This is a complex teaching! What so I need to spend more time understanding with grater clarity?

@netherquartz8946

6 ай бұрын

Just FYI it's greater. Not grater. Also, haven't watched the video yet but to answer your question about complexity in some ways it is very simple. Everyone who has lived or is living or will live will be resurrected and live in heaven apart from those who deny this gift after having a perfect knowledge of it.

@mycatwould

6 ай бұрын

Also “what do I need…” not “what so I need”. All good, I’m all thumbs too LOL.

@yvonnejohnson9587

6 ай бұрын

We also believe that our Heavenly Father is and always will be the God of this universe.

@nathanshaw6303

6 ай бұрын

As you have started to realize, the details of this doctrine can be found in modern-day revelation. Study Doctrine and Covenants sections 76, 78, 88 131 and 137. Toss in all litte 2 Cor 12. As a start. More hard teachings? Who can hear? Thanks for taking a look at this talk.

@janet-Spirit_of_the_Living_God

6 ай бұрын

@@yvonnejohnson9587And so the further explanation of that would be that you and your eternal spouse become gods of another universe???

Speaking as an active Latter-day Saint, It’s not really about what we DO. It’s about what we BECOME and Jesus is central in this. It’s a holy process of continual re birth in Christ. Without Him we are Nothing.

@nonrepublicrat

5 ай бұрын

Not entirely accurate. What we become is the result of what we do. Those cannot be separated.

@anneknudsen8338

5 ай бұрын

⁠@@nonrepublicratyes. I agree. Obviously what we do matters. But we can DO things without becoming something better. I can go to church but not take it into my heart. I can give to the poor without feeling charity. My point is God wants us to grow as His children. This requires practice, ongoing repentance in an effort to become. It is a sacred partnership with Christ. “take my yoke upon you and learn of me.”

It is TRUE, the LDS church IS a works base religion, because faith without works is dead, or in other words, faith without works is not faith, therefore the LDS church is a FAITH base religion. Makes perfect sense.

@godsoffspring4195

5 ай бұрын

"Faith without works is dead" - Jesus Christ. :>)

@stephtimms1776

5 ай бұрын

@@godsoffspring4195 🎗 Where did he say that? James said it in James 2.

@hudsonhorizons8859

5 ай бұрын

@@stephtimms1776James 2:17

@godsoffspring4195

5 ай бұрын

@@stephtimms1776 ... Hi Steph. Yes, in James 2. All throughout the chapter, James is teaching what Jesus has said. You can't have faith without the works to go with it. 11 For *HE* that said, Do not commit adultery, said also, Do not kill. Now if thou commit no adultery, yet if thou kill, thou art become a transgressor of the law..... 17 Even so faith, if it hath not works, is dead, being alone....... 18 Yea, a man may say, Thou hast faith, and I have works: shew me thy faith without thy works, and I will shew thee my faith by my works....... 20 But wilt thou know, O vain man, that faith without works is dead?...... 26For as the body without the spirit is dead, so faith without works is dead also.

@stephtimms1776

5 ай бұрын

@@godsoffspring4195 🎗 Yep, and Matthew 7:19, "Every tree that bringeth not forth good fruit is hewn down, and cast into the fire." ~ Jesus Christ. That doesn't nullify the equal or greater importance of faith though, because faith enables works. Neither does it take anything away from the Atonement of Jesus Christ in his sacrifice for the salvation of all men.

Hey Jeff , I stopped by my local LDS meetinghouse and never knew their was one in my own town and I plan on going to a Sunday service for the first time soon

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328

5 ай бұрын

I've been to several in CA and UT. The last time I went right after my own Bible church meeting so I did a word tally at each on words such as Jesus, grace, mercy, salvation, prophet, sacrament, ordinance, prayer, God, etc. I'd be interested to hear what you think of your experience and if you have any church background to begin with.

@hollayevladimiroff131

5 ай бұрын

Mormonism s nonbiblical, they believe Jesus is created, pease do your research before getting involved with this church, it is not a Christian church!!

@NateWoodbury

5 ай бұрын

@@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328 This is an awesome exercise that I would encourage with some context. Remember that LDS clergy are unpaid volunteers, and those who speak in sacrament meetings or teach in classes, are just members of the congregation. Sometimes we slip into personal stories and experiences. The goal of every meeting is to focus on Jesus Christ. If in a particular meeting, your word tally is low, come back again the next week to hear from completely new people.

As to President Oak's description of people suffering for their own sins, that teaching is best explained from D&C 19:16-19: "16 For behold, I, God, have suffered these things for all, that they might not suffer if they would repent; 17 But if they would not repent they must suffer even as I; 18 Which suffering caused myself, even God, the greatest of all, to tremble because of pain, and to bleed at every pore, and to suffer both body and spirit-and would that I might not drink the bitter cup, and shrink- 19 Nevertheless, glory be to the Father, and I partook and finished my preparations unto the children of men." We believe that this suffering for all those that will not repent will happen before judgment in the spirit world. They must still pay the demands of justice before they enter into a lower degree of glory. However, for all those that repent, the atonement of Jesus Christ satisfies the demands of justice and encircles them about in the arms of mercy, and such do not need to pay for their own sins. For those that must suffer for their own sins, this is often times described as a form of "hell," although not the only definition latter-day saints ascribe to the word hell.

@thisorthere

5 ай бұрын

I think that's a good reference for the other quote from Doctrine & Covenants 138. But I'd also add President Oaks' quote from Doctrine & Covenants 76 about how Jesus "glorifies the Father, and saves all the works of his hands". Or in other words, even after suffering for sin (which we all do to some extent), all our salvation comes through the grace and power and atonement of Christ, no matter the degree of glory. What you said isn't contrary to that. I just wanted to add the further clarification.

@markwellsfry9843

5 ай бұрын

So much religion that does not come from the revealed Word of God ( the Bible ). My understanding is that the LDS Church accepts the King James Version as their official Bible scripture. Interesting to me that apparently the Joseph Smith Version of the Bible is so awful that upon reflection, and with honest scholarship, the LDS Church could not accept it as anything other than a bad paraphrase of the 1765 KJV. I also find it interesting that the Reorganized LDS Church ( Disciples of Christ) reject Temple ordinances, The Pearl of Great Price, and many of the D&C's. Quite a departure for the 1st wife of Joseph Smith Jr. And his son.

@brainhunter1000

5 ай бұрын

@@markwellsfry9843 on the contrary, just about everything stated can be seen in the Bible. Even the degrees of glory. They just aren’t explained as clearly. As for Joseph smith’s son rejecting part of the truth, I’ll just point to Adam and Eve whose own son was the first murder when he killed Abel. Free agency is free agency, even for a prophets son.

@danacowles2848

5 ай бұрын

Yes

@cheyaweber704

5 ай бұрын

@@markwellsfry9843 Joseph Smith only added clarification to certain verses in the Bible. He didn't translate the whole Bible so there was nothing to rejected. Secondly, the Disciples of Christ broke off from the Restored Gospel so they can decide what they want to believe and what not to believe. Isn't that how it is with each different Protestant religion?

I am extremely happy with this doctrine, as it shows me how kind God is and wants to share everything He has with his children. I would be very sad if after this life I did not have my beloved wife and my beloved son. All of this is possible thanks to Jesus Christ, our savior. Some evangelical friends have difficulty accepting this doctrine because it requires extra effort, it requires us to go the extra mile. But praying, having faith, caring for the poor, etc., are all work, and this all brings us closer to God. When I stop to think about the revelations of the prophets of our day, I am very amazed at the greatness of God's plan. The history of this world is still being written, it did not end with the death of the apostles and God continues to act and will still reveal many things concerning the salvation of men.

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328

5 ай бұрын

I would say the teaching is extremely controlling and short sighted. The Bible actually goes so far as to exalt those who are called to singleness and teaches that women are not saved thru childbirth or marriage. Even Jesus himself wasn't married, neither were most of the disciples and other figures of the New Testament! What humiliation that the LDS church offers only a lesser heaven for those who don't marry or don't measure up to be worthy of a temple marriage, etc. What a different view of God this takes from the Biblical view of the love He has for those who choose Him once He has chosen us! The point about heaven is worshipping our Savior, not being eternally pregnant to populate new worlds, and sharing a husband with as many wives as he wants. What a strange focus to have about eternity. (It's actually quite close to the Muslim view of having endless virgins at beck and call, and for the women to not get flabby breasts.) How sad Jesus must be to be sidelined for an extended eternal earthly spouse instead of being glorified and celebrated as the amazing head of the church and bridegroom that we will all celebrate at the marriage supper of the Lamb of God, who laid down His life for each one of us. Read Revelation where we will be completely awestruck by Him, face to face. He is supposed to be the center of our lives, not our home, our church or even our spouse or children. This is the teaching of the Bible and the Holy Spirit.

@immrfun

5 ай бұрын

@@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328you lost me when you said Jesus was not married. Little is known of Jesus’ personal life, but the circumstantial evidence indicates he was likely married. Perhaps look a bit deeper into your scripture study. Same question posed to another; does it bother you if he was married?

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328

5 ай бұрын

@@immrfun LOL, with a response like that you better state your Bible verses as to why you think Jesus was married. Paul also encouraged singleness to have more availability for ministry. Doesn't bother me one way or the other, since I've lived in both places, but it's just odd to have an entire LDS saving theology that depends on women being married in the temple and doing XY&Z, when Jesus mentions none of that to any of the women (or the men) he grew up with on earth.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@immrfun to answer your question about it bothering me if he was or wasn't married... no. Not really. Obviously it was not of much concern to Christ or to His Apostles if they did not find it necessary to write down even a passing mention of a potential wife.

@BrianTerrill

5 ай бұрын

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328 the Bible does teach that women are saved through childbirth. It literally says that: "15 Notwithstanding she shall be saved in childbearing, if they continue in faith and charity and holiness with sobriety" (1 Timothy 2:15)

I love that Elder Oaks admits, “There is much we don’t understand” True! We don’t know much about the afterlife, mercy, justice and judgment of our savior. What I do know is many in this world of different faiths are marvelous people and are doing the best they know how to do. Those who have charity, it will be well with him in the last day. I’m not sure how much the Lord focuses on our differences. I’m sure we will all learn a ton in the next life. When the savior appeared to the people in the America’s, he simply clarified and corrected the doctrines the people and told them not to contend one with another and then onward. I love Elder Oaks talk and pastor Jeff’s perspective.

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328

5 ай бұрын

@@leilettesartoga7276 If you want to know more, study the New Testament, one word at a time, as a child would read it, without church commentary. Commit to it and ask for divine guidance for His truth alone.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

I'm curious then what value is there in a prophetic connection to the divine, if it doesn't appear to answer these types of questions.

@kylebaggaley

5 ай бұрын

I certainly believe modern day revelation is greatly valuable and is absolutely necessary as it gives us what we get what we need at this point in our existence. It certainly hasn't made all things known especially regarding the afterlife and I'm okay with that! As Elder Oaks says, "there is much we don't understand", but this doesn't diminish the value of what we do understand. I leave it at that rather than speculate further than our leaders' words. @@BrendonKing

@Compulsive-Elk7103

5 ай бұрын

Jesus did NOT visit the Americas

@Pastor Jeff, did you catch Elder Oaks' statement that the Terrestrial Kingdom is comparable to much of the mainstream view of Heaven. Those who go there will experience Heaven as much of Christianity teaches. They will enjoy the presence of Jesus Christ. They are not married. They will be in a state of glory. They are good people who accept Jesus as their savior. LDS doctrine just teaches that there is something more for those who are willing to make the necessary commitments. Thus, the LDS believe that good people such as yourself will receive the type of heaven that you are seeking.

@elijahkropf

5 ай бұрын

While this is true for Latter-day Saints, let's be careful not to assume we know where anyone we deem righteous or otherwise will end up in eternity. Our judgement is often clouded by our own perspective.

@mossandsea

5 ай бұрын

Also did we catch what Jesus Christ said about Heaven and Marriage in the NT? Because it's not at all in line with LDS doctrine. ( source: I'm LDS).

@gem7sagg

5 ай бұрын

​​​​@@mossandseaWhen Christ said they are not married or given in marriage in the ressurection he meant that they would already be married by proxy in temples before they were resurrected. We don't get ressurected to a Celestial glory until after we get married in a temple. Everyone will have a chance at that. Even the babies and small children who died before they turned 8 years old. People will be ressurected to the Celestial Kingdom from the start of the ressurection. (The morning of the first ressurection up to 500 years into the Millennium. There will be enough time for everything to happen. Then from about 501 to 1000 years of the Millenium the Terrestrial will be ressurected. I'm not sure of the exact number of years but a given time will be set apart for them. They will not be married. After the Millennium the inhabitants of Hell will be ressurected. They will also not be married nor given in marriage. So this is what Christ meant when he said that scripture.

@rebekahedwards5318

4 ай бұрын

Christians believe in ONE heaven and ONE hell.

I appreciate your respect and understanding, albeit not full understanding. You are a great example for us all. I am an active member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-Day Saints.

The only people who "pay for their sins" are those who do not repent. When you talk about preaching the gospel to the dead, this preaching allows the dead to repent and not suffer for their sins.

@coxrocks25

5 ай бұрын

I disagree with this. I think suffering for your sins is not the punishment like what we think of as "paying" for your sins but more as you become aware of them and their ramifications they will cause a level of suffering for our soul that must be experienced by the sinner. Not because God requires it but rather simply because it's a natural consequence of sin.

@mycatwould

5 ай бұрын

@@coxrocks25agreed

@stephtimms1776

5 ай бұрын

@@coxrocks25 🎗 God requires Justice. Those who reject the atonement of Jesus Christ will have to suffer for their own sins, as in satisfy the laws of justice, without mercy... for they rejected the mercy of Jesus Christ.

