Great video thanks, John, I love Higbee / Blunt start threads. I have been using them for years however, I never programmed them with CAM. Now I have some reference and example to try thanks to you, Keep up the good work. FYI for those that don't program with CAM. If you want to do it the down and dirty way just duplicate the G-Code from the G76 / G92 Threading cycle and just Adjust the Z Starting value by 1/2 the distance of the Pitch and use a Grooving tool that is wider than the thread Pitch. Sample G-Code below. 5 TPI = 0.2 Thread Pitch Start of Thread = Z.25 Start of Higbee = Z.35 (.25 + 1/2 Pitch ) N2 (1-1/2 X 5 ACME THREAD ) T404 (SERIES 3 ACME THREAD INRERT) (MAJOR DIA MIN=1.485 MAX=1.5) (MINOR DIA MIN=1.285 MAX=1.265) G97 S450 M03 G00 G54 X1.75 Z0.25 M08 M33 M24 G76 X1.275 Z-1.3 K0.108 D0.008 F0.2 G00 X1.75 M09 G00 X12. Z2. M01 N3 (SKIM CUT HIGBEE BLUNT START) T101 (5mm GROOVING TOOL) M08 G97 S450 M03 G00 G54 X1.75 Z0.35 M24 G76 X1.275 Z-0.3 K0.108 D0.045 F0.2 G00 X12. Z6. M00

@nf794

4 жыл бұрын

Thank you sir

@rossmcdonnell1035

4 жыл бұрын

Will definitely be trying this out 👍

@hatrivers8227

4 жыл бұрын

Is this how to find the clitorus?

@richifuz

3 жыл бұрын

COPYING AND PASTE TO MY NOTEBOOK

Really appreciate your recent lathe videos, booth on manual and cnc. :) i try to learn fusion turn now, videos like this are super helpfull. Thx and keep up the Good work!

Thanks for showing us this in Fusion 360. Higbee threads are most useful with large diameter fine threads, that's when cross threading is most likely. I've heard them referred to as fire hydrant threads, I think that's where they were first used. Also called blunt start threads. When used on both ID and OD threads, just back turn till the parts click, then forward turn to thread. Once you've experienced this, you'll always want a higbee on large diameter fine threads. Keep up the good work!

Good workflow to machine this. I've been doing these for years and I consider them pretty much necessary. Thanks for the video!

I tried it on Esprit TNG, You-ji 2 Axis Lathe with Fanuc controller and results were awesome. Thank you for the information that you are providing.

Got a perfect application for this on the lathe tomorrow. I'll be giving it a try! Thank you, sir. - Tom Z

I was just paging through Machinery's Hdbk last night while sitting on the toilet, and saw a Higbee thread. Then today I stumble across a video describing it. Neato!

Good to see this is still used. I taught my programmers in the very early 80's how to do this using Smartcam .

@thomashenderson3901

3 жыл бұрын

What was the CNC world like back in the early 80s? Was there software? We're you doing it all by hand?

Nicely executed. Also good to see you using the lathe more. :-)

I'm here to find out what a higbee thread is 😳

Hello! Mechanical designer here. 1) To machinists everywhere, I am sorry for existing 2) I reference your videos all the time to learn new stuff. I'm designing a bunch of custom thread gages, and I'm going to use a Higbee on all of them.. I can't wait to see how much pushback I get.

Very useful, thanks for sharing.

No birds nests or crashes on a lathe project? Who are you and what have you done with the real John Saunders?! ;)

I feel like your using a different approach to you presentation. I'm loving it!

@igorbarbarossa

4 жыл бұрын

*You're

It will be neat to see this done on, your buddies, grismo pins!

Thanks John. Great timing, exept two weeks too late :) I was making an expensive part in bronze on the Okuma MacTurn when with a big internal thread in it. I think it was something like M136x5. Recently I saw a video on cutting a higbee somewhere else, i believe it was Peter Stanton from Edgeprecision, using the C-axis and simply milling the higbee. I thought it would be nice on this part, however I didn't get it programmed quickly so nevermind, I deburred it by hand. However it was sitll bugging me. This should be simple. So I tried again last week, just milling air. Still didn't work. I'm definately going to try this soon! Thanks from the Netherlands!

