Dave, thanks for this remarkable update, I'll keep it in mind, my setup is still under construction for upcoming events next year so I haven't tested the Fiiio in my car yet, I'm waiting for my door panels which are still under modification. As you mentioned about the music apps, we are a big fan of Tidal and only few cars with Quboz and Deezer. Both these apps are based in France but most normal families prefer to use sportify as a decent radio. Thank you for sharing this video.🙏🙏

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

I have had a lot people telling me/asking if MQA would play through the coaxial digital output going into a helix dsp when switching the MQA setting to bitstream which I knew wouldn’t work, so that’s why I made this video. It got me thinking, I don’t think their is any DSP on the market that is certified with MQA. You are correct there is a lot of people that still use Spotify. I use it but only for the Joe Rogan podcast, not for music although I like their interface

@high16200

Жыл бұрын

Hi Dave, you were right as this question about MQA has been floating around social media for a while and hope those looking for an answer can find it here. I like your videos and your enthusiasm because you are always one step ahead. You are absolutely right, there is no car audio DSP on the market that is certified with MQA. yes! Sportify is experienced as a basic tool in everyday life. Thanks for your always remarkable videos. Btw, before I go to bed I always love to watch the Canadian "Just for laughs" they are so funny.🤣

Hey man, this is a great video and talks directly too the ongoing comment conversation we've been having. I'm super surprised that when you set the Fiio player MQA setting to decoded that it doesn't play a signal via COAX that the DSP can handle. You'd think with a name like 'decoded' it would work! Anyway I had my Helix DSP installed and tuned and it's night and compared to what I had before, just wait to score a Fiio DAP and have a pre run analog to RCA cable ready to go 🤟

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

Yes, I had a lot of people asking me about the Fiio DAP’s their ability to play MQA via coaxial digital output. Congrats on getting your DSP installed and turned!

@soopamarcus1

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons if Fiio are watching, update the software to unfold MQA and send a signal out that is universally playable 🤟

@soopamarcus1

Жыл бұрын

Hey Dave, I was gonna ask you something. What settings do you need to select on the Fiio DAP for both analog and coax output to a DSP. I'm particularly interested in analog becuase the DAP has an internal amplifier so do you want that volume at full or how do you run it? I'm guessing COAX is just plug and play.. Or are there other settings to be aware of? That would make for an interesting video

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

@@soopamarcus1 It all depends on what your system consists of, as every system will be different. For me I use a 3.5 to RCA 5 meter Audioquest cable, and an Audioquest Cinnamon coaxial digital cable. You can just switch back and forth with the Director if you have a Fiio M17 which allows to have multiple outputs going at one time. There are many different settings depending your system configuration. You just treat a DAP like you would a source unit. So you would just make sure all your gain settings are done correctly

@soopamarcus1

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons Can i ask though, for analog output to the DSP are you using the LO or PO setting?

Hey Dave. I have the same exact setup, but with Zapco amps, GB series Audiofrogs,but with (2) AF GB 10” subs, ported . I have a Fiio M11 Pro. I was just curious how much of a difference in clarity/SQ you heard by upgrading to the M17? I’m also using the Coaxial out form the Fiio into a Helix Ultra. Using Tidal. Sounds fantastic right now. I can’t see how it could get better. 🤙🏼

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

I never had the M11 Pro, just the M11 and then the M11 Plus LTD and then the M17 and also just doing a review on the M11s. The M17 SQ wise is a step up from any of the Fiio DAP’s regardless of which connection you use.

UPDATE! MQA Works on the FiiO M11s on all settings via the coaxial digital output. This seems to be an issue with the FiiO M17. I have sent an email to FiiO and they got back to me saying that they also had the same issue when they tested it. They said that they would pass on the information to their Engineer team. So hopefully they will have an update in the future.

Hey Dave, do you have a HEC BT card installed on your Helix DSP? I'm now curious what happens to MQA format when played over BT 🤣

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

No I don’t have it installed yet. I’m back and forth on whether or not I want to get it installed as I’m not a fan of Bluetooth. So the only reason I would get it installed would be for the tuning process.

@soopamarcus1

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons yeah so far I'm not impressed with mine. It keep dropping out, so gotta take it back and see what's going on

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

@@soopamarcus1 Yes, I haven’t heard anything that great about any of the Hec cards. I know a few years ago they were working on the audio stage but it seems they must of scrapped it because it’s been like 3-4 years now and I haven’t heard anything else on it.

@soopamarcus1

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons hey update for you, I got my M11 Plus ESS and for now have connected via Bluetooth apt x HD and MQA tidal does play back over that connection. The only thing now is I'm struggling to tell if there is any sound quality improvement over my Samsung Galaxy s22 ultra as the source.. I feel like there is better instrument separation and slightly punchier mid bass but it's not a huge difference. When I get the analog path tuned, hopefully there's a marked improvement 🤟

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

@@soopamarcus1 like I said before I’m not a fan of Bluetooth anything and never use it. There are people that like it though just not me 😆 I never seen a point to buying audio equipment to use the worst connection possible, doesn’t make sense to me. If I was going to go to a wireless connection it would be the WIIM Mini Streamer as it blows the doors off of any Bluetooth device.

