Thank you for this video. Definitely informative!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much!

Thank you for you video. Thinking of changing to mirrorless soon (budget priorities permitting). I shoot several different amateur sports from soccer to triathlons and kitesurfing. Sprint jet boats are a real challenge. Small boats, with a crew of two, traveling 80 mph on a short track no wider than the boat’s length, with many hairpin bends. New gear takes time to learn and be comfortable using so I’m finding out as much info as possible.

Fantastic John!!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks!! Glad you like it!

Awesome John I shoot a lot of high school sports and this was helpful. Spring sports just started

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Great timing! I think I could have done a little more testing with the focusing modes, but I think the Electronic stutter is out.

Excellent video yet again

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much!

I have taken sports action images with this camera in combination with 500 F4 IS II and the 100 to 400 IS II and used the electronic shutter, the 'rolling shutter effect' is there but my experience has been a very, very low percentage of the images where you see the ball slightly out of shape but the vast majority of images, I would say 95% are fine. I use eye af in ai servo and single shot expansion (4) points surrounding the centre point in ai servo and I have very, very few shots out of focus. I find that you must make sure the eye detection has people selected if you are taking pictures of people and animals for birds and animals. If animals is set when you are taking people the af in focus hit rate takes a big nose dive. I have found this camera with either mechanical shutter or electronic shutter to be absolutely fantastic for sports and wildlife in the short time using it. I respect your findings as outlined in your video but I just want to give my experience.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I have no doubt that you have had good results. When I was shooting things that were relatively easy to shoot like people running or a quarterback falling back to throw a pass almost all of the images were sharp. But when I was doing extreme things like switching to receivers who then jumped and place their hand in front of their face, I got 1/3 of my images out of focus. I actually find this to be very acceptable and usable. As for the electronic shutter, the problem as I see it is that the best moments have extreme movement. And it doesn't help you to nail the timing at 20fps is that peak moment is unusable. So I would rather chose from 12 distortion free frames than lose the moment. 12fps is plenty. I also noticed yesterday when photography someone in my studio wearing a helmet that the camera could not find his eyes or his face, so I think face and eye detection are not going to work when it comes to football.

@frankelbefotografie

3 жыл бұрын

John Gress, in my experience with R6 and R5 both of you are right. I always use the electronic shutter for running dogs, running and playing children and so on. I don‘t have any problems with rolling shutter. It‘s not visible, even if it‘s there a little bit. But if I would take paid pictures of sports like tennis, golf or baseball, with fast moving balls ⚽️ or fast swinging golf clubs, I would use the mechanical shutter. Balls, rackets or golf clubs have a clear shape, so that a little bit of rolling shutter becomes immediately visible, because our eyes know how it has to look exactly 🙂 Except for the Sony A9, this is the least effect of rolling shutter I have seen in a mirrorless camera. A big step forward for canon with all the other improvements of the R6 and R5 I think 🙂👍

@w.scholz9705

2 жыл бұрын

I had Canons until 2018. From then on I have used 2x Sonys A9 - only with electronic shutter. I have not yet seen ans rolling shutter problems in my sports-photos. as I still have al lot of Canon-glas, I had in mind to get the R5 because it is not es expensive as the A1. But obviously the read-out / scanning of the pictures ist faster in the A9 and now also in the A1.

Best video on R5 doing sports. Very well organized, and the data helps a lot. Your advice makes a lot of sense. Thank you. I'm using Case 4, mechanical shutter, and I'm turning off the continuous AF to save on battery life. Now if you want a challenge, try high school basketball in a gym with fluorescent lighting. Mu-ha-ha-ha!

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks ! I think I neglected to say that I was trying to stress I was do something fairly extreme most of the time in this video. Probably one of the more challenging things to shoot in sports and framed tight.

What settings would you suggest or case for an outdoor pole vault with an R5C and 70-200 RF lens?

I trust your experiments and experience more than most other people's facts. As an art director, I thought your comments were insightful, practical-and useful.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Rick! I just wanted to push the camera in an extreme situation and see what would happen.

Great tips thanks! My sports photography is rodeo and have been trying to get my new R5 perfectly dialed in for up coming events. I want the horse and rider face in focus 😬

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks. I can imagine that is quite challenging head on.

This was helpful. Thanks

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Glad to hear it!

A very interesting in-depth video on the R5 and the problems of rolling shutter. I do not do Sports Photography, never have, never will so can't really commit on this video. However i've been a wildlife photographer for nearly 40 years and have owned the Canon R5 for two years. I occasionally get some rolling shutter, but it's so little it doesn't concern me. I mostly use Electronic Shutter, a combination of Spot AF and Animal AF Tracking, Case 2, with tracking sensitivity set low and Accel./decel tracking set slightly lower this makes the autofocus point stick to the subject longer, stopping the autofocus point jumping from subject to subject. True the R5 is not perfect, but the Animal Eye AF is often quite incredible, so for wildlife photography it's been extremely useful.

Thanks for the info

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Any time!

This was what I was looking for! Thank you!...very dissapoining results but thank you!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

You're welcome! I actually think the results are quite good since I was really pushing the camera to it's limits. For most movement, it is going to be spot on.

@burritobrosvideos8060

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress lol ok. What I would have been buying this camera for was the 20fps and fast sports. I guess the warping is what im saying is dissapointing.

Thanks for this! Damn, I really had high hopes for the electronic shutter, but I suppose the stacked sensor on the Sony A9 series really is a requirement for eliminating rolling shutter distortion in stills. Still looks like an incredible camera for anyone looking to get into Canon mirrorless and is a massive upgrade from the original EOS R.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Maybe at this point in time you have to chose between a lot of MP and an electronic shutter. I'd take the MP, hands down.

@sosomelodies659

3 жыл бұрын

Not only does the stacked sensor eliminate rolling shutter it also allows for smooth panning without evf lag and blackout.

@pawelmod3292

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress or 1 year later you can have both with Sony A1 ;-)

Hi John. Have the updates from Canon helped the rolling shutter at all? Thanks.

Dope info

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks! Glad you liked it!