@hatrivers8227

4 жыл бұрын

Taps dies and grinders and a strong impact pop pop pop pop pop

For typical cap screws, I would call for a modified half-dog tip as a feature, Higbee is a special usually in high-end fluid coupling. But dog point is generic in any cap screw. Many automotive fasteners use of location between preventing cross-threading and give alignment when using an automatic fastener machine. I use in swage form machining and lathe. Nice tip. When you need an exhaustive resource for fasteners, get the latest IFI codebook for excellent guidance.

Nice John! ATB, Robin

*_7:51_*_ Girl in background disappears._

@fartzinacan

3 жыл бұрын

Ghosts tend to do ghostly things

Pretty cool!

Nice work John! I'm baffled how anyone would give this a thumbs down.

@TheFarCobra

4 жыл бұрын

Only a fascist would thumbs down this.

@patrickmartinez7680

4 жыл бұрын

Only people that thumbs down this is people who have been just chamfering the end of their parts and leaving the big snag on it for the next guy to cut their hands on. We don’t like those guys.

Why are people commenting that they haven’t had an issue before? It’s not a matter of whether somebody feels it’s necessary, it exists for a reason and some use cases require it. If the customer needs one for the part to be in spec, it’s not going to work just telling them “Oh I did a chamfer because that’s always worked for me”.

@grottonisred6541

4 жыл бұрын

Bang on there....👍 I'm sick to death of our sub contract machine shops re-designing components for us....just make the thing to the drawing!

We call it thread clipping. We use it a lot on oilfield threads. G32 does the trick for the clipping.

Mdt or grooving tool same width as pitch then another g76 screw cycle one thread deep. To adjust where higbee lands rotationally adjust your start point of thread cycle. Slow speed for steep higbee with max Rapids. Figured it out 10 year ago

Thanks a lot!!!,

You should show how to do this on the live tool lathe. Its fun mental exercise working out how to cut that first thread.

Great 👍

Could you guys do a video discussing multi-start threads? There aren’t a ton of videos out there on the topic. Thanks!

Nice lathe department

Did you also try cutting the relief before the thread? If you give up the ski slope and just make it a chamfer then you could also do it with live radial tooling or even a parting tool.

I am wondering if you could cut the higbee before cutting the threads? If you are not parting off (and using the part off tool to cut the higbee) it would save a tool change ... especially helpful on a machine with a manual tool post.

The real trick is clipping the back of the thread with a left-hand grooving tool in reverse. Takes a little more math and adjustments but works great for threads close to a shoulder or really coarse threads that are a pain to deburr

Is Fusion using G76 or repeated G33? Do you need the run-out groove? It is neater, but weaker....

OK so trying this now. As long as you use a grooving tool, and use the same hand and spindle direction you can do this partial thread removal. My grooving tool is left hand and my threading insert is right hand. I'd have do the work around to use a wnmg. The workings out still work btw

Have you found the internal threading tools?

Was doin this 30 yrs ago useing 2 x G76 opps , 1 line of code for each.

Sir, Please guide us same for Acme ER Threading. Waiting for your reply

What are you using to calculate thread depth?

I was hoping to get shown the difference of the part made with coolant to the first one - i guess there was nothing worth showing?

I find I get much the same result by cutting the start and end chamfers after cutting the thread. May not be Higbee, but gets rid of the nasty sharp edges

Watching the Higbee gives me the heebie-jeebies.

@hatrivers8227

4 жыл бұрын

Dude

i usually chamfer the end alittle more then the debth of the thread, and i have never had an issue with it. its extremely efficiant, and does not requier another operation. but then again Higbee is better, but could u not just turn the thread down at the front, or would that still leave a sharp tip on the threads?

@nikolaiownz

4 жыл бұрын

Some customers require Higbee/blunt start threads

@RzAn8

4 жыл бұрын

used to make drilling pipes for oil industry. all of them pipes had a higbee cut on the threads cause they slam those pipes into each other and hydraulically tighten them and you dont want a rolled over first thread and destroying the coupling on 2 pipes

@MrTimelessWinter

4 жыл бұрын

@@nikolaiownz never gotten one luckely haha. i would need to do some Woodoo magic on the CTX 310 Gildemaister to make Higbee threads. im sure i could find a way to cheat alittle, but hopefully i dont get any jobs that requier it any time soon

@JaakkoF

4 жыл бұрын

@@MrTimelessWinter Assuming it is a CNC lathe (didn't check), you can cut a Higbee thread by copying your threading code, adjusting your Z starting position by half the pitch and using a tool that is wider than the pitch (WNMG, parting tool, grooving tool) to cut just single pitch 'thread'.

