"It's called the American Dream because you have to be asleep to believe it." -- George Carlin.

@dmichael100

3 жыл бұрын

The American Dream was really that you had more opportunity to raise the quality of your life in this country than most other places. That has proven correct and the vast expansion of middle class families, particularly from immigrant communities is testimony to that. The perspective or bar has been raised in later generations and therefore the American Dream has been redefined. No system works for everybody and nothing is ever perfectly fair (even if you could address everyone's definition "fair"). Are there different challenges as the population has grown and our forms of society have shifted and morphed over the decades? Absolutely- housing and higher education costs are two major problems. But we have improved countless other challenges that get forgotten and become expected as the generations past. We should probably call it "American Opportunity" and its better in some places than others, but compared to the rest of the globe, it's still better than most.

@FramedArchitecture

3 жыл бұрын

@@dmichael100 United States is listed at number 27 on the Global Social Mobility Index.

@zeenuf00

3 жыл бұрын

@@FramedArchitecture right below all those 95% white countries you people worship lol!!

@RodrigoSouza-ur5jz

3 жыл бұрын

@@dmichael100 Not compared to most countries in the European Union, Canada, Australia, New Zealand, etc... Statistically speaking, you have more chances of becoming a millionaire if you are born in Denmark than in the US (after taxes!).

@elainehiggins713

3 жыл бұрын

Rodrigo Souza Denmark is 97% white.

He had me at “It’s not good to make policy based on exceptional cases.” I could not have articulated it better!

@johnburt7935

4 жыл бұрын

That was an extremely good point. If you want to make policy based on exceptional cases, you can look at Frederick Douglass and George Washington Carver and say that slavery is no big deal.

@opinionatedape5895

4 жыл бұрын

and then he talks about elites....so there goes that argument

@johnburt7935

4 жыл бұрын

@@opinionatedape5895 Hmmm?

@pendejo6466

4 жыл бұрын

Immigrants and their children whom become successful in the US are not "exceptional cases."

@vg7985

4 жыл бұрын

Pendejo you need also keep in mind that most immigrants who are coming to the USA legally are already highly educated in their own countries. They themselves very seldom can achieve their potential in a foreign country, but they are educated enough to guide their kids through the system. I see poor immigrants taking their kids to opera while middle class American would rather take their kid to ball game. I see poor immigrant saving money to send their kid to their home country during summer to learn language while middle class American pushes his kid to get job at McDonald's.

The society that fails to invest in its people, does so at its own risk.

@saphire2214

3 жыл бұрын

...At its own perils

@Pilgrim812

3 жыл бұрын

Pllplppplplpllll lol loll lpll lol lolllllplll pllllllllplllllpll lplppllll lol lollp llllllll pplplpl lololol lolllplll ok ppll lol LLPll lol llllpllllpllpl lol lllpllllll lol loll lol ll pplll lol lll

@darkofius

3 жыл бұрын

To in debt young people with students loads, that with day one one has modern day slave...Predatory capitalism with a DNA of a parasite, exporters of a democracy by drone and cruise missiles, political economy to propagate under wrath of over 8000 sanctions, a society that harbours millions as illegal immigrants to be exploited to the bone, preachers of freedom and justice that do not recognize an International Criminal Court, corectors of regimes, supporters of serfs and vassals or most grotesque regimes...

@mrsoshadabaadman

3 жыл бұрын

@@Pilgrim812 Did you have a medical episode like a stroke here.

@alanblanes2876

3 жыл бұрын

@@Pilgrim812 Obviously a trifling GOP sympathizer.

Amanpour and Company is one of the most interesting and relevant news shows out there (which explains the low viewership). I hope this anomaly of a program can find a way to keep going. We need it.

@pennyo6868

4 жыл бұрын

Carlo Dave, Bingo! Thankyou for sharing your observation;)))

3 жыл бұрын

yeah. most folks prefer their opinions to be predigested for them. that explains the popularity of mainstreams of left and right. my opinions tend to be unpopular on both sides. i must be doing my own thinking.

@forgivensign

3 жыл бұрын

I guess number of subscribers is a metric they could use

@graywolf2107

3 жыл бұрын

FACTS

@carlodave9

3 жыл бұрын

@@jacc9061 WHEN they take over? The reason Amanpour & Co. even comes up in my KZread feed is because machine algorithms have me pigeon-holed: "Intellectual" with a distaste for unbridled corporatism, partisan rage-speak, and baseless conspiracies. If being appreciative of principled journalism and complex civil discussions is only an elitist paradigm that we must feel wary about, then God help us all.

I work at a private school, and I see this ALL the time. I have students that are completely average, BUT they get private tutors in everything. The moment their grade slips to a "B" or lower, they get a tutor for $150/hr who literally does their homework/ projects with them. If they start to struggle in ANY way, we teachers meet with their parents or tutors to arrange a plan to help them. These kids do not have learning disabilities, they do not need IEPs. After school, they're enrolled in a ridiculous amount of extracurricular activities to make them competitive for high school applications. I've had one parent tell me, he spends $4000 per month on his two kids for after-school activities. The result of all this: my students tend to be extremely anxious (I've had 6 year olds in therapy) and unnecessarily entitled with no sense of resilience. The moment something is hard, they look to blame someone for their problems, and we teachers are constantly scrutinized for our choices. It is a stressful system, and no one is winning long term.

@TeresaElainePhoenixArizona

2 жыл бұрын

This Wealthy Students Teacher's Comment should be at the Top!! Real World • Example. And, Pointing out Extracurricular Activities Success as a Distinguishing "Merit" for College Entrance probably doesn't come to mind. A University's Extracurricular Programs (UnPaid or Paid 😉 see: College Athletes) Are Important for the School's Promotion.