I don’t imagine you will run this again, but it would be interesting to compare performance and hit rate using the single point, or expanded single point AF. Thanks for the information on slower FPS with lower battery level. Surprising to me. The 1DX line obviously doesn’t suffer from that.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I think were going to try it again with the + AF and also possibly against a 1DX2

@philipjames7374

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Thanks for this. Confims what I thought. I bought the R5 to go with my 1dxii a few months ago and I have found electronic shutter impossible to use for soccer but very good for rugby where they are mainly runnng towards me. I prefer my 1dxii in all scenarios though. I have had to buy a second older 1dx mark one as my second soccer camera.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

@@philipjames7374 Glad it helped. You would be surprised at how many people suggested I did something wrong and it was my fault because someone else shot a bird or a 13 year old running with a football and didn't get any distortion.

I was wondering if you changed the case number to increase stickiness. I shoot birds in flight and use case one with track lock number lower to increase lock on.

Great video! Since you posted this video, have they come out with new firmware updates that improved the auto focus?

@JohnGress

Жыл бұрын

I think the autofocus is quite good. What I was shooting was an extreme test.

This hasn't been my experience. I use the R5 with a 500L II mostly for birds and wildlife and couldn't be happier with the electronic shutter. Honestly, I'm so happy with how its working, I've yet to try any other shutter modes.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks for sharing Mike. I do think it will be acceptable most of the time, but I would rather have 12 distortion free frames than blow a shot because of distortion. In all seriousness, did you shoot any birds of prey tightly framed diving from the side? I am trying to think of a scenario close to what I saw with the football. I think this would be the breaking point for the electronic shutter.

@u107916

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress, I'm thinking a diving peregrine or a tight and close humming bird in flight is about the camera swing or subject speed needed to see any appreciable distortion. Currently, there are no in season targets to confirm. But don't let that take away from what you found. I can 100% see the rotational speed of a football or a golf clubs' head speed causing an issue. Its just for the wildlife arena, this feature will be hard to beat.

@whistlingwingsphotography

3 жыл бұрын

I have shot a lot of birds in flight with the R5 using 600 f/4 IS II with 1.4x and 2x TCs. Included in this is swallow-tailed kites diving and flying fast from the sides of the frame. I have shot both Elec. and Mech. shutter and I have not noticed any rolling shutter issues. Also, I have found the AF system to be fantastic for birds and BIF. I have used just about all the AF methods from Zone to single point and the camera does an amazing job for me. With AF systems at the level they are now, I just can't complain about AF performance. I come from a time when AF did not exist and we shot some stuff called film. The R5 is an amazing tool for stills photography IMO. If in doubt, get one and try it for yourself. It is the only way to know for sure it the camera fits your style of shooting. Just FYI.

Thanks for the info. Are you out of focus in the presentation or is that the KZread compression? Id also love to know how the EF 70-200 performs with the R5, have you used that combo yet?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I think its the compression, but maybe I should go back to uploading in 4k. I used the R5 and EF 70-200 2.8 IS II on a studio portrait shoot and it was great Basically sharp 100% of the time. I think the AF works great in most situations, I just wanted to push it to the extreme in this test.

John, great review! How was the FPS mechanical shutter when you were shooting in servo with EF glass? Did you find that the camera actually did shoot 12fps when tracking subjects?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Matt. I actually learned after the fact the the camera wont do 12FPS without new batteries. I think it was closer to 8-9. But the Electronic Shutter did appear to be 20fps looking at the time stamps. Also I learned that this lens allegedly wont do 12fps with the camera either. It seems that only the latest versions of lenses will work, which kind of sounds like a sales ploy, but maybe not . Manual page. 896.

@Stefan1968ful

3 жыл бұрын

@John Gress For me it worked like this. The older original Canon LP-E6N batteries won't give you 12fps. They give you 9-10fps. A 3rd party version of the LP-E6N gives you only something like 6fps. Only the new Canon LP-E6NH guarantee 12fps. That is a fact for me. I am into Wildlife and with my Canon 600mm 4.0 III and Canon 400mm 2.8 III, I get 12fps with the Canon LP-E6NH. I only recored on CFexpress. Electronic Shutter I don't use with the R5, it is simply not useable for fast moving Wildlife, simply terrible Rolling Shutter. Nothing compared to the Sony A9 II in this regard.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah i figured birds would look as crazy as the football. If I knew what I know now, I would have used the new battery I have in the camera.

Nice video and thank you for being so specific I rented the R5 to shoot volleyball and field hockey and was using scenario one and tried some of the others and yeah they didn’t work as well and then switched to auto and it seem to work pretty well too but that means it’s probably choose in scenario one. Plus the rental camera was still on firmware 1.3.1 S. I upgraded it to firmware 1.4 so we’ll see if that makes any difference today for the final volleyball game. But they R5 is so far superior to the EOS R

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! I use to always use the center five points on the AF the soccer scenario.

@whiterock1865

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress For the final Volley Ball game, I just used the center 5 points with back focus and servo, and think it did great...got some awesome shots. Now the issue was the crappy inside lighting...so high ISO.

Great, thank you John that's exactly what I am looking for. Do you think 1dx3 has more successful rate than the R5. The 20fps live view mechanical shutter on the 1dx3 will be much useful without rolling effect.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Well if it’s as good as the Sony A9 II then that would be great. I actually think a 67% hit rate on a challenging subject is really good. A friend who shoots sports professionally with 1DX2 s said he was impressed with the performance.

@johanvanderwouden6862

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Hi from way down here in New Zealand we shoot major sports events and some low light nature projects. We have all Canon gear from the trusty MK4 through to the MK1 -MK2 1DX bodies. We have just started "testing" or playing with the R5 - R6 camera's . The guys have come back with the opinion they would prefer these R camera's they are sharp light quick to change over to video and back. The odd out of focus frame is rare they say. So it looks like we are likely to add these to the collection. Just thought I would drop our experience in here from a commercial outlook down under . Thanks

John I and a sports shooter 7dII with 70-200 2.8 and 300 2.8. I shoot a lot of lacrosse. They are wearing a helmet and have sticks moving very fast with defenders on them with multiple players in the foreground or background. What case would you uses, and can you switch to the player you want even after locking on to one player and then shifting to another. File size. I usually take 2000 per game. That’s a lot of data. Worried about time it takes to download or then upload with 45mb image. Debating on R 5 or R 6.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

If I were to repeat this test I would try to do a head to head with the "plus" focus point and the zone tracking. I suspect that the plus would win out, but I might be surprised. I did a portrait shoot in my studio with a player in a helment and the face and eye tracking wouldn't work, I am guessing because of the obstruction and the effective increased head size.