Mate... Im using Android phone + btr7 wired using usb c to usb c cable and it could run MQA smoothly...

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

Yes, that’s not going out of the Coaxial Digital Audio output or optical toslink output, as a BTR 7 only has Analog outputs. Like I said in this video MQA will only play via analog outputs when going into Helix DSP’s.

@TheMadcowintucson

Жыл бұрын

The reason for this is simple. There is no mqa decoder in the helix lol. So this digital out is exactly that it sends the base carrier signal and dies not decode mqa. It only decides mqa internally and then sends it out via analog. Get another external DAC that can decide mqa and hook it up and you will see it decide the mqa but helix does not have that

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

@@TheMadcowintucson Did you watch the video. Or read the previous comment? 😆

@CastingCelebrity

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons ahh i got it... Thanks...

@8799crosby

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons I just got the m17 FiiO , unreal dap, I have it into my dsp via 4.4 to rca right into dsp , I could get a coax to toslink with a box maybe later , my question do u set the FiiO to , LO instead of PO , and if u do use po , what gain and volume level do u use . Thanks

I think your problem lies in the settings of the spdif output of the Fiio which you can find under audios. You can set the spdif output to DoP (DSD over PCM) or D2P (DSD to PCM). The Helix you are using cannot handle a DoP signal and you must set it to D2P for that. The Helix cannot handle DSD signals and only works on PCM. This is also all described in the user manual of the Fiio M11s how to do this. So always read the user manual first.

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

Hi Marc, I made this video because I had a lot of people asking me about MQA, and if it would work going out of the Coaxial digital output. Some were saying if you change the setting to bitstream that it would play. I was just showing that it won’t which I already knew but some people obviously don’t. The people that love Tidal and MQA, and want to get a DAP to use with a Helix DSP or any DSP for that matter, through coaxial digital now know that MQA isn’t an option via coaxial digital into the DSP. It doesn’t matter what setting you use as the only way to use MQA with the Heljx DSP is going analog out of the Fiio DAP’s, period. This is something that reading a manual isn’t going to tell you. Also the settings are slightly different on all the Fiio DAP’s.

@marcwiesen

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons MQA is a licensed compression format and can only be used by a licensed company such as Fiio. So the MQA file you played is decoded and then delivered to the player's hardware in DSD or PCM format. The player can then forward the decoded file to the DAC for the analog outputs or as a Digital DSD or PCM format through a digital output such as coaxial s-pdif. So the MQA file is already decoded and therefore you can hear the music through the analog output as you showed in your video. Just not via the digital output, but that has nothing to do with the MQA file because it has already been decoded. It has to do with the digital output settings of the Fiio or the digital input settings of the DAC of the Helix DSP. I mean the audio settings of the Fiio and not in the application. The MQA file cannot be sent via an s-pdif output, it was not made for that. It's just a way of compression of the music just like flac, alac, mp3, aac etc. but then (according to them) better. A friend of mine also has a Fiio connected via coax to a Helix DSP and it works flawlessly with MQA after properly setting up the player and the DSP. Take it from me that it is not the MQA file but the settings of the Fiio or even the DSP. Try it out and you'll be happy. 🙏😀👍

@marcwiesen

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons What it could also be is that digital output will not work if you are using the headphone/line output. Also try to see if that is the problem.

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

@@marcwiesen Marc lol You cannot play an actual MQA file via the coaxial digital output as once you switch to the bitstream mode like I showed you in this video it only does the first unfolding. I have had every Fiio DAP since the X5iii and used them all in my set up. The only music streaming service I used until recently until Apple Music lossless came out was Tidal. Your friend is not playing MQA via coaxial digital into a helix dsp as it’s not possible under any setting.

@marcwiesen

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons Yes, he just plays MQA files via the coaxial output with his Fiio M11 Plus LTD to his Helix DSP Pro. Other people I know also have no problems playing MQA files with their DAP. I set it up myself for him because he doesn't understand it. Together with him I built his caraudio competition installation in his car. I have been active in the car audio scene for decades and have built several competition cars. I know what I'm talking about. I have also won enough prizes in the EMMA competitions here in Europe. It just works, except that the settings on the sending side just like the receiving side must be set correctly. But if you think otherwise, that's fine too. 🙏 😀

Isn't MQA only decoded directly to analogue, and that's it? They're quite cagey as to how it's encoded. Presumably, coax is for the transfer of more traditional music formats. Either way, MQA is a controversial format.

@CarAudioHorizons

Жыл бұрын

MQA signals can go through coax, both MQA Core decoded and MQA bitstream. This is a common connection in MQA streamers and DACs as well as CD players and MQA DACs. I agree it’s most definitely controversial and I’m good with lossless.

@FatNorthernBigot

Жыл бұрын

@@CarAudioHorizons Thanks for that. It's all very shady. I use Tidal, but I can only decode on the headphone amp.