@olivergreen1520

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you for your honesty and service. Not many are ready to admit this reality. What are your thoughts on school choice or homeschooling.

Once kids are out of school it depends on who you know! The rich network stick together.

@thugly921

4 жыл бұрын

That's his whole point - this concept is starting earlier and earlier in life

@mikolowiskamikolowiska4993

4 жыл бұрын

Then poor police better network

@douglaswayne8916

4 жыл бұрын

And the network is mostly white.

@jjgogojag6371

3 жыл бұрын

But, also remember some just lie to lie. Rewriting history. Bullies come in all walks of life now. Some positioning peoples are horrible gate keepers. They allow absolutely no gate crashing........ LIE.

@naomiwilliams8850

3 жыл бұрын

@@artisteye2283 It's not enough to just be present you actually have to network with other students and lectures.

There should be no elite schools in the public school system - they should all be good - and that requires well paid teachers. Finland pays the second highest public wage to teachers - bellow only the doctors' wages. That and the fact teachers have 3 months of vacation has made the profession the dream work for most people. When a child is born, in Finland, the family receives a cardboard box with some clothes and toys for the baby - for all babies, rich or poor: they do this because Finland was a poor country in the early 20th century and that's what they did back then and they keep doing it as a reminder that everybody is equal. The cardboard box was to protect the baby from the cold currents inside the house.

@dmichael100

3 жыл бұрын

I agree with your overall point but I'm not sure the "everyone good/no elite" is realistic or what we want. I think we want to head more in that direction. I teach at a charter high school after having taught at a public middle school in a low-income county. I am able now to teach advanced English (AICE/Cambridge curriculum) but our school is public in that it accepts anyone who comes. You do have to apply for AICE classes, but in practice, we take many that probably don't "qualify" because their parents are wanting the college credits and scholarship our program offers and put pressure on administration to admit them. We need a certain number of students to keep the doors open so we often give in to that pressure. So the overall rigor is raised for everyone (which speaks to your point) but my main concern is not pushing the highest students enough. I tweak my curriculum to try and challenge the best students as well, but there are always going to be distinctions (even in Finland) and from my perspective, the biggest issue I face now is the pressure of grade inflation from parents. The best are being brought down to the level of the average more than being challenged themselves. We are always going to need the brightest to lead in many ways. In my class, the best students pull the others up in many cases (we do a lot of peer feedback) so while I don't have all the answers, I want to raise the standard for everyone but I don't want to continue to drag down the brightest students in the process.

@faithalessandri968

3 жыл бұрын

🥰

@Jawshuah

3 жыл бұрын

I don't think that would help much. canada does better than finland on 2 of the 3 tests here and asian countries do better as well. Honestly, giving public school teachers more money would not yield a significant return on investment. it already suffers diminishing return. what would help the most is property taxes funding schools statewide or at least county wide. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Programme_for_International_Student_Assessment

@bonniesitessolutions7728

3 жыл бұрын

@@dmichael100 The problem with having any sort of elite or other classes is that one class will always feel superior to another, then start to exploit them. It's been played out over and over and over in this planet's history.

@aleejones7508

3 жыл бұрын

I kept waiting to see that three month vacation, waiting at college classes, waiting at revising lessons, waiting at meetings and on and on....dream job: I had to work another job at night and weekend to make payments

This system is how you get ivanka Trump saying with a straight face that poor people like to work for their money. Like you ever did in your life time Ivanka.

@johnburt7935

4 жыл бұрын

The Trumps aren't *_EVEN_* part of the meritocracy. They're part of the old-style elite, coasting on their money.

@losmanzani6849

4 жыл бұрын

@@johnburt7935 Exactly

@johnburt7935

4 жыл бұрын

@@losmanzani6849 And that's setting aside the fact that the word "meritocracy" was coined in a satirical novel written to *MOCK* the concept of meritocracy.

@shawnaweesner3759

4 жыл бұрын

J C Well said!👍😷

@TheThinkingMathematician

4 жыл бұрын

you call having a father like hers not work.....must be torture bud

Kudos to Mr. Markovits for being able to see his own privilege--and for speaking out so effectively.

"A structural system that excluded you" The best description of America and meritocracy .

@tslee8236

4 жыл бұрын

Corrupted meritocracy of America. It's not real meritocracy.

@Teddypally

4 жыл бұрын

@@tslee8236 If two people jump off a cliff and one lives and the other dies, it isn't evidence that gravity changed to treat them differently. If one person had a parachute and the other did not, it still isn't evidence that gravity changed to treat them differently. Two people may have different outcomes according to their preparation but such a difference in outcomes doesn't mean gravity changed to treat them differently. The kind of mind that comes up with the reasoning, "different outcomes is evidence that gravity changes according to how prepared you are, therefore gravity doesn't treat everyone equally so gravity is a sham" is the kind of mind being presented in this video.

@williamtaylor5193

4 жыл бұрын

The victimhood is strong.

@Teddypally

3 жыл бұрын

@Random Runner What you posted is my conclusion of the opinion of the interviewer. I provided an argument for why I had that opinion. What is your argument for why you have your opinion about me?

@vitaminaebddinis9844

3 жыл бұрын

@@Teddypally Who put gravity in place and established its rules?

Another excellent interview by Amanpour & Company. Exactly what we would expect from one of the most trusted & respected journalists on the planet today. And she has built a quality team of interviewers & reporters, like Hari Sreenivasan, to help inform viewers who are tired of mainstream news outlets with their brief, shallow and sensational news reportage. We want depth, we want critique and we want possible alternative solutions to our nation's growing list of failing socioeconomic systems & institutions. We want journalism!