@coxrocks25

5 ай бұрын

@stephtimms1776 you're not wrong. But Jesus still paid the price for their sins too. So their suffering is redundant and is not "paying" for anything. We will all suffer for our sins to some extent. But accepting Jesus Christ is what will alleviate that suffering at some point.

@stephtimms1776

5 ай бұрын

@@coxrocks25 🎗 God will *not* force anyone to accept anything they don't want to, and believe it or not, some people don't want any thing from God.

I have lately been having many conversations with a few Evangelical friends and I have had an epiphany which is very useful to me, and maybe it would be useful to other Latter-Day Saints. It is: I am grateful that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints is different from "mainstream" Christianity. How odd it would be if the restored Church, the one the Father felt was important enough to come personally to ignite (a truly rare event in history), was just like all other sects! No! We, by necessity, must believe differently than our brethren still clinging to the beliefs the Father and Son came to correct. And we should absolutely not be ashamed of that. It is hard to feel the disconnect from our brothers and sisters of other sects who believe in the Savior (to an extent). We wish to be united and share whatever truths we each have, but sadly we don't find that same joy from our other Christian brethren, who often respond with rejection, and often rude rejection. I must give Jeff credit on this front: he shares the truths he believes in kindly. Regardless of the method of the sharing however I hope Latter-Day Saints feel nothing but joy as they consider the light of the restored Gospel compared to the beliefs of other sects. In general, across the board they are deeper and more detailed than other sects. Some examples: - a preexistance where we are defined as existing, with a purpose in existence and eternal identity v. no existence (except as ideas in the mind of God) before earth - a creation catered to fulfill that purpose of existence with a sensical explanation for why we have to have mortality where we are disconnected from the presence of God. v. a creation to fulfill "God's will" with no clear answers about why mortality is necessary. - a deep understanding of the necessity of agency v. either an acknowledgememt of agency so we can freely worship God or a denial of agency all together (Calvinists). - a knowledge of what happens to those who can never hear the Gospel v. "a mystery" or "the sovereign will of God that they are predestined to be "vessels of wrath"" - a knowledge of families and their eternal value v. A temporary good thing (for reasons we don't quite know) that is of no worth, or even existence, in Heaven - an understanding of God's continuing revelation v. a closed Heaven that can only increase our understanding of what is, but not reveal more. - a defined afterlife with eternal purpose and growth v. a vague afterlife where we are "totally fulfilled" and at peace, but not much else. This is not to bash the beliefs of those who believe differently, but just to point out to Latter-Day Saints that we have it pretty good in all that the Father has revealed and we should be so grateful for it.

❤❤❤Great video, Pastor Jeff. You have a lot of good things based on Dahlin H. Oaks' talk. Let me expand your understanding: @6:00 You said "Anyone that puts their faith in Him can be restored to his presence and live there forever" Well... "Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven. Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?" This was the conclusion to Jesus's Sermon on The Mount. As well as: "whosoever heareth these sayings of mine (the Sermon of the Mount), and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock" and we will have Eternal Life. @7:00 You said: we don't teach you to do certain things to qualify for "more of God's Glory" or a "Higher level of heaven". Once a person is saved they will reach God's Eternal Glory. However, in the New Testament, as described by Paul to the Corinthians "There are also celestial bodies, and bodies terrestrial: but the glory of the celestial is one, and the glory of the terrestrial is another. There is one glory of the sun, and another glory of the moon, and another glory of the stars: for one star differeth from another star in glory" 1 Cor. 15:40-41 Then there will be more about the afterlife glory that has not yet been revealed. Paul, and the Saints at the time of his writing to the Romans understood this: "I consider that our present sufferings are not worth comparing with the glory that will be revealed in us." Rom. 8:18 It's that plain and that simple. And Jeff, I testify to you it has now been revealed to us through modern-day prophets which you may read in the Doctrine and Covenants in Christ's own words. @9:00 YES. “God said, Let us make man in our image, after our likeness:” We take this as a literal creation, not figuratively. There are three glories one of those being a Celestial glory- Those that will continue to progress and continue with their families and become like their Father in Heaven, thus why else is he called Father, all fruit bears its own kind as is outlined in the Bible and science for that matter. "That is why a man leaves his father and mother and is united to his wife, and they become one flesh." (Gen. 2:24), and continue to Godhood. As we are created in God's likeness and image, we inherit not only his image (meaning the image of his face, arms, and body, etc.) but his likeness meaning his attributes. We will never be above him since he will always be our Father in Heaven but we ARE and WILL be like him and will have the ability to one day create as He creates. @10:48 The word "gods" with lowercase "g" in John 10:34 was put in by the one who translated that from Greek to English. The ancient Greek text used no lowercase. It was all upper case. The exact word for God "THEOS" is used in all these 4 verses. 33: The Jews answered him, saying, For a good work we stone thee not; but for blasphemy; and because that thou, being a man, makest thyself GOD(THEOS). Jesus answered them, Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are GODS(THEOS)? If he called them GODS(THEOS), unto whom the word of GODS(THEOS) came, and the scripture cannot be broken; Jn10: 33-35 in Psalms, which is in Hebrew, is clear as well. Again, no upper or lower case in Hebrew. It was the translators who turned the Hebrew into lowercase to fit their own beliefs of the time. Here is Psalms 82:6 "I have said, Ye are GODS (ELOHIM); and all of you are children of the most High." The question is when did the Psalmist write this before? Good question, right? So, No Jeff, it does not appear the Lord is talking about "magistrates" or "Kings" here. He, Christ, is talking about GODS as in (THEOS) Our Heavenly Father (ELOHIM) @15:00 We will always have a different interpretation of what is meant by Matthew 19:6 "So they are no longer two, but one flesh. Therefore what God has joined together, let no one separate." You will quote Matthew 22:30 "For in the resurrection they neither marry, nor are given in marriage, but are as the angels of God in heaven." But it is Jesus who is only addressing a certain hypothetical question by a certain group of Pharisees trying to trap him and not about all of God's human creations that have been married and sealed together. Marriage is considered very significant in the Bible, and its importance is emphasized in various passages throughout both the Old and New Testaments: Foundation of Society: (Genesis 2:24) Symbolism of Christ and the Church (Ephesians 5:22-33) Fulfillment of God's Plan (Genesis 2:18, 21-24) Procreation and FamilySexual Morality (Exodus 20:14), @18:00 "works based religion" Again, Just go back to the Sermon on the Mount comment above @6:00 In that sermon, Christ lists a series of actions we should engage in and then concludes: "Whosoever heareth these sayings of mine (the Sermon of the Mount), and doeth them, I will liken him unto a wise man, which built his house upon a rock" and we will have Eternal Life." (Mat 7:24) Those that don't will be like a foolish man who built a house on the sand and when the rains came the house will fall (Mat. 7:28) So yes, Jeff, we need to have faith AND we need to apply the works as instructed in the Sermon on the Mount. @22:00 Works that follow faith to most LDS is somewhat of a paradox, you've said it before, Jeff, The Chicken and the Egg. The one who plants and the one who waters have one purpose, and they will each be rewarded according to their own labor. For we are co-workers in God’s service; you are God’s field, God’s building." 1 Corinthians 3:6-9 (NIV): i.e. Giving to the Needy, Prayer, Not Judging Others, Asking, Seeking, turning from Anger and towards Reconciliation, plus The Beatitudes. You even have said baptism is not required to enter the Kingdom of God even after what Peter wrote "Repent and be baptized, every one of you, in the name of Jesus Christ for the forgiveness of your sins. And you will receive the gift of the Holy Spirit.' Acts 2:38 Peter clearly states that if you have forgiveness of your sins you must be baptized. NOT .....In order to receive forgiveness of your sins, have faith in Jesus, then later on, when you get around to it, if you happen to be near a baptismal font, go ahead, and get baptized, BUT you still don't have to. Tens of thousands of Christian faiths, Jeff, and many thousands of interpretations on this part too. We LDS, find it clear. Repent, be baptized, receive the gift of the Holy Ghost, get married and sealed (either here or in the life to come), and receive your judgment (Rev. 20:12-15), receive your glory. If you received the highest glory based on your faith AND your choices then you may continue to further explore why the GODS(Elohim) made man in His own image and likeness (DMUWTH).... What God is, man is His offspring, and His offspring can become like Him since, again, we were made in His likeness. My question is why do "mainstream Christians" not see that both faith in Christ and works(such as baptism or obeying the commandments) are required to enter the Kingdom of Heaven? -- And at @26:00 Yes, this can be found in DC 138 in his "Vision of the Redemption of the Dead." I answered this earlier since this is one of your specific burning questions toward the end of your video. Again, Pastor Jeff, I love your bi-weekly videos and getting to answer your questions. If you read what I wrote here and like it, give me a Until next time! 😃👍❤❤❤

@mycatwould

5 ай бұрын

Well, even if nobody else says it, well spoken!! Loved this!!

@peter10562

5 ай бұрын

💥💥‼️

@angela_flute52689

5 ай бұрын

A clarification to a point in the middle of your great comment: "Elohim" is plural, referring to Heavenly Father *and* Heavenly Mother. I also wonder why mainstream Christians say we focus too much on works while simultaneously recognizing that it's important to do good things, serve others, be kind, keep the commandments like Jesus and God the Father have instructed, etc. Those are all works too. We just believe there are more commandments to be heeded than they do, so the list of works we focus on is broader.

@spencerdunwoody5508

5 ай бұрын

I could go through these points one by one, but I’ll just make the broad strokes that addresses all of these. These scriptures are all taken out of context very much. Culturally, within the chapter, and within the book it’s written in. The context is really important here. The authors of those verses are trying to get across very different points than what you are implying.

@TubeFlexMedia

5 ай бұрын

@@spencerdunwoody5508The “out of context” comment is more often than none based on not context but by perception and interpretation I just use the scriptures to poi t out there is context and thousands of ways to interpret the context I always say for this very reason we have so many different styles of Christianity from Amish to Greek orthodox Coptic orthodox, southern Baptist, Northern Baptist, Armenian Christians, Ethiopian Christians, and thousands and thousands and thousands upon thousands of Christian denominations, all pointing to interpretation through their own looking glass, including LDS. One passage of scripture says “I and the Father are one." So you have one group of believers saying, “well there there can’t be 2 Gods so the Father and The Son are the same entity” Then theres people like the LDS who point out “Jesus the Son is actually praying to another entity, the Father, His Father, in Heaven “My Father, if it be possible, let this cup pass from me; nevertheless, not as I will, but as you will.” For me, it obvious that when he said “we are one” it means one in purpose. And it makes more sense for the Son, (one entity) pray to the Father in Heaven (another entity) on top of that, it was the Gods (Elohim Hebrew plural for God) that created the Heavens. It was a Bible translator who changed it to English singular. Ut At East Im open to understanding how the Bible can have so many different interpretations where Evangelicals are more into solo scriptura while us LDS have the Book of Mormon to help make things more clear

This isn’t too related to your video, but as I’ve been watching your channel it’s inspired me to go better understand other religions. It’s amazing to see and learn about other religious views, and that’s one of my favorite parts of your channel- you share your own religious view and how it compares to LDS views. I’d like to see a video dedicated on the atonement, specifically what took place in the last week of Christs mortal life, and how our different understandings of it compare :)

Thank you for this video! I so appreciate your insight. President Nelson said in April 2008 Gen Conf: "In God's eternal plan, salvation is an individual matter; exaltation is a family matter." So, I understand salvation to be between Jesus Christ and me, and exaltation to be between Heavenly Father and those I'm sealed to here on Earth (this also happens because Jesus Christ made it possible). It is a unique doctrine. And as a very imperfect parent, I hope my children will become even better than I am--that would be my ultimate gratification; perhaps Heavenly Father thinks of us similarly...that his greatest happiness would be us living with Him and like Him (aka, exaltation). Thanks, again, and wishing you all the best!

Our children have the potential to become parents, we as God's children have the potential to become like Him, creating our own spirit children and providing them with their own world to go to.

@braydenweese1407

5 ай бұрын

I think we can get married in the spirit world if we don’t make time for it in this life, is that correct?

@germanmarine6582

5 ай бұрын

@@braydenweese1407 it depends. If “you don’t make time” then no. You have no promise. You cannot delay the day of your repentance. But if you are not given a chance to get married or sealed here, you will be given it. Just like baptism.

@braydenweese1407

5 ай бұрын

@@germanmarine6582 I mean, I’d be open to it, but my progress is slow. I’d rather be prepared for it than jump into it. Plus I don’t really want to have to change diapers.

@BrianTerrill

5 ай бұрын

@@braydenweese1407 changing diapers is a part of the be fruitful and multiply part. These as is marriage are commandments, not suggestions

@braydenweese1407

5 ай бұрын

@@BrianTerrill Sure, they’re commandments. But God doesn’t expect everyone to follow all of His commandments. We have agency.

🎗This was well done Pastor Jeff! Thank you for trying to understand this with a sincere heart. I already commented upon the doctrine of exaltation, in your first comment. As far as the destiny of the dead, Peter 4:6 reads, "For for this cause was the gospel preached also to them that are dead, that they might be judged according to men in the flesh, but live according to God in the spirit." Those to whom this applies who had a chance but did not accept on earth the suffering of Jesus Christ on their behalf, though he did do it... they must suffer it fully also, which caused God to bleed at every pore. We don't know what glory they may attain to after that... only God knows but we believe men will be judged according to their desires and the laws they are able to abide.

@foreverstrong6532

5 ай бұрын

‘Trying to understand?’ Really?

