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@seanharrison2729

8 ай бұрын

Nambu chamnes.

Imagine having Luke as a language partner or a history teacher, that would be so cool, guy just oozes passion for what he does.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

That’s very nice of you to say. There are many better teachers of all these languages; I’m just a KZreadr.

@devinodonnell

11 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke There's nothing saying that being one precludes the other. 🤷

@C_B_Hubbs

11 ай бұрын

Luke is an edutainer. I found this video in particular equally informative and hilarious. 😂

@Panda-jl7ch

11 ай бұрын

Fun fact, he was my coteacher for 2 months while he was dating my latin teacher

@ancientlanguageinstitute

11 ай бұрын

Indeed! Think about how we feel :)

And this: Secondary sources have informed us that a comedy, “Macedonians,” written by Strattis circa 410 BC contained a piece of conversation between an Attican and a Macedonian, each speaking in his own dialect. From the few saved words and other lexical evidence, Hoffman and Ahrenshad identified the Macedonian speech as Aeolic, similar to Thessalian and Lesbian. Romiopoulou (1980) thought that Doric might have been a second dialect in pre-Hellenistic Macedon in addition to a Macedonian dialect. The lead scroll known as the Pella katadesmos, dating to first half of the 4th century BC,which was found in Pella (at the time the capital of Macedon) in 1986, and published in the Hellenic Dialectology Journal in 1993, changed this view. Based on this scroll, Olivier Masson expressed his opinion in the Oxford Classical Dictionary that the Macedonian dialect was one of the northwestern dialects, an opinion that is echoed by Emmanuel Voutyras (cf. the Bulletin Epigraphique in Revue des Etudes Grecques 1994, no. 413). Brixhe and Panayotou (1994: 209) agree, although they have not ascertained whether it was the dialect of the whole kingdom. James L. O'Neil (2005) categorized the dialect as 4th century BC Northwestern, whereas Prof. Edmonds of Bryn Mawr College suggests a 3rd century BC date. On the historical side, Hammond has expressed the view that Upper Macedonians, being Molossian (Epirotan) tribes, spoke a northwestern dialect while Lower Macedonians spoke Aeolic. He based his opinion on archeological and literary evidence of ancient sources referring to Hellenic migrations before and after the Trojan War. Heurtley (BSA 28 (1926), 159-194), also basing his theory on archeological evidence, cites the specific migration of the Macedonians through the Pindus mountain range to Pieria as ending by the mid-11th century BC. Katadesmos proves to be a challenge due to the deteriorated condition of the scroll, the vocabulary, grammar, and syntax of its dialectal form, as well as the location in which it was discovered. Nevertheless, the fourth century BC spell written in a Northwest Hellenic dialect reinforces Livius' statement in the History of Rome that “Aetolians, Acarnanians and Macedonians [were] men of the same speech.” In this paper, I will appraise the scroll, analyze the script from a linguistic standpoint, and compare and contrast it with other Hellenic dialects, while stressing the significance of the Dorian migrations in the Hellenic dialectology. Markus Templar

@user-vw1vf5cw7d

11 ай бұрын

Luca Ranieri non sa queste cose, propabilmente crede che i veri Macedoni sono Slavi.

@Phaedon53

11 ай бұрын

@@user-vw1vf5cw7d Translation?

@user-vw1vf5cw7d

11 ай бұрын

@@Phaedon53 Luca Ranieri doesn't know these things, propably believes that the Macedonians are Slavs

@Phaedon53

11 ай бұрын

@@user-vw1vf5cw7d I am sure he is aware of the Latin sources: “For if all the wars which we have carried on against the Greeks are to be despised, then let the triumph of Marcus Curius over king Pyrrhus be derided; and that of Titus Flamininus over Philip; and that of Marcus Fulvius over the Aetolians; and that of Lucius Paullus over king Perses; and that of Quintus Metellus over the false Philip; and that of Lucius Mummius over the Corinthians. But, if all these wars were of the greatest importance, and if our victories in them were most acceptable, then why are the Asiatic nations and that Asiatic enemy despised by you? But, from our records of ancient deeds; I see that the Roman people carried on a most important war with Antiochus; the conqueror in which war, Lucius Scipio, who had already gained great glory when acting in conjunction with his brother Publius, assumed the same honour himself by taking a surname from Asia, as his brother did, who, having subdued Africa, paraded his conquest by the assumption of the name of Africanus. [32] And in that war the renown of your ancestor Marcus Cato was very conspicuous; but he, if he was, as I make no doubt that he was, a man of the same character as I see that you are, would never have gone to that war, if he had thought that it was only going to be a war against women. Nor would the senate have prevailed on Publius Africanus to go as lieutenant to his brother, when he himself; a little while before, having forced Hannibal out of Italy, having driven him out of Africa, and having crushed the power of Carthage, had delivered the republic from the greatest dangers, if that war had not been considered an important and formidable war.” [Orations of Cicero]