@jacovawernett3077

4 жыл бұрын

Amen

@KrisenNaidoo

4 жыл бұрын

Starving for shows like this

@bernardlunn

4 жыл бұрын

Yes yes yes

@christinapennell5073

4 жыл бұрын

I learn much more from you than any of the mainstream media for sure!

Poor kids have to be smart enough to go to college while holding down a job. Rich don't. Insanity.

@pendejo6466

4 жыл бұрын

Working while attending school made me a better and more efficient student, which instilled good habits that helped me rise over my peers at work.

@johnbrooke6867

4 жыл бұрын

@@pendejo6466 So why not make the system even more difficult? Why not make it so that people have to lose sleep and consider suicide in order to succeed in their careers? You are doing what the author calls defending the system that worked for you simply because it worked for you. How do know your studies didn't suffer because you were at work and not studying? You do not because you didn't have that experience. I had to work while attending junior college and literally could not do it. I got a few credits under my belt and I have no regrets at going to college but I never got my degree. The point is that there is a clear advantage to being able to focus on your studies and having an additional 8 hours a day to do so. Imagine if you had used that time to take advanced classes that all fellow peers didn't have time or money to take? I suppose your chosen youtube name says a lot by itself.

@drmodestoesq

4 жыл бұрын

It's like sports events like polo and yachting. They only allow amateurs. Who can afford to excel at yachting if they're poor unless they are a professional yachter. Who knows how a professional yachter would do against the richos.

@johnrodarte7397

4 жыл бұрын

@@pendejo6466 I worked in college on a dish line for 3.5 years while my peers worked in computer labs. I don't know how poor they were but they were certainly richer than me and the rest of the dish line. The richest students, of course, did not work at all. They had the freedom to enjoy college on a level I never did. Nearly all my money went to paying for the phone calls home (which were sparse). And though I went to college with many, many wealthy students, the single dollar donated every week to our dorm charity was mine, every week, every time. I don't know if I became a "better, more efficient student" than my peers. However, I do know that I payed a higher price for my college ticket and got less college experience for it.

@pendejo6466

4 жыл бұрын

@@johnbrooke6867 "You are doing what the author calls defending the system...because it worked for you." I reported my experience truthfully, and mine alone. "How do know your studies didn't suffer because you were at work and not studying?" Perhaps my studies did suffer; perhaps the education I received wasn't necessarily academic in every instance, but was important none the less to my development (e.g., attaining a sense of appreciation, acquiring self-confidence in overcoming difficulties without resorting to self-pity, etc). "I had to work while attending junior college and literally could not do it." Okay. "The point is that there is a clear advantage to being able to focus on your studies and having an additional 8 hours a day to do so." Of course there is, but the advantage wasn't mine to possess, so I made it happen however I could: I didn't whine about it. "I suppose your chosen youtube name says a lot by itself." Sounds like you're taking it personal, but I'm not the one who failed to obtain a degree from a junior college.

So true when he says that elite parents know HOW to train their kids (what is important, what sort of experiences should they have, what should they read what conversations they hear around the dinner table) and have the resources to train their kids, and train them like other parents cannot. As a high school teacher, I see how absolutely true this. "They know how to train their kids like nobody´s business and they out train....."

Amazing. Thank you Prof. Markovits. I raised my kids in Spain. When we returned, my daughter took the ACT and got a 26. A friend told me that everyone takes their kid to an academy to get the score they want. When I took my daughter there, they told me that for $3000 they could get her a score of 30-32 within 2 months! I was aghast and made my daughter take and retake the test on her own with a prep book. Then, I hired a math tutor ($1000) and after those two months, she got a 30. As she said after opening that envelope, "I'm no smarter now than when I got a 26." When my son took a prep class, the teacher of the class said that he didn't do too well on the test at first, but now that he has experience, can get a 36 every time.

@schechter01

3 жыл бұрын

It's called getting test-wise...an important skill to have when going through formal academia (at all levels).

@susanhenry6834

3 жыл бұрын

If he doesn't know the answer..leave it blank..trust me my sister worked for one of the best tutoring centers. If you have time at the end go back and take time to figure it out but if you can't leave it blank. Oh both these test now not being used to get into college..I think they said next 2 years

@NotADuncon

3 жыл бұрын

Now imagine your kids have ADHD or other condition that makes them not work well with testing. The whole testing system is bad and I say this as someone who went through the IB program which has a very good curriculum (they screwed up higher maths now though) but is the testiest of all test ridden high school programmes.

@gabrielgonzalez6456

2 жыл бұрын

I don’t understand?? How was that not a good experience?? Your child tested well but wanted her to do better so studied on the certain subjects and biases of the ACT and scored better. Her IQ level or intellect might’ve not changed but her study habits and knowledge improved dramatically.

Wow! This man has good insights. He is articulate and convincing. I’ve never considered these things as mechanisms of class and wealth. Thanks.

Easily one of the best Interviews I’ve seen in years. And I went to an “elite” uni.

This is actually a very old argument. Charles Dickens said basically the same thing in the 19th century.

@snoopy_peanuts_77

4 жыл бұрын

and then everyone forgot and went back to robber baron mentality

@denisdaly1708

4 жыл бұрын

Quiet right. Still, people forget.

@janko6637

4 жыл бұрын

Graham Luell This. life is extremely hard and harsh place and paradise is impossible bitter truth that nobody can truly accept. failing and being rejected has the potential to destroy people and some do take their lives but what can you do? Hand outs? Forced diversity? you can make laws that encourage fair economic activity, a honest dollar and a lot of them are in place All you can do is treat people like individuals let those who earn power have it and fight corruption and evil.

@jakecostanza802

4 жыл бұрын

Turns out that not all arguments are good just because their new.

