What an awesome game and cast! Thanks again for another gem in BAR coverage!

@rami-succar7356

9 ай бұрын

Thank you guys for this great game!

@forsaken4229

5 ай бұрын

Omg im a BAR fan thanks for the amazing game (destroys my laptop but its worth it)

Neat game, but I think there are definitely things of varying value to take away. - I really like his allowing those tanks to run past his commander to die to his laser tower and pawns. That was VERY well done, with ample flanking damage. - I love his mobile build power to cap and upgrade his mexes very fast, and that is where the money came from, I think. He gets the highest income on his team by like 10 metal a second very early, even when on tier 1. - His play is very high tempo, as he avoids reclaming, which is a costly activity in terms of time, as nanos take a while to pay themselves back on time, but also cost a lot of energy. I believe the break even time on nanos is like 26 seconds ish (That is not a precise figure, it's a dim recollection). you do not see him mass reclaming. this is also why he can do so much with such limited energy income. he is storing his energy, not using it to build stuff he will later reclaim. You can see that as he is building his fusion, he is already energy stalling, quite badly, in spite of having energy storage. His team is also overflowing energy into his 14k bank, meaning he is getting an appreciably faster timing by just leveraging inefficiencies in his team's economy. Nano turrets would eat into this energy quite heavily, as 7 nanos have the energy cost of 1 fusion reactor. he has few nano turrets, so his fusion is going up slowly, but it is going up very early, as he didn't spend 2 minutes building 16+ nanos to prep for it, and he doesn't have 50 wind turbines to finance his nano wall. His fusion reactor is energy limited, but that makes sense, as a fusion reactor is an energy producing building. Why build one if you don't need energy? ( I know, to convert to metal, but that is a slow payback activity). I haven't really done the math, but if we figure an AFUS is 30% more efficient than fusion, and an afus has a 200ish second payback time, then dismantling a fusion to make an AFUS has like a 11 minute payback time. This is not terrible, but it's clearly low value activity compared to say, building units and kicking your opponent's teeth in, or building another AMEX with like a sub 2 minute payback time. His effectiveness is partly his micro for sure, but I think it's largely he doesn't spend his time buildling 20 nanos and THEN having an impact, he has an impact very quickly because he just uses buildings he already has, like a t2 factory, or his fusion reactor. He is not reclaiming them.

Note at the end that StarDoM has perfect resource usage; the opposing team has almost perfect metal usage (0 excess metal) but they have massive massive energy excess which is wasted resource usage. The entire opposing team produced 8K units and nabbed "most resource efficient" from the end game trophies, but StarDoM didn't show up anywhere in that category because what that trophy represents is not really "most resource efficient" but "most resource waste". Also, note that this is basically minimized energy waste vs minimized metal waste as strategies, and the difference between them is StarDoM carrying through five opponents relatively easily. StarDoM minimizes energy waste and that happens to align also with minimizing metal waste; this is because metal is a bottleneck whereas energy is generally not, so you can minimize metal waste while still bleeding energy but you basically can't minimize energy waste without also minimizing metal waste. As with Total Annihilation, the best economic strategy is maximize energy usage--if you're not running a power deficit at least some of the time then you're playing wrong. Every unit of energy should be used. That converts potential into actual either in terms of growing economy or in terms of more units attacking more opposing economies. One of the major differences in terms of combat and engagement between StarDoM and the other players is the other players attack each other's units; StarDoM is almost exclusively doing one of two things with units: establishing defensive lines to protect resources or pushing through defensive lines and running to attack opposing economies. The fleas make a lot of sense because they don't threaten much, but they are sufficient to attack and destroy mines, wind mills, construction bots and infrastructure, and to generally bleed away the economy of the opposition while the focus of the opposition is on the "serious threats". Also, about Advanced Fusion. They're a liability; it is probably by StarDoM's calculus less risky to diversify at a slightly higher cost into regular fusion or other non-explosive power generators than to put everything into a blink red target which opponents will if they are wise absolutely target for mass destruction.

You'd think 4 players could outscale one player. The opposing team sure did psyche themselves out in how much echo they thought he had.

man when sc2 and aoe content creators both start covering bar you know its gonna be one big year for your fav indi game

@drenghel4641

9 ай бұрын

Examples of SC2 casters coming to BAR ? pls

@1dog915

6 ай бұрын

@@drenghel4641 winter

@Thot-Slayer-420

4 ай бұрын

@@drenghel4641 winterstarcraft? i saw his 25v25 that got me into bar content

23:20 I have the same strategy building base this is definitely from the TA times ;) my most palyed game aswell in the past. Thisis the way TA was played you never stop producing unit all tech same time .. ammo and shot eaters aswell as heavy tech. Just have several groups planned 1 hour ahead to jsut cosntantly build generatros and towers and focus on units and tech while your push is compeltely automated. Good old times.