@Phaedon53

11 ай бұрын

@@user-vw1vf5cw7d Caranus also came to Emathia with a large band of Greeks, being instructed by an oracle to seek a home in Macedonia. Hero, following a herd of goats running from a downpour, he seized the city of Edessa, the inhabitants being taken unawares because of heavy rain and dense fog. Remembering the oracle’s command to follow the lead of goats in his quest for ar empire, Caranus established the city as his capital, and thereafter he made it a solemn observance, wheresoever he took his army, to keep those same goats before his standards in order in have as leaders in his exploits the animals which he had had with him to found the kingdom. He gave the city of Edessa the name Aegaeae and its people the name Aegeads in memory of this service M.Justinus’ epitome of Pompeius Trogus’ Universal History 7.1

You manage to make a scholarly subject most would find dry and boring (not me, though) and make it fun, accessible and hilarious for everyone. I too cannot wait to explore the richness of Ancient Greek dialectology with you! Χάριτάς σόι πολλά!

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Thanks, man! I’m glad you liked my silly interpretation

@13tuyuti

11 ай бұрын

I'd say it's the other way around. Scholars have managed to make an absolutely fascinating topic seem dry and boring.

Can't wait for the 20 hours video about all the Greek dialects in detail :-)

@FIRE-zt6vw

8 ай бұрын

How dare you. 20h video is a waaaaaaay to short video. You should know that this means war

My first Latin teacher used to say (maybe he still does, I don't know ;-)): "Trying to figure out how all Greek dialects fit together is trying to solve a million pieces jig-saw puzzle. It will take you forever and you're bound to fit some pieces that fit together multiple ways."

It breaks my heart when i realize many of these dialects are close to extinction. I speak Cypriot, and i try speaking only Cypriot, without modern Greek words (demotic) as much as i can.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Good for you! I very much favor the continuing study and use of minority language varieties, as they teach us so much.

@gnas1897

11 ай бұрын

I'm from Greece but live in Cyprus and honestly I feel like many of my compatriots don't appreciate the beauty of the Cypriot dialect. Though nowadays most Cypriots speak a mix of traditional Cypriot and demotic Greek.

@mariajukejax9649

11 ай бұрын

I do that too. I live in Cyprus, my mother's family is Cypriot, everyone uses the Cypriot dialect, obviously it's what I learnt too, though my accent is still a bit dodgy lol.

@vassilisxerikos3908

11 ай бұрын

I love all Greek dialects and not just the obvious ones like Cypriot or Cretan but including the northern variants which are rarely discussed in Greek media in non-pejorative ways. I often watch ΡΙK or Cypriot dialect videos on KZread for that reason. Unfortunately all the dialects mentioned here have been superseded by Koine for two millennia already, contemporary Cypriot is not an arcadocypriot child but a Koine one. Tsakonian might be the only exception.

@petera618

11 ай бұрын

I could understand this, we are having the same problem with Sicilian which is considered a language not just a dialect. With every generation it's becoming more "Italianized". Original Sicilian words and phrases are being replaced by Italian ones. I try to keep my Sicilian as pure as possible .

Χαιρετισμούς και πάλι απο την Ελλάδα , και Εφόσον γνωρίζεις Ελληνικά αγαπητέ "Πολυμαθή" , σε προσκαλώ να έρθεις στην Βεργίνα που βρίσκεται στην γεωγραφική Μακεδονία ( Real ) - αν δεν έχεις έρθη - και βλέποντας τους βασιλικούς τάφους , να δείς με τα μάτια σου ποιοί πραγματικά είναι οι Μακεδόνες . Προσωπικά δεν είμαι Μακεδόνας στην καταγωγή αν και γεννήθηκα σε αυτήν την περιοχή . Είχα την ευκαιρία να δώ στην ύπαιθρό μας με τα μάτια μου πολλούς αρχαίους τάφους , και αρχαία , και όλα παραπέμπουν στην αρχαία Ελλάδα και την Ρώμη . Ακόμη και στα Ρωμαϊκά τείχη της Θεσσαλονίκης υπάρχουν αρχαίες επιγραφές στα Ελληνικά ! Και φυσικά αυτός είναι ο λόγος που "βγαίνουμε απο τα ρούχα μας" όταν ακούμε κυριολεκτικά διάφορες ανοησίες απο πολλούς Δυτικοευρωπαίους που στην πραγματικότητα αυτοεξευτελίζονται δεχόμενοι το ψέμα σαν ιστορική αλήθεια για την εξυπηρέτηση των δικών τους συμφερόντων . Και 2 τελευταία πράγματα : Τα νέα Ελληνικά , έχουν σχέση με τα αρχαία απλώς είναι πολύ πιό απλοποιημένα ως γλώσσα του λαού , και 2ον δεν είμαστε απλά Έλληνες αλλά Ελληνορωμαίοι - αυτός είναι ο σωστός όρος .

Είμαι ειλικρινά εντυπωσιασμένη από την όλη σου προσπάθεια! Πραγματικά, δεν έχω λόγια! Congratulazioni!!

@polyMATHY_Luke

9 ай бұрын

Ευχαριστώ πολύ!