@stephtimms1776

5 ай бұрын

@@foreverstrong6532 🎗You think he's not? Have you ever experienced Evangelicals misunderstanding? I have, many times.

@BGCflyer

5 ай бұрын

...interesting how this sounds so much like purgatory....hummm!

Faith = Works Works = Faith Faith without works is dead Works without faith is dead. Works building faith and faith that produces good works leads to eternal life.

@jlewis8145

5 ай бұрын

God requires perfection to get into heaven. Matthew 5:48

@devonmarr9872

5 ай бұрын

@jlewis8145 Correct. Perfection that will never be reached. This is why faith is required and no work can get you to heaven.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@devonmarr9872 So you think your filthy rags will get you favor with the lord?

@jlewis8145

5 ай бұрын

@@devonmarr9872 Christ has imputed to me his righteousness, which is the righteousness of God. Romans 4 Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering Christ hath perfected forever those who are sanctified.

19:34 he’s not suggesting there are works we need to do to have full access to God’s glorified presence. He’s saying that those covenants and ordinances help us understand what a new life in Christ looks like, the type laws that need to be followed to “abide” or have place in that kingdom. Ultimately we choose whether we want to live that type of life. It’s a subtle difference to ordinances qualifying us, to ordinances, which come with covenants showing us what a new life in Christ looks like. Which is why everyone will receive those covenants, and then choose whether they’re willing to live the higher, celestial law taught by Jesus in his ministry.

@maxstooksberry9458

5 ай бұрын

Is it possible for someone who chooses to not keep any covenants be comfortable enough/be able to choose the highest degree of glory?

@kellharris2491

5 ай бұрын

@@maxstooksberry9458 That's like asking is it possible to want something, but not actually want it. I mean yes but....No. God wants us with him but he is not going to force you. He is perfect and to abide perfection means abiding in Christ. The two greatest commandments are to love God and love Your fellow men. The covenants you make and keep with God are all under that umbrella. Christ said," if you love me you will keep my commandments and love one another." This is how you come to know and have faith in Christ. Through Christ your heart or desires change. We all fall short of the glory of God and are not actually worthy but through working with Christ we obtain the victory. We are purified through Christ. How far depends on you. Think of it like a spectrum if that helps. You go were you choose. If something is too hard you can ask Christ for help through grace. But again Christ isn't going to change your heart. If you are not willing to change he won't force you. And I imagine for some it will take longer. But there is the parable of the laborer. The first shall be last and the last shall be first. We will all have our turn and opportunities. You are placed basically were you choose to go. As high or as far as you are willing to accept Christs grace for you. Does that make a little more sense? But I wouldn't worry about that aspect too much. Just focus on the two great commandments and Christ will prepare a way for you.

@maxstooksberry9458

5 ай бұрын

@@kellharris2491 thanks for the reply! So you get to choose how much of Christs grace covers you? The only thing separating us from the Father is sin because he is so holy. The Bible says that Christs blood on the cross covers all the believer’s sins. So since someone is now clothed in Christs righteousness, he can boldly stand before the throne of God and be in the Fathers full presence. John 1:7-9 but if we walk in the light, as he is in the light, we have fellowship one with another, and the blood of Jesus Christ his Son cleanseth us from all sin

@devonmarr9872

5 ай бұрын

Works are a means to greater faith. Works dont matter at all of they dont produce greater faith. Faith likewise produces good works but those works are not what saves. The faith is.

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328

5 ай бұрын

I don't understand how your description can be called good news (gospel), especially if someone has no control over whether they marry or have children, or have a temple nearby for sealing, etc,, and it certainly is a very different gospel than the Bible teaches (individuals are saved by grace to be the bride of Christ now and forever more, indwelt by the Holy Spirit with gifts to do good works of worship and gratefulness and bring others to faith in Jesus, whose family is a spiritual one, not a physical one), and that would invoke Galatians 1:8 perfectly ...accursed if believing a different gospel brought by an angel... Study well the inconsistencies.

I love the doctrine of Jesus Christ. Thank you for sharing this talk with President Oaks…awesome to have these revealed expansive truths and understanding about the eternal nature of our marriages and families.

These teachings help us to better understand not only the true character of Heavenly Father and Jesus Christ, but also our character as literal sons and daughters of heavenly parents. We are eternal beings out of place here on earth. It is a necessary but brief moment in our eternal existence

@collinscr3w

5 ай бұрын

Why do you separate God and Jesus. The Bible says that Jesus is God in human form. They are one in the same not separate. Just curious, no judgment says a never mormon

@cheyaweber704

5 ай бұрын

@@collinscr3w Latter-day Saints believe that God and Jesus and the Holy Spirit are 3 distinct beings who are one in purpose. In John 17: 21,22 Christ says, " That they all may be one; as thou, Father, art in me, and I in thee, that they also may be one in us: that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou gavest me I have given them; that they may be one, even as we are one: Does that mean the followers of Christ are going to merge into one Being with Christ and God? Many churches belief God and Christ are one? (John 10:30 "I and My Father are one") The wording would suggest that we become one with God and Christ. And yet reason tells us that in the first verse we would say it means we will be one in purpose and belief with God and Christ, so why wouldn't that same logic apply to the second example?

@Compulsive-Elk7103

5 ай бұрын

@@cheyaweber704 that's just where we disagree. For 2,000 years the Catholic church has always taught that God is 1 being in 3 persons and that they are distinct persons. If we call them 3 beings , then that to us is saying their 3 gods.

@germanslice

5 ай бұрын

@@Compulsive-Elk7103 The Lord's Prayer reveals the mystery that all may be one also with God and become like God. The Godhead are not one physically but are one spiritually.

@jnorristube

5 ай бұрын

@@collinscr3w The Bible records Jesus’s great Intercessory Prayer, where He declared that “this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, whom thou hast sent” (John 17:3). This is just one of many scriptures that clearly shows us the relationship between Heavenly Father and Jesus. They are one in purpose and mission. But the Bible clearly teaches that they are separate individuals why else would Christ himself address God as such and. Speak to him as you would speak to me. Do not allow yourself to miss out on beautiful truths because of the tradition of men.

he is teaching that our actions define which Kingdom we will inherit. Yes there are certain ordinance we must do, but after that it is the choices that we make that define where we are best suited to spend the eternities.

@janet-Spirit_of_the_Living_God

6 ай бұрын

You have just described a works-based eternal resting place, not a faith-based one (faith based on Jesus paying the full penalty for our sin). I am guessing that growing up in such a belief system it may even be difficult to comprehend the unconditional (agape) love of God, the Good News that is the Gospel story as described in the Bible, where everything we do and become is in gratitude for all the actions and choices GOD has already done for us. Agape says that there is nothing you can do or not do that would make God love you any more or any less. Any lesser definition is not a perfect God of love.

@tracyengelke4039

5 ай бұрын

​@janet-Spirit_of_the_Living_God I struggled for decades when I was taught that people will be sent to hell if not baptised. We have billions pre Christ, living in areas of the world that never knew Christ, so was never baptised. Some Christian faiths write them off as lost. Babies are baptised to ensure that they don't end up in hell. I found difficulty in my Luthern faith for a long time. CHRIST would never force his lambs to be lost forever. The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints believe that every degree of glory is miles better than this Earth life. Christ has paid the cost of all sin. But it is up to the person to give their sin to Christ, as Christ will not force anyone to repent. Any sin held onto by the person must be paid for as spoken of in the Bible where people are cast into prison until they pay their debt. It is a wonder and a glory to know that not a single child of God will be lost unless they choose not to accept Christ to His Face. All others will receive a much better life in a degree of glory. God Bless😊

@kathrinebeeder9892

5 ай бұрын

@@janet-Spirit_of_the_Living_God If you choose who you admire and want to emulate, you tend to follow their example and belief system. Jesus went about DOING GOOD. I don’t understand your infatuation and emphatic disavowal of .going about doing good. It’s an honor when I know I have been prompted by the Spirit and do something that brings about good. I won’t let your argument take that away from me. To me that would be honoring your opinion more than my adoration of my God. That’s a sin, so to speak.

@cheyaweber704

5 ай бұрын

@@janet-Spirit_of_the_Living_God I am always a little bit surprised when people say that heaven is a faith-based, eternal resting place and that Latter-day Saints don't believe that as well. Christ did pay the full penalty for our sins but is it enough to just say that I believe and through Christ's grace I will be saved? Matthew 4:17 says that Jesus taught repentance. Luke 24:47 "and repentance for the forgiveness of sins will be preached in his name to all nations" It is not enough to say I believe therefore I will be saved based on my faith. Do you consider repentance as 'works'? James teaches that faith without works is dead. Do you consider praying and studying the scriptures as work? Some would; and yet these are 'works' that help us grow in knowledge of Christ and they deepen our love for Him and for the marvelous gift of Grace. It is through these 'works' that we learn of God's Grace and better understand the magnitude of it (as far as our mortal understanding will allow.) I totally agree that our works do not save us; only God's Grace will do that but I do think there is a place for works or else why is there a judgement bar where we all be judged?

@janetspiritofthelivinggod6328

5 ай бұрын

@@kathrinebeeder9892 You have assumed I disavow doing good, and have created your own religion to do good. That is not how the Bible says we are saved, otherwise Jesus died in vain. We do good because we are grateful for His free gift, and the Holy Spirit in us empowers us, by giving us Spiritual Gifts (not church callings) to be used to build God's kingdom, not our church or our family or our own sense of pride in good works. It's like steering a boat in the water these LDS teachings based on the Bible...one degree off now results in miles apart toward the horizon.

One of the phrases that is being transcribed in your mind (from protestantism to what President Oaks is saying) is "receive" vs "get into." We do not earn or "get into" any degree of grace or glory. We receive the law in connection with that glory. Relisten to this talk with that thought in mind and you will find that we do not "do" actions, but instead "receive" laws. We can choose to receive or not receive. We can choose to abide or not abide. It is not what we do, it is what we become. This is something that is rarely correctly communicated between our faiths. We do not "earn" or "get into" anything. Think of the Calvinist vs Arminian concept of . They talk across each other and rarely connect because they are coming from different starting points, and thus the conclusions miss meeting in the middle. Of course Latter-day Saints believe in works, but only inasmuch as they increase our faith in Jesus Christ or allow us to become more like the Savior. You've read the Book of Mormon so you know that King Benjamin declared that there is no other name or means given under heaven, only in and through Jesus Christ. We believe in the Bible every bit as much as you, thus the singularity of Jesus Christ's sacrifice and triumph in the Garden, on the cross and at the tomb are the most glorious acts in all the universe, everlasting, from all eternity to all eternity. He is the singular source of salvation AND exhalation. He has revealed additional laws for us to receive just as he did when He was on the earth. Adam had a law and his children had it recorded in the Book of Life. Abraham received a higher law than he was living and his covenant applied to all generations without end. Moses received a law, but his people had become idolators, so his law was met at the level his people could abide. Jesus brought the highest and fullest level of the law while he was on the earth. Creeds and sects have divided and philosophized that law to the point that it required a restoration. The Bible predicted such actions would continue until we come to a unity of faith in Jesus Christ, One Lord, One Faith, One Baptism.The laws we received in this era are restored truths that Jesus taught. Thus, we act in accordance with a law we wish to commit to for eternity to BECOME like Christ and BECOME like God the Father, or not if we choose not to. And yes, Joseph taught that God the Father went through this same process of mortality and exaltation, but is that so difficult to believe considering Christ experienced mortality and overcame the bands of sin and death as God but while in a mortal tabernacle? Hell is God's eternal punishment for those who choose not to repent or accept Jesus Christ, thus the punishment is everlasting and eternal because God is everlasting and eternal. The punishment is eternally and everlastingly affixed. It is always there, but that doesn't mean you spend eternity in it. This is another revealed truth. After those unrepentant souls have suffered for their sins, Christ's eternal and everlasting redeeming power will reach them and remove them from their torment. Thus "every knee shall bow and every tongue confess that Jesus is the Christ." There are no other "requirements" to "get into" heaven, or even the Celestial Kingdom. The requirement is to receive the fullness of Jesus Christ, including His commandments and laws, each principle of which is a direct manifestation of His atoning power and grace and mercy to the children of men. Each ordinance we partake of repeatedly and fully immersively teaches and directs us straight to Him. The sealing is not a wedding ceremony. It is a covenant to keep Christ first and foremost in your lives. The endowment is the reception of Christ's power to enable you to overcome death and hell, not because YOU are doing it, but because you are covenanting with Christ to follow Him as He does it for you. Can you see how there is transcription occurring rather than communication? Christ is EVERYTHING to a Latter-day Saint. There is no universe, no tomorrow, no love, no hope, no faith, no anything without Christ. He is the central focus of all our worship and learning and teaching. As we accept the fulness of His law, we receive the fulness of His glory. Not by our works, but by our faith which leads us to change our works to become works the Savior would have us do.

I would like to add that, while Latter Day Saints believe that everyone will have a place in a Kingdom of Glory they do not have full access to the Godhead unless they are in the Celestial Kingdom. To me, anything less than being in the actual presence of God (Father, Son and Spirit, not only the Spirit or the Jesus and the Spirit but the Father, Son and Spirit) is not Heaven and I would say that most Evangelical and mainstream Christians would agree with this. I would also say that while we strive to be like God, to be Christlike and live a Christlike life, we would never want to be God. We can be like Him but not become Him.

Amen Pres Oaks! Thank you for teaching us about the higher holier law which the religions of man can’t understand.