Hi John! Do you think it would’ve made more of a difference if you didn’t use initial face priority on shutter click? And rather let the 100 % af coverage with eye detect pick where to focus?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Possibly. But you’ve got to let the camera know which face you want somehow.

Thanks for the video and presentation! I have been shooting dance competitions with the 5D4 but I need an upgrade. My eyes get super tired after 9 hours of looking through viewfinder so I want high burst while using lcd screen. Having said that, the dancers move horizontally. Should I use electronic or mechanical shutter? I take I should use electronic from watching the video? How about banding when using electronic shutter in theater stages, lit by many gelled lights? In short, would you use the R5 for this type of photo or would you stick to the 5D4? Thanks!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I would not use the electronic shutter for movement. You could always try it but I would expect that you’re going to end up with deformed subjects. The R5 is going to have an advantage over the 5D Mark IV in every situation because you’re going to end up with more photos In focus. I’ve never had an issue with banding.

@jsasa5668

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress thank you very much for your prompt reply! It wasn’t a deal breaker for me using the mechanical shutter (at all) but I wanted to understand whether the electronic could be used in the specific setting I will be needing it as well as the pros and cons of each. As it turns out and I have been able to find out, electronic shutter will cause rolling shutter (as you point out) and banding especially at faster shutter speeds (when shooting in a stage with flickering lights). That’s a deal breaker for me. It looks like the noise and dynamic range are also affected negatively when using the electronic shutter. So, mechanical shutter for me it is, and I thank you for instructing me on the subject. I can only hope that I’m able to use the LCD and 10-12fps without having to change the batteries on the grip every hour, since I can easily shoot 1500 exposures per hour on these dance competitions depending on bulk and speed of competition itself. Thanks again. Ordering the R5 today

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Sure thing! No problem. The electronic shutter also results in less bit depth than the mechanical shutter.

Thanks, great video! I don’t really see a good use for the electronic shutter then, do you?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you! Well in the comments on this video people reported getting good results shooting birds in flight, so maybe it is good for everything but cars and sports.

I like your straight to the point approach and testing method. I may be taking you too literally when you say that you would never use an electronic shutter for action (Perhaps you meant the R5's electronic shutter). Have you tried the Sony A9?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Jeff! I meant I wouldn’t use the R5s electronic shutter for action. I haven’t tested other electronic shutters.

Hello John, I own the R5 too and was really interested by your test. I'm kind of disapointed with my R5 in sport/action, it's way inferior with what I'm used to (Sony), the burst is not that fast (6-8 fps) and the hit rate (50-65%) not incredible. I also find that while it's in focus, the image is not 100% sharp with High burst mode. If I use low burst instead of High/High+, photos are sharper. Did you try to compare photos High burst vs Low burst ? A bit disapointed... but Canon never said it was a sport camera I guess...

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Damien, I read in the manual after the fact that you only get 12fps is one new battery in the camera or two in the grip. And then you also need the latest version of select lenses. It’s in the manual. I posted the page somewhere here in the comments but you can find it by searching 400mm in the pdf. I think I was getting around 9fps and I think the hit rate was around 2/3. But while it has been a while and I’m a little rusty, I think what I was shooting is very demanding on the camera given the framing and the helmets. Full body or basketball would have been a lot easier. But that’s interesting you find the Sony better. A9?

@DamienBernal

3 жыл бұрын

​@@JohnGress Yes, A7RIV or A9, seems to me way clever to pick up the right subject in a zone while my Canon R5 get trapped by high contrast zone instead of faces. I'm frustrated too that I get sharper pictures in Low bust than in Fast burst (it's still in focus, just less sharp).

@Libinkttm

3 жыл бұрын

@@DamienBernal its just your problem I guess , R5 is way better than Sony A9 II and A7R4 for sports and wildlife ..R5 and R6 are 1DX mark III in a small body ...

@Stefan1968ful

3 жыл бұрын

libin thomas I don’t know based on what facts you can say that. I do wildlife with R5, A9 II and A7R4 commercially. And no, for fast moving subjects there is nothing what can beat the A9 II. The autofocus of the R5 is good but it lacks the accuracy of the A9 II especially while tracking. And worst thing is the rolling shutter on the R5 with 20fps, it’s really ugly Distortion you can get making this Mode for Wildlife - Action - Sport basically unusable. The sensor of the R5 is simply inferior to the sensor used in the A9 and A9 II, it’s not a stacked sensor making the effective readout time much longer compared to the A9. And again, this is not a spec comparison, I say this based on my work with all these cameras.

Well, a couple of notes here. great video as usual John. Like someone wrote, ball does look weird but it does travel quite rapidly, not sure there, do like that there was movement to it i guess haha. I have never shot anything other than a car event ( drag, drifting, autocross) so im still interested to see something there, as I would shoot burst on my 1dx, on an autocross day in Miami at 88++ degree, wont leave those events with less than 3k captures. The pictures you took, I would be happy with those, now... would another camera perform better using the same lens and conditions? Also, not sure if you would have a test coming with a 70-200? would it still work at 12fps? just a few questions I would be looking for answers to?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Pedro. I would expect that the ball would be fairly frozen at 1/4000 but I know it wouldn’t look like a parallelogram. My concern with using the electronic shutter is that the key moment will be ruined and 12fps should be good enough for most things. I don’t feel that the same ranks very loud even with the mechanical shutter so I don’t think you would been the electronic shutter unless you were in a court room or movie set or something. If I had a 1dx 3 I would have done a direct comparison but I think over all a 2/3 focus success rate in this scenario is pretty solid and above average. I don’t have a 70-200 test planned but if you check out my initial reactions video I did use it in my studio, if that’s of interest.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Oh and the silent / electronic shutter on the Sony A9 II which is only 24mp doesn’t have this issue.