@crit7581

9 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke όμως αν μου επιτρέπεις, υπάρχει κάτι στην προφορά των δίφθογγων που με "ξενίζει"... Αφήνοντας κενό ανάμεσα στα διφθογγα φωνήεντα δημιουργείται ακουστικά μια επιπλέον συλλαβή. Νομίζω ότι ο ήχος παραδείγματος χάριν του " οι =ο•ι" θα πρέπει να είναι πιο συντετμημένος.

I got so hyped when I saw this video. As a Latinist with no ability in Greek but a profound love for it nonetheless, I can't wait to dive into this video!

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Enjoy!

@francisdec1615

11 ай бұрын

I just wish I were younger. I'm 52. I will probably never be able to learn Latin thoroughly (my Latin is still very basic) *and* Greek as well, especially not all the different dialects😔

Attic-Ionic/Koine and their descendants, down to standard Modern Greek, ultimately drove almost all other dialects to extinction… But there is one endangered yet hitherto still living modern Greek variant descended instead from ancient Doric Greek, _viz._ Tsakonian («τσακώνικα»), which has a few thousand fluent speakers remaining now in Tsakonia in the eastern Peloponnese where Doric has been spoken since Classical antiquity.

I really would like to hear more about Proto-Greek and Mycenean Greek :(

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

You shall!

@oron61

8 ай бұрын

No! Not the Linear scripts! ai ca no -two-rai-te i-po-ro-pe-r e-ne-gi-li-sh i-fi yu go ba-ca too fa-r i ta-i-me

@markomarekic5606

7 ай бұрын

Read books about this.

Heya Luke, Great video as always, really enjoy and love the way you present it all. And that epic mustache is just the cherry on the top XD

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Hey thanks man! Great to hear from you. I’m glad if you like my silly content.

Φανταστικό βίντεο!! Σου στέλνουμε πολλή αγάπη από την Ελλάδα 🇬🇷🤍

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Ευχαριστώ!

@Phaedon53

11 ай бұрын

Κι ας "ξέχασε" τα αρχαία Μακεδονικά , εμείς τον αγαπάμε.

@ellinmakedon1216

11 ай бұрын

Το φανταστικό που το είδες;;; Η Μακεδονία που είναι με τη δωρική διάλεκτο;;;;;οι γιαγιάδες μου ακόμα λένε παγαίνω αντί πηγαίνω ή δα αντί θα και πολλά άλλα.

@ellinmakedon1216

11 ай бұрын

​@@Phaedon53 είναι απαράδεκτο αυτό που κάνει με την Μακεδονία.

@KaterinaStamatelos

11 ай бұрын

@@ellinmakedon1216 Την Μακεδονία φροντίζουν να την "ξεχνάνε" πολλοί δήθεν φίλοι μας! Πονεμένη ιστορία...

Nice video as always Luke! I would really like to see a part 2 of this video, or perhaps another video about Mycenean and Macedonian.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

You’ll get it!

Nice video! Thanks for uploading.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Thanks for watching

Really interesting topic, thank you! would love to hear about it in more detail some day :)

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

You shall! Thanks for watching

I read the title and thought how tf is he going to do this? Then I got a lesson on how reconstructing all these ancient dialects is basically impossible - as I initially thought. Then the video blossomed into the most magnificent explanation of Greek dialects and their distribution that I have ever heard. Superb work. Thank you.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Haha thanks, Red! Glad you liked it. If it’s magnificent, it’s in demonstrating my frustration with the terminology and lack of clarity inherent in the subject.

Hey, Luke, thanks for all the efforts, fun and informative, as always! I was wondering if you're still doing the "How is the Greek/Latin" videos? There's an entire scene of "the Greek of Homer" in 3000 Years of Longing, would be cool to know how good/bad it is!

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Thanks! I’ll check it out

Can't wait for part two!

Oh boy, this will be good.

Due to the Anabasis, the difference at 9:22 is very interesting. Modern Greek speakers and those who know only Koine insist that the iconic exclamation sounded like Θαλασσα. In the original text, however, it appears as Θάλαττα. At least there is no dispute that when Antony retired from Persia and thought of the ten thousand of the Anabasis and their escape, he sighed like this: οἱ Μύριοι! Wonderful relations. Many thanks for your work polýMATHY. You are a great help to me in that my knowledge of Latin and Greek, which I have not practiced for twenty years, does not completely disappear.

An interesting anecdote is that the lovely Anna Komnene wrote the 12th century Alexiad Ἀλεξιάδα in Attic Greek, though that dialect was by then long dead. en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Alexiad

Luke, your ancient and modern Greek pronunciation is quite impressive! I’m Greek and I can’t pronounce Ancient Greek as well as you. Congrats!

I am Italian. As a child I wondered if Alessandro Magno mangiava la macedonia. You just reminded me of that. Grazie

Looking forward to the video(s) where you go into the linguistic details!

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Me too!

What are the two Greek words you say at the closing of the video? ὑγιαίνετε καὶ something? Anyway, great video! ❤

Ohhhh - you got my hopes up! Here was me willing to settle in for the first of several Greek dialect videos...