I think that this talk focused mostly on the raw details and doctrinal points of the Plan of Salvation as part of a series of talks that Oaks and Nelson have given over the years on the subject. I think the most simple understanding a Latter-day Saints have of this subject is basically: We are the children of God. We have divine potential and an eternal destiny. Because of the atonement of Jesus Christ, death and hell no longer have power over us, and where we will live eternally and with whom and with which member of the Godhead (Celestial: all; Terrestrial: Jesus & Holy Spirit; Telestial: Holy Spirit and Angels) is pretty much up to us. The Restoration ensures we know what’s right and wrong. We have the basic path of covenants (baptism & confirmation, the endowment & finally the sealing) to give us a physical and tangible sense of progression and direction, to help us constantly remember Christ. And should we be faithful in trying to just do our best and overcome all things, we’ll all go to the Celestial Kingdom and receive exaltation. Now since life is messing (limited knowledge of Christ, divorce, war, premature deaths, etc.) there is a place called the Spirit World where those who didn’t know Him in this life or may have even rejected him may repent and receive the gospel. The wicked will have to “pay” for their sins in the sense of suffering the punishments for them. Finally, judgement day will come and we’ll get assigned to the kingdom of glory we chose to have. because of the restoration in mortality and our time in the Spirit World, everyone will be on the same page, having had an equal chance to receive the fulness of salvation and exaltation by the grace of God and Jesus Christ. No one will be judged and assigned without fully knowing whats going on and having made a final decision. At least thats how i’ve come to understand it

@HelloSaints

5 ай бұрын

@thejimster6322 Good summation ... thanks.

@james8996

5 ай бұрын

@@benjamingregersen9777 Mormons are a religious Cult , Where is the scriptures in the Bible about GOD dealing with Joseph Smith since he was a so called prophet The Mormon church breaks the 4th Commandment every Sunday

Jeff, you are a wonderful person, and I always appreciate the even-handed way you do these videos! I also love learning about views different from my own! I rememner this talk. I remember wondering how you'd react to it, lol. One of the things that stood out to me, (sorry this is long and rambling) as a lifetime member of the church, was the comment made about the Sealing not being forced on anyone unwilling. While this probably didn't stand out to you, it did to me. There has been a push the last several years, by the leadership to remind members to be nice, kind, Christlike. Sometimes, their wording is very blatant. It saddens me that it is even necessary, but I'm heartened to see it getting addressed. To see them trying to help us generational members remember/see the difference between the culture and the doctrine. Relating to this point is a long history of men abusing their "power" in their homes. As my dad says, "a good man will read the bible and go out and do good. An evil man will read the bible and go out and do evil." Bad men have ever used what power their given to domineer over those they were meant to protect. My great-grandfather murdered his wife on the street in broad daylight as she walked home from church because she wanted a divorce. His abuses of her, his daughter, his grand-daughter have echoed across the generations. And I've never been able to wrap my mind around the stupidity of it. He murdered her because she wanted to leave him. And somehow, he must've thought if she was dead, she'd be his eternally due to their Sealing. But I've always believed in both a Just and Merciful God, who would never force His daughter to be eternally sealed to her murderer if she didn't want to be. And I was greatful for this talk, this line, that supported that belief. It is a call to all spouses to do better, to be better. Because she or he doesn't have to pick you in the hereafter. And one spouse's failure to live up to their covenants won't hold back the other from their promised blessings. Anyway, a little deeper of a dive than your channel addresses, but I thought it was neat.

Hi, Jeff. Love your videos. If you are looking for greater clarity, there is a book written by one of the leaders of the Church (a Seventy) named Elder Tad Callister. The book he wrote is titled "The Infinite Atonement." The things President Oaks is teaching are discussed in the book. I think it's a better explanation (not because President Oaks didn't teach well, but that books provide a lot more context than President Oaks has time to teach with a relatively short talk) of Christ's atoning sacrifice and of why we believe we can become gods. About "paying for our sins": We do not believe we can pay even one iota for our sins. Jesus Christ is the only One who can do that. What President Oaks said is we would "suffer for our sins." We will suffer so that we understand what the effect of our sins is and so that we understand what price Jesus paid. But we do not and cannot pay for our sins. If we could, then we wouldn't need Jesus to do it for us. Also, about timing: All of our repentance must come before the final judgment. Once we have been judged, and we inherit the kingdom we chose, then there is no "movement" between the kingdoms. I hope that clarifies some of what we believe.

@janicenagao7409

5 ай бұрын

WONDERFUL suggestion

Again Jeff, I think Evangelicals and LDS agree more than we disagree. Your father will always be your one and only father, even tho you yourself have become a father, just as you will be your son’s father forever even tho he too will become a father. So we agree, God will always and for ever be our one and only God. If you as a loving father want everything good available to your children, then why would God who is more loving than anything we can comprehend hold anything back from us if we are worthy of it?

@kneesflorists5860

5 ай бұрын

God does want what is best for us, but he gave us free will to make our own choices. People can choose to follow God or turn their back from him. The Bible clearly teaches us that the only way to heaven is through Him. The Bible also teaches us about false prophets…

@McDan2425

5 ай бұрын

@@kneesflorists5860 I totally agree. I think the judgement day will basically all fall on our willingness (our free will) to either obey the commandments and follow God into heaven or not. Don’t know what the comment about false prophets was referring to, but again I agree there as well. We always need to be cautious and on guard of anyone who tries to take our focus away from the Savior.

Pastor Jeff what hell to me would be, is me being stuck with the infinite knowledge and reality of my poor choices holding me back from progression in the eternities. Being consigned eternally to a lower kingdom because I wasn't willing to forsake all I have and am to live with my God and His perfect son Jesus Christ, would be hell because eternity is, a long, long.. time. True heavenly experience to the righteous could only be the Celestial kingdom and that's because it's the only place that allows for eternal progression and especially progression with my family and posterity. I love that we all reap the fruits of what we sow in this life. It's also a very harsh reality that we must be willing to forsake all in order to receive the highest degree of eternal freedom and progression, being the Celestial kingdom with our Heavenly Father.

He said if you love me keep my commandments. Works are important. What manner of man aught you to be even as I am. A wise father expects us to show our true love and appreciation for the atonement that was absolutely necessary. Non can obtain salvation if it wasn’t for the atonement. Carol

Pastor Jeff - thanks for taking time to listen to this talk. My only comment is that while you listen and comment I wish you’d do it in the way that Christ taught. Become teachable as a little child. Until you can do that then you might be as the Pharisee at the time of Christ so caught up in your own traditions and understanding that you have no room for real learning. I do appreciate your honest responses as I was like you in many ways when I was younger. When I chose to be teachable as a child I began to really understand what the Bible was about.

@peaceful525

5 ай бұрын

Are you teachable? Are you willing to challenge your own traditions and understanding?

@jlewis8145

5 ай бұрын

If the LDS church were wrong, would you want to know? Where are these teachings? Who made them up? Based on what? God used to be a man on another planet, (Mormon Doctrine, p. 321; Joseph Smith, Times and Seasons, vol. 5, p. 613-614; Orson Pratt, Journal of Discourses, vol. 2, p. 345; Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 7, p. 333). “The Father has a body of flesh and bones as tangible as man’s . . . ” (D&C 132:20). God is in the form of a man, (Joseph Smith, Journal of Discourses, vol. 6, p. 3). “God himself was once as we are now, and is an exalted man, and sits enthroned in yonder heavens!!! . . . We have imagined that God was God from all eternity. I will refute that idea and take away the veil, so that you may see,” (Teachings of the Prophet Joseph Smith, p. 345). God the Father had a Father, (Joseph Smith, History of the Church, vol. 6, p. 476; Heber C. Kimball, Journal of Discourses, vol. 5, p. 19; Milton Hunter, First Council of the Seventy, Gospel through the Ages, p. 104-105). God resides near a star called Kolob, (Pearl of Great Price, p. 34-35; Mormon Doctrine, p. 428). God had sexual relations with Mary to make the body of Jesus, (Brigham Young, Journal of Discourses, vol. 4, 1857, p. 218; vol. 8, p. 115). “Therefore we know that both the Father and the Son are in form and stature perfect men; each of them possesses a tangible body . . . of flesh and bones,” (Articles of Faith, by James Talmage, p. 38).

Great summary pastor Jeff. This was very informative as well as helpful to hear what the LDS leaders teach. Thank you for all your work.

Dang, sometimes I wish I could have a dialogue with you on these, as there are always those little things that I think it merits a little clarification from how youre hearing it and comparing. You have got a lot of good knowledge and exposure to the church's teachings, and Im no scholar or authority but as a lifelong member, and having served my mission in the Bible belt, I want to share my particular insights sometimes. Sometimes it wont change the fact that the principles are different, but perhaps to help you see how we arrived at them or how we connect those principles to the things you approach differently. I think you put it in a good way that God will always be the one and only God to this universe, and as I said in a comment on a previous video, I look at the pattern of families here on Earth as to how that relationship will grow, and what it will become. As we grow to our own godhood, it doesnt in any way take away from God's position as our God, our Father, etc, in fact it only adds to his already infinite glory in the same way that the accomplishments of children can reflect the good job done by the parents in raising and preparing them. As for the other degrees of heaven, I think you got most of the way to the clarification I would have wanted to make in seeing that the lower kingdoms do not have the full ess of the Father's presence. In that way, beyond the suffering they will go through in the waiting time before the resurrection and final judgement, and in spite of their eternity being a in a place of glory and peace, they will also know that they missed out on the opportunity to achieve the fullness of the Father, and were unwilling to be fully changed to be able to live with him again, and that in itself may be a hellish punishment, even in a place of glory. So even though the suffering in the in-between time may sound like it correlates to classical descriptions of Hell, even the eternities may have a degree of that sorrow. Also, as he references the suffering of those to pay for their sins, I don't believe he meant that that suffering itself is enough to fully pay for their sins before they receive their final judgement, but a comparatively small measure of suffering and that the reward they get is still wholly on the merits of Christ's atonement. I also think its important to say that while we do believe in the importance of certain ordinnces, especially to reach the highest degree of the celestial kingdom, the distinction between being born again and demonstrating that through our actions vs. striving to do good things and continue to become more like Christ in this life is a little smaller than I think you seem to see it as. Rather than a one time event that we have happen to us, it is a matter of continuing to choose to be like Christ as best we can, and turn to Him for help in doing so, and our efforts will be inadequate to actually 'earn' us a place in heaven, but will be a demonstration of our willingness to accept His atonement in our lives, which is what does the actual saving. Even our ordinances are only empowered to save because of His atonement and because it is what he has asked us to do in order to thank Him for what He has done. Theres a great talk by Boyd K. Packer about this idea, a parable of a debtor. I think it was Dieter F. Uchtdorf who also expanded on that describing our actions and ordinances as a child practicing the piano when their parents payed for piano lessons. The practicing does not pay the instructor, or pay back the parents who did pay, but it is the price asked of the child by the one who did pay. And the one who did pay is made happy because they see the child grow and improve. I think it is important to clarify that distinction between Exaltation and Salvation. Most of what you tend to teach as our ultimate and highest reward is what we would call Salvation, and we agree that that comes to us not because of our works, but that it is a gift that Christ gives us, and He has already done all the work for it. But what we speak of beyond that, in an eternal marriage, becoming more like God, that is Exaltation and does come with a request that we practice. I can understand feeling like it crowds out what Christ taught, and makes it hard to focus, and that is definitely a struggle for many people, to not lose focus on Christ. I think that is absolutely a fair observation and criticism, but at the same time, if these things are true, its important that we dont just ignore them. At least thats how I see it. I do agree that its key to keep the focus on Christ, and the church does what it can to balance these things, but we arent perfect, so we just keep trying. The church has definitely lately been giving direction to the local wards etc to strive to bring everything back around to connect it to Christ and help us to keep that focus there as we work to improve. Thanks for another great video!

@caroleewolfley9737

5 ай бұрын

I so agree! I guess I think often about the question- "how far does my faith go? At what point do I say "that's enough knowledge or action, skill...movement towards God for me? I'm happy just to be here. That is enough for me???" I'm currently working on a "refining" HOMEwork pickle I've gotten myself into that is taking all my brain power trying to figure out how to 'bend' the rules to conform to what I WANT but know God would not think or act in that way. My heart says one thing but my head is determined to hold onto "My" way!! Reconciling my will to His in this VERY practical earthly 'HOMEwork' experience is helping ME to define who I really want to Be...Eternally! And it is taking all of my previous faith, trust, experience, knowledge, covenants, and promises to hurdle this one! Do I want earthly money, prestige, pride, my way, results, "repent later After I get what I want (momentarily), and still "convince God I 'really want his countenance" written on me! ?? How much of Father's Glory & Light do I Really want? Dang this faith stuff is hard!! I want my cake (my testimony of Jesus) & eat it (worldly/fallen state actions) too!! It is only through the atonement of Jesus Christ that I will be able to work this challenge out. I know He is praying for me & has already paid the price for this pickle I have gotten myself into And for which ever choice I make but ultimately, I am going to have to make MY choice. That is why it is such a privilege to be here on earth. I am learning really about me. The "pull of the world" wasn't in heaven. I professed soundly that I was all in on Father's Plan. Now, I am watching me trip on this VERY REFINING detailed opportunity... Do I trust God ...EVEN and INCLUDING on this 'one'? No one will ever know I struggled with or even had what the philosophies of men would say "is no big deal!" But I know this refining moment between me and Him is very real. God is not going to love me 1 bit less which ever I choose but I will know where I want to 'stop' or go forward. Boy do I understand the term 'my wrestle with God' in a whole new light!😂 Do I Really want: -ALL God's Light? -To be "good" but not Valient? -just Do what interests/is good for only me?

@BGCflyer

5 ай бұрын

...everything you are saying is consistent with LDS theology. The problem is, it's only true if you add the Pearl of Great Price, the Doctrine and Covenants and the King Follett Discourses. So, a Biblical Christian will say, you are adding ordinances or complicating what is already simple and complete. If you can show me that Jospeh Smith translated the Book of Abraham correctly, then I'm happy to consider these additional teachings.