@MrKongatthegates

3 жыл бұрын

Saying it wont change it

I attended an elite private college and a state college. There is absolutely a difference in the quality of education. At the large public college, even the highly rated ones, you had to compete and be a “star” student to receive access to the best teachers and the types of opportunities that almost every student received as a matter of course as a student at an elite college.

@coolbreeze2.0-mortemadfasc13

3 жыл бұрын

I've only gone to public schools my entire life and I absolutely believe you.

@patrickortiz2898

2 жыл бұрын

And its somehow wrong that your parents did all that ? This guy is a smart credentialed idiot. Meritocracy is not invented and its not a lottery. This was the goal

@anthonyfaucy2761

Жыл бұрын

I think the problem is parents who aren't elite sabotage their own children's future feeding them junk food and letting them watch cartoon propaganda that reduces their IQ instead of taking time to teach them when they aren't working. The reason elite kids are elite is cos the elite parents actually put efforts in getting the kid educated even if not by them by someone else. Theres no reason why anyone should be dumb in the era of the internet yet more kids care about their favourite youtubers instead of studying

In the U.S., we do not have a sense of connection to each other. Everyone is for himself/herself.

THIS .. this is what I've been trying to explaining, ironically to friends who grew up in Austin Texas who were among the first to be bused and the resentment it created.

@virginiamoss7045

2 жыл бұрын

THIS, also.

Hari Sreenivasan is one of my favorite journalists and my favorite interviewer! Amazing.

I am impressed with Markovitz's unpacking of the dimensions of this issue. His example of how elite students come out of elite universities and transform jobs to function more like they function is prescient. For instance, the taxi-driver to Uber example is one I had never considered. I had always just thought of these as technological progress (and they are) but there is another level to them I had not thought about. Certainly investment banking is a good example- it doesn't really help society as much as generate vast wealth for a few.

Markovits is right. Meritocracy is structured as a system of training individuals Through 1) The family unit - a parental intellectual, material and economic apprenticeship system of sorts for the offspring. 2) secondary schools-privateprep prep schools and suburban public schools that get their students ready for colleges and careers 3) Elite colleges/universities - selective higher education turns their students into future financiers , lawyers, politicians , doctors not only by providing coursework and top tier instruction but a networking system as well as system of networking for graduates. All three produce a system that funnels its participants into position and careers either at the top or near the top. Lower middle class, working class and poor don't have a chance in America.

@jacklyncheung4993

4 жыл бұрын

He makes a great point on excellence vs superiority. All these rich kids graduate from elite schools to go into finance and investment banking, furthering the experiential gap between wealthy and poor. So they can never relate to those "inferior" to them.

This is an awesome interview. Prof Markovits basically outlines the fact that the contract between the rich and the rest of society has been broken. The care of previous generations of wealthy who believed in meritocracy and the current generation who does not, has led to a disconnect between their ability to live unencoumbered from society to their obligation to sustain meritocracy for all. This is a major corruption of our higher institutions. There are a lot of solutions, but not a lot of leaders on this topic.

Another difference is a family's cultural attitude towards education. A family that values education and manages the child's education will get better results than families that do not value education or manage the child's education. This why the children of poor immigrants in the US achieve higher career success than their neighbors.

@rosalindmartin4469

4 жыл бұрын

Very True. But a ghetto neighborhood is more difficult to manage ... If you ever lived in a rough overpopulated loud noisy kids in the street ...and now drugs ...wow

@nesne2167

4 жыл бұрын

That is why I chose parents who valued education. Its simple, just choose the right parents and you will be successful.

@Mateo-et3wl

4 жыл бұрын

Please use some critical thinking. "poor immigrants" are an enormous group made up of many different groups, some of which don't value education at all (latinos)

@andrewedris2800

4 жыл бұрын

It is the same result whether it's an affluent or underfunded school district. Academically successful children of immigrants are resented by the local Americans of any social class.

@player1111ful

4 жыл бұрын

@@Mateo-et3wl racist

The fact that this is not front page news being discussed on every platform just proves to me how doomed we all really are.

You can't start fixing this problem with the colleges. We have to start fixing it in preschool.

@danhworth100

4 жыл бұрын

needs both

@sansserif2559

4 жыл бұрын

@J C we need universal basic assets that includes basic housing

@jacklyncheung4993

4 жыл бұрын

Can't "even the playing field" without an entire system overhaul. Take money out of politics so the rich can't influence policy. Reallocate war dollars to impoverished communities. Undo gerrymandering. Pass universal healthcare and free education for all. Close tax loopholes, pay our teachers and nurses more.

@chunchuanlv3211

4 жыл бұрын

He explicitly said from kindergarten.

@scifirealism5943

3 жыл бұрын

I would abolish all private schools

It's not just training either, it's connections and network of people. The first time I got someone to vouch for me and saw how easy it was to get a job, that's when I knew that's what I had been missing. I come from a single mom immigrant poor background. And I worked my butt off in school and only got so far with that. But it wasn't until I met someone with connections that vouched for me that I saw some of the doors for me open up. When I thanked her she literally said, "Don't worry about it, nothing I wouldn't do for family." She was being kind to me, but that's when I knew the kind of advantages the wealthy had that I was not born into.

Great interviewing skills .... no time wasted ... lots of ground covered! Good job!

