One of the most common questions we get asked on the tech line is “How do I phase in my distributor?” Now, some of you may ask: "What the heck is a distributor? My engine doesn’t have one!" And that may be true, there have not been any distributors used in common factory applications in well over 20 years. But there are plenty of classic muscle, race and historic engines that still use them. And if yours is one of them - this video is for you! Got a topic you'd like us to cover? Leave it in the comments section! ----------------------------------------------------------- Use the shortcuts below to skip to the section that interest you the most: 00:00 Introduction 00:23 What is a distributor and how it works 01:00 Rotor phasing theory 03:55 Adding continuous variable ignition timing 05:40 How to find the angles on your harmonic balancer 07:20 The Swing explained 08:49 Enough theory - now for the practical demonstration

I can't help but feel this video was inspired by a few heated discussions with customers that just didn't understand.

Some very handy tips in there for engines not even running a distributor. Legend Scotty!

We use a sacrificial distributor cap with a hole drilled in it by the #1 cylinder post.

Dayum he just cover my collage ignitions system subject in one go

@strangerdangerous

Жыл бұрын

You made a collage of ignition systems? That's very artistic

Best explanation EVER for rotor phasing on a Dizzy. Important step that is often missed. Awesome job!!

well dang, I thought this was going to be about rotary engines. I guess the older rotaries apply to this. Good work as always!

The best explanation I have encountered.

The rotor is on the distributor and is what spins. The rotor button is the spring loaded "button" on the inside of the cap

Super helpful thanks

Awesome Scotty

Just discovered this channel. Very comprehensive explanations, I like it!

Very clear and informative as always!

Excellent thorough video 10/10.

Thank you as always Scott !

Hands down best explanation i have looked for or ever heard. Champions! Thank you!

Haha, imagine my surprise seeing this video, right after dealing with this very issue on a small block at work. We replaced the dizzy with a cheapo unit, but we were having an issue at low RPM and moderate load. We noticed that the available energy on an open lead was barely more than the plug firing voltage. After the same problem on a new ignition coil, I checked the rotor/reluctor phasing. It was out, the rotor being just past the post on the cap when the coil fired. We spoke with the supplier, they sent us another unit, and it was exactly the same. In the end, we ordered a unit from Performance Ignition, and it was spot on, resulting in plenty of reserve capacity in the firing voltage of the coil.

Thanks haltech, i cant even understand numbers but i still got somthing from this video, thanks for the info

very good, I finally understand this properly

As an "old" guy who grew up working on small block fords and chevys I found this fascinating. I prefer the old ways for sure....like the original 240 Fairlady...

Thanks! Thus made me wanna recheck all this on my 3SGTE.

Man I learned a lot. Thanks. I just learned of this buying s fitec unit

👌👌👌 this info is a must and the way you axplain / perfect bro more and more this style of info 👌🤘✌️

The VW type 3 did use an adjustable points style distributor with multi-point EFI. Its nice to be able to adjust your timing

Just want to say thank you Haltech for your awesome answer to a question that has been bugging me. set the rotor in the middle of ignition timings operating range!!! I have had problems with rotor phase in my SBC with msd programmable it's not happy been at low timing numbers and after this video it all makes perfect sense as to why. Now to fix the issue!

Dang tuning fork! Looks like you got some sun recently. Awesome informative video as always

Thank you very much for making this video. I have been struggling with this problem for a couple of days now. It helped me immensely.