Thanks for another great video! You are making such an incredible resource to refer to when Christians have been misinformed or don't understand our doctrine.

"Faith without works is dead". Our works are an outward representation of an inward faith in Christ.

Thank you, Pastor Jeff. Yes, Jesus Christ is always the answer. He has paid the price and loves each one of us. That is very comforting. Also knowing we can each choose for ourselves. When I hear covenants, I often think commandments. I know as I keep His commandments, my life is blessed right now to better serve and love others. Hopefully to come closer to my Savior Jesus Christ.

Thank you for Hello Saints, I've really learned a lot from you about what my extended family believe who are mainstream Christians. I am a member of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints and I appreciate you being so respectful. Many might say my comment has nothing to do with Elder Oaks talk, but these were my thoughts while listening to him speak at conference. I have wished for many years that we knew more and talked more about the millenium. I'm looking forward to the day when Jesus Christ reigns. My prayer is that I help Him in any way possible to bring more souls unto the Father through Him and His atoning sacrifice. Can you even imagine how many millions of people lived on the earth and never even heard of God or Jesus Christ? I hope all Christians will be spreading that "good news" to others. I know there will be a final judgement and I'm very glad I have more time to learn and grow before then. I have a different perspective about the afterlife before the final judgement. My son died by suicide for multiple reasons. He left 2 daughters and a soon to be ex-wife. He served as a Marine for 8 years and had a very hard time reconciling war and killing with God's plan. He became agnostic, but had a heart of gold. When he died my family and I sensed his sorrow. I also read a lot of near death experiences by suicide and they saw others who made the same choice walking around in grey all saying they were sorry to their loved ones who couldn't hear. There were some taken up by a bright light. I made a decision then to forgive him, to forgive myself and others to help him find peace again. I'm grateful to believe that we were spirits before life on earth, that we are all brothers and sisters in Christ and that there is an afterlife that we will know much more about when we die. I've also heard that the term death isn't used in Heaven because no one will ever die again. See you on your next video!

Bottom line, President Oaks is an Apostle of Jesus Christ. He has the authority to testify of truth. Those he quoted are likewise authorized with a call from the Living Christ to teach His plan of Salvation and Happiness for us. It's all true!

@Compulsive-Elk7103

5 ай бұрын

No

I am so glad to be a member of the church of JesusChrist of latter day saints. The doctrine its like a puzzle, where all the pieces are there!

Thank you, Jeff. I find you to be a thoughtful, sincere seeker of truth. Please continue your journey, wherever it takes you. God bless you and your family.

Absolutely love the respect you give in these episodes of doctrinal teachings that oppose that of your own beliefs. It definitely is admirable and you've inspired me to give all other people I encounter my curiosities instead of my silent critisisms. Great episode as always

What He wishes us to become is “Like Him”. Having his image in our countenance. Our desires are the same as Him. Hearts and minds are purified. No desire to do evil or take advantage. Pay the penalty is likely going through repentance-change of heart. My understanding is that it’s easier while in our earthly life. I am sure there will be those qualified to serve them in helping them attain this. And it will be their own will and desire to repent and “become a new creature”. And everyone will have their temple ordinances performed by proxies, but are given agency whether they accept it or not. A majority of this temple work will be done during the millennium, meaning we are just scratching the surface right now (And if the individual that did someone’s work isn’t really worthy [lied to get a recommend] it won’t be held against the individual whose work was done for them).

@CarlosWashingtonMercado

5 ай бұрын

I was thinking the same answer as you did, but more in the lines of "He wants us to become HIM", and not just "like Him".

@Vail-AspenSUVrentals

5 ай бұрын

Agreed. That's why our number one covenant is to take upon his name. And always remember him. It helps us change. Just like pastors Jeff said. They will become something. These covenants help us become something new in Christ. Covenants teach and change. Much like his church. It has to take upon his name.

@wellsaidgoodheadfred9843

5 ай бұрын

Why is there more haughty eyes in Mormon churches than in any other place in the entire universe then? One of the seven things God says he hates are haughty eyes.

@kathrinebeeder9892

5 ай бұрын

🙄

@wellsaidgoodheadfred9843

5 ай бұрын

Not to mention Russell M Nelson's Mozambique story, his airplane story, and his big hat woman story. If you know, then you know.@@kathrinebeeder9892

President Oaks indicates that final judgment by God will determine the degree of glory each person receives in the afterlife. This judgment is based on individuals' actions, choices, and the extent to which they have followed Christ's teachings and commandments to become truly converted unto Christ. This process is further expounded in a wonderful scripture from Moroni 10 in the Book of Mormon: 32 Yea, come unto Christ, and be perfected in him, and deny yourselves of all ungodliness; and if ye shall deny yourselves of all ungodliness, and love God with all your might, mind and strength, then is his grace sufficient for you, that by his grace ye may be perfect in Christ; and if by the grace of God ye are perfect in Christ, ye can in nowise deny the power of God. 33 And again, if ye by the grace of God are perfect in Christ, and deny not his power, then are ye sanctified in Christ by the grace of God, through the shedding of the blood of Christ, which is in the covenant of the Father unto the remission of your sins, that ye become holy, without spot. 34 And now I bid unto all, farewell. I soon go to rest in the paradise of God, until my spirit and body shall again reunite, and I am brought forth triumphant through the air, to meet you before the pleasing bar of the great Jehovah, the Eternal Judge of both quick and dead. Amen. Extracting the basic logic of these versus reveals: 1. If one embraces Christ and rejects all that is morally wrong, And if one loves God with complete devotion, Then one will receive God's favor, enabling perfection in Christ. 2. If one is perfected in Christ through God's grace, Then one acknowledges God's omnipotence. 3. If one maintains this state of grace and recognizes God's power, Then one is sanctified through Christ, and sins are forgiven through His sacrifice. 4. When one faces final judgment by God, Then those adhering to these principles will experience a triumphant resurrection, reuniting one's spirit into a Celestial body so that we may be exalted into God's presence as a joint-heir with Christ forever.

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

Have you been made perfect?

@michaelmurff9649

5 ай бұрын

@@Elizabeth-rk3do Consider reading Alma 5 to introspect on this question . . .

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@michaelmurff9649 not interested in the fanfiction of an 1800s New Yorker.

@murffmjtube

5 ай бұрын

@@BrendonKing how do you know that the Book of Mormon is fiction if you haven't actually read the text?

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@murffmjtube Read it for twenty years.

There is no pressure from the Church of Jesus Christ of LDS on anything! We abide by the law of free agency. 😇

We are all at different processes of understanding the mysteries of God. When we look to far ahead it can feel overwhelming, that is where we have to take a step back and remember we are here on earth, spiritual beings having earthly experiences, failure and repentance is part of our learning, we are not meant to be perfect, we are gaining understanding and building a relationship with Christ, hearing and feeling the spirit work with in us. I just can’t run faster than I can and I don’t have heaven all worked out, like President Oaks said…”there is still a lot we don’t know”

Pastor Jeff as a biblical Christian i know exactly what you are thinking and what is going through your mind 😮

@michellemarshall7223

5 ай бұрын

I don’t…..what is it?

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@michellemarshall7223he’s very composed.

The reason the restored gospel of Jesus Christ is different from the Bible is simply because the Bible is inadequate to understand all of this. It doesn’t mean the teaching is unbiblical; it rather means that the teachings are unknowable in an appeal to the Bible alone. Thank God for prophets and continuing revelation from a loving Heavenly Father. God is good. Yesterday. Today. Tomorrow. Forever.

@kevins4254

5 ай бұрын

A "restored" church with continuing revelation. How convenient.

@germanslice

5 ай бұрын

@@charlesmendeley9823 We teach that God has no beginning nor end to his spirit intelligence existence BEFORE he became a Man on earth in a body of flesh and bones and then was resurrected. We believe that God annd his son are eternal spirit beings embodied with glorified resurrected bodies of flesh and bone.

@mdcarson

5 ай бұрын

@@charlesmendeley9823first of all, the King Follett funeral sermon isn’t official church doctrine. Doesn’t mean it isn’t true though. Second, the Bible doesn’t give a God-origin story. Why? I don’t know. Why is God never had a beginning, evangelicals dont know why either- just cause “the Bible tells me so”. I guess this really matters, but does it really matter? What I have come to believe is that God currently talks, acts and speaks a lot like His son, Jesus Christ. How He got that way, I really don’t know. Right now, I really don’t care.

@mdcarson

5 ай бұрын

@@kevins4254if The Church of Jesus Christ is true, then it is not only convenient, it makes perfect sense and wise men and women would look into it further.

I couldn't imagine being separated from my father for all of eternity because I couldn't fulfill getting married in a temple. I am a Christian. I am so thankful I have my faith in Christ he is going to save me and be with me forever. Amen.

@joesimpson9230

5 ай бұрын

A temple that people have to pay money (tithes) to get approval to go it. Its a scam. You won't find that in the early church under Joseph Smith and not in the Book of Mormon.

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

Jesus Christ said that he would divide people and families. Matthew 10:34-37; Luke 12:51-53; The truth naturally divides people. To be worthy of Jesus and eternal life, one must side with God's truth even if it divides his own family.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@Elizabeth-rk3do amen

It's not DOING in the sense that we EARN. It's the BECOMING as we keep covenants. Our efforts in BECOMING like Christ are seen, are noticed. His grace ENABLES us to become as we strive (and are always falling short somehow). It's a perfect balance between us truly CHOOSING to live our faith (becoming like Christ in attributes) and relying on His saving and enabling grace to forgive us and help us BECOME like Him. 😍

@HelloSaints

5 ай бұрын

@LuxuryPads90 Appreciate that you make the distinction between doing and earning. You have a good view ... thanks!

@LuxuryPads90

5 ай бұрын

😊

To be come like Him is to be perfected in Him, to be perfect as He is, and to inherit all He has.

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

Have you been made perfect?

@brandonaeiou

5 ай бұрын

@@Elizabeth-rk3doShe is suggesting by grace we can become like Him. I believe w every fiber of my being, that God created us to be happy and to become eternal beings. God has everything and He chose to do this for us. Gods true divinity and power is limitless. I don’t think God created us to damn our true potential. Through His divinity,love and help…Resurrection means we will become immortal like God is. Eternity is a long time.

@annetteatwood8272

5 ай бұрын

@Elizabeth-rk3do perfect only through Christ. Because of His Atonement are our sins washed away. We are made clean, pure, and complete. Perfect doesn't mean without sin or mistakes, but our sins and mistakes are forgiven, making us worthy and clean to enter His kingdom. Our bodies are also prefected after we die because of Christ's resurrection. We are also resurrected, whole and complete, never to get sick or die again.

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

@@annetteatwood8272 Christ paid the penalty for my sins when he shed his blood on the cross, died, and rose again. That's the true, original gospel. I Corinthians 15. When I repented of my sins and put my faith in what Christ has already done for me on the cross, Christ forgave me of all my sins and imputed/gave to me His righteousness, which is the righteousness of God. 2 Corinthians 5:21 God made Jesus, who knew no sin, to be sin for us, that we might be made the righteousness of God in him. God now sees me as perfect, as clothed with the garments of salvation, the righteousness of God. ( Isaiah 61:10) I can walk out of God's courtroom free on Judgment Day because Christ has paid the penalty for my sins in full with his life's blood. Hebrews 10:14 For by one offering Christ hath perfected forever them that are sanctified. I have peace with God by faith. Romans 5:1 Therefore being justified by faith we have peace with God. 💕 🕊

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

@@annetteatwood8272 I still sin. My status before God is perfected. My current state is a sinner. Moroni 10:32 Come unto Christ and be perfected.

What is the only thing any of us truely have that we can offer Him? A broken heart and a contrite spirit. That we might be willing to take upon us His Name and always remember Him. This is an essential part of the Great Atoning gift to have our repented sins remitted. Not in our sins but from them. It is Why we do as He commanded and covenant to Love the Lord our God with all our heart, might, mind and strength. And the second, to love our neighbor because we truely want others to receive this offering also. Is work involved? Yes! Many acts of sin are covered by serving our fellow man. But who is the cover? Not me, but He. And what do I become? More like Him!Let your Light so shine, to Glorify God.

I think you just said, around min 23, that you become, through your actions, like Christ. 😂. Well done! Pres Oaks is referring to becoming like Christ, by understanding and developing the be attitudes preached in the sermon on the Mount. Just as you, and Pres Oaks said, in order to become something better, action is required.

I always thought of it like this… I am comfortable in the celestial room of the temple. The same would make others skin crawl. Some are fully at home in a dirty bar. The same would make my skin crawl. We will all make our own bed.

@joesimpson9230

5 ай бұрын

Do you see how the elaborate temples are a fulfillment of prophecy in the Book of Mormon of churches robbing the poor? 2 Nephi 28 11 Yea, they have all gone out of the away; they have become corrupted. 12 Because of pride, and because of false teachers, and false doctrine, their churches have become corrupted, and their churches are lifted up; because of pride they are puffed up. 13 They rob the poor because of their fine sanctuaries; they rob the poor because of their fine clothing; and they persecute the meek and the poor in heart, because in their pride they are puffed up.

I am enjoying your videos more these days as you try to truly understand what we believe. I think the main idea you are still missing is that we do believe that all of these things are only possible through Christ and His Atonement. We 100% cannot accomplish it on our own. What you call "works" and we call "ordinances" are not a means to "earn" our way into heaven - which what Elder Oaks is trying to say. They help us learn to become more like our Heavenly Father. We believe this life is all about learning, and through that process we all make mistakes and do things we shouldn't. We can only overcome those weaknesses with the hel of Jesus Christ. Without Him, none of this would be possible, and life would be pointless.