Also, I suggest running a spring pass with your threading tool after clipping the thread to completely remove the burr created by clipping.

@patrickmartinez7680

4 жыл бұрын

It’s a nice thought, but the spring pass for me almost never takes the burr off. Also, I’ve had many instances where the spring pass wants to chatter in the pitch because there’s no cutting force, especially on coarser pitches threads

@hillfortherstudios2757

4 жыл бұрын

@@patrickmartinez7680 Right, I wouldn't do it on a course thread like a big acme or something.

Dear sir can you share same program how you make

Been doing that on mazaks for 25 years. Where you been?

Good job as usual, John. Watch out for the dumb lathe guys that will do exactly what you're doing and tell you you're doing it wrong.

This is interesting. Personally i don't use fusion for programming but i shall try to make a program manually to replicate this. I believe the relieve (ski slope?) on the thread depends hugely on the rapid feed rate and acceleration of the machine. Might need to slow down my threading to not just remove everything when doing the higbee. (usually i got something around 1800rpm to 2500rpm when turning m24 threads)

@johnbrill9289

4 жыл бұрын

The Ski slope is a direct relation with Rapid pullback in X when terminating the thread cycle. In order to do a Higbee all you need to do is. Duplicate the G-Code from the G76 / G92 Threading cycle and just Adjust the Z Starting value by 1/2 the distance of the Pitch and use a Grooving tool that is wider than the thread Pitch.

@spikeypineapple552

4 жыл бұрын

John Brill BOOM

how to start machine shop?

u can use a grooving tool to thread now.. ;)

I wish Autodesk would learn that the cnc programmer needs to be in control. Not the computer programmer. Can't thread or turn with a grooving tool...

@johnalexander2349

4 жыл бұрын

Fusion, not Autodesk. I don't CAM, but I'll take AutoCAD over Fusion any day of the week, for this exact reason. And they aren't the worst: Don't get started on mainstream software from Google or Apple or even FOSS.

@tophan5146

4 жыл бұрын

John Alexander FOSS?

@benrivenbark

4 жыл бұрын

@@tophan5146 Free and Open Source Software

@ottersdangerden

4 жыл бұрын

@@johnalexander2349 one thing with FOSS, they are only as good as the professionals helping create the tools. It could be the developers of the tool not taking helpful info but getting useful feedback can be a pita too. Though i do have to say there are foss programs that are on feature parity with paid software. Id say blender is up there for the best 3d modeling software, libreoffice for office software. However you end up with stuff like freecad that imo is trash compared to anything out there for parametric modeling. Then you have interesting tools like openscad that can be used to throw simple things together. but yeah I know what you mean on the open source side of things.

@xaytana

4 жыл бұрын

@@johnalexander2349 Fusion is Autodesk, though. Open source software can also be fairly decent, as the ones programming it are the ones using it, which means things that should be implemented have a higher chance of being implemented, as compared to closed source software, which will either outright say no to implementing a feature, or put it on the list of things to add yet never get added. Plus you can argue that programs like Fusion have an open source component, as add-ons, extensions, and plugins exist for the program; I wouldn't be surprised if an app could 'fix' this issue, or provide a quick workaround. Your comment is very poorly informed, and just outright incorrect.

🔧😊👍

Hi guys! Not trying to hijack this subject, just making a comment. G76 has alot of limitations. No shift angle, no negative flank angle infeed, no custom jump-out angle/feed etc.. I made a macro based on G32/G33 single block threading some years ago. Example: kzread.info/dash/bejne/nqNl07SDlKWulLA.html Within G32 line, you could just add Q180 instead of moving start Z. Very useful when you do not have the space to move tool 1/2 lead. Simplified metric: G32 X100.0 Z-100.0 F10.0 Q180.0 (start-angle shifted 180 degrees) G32 X105.0 Z -102.0 F[10.0*4] (jump out feed 4 times the threading feed) G00 Z5.0 Anyway, thanks for the info!