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

I will indeed do many

@OcarinaSapphr-

11 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke Yay!☺

Εὖγε Luke, And dialects have words of no Indoeuropean origin. Amazing Greek language ,the real Labyrinth.

Wow. Great video!

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Thanks for watching!

Great video!!! I guess the reason that Greeks have so many dialects is because the words are long and you can understand them even if you change some syllabes. Like θάλασσα and θάλαττα. Φυλάσσω, φυλάττω... They just change the 'σ' on suffix to sound more fluid. It's not so weird... We do stuff like that even today. You might hear πλερώνω instead of πληρώνω or κάμω instead of κάνω in Northen Greece - Εγώ πλερώνω και κάμω ότι θέλω | Εγώ πληρώνω και κάνω ότι θέλω You might hear Λάρσα instead of Λάρισα in Central Greece - Λάρσα, σ'είδα και λαχτάρσα | Λάρισα, σε είδα και λαχτάρησα If you change your mouth properly to speak the accent, the letters change automatically.

@mariajukejax9649

11 ай бұрын

You hear a lot of variations in the Greek Cypriot dialect too. And some words are totally different. Eg the Greek word for fork (piróuni) suddenly turns into "protsa". Or instead of saying "Kano/kamo", a lot of Cypriots say "kamno".

I would love to see a video all about ionian greek since am from Euboea and yes you have to pronounce it in all tree ways every time

@polyMATHY_Luke

8 ай бұрын

Haha and so I shall!

I just want to leave my petition for a video on Mycenaean Greek!

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Received

I have a question or two about Homer: 1. how high was ᾱ and how low was η? Do I get to pronounce η as the æ in 'cat' and make things easier on my American tongue? 2. does the presence of metrically implied digamma (in an online segmented textbook whose name I forgot) before οι, (but apparently NOT surviving before ο, ου, ω) imply that the οι was NOT rounded, since it did not metrically eat the digamma?

I haven't seen a Polymath video in a while and then all the sudden I see Luke with a moustache! It was quite the shock but I must say, he pulls it off well.

@polyMATHY_Luke

10 ай бұрын

Very kind. I change my facial hair style often, so who knows what’s next

Luke, we would all appreciate the longer version, in more detail, or a series on the different dialects, we want MORE content, not less! Definitely don’t cut stuff out for brevity unless it’s something obvious. Just my opinion.

@garrettrye6951

11 ай бұрын

Absolutely LOVE all of your videos by the way 💕

Could you also discuss whether or not Doric is descended from a "Mycenaean" form of Greek or if there also existed a differentiation between a possible ancestor of Doric from the Mycenaean times and the recorded Mycenaean Greek?

@skylinelover9276

7 ай бұрын

From what I study the Myceneans are actually Ionians Wich J2 DNA paternal haplo group is their blood. While Dorics is still on the top(modern day Greek maccedonia region) at those time. My hypothesis is that the ancient maccedonians a.k.a Dorians are the real Indo Europeans that migrated to Balkan. While the natives of Greece adopted Hellenic language then they create the Mycenean civilization.. the collapse of Myceneans had connection to the Dorians invasions/migration towards Mycenean land

Thanks!

I would very much like to see a video explaining the early history of the development of the dialects into this point if thats something in the works.

speaking of Horrock's ... what is the name of a very big thesaurus where you can find odd forms with their attestations, like "dee" or "audibam" or "faxit" (if that ever occurred) and so on? It looked on the shelves of the Institution like sth which had been printed quite a few decades earlier.

A great communicator.

I sometimes think of ancient languages as fascinating but more in a rigid sense, like looking at a painting or a statue from different angles, yet they don't move but with this video they come to life as if some magic polymathic tablet gave it to them XD Grrrrreat video! :)

There is no way a can NOT watch this video...with THAT introduction!

Luke I love you bro 😂😂😂😂, this video made my day!!!!! Can please do videos on Mycenaean Greek and the debate over the Macedonian language? My ancestors actually from both regions of Greece and I would love to learn more about these topics. Honestly you have made my day with this video 😂

@alexandroscomingaftermonke596

11 ай бұрын

Mycenaean Greek and Macedonian Greek are both Doric. You are a 100% Dorian Greek. For example when Dorian Spartans said : Ή ΤΑΝ Ή ΕΠΙ ΤΑΣ" were comprehensible by Dorian Macedonians but not from Aeolian or Ionian Greeks who said: "Ή ΤΗΝ Ή ΕΠΙ ΤΗΣ"

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Hey Niko, Macedonian is probably West Greek, and thus related to Doric, based on the scanty inscriptions map evidence available. Mycenaean is East Greek, before Ionic split off from it, or the common “South Greek” branch.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Hi Alex, Mycenaean has more in common with East Greek like Ionic. Post-Bronze-Age East Greek - namely Ionic - changes ᾱ > η; however, this is a later innovation. Thus we would expect all non-Ionic Greek to have ᾱ and not η in those positions, including pre-Ionic Mycenaean, and that’s what we see. Having ᾱ for η is *not* a determining factor as identifying something as Doric, it just makes it non-Ionic. Note that Aeolic also uses ᾱ, cf. Lesbian σελάννᾱ for Attic-Ionic σελήνη. Macedonian has extremely few inscriptions, but the ones available like the Pella curse tablet suggest a dialect of the West Greek group. Doric proper (Peloponnesian Doric) also pertains to West Greek, thus they have affinities. But in modern dialectological terms, calling Macedonian “Doric” would be like calling Portuguese “Spanish” - clearly closely related, but not the same.