@evenspor

5 ай бұрын

I have to add that the Plan of Salvation is the fundamental doctrine that those of us raised in the Church are taught about from the time we are little, but at 45, there are still things that I am learning, and that's all part of the process. So it's understandable that it's difficult for you to grasp the fullness of it.

Jeff, I would submit that in LDS vernacular, "being saved" has more nuanced meanings as compared with evangelical Christianity. Everyone who has ever lived will be "saved" by resurrection from eternal death, even if they don't go to a kingdom of glory. We also speak of being "saved" in a kingdom of glory (celestial kingdom, terrestrial kingdom, telestial kingdom) which excludes what is called "outer darkness" or a kingdom with no glory. We also speak of being "saved" in the presence of God, the celestial kingdom, and finally we speak of being "saved" as in exaltation to the highest degree of glory in the celestial kingdom. The terrestrial and telestial kingdom are not "heaven". They are kingdoms of glory, but exist separate from the presence of God. Heaven is in the presence of God which we call the celestial kingdom. So protestant heaven may be more closely aligned to what we call the celestial kingdom. Here is my question for you Pastor Jeff: Do you believe that God knew the Fall of Adam and Eve would happen if He placed both trees in the garden? If He did know that it would happen, why did He place the tree of the knowledge of good and evil, knowing Adam and Eve would partake and Fall? It seems to me, that Christianity at large assumes the Fall was not part of the plan, but was an unfortunate deviation from God's plan. This not only isn't scriptural but I would submit that the Fall was God's plan and that Christ was not plan B. Revelation 13:8 "the Lamb slain from the foundation of the world" - According to the New Testament, God chose Christ to be the Savior before the foundation of the world. Thus when the garden of Eden was set up, the conditions for the Fall to occur were set in place and Adam and Eve given their agency. When they fell, a Savior was already chosen even before they fell. Not only does Christ correct the consequences of Adam and Eve's actions by ensuring universal resurrection, He also shows us the way in which to return to the presence of God. Christ's resurrection assures our resurrections, but it does not assure an inheritance in Heaven or God's presence. Therefore, Christ shows us what to do and how to do it. John 14:12 "Verily, verily, I say unto you, He that believeth on me, the works that I do shall he do also; and greater works than these shall he do". - How are we going to do greater works than Christ? Could it be possible He is referring to some future time when His followers would be forming their own creations in God's "many mansions"? We don't have that level of divine disclosure, but Christ's words make one wonder at their immense implications. The idea of the kingdoms of glory are biblical as Paul mentions them multiple times (2 Corinthians 2:12 & 1 Corinthians 15:40-41, also the New Testament Apocrypha called the Apocalypse of James mentions John the Baptist residing in the Third Heaven). The reason the Fall is relevant to the idea of kingdoms of Glory, is because many Christians assume the Fall was a deviation from the plan of God for mankind. We believe the Fall was a necessary process that allowed man agency and a probationary period to prove if he was willing to follow God. Not only would man have the chance to genuinely show his sincerity by faith in a fallen world, but he would also be added upon if He went on to do the works of Christ in his life. Fundamentally, the difference in belief is that Latter-day Saints believe that God desires us to become as much like Him in perfection and attributes and joint-heirship with Christ (Romans 8:17) as we possibly can over the course of our existence since we are literally His children. The ultimate destiny of a child of God is to be sealed in a House of God by priesthood authority to a faithful spouse for eternal companionship and eventual exaltation where they would go on to do "greater works than these".

@Vail-AspenSUVrentals

5 ай бұрын

You distinguish something that's critical. There is no Gospel of Jesus Christ without the fall. That's my biggest struggle with modern Christianity. It believes the plan a has no Christ as you mentioned. The entire plan of the salvation which is clearly taught in the book of Mormon. Christ Is the center of all things, all redemption. It's hard for me to believe in a plan b.

@natedawg2020

5 ай бұрын

I disagree that LDS people talk about resurrected people in outer darkness as being saved from eternal death. Resurrected people who go to outer darkness are immortal but not saved from eternal death, which is not the same thing. Outer darkness is eternal death. Sons of perdition are eternally suffering from everything related to death. They are actively dying for all eternity with wailing and gnashing of teeth. They are completely cut off from the presence of God.

@cameronreed1411

5 ай бұрын

@@natedawg2020 Hey Nate, I think we actually agree but what I could have said to make it less ambiguous, is that they are saved from eternal physical death because of their resurrection, but they are subject to spiritual death because of their separation from the presence of God. Their residence in a kingdom not of glory and knowing what they chose vs. what they could have chosen is the hell they will find themselves in and the cause of the gnashing of teeth.

@cameronreed1411

5 ай бұрын

@@Vail-AspenSUVrentals Exactly. Christ wasn't plan B because He is the Way chosen from before the foundation of the world.

@natedawg2020

5 ай бұрын

@@cameronreed1411 I understand the semantics of it, and personally I wouldn’t classify it as a resurrection unto salvation. I assume the magnitude of their eternal spiritual suffering encompasses their whole existence in a very physical way. I understand Cain may value his physical body more than Satan, but I don’t think either of them will sit around thinking how saved they are while they are eternally suffering.

Pastor Jeff, this was a great video! God Bless you!! Praying for you & your Ministry. 🙏✝️

Jeff, so glad to finally sit down and thank you for all the great content. just listening to your first episode that popped up on my feed. first of all, what a great friend you have become, your wife is right, you do have a gift. I admire your love of Christ, and your willingness to share with everyone, that love. Those that don't have that interest, will probably not know you or me, anyway. we all have a different understanding of everything. I especially admire your courage to open your mind and join with everyone in this human journey that we are all on while we are hear in this mortal life. we wouldn't have to have a separate distinct descriptive word for mortal life, if there were not another kind of life that's described with the word Eternal. We are all in this together. My church, The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, is just that. It's the organization here on Earth that guides me on my journey back to my Father in heaven. I testify that this church is the one that has opened my mind, and presented the necessary information to ascend beyond this mortal life. Each individual that comes here ( Earth) has a different path because of the fact that there is no one else like us.We need to join together and use our special talents to accomplish what God is asking us to help him do. And that is to gather the house of Israel. We are all to become a part of that Family sometime in the future. We must all join in Gods plan. I hope we will all do what you have done by starting your " Hello Saints" Channel. Thank You so much for your Friendship , I love you Brother, and hope in the future I get the opportunity to meet you personally. Good luck in all your future endeavors, and may the Lord Bless you for you good heart. Welcome to Utah!

I sustain everything President Oaks said in this talk. I shall comment on your objection Pastor Jeff with regards to people paying the penalty for their transgressions. President Oaks said that the dead still has an opportunity to repent, and if they do repent and make and keep covenants with God through the ordinances of the temple that are performed for them, then after they have paid the penalty for their transgressions, they shall receive a reward according to their works, in other words they will inherit a kingdom of glory according to their works. Pastor Jeff, your response to that was that nobody can pay the penalty for sin, only Jesus Christ can. You did not understand this teaching, so let me clarify this for you. Paying the "penalty" here simply means they will be punished in hell. Remember that the spirit world is divided into two parts: spirit prison aka hell (for the wicked) and paradise (for the just). Anyone who goes in spirit prison after death is being punished. That's the penalty that they have to pay. The penalty (or punishment) is spending some time in spirit prison or hell. However, once they receive the gospel and repent and obey the ordinances of the temple, their suffering or punishment is over, and by the Atonement of Jesus Christ they are redeemed. They are then liberated from spirit prison or hell and pass to the other side, which is paradise, and when it's time for them to be resurrected, they will rise to inherit a kingdom of glory according to their works. Summing up, we are not saying that someone can pay for their own sins. We are saying that those who go to spirit prison or hell after death will suffer the Lord's punishment, that of being in spirit prison or hell for a time, and after they repent and obey the ordinances of the gospel, they too will be saved. Those were the teachings of President Joseph F. Smith who claimed to have received them by revelation from God. This probably isn't anywhere to be found in the Bible. So really the only question is: Was Joseph F. Smith a true prophet? This is the only and the most important question that you and me have to answer for ourselves about Joseph Smith Jr. and all those who succeeded him, all the way to Russell M. Nelson. I have my answer already. What is yours Pastor Jeff? I think your audience deserves to know what you honestly think about those men who claim to be speaking for God. Don't you think?

Regarding marriage, again I’m curious what an Evangelical Protestant Christian would think of the marriage between Adam and Eve. They were clearly married prior to partaking of the fruit and the fall of man which introduced death into the world. Death wasn’t a thing when marriage was introduced. So doesn’t it stand to reason that Adam and Eve were married for eternity? Wouldn’t this imply that marriage in general is an eternal principle? Regarding Jesus saying that there is no marriage in heaven, we would read that as stating the necessity of these covenants and ordinances being done on Earth because there are no marriages performed in heaven.

@adaynasmile

6 ай бұрын

The Bible doesn't tell us that they were married. They were partners, which we would consider to be marriage today, but there is no discussion of marriage. They were unaware of their nakedness until after they partook of the fruit of the tree of knowledge which leads me to believe that if there was sex it was purely for creation purposes and not really used to bond one another to each other, or to bring pleasure. Honestly, it is a mystery and is unclear. But the command to join together was not until after the fall when Adam and Eve were kicked out of the garden. In Luke 20:34-35 Jesus tells us that there is no marriage in heaven. There will no longer be death, no longer be a need to populate the earth, and therefore no longer be a need for marriage. This was a good question! Thanks for getting me (and Evangelical Protestant) to think it through a bit more.

@andrewolsen2711

5 ай бұрын

@@adaynasmilethanks for the thoughtful explanation

@leslyvevedmc782

5 ай бұрын

Exactly! The Bible says that no one will be given in marriage in the resurrection, but it doesn't say that marriages that were performed on earth for the living or the dead before their resurrection will not continue to be in force in heaven.

@janellehoward7873

5 ай бұрын

@@adaynasmile Actually it does say they were married prior to the fall. (I use the KJV.) Genesis 2:22-25: 22 And the rib, which the Lord God had taken from man, made he a woman, and brought her unto the man. 23 And Adam said, This is now bone of my bones, and flesh of my flesh: she shall be called Woman, because she was taken out of Man. 24 Therefore shall a man leave his father and his mother, and shall cleave unto his wife: and they shall be one flesh. 25 And they were both naked, the man and his wife, and were not ashamed. The fall is in Genesis 3.

@janellehoward7873

5 ай бұрын

@@adaynasmile Also it mentions be fruitful and multiply in Genesis 1:27-28: 27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God created he him; male and female created he them. 28 And God blessed them, and God said unto them, Be fruitful, and multiply, and replenish the earth, and subdue it: and have dominion over the fish of the sea, and over the fowl of the air, and over every living thing that moveth upon the earth.

For me the doctrine of Exaltation is powerful as it is the only teaching (at least within Christianity that I am aware of) that explains what you would actually be doing in Heaven and what it would actually be like. Like all of us Christians agree that God will be there, and that we will be happy, and that it will be amazing and beautiful, but what are you going to be actually doing in the next life on a day to day basis that is so awesome?? Exaltation gives us a glimpse of what that could be! It also gives an additional purpose in life beyond just simply returning to our Heavenly Father, but that he wants us to eternally progress which is one of the reasons most Latter Day Saints tend to value education. Because we believe the knowledge we have obtained in this life is the one thing we can carry with us to the next to help us on our journey towards Exaltation.

.23.57 He wants us to be like him, glorified and have all that he has.

Isaiah 43:10 “You are my witnesses," declares the LORD, "and my servant whom I have chosen, that you may know and believe me and understand that I am he. Before me no god was formed, nor shall there be any after me.” 1 GOD ONLY THE TRIUNE LORD. Thank you Jeff you’ve helped me a ton in my recent decision to step away from the LDS faith. I am saved but I have much to educate myself on I am in SLC and I am attending an evangelical church. So thank you again for the help you have given me. 🙏🏽 GOD BLESS JESUS IS THE WAY !!!

@joesimpson9230

5 ай бұрын

Also confirmed in the Book of Mormon. Alma 8 79-82, 104 RLDS (11:26-29 LDS) And Zeezrom saith unto him: "Thou sayest there is a true and a living God?" And Amulek saith: "Yea, there is a true and a living God." Now Zeezrom saith: "Is there more than one God?" And he answered: "No." And shall be brought and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son and God the Father and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, To be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil. 2 Nephi 8 (11 LDS) 13 For if there be no Christ, there be no God; and if there be no God, we are not, for there could have been no creation. 14 But there is a God, and he is Christ; and he cometh in the fullness of his own time.

@melodylady99

5 ай бұрын

Amazing ❤ I am so excited for you and your new journey with Yeshuah. 😊

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

God bless!

@1GodManyprayers

5 ай бұрын

@@melodylady99 thank you!!!!

@wayneorr6748

5 ай бұрын

god the father will always and only be my God that does not mean their can not be other Gods.

I'm always struck, as a fellow Evangelical, with the idea that there's an aspect of the Catholic teaching of purgatory in the punishment idea of sin. I think your ending statement is so accurate, and while there's a real sense that the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints teaches a form of universalism, it really can be a confusing situation with what is required to achieve the levels of exaltation.

@diannaanderson

5 ай бұрын

When I have often explained to those outside of The Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints where we do our suffering, I give it it's proper name - Spirit Prison; and then relate it to the Catholic ideology of Purgatory. It's not so much like Purgatory, but it gets the general idea across and that's what members do to simplify unless the person/people want a more in-depth explanation.

@MrDaveKC

5 ай бұрын

@@diannaanderson thanks for the response.