I find it best to use the part off tool to do the Higbee.

@14768

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah that's what I was going to say. Or just chamfer it. That's all i've ever done and I have never had an issue. Also i'm not sure why the HUGE thread relief, I don't even make one that big on a manual lathe.

@TheFarCobra

4 жыл бұрын

I suppose that saves a tool change, if you cut the higbee then part it off.

@westellmodel

4 жыл бұрын

Part off tool is long and can be weak. The company I worked for used a triangular grooving insert. Very little stick out from the tool holder. Higbee cuts can be sensitive to chatter on hard material with a larger part.

@dmbworks8094

4 жыл бұрын

@@westellmodel thats great, i only do small parts in my swiss style lathe

@westellmodel

4 жыл бұрын

@@dmbworks8094 I just started a new job on a swiss citizen l20 My old job was oil field pipe threading pipes from 4.5 to 13.3625" diameter pipes. Whole different world of machining I've entered, but the swiss is very interesting.

I've been doing threads like that since the mid 80's but never called them Higbee thread they called them a clipped thread. For close tolerance gauges.

vid idea: cut threads on a mill working as a lathe (material in spindle, tools on bed) comment: suggetsting this bc i cant find any resources about that / dont know how to google it correctly

Yeah, i meant clipping

Radial endmill by no means equals better thread engagement junior.

A glitch in the matrix at 7:53

With the appropriate skill level, this can be done on a manual machine too.

@stanervin6108

4 жыл бұрын

Or freehand on a belt sander. Why do programmers like to show off by making every minor task so complicated? Probably took at least 5 minutes to write the code. In that 5 minutes I could freehand the blunt start on perhaps a coupla hundred threaded bolts. Just saying.

I need to beburr an acme

Uh isn’t making a bigger chamfer a solution?

May sound stupid but why no chamfer?

@craazyy22

4 жыл бұрын

It was already chamfered. There is still a sharp weak thread at the end no matter what chamfer or radius you use. A chamfer helps a bit but doesn't remove the thin point completely.

How would this look in GCode?

@JaakkoF

4 жыл бұрын

Exact same threading cycle, except starting position adjusted in Z direction half the pitch and only cutting one thread pitch of length.

Hi...bro..can i say something

Why are some tools held upside down in CNC machines?

@billmcmahon9697

3 жыл бұрын

Allows you to run a right handed tool as a lefty and vice versa.

@wendull811

2 жыл бұрын

Can also allow for left handed threads to be cut with the same program as a right handed thread just reverse the tool and spindle direction.

this type of cut is also on fire hose.

Sir my question is 1) which CAM software you are using.? 2) How can I download or buy that software? 3) is it possible for me to learn that software by myself just watching some online training videos? 4

@shawnfee9107

2 жыл бұрын

Fusion 360 is an Autodesk product. should be fairly easy to find.

Did I see a manual lathe in the background? I think you’ve officially come over to the dark side. Welcome!

Is it possible to do that on a female thread?

@Hi_Doctor_Nick

4 жыл бұрын

You can do it on male and female threads, first and last thread. Just remember if you're doing the last thread to do it backwards. The front higbee / clipped thread is done in the same spindle direction as the thread was cut. While the back higbee is done in the opposite spindle direction as you're starting at the back and cutting out. Only done a couple of internal ones myself, all done with live tooling as the customer requested it.

G76 X Z D K A55 or A60 F.

I thought that higbee was going to be like a rogue machinest who was a rebel at heart and just threw the charts out the window and said, you want a strong bolt I'll give ya a strong bolt and at break time everyone else would sit around and speak highly of his name for going stronger than grade 8. But nope and this is why I'm a slow learner cause now I just wonder of the man higbee could have been

Well, this seems like long jump off a short pier. Why not just come in with an inset at about a 45 degree angle as if you were going to cut (bevel) the sharp edge off a newly faced shaft end? That should take care of the sharp bits of the thread, and file, or sandpaper it a bit by hand, just to finish it off and remove any burrs from the tops of the threads. Or was this just another excuse to get to play with your nifty CNC machines (nothing wrong with that)? 😊 Take care, I hope you guys are all safe and healthy up there! 🤠

Beeeeeeeeeeeeeeep beeeeep bepbepbepbep beeeeeeeeeeeeeep

I alway chamfer the face and after that i cut thread.