Meritocracy was and is still the battle ground 'value' in my society Malaysia. This interview though shines a very interesting light to its imperfections

@MrKongatthegates

3 жыл бұрын

I mean, it beats total corruption

@theallseeingeye9388

2 жыл бұрын

Im a non from Malaysia. Like all nons, the narrative I was thought when I came of the age of knowing about politics was we had to work hard and hardee and hardest because we are victims of a system that is not based on meritocracy. It took me about 15 odd years to learn that while meritrocracy is preferred for the corporate world, it would be a disaster for a government to do so. The government has many functions and one of its primary duty is to ensure that the equality in opportunities exists at all times for its citizens. The opportunity to improve ones life and the resulting social mobility contributes to a generally peaceful and progressive country. A nation that has more than half of its citizens trapped in dire poverty and absolute lack of social mobility can only function if the state adopts brutality in keeping order. There will be law but no justice. The probem in Malaysia is there is no much venue and opportunities for society to have mature discussions so that truths like the negative side of meritocracy can be explained. There are many like me who still believe they are victims of affirmative policies. Secondly, pork barrelling by the political class in the name of affirmative policies. Spending capital on social welfare programs does not come from a bottomless barrel. Sooner or later we have to see returns from it or there isnt going to be much for each upcoming generation. Finally, poverty and absence of any opportunity in Malaysia today is no longer based purely race or religion. The system needs to be reformed along the lines of who really needs it. Or we will keep slidding down as we are now

It's a lot worse than you suggest. There is no real meritocracy system in place here. I couldn't get a job at a time when the only way to get jobs was through agencies. Then I earned a Ph.D and I couldn't get a job because I was either considered over-qualified or I was told that my degree was not transferable to another field than that of my study. In order to survive, I had to take civil service tests because I believed I would have to be hired if I passed the tests. As it turns out, there is a civil service rule that allows their HR to choose one of three, meaning they could refuse you and choose someone else even if you scored higher than the person they decided to hire. So when I hear people in power bullshitting about getting a college degree and evening the competitive field, I want to puke. The only way you move ahead is to belong to a certain group and conform and kiss ass- don't have a real personality or you'll struggle to survive. Don't listen to this guy about the pruning of the rich kids for future and better success; it may be true, but this doesn't really concern you. You won't get anything from anyone unless your parents had connections and friends in places.

Exactly, You need TONS of money to do anything. I earned scholarships all the way to my PhD (i owe this opportunities to my parents). When i was ready with good basis to start my own thing, i realized it was no help to just have good education and have worked very hard to get the data needed.

I work for these wealthy parents. They are NEVER going to stop providing advantages for their kids. They always did, they always did. This guy is not going to break those social connections that make school and getting a great job easy for them. He can write his books, but since he teaches their kids, he knows this....

@tjfitzy

Жыл бұрын

Agrees. What are the wealthier supposed to do? Spend it on my kids?!?! 😉

@fod79

10 ай бұрын

That's why wealth gap needs to be controlled. Try to find solutions if you disagree with his.

This is completely true and easy for most to relate to. Taught for many years with preschool and elementary age students, the gaps are huge. My wish is for every child to have free healthcare, dental care, free preschool and free college until the age of 21. Asking poor kids to compete with rich kids is like saying , okay even though you were born in a wheel chair you’re going to have to be just as fast as the kid who wasn’t. The sad thing is, many of these kids who begin to fail without proper support go on to believe they are at fault and give up on themselves because failing over and over again is just too soul crushing.

Thank you for your observations about the system very accurate and inspiring for change, let's make society better for all.

@johnburt7935

4 жыл бұрын

"[B]etter for all", imagine, what a concept.

This is SO relevant to me right now. I came to North America as an african refugee. I come from a priveledge background back home but my parents lost all their wealth in recreating a life for us here. However, they ALWAYS emphasized education. Fast-forward to now, I'm working in London as a consultant in finance (that dig at us really did hurt 😂). I never went to an ivy league or even a private school (got into some good schools but couldn't afford much as I was the one paying for both my post-secondary degrees 😬). Now I'm finding myself working with people from incredibly privileged backgrounds, and wow, it's been an adjustment. Just from the way they express themselves I can basically sense the small fortune spent on their education. I do feel they are better trained and better equipped going into a job market that favours people with their exact backgrounds. While I have been able to strategically wrangle myself into a promising career path, I wish education could be more equitable for everyone. It's true that people in the top aren't necessarily brighter, they have usually just been groomed to fit their roles. The incredibly intelligent and incredibly talented are few. And hard work? Many poor people work harder and longer hours for a tenth of the pay. It's easy to motivate yourself to work hard when you are earning 200,000 a year with bonuses in the thousands. Meritocracy as experienced in our current society is a joke.

Such a necessary video

EXCELLENT VIDEO. for someone who is not an American it is saddening to hear the true nature of what is really going on . the decline of America from what was once a great nation that the world looked to as source of inspiration will no longer be the case.

Totally agree about your take on meritocracy, but also so important is the difference between someone nurtured on real food and those forced to grow up on processed food.

Amazing interview. I must read the book.

Not to mention when the parents pay colleges too except and pass their kids.

It is not the just system...How good it is to hear the truth from the mouth of a privileged one. God bless you!

Good interview. Professor Markowitz is perceptive and articulate. I have taught as a professor at a US State University and a highly ranked private university and I can attest that the teaching and learning experience is very different. The class size is much smaller at the private school, and the University itself takes much greater steps to insure the success of individual students, and the power differential at private schools is much more in favor of the student than at large public schools. The ability level and motivation of the students in recent years at the private university has been amazing. However three caveats: these students come from all over the world. This extreme level of preparation is not a uniquely American phenomenon, parents in many countries are grooming their kids to do well at elite universities. The private university where I work is doing better in recruiting students from various economic backgrounds than in the past. The acceptance rate issue is somewhat artificial because of the Common app that allows kids to apply easily to many schools. Still, I think Prof. Markowitz is onto something really important that will have long-term impacts on our country.