@snphotonparts

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Did watched those, those were great but this is more of my field, rather than portraits and or non movement subjects. I still watched and will watch future videos. really interesting to see perhaps other settings or messing around with the " scenarios" if that would change anything, but not really sad about how these came out, they look very workable but yeah I guess would be ideal to test against a 1dx. Also that you mentioned about the lens, maybe marketing or maybe RF lens would really make that difference, yet to see but also very expensive for us that still have and run EF haha. Thanks John!

@danz1833

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Does the R5 have a cropped Raw mode? I wonder if the rolling shutter would be eliminated in this mode as it should read the cropped sensor faster than the full sensor? And you would have similar MP to the A9 II.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Also people keep suggesting I test it against RF glass. There isn’t an RF 400 2.8

I’m really struggling whether to keep the r5 or not. As a bird photographer the autofocus retention on subject is insane good, like never before good. But my old 500 f4 only gets 6.8fps on mechanical shutter but does get the full 20fps on e-shutter. Obviously there will be certain birds in flight that will show the rolling shutter effect but curious if your reaction to rolling shutter in your sports images were only of the football or more? The rest of those images seemed acceptable but the ball was indeed crazy looking.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Hi Josh, I didn’t test the electronic shutter after I saw these results. For what its worth people have sworn in the comments that the electronic shutter is fine for birds. A fast football pass is equal to a fast bird but maybe most birds are slower than a football 🤷🏼‍♂️

Hi, Which camera and lens have you used for shooting yourself in the video ??

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

This is a c200 and probably an EF 35mm f1.4 II

Hey John, about 8:16 you mentioned for weddings and couples walking down the aisle after the ceremony that you'd recommend the electronic shutter over the mechanical. However, a few clips prior you said for movement and distortion that you'd not suggest the electronic. Which one is it? I love the silent electronic shutter but the movement pushes one to use the mechanical shutter. Thank you.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Sorry Geoff I meant to say mechanical at 8:16 Over the past year I have only used the camera with a mechanical shutter. Also I think you'll see in the comments on this video that using the electronic shutter reduces the bit-depth of the images.

@geoffwilkingsphotography

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress thanks John. I guessed as much. Great job btw.

@geoffwilkingsphotography

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress have you banding to be an issue for the R5 for indoor lighting. Ie reception room for weddings etc? I’ve yet to try it for movie or electronic shutter but wondered if you had. Mechanical isn’t an issue. Thanks again.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks! After I saw the distorted footballs, I stopped using the electronic shutter. Since then I haven't seen in any banding in the stills or the video.

So shooting a performance (like dance) in a theatre - you would want electronic to stay silent - (dress rehearsals are the best to shoot). You're saying, props, moving arms, etc would have a distortion problem?

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

They just, especially during jumps. The camera is really quit with the mechanical shutter anyway, so maybe just shoot near the speakers =)

8:13 "I would just stick with the electronic shutter". lol But good video! Thanks for sharing.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah sorry I said the wrong thing. I would just stick with the mechanical shutter. =)

@Bassbarbie

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress I didn't spot this, but I think you can add a note into your video afterwards can't you? I'll now have to scrutinise the football (soccer) match I shot with electronic shutter on my R5. I didn't spot any problems, but perhaps there were.

Hi John The electronic shutter seems to be a useless gimmick but did you have trouble with the EVF blacking out with the mechanical shutter ? Thanks Noel

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

It wasn't a problem but it was something that is different. Its probably a shorter blackout time than a DSLR but its feels more like an interruption in a video feed.

@noelchignell1048

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress There’s no black out at all with a DSLR but does the EVF black out affect your ability to take bursts following a moving target ?

@chazM6116

3 жыл бұрын

@@noelchignell1048 how do you see when the mirror is up?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Blackout occurs when the mirror lifts in a DSLR. The effect on this mirrorless camera is different, but at this point I don’t think it makes it harder to track.

@noelchignell1048

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress ok I didn’t know that but also never noticed it so I guess it isn’t a problem with DSLRs ! It is a major issue with mirrorless I’m told but I’ve never used any of them and it does concern me if I get one

Hey brother I'm using Canon eos r5. Do you know how to slower electronic shutter? I use the slowest one still let take 3-5 photos per press. That's too much most of the time I get same photos for like 5-7 shots.

@JohnGress

Жыл бұрын

You need to change the drive mode support.usa.canon.com/kb/index?page=content&id=ART178130

@sottheaphoeurng9044

Жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress thank you for sharing this, but that tip apply only using mechanical shutter. For electronic shutter it still shot 20 fps even I switch to slower continuous mode.

Did you do any tests where you picked the focus point and tracked the subject? Zone AF is fun but not reliable in my experience unless your subject is so erratic that it's the only option. I've been using it all day at a horse show and it's quite good. It can't hip fire as incredibly fast as the 1dx3 (that thing is out of this world), but it's focus is still quite strong. My anecdotal experience is not nearly as polished or extensive as yours, but I'd estimate it only missed 1-2 shots every 300-500 frames. If you need the 1dx3, then this is not quite as good (though almost half as much). If you're coming from any other Canon camera, this thing is a giant upgrade. This thing performs the way they marketed that the 7d mark II could perform.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I did really posh the envelope by shooting tight, quickly moving subjects with helmets and arms flailing. I actually don’t think 67% in this situation is bad. That’s good news about the horses. Given that they’re big and steady in their movements and without arms flying past their face, I would expect it to do better but I’m pleasantly surprised and pleased to got 99%. If we run another test I’ll try it against the 1DX2 and I’ll work on the + focus point too.