Not having an advance fusion makes you less of a target and less vulnerable to raids also allows for more units on the field on the short term. So as long as your killing units and loseing units efficiently(having your units corp die closer to you then the enemy) and reclaiming all of it, it will make up for the lack of AF.

@Leonhart_93

Жыл бұрын

Honestly, considering how long it takes to build them and how risky it is, it makes more sense to ditch them until much later as a frontliner. And they are like what 33% more cost efficient that fusion? Not worth to rush them.

@StpMakinMeChangMyNam

Жыл бұрын

Most of his units were dying on the enemy's side of the map though, not his own. Really the more important factor is that the AF takes a long time to build and has a much larger upfront cost. Having to invest that much time and money and wait that much longer for the payoff puts a big dip in your unit production. Going for standard fusions instead allows you to produce more consistently. If you can then use those earlier units effectively before your opponents can out pace your eco you can win through overwhelming pressure. If you fail to use the earlier units effectively your opponents' eco will pass yours and they will have the advantage. It's a yo-yo effect that started with his early tier 2 rush. By rushing tier 2 faster than everyone else he was vulnerable early, but managed to start the mid-game snowball faster so not only did he extend the time where he could snowball by delaying AFs, but he got there quicker too. The brilliance is that this works because the commander counters tier 1 units so it's totally fine to rush tier 2 and use the com to stay alive but then the com is fare less effective at defending tier 2. Unless someone finds a hard counter to this style of play, I think it will very quickly become the go to meta. Rush tier 2, build up massive armies while slowly building up standard fusions and try to win with overwhelming pressure, if needed go up to cheap, fast tier 3 units to continue the pressure.

This cast was eye opening for me. Makes me a feel like a wee baby playing BAR

We fucked up in this game by us not making static defense which meant our units had to be in defense against faster units like marauders and pawns. If we [south] could push bottom with the 1 thor we would've won since killing star would be auto win. -Choice

Thanks for doing those BAR videos, Drongo.

First couple of casts I was like, what is this game even. Now this cast made me want to play it. Awesome versitality in units, strategies and game settings. Until new Season AOE4 is live, I'll be here!

Achieved is a former t1 fps player from rainbow six. It's very cool to see him dipping his toes into the RTS side!

i have looked a bit into the rankings (its openskill now, they changed it a while ago, still works with the same mathematical principle) you have an estimated skill which starts at 25, and how uncertain the system is about you (which starts at 8.3) your matchmaking rating is your skill - your uncertainty your uncertainty goes down by a few % (never reaching 0) the more data (matches) the rating has, and also scales how much skill valuation you loose or gain if you lose or win (this still gets scaled by the difference in skill) i dont know if it ever goes up again (in a season? over time?) matchmaking tries to balance skills and standard deviation of skills on each team (so its not one 55 rated player and 7 5 rated noobs vs 8 10 rated beginners) the chevrons are about leaderboard positions where its skill - 3x uncertainty (so you start out at 0 and even if you loose all your games, uncertainty goes down faster than your rank)

great cast.. very skillfully done ... gameplay was good too :)))

Stardom is a really impressive AI.

i love bar i love drongo i hope bar gets more popular

while Star DoM was definitely the star of the show, we should not forget to give bingbingbang some credit, they did absolutely amazing too with supporting star DoM

New to the channel but great video! Really liked that it kind of focused on a player and had some structure to it; most casters I've seen just seem to be bouncing all over the place making it really difficult to follow, so appreciate you taking the time and talking through what things are standard/non-standard etc. in this kind of play.

I like bar because in big team fights you never need to say gg. You need one metal and energy storage as well as one construction bot. You can easily scale again by the excess of the other players. Most eco player keep your energy toped while fighting and someone reclaiming will keep your metal toped out. And even if you can only spam ticks or pawns they help other units survive.

I don't play this game, I randomly got this in my recommended, and I am thoroughly invested in your commentary and the gameplay, might start playing this when I get a better computer :D

stardom literally just went “i’m gonna keep macroing and you cannot stop me, lmao”

the total annihilation fan in me is veyr happy that BAR exists. the supcom fan in me is sad that i cannot see any shield gens in the game. sue me, The FaF team made shields balanced, they where OP in vanilla supcom though

@asagoldsmith3328

11 ай бұрын

Well at least you have plasma shields

Great content, thx for the videos.

amazing gameplay by stardom and awesome cast

love for another custard game mr drongo! thanks mate

Normal fusion also takes 20% of the time to build compared to afus, even if you have the resources. The eco in this game is exponential, so smoothing the curve with fusions and getting your eco scaling faster is generally better, especially when you can't afford to stall on an afus.

Suggestion: Maybe disable the LoS range sensors to decrease the amount of UI clutter? Not sure if you know, but you can also disable friendly defense ranges for land/air/nuke if you want (but keep enemy on) Other than these nitpicks, awesome video!! & Very awesome game as well.

I'm new to BAR and would also love to study this replay some more. Is there a download link or how would I find it?