@alexandroscomingaftermonke596

11 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke And this is how polyMATHYs teach Greek history to the Greeks. Thnx mate👍

@skylinelover9276

7 ай бұрын

Maccedonians were Dorians (Indo European Hellenics)

You do a good Plinkett!

Hi Luke, all the respect in the world to your channel; it's one that I've shown to my Latin students multiple times to stimulate discussions regarding linguistics, Latin's life in the 21st century, history, and more. It's been a source of entertainment for myself outside of the classroom when I want to learn new things about Greek, Latin, and the Romance langauges. It's been an inspiration to incorporate Latin into my everyday life in pursuit of fluency and genuine expression in that beautiful language. It's been a little while since I've watched your videos. This one started off very promising, but quickly became unwatchable for me due to the amount of meme tangents and interruptions. It just kept taking me out of the mood that I associate with your channel and classical study. Is this the normal style for your videos now? I feel as if I might be out of touch and want to gain perspective. Thank you.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

This video is a perfect representation of the inside of my head. This is how I relate to everything, and indeed many of my videos are in this style. But I use many styles, and they’re all ways that I like to convey information. My videos from the earliest have incorporated my sense of humor, such as it is. If my channel is not for you, that’s totally fine. Thanks for the views on other videos and I wish you the best.

Visit Greece today and you will find different dialects and accents still in place in different regions Some of The Agean islands, Crete along with Cyprus are the hardest to understand.

Your mustache is absolutely fantastic!

Listing a bunch of major isoglosses like the talassa-talatta one might actually be a more sensible way to handle this. Rather than looking at the myriad specific dialects, we'd have some variable features. Then, if we needed to describe how a given dialect worked, we'd just list on which side of each isogloss it falls.

Awesome video. Is there a "Latin dialects throughout the Empire" one coming at a certain point? Also, 3:24 was very brave. 😱

@pawel198812

11 ай бұрын

Late imperial Latin had a very robust orthographic consensus/standard. Any differences in dialects would be based on extrapolations from modern descendants minus all the accumulated linguistic adstrata. In comparison, Greek was more of a dialect continuum with a few prominent literary dialects, a bit like Scandinavia or Italy before the advent of language standardization and mass media. Then there's Homeric Greek, which is Ionian mixed with Aeolic and smitherings of Arcado-Cypriotic and Achaean, all influenced by an Atticizing textual transmission, it's mess, really.

@personifiedmarvel6964

10 ай бұрын

Can you explain about 3:24? Is it some kind of joke or cultural reference?

@Reazzurro90

10 ай бұрын

​@personifiedmarvel6964 I'm not sure if you're familiar with the Macedonia-Greece controversy. There is a highly complex set of issues regarding whether the Republic of Macedonia has a right to use the name or whether it is "stealing" and indirectly making claims on the Greek region with the same name. Technically now they've compromised with the name "North Macedonia." Greeks are monolithic when it comes to the Greek nature of ancient Macedonia (side issue, but kind of related). How Greek was Alexander the Great? Was he ethnically Greek or just a Hellenophile? Which begs the question of "who" can claim him. Greeks were also upset with N Macedonia using symbols associated with Alexander the Great. So I called him brave because knowing the controversy it can arise among Greeks, saying "Macedonia had great ethnic variety" is very brave. Long-winded, but does that make sense?

Been learning ancient greek and latin for about 2 years now. I think a lot of ppl don't know that 'Istanbul' is a greek phrase which means 'through the city' or 'towards the city' , which i would prefer over a city named like a name like Constantin. Love your content, greetings from Akroinon, Turkey!

@an_pa

9 ай бұрын

Akroinon is also a composite greek word, "akron" and "ina" which means "end of the line".

@Agapismene

9 ай бұрын

stin poli . , to the city 🎉🎉🎉😊 Anatalya - Anatolia ( anatolika is greek for the east ) Izmir - Smyrna .

@mikel3359

9 ай бұрын

In my opinion probably "istanbul" comes from " I conSTANntinouPOLI". Poli becomes bul. Stanpoli-stanboli-stanbul.

@taylorswift8700

14 күн бұрын

​@@mikel3359no it comes from εις την Πόλη, it is the all phrase for you to understand .It sounds is tin poli.But even today ,we use this phrase for each town,at least in Crete where I come from.We use also instead of poli chora( χώρα,x sounds like the durch geen).Both are used when we go to the main city of the region.