@jwinslow

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress they are bigger (sometimes), but the obstructing sides of the jump (esp tall bushes) and brief focus windows can challenge the af system more than football sometimes. There are also more than a few times without much contrast (dark horse, dark coat, dark background). When I was inside at iso 12800, I'd say the keeper rate was close to 95%. It was also extremely sharp, like the 1dx3, where absolutely no other canons (or Nikons) have been sharp in those venues. In focus yes, but not razor sharp. Where it struggles is asking it to rapidly pick up focus in a challenging situation. Waiting for the subject to clear an obstruction and then focus/fire. It was slow to acquire focus there. or having it move rapidly on 2-3 planes, it struggles there. Like a horse rapidly cantering towards me while swinging around a curve. A couple times it didn't focus. Whereas the 1dx3 could pull off some insane things, and it's live view was not only super quick but sometimes faster than analog to acquire and fire immediately. My takeaway was that people will be really happy with the r5, and sports photojournalists can use it too, but should get the 1dx3 if they can afford it. I will probably own both for different deployments, especially with the huge dropoff in price.

@showcasehardwoodfloors1473

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Joshua....I think I’ll keep my 1DX3 for now until we see the upcoming R1 this year hopefully!!

@jwinslow

3 жыл бұрын

@@showcasehardwoodfloors1473 yep they're different classes of cameras. The r5 is magnitudes better than the 5d/7d bodies before it, but it's still noticeably less reliable in action shooting than the mk 3, both in challenging situations and overall consistency with simpler subjects. It also comes down to preference. As a sports guy, when I go to a portrait trade show, a lot of the prints and product samples in the portrait world are too soft for my taste, while I'm sure they feel the opposite way about some of my super sharp shots. So some of the slightly soft shots of the r5 might not be as big of a problem for others. I'm very happy owning both the r5 and 1dx mk iii. They serve different purposes, but the r5 can wade into the deep end of action photography far better. The r1 is going to be a monster.

@showcasehardwoodfloors1473

3 жыл бұрын

@@jwinslow thanks again Joshua! I have the best of the best w the 1DX3 but yes that R1 gonna be the upgrade so I’m sure it’ll have to represent!

I don't have the R5 yet but I shoot a lot of live theater images with motion, how do you think the R5 would do? Thanks!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I think the AF is great! A friend who shoots sports full time looked over the images and said the in focus percentages were very good and in the studio it was almost 100%

@JBSPhoto

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Thanks!!!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

@@JBSPhoto Thank you!

@richardperson1435

3 жыл бұрын

FWIW, I used my R for theater and it worked very well. Superb low light AF and the EVF helped to see the dark scenes better. I can only imagine the R5 performing even better.

Right before 8:15 i thought i heard you say, “So I would just stick to the electronic shutter.” Is that what you meant to say? I think you meant to say mechanical shutter to avoid distortion, right? Thanks.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Sorry I misspoke After conducting this test I have only used the mechanical shutter.

I think e-shutter will be fine unless the action is faast, so weddings should be ok in general. Canon sensor scan speed is nearly 4x faster than Sony A7RIV/A7RIII for example. Only Sony A9 with its stacked sensor has much faster scan speed. However, for fast action mechancial all the way.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

The best moments in life have a lot of movement tho, So I wouldn’t want to blow it because I wanted to shoot 20fps at a wedding. The R5 shutter seems quieter than the 5DIV but I didn’t test it. I’ll try it out soon and put that on my full review.

What about with helmets on and more people and auto focused point?

Do you recommend the R6 for wildlife photography?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I am not a wildlife photographer, so I do not have an opinion.

I've had terrible results with the EVF lag! I'm shooting kiteboarders who are moving both horizontally and vertically, and when trying to pan and keep the athlete in the frame, the EVF lag is so bad that it's very difficult to keep framing. The result is the photo is unusable. Yes, the EVF refresh rate is set at its highest setting, but it's not good enough.

@westshorephotographyclub6696

2 жыл бұрын

I had the same experience--initially. Changing the "Display Performance (Shooting Menu 8) to "Smooth" resolved the issue for me. Using the R6.

When you say electronic shutter has many distorted images, are those included in the 15%?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

That is a very good question and something I should have clarified and noted. I am not sure. There weren't a lot of distorted frames, but it did take place at the worst times.

I thought CFast was a dead standard, and CFExpress was CompactFlash Express? Are these R5 Cameras actually CFast?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Sorry I misspoke. it is CFExpress. The other slot is SD.

@martinbsmith3

3 жыл бұрын

Ah no worries! Still learning things myself, so I wanted to be sure I hadn't gotten confused!

Whats up John! Long time.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Right! You might be the only thing I miss about Churchill Downs!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Since you watched this video, what I didn't do a good job of explaining is that the R5 AF is nearly perfect when shooting easy things like quarterback, most of my tests however were on WR.

It would be interesting to know what lens you use for your test. Canon lenses are categorized as A, B, C, D, E, F, G, and H. Not all lenses have the same number of compatible AF points. A was the better target and H the worst. Excuse me for my bad English, I am a French Canadian.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Pas de problemme! I should have but it in the subtitles and not relied on the meta data on the screen recording. 400mm f2.8 IS II USM

@denisbellerose273

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Here are the categories of the 400mm; EF400mm f / 2.8L USM A EF400mm f / 2.8L USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III B * EF400mm f / 2.8L USM + Multiplier EF2x I / II / III B * EF400mm f / 2.8L II USM A EF400mm f / 2.8L II USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III B * EF400mm f / 2.8L II USM + Multiplier EF2x I / II / III B * EF 400mm f / 2.8L IS USM A EF400mm f / 2.8L IS USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS USM + Multiplier EF2x I / II / III B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS II USM A EF400mm f / 2.8L IS II USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS II USM + Multiplier EF2x I / II / III B EF 400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM A EF400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM + Multiplier EF1.4x B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM + Multiplier EF1.4x II B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM + Multiplier EF1.4x III B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM + Multiplier EF2x B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM + Multiplier EF2x II B EF400mm f / 2.8L IS III USM + Multiplier EF2x III B EF400mm f / 4 DO EST USM B EF400mm f / 4 DO IS USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III B EF400mm f / 4 DO IS USM + Multiplier EF2x I / II / III H (f / 8) EF400mm f / 4 DO IS II USM B EF400mm f / 4 DO IS II USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III B EF400mm f / 4 DO IS II USM + Multiplier EF2x I / II / III H (f / 8) EF 400mm f / 5.6 L USM B EF400mm f / 5.6L USM + Multiplier EF1.4x I / II / III

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks. A

Do you mean Mechanical Shutter at 8:12? (instead of Electronic?)

