Here's what I will say about the villain/antihero/hero debate around Paul: 1. An anti hero is usually someone with good intentions but whose actions are BAD. The punisher: good intentions = wants to rid the world of criminals that the broken system refuses to do anything about. He wants to protect the innocent by killing other murderers and rapists. But he still does BAD THINGS HIMSELF. He kills. He's an antihero. SO IS PAUL. Paul may have good intentions, and you even can agree with his good intentions. (hell, I agree with the Punisher!) but that doesn't make what Paul is doing GOOD. Paul is still using a story made up by his mothers' people to take advantage of an oppressed group of people to take revenge and start a universe wide holy war. 2. Paul fights and FIGHTS the messiah thing bc he literally says the Fremen should be led by one of their own. He's just there to help. And when he finally gives in to the messiah fairytale, the narrative doesnt frame it as heroic. If you notice the soundtrack, the visuals, it's not framed as grand and heroic. It's framed as....a little dark. Frank Herbert's story is a critique on the white savior trope. Paul is an example of a white savior who, while at first wants to free them and save them, he ends up using them to his own advantage and kills thousands of them. So, it's okay to LIKE Paul and even root for him, but I would watch calling him a hero. He is a victim, yes, but he can be a victim and STILL have bad actions. EVEN if he has good intentions. Calling him a villain isn't true either, it's just a cool song I chose to edit to for fun! So...it's okay to like Paul. Hell I love him. But I recognize that he's an antihero.

@MrJakeasaur98

Ай бұрын

I kinda disagree that Paul is an anti-hero, even by the definition you've given - does Paul truly have good intentions? A rather big plot point that's emphasised in the sequel movie is that Paul is seeking revenge. Not justice. He knows that the only way to get his revenge is to choose the path to a jihad, and he does so willingly because he is so consumed by his need for revenge not only against the Harkonnens, but the Padishah emperor as well, all for their part in the murder of his father and house. That revenge extends to the lesser houses for their indifference towards the power struggle, when the majority were likely innocent of any ill will towards Paul before his actions portrayed in part 2. There were likely other routes to achieve justice, but the path he chose was the one that assured him revenge. That's not to say there are benefits to his actions. As far as the Fremen are concerned, this is for the betterment of their planet. That's certainly true to an extent, but I don't think Paul particularly cares about that goal outside of know it helped him gain the loyalty of the less fanatical Fremen early on. The boy that Paul was likely had good intentions, but he died the moment the Harkonnens tried to leave him for dead in the desert. The man he became is more Villain than Anti-Hero. I'm not surprised this movie was more successful in appealing to a wider audience nowadays than the older adaptations were, because in recent years we've seen a surge of media following "bad" characters - shows like Breaking Bad, Peaking Blinders and The Walking Dead to name a few.

Timothee is excellent!!!!! Can’t wait for the messiah (part three) Lisan Al Gaib

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

He really is Paul atreides through and through!

Lisan al-Gaib is supposed to make Arrakis green, Paul did exactly that

@dosomestuff1949

Ай бұрын

No, he was responsible for billions of deaths across the galaxh

@GabrielSanchezGameDev

Ай бұрын

@@dosomestuff1949he prevented the deaths of billions more by keeping the firemen under his rule. Also, should he have let the others snuff him and the firemen out ? The Atreides were already snuffed out. Should Europe have surrendered during ww2 to prevent deaths?

@dosomestuff1949

Ай бұрын

@@GabrielSanchezGameDev he did not prevent the deaths of billions more. idk about him being snuffed out, but the fact that the fremen follow him so blindly is what's terrifying. Leaders like this are all over the world, and they are terrible people, massacaring others in their name.

@danieltchernov7745

Ай бұрын

@@GabrielSanchezGameDev The Jihad ultimately killed more people than it saved and worsened the average life among the whole galaxy. The Jihad was happening regardless of Paul's will however, Sure he could keep them alive but the fanaticism was out of his control do you think he ordered them to burn bodies? the symbolism alone in that makes the idea of Fremen committing countless atrocities in his name a reality.. Self preservation doesn't make one good or bad but the Holy war was far from "good" or even about self preservation, he had more paths but he chose the only one that would give him revenge. The WW2 example doesn't work as an analogy though, because in that instance MORE lives wouldve died from surrender.

@GabrielSanchezGameDev

Ай бұрын

@@danieltchernov7745 it does work as an analogy. The number of lives is irrelevant. The question is them or us. I choose us any day.

This is so good!!!!

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

Tysm!

villains u say ohhh this was fire 🔥🔥🔥

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

Thank you!! I’m glad you liked it!!

Paul is 1 of the greatest villains of all time. He let billions of people did just so that he & his Mother & Alia live.

Wow it was beautiful 😮

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

Tysm!!!

underrated edit of dune

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

Thanks!!!

He's not a villain just the wrong person. He's son the chosen one not him

Lisan al-Gaib

The lisan al gaib is no villain. He’s the messiah

Beautidul video and I agree with your pinned comment.

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

Thank you!! And even if people don’t have the same viewpoint, that’s okay! But that’s how I have interpreted the movie/book!