Fantastico!!❤😂

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Grazie, amore! ❤️

Luke is one of those rare teachers who could turn even paint drying into an interesting topic.. This, however, is a great topic and Luke's teaching style elevates it all the further. Great stuff! 👍

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Very kind of you to say, Jason! Thanks for watching and for being a Patron.

@sjoerdvdongen

11 ай бұрын

Paint drying is most fascinating! Look into the work of e.g. Joris Sprakel!

could you inform us about the Boustrophedon (Βουστροφηδόν) writing found in Crete and abandoned in the 7th BC. and which is probably archaic Greek writing. Thanks for the videos!

Fourier analysis is trivial once one learns a little linear algebra. It's all vector spaces, and in particular, Fourier analysis is all about angles between vectors. What's the angle between this vector and that vector? What's the angle between that vector and yonder vector? That's Fourier analysis in a nutshell (admittedly with a bit larger vector spaces than our usual 3D space with its "only" 3 directions lol)

How is it possible in the 3rd century BC to speak the language of a state that was founded only in the 19th century AC?

What a splendid moustache luke

you should make a comparison video of the katharevousa greek with attic/koine greek it seems to me like it might be an easier transition into modern greek

I like how Luke's vignette is a Eb major chord.

Could you please do a video regarding the Latin in Supernatural? Specifically from season 6, episode 22

Watching Luke do RLM references feels surreal to me but then again he’s a big Star Trek fan so this probably shouldn’t be surprising lol

Less to do with Greek dialects, but I’m wondering if you would make a video on the replacement of Σ with C in Greek during the Roman period. I’m fascinated by the phenomenon yet I have much difficulty finding anything written about it

@steliopapakonstantinou674

6 ай бұрын

Ήδη από τον 3° αι. π.Χ. αρχίζει να παρατηρείται μια τάση αναγραφής μηνοειδών γραμμάτων, σε σχήμα δηλαδή μισοφέγγαρου, όπως τα Ⲉ (Ε), Ⲥ (Σ), Ⲱ (Ω), κάτι που είχε αρχίσει νωρίτερα στη γραφή των παπύρων. Η Ελληνική γραφή, Αθήνα 2002. Υπουργείο Πολιτισμού, Διεύθυνση Βυζαντινών και Μεταβυζαντινών Μνημείων. Επιγραφικό Μουσείο.

9:15 That applies to any and all language trees: they often get muddied up because languages borrow from each other (unlike organisms, which cannot borrow cells or organs from one another).

@jackalope07

11 ай бұрын

bacteria can and often do share genes

@revilo178

11 ай бұрын

@@jackalope07 point taken

@jackalope07

11 ай бұрын

@@revilo178 in fairness to you they're definitely not sharing cells (only have the one) or organs (don't even have organelles)

About ancient Macedonian : One of the best researches over the Ethnic diversity and dialects in Ptolemaic Egypt and especially in Alexandria, comes from prof. W. Clarysse. Prof. Clarysse after examining all the available evidence regarding the names of ancient Macedonians in the Alexandria of Egypt, concludes that “nearly all the names are Greek and only 3 hellenized families shows traces of foreign descent“. Furthermore, he adds “All these names have in common the feature that they are not in koine, but represent one of the “Doric” Greek dialects. As the old Greek dialects gradually disappear in Greece itself toward- the end of the Hellenistic period, it is the more interesting tο see them alive and well in the names of the most prominent families at the royal court in Alexan­dria. Dialect names were not born by peasants or common Alexandrians, but functioned as a hallmark of the highest nobility. The list of eponymous officers confirms that of the eponymous priests: Doric names were typical of some of the higher families at the royal court. It seems possible that members of these families were still speaking a Doric dialect.“[..] Professor continues: “This remind us of a famous passage where Plutarch criticises the later Ptolemies be­cause some of them had forgotten to speak Macedonian (ενίων δε και το μακεδονίζειν εκλιπόντων). Plutarchus. Vita Antonii 27.5)- This shows that at the Alexandrian court Macedonian remained spoken for a long time alongside koine Greek and was considered us a sign of aristocratic descent. Speaking only plain koine was considered a sign of degeneration! A vivid illustration of the Macedonian roots of the Ptolemies is provided by one of the poems of Poseidippos in the famous Milan papyrus, which is to be pub­lished shortly by G. Bastianini and C. Gallazzi.” The poem was no doubt meant to ac­company a statue group of Ptolemy II and his parents, perhaps in Olympia. Ptolemy ll himself speaks, proudly reminding the reader of his roots in Heordaiai’ “We are the first three and only kings who have won the Olympic chariot race, my parents and i am number one, having the same name Ptolemaios and being the son of Berenike, belonging to the race of the Heordaioi. The two others are my parents “ The most remarkable thing about this poem is its language: it is the only poem by Posidippos that is not written in the usual poetic koine. It is written in a Doric dialect…the -prestige dialect” which the Macedonian kings spoke among their peer. That the Macedonians kings claimed a relationship with the Dorians is confirmed by an inscrip­tion found in Xanthos, where the Dorieis of Central Greece, asking for financial help from the Xanthians, stress that such help would be appreciated by king Ptolemy, who is a relative of the Dorians through the line of the kings of the Argead dynasty since Herakles.”