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Yes. sorry about that.

What firmware were you using?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

The original firmware was the only firmware available when I recorded this video.

I want a comparison between sport photographers using this camera and the 1Dxiii. Thanks.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

You should make that video.

@Davitor1

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress I'm not a sport photographer. But thanks for the compliment.

@wendyu1

3 жыл бұрын

I'm in the midst of a tough decision... which of those two cameras to use when shooting the Breeders' Cup races next weekend. I'll be shooting the head on. At this track there are two different finish lines (very unusual in horse racing) so when a race uses the finish line further away from me (there's 1/16th mile difference between the two), I plan on using the R5. I'll need all the pixels I can get due to cropping. The most difficult part for me is the fact, that due to covid and no racing fans, there are no additional toteboards to see who is in the lead nor can I hear the announcer because his speaker has been turned down a notch. I'm literally shooting blindly on close finishes. I'll probably use the zone focusing which will pick up the subject closest to me. My fear is that I may lose focus, or it focuses on something else when the jockey is coming by and doing some jubilation... I've had success with that using my 1dx ii during the fall Keeneland meet. Hoping for the same success with both the R5 (recently purchased) and the 1Dx iii (loaner).

yeah for anyone watching, he's using an EF lens which has slower AF as opposed to RF lenses, so this makes sense

8:10 "I would stick to the electronic shutter" I think you mean 1st curtain shutter to avoid the rolling shutter distortion associated with the electronic shutter and horizontal movement.

@JohnGress

10 күн бұрын

I meant the medical shutter.

I think it’s mostly the EF lens which is causing these issues. If it was a modern RF lens, you’ll probably get closer to 90% hit rate

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

If only there was an RF 400 2.8. I think the hit rate is actually quite good.

Oh plz do more test with sports photography. I am planning to buy it exclusively for sports. I want 90% + photos to be in focus. Espically when players are wearing s helmet. Plz plz do a part 2 and upload more of these. Do exclusive full mechanical shutter. And helmet shots with all the af modes and speeds.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks! We dont have people playing games here, just random people practicing, so I won't be able to do what you are asking me to do. I think you will get 90% in focus when people are not moving up and sideways at high speeds.

@popcornparam

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress well if I am shooting sports then ofcourse PPL are gonna be moving fast. Plz do more testing when possible.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I was thinking that a lot of sports don’t involve both vertical and horizontal movement happening simultaneously. For the most part that doesn’t happen with running backs, swimmers, sprinters or tennis players.

@popcornparam

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress I shoot foot ball, I mean soccer. ⚽⚽⚽⚽ And cricket 🏏🏏🏏🏏 which is like base ball, in this game the pitchers come In running and they throw the ball and then slow down. U know how catching the ball works.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

IMHO, Aside from having to react quickly, focusing out baseball is really easy. I think the hardest thing we have to shoot is passing in our football. Where as your football is a lot easier to shoot.

Was it EF 400 f/2.8 version I? Or version II?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

IS II

@kennethlui2268

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Hm...Version II should be quite fast tracking. Are you sure the somewhat high out of focus rate is not due to user error? Was the shutter speed above 1/1000?

@chrisb5940

3 жыл бұрын

Lol hmm... If it was user error do you think he would of posted the results on the multiple modes? Out of focus and motion blur are different things and he’s out doors with a fast lens I’m sure his shutter was fast enough. Seemed like an unbiased realistic overview plus he stated in a comment that AF was 100% in studio. Hmm

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Chris. It was 1/4000. That’s why I posted the video with meta data on the DPP screen. .

@kennethlui2268

3 жыл бұрын

Chris B when I get the camera, I will do my own test. Good in studio but not great outdoor? That is not good.

Did you misspeak at 8:14? You said you’d stick with the electronic shutter. You meant mechanical shutter, right?

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Good catch. Sorry I said it wrong. I’ve used the mechanical shutter ever since.

You need the A9 for that electronic shutter performance.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I don’t.

@benjaminmesa1089

3 жыл бұрын

The main reason that the Canon R5 "struggles" with the electronic shutter is because it is more than TWICE as many MP. That's more than twice the amount of time it has to read. It's not a global shutter, so the fact that it can electronically read that much info that fast is what is impressive to me. Yes, if you pan hard enough, or the subject is moving at an angle and fast, you will see electronic shutter issues, but in most situations, it does just fine.

Was that an RF lens or an EF lens?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

EF. There aren't any RF super telephotos.

@chimpy9823

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress John, there are... The new 600 mm and 800 mm f11.

Just FYI, the memory card is either CFast or CFexpress. Two different technologies.

@minusinfinity6974

3 жыл бұрын

It's CFExpress, CFast is basically dead end technology. CFExpress is an evolution of XQD and should be backward compatible, but Canon has not implemented that so you can't use XQD in the R5/R6 to save money, unlike Nikon did with the Z6/Z7

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Does CFExpress stand for Cfast Express? Perhaps compact flash express?

@Samyah93

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Yes, it is Compact Flash Express.

I would have liked to have seen 8K Frame Grabs. Easier to scrub through video clips then a lot of high rez still frames. I'm renting a R5 to to test that.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Good luck. please post. That would never be in my approach since I always want RAW files of everything.

@makofoto

3 жыл бұрын

Which is why this camera is exciting. 8K RAW Video ... supposedly.

@makofoto

3 жыл бұрын

kzread.info/dash/bejne/YqF6m5Kfo66tYNY.html

According to Canon specs, to get 12 fps you have to have at least 60% battery life, so not sure but that could have been an issue. Also wondering if you had AI servo on and eye tracking for people, no animal or no priority.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

The batteries were full and it was set to human eye tracking. I noticed when shooting portraits of a football layer that it cant spot a face within a helmet. I would assume because the head size to eye ratio is off. Another youtuber who shared videos of the R5 and long lenses was shooting fairly static subjects, like preteen quarterbacks. When I shot easy subjects to focus like this it nailed it, so I moved on to very difficult to focus subjects - wide recievers. Overall I think this camera is an improvement over the 5DIV. Its not a 1DX3 or an A7S3, but people sure expect that its going to preform like every camera they can imagine.