@Wintersmith.

Ай бұрын

@@flygurl2Zim for me, it was the critique of the white saviour trope that I liked about the movie. The way they've shown Paul embrace the messiah role? Wonderful acting and wonderful commentary

Broo you gotta eat 🍟🥥🥑🍏🥐

bro is not villan he is a victim

@nelson_rebel3907

Ай бұрын

Someone hasnt read the books

@d-_-b8558

Ай бұрын

Like so many villains are. Spoilers for Dune Messiah and God Emperor of Dune: Paul's jihad kills 61 billion people across the Imperium and starts a dynasty of oppression that will last over 3,000 years after his death.

@aliuzun2220

Ай бұрын

@@nelson_rebel3907 I have read them twice when paul discovered the jihad it was already too late even falling in to his knife couldt stopped the jihad he can only lower mitigate the destruction by overseeing and declare him self god emperor and by the way discover that atriedes family actually are the hero and leto2 saved humanity with his golden path in 5 6 book now shut it

@nelson_rebel3907

Ай бұрын

@@aliuzun2220 someone got defensive. Pauls actions were still completely villianous. Doing things in the name of some future survival doesnt excuse the entire persecution of religious jihads that wiped entire planets of people.

@jaybristowe2346

Ай бұрын

He can be both

Yet, in Dune Part 2, he rallied against every villainous impulse until he confronted the conspirators who murdered his father. His demeanour throughout the film was definitely not of a cold blooded villain. He was sincere, respectful, softly-spoken (upto the Southern scene), and even continued to confront his mother on her Order's machinations. It's too basic to call Paul a bad guy especially since both Dune movies go out of their way to portray him as the opposite.

He's not a villain, despite what the director wants us to think with his dumb rewrites.

@M4cTr1cK

Ай бұрын

My brother even the original author of the books wants you to see Paul as a cautionary tale not to follow charismatic leaders. Maybe not a villain, but sure as heck not a hero/messiah either. False prophet or anti-hero would be better labels.

@d-_-b8558

Ай бұрын

The shallow understanding is that Paul is a blameless hero. The elevated understanding is that Paul is not the hero, he's actually the villain. The TRUE understanding is that Paul IS the hero, but that heroes are flawed, fallible people who often have unforeseen consequences. Frank Herbert literally said in interviews that Paul's story is a cautionary tale about how hero worship is a dangerous thing and it's how atrocities are committed. Herbert was troubled that so many people sided with Paul at the end of Dune, despite the evil things he did in his pursuit of justified revenge. So he wrote Dune: Messiah to confirm for the audience that, yes, Paul was a victim, but his rule also led to unspeakable evils being committed in his name. Hence Paul's terrified vision in the first movie. It's not a dumb rewrite, you just didn't get the point of the books.

@apples8872

Ай бұрын

It is a cautionary tale but Paul wasn’t charismatic he was given signs and his path was laid out in front of him. He really had no choice at all if his fate was already decided. I don’t see him as a villain but a man put in a shitty situation

@monojuice

Ай бұрын

Literally starts Messiah off comparing himself to Hitler. Not a villain though am I right?

@andrewomahony9260

Ай бұрын

Anyone can judge the character of someone based on the result, without forgetting the reason. He and his entire family were under siege by the rest of the great houses, so he took the only option available to him. That doesn't make him a villain anymore than Saladin or Alexander.

villains ?

@BB-cn6mk

Ай бұрын

yes paul is the anti-hero or pretty much the villain in his story. should be obvious by now but it will be in third if u didnt ge that part

@dosomestuff1949

Ай бұрын

Yes. Paul atreides is not the hero

@flygurl2Zim

Ай бұрын

@@BB-cn6mk agreed!! Paul is shown as a very complex protagonist, but that doesn’t mean he’s a hero. He does begin a universe wide holy war 😳

@GabrielSanchezGameDev

Ай бұрын

Explain how he is a villain or anti hero? I only hear people parroting what everyone else says about it but no one explains why. Did the emperor not start the war when he snuffed out the atreides and persecuted the fremen? Should they just accept it? The great houses didn’t accept his ascendency. So then it’s their fault right ? He gave them a solution without conflict.

@fyrewolf7805

Ай бұрын

@@GabrielSanchezGameDev basically it's a mixed bag. on one hand, since he's seen the future, he knows this is the only way, and his enemies are really bad people. but to do all that, he plays into a prophecy he knows is false, planted by the Bene Gesserit, and he brings fremen into a war that will kill most of them and cripple their society (he's essentially fighting everyone in the galaxy). i suppose they can't be oppresed if they're dead, but essentially he's screwed them over. this was the only way for him to come to power. this was not the only way for the fremen to escape oppression. arguably there was no way, but the fremen hiding in the south and living their lives is arguably a better fate than dying to war. Look at this from the emperor's point of view. Paul kills an entire clan, a planet's worth of soldiers, kills some of your soldiers, violently takes the throne, and then expects you to just let him chill and wait for him to invade. And trust me, Paul was not sated. He would have invaded either way.