Ancient Greek dialects are a fantastic demonstration of why the tree model of language families is insufficient, and an instance where the wave model of it as a dialect continuum can be much more helpful

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Indeed! Though Horrocks discusses doubt for the wave model (which is traditional to ancient myth), as it’s possible the dialects became distinct after the arrival of a somewhat unified Proto-Greek. I’ll investigate

@tristanholderness4223

11 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke I mean the wave model in the sense of historical linguistics, not a model of waves of migration Basically you think of the space as a dialect continuum with various intersecting isoglosses which gradually expand, contract, or move around the continuum over time, leading to diversification. In this case you'd probably see dialects like Boeotian and Attic as part of a transitional fan

You should react to the latin used in the covers made by the miracle aligner! I would love your insight in their usage of latin to both translate the songs and the singing itself!

@polyMATHY_Luke

10 ай бұрын

Nah, he’s a good guy, and supportive of the channel, which I appreciate. I wouldn’t want to tear apart pronunciation errors and grammar mistakes publicly.

@WaldoKrayt

10 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke Fair enough, i understand. Love both your guys' channels so keep up the great work!

loving the mustache man

Fabulous and entertaining! I have a curiosity: I've read that all Modern Greek dialects descend from Medieval Greek, with the exception of Tsakonian, which seems to descend directly from Ancient Doric. Is it true?

We definitely need some Epiknemidian Locrian reconstruction.

It's all Greek to me!

That’s one of the best episodes of voyager tho

Ευ(β)Fοια F is the ancient Euboean Greek letter Digamma (Δίγαμμα= F) which was pronounced thick B ( vvvita)

Love the mustache!

I know reconstructing Mycenaean Greek would be complicated, but I really want to see that after looking at all the greek dialects.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

One day

Yes, Herodotus was a historian.

@pawel198812

11 ай бұрын

Herodotus the first geographer maybe? He devotes as much time to describe the customs, living conditions etc of the peoples he talks about as much as their history

@oraetlabora1922

11 ай бұрын

@@pawel198812 Is that not a part of history?

@pawel198812

11 ай бұрын

@@oraetlabora1922 Yes, it is. He didn't really make a clear distinction, anyway. He is called the father of history, but might also be called the patron of geographers, travel writers, reporters. Herodotus is the intellectual ancestor of Polybius as well as Pausanias (it alliterates, therefore it must be true!)

@akl2k7

11 ай бұрын

Then again, there's a reason he's both called the father of history and the father of lies. He wasn't the most accurate, but, hey, you got to start somewhere.

@oraetlabora1922

11 ай бұрын

@@akl2k7 According to whom was he not the most accurate?

😂 this is a didactic masterpiece, that's how you explain complex stuff 👍 honestly, i would like to have teachers like you, on the grammar school, the latin classes were booooring as heaven (sorry, declension & conjugation tables, shawms and angelic singing do not compare to imaginativness of endless torture).

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Thanks so much, Jan! I’m really glad you liked it. I’ll try to keep up a good standard

Does Horrocks' book cover the Aeolian dialect? My family comes from a tiny village in the Thessaly region and I am very familiar with our modern dialect but I'm curious about the ancient dialect because locals claim that our tencdency to reduce unstressed vowels was present in the ancient dialect and I wanna see that for myself. The book I'm using to learn about ancient greek is by Babiniotis and it doesn't cover Thessalian in a lot of detail because it's meant to be a brief overview (260 pages) of how proto indo european evolved into ancient and then modern greek.

@skylinelover9276

7 ай бұрын

First the original owner of the Hellenics language are the Indo European Hellenics (Dorians Greeks) then they arrive in balkan around bronze age, the natives of Greece were ionians and Aeolians (neolithic Anatolians and Mediterranean Pelasgians peoples) at bronze age they adopted the Hellenic language. While the Ionians (Anatolians) create the first Hellenic civilization called Mycenean

@skylinelover9276

7 ай бұрын

Ionians- Anatolian Greeks Aeolians - Mediterranean Pelasgians Greek Dorians - Indo European Hellenic

We could well say that Doric and Western Greeks are derivations of Aeolic, since Aeolic is in the Central group with the Arcado-Cypriotic, which is the closest to ancient Mycenaean

I feel like your energy went through the roof with this vid lol

Η πανέμορφη ελληνική γλώσσα!!!!

I asked and the legend delivered!

Can you do a video on the Ancient Greek of the new Indiana Jones film?

@polyMATHY_Luke

9 ай бұрын

I’d have to see it first. I’d rather avoid that disappointment.

@BesserGlauben

9 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke Haha - it was actually way better than the crystal skull (which was horrible) in my opinion. I actually liked it.