@haltech

3 жыл бұрын

You're welcome! :)

Thanks, doing an Elite 950 on my 95 Cobra. This will come in handy!

old school we would disconnect the vacuum advance and change springs on the mechanical advance and set maximum advance via the limit tags for the centrifical weights, springs would determine when the timing would come in, the advantage was mechanical advance would advance rotor as well as the spark with less chance of cross fire. the distributor you were using obviously didn't use mechanical advance and looked bizarre to an old fart when you revved the engine and no timing changed. nice explanation thanks

That's the go, good one lads

Thank you for covering this. I've been messing with standalone for almost fifteen years now on my l28 and I think Ive made a critical error. I've always set up my rotor phasing at top dead center. It runs and drives fine makes boost... makes good power but it always seems to fall off up top (above 5500) and I think this might be one of the factors. L28et cammed megasquirt V2.2 with over a 100k miles hx35 water meth edis 6. Long list of other stuff. I had an l28 ET out of an 83 which of the hydraulic head and it revved like 67-6800 no problem and pulled like a freight train and ever since that engine blew a head gasket and I replaced it... I've been chasing that and I haven't been able to get it to do it again. 😕

Great video. (I expect this to find it's way into more that a few Mechanic trade school lectures or 'recommend viewing')

Good vid, the only thing I seen you didn't mention was to rotate the crank in direction of rotation to 30 degrees to take the slack out of the timing chain.

@lancecooper4646

3 жыл бұрын

THAT is the key to grasping the whole concept of "advance & retard" the ignition timing...you've gotta know the direction of rotation for the engine AND the dissy...I don't think he got into that......

I'm a 64yo mechanic and grew up with all that dizzy stuff but I have to say your spiel on setting a Dizzy was the most intricate I've ever heard Scotty...Outstandingly confusing to some...From there on out it was a SUN Engine Analyzer to give the results on the oscilloscope and adjust accordingly...No such thing as an old school Tune-Up anymore...Man I love EFI but have there's something about a camed carby V8...Maybe I'm just old.

Great as always 💪 much love from Detroit 👍 THANX Great job

You can also just measure the circumference of the damper and divide by 12 to mark the 30 deg. position.

Awesome

Good video i like

Good idea to disable the ignition too just for the first crank if there's any fuel sitting around still in a port. Great video though

very good video i really wish you could use honda as an example because D and B series engine have electronic controlled ignition with distributor but at the same time all engine position sensors are inside the distributor what means changing the angle of distributor affects injector phasing what can also affect how engine runs also its important to scale the ignition map so it will work properly i know tuners which are in busines for years and dont know how it works one tuner a friends of mine got a look at my map and didnt undestand how it is possible that ive set -8 deg ignition software we use allows 60deg so depending on what we set in first square of the ignition map we can adjust base timing and from base timing we have -20 +40 deg range some engines had 12deg marked on pulley other 14 so its important to set base timing properly and if needed for specific aplication adjust it

Great info as always! scott, what start point would you recommend for an L20B na. I am using a Ka24e dizzy!

Good today to post

That dizzy just had less timing drift than any factory Nissan trigger setup

Any plans to do a "Whats so special about" on the EJ207? JDM STI engine is quite understated, used widely in motorsport. I was really surprised when I found out people from the US never got these engines in their STI! explains all the stereotypes.

Leave it to EFI to make distributors overly complicated. I kid, the results are impressive, my distributor triggered system on my SBC always had a jitter of 1-3 degrees. That rock solid timing mark you got is amazing. Now I'm wondering if you have any tricks for the lack of coil dwell time as the RPMs increase with an 8 cylinder engine?

Yes that good I have a ford Capri which have none of these thing very old fashion so which side of the zero mark is the before and after in order to set up the timing thank

What damper did you use to get a 36-1 wheel on a SBF? The only one I know that came factory like that was the Ford Explorer, and it is a one-piece unit with the crank pulley with the wrong offset any other accessory drive system.

“You don’t know car history, but that’s ok!!!”

Would this still apply to cars running a distributor as an engine trigger/cam sensor? For example, my little Mazda Familia Running an FE3 engine and adaptronic ECU. It's running yaris coil on plug, fired by the adaptronic, but the distributor is still fitted to the engine (Just with no Coil or plug leads). I suppose the easy way to check would be lock the timing at say 10 or 15 degrees in the adaptronic and check that it lines up on the balancer?

