. Rg8 Nh8 8. Nxg7#

Unique and fun chess content!

6:31 Was the rook for black off limits or couldn’t you use that one to do an in between move?

7:40 they mightve meant to get all the pieces on the other side of the board

I got a 12 move solution 1st try for the knights one that you got 13 moves on. 1.c4 d5 2.cxd5 Qd6 3.Nf3 Qe5 4.Nxe5 Bd7 5.Nxd7 Na6 6.Nxf8 Nb8 7.Nc3 Na6 8.Ne4 Nb8 9.Nc5 Na6 10.Nce6 Nb8 11.d6 Na6 12.d7#

My solution for proof 2 in 13 moves: White: Moves queenside knight to c3 e4 g5 e6 then capture the bishop on f8 Moves kingside knight to f3 g5 e6 c pawn captures d3 c4 d5 then marches to d6 d7 (checkmate) Meanwhile black: Marches d pawn to d6 d5 d4 d3 Moves light coloured bishop to e6 c4 Moves queen to d5 Moves the queenside knight between b2 & a3 until checkmate

This is so awesome! I have been showing this kind of content on my channel as well. I love SPGs and Retrogrades. Maybe one day we can collaborate if I ever get on your level. 🙂

11:30 just move blacks a pawn up 2 then move rook to d8 then take other pawn then move c pawn up 1 then take that then follow the chain and waste blacks move by moving the king

3rd one can't be done in 17 moves because the knight changes colour with every move. It must take an even number of turns.

25.39 "How do I get my rook there in two moves" minor promotion?

Thanks Nelson for these amazing videos, when you upload you make my day. I have a video suggestion which would be very helpful for Everyone, ESPECIALLY me, so the suggestion is: when do we know we have to fianchetto our bishop? Have a great day😉

I got #2 in 12 moves: 1. c4 Na6 2. Nf3 d5 3. Nc3 Be6 4. Nb5 Qd7 5. Nbd4 Nb8 6. Nxe6 Na6 7. Nxf8 Qe6 8. Ng5 Kd8 9. cxd5 Ke8 10. Ngxe6 Nb8 11. d6 Na6 12. d7#

12:00 I think c5 is good

this reminds me of a really cool puzzle book- The Chess Mysteries of Sherlock Holmes”.

My solution to the second one: 1. Nc3 d5 2. Nxd5 Na6 3. Nf4 Be6 4. Nxe6 Qd7 5. Nf3 Nb8 6. Nh4 Na6 7. Ng6 Nb8 8. Ngxf8 Na6 9. c4 Nb8 10. c5 Na6 11. Qc2 Qc8 12. Qd1 Qd8 13. c6 Qd7 14. cxd7#

1. h4 kh6 2. kf3 kf5 3. kd4 kxh4 4. ke6 kg6 5. rxh7 kf4 6. rxh8 kg6 7. rg8 kh8 8. kxg7# 8 moves solution for last one

For the second one I got: 1. c4, d5 2. cxd5, Na6 3. d6, Be6 4. Nf3, Nb8 5. Nd4, Na6 6. Nxe6, Nb8 7. Nxf8, Na6 8. Nc3, Qd7 9. Ne4, Qe6 10, Nc5, Nb8 11. Ncxe6, Na6 12. d7#

For the second, there is no way to win a tempo by taking the Bishop with Knight but the Queen with pawn ? Allowing us to move the pawn for 2 and not 1 in his first move ? As the Queen will be capture we can lose a time with her to have the Knight on the good place.

For the second prove game, if you used the b1 Knight, it would not be check

Second one in 12 moves :) 1. c4 Na6 2. Nf3 d5 3. cxd5 Bd7 4. Ng5 Bc6 5. dxc6 Nb8 6. Ne6 Na6 7. Nxf8 Nb8 8. Nc3 Na6 9. Ne4 Nb8 10. Ng5 Na6 11. Nge6 Qd7 12. cxd7#

@japanpanda2179

2 жыл бұрын

I got the same number of moves with a different combination: 1. c4 Na6 2. Nf3 d5 3. Nc3 Be6 4. Nb5 Qd7 5. Nbd4 Nb8 6. Nxe6 Na6 7. Nxf8 Qe6 8. Ng5 Kd8 9. cxd5 Ke8 10. Ngxe6 Nb8 11. d6 Na6 12. d7#

On 11:06 you could play Ke8

With the last one, couldn't you have put black's pawn on h5 and taken it with the knight on the way to g7? No idea if that would actually save any moves tbh

@user-pt1gw5pj4m

Жыл бұрын

It wouldn't because the knight on h5 blocks the rook from getting to g8

13:40 I think the white pawns are moving up the board, no?