Hey Drongo! I absolutely love your videos, i was curious, how do you set up the settings to see true skill? I know how to see open skill, but as far as i know that's not as accurate. I'm not too sure on the difference though. Thanks for making super informative videos!

@okaberintarou9879

Жыл бұрын

True skill is old name for open skill thats all.

No other game can do this - make a playable battlefield that actually looks like a star wars cinematic

@asagoldsmith3328

11 ай бұрын

Modded star wars empire at war Still holds up visually

I think think not having advanced fusion is a good strategy. A advanced fusion is like a bomb right in your base. His his distributed fusion are also not easy to kill with bombing runs

How do you get that widget for reclaim fields? been looking everywhere back and forth for a week

any chance i can have the link of the game, id like to rewatch it on my own, thx appreciate it, loved the commentary, very usfule to watch for 1st time

8:51 the gauntlet is a T1 armada Plasma artillerie

Snoopa doesn't look like he spent his metal coz he's using vehicles while Stardom went for bots. Vehicles need much more metal.

I have to say that while AFUS is more metal-efficient, it's much less energy-efficient, which might be a reason why he is using more regular fusion reactors. It might also be that fusions are simply faster to build and can be better under constant high pressure, which can leave smaller risks.

You need only enough military to defend yourself while you build eco. On other maps a backline player can expect to get away with zero military. On this map you need at least some. You can't go "all in" on a tech rush.

4 allied Commanders just went down in 10s at 41:01

Man, I miss these. Hope the little one is doing well. :)

Fun match!

@drongo the map name and author is at the bottom left corner, just zoom right in :)

is the map name and some minor info not written in the bottom left corner? super zoomed in just outside of the playable area. i noticed you werent sure about the name but also didnt check

When I don't tech here, I lose pretty often. When I tech, I typically win.

Bro gave us a direct league quote in the middle of this game what on earth ahahha

Chaos under control .

I do agree with 11:20 when you said StarDoM was being selfish. I think it's called 'eccentric genius' or something more unconfronting perhaps haha

When are we getting custard flavored BAR streams?

Played him once, Stardom is a god on this map xD

nice

Does this game work well with distant players? I live in South Korea and I wonder if I could play multiplayer matches without lagging.

@jasonbogg3879

Жыл бұрын

yes, most matches have people from all around the world in them, many matches have american, european and asian players in them

@manumaster1990

Жыл бұрын

@@jasonbogg3879 correct!

@sir9129

Жыл бұрын

Its more of a macro game then micro. You dont need fast reflexes like starcraft as each unit fires on their own. Its more of positioning and unit comp kind of game.

ORGANIZED CHAOS

Right side threw by not pressing on boarder. They could have been hitting Stardom from behind all game

No afus no super boom in your base

Hello, can i have this review? cheers

Sharing is nice, but this map is pretty much a "carry your lane" map so unless there were some pre-planned agreement I see an issue with doing your own thing.

Drongo dont get me wrong but you can only carry in max 20 OS lobbies.

Stardom had a forest, and ate a bunch of it af the beginning Snoopa didnt Might go some way to explain how he afforded to tech up and make more shit than snoopa

I'm not seeing BAR players using Dragon Teeth to protect their defenses, like Laser Towers. Why is that?

@timiaus

Жыл бұрын

To micro intensive and you really don't won't to bother building walls around t1 towers as they are just to delay push/deter. Also as soon as t2 come out they can be run over or shot over them. At best they are best at just narrowing the fighting space early on. T2 wall I have only ever used to wall t2+ "towers" or t2 geothermal.

@timmietimmins3780

Жыл бұрын

This game is quite new, so it's quite possible people just haven't incorporated it yet. It's tempting to see what people are doing and create stories, which go "this is happening, so there must be a reason". The reality is that we are seeing a lot of very effective novel techniques in this game, particularly in team games. we are seeing guys build a wall of torpedo launchers to secure a flank on supreme strait, we are seeing people run a 135 metal ghost up to a 3800 metal razorback and basically one shot it because no one on the team has built an intrusion countermeasure system. We see hounds run into the center of the map unsupported only to find they all die to super common air units like shuriken. We are seeing mass mine and tick spam be experimented with. Really, test it. I suspect it's viable, but the only way to know for sure is to see it really be attempted at scale. It was certainly cost effective here, but we really only saw it after the game was near over. Especially given blue's morale. But there is clearly a lot of space to innovate in this game.

@JadeSune

Жыл бұрын

Pretty sure most of the time they just straight up don't protect the tower. Like iirc rocket bots shoot at the top of the LLTs, so, the dragon teeth don't block the shot.

pls more frontline content

If sacrificing your team mates is to be considered a strategy, it needs to be agreed upon with said team mates. If it isn't, it's just selfish nonsense that happened to work this time but would be punished every time it met an equal opponent with an actual team play strategy.

i feel like 8d did cost them the game barely any aggression only ecoing it seems