What is this perfect timing? I've been battling a no start after my distributor died and as my first carb&distributor car I'm struggling to get her running. Thank you Haltech!

@Ryan-hf9qz

3 жыл бұрын

It’s not 180° out? That’s pretty common

8:15 "The name of the game is to have the smallest distance between the rotor button(? blade) and the target post under all firing angles." Agreed, but if the point is to reduce the chance of rotor arc to the wrong terminal post, rotor fazing calculations should include expected spark duration. Sure with CD type ignitions the duration is short enough to ignore, but other ignition types can have 10* to as much as 30* of spark duration. Does it really make sense to allow for 20* (crankshaft) computer timing change, but ignore say 15* to 20* of spark duration ? The rotor swing angle should be from the earliest trigger point(most advanced) to the latest point where spark exists(latest trigger point plus expected spark duration). The mid-point of THAT swing angle is where the "target post" should be. Yes, ignoring spark duration makes a complex idea simpler. But isn't it better to provide all of the information for those who can soak it in.

Lovin the Bronco. Thanks for the vid Scott. I think I now know why I could never get the timing right on a 6cyl I once owned. How's the rear castor rod bushes going in that beast? You can change them in an hour so if need be. cheers.

@haltech

3 жыл бұрын

It's actually an F350 pickup. It's a beast!!!

@victorbitter583

3 жыл бұрын

@@haltech Nice.

Scott, My Miata has 4 Brembo rotors. Do I need to mark each one with Liquid Paper? Timing light reaches both front wheels, but I need an extension for the rear. How many Pi's do I use? Can they be cherry?

@robmotown1

3 жыл бұрын

Barney Ward, Somerset, NJ You would be better off replacing the rotors with newer style drums.....you can get the job done by hitting the drum with a stick.... when you get the most base.....that's when your timing is correct!!! It's so much better having drum timing!!! You don't have to worry about any timing marks. It's done by ear on all 4 corners.

@bvward

3 жыл бұрын

@@robmotown1 Good advice! I'll reach out to Gretsch and Ludwig to see what's on offer. I'd hate to get snared by an inferior product.

@robmotown1

3 жыл бұрын

Barney Ward, Somerset, NJ sounds great!!! If they want to charge more than $100 for the lot...thats a symbol they are beating you up!!

Download and print a protractor and tape it to the balancer. Make pointer. Degree wheel for free

what can you do if forgot to mark the pin when disassembling distributor how do you fix the phase

Is the Porshe 993, 3.6 engine a four-stroke engine? Thanks, Ken

BHello Scott; I like to know if you can tell me how this dist-phasing will help my 1986 BMW 635? Thanks; Brian

So, when you have an old engine, like a ford YB, and want to change from distributor to coil on plugs, you still need a phase sensor signal to the ecu? or is a crank sensor enough?

@lasersimonjohnson

3 жыл бұрын

You still need a phase sensor

7:13 was it set to scale? Doesn't look like 30°

Hello Scott I'm Kevin from Malaysia , I'm using a Datsun B310 . Car starts perfect at times and dies within 20 minutes during idling . When it dies I'll need someone to crank while I knock the distributor and starts perfect . What could be the problem? Bearings in the distributor? Thank You 🙏🏼

It’s better to mount a trigger wheel on the crank pulley in my opinion

I have a question I need a new complet ac for freelander 1 which on suit for my car please let me know heltech can help

Any reason why you can't remove a spark plug, put a thin stock in it and turn the crank to figure out whether the cylinder is on the intake or exhaust stroke on these engines?

@justinbegley2310

3 жыл бұрын

That would only tell you TDC not which stroke its on

So my car breaking up at 4000 could be phasing issues 🤔 would save me a bunch not swapping carb

Great now I’m even more confused lol😂

What brand distributor is that?