0:43 need cam for that?

But my mom said not to lie lol

We call this thread clipping where I’m from

@antonmessina5304

4 жыл бұрын

Thread ramp where I'm from!👌🏼

That PDX value should have nothing to do with it. You can cut threads with a 60° tool of any length. The took could be 2" wide, as long as it's 60°. So I'm not getting why that is relevant. The critical dimension is ½ the thread pitch, and maybe the insert you used just coincidentally had a PDX value of ½ the thread pitch.

@patrickmartinez7680

4 жыл бұрын

I get what you are saying, and I thought the same thing at first. I think why it’s relevant in this instance is because of how you touch tools off the front of the insert. The lay down insert style has a “lead in” so to speak. You want to have both tools essentially start threading at the same point. Meaning this, you want to take off exactly one thread off the end of that makes sense. Using the pdx value makes it easier to do that.

Why don't you just make a bigger bevel?

NOT A HIGBEE!!!!!

@patrickmartinez7680

4 жыл бұрын

Are you going to elaborate? It sure seems like a higbee/blunt start to me

@bigfish2827

4 жыл бұрын

Yep it’s not a higbee in Texas or Oklahoma.

@jaremygolightly3279

4 жыл бұрын

Thats a higbee in Texas. The only difference is when put it at the start and the end of the thread.

Can someone help me I go to washburn tech I dont know shit about cnc machines never used one yet I use manual lathes and manual mills if u see this comment please comment links to good videos for beginners that dont know shit about cnc machines if u would it would help me alot thanks in advance

This is not a (true) higbee thread. Good idea, but will not pass inspection for a customer with a higbee spec call out. I do like the idea thou.

Just a blunt start, not a higbee.

After years of just cutting a bevel on before I thread, meh....😏

@patrickmartinez7680

4 жыл бұрын

I agree with machinist. The chamfer technique never works as well as a higbee. I cut a lot of threads and typically higbee everything. I can’t count how many times I’ve snagged my finger on a threaded part without a higbee. I just think most people never think about it because mass produced fasteners are roll threaded and that process doesn’t produce that thin snagged first thread

Machinist checking in. If you have a print asking for a blunt start you better make damn sure the client is OK with this method and they understand EXACTLY what you're doing with this hackjob, in writing, with pictures, so they don't kick it back as scrap. Because I guarantee if you spring this on most clients they will go "wtf is this" and reject it. I know I would.

Yeah not a higbee but the math is the same. I just did it in Esprit 2020 for a 5 axis and a small endmill, also it will simulate there perfectly. Not all software will do it by distance since that may just become lead-in. You're really changing the start angle by the threading tool offset and the TPI. Higbees are designed to be slammed together and are impossible to cross thread. This trick would fail a higbee call-out.

I do love 360 but come on, know when it's time to go back to conventional on controller programming, couple of G76s and your sorted.

Hmmm..... So let me correct you NYCNC, firstly, this isn't a HIGBEE thread. As you said "if you google HIGBEE thread it might look a little different" That's because it is! This isn't a HIGBEE, what you are doing is feathering the thread. It's called a feathered thread. It's not a type of thread, it's a process done to the thread. It's also standard practice that is done all the time, even on a manual lathe - it takes a few seconds with a hand file. Also, NC PROGRAM is garbage. Everytime you create a new NC PROGRAM you have to set it up each and every single time. Set all the post properties etc. This is dangerous and un-reliable and anyone who knows anything about CNC will tell you that this is bad news. The old method would remember the previous settings last time you used that post, way more effective and safer. Also, you've been able to post individual tool paths the whole time. Just hold ctrl and select the process' that you want and click post. And anyone who wants to try this, you should also feather the thread FIRST and then cut the thread. If you feather it last, you'll push a burr into the thread and it has a chance of not working.

@vilts

4 жыл бұрын

I generally like the NC programs when there's a lot of reposting during development phase, but the initial setup is indeed pita. Set all the setting from scratch including post processor (and where it's taken from).

good lord..just program by hand....... 5 minute program

So... the term “higbee” means big chamfer!? Correct me if I’m not clear but wow waste of time and everything!