I now know why in school we worked with a dutchified version of attic instead of realy doing something with pronunciasion.😂 These video's are realy cool, because I do want to know these things.😊

@Treinbouwer

11 ай бұрын

I've made slight changes to the polyphonic script adding an old letter for the w sound, shifting sounds to Dutch sounds and changing the diacritics to make up for some things like vowel length for α,υ and ι and using it to note exeptions in pronunciation. I made it so that I can write Dutch phonetically using the Greek script with as little change as possible. Any Dutch learning ancient greek should be able to read it with relatively little effort and it can be typed. Διτ ἰς ἠν υωρβηλτ τεξτ.

@13tuyuti

11 ай бұрын

I think all teaching methods available in the Netherlands teach Attic because the most well known authors are from Athens. In the English speaking world there are methods for Homeric and Koine as well. Of course it has been proven scientifically that Plato really did speak with a Dutch accent. The Germans, who think that he spoke in a German accent and the English who would have it he spoke in an English accent are simply WRONG!

Thx a lot ♥️ right after the explanation of pronouncing the Ukrainian toponyms, my so far favourite KZreadr explains the thing I used to study at high school 🥰

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Thanks for the kind words! I’m glad you enjoyed it; I had fun making it

@nonameuserua

11 ай бұрын

@@polyMATHY_Luke my most relaxing memories from the university, when we were listening about differences between Ionic and Attic at the elective after our boring German classes, Luke Btw mustache suits you, don’t even think about cutting it off!

I only have one simple noob question... were these "dialects" mutually intelligible? Were they separate languages called "dialects" in the way the Italian romance languages are called "dialects" or were they really mutually intelligible dialects of the same language?

@skylinelover9276

7 ай бұрын

Hellenic languages much better

What did Spartacus say when the lion ate his wife? Nothing, he was a gladiator.

"I know not what he said. T'was all Greek to me."

Actualy Macedonian greek is pretty easy. You just have to put β instead of the φ. For instance to say Φιλιππος you said Βιλιππος, the verb φερω becomes βερω. Super easy super simple !

What happened to Aeolic? The wind blew it away.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

👏

@personifiedmarvel6964

10 ай бұрын

I don't think so. It evolved. I'm not expert in the history of Greek dialects, but that's what happens generally to languages.

@skylinelover9276

7 ай бұрын

Ionians is superior in culture in Greek world that's why maybe the unswer

I wish we could bring back a Senator from Ancient Rome to talk to Luke. It would be fun to see how close he is to the real speakers. Finding out what slang they had that we aren’t accounting for.

Carl Sagan pronounced ‘billions’ like that because he wanted to make sure that viewers wouldn't think that he was merely saying ‘millions’.

So how did we get Byzantine Greek?

fascinating - questions, questions, question... :-) - mutual intelligibility - how would I have managed on my 10 year voyage home after the sacking of Troy - when I put into port somewhere how much would it have mattered whether the locals spoke my dialect or just some dialect of Greek ? Where did this mess come from ? I like simplicity :-) - if we follow all these threads backwards to some proto-Greek, what was it, where was it spoken, what did it taste like ( I guess this was before writing so I can't ask what it looked like). How does the linguistic genetics interact with biological genetics ? Were the Greeks an ethicity or a culture ?. What made them so smart and infuential ? I could go on ...

Disturbing that it took my brain a second or more at 9:44 to realize that the picture of Homer was the wrong Homer.

@personifiedmarvel6964

10 ай бұрын

It's some kind of pun because of the similarities of the names. Not sure if it's on purpose.

whole BOOKS are written on the subject, but if you reallllly wanna do it, that's why KZread has playlists ;) Make it a Series! :D I'd watch it.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Indeed! It’s a dense subject

Χά Χά Χά I could not stop laugh and listen ! O.k. Υou are very instructive and accurate. (Carl Sagan ! a worship) A Greek friend, Dimitri.

That French mustache begs for a cooking video in ancient Greek. Also .. was there some Alabama music with the Ptolemies?

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

That was the theme song to the Beverly Hillbillies: kzread.info/dash/bejne/gap5m9yDl9Cef7w.html

Hahaha, I was thinking "how about Macedonian?" and right in the end... That being said, it's sad that we can't really know how a lot of them are pronounced as they likely used the same or similar alphabets to describe different sounds. Luckily, Boeotian and some comedy at least can give us some idea of some pronounciations (υ likely remained /u/ in multiple dialects, aspirates becoming fricatives in the west and probably even voiced in Macedonia, and α being /α/ or even /å/ (I know, not the right symbol but I cant do the upside down c) in macedonian). Would love to see something similar on Italic dialects (languages), as they are often overlooked because of the omnipresence of Latin

Overwhelmed by this linguistic chaos, but still need more? Go a few years back, to the pre-alphabetic era. Linear B? Cypriot? Still need some more challenge? There also the pre-Indoeuropean languages, such as Eteocretan or Lemnian. Of course, you can try deciphering the Linear A.

@polyMATHY_Luke

11 ай бұрын

Haha yes there is always a fun challenge

OK, who is going to focus on learning Cretan and Lesbian Greek? That would make a nice topic for dinner parties.