1:00 "The distributor is driven of the camshaft" ...or this is what I thought until my VW didn't start after I had to replace my cracked cylinder head. The car didn't try to start at all, but the next day I checked my repair manual and found out that the distributor is connected to oil pump shaft. Ofc I didn't time my oil pump gear at all, and the timing was way off. The manual had great instructions to get the timing about right in couple of minutes. After that the car started and just had to be warmed up to operating temperature, and then the ignition timing is set on idle to 6 degrees (+/- 2deg) BTDC with timing light. After couple of starts, timing checks and re-adjustments the timing was on point.

Bronco XLT FTP....um.....EFi with Fast ignition. Aussie Falcon 5.0 EFi HO swap. For others fron the USA, thats an exported Mustang/ Mn12 Thunderbird, F150 or USA Explorer based 1992 to 1996 5.0 Lit(er) with Sequential injection via either TFi or the later Explorer EDiS 8. Most people down here dont realise that Ford Australias Bronco and F 100s had a 216 hp 351 Cleveland 2V 4 bbl till 1985, then a 195 hp 5.0 Lit(er) Bank fire US import engine for late 1985 till 1988 when local production ceased. So that Sequential 5.0 EFi engine Mr Haltrch is working on is an EB to EL Falcon 5.0 from 92 to 96 which is pretty different. Non of the Aussie Explorers got a 5.0...only the Falcon/Fairmont/ Fairlane/LTDs from 92 to 2002. Some were even 5.6 lit(er) strokers. Sensational info Mr "Haitch"!

So, is this basically putting the engine and computer in sync, so then you can use the computer to control exact engine time and advance and retarding, however you like, is, tuned?

"Rotary for evah" - Keisuke Takahashi

@haltech

3 жыл бұрын

Different kind of rotor bud....

@nightkids7163

3 жыл бұрын

Rotaries are good and all, but have you ever tried reliability? :P

@christrovellebarredo2316

3 жыл бұрын

@@haltech NaH they're "Doritos"

@christrovellebarredo2316

3 жыл бұрын

@@nightkids7163 they ain't reliable like the piston counterpart but they are reliable in different way cuz they had different needs in terms of reliability such as hitting redline in order to expel excess hydro carbons, chemistry session when filling up fuel and etc.

@nightkids7163

3 жыл бұрын

@@christrovellebarredo2316 so basically premix your fuel, and flog the daylights out of them, voila. reliable dorito?

This makes me upset at many people teaching me an inferior way to install distributors! Does rotor phasing matter as much for unmodified vehicles? I’ve been taught to install it at TDC of compression. Boats, cars all the same. I was told vacuum or mechanical advance systems keep the timing o.k. I have observed arc pitting on the rotor, towards the leading or trailing edge when replacing on vehicles. Though, looking at manufacture instructions, it usually says to lock the ignition and install the Distributor @ CYL1 TDC. Once it’s in you get that +/-10-15^ sweep from the adjuster bolt to set base timing. On OEM systems the rotors generally have a good surface area, and I never have misfires or problems doing it that way. Now I’m even more confused hahahaha

I'm playing with a haltech e6x 1996 2.6 tf rodeo 4ze1 4cyl Need as much help as I can If anyone has any old maps or setup configurations

I came here for twin spark plugs and eccentric shafts

Why use electromechanical distributors at all when there are more reliable aftermaket alternatives?

4:40 - isn't that 10° before TDC and 10° after TDC, because the crankshaft is set on the mark at 0°? With a range of 20 degrees it is half the one way and half the other way. Or am I mistaken? Thanks for the video!

im old enough to still need my points gapped

ROTOR not rotor button, the button is in the cap!!

Heltech ac

Scott, you rock, but I gotta call you out. Your decimal expression of Pi is correct. A more accurate, and helpful expression would be its fraction 22/3.

First mad

@haltech

3 жыл бұрын

Mad!

@jinan_hwasal

3 жыл бұрын

You both mad

Huh ?

turning the wrong way idk

L SERIES WOOO

@DRIFTSUN

3 жыл бұрын

What he said!!

Mighty Datsun L series funny joke