Although not necessarily central to this thesis, I have seen examples in my own extended family where what I’ll just call the “2-parent/good resources/elite school/high expectations” upbringing ends up locking kids into a set of expectations that creates very serious psychiatric issues down the road...especially when combined with depression. John D Rockefeller II was a famous example of this...although he was for the most part able to overcome his issues following a hospitalization, a good marriage, and an eventual realization and acceptance by his father that he wasn’t cut out for and hated the oil business. He spent the rest of his life as a philanthropist...a sort-of super-rich social worker. Ulysses S. Grant is another great example from the 19 th century. Well off people DO have the financial resources to “fail”...but without the proper amount of grit and perseverance, the often do not reach adulthood with the psychological resources to either maintain inner happiness or escape the trap. The upper classes may be raised on notions like: “you can be or do anything you want i f you just put your mind and heart into it” and “if you don’t love what you are doing you are wasting your life”...but believe me, there are many doctors, lawyers and banker out there who would have preferred to be cabinet makers, school teachers, artists, farmers or even soldiers if they hadn’t spent the first 25 years of their lives locked into and trapped within their parents or grandparents expectations of what was considered an acceptable vocation for a member of the socioeconomic group within which they were raised. Having a very enriched childhood can expose one to a dizzying landscape of options and expectations that is often very difficult to navigate. If one reads biographies of famous accomplished people who come from “means”, there are almost always examples of collateral examples of friends, acquaintances or siblings who struggle with this very issue.

@carlodave9

4 жыл бұрын

As a public school teacher who has seen kids grow up through and beyond my classroom, I can tell you it is generally better to be a neurotic child surrounded by high expectations than a seemingly happy child drifting in a tide of low expectations. It starts to show in adulthood. Happy-go-lucky poor adults are the exception, as are helplessly depressed wealthy ones. Data on contentment in America as it relates to income bares this out. This isn't to say a billionaire is happier than a millionaire, but those who make more than 200,000 thousand per year are statistically FAR more content than those who are poor or middle-class. Affluenza is a minor, treatable risk compared to the alternative.

@165Dash

4 жыл бұрын

Carlo Dave Thanks for the comment. I pretty much agree with what you are saying. My own extended family includes members of both groups. I am 64 and my childhood environment was 100% New Jersey public school, middle middle class with few parents with college degrees. My mother had the only masters degree in the neighborhood. Pop didn’t finish college. Only 30% of my childhood friends went to college. I married into a family of doctors, lawyers and one investment banker. Interestingly, one could say that THEY have been downwardly mobile from grandparents who were very well off in the 1920s. Both groups have seen the ups and downs and only a couple of individuals in either group have “done better” than their parents. “Happiness” is hard to measure and whatever one might use as an anecdotal “metric” cannot be broadly applied. Interestingly, one of the “happiest” members of my family was my sister’s husband who died last year. His childhood and early adulthood included many tough moments including suicide, alcoholism, incarceration and yet this very smart and talented guy ended up thriving through his own considerable wits, talents and a loving family.

@Mad_Intalect

4 жыл бұрын

@@carlodave9 Well, 2 of my cousins committed suicide in their teens because of this, from the same family, depression is no joke man. But my uncle was such an asshole though, a very corrupt and rich one smh.

@krs1968dec

4 ай бұрын

You make some valid points here. Seems like this system is failing people from all walks of life.

"The really rich kids at Princeton get a 40 times bigger subsidy than the middle and working class kids at the local community college" (7:30)

@scifirealism5943

3 жыл бұрын

That is Depressing.

He gave a good explanation of how the system is not actually meritocratic. Meritocracy is still a positive ideal, we just have to get the education standards up for everyone so that they can meet those opportunities.

Love this guy! All he says relates to my own experience. Only I had just ½ the privilege, as my dad taught at Columbia but mom was of poor Irish descent. The end result is that only ½ my kids got through college as I fell from upper middle-class (six figures) to working poor during the 2009 fail. I managed to do ok when retiring in 2016, however. But that's all she wrote... for many of my old school chums with less of a jump start, things went very poorly indeed.

@NotADuncon

3 жыл бұрын

I get you. I went to a very good high school but his story of "falling in love sophomore year" meant I went to a worse uni plus my ADHD meant i dropped out (diagnosed at 33) but still thanks to that elite high school, the cultural capital, the connections, the interests or even my parents spending time with me in specific areas I still ended up rather good.

Public subsidies for Harvard, a surprise !

Having made it out of poverty, I can tell you it starts with poverty of thinking. That’s the barrier. So rife with misapprehensions about opportunity.

@BigHenFor

3 жыл бұрын

"If you can't see it, you can't be it."

This is the information I try to wedge into the conversations and arguments that spring up around the poor, lazy and unwashed masses and of course black Americans. I have the gut feeling that everyone who has this info must share it before the door is completely shut.

Very intuitive conversation and much needed. I will definitely buy the book. Thanks!

Great interview. I actually thought it could have been longer. Professor Markovits did not provide a crystal clear solution to his problem with meritocracy. I agree with him that this is a huge problem, but what is the solution outside of Harvard admitting more people.

@jacklyncheung4993

4 жыл бұрын

There is no single clear solution to the problem of inequality in America. We need a systemic overhaul if we are going to provide equal access to all socioeconomic classes to even foster any actual meritocracy. Nobody can control the status they are born into, but we can make sure the social institutions are in place to ensure everyone gets a fair chance, such as universal healthcare, free education and childcare, affordable housing, living wage, etc. This cannot exist in the current reality of unchecked capitalism, unfortunately. These issues are all too intertwined.

@exellion82

4 жыл бұрын

Jacklyn Cheung so, if I may however, a living wage is really driven by our own need to consume right? So, how would you baseline if? To me, it almost sounds like we just need to go back to basics first. Understand what are needs and wants. In many cases though, each student have desires to college x or y. How would determine that outcome? I feel the root cause of this issue is the tribalistic nature of some people. That I think that is why meritocracy was picked. Scoring a baseline is a way to gauge learning. I feel like the very nature of this issue is really our desire to climb the socio economic ladder and for some (or many), the avenues are shrinking and for those in power, new innovations are threats to their influence. I think in many ways, this is exactly what happened in the 1920s. You have people that are inventing things at record pace and you have others who just can’t keep up.