@johnf.7356

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress I'm a little disappointed with the R5, I think the photography side was also over-hyped just like the video capabilities. I've tried every setting and the best I can get is 9 fps. Even with electronic shutter same 9 fps. I'm not a pro, but coming from using the 80D for over 3 years I had higher expectations for this camera. I'm also not getting no where near 6 stops of stabilization with an RF lens. Of course it could be user error. Oh well, thanks for your reply.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Coming from the 5DIV it’s a great upgrade. Much better AF allows you to focus on the composition and not the, well, focus. In EVF image review. Plus 50% more pixels for the basically same price.

@johnf.7356

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress I have to give it more time, patience and practice. This is not an 80D lol.

Did you just say towards the end you’d stick to electronic shutter?

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Sorry, I meant mechanical.

Very informative video thanks, But as mentioned below, Very irritating/distracting music

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks! I stopped using background music about 6 months ago.

Not every sport out there has fast moving balls going around. there are sports without any ball throwing (track n field), etc. I'd say the title is a bit harsh and misleading. I plan to buy the R6 for sports (track n field), and i will certainly try out the e.shutter. Based on what i've seen it will be just fine.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I have learned through the comment process on this video that the electronic shutter reduces the color quality to 12-bit color.

@brucedeo1981

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress thanx for the input, i've also seen that appart from the obvious banding in flickering light, it also introduces a bit more of noise.

8:12 Did you mean to say mechanical shutter here?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️🤦🏼‍♂️ OMG yes I did.

@gtaatmiami

3 жыл бұрын

John Gress lmao I told myself “I’m just gonna pretend he said mechanical”

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

🤣🤣🙏🏼🙏🏼

Great straight forward review.. I switched from C 1Dx to S A9ii about a year ago... I’ve been waiting on R5 reviews specifically centered on sport, movement, and/or fast moving wildlife... I look forward to more in-depth sports centric reviews from you and others to see how consistent they are or maybe even prove different results. For me, the “hit” (in focus) rate for your review is jus unacceptable & toss in the rolling shutter distortion makes it completely un-usable. Can’t wait to see more reviews to confirm or disprove the lack luster performance

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you for your response. A lot of people int he comments don't like my results and so rather than seeing if they can repeat the statistics, they're saying I'm wrong. I think given the extreme nature of my test, the results aren't bad. The camera preforms above 80-90% for quarterbacks throwing and receivers running, but on catches at close range, the results are mixed. I feel in general people expect every camera to do everything. The A9II has a small sensor and no rolling shutter. The R5 has a big sensor and rolling shutter. I think rather than complaining about whats not possible, I think people should be evaluating if the camera works for them based on its capabilities. For my use, as mostly a studio photographer who shoots video and has a C series camera, the R5 is a perfect fit. The A9II would never be something I would consider buying.

@y_h_d1638

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress you are correct. because they are just canon fanboy. please show some rolling shutter distortion shots.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

It’s in the video. If you look closely, the helmet doesn’t look right either. I’ve used Canon for 24 years and I am happy with their cameras. But with all technology you have to know the limits and work with what’s possible and not complain because it’s imperfect.

The Mongral thing has got banding in the shadows at highish ISOs. So just a warning to everyone. Mines going back.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Was that by chance something you observed with the electronic shutter? It's only 12-bit color.

@markrigg6623

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Hi John No its just elec. Ist curtain which works fine with all my other cameras. The 1st curtain mode is put there for a reason but its unusable at least at highish ISOs. 12 bit doesn't automatically cause banding as well. Thanks for the response.

You should also test native RF lenses auto focus capabilities for a fair auto focus evaluation.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

There are no RF super telephotos to test.

@justicew7612

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Then you should mention that your autofocus capabilities review might not be a fair evaluation on R5 since you only use a EF super telephoto lens.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

It’s very fair. The EF lenses are the lenses professional sports photographers have to choose from and this was a test of using this lens with this camera.

@justicew7612

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Your comments make no sense! Your review is all about R5 camera auto focus capabilities! If your review was how a Canon DSLR super telephoto lens autofocus capabilities on a new mirrorless system R5 camera, your comments might make more sense. I would say a fair review of R5 autofocus capabilities should be putting both native RF lenses and EF lens to test and then compare the results. The result would indicate if there are any autofocus issues. If yes, are the autofocus issues due to R5 camera or due to the RF lens or EF DSLR lens limitation on the mirrorless system R5. I believe I have made myself clear.

you almost sound like Marty blue lighting t.v

I’m very confused? You say that you wouldn’t recommend the electronic shutter for motion, but yet it has the smallest failure percentage? And you said to not use silent shooting, like at a wedding,because of the possibility of horizontal distortion, so just to stick to the electronic shutter. Isn’t the electronic shutter silent? Am I missing something here? Great presentation, I could be way off base here.... thanks!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Actually you caught me. I meant to say stick to the manual shutter. The reason being is that you could end up with crazy distortion from the electronic shutter that will ruin a key moment of whatever you are shooting. In addition the electronic shutter modes reduce the bit depth of your images too, resulting in lower quality.

@Chbucha

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress ah ok I was wondering if that’s what you meant, but reading through the other comments I didn’t see anyone else say anything, so I really thought I just had electronic and silent misunderstood for the last several years. Thanks for the clarification. Liking your videos! Keep it up!’

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Oh sorry, Silent = electronic. It's silent because its basically just capturing a still from the video feed which is lower bit depth than manual shutter stills.

It's funny, because a lot of people say the exact opposite that electronic can be used for bird photography, which is the most motion packed of all photography types aside from insects. I don't know who to believe about that one anymore....

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I guess this test may just show that footballs move faster, or they are faster relative to something.

The R5 does not seem to get a break

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I thought the focus results were quite good.

@nyambe

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Really? they seemed low compared with other high frame rate mirroless

@hamishsnell7735

3 жыл бұрын

@@nyambe John says that the numbers presented were the number of shots out of focus. The success rates are > 75% in most cases which is generally pretty good

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

@Samiebuka I was shooting one of the hardest things to focus. People sometimes in helmets jumping laterally and vertically often with their hands in from of their face with very tight framing. I think the camera would do have much higher numbers for runners or quarterbacks throwing.