@kellharris2491

5 ай бұрын

The Most important thing is to keep the two great commandments. God will guide you to know what you should do personally in your life. If you are sincere with God then God will be sincere with you.

@MrDaveKC

5 ай бұрын

@@kellharris2491 thanks for replying. The two great commandments, love God and love your neighbor are great and important commands. Yet none of us always do and succeed in always loving God and loving our neighbor. I'm grateful that "God demonstrates His own love for us in this, while we were yet sinners, Christ died for us." (Romans 5:8)

Heavenly Father is a father of LOVE and also the Great Teacher just like any goodly parent. The symbol of His only begotten Son Jesus Christ died on the cross was not a limited love but perfect love for all. I like Elder Oaks when He many times referred to the “modern days revelation” tells me that God never stops talking to His children here on earth. He wouldn’t stop at any destination but will always teach and guide according to the point and time for all. It is an on going love for all of His children taking this earthly journey we all agreed to be a part of!

This was one of my favorite talks from last Conference and I appreciated hearing your views on it. If you haven’t already, I recommend listening to Elder Christofferson’s talk “The Sealing Power” from the same session. it is the perfect follow up to this one and explains why we believe that families and covenants are so important. Keep up the great work!

This is a good doctrinal talk on a core and fundamental belief of Mormonism. I've always appreciated Elder Oak's clarity on explaining the doctrines of the LDS Church.

@BGCflyer

5 ай бұрын

...so would you agree that the LDS church teaches you can become God someday? Just as Joseph Smith Taught in the King Follett discourses?...Isn't it interesting that Satan also beguiled Eve to "Be like God"?

@kennunez5927

5 ай бұрын

Yes, I agree the doctrines of the LDS church teach that exaltation means one can become a God (like their heavenly father). @@BGCflyer

@james8996

5 ай бұрын

@@BGCflyer Psalm 82 read it

You say you’re interested in learning and I used to believe you were interested in learning. You always rebut what’s said with your own beliefs. These are prophets and apostles of God and are here for people of the whole earth to learn from. I do appreciate your videos.

Pastor Jeff, Thank you for your video. I appreciate you taking the time to even do this. I think how you described Heaven and Hell as being those who will be found in the book of life will enjoy Eternity with God and those who are not will be separated from him is actually very in line with what is being taught. Only those who obtain the Celestial Glory will be able to live in his presence. The other 2 kingdoms have separate and distinct features about them that again, we don't understand that much about them, but we understand that they will be separated from God, Our Heavenly Father. I also love that you talked about us understanding God's mysteries and that there is a lot of mystery in that. For me, that mystery includes eternal progression, progression towards becoming as he is as his children and spiritual offspring. As far as I understand it, being separated from God includes a sense of eternal damnation. Although not an eternal suffering for sin or an eternal punishment, it is an eternal damnation as you are stopped in your progression and learning at a point if you have not lived Eternal or Celestial Laws to qualify for that.

Thanks and great video! (I learn so much) appreciate it!

Thanks, Pastor Jeff, for your reaction to Pres. Oaks' talk. Yes, it is doctrinally very dense. It helps to realize that things that are only hinted at or described in part in the New Testament, are clarified through modern revelation through prophets. An example of this is I Cor 15:40-44 where Paul speaks of the glories of resurrected bodies (sun, moon, stars). Because this passage can be interpreted a number of ways, God clarified this doctrine in 1832 in an important vision to the prophet Joseph Smith together with his counselor, Sidney Rigdon, (second witness); this is now recorded as D&C 76. Much of Pres. Oaks' talk is based on this vision which also clarifies the "many mansions" statement of Jesus Christ in John 14:2 which Pres. Oaks cited in his talk. This and many other doctrines of the restoration are much easier to accept once one has accepted that God has the power to call prophets whenever and wherever He chooses, through whom He can reveal light and knowledge. If one cannot accept that truth, then many restoration doctrines remain difficult to accept.

@BGCflyer

5 ай бұрын

...so if I understand correctly, you have to go outside of the Bible to get complete LDS theology? Can you show me if Joseph Smith translated the Book of Abraham correctly? and where is the word "Telestial" found in the Bible?

@OzzieandHarriett

5 ай бұрын

@@BGCflyer if God is the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow, why would He stop using prophets after the New Testament? Can you should me in the Bible where it states that revelation and the need for prophets would end with the death of the apostles? If Christ is the final Prophet and we don't need any after, why the need for anything past the four Gospels? Why the need for Paul (formerly Saul)? And can you show me that everything in the Bible has been translated correctly? And if so, which version of the Bible is the most correct in its translation?

In the 1st edition of the BOM, (1830) before any revisions (1835) on the diety of Christ or the Doctrine on heaven, and hell , 1 Nephi explicitly teaches the same as the Holy Bible on this subject. I find it so fascinating, as those changes (1835) completely create a different gospel. I respect the heart of the LDS people, but honestly, if the 1st edition of the BOM is authentic, why would it need to be so revised. Read it, Pastor Jeff. I think you will be surprised as I have been. I am in the middle of reading it now and can not put it down. You inspired me to read the BOM with you this last year, and I did the (1982) edition. Though I have heard many LDS tell me it was only punctuation or small revisions that have been done, I find this not so. It is so eye-opening. I actually think the 1st edition is rather compelling and beautiful in its descriptions of 'The Holy One of Isreal.❤ Thank you so much! This was an excellent video Pastor Jeff! Blessings to all. 😊

@cameronreed1411

5 ай бұрын

No, it isn't a different gospel. Joseph Smith had the priesthood keys and had all the authority necessary to make changes or adjustments that alleviate confusion. The Inspired Translation completed by Joseph Smith is a great example of this.

@DistinctiveThinking

5 ай бұрын

Thank you! ❤️

@sc766

5 ай бұрын

YES! The 1830 edition is the original and has totally different view on Godhead. It states that Jesus is the eternal father!

@idahojoe79

5 ай бұрын

And now, because of the covenant which ye have made ye shall be called the children of Christ, his sons, and his daughters; for behold, this day he hath spiritually begotten you; for ye say that your hearts are changed through faith on his name; therefore, ye are born of him and have become his sons and his daughters. Mosiah 5:7 If ye will lay hold upon every good thing, ye certainly will be a child of Christ Moroni 7:19 The Book of Mormon is still pretty clear that we can become "children of Christ" through faith in him and acceptance of his atoning sacrifice for us... Making him an "Eternal Father", as we are "born of Him" The doctrine hasn't changed, even if some grammatical clarification was.

Dallin Oaks talk is solid and rings true. You ( whoever you are) are free to accept or reject these truths. This is the basis of ongoing revelation revealing and clarifying the vagueness of ancient scriptures. I believe we’ ll all get what we shoot for. The terrestrial kingdom fits perfectly in the evangelical expectation. Great. You’ll be happy there. I shoot for an eternal marriage and family. Maybe the mainstream community should also hope and be happy for us to reach that goal.

Hello. Can you believe that I cling to every word said and analysis given through your videos in order to strengthen my own beliefs and testimony of truth. I am seeking to better build a solid and firm foundation of who God is, and exactly what he desires from me. It has enabled me to break apart all I have been taught and have faithfully practiced all my life in order to understand it even more clearly as you give a Chistian and evangelical view alongside my Lds beliefs and understanding. Thank you!

@brooke1318

5 ай бұрын

He doesn't always have the best tone, just be careful going to this pastor for clarification... His bias can sometimes slip through the cracks, bless him for trying. I invite you to turn to the word of God and conference talks from modern day prophets for this clarification. I promise you will receive all the answers you need and more 🩷

@joesimpson9230

5 ай бұрын

@@brooke1318 I don't believe that the modern day prophets are really prophets. They don't prophesy. They also teach things that are contrary to the Bible and the Book of Mormon. Russell Nelson notes in his own autobiography that he is a Skull & Bones member, and also Owl & Key....secret satanic societies like those warned of in the Book of Mormon. There is only one God. Alma 8 79-82, 104 RLDS (11:26-29 LDS) And Zeezrom saith unto him: "Thou sayest there is a true and a living God?" And Amulek saith: "Yea, there is a true and a living God." Now Zeezrom saith: "Is there more than one God?" And he answered: "No." And shall be brought and be arraigned before the bar of Christ the Son and God the Father and the Holy Spirit, which is one Eternal God, To be judged according to their works, whether they be good or whether they be evil.

I hope the LDS Church is right. I’m also partial to the kingdom where one can imbibe cappuccinos.

@melodylady99

5 ай бұрын

Your comment made me laugh a little..thank you 😂

@cinnamondan4984

5 ай бұрын

@@melodylady99 my pleasure beyond measure.

Enjoyed your reaction. My personal thoughts The way I approach this topic is in terms of character, desires, and laws. We become Gods or the sons of God when we fully embrace and uphold the desires, qualities, and laws of God. Which is only possible for us through the grace of the holy Messiah. Exaltation is about fully and completely embracing the nature of God until his qualities and nature are fully expressed in us. We believe that God asks us to “become perfect even as he is perfect” Matthew 5:48 and that God provides a way for that to be possible through His son We qualify to live in an exalted state by becoming one who desires and lives the laws of exaltation in the celestial kingdom. This is possible through developing faith in the Lord Jesus Christ unto repentance which causes us to develop a changed heart. This changed nature leads us to seek to follow and obey God, to become one even as Christ and Heavenly Father are one John 17: 21-23. Our relationship with Christ grows by living his commandments and making covenants with him. This is our love of God made manifest. John 14:15 If ye love me, keep my commandments. 3 Nephi 27:27 “What manner of men ought ye to be? Verily I say unto you, even as I am” We believe Christ has the power to not only forgive sins but to enable us to fully become as he is. Psalm 82:1, 6 John 10:34-36 John 17:21-23 Luke 6:35 1 corinthians 8:5-6 D&C 76:58 D&C 121:28 Topical guild: Man, Potential to Become Like Heavenly Father www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/tg/man-potential-to-become-like-heavenly-father?lang=eng Short video by Saints unscripted kzread.info/dash/bejne/oaOarrlrldjUd9I.html Vision of the Celestial Kingdom www.churchofjesuschrist.org/manual/doctrine-and-covenants-student-manual/section-137-vision-of-the-celestial-kingdom?lang=eng Council in Heaven www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/council-in-heaven?lang=eng The Divine Council byustudies.byu.edu/article/the-divine-council/ Joseph Smith and the Biblical Council of Gods www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/conference/august-2010/joseph-smith-and-the-biblical-council-of-gods Question: Do Mormon men believe that they will become "gods of their own planets" and rule over others? www.fairlatterdaysaints.org/answers/Question:_Do_Mormon_men_believe_that_they_will_become_%22gods_of_their_own_planets%22_and_rule_over_others%3F Gods of the Bible, Part 2 kzread.info/dash/bejne/d3yIz6aIg6XWidY.html This doctrine also has different kinds of interpretations in our faith Here is a good discussion on a few looks at this doctrine kzread.info/dash/bejne/o2mDp6yPg8u5icY.html King Fallet Discourse www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/history/topics/king-follett-discourse?lang=eng Premortality: Topical Guide: www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/manual/gospel-topics/premortality?lang=eng Index to the Triple Combination: www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/triple-index/premortal-existence?lang=eng Guide to the Scriptures:www.churchofjesuschrist.org/study/scriptures/gs/premortal-life?lang=eng I hope this helps. thanks for the great Content

Excellent commentary!

I love the honest effort to understand what is being taught. In regards to teaching the dead, we know that there is a time between death and judgment. That is best described in Alma chapter 40

@tony-northcountry3272

5 ай бұрын

@arjunheart5859 There is no teaching to the wicked between death and resurrection. They are waiting for an awful judgment. Alma 40:11-14, 26 - Now, concerning the state of the soul between death and the resurrection-Behold, it has been made known unto me by an angel, that the spirits of all men, as soon as they are departed from this mortal body, yea, the spirits of all men, whether they be good or evil, are taken home to that God who gave them life. And then shall it come to pass, that the spirits of those who are righteous are received into a state of happiness, which is called paradise, a state of rest, a state of peace, where they shall rest from all their troubles and from all care, and sorrow. And then shall it come to pass, that the spirits of the wicked, yea, who are evil-for behold, they have no part nor portion of the Spirit of the Lord; for behold, they chose evil works rather than good; therefore the spirit of the devil did enter into them, and take possession of their house-and these shall be cast out into outer darkness; there shall be weeping, and wailing, and gnashing of teeth, and this because of their own iniquity, being led captive by the will of the devil. Now this is the state of the souls of the wicked, yea, in darkness, and a state of awful, fearful looking for the fiery indignation of the wrath of God upon them; thus they remain in this estate, as well as the righteous in paradise, until the time of their resurrection ... But behold, an awful death cometh upon the wicked; for they die as to things pertaining to things of righteousness; for they are unclean, and no unclean thing can inherit the kingdom of God; but they are cast out, and consigned to partake of the fruits of their labors or their works, which have been evil; and they drink the dregs of a bitter cup.

Hi Pastor Jeff, thank you for your reaction to this teaching from Dallin H Oaks. You mentioned 5:41 your belief in an afterlife consisting of an existence with God having been named to the Book of Life contrasted with an afterlife of separation from God. To clarify, my belief in kingdoms of glory in an afterlife are consistent with how you stated yours in this video because the lesser kingdoms Dallin H Oaks mentioned are in fact a separation from God despite the grace and glory provided to the inhabitants by a loving God. Hopefully, this helps; thanks again! 🤔

@darkforgiven360

6 ай бұрын

That is actually helpful, since at first glance it does seem like universalism. Definitely helps clarify it.