@MesRevesEnRose

4 жыл бұрын

The solution is the abolition of private education and the removal of school zones and elimination of public funding through standardized test results but he just didn't want to say it because it's too radical for Americans. It's not impossible, though. It is done in Norway and they have one of the best education systems. Denmark also does something similar and they are one of the most entrepreneurial and productive countries in the world. So clearly, it can and does work.

@007Fusiion

4 жыл бұрын

Jacklyn Cheung Still need guidance, network and prospects even with open doors. Imagine a working class person at Yale. They are still behind.

@BigHenFor

3 жыл бұрын

@@exellion82 Your reading of history is naive, as it provides no sound explanation of the social and economic homogeneity across time of those who get to the top. Those who made it in the 1920's still make it in the present- despite their objective mediocrity. They aren't especially talented or incisive but, they are extraordinarily entitled.

Somebody who gets it! Living as I do in an upscale coastal community overflowing with the children of the superrich I see evidence of the correctness of this author's theories on a daily basis. What, for instance, would a struggling lower middle class worker think about the entire fleet of expensive racing sailboats used to train the children of wealthy people how to sail being written off as a tax expense because the yacht club is a "non profit" corporation. That's right some multimillionaire contributes $25,000 to the training boat fund somthat his kid can learn how to sail and then gets to right off as a charitable comtribution.

@gwills9337

3 жыл бұрын

rage...increasing.

A very enlightening segment, thank you.

Amanpour is top 5 must watch channel on KZread

I was educated in the 50s and 60s in public schools in the Cape Canaveral area. We benefited from excellent schools that gave us a real education. Now I can't talk to the grandkids about history because it's a mystery to them. Disturbs me that they are afraid of math. Good teachers could fix that. When we get that Democratic president we've got some things to fix.

@dianaz9221

4 жыл бұрын

Absolutely, education has gone down so much. Kids are not being trained properly, Im afraid for the next generation.

Thank you for telling the truth about how it is. Tax relief for the rich and rich colleges again. . .

"Our education system, because it is meritocratic, has abandoned the idea of excellence." (9:52) Where excellence is defined as "being good at things worth doing".

Regarding SAT scores: rich kids have parents who understand that these type of tests have a certain knack to doing well. Therefore, rich parents makes sure to hire SAT coaches to make sure their kids understand exactly what each question is asking and what type of answers get the points. The poor kids have parents who think that you should just show up and write the test!!!!!!! That is one of the biggest issues in these types of exams.

There has never been a meritocracy.

@johnbrooke6867

4 жыл бұрын

True but not really the point. America has devalued labor and devalued the dollar. Upward mobility was MUCH easier in the 70's and the gap between the the absurdly wealthy and poor was less. It was significantly better time to have a career, own a house, and retire. Even then...there were plenty of problems. The point is to improve things for us rather than go further down the spiral.

Its a loss of talent if financial situation of the parents is the main selection criteria.

@boristheamerican2938

3 жыл бұрын

Thats why we have H1-B visa workers

@ronaldronald8819

3 жыл бұрын

@@boristheamerican2938 That is funny and cynical at the same time..

@boristheamerican2938

3 жыл бұрын

@@ronaldronald8819 Im 59 and have worked many years. Seen a lot of stuff.

@ronaldronald8819

3 жыл бұрын

@Richard Williams Ha ha ha... You could build a pretty solid case for that argument.

This is the most enlightening video on social media.

Professor Markovits is saying what I've been saying for most of the last 40 years. The oldest of six kids in a blue collar family, my parents both worked, were not educated professionals and couldn't provide the "training" kids from higher classes received. Nevertheless,I read a lot and eventually worked my way through college. I entered a journalism career and got a lot of exposure to how other folks lived and prospered. I'd often say kids like me could have gone to Yale if...I always knew that was true, and now Professor Markovits explains things I talked about, but nobody listened, in his book.

Excellent

Meritocracy works very well for Germany and for China. The difference is that education in both countries is free. America has an apalingly low quality of education in general and an apalingly expensive one for quality education. The answer is not to mess around with the top quality schools and decrease their quality but to increase the quality of all the other schools and universities. In Germany there are no top universities like Harvard and Yale which outshine nearly everyone else. All universities there are top quality universities. That is what America needs to aim for and that will require massive investment from the government. History has shown that countries that invest in their education system get ahead and stay ahead. America has not done that. Just as it has not invested in it's health system. Thse are both things that Mrs Clinton campaigned and fought for. Unfortunately, too many Americans had not had a good enough quality of education to understand this.They bought into Mr Trump's lies.

Eye opening. Thank you.

Thank you very much and all the best!

Tuition block kids of less privileged family, particularly for basic education.

This dude is bright. Must've been all that investment...

This is a fantastic discussion.

AWESOME!!! I'm getting the book!!

I have a college education and so does the man I live with, and in this country we are considered lower-middle class. It kinda shocked me to realize that. I thought maybe it’s because we were not typical people since we were both for most part entirely single until we met around 40 and bought our first home in our mid-late 40s. But I thought for sure we were middle class. Not that it changes anything about us, but if two educated people in their 50’s with no kids are considered to be lower-middle class, what is the rest considered to be. This is interesting in a relation that he mentions that a cab driver used to be considered a middle class person.