For solo king you can play 1.Nc3 b5 2. Nxb5 Nf6 3.Nxa7 Ne4 4. Nxc8 g6 5. Nxe7 Na6 6. Nxg6 Qg5 7. Nxh8 Nc3 8. Nxf7 c5 9. Nxg5 Nb4 10. Nxf8 Nb4 11. Nxf8 Nd5 12. Nxd7 Ndc3 13. Nxc5 Ra4 14. Nxa4 Kd8 15. Nxc3 Ke7 16. Nxb1 Ke8 that's it

@zigzy2967

2 жыл бұрын

There is no 10. Nxf8 because the Knight is on g5, what you have to do is: 10. Nxh7 Nbd5 11. Nxf8 Ra4 12. Nxd7 Nb1 13. Nxc5 Ndc3 14. Nxa4 Kd8 15. Nxc3 Ke8 16. Nxb1

With the knights game can you save time by using both knights

@schwingedeshaehers

Жыл бұрын

you can't with one knight it is theoretical possible in 16 (15 captures, + 1 first move) with 2 knight you need both opponent knight at b1/g1 and something at the other knights first move. (it cant be faster, and is a lot harder to find a 16 move sequenz)

Third one in 20 moves :) 1. Nf3 g5 2. Nxg5 e6 3. Nxe6 Qf6 4. Nxf8 Qg5 5. Nxh7 Nf6 6. Nxg5 Rh7 7. Nxh7 Nc6 8. Nxf6+ Kd8 9. Nxd7 b6 10. Nxb6 Ke8 11. Nxa8 Kd8 12. Nxc7 a6 13. Nxa6 Nb8 14. Nxb8 Bd7 15. Nxd7 f6 16. Nxf6 Ke7 17. Nh5 Ke8 18. Nf4 Ke7 19. Nh3 Kd7 20. Ng1 Ke8

At 10:13 You could just move the King to

This was my solution to the first one: 1. e4 d5 2. d4 e5 3. Bf4 Bf5 4. Bc4 Bc5 5. exf5 exf4 6. dxc5 dxc4 7. Nf3 Nf6 8. Ne5 Ne4 9. Nd3 Nd6 10. cxd6 cxd3 11. Nc3 Nc6 12. Nd5 Nd4 13. Ne3 Ne6 14. fxe6 fxe3 15. O-O O-O 16. d7 d2 17. e7 e2

Proof Game 2,12 moves. 1.c4 d5 2.cxd5 Bd7 3.Nf3 Bc6 4.dxc6 Na6 5.Nc3 Nb8 6.Ng5 Na6 7.Ne6 Nb8 8.Nxf8 Na6 9.Ne4 Nb8 10.Ng5 Na6 11.Nge6 Qd7 12.cxd7#

in the second one you can waste a move with the bishop too

Proof game 6 - 8 move solution: 1. h4 Nh6 2. Nf3 Nf5 3. Ng5 Nxh4 4. Ne6 Ng6 5. Rxh7 Nh4 6. Rxh8 Ng6 7. Rg8 Nh8 8. Nxg7# 1-0

Got the last one in 8 moves first try

his would look really bad taken out of context

I did the 2nd Proof game in 13 and a half moves...

Nice video

My solution to the third one: 1. Nf3 e5 2. Nxe5 Nc6 3. Nxc6 Nf6 4. Nxd8 Bd6 5. Nxf7 Bg3 6. Nxh8 d5 7. Ng6 Ng4 8. Ne7 Ne3 9. Nxc8 b6 10. Nxb6 Rc8 11. Nxc8 Bd6 12. Nxa7 c6 13. Nxc6 Be5 14. Nxe5 Ng4 15. Nxg4 d4 16. Ne5 d3 17. Nxd3 g5 18. Ne5 g4 19. Nxg4 h6 20. Nxh6 Kd8 21. Ng4 Ke8 22. Ne5 Kd8 23. Nf3 Ke8 24. Ng1

solution for the last one in 8 moves: 1.h4 Nh6 2.Nf3 Nf5 3.Ng5 Nxh4 4.Ne6 Ng6 5.Rxh7 Nf4 6.Rxh8 Ng6 7.Rg8 Nh8 8.Ng7

I got one for you. See if you can trigger the '50 move' rule on move 50.

@schwingedeshaehers

Жыл бұрын

easy, only move the knights (and don't hit 3 times the same position)

@angelmendez-rivera351

Жыл бұрын

@@schwingedeshaehers Is that possible? Keep in mind that the Knights must also not capture in order for the 50 move rule to apply. Are there sufficiently many squares on the board such that the Knights can make 50 moves without capturing and without repeating positions? That seems difficult.

@schwingedeshaehers

Жыл бұрын

@@angelmendez-rivera351 I am pretty sure that yes. -> do you have discord?

@schwingedeshaehers

Жыл бұрын

@@angelmendez-rivera351 I found a way for 19 moves with one horse of each player, and for black only going for and back. (And only then I get a first same position) (and it is not optimal)

I solved third OMG!

I found an 8 move solution for the last one! 1. h4 Nh6 2. Nf3 Nf5 3. Nd4 Nxh4 4. Nf5 Ng6 5. Rxh7 Nf4 6. Rxh8 Ng6 7. Rg8 Nh8 8. Nxg7#

proof game #2 12 move game 1. c4 d5 2. Nf3 Na6 3. Nc3 d4 4. Nxd4 Qd5 5. Ne6 Bd7 6. Nxd5 Bc8 7. Nxf8 Bd7 8. Nf4 Bc8 9. N4e6 Bd7 10. c5 Bc8 11. c6 Bd7 12. cxd7#

Ay i did the first in 12

@aperson3787

Жыл бұрын

*second

12 move solution for proof game number 2 (read more) 1. c4 d5 2. cxd5 Qd7 3. Nc3 Qc6 4. dxc6 Bd7 5. Ne4 Na6 6. Nf3 Nb8 7. Nd4 Na6 8. Ne6 Nb8 9. Nxf8 Na6 10. Nc5 Nb8 11. Nce6 Na6 12. cxd7#

#useless