@douglascarlson321

5 ай бұрын

@@darkforgiven360 Latter-day Saints regularly refer to people using a middle initial within church leadership. It seems a little bit quirky to me, but I think probably everyone in the church knows that his middle initial is H. I don't know why we do that.

You need to also remember we differentiate between God the Father and Jesus Christ. Two different beings. It's hard to follow when you try to use them as the same. The Celestial has the presence and fulness of the Father. The Terrestrial has the presence and fulness of the Son. God the Father wants you to return to him.

Thanks for your respect and your willingness and efforts to understand. It's exciting to watch you learn! There can be a lot of nuance to our beliefs when you're coming at them looking for deeper understanding. Three pieces of feedback I have are: 1. Look deeper into the idea of any Kingdom being "better" or "worse" than any other Kingdom. 2. Dig deeper into what we believe the word "progress" means in relation to eternal progression as a family unit. You won't find a ton, but it may help reconcile the differences between the heaven you keep saying Christians are looking for and our beliefs about all the varying degrees of glory. 3. The heaven you keep talking about (complete access to Jesus, not married, etc) is available in the way you keep talking about it, within the LDS belief of the kingdoms of glory. Keep looking for it. Great comment on the telestial kingdom aligning with the Christian concept of hell. Also, great catch on the concern about "pressure to get married". It's real, and it seems to be a concern at every level of the church.

At 11:49 you said it clearly, one God over "this created universe". As an exalted being, we will create new worlds and new universes, as did our God. The process, I believe, is neverending, as is our relationship with God the Father. No beginning, no end.

The Bible is true, but where does it say that it is all of God’s truth? The Bible doesn’t testify of itself as the whole of God’s revealed truth.

It’s different than universalism because the wicked who reject Christ will suffer the punishment for their sins in Hell just like they do in traditional Christian teaching. The difference in our teaching is that Hell has an end. Eternal punishment just means that it’s God’s punishment, not that it has no end. The wicked people in the telestial kingdom are forever separated from the presence of God, just as they are in traditional Christian teaching. It’s just that their suffering in Hell has ended. And God loves all of His children.

@jessekoeven3757

6 ай бұрын

To state it simply, Hell describes quality, not duration.

Pastor Jeff, I appreciate your videos and discussions. I do tend to get wrapped around the axle about Faith and Works. I was reading the following verses in Revelations this week: Blessed are they that do his commandments, that they may have right to the tree of life, and may enter in through the gates into the city. Rev. 22:14 12 And I saw the dead, small and great, stand before God; and the books were opened: and another book was opened, which is the book of life: and the dead were judged out of those things which were written in the books, according to their works. 13 And the sea gave up the dead which were in it; and death and hell delivered up the dead which were in them: and they were judged every man according to their works. 14 And death and hell were cast into the lake of fire. This is the second death. 15 And whosoever was not found written in the book of life was cast into the lake of fire. Rev. 20:12-15 I believe hese scriptures are pretty straightforward in stating what we do matters as much as what we believe. I feel that Faith, hope, keeping the commandments and works are all critical in making it possible to obtain joy, peace and the opportunity to live in the presence of God. Any thoughts? Thanks again for sharing your time and talents with us!! :-)

@HelloSaints

5 ай бұрын

@kylerobinson7572 Thanks for your comment ... faith and works is a common challenge to all of us! Christians are called by our faith to witness to the faithfulness of God, and witnessing manifests itself in giving hope, comforting, and loving others. It's how we are compelled to respond in reflecting His grace.

“It's difficult to get a man to understand something when his salary depends on not understanding it." -Upton Sinclair. Pastor Jeff is not trying to learn truth. He's trying to coddle the Saints into listening to him.

you should react to the gospel topics essays.

You chose a great talk to review. It concisely sums up the biggest difference between mainstream Christianity and the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints. Simply put, that difference is that there is more. It is not just about being saved and living in a heavenly place and avoiding hell. It is about becoming one with God--or becoming like God. From an LDS perspective, Christ's great intercessory prayer in John 17 strongly supports the idea of becoming like Christ and like God himself. I would love to understand better what your view is on the doctrine of reconciliation if it doesn't involve becoming like God. And if you say that we can become "like" God without becoming "Gods" then I would submit to you that the difference in your belief on the matter and LDS doctrine is merely a difference in semantics. God will always be our God but if we are becoming like him... are we not becoming Gods? Several other New Testament passages also point to this doctrine. When Jesus was accused of blasphemy on the grounds that “thou, being a man, makest thyself God,” He responded, echoing Psalms, “Is it not written in your law, I said, Ye are gods?” In the Sermon on the Mount, Jesus commanded His disciples to become “perfect, even as your Father which is in heaven is perfect.” In turn, the Apostle Peter referred to the Savior’s “exceeding great and precious promises” that we might become “partakers of the divine nature.” The Apostle Paul taught that we are “the offspring of God” and emphasized that as such “we are the children of God: and if children, then heirs; heirs of God, and joint-heirs with Christ.” The book of Revelation contains a promise from Jesus Christ that “to him that overcometh will I grant to sit with me in my throne, even as I also overcame, and am set down with my Father in his throne.” Why settle for heaven when there is more?

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

The 'more' is just things made up by the LDS church. It contradicts God's Holy word. I know that there are no levels of heaven. I Corinthians 15 never mentions heaven, levels, degrees, three, telestial, etc. Heaven is not about what you want but about submitting to what God wants. Only then will you be truly 'happy.' When I die, I will immediately be with my Lord and Savior Jesus Christ. "To be absent from the body is to be present with the Lord." 💕 Jesus Christ said to the thief on the cross, "Today, you will be with me in Paradise." Luke 16 Lazarus was already in Abraham's bosom. The rich man was already in conscious torment in hell. "It is appointed unto man once to die and after that the judgment." Hebrews 9:27 There will be no second chances. When you live your life apart from God and follow man made ideas, you have far, far less. God is in charge of heaven not the LDS church.

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

Psalm 82 is referring to the unjust, Jewish judges of the day who were seen as gods by the people. They were only men and would die one day. You are not a god. You are a sinful, fallen, created being that God has already sentenced to death. God has already told us that he is the only God there ever was, is, or will be. God doesn't even know of any other God. Isaiah 43:10; 44:6, 8; 45:5; The Bible says that everyone is born spiritually dead in their sins, children of disobedience, children of wrath, and without hope in the world. Ephesians 2 Isaiah 59:2 Our sins separate us from a holy God. Christ told the Pharisees that they were of their father the devil because they refused to believe that he was God (John 8) Christ said that their sins would not be forgiven and they would be condemned. John 1:12 Only those who receive the biblical Christ become children of God. The 'offspring of God' refers to the idea that we are all God's creation. Unlike pagan gods, we know that God is not married. God is self-existent. God does not need food, air, water, clothing, shelter, sleep, sex, or anything else a mere created being might need. Acts 17 - The Athenians worshiped all manner of false gods. They had an altar 'To The Unknown God.' Paul told them about the true and living God, our Creator. Latter-day Saints worship a false god. An 'exalted man' from another planet. A god that had to work his way to Godhood, practices polygamy, and damns people who deny the eternal principle of polygamy. D&C 132 The true and living God would never do that. 0:02 Why don't you worship the true and living God? The Creator? The God who spoke the universe into existence from nothing including the planet that the LDS Heavenly Father came from and the star Kolob that he lives near?

@jessewilson7809

5 ай бұрын

Gish gallop (/ˈɡɪʃ ˈɡæləp/) is a rhetorical technique in which a person in a debate attempts to overwhelm their opponent by providing an excessive number of arguments with no regard for the accuracy or strength of those arguments. Gish galloping prioritizes the quantity of the galloper's arguments at the expense of their quality. I will gladly continue this conversation if you would like to take it one topic at a time so we can have an actual conversation. Regardless... I don't think it is likely you will persuade me to be a follower of Elizabeth's gospel. Seems a bit too angry for me 🤷‍♂ @@Elizabeth-rk3do

@Elizabeth-rk3do

5 ай бұрын

​​​@@jessewilson7809 I don't have a gospel. The true, original gospel is in I Corinthians 15. I can't persuade you of anything. Only God can regenerate a person's soul. I would just urge you to read the New Testament as a child. Nothing is more important than where you spend eternity.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

@@jessewilson7809 Gish gallops are irrelevent in a chat/text-based forum, where you have all the time in the world to respond in kind, but good deflect.

Based on your fascination with this talk I would LOVE to see a reaction to Tad R. Callister's talk "Our Identity and Our Destiny." I think it would be really interesting to see you watch it since it is one of the best descriptions of this content I've ever encountered!

As members of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter Day Saints, we believe that when we dies, we will be assigned to preform missionary work to those who either rejected the gospel in life or did not fully embrace it. Those who are still living on ear5yh can preform ordinances for the dead in the temples as a gift. Those who the ordinances are preformed for, still have the oppritunities to accept or deny.

@jlewis8145

5 ай бұрын

It is appointed unto man once to die and after that the judgment."

John 8:23 destroys the LDS belief in a human pre-existence.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

Christ draws this distinction all over the gospels, and yet humanity is determined to make Him one of us.

You need to have a conversation on Outer Darkness and the Second Anointing.

@rodneyjamesmcguire

5 ай бұрын

@@charlesmendeley9823 🤣🤣🤣

My Father is not limited. He can make me like Him through obeying Him.

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

Such conditional love

one thing to emphasize is the church is a restored gospel. Through revelation in our days, the restoration has given us a bigger picture that builds upon the amazing truths you have already built a foundation upon. There were a couple points that you suggested would be completely contrary to evangelical teachings, but much of what I heard/saw would be an expansion and more light and knowledge of what’s been given in the Bible. The doctrine seems heavy, but I love the point that we are choosing a place where we can comfortably abide. If one chooses to give glory to Christ their whole life, that’s what they’ve chosen and that’s where they will be most comfortable. If they are willing to give glory, keep the commandments, and willing to make promises and covenants with the Father, then that’s where that person would feel most comfortable. As he said, nothing will be forced…it all comes back to our willingness/commitment we are wanting to give.

Interesting that you edited out where Elder Oaks mentioned the Bible reveals two of the kingdoms of glory but that the third was revealed to Joseph Smith. I would think that to be an interesting talking point. 17:23 This is what is missing from what Elder said: “The Apostle Paul describes the three degrees of glory, likening them to the glories of the sun, moon, and stars. He names the highest “celestial” and the second “terrestrial.” He does not name the lowest, but a revelation to Joseph Smith added its name: “telestial.” Another revelation also describes the nature of the persons to be assigned to each of these kingdoms of glory.” Study help: 1 Corinthians 15

@Lola-sz8zu

5 ай бұрын

My thoughts exactly! It was edited out.

Faith is a work. The sinners prayer is a work. Caring for the widows and the poor is a work. Evangelicals just don’t want to admit it. But it does complicate their doubling down on “faith-only salvation”.

@janeeyre8241

5 ай бұрын

Further than that, prayer is a work of faith, as is reading scripture and attending church. These are all works of faith and all faithful evangelicals do them.

@maxstooksberry9458

5 ай бұрын

The Bible separates faith (Hebrews 1) and work (meriting favor) Titus 3:5

@BrendonKing

5 ай бұрын

Again demonstrating that the lay Mormon does not understand faith vs. works from an evangelical standpoint.

@janeeyre8241

5 ай бұрын

Hi Brendon, if you read the following Titus verse 3:6, the Lord promises the abundant outpouring of the Holy Ghost on those who do not seek salvation in their own merit but rely on Christ’s mercy. I was once an evangelical but now a Saint and I can promise you the outpouring of the HG is ten-fold more powerful since my conversion to the LDS faith. That is God’s confirmation I am on the right path. As Saints our reliance is wholly on Christ’s redemptive power not our own. But our obedience and our works are an expression of our faith, not to merit favour. Nevertheless, I’ve observed when I magnify my obedience God magnifies the HG. He loves to reward a sincere sacrifice. I still have many evangelical friends and family and occasionally I hear their conversations about the lack of real encounters with God and His Spirit and how they desire more of Him. That is never a conversation Saints have as the Spirit is so abundant and present in our lives. And that’s because the Church is true! God bless you good brother 🙏

@mdcarson

5 ай бұрын

@@BrendonKingprobably right about evangelicals and Mormons talking past each other. I probably understand more about evangelical views on faith and world than you are giving me credit for. Anyways… Evangelicals, lay or not, just love to assume we do everything we do to be saved. I think Elder Oaks’ talk should put that idea and accusation to bed. “Works” help us become, not to earn. I am aware some terminology we use can be confusing on that point, but Elder Oaks lays it out clearly and I believe that is our doctrine and teaching of the church, despite what quote someone can show me from the Journal of Discourses, volume x, page y.

I am so grateful for these perspectives from you! I have wanted to know for years how different Christian religions teach the beautiful gospel of Jesus Christ and God. Thank You!

Hey Jeff, to answer your question about teaching the dead; our understanding is an extension of 1 Peter 3:19. We believe that before His resurrection, Christ established His church among the dead, including post-mortal missionary endeavors.

Your beliefs fit perfectly into the “popular idea” Oaks mentions during this talk ( 17:50 “comparable to the popular concept of heaven”)- exactly correlates to the experience of inheriting the terrestrial kingdom. So you’re right about inheriting Paul’s ‘second heaven’ - you don’t have to change your course for that. Faith without works is dead, mainstream acrobatics around that fact aren’t convincing at all

It’s not the three Degrees of Glory, it’s the Three Kingdoms of Glory. The three degrees of glory are exclusively in the Celestial Kingdom.

Im fairly new to your channel,i find it very informative,im watching as an ex Mormon to see hiw much of the doctrine i remember as ive been out of the church for 32 years,i find your comparisons clear and easy to understand