The myth of meritocracy has never been better exposed than by the writings of John Taylor Gatto; The evaluations of the school/upper-ed system, in their actual substance (not appearance), are overwhelmingly based on the degree of a student's obedience to being controlled and ordered around by teachers-- not according to actual "learning" or "excellence". That is what these standard discussions about 'the myth meritocracy' miss, they focus on class without actually seeing the larger picture-- the hidden nature of what the function of school really is.

@africanqueenmo

3 жыл бұрын

Eric I think this author referred to this when he talked about how rich kids are subjected to a twisted form of educational expectations. where they must conform and live perfect lives otherwise risk being sidelined to the periphery together with the poor and middle class underdogs

@TeresaElainePhoenixArizona

2 жыл бұрын

@@africanqueenmo And the point he makes about the Wealthy Elite Graduates Perpetuating various facets of ...

Exquisite Prof.Dr.Fazal Cambridge

Wow! and that was very eye opening for me

Seems like the problem is not merit, but the problem is CLASS.

@MultiSmartass1

4 жыл бұрын

No the problem is merit which feeds into class.

@dspondike

4 жыл бұрын

@@MultiSmartass1 : Actually, listening closely, it is one's Class that determines one's merit. THAT is the problem, in a nutshell.

Wheew. Markovits makes all of these key points dead-on. These issues are so crucial.

Very informative and well-argued interview. It is built-in structural bias that has prevented a lot of people from getting ahead.

The inequality structural system’s eminent collapse easily understood and why the ruling class should want to support it. Thank you

Majority of the population would not measure up to Ivy league standards, no matter how much education they get. Most kids are not that smart.

@orclover2353

3 жыл бұрын

Maybe, but Ivy league schools don't only take geniuses and savants, they also take kids who have been trained to pass tests..and have paid thousands to look smart. There is no IQ requirement to enter Ivy league schools and I think this points out clearly that the system has been rigged by the wealthy because IQ, although it can be changed, it much more of a indication of talent than grades or the SAT. Let's start by saying only geniuses can go to the IVY league...I bet the rich would roar at that.

Bernie ! Elizabeth ! Damn America, fix your society!

@gregghanson6095

4 жыл бұрын

do you realize what you're asking?

@donnamogavero9212

4 жыл бұрын

Yes Gregg Hanson we do.

@losmanzani6849

4 жыл бұрын

I think we are well and truly fucked. Not because of trying to establish a meritocracy but because a significant part of our population don't know how to think and misinformation is being weaponized like never before and will only get worse as technology makes it easier.

@rum81

4 жыл бұрын

No they love Biden!! Who has no clue

Al Franken said the something similar. He said kids with all the advantages have little room left for improvement. In college with a good coach or or good professors poor or middle class kids will improve a lot more. I had never heard the argument till Al said it. Thanks Al.

Very good piece... understand so much more what’s going on with American education.

No, just convincing private schools to admit more "underprivileged students" won't do it. Public schools need to be strengthened along with public universities. This argument can lead to the idea of privatization....We know that charter schools yield no greater outcome than public schools. It seems the elite really do not like public schools and are always looking for something else. I am very familiar with high priced private schools and I can tell you that there is a lot of mediocrity there. Whereas teachers in public schools are encouraged to get a post graduate degree, many private schools will take kids right out of college with only a BA and no training in education and charge astronomical tuitions.

@Renku07

4 жыл бұрын

That's very true. You have spoken truth through your words. I live in a Latin American country, I know really expensive private universities that employ cheap professors graduated out of the same university just because they're cheaper and can't find jobs due to lack of training. However, in public universities, you must have degrees and experience to teach.

@mikolowiskamikolowiska4993

4 жыл бұрын

You sure charter schools not any better

@aFreeDrifter

3 жыл бұрын

If charter schools are no better than public schools, why is there such huge demand/waitlists with only a few percent getting in and parents cry when their kids don't get chosen?

@rrickarr

3 жыл бұрын

Judith Wyer: Education goes beyond what you learn in school. The rich also teach their children social graces and cultural intelligence. Public schools just want the tree 'R's. Kids from a mediocre schools may have the grades to get into a great university, but that student will have a difficult time fitting in socially with the rich kids that will be classmates.

His first postulate that rich families have more resources to train is kinda false. Rich families use resources to play the system, not to play by its rules. Lori Loughlin ftw lol

@anzial9225

3 жыл бұрын

@Richard Williams Lol which rock have you been living under I wonder? NM, you sound like one of the Trump brain-washed minions, impervious to reason and logic, and evidence most of all.

What a fantastic conversation

Essential! To the point!

I loved this video. And if you're going to bring up the opioid epidemic, bring up the crack epidemic as well.

The game of Life is rigged.

fascinating themes presented in this video. must see tv.

Absolutely fascinating interview

Professor Markovits, when I am elected president, do you think you might serve as Secretary of Education. Do you think you could fill Betsy's boots?

@johnburt7935

4 жыл бұрын

I sincerely hope that in the Spring of 2021, the new Secretary of Education appointed by the 46th President arrives with a nice big broom which sweeps Betsy's boots and the rest of her trash out of the Department.

@ubatuba1

4 жыл бұрын

Even socks can fill Betsy's boots

Meritocracy doesn't just apply to the individual, but to generations. If you work hard and gather enough wealth to give your child an edge over other children, that is also multi-generational meritocracy. People dont create wealth for themselves, but for generations to come. They do not want their successors to go through the same struggle they did. If you dont have the same chance as the next person, it also means your parents failed you,

Wow! What an excellent interview! I have to read this book.

Very interesting interview!!!

What a wise, insightful, superior man Professor Markovits is. He should have a cabinet position in the next administration.

Astounding and profoundly instructive interview... Blessings.

He nailed it: Convince the elites that the system isn’t working for them either and then something will get done. I think he is on to something there.

this is a great conversation.

Simply excelent!