8:15 so stick to the ELECTRONIC SHUTTER for weddings? That part through me off is they are swinging their arms or waving out of excitement.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I meant mechanical and I didn't catch it until after it was posted

@MsSpokenvoice

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress awesome! i think i will change my setting and just leave it. I shoot mainly sports and weddings and some seniors.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

12 FPS is enough 😁🙌🏼

Gotta say my results are SO MUCH better than yours. Electronic works pretty darn well. I used it tonight at the ALCS MLB game and it worked great. All electronic shutter with zone focus.

@JohnGress

8 ай бұрын

Baseball is a lot more predictable than football but I am surprised you are not getting misshapen baseballs.

Very useful & informative video. The only major flaw is the background music! Extremely distracting & annoying.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

No worries. I have discontinued the use of a music bed (except for Christmas).

@jgrattigan

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress thanks for speedy reply! I’m probably just getting too old & can’t concentrate if there are distractions!! 😂🤣😂

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Ha. I think that's all of us!

And yet one Pro wildlife reviewer says he would have no hesitation shooting a Cheetah hunt at 70 mph @20FPS with the R5 ?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Does a football move faster than a Cheetah? There was distortion in their heads and helmets too.

@chasmoonie3403

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress This is bad news , I have A9II and was hoping R5 would come close.... this doesn't look very promising for 20 fps action stuff, that's the whole point of having 20 fps...

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I wonder if it’s even possible now with a high MP sensor.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I wonder if it’s even possible now with a high MP camera.

@chasmoonie3403

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress probably not....

i had the awesome privilage of being at a ton of champions league games even during covid, the pros on the side lines do not use mirrorless or electronic shutters, they just don't they had the odd ball camera to test from time to time, but when picking up Ronaldo heading a ball you can always hear that mirror flapping about. it was way more likely to see a nikon D4s at a game, then to see a sony A1.

now try birds in flight !!!!!

There is a lot of distracting background noise in the video which makes it difficult to hear what you are saying.

@JohnGress

Жыл бұрын

I no longer use a music bed.

I gotta say, I've never heard of anyone else getting such a low hit rate using this camera and I've watched a lot of videos...

@JohnGress

11 ай бұрын

Did anyone else give statistics while shooting football or just vague impressions?

8:10 you mean mechanic shutter

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Yes, sorry.

Usually, electric shutter has a typical "rolling shutter" effect. But the R5 is really really expectional good at this point. I have seen images of users would did tests photographing birds in mid flight with electronic shutter and you couldn't see the slightest rolling shutter or image. If the R5 can take pictures of small birds that are hovering above plants, flapping their wings, with electronic shutter without any side effect its basically good for everything else too.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I too have seen videos where it preformed well with birds. But clearly it doesn't do a great job with balls in flight. I also think i saw distortion in the athletes. What also bothers me is that the electronic shutter drops the bit depth of the raw files.

@gregoryfricker9971

3 жыл бұрын

You sure that wasn’t just the shape of the football when thrown?

This is the worst AF performance I have seen in any R5 test video. A major achievement how did you manage that?

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

By pushing the camera to see how it would react multiple times in one of the most difficult scenarios.

@daviddouglasuk

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Others have shot sports and reported excellent performance. I guess the helmets didn't help but Canon has improved that in recent firmware.

@daviddouglasuk

2 жыл бұрын

In many of the shots the eye is clearly visible and in other tests the R5 would have tracked the eye. I don't understand why you were nit achieving that.

@JohnGress

2 жыл бұрын

Adult wide receivers change their head direction and hand positions rapidly while running and flying through the air. A lot of the examples I saw were of people running or children throwing footballs.

@daviddouglasuk

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress Did you see the videos by Jared Polin? He shot some stuff with f1.2 lens which maintained focus. He also shot some football stuff but the players didn't have helmets. He was getting 90% in focus.

YOUR HANDS ARE DISTRACTING AF

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, I have heard this before, and I am working on it.

Hmm, you and Jared (Fro Knows Photo) were at the same practice with the same athletes, but he seemingly had a much higher success rate AND he was using a 3rd party lens (Sigma 70-200).

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

First he didn't provide statistics. Second, He was shooting pre-teens who weren't moving very fast. When I shot quarterbacks throwing the balls and people just running almost all of the photos were sharp. When I shot wide recievers running at full speed, jumping through the air and putting there hands infront of their face is when the camera didn't keep up.

Small sample pool, operator error, large variation of object movements and lighting condition, make this jarring conclusion less scientific therefore not very convincing, Especially everyone else has been nothing but highly praising R5 in sports action wildlife shooting. Change one setting at a time, and try to keep the action as consistent as possible, shoot similar amount of photos in each comparison. If comparing af performance and hit rate, then rolling shutter is not the problem, the operator is. A sports photographer should know when to use es for what type of sports. Mixing two topics into one with a trolling title won't earn you any more subscribers.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I actually think the AF in this camera works quite well. And I have owned a 1, 1n, 1VHS, 1D, 1D II, 1D III, 1DX2 and every 5D camera, and used most of them to shoot sports at a very high level. I think I may have failed to properly communicate my approach and what I was doing. This has become clear to me as I have seen other people make videos on this topic, claiming almost everything is sharp, when they're shooting easy to focus subjects, like children tossing a football or people running, and then not sharing statistics, but their general impressions. The easiest thing for any camera to do, is track a person running at average speed or running at high speed in a straight line. When I shot these types of scenarios with the camera, maybe 10% of the images were out of focus. But one of the hardest things is to follow a tightly framed subject that is running at full speed, changing direction, jumping vertically and horizontally at the same time, while catching a football, often times with their hands between their face and your camera, plus a ball. So the reason why I focused on the wide receivers and not the quarterbacks, is because it nailed the quarterbacks and I wanted to know how the camera would perform in an extreme situation. As for the electronic shutter, my main conclusion, I fully stand by that evaluation. I would much rather have 12 frames without distortion then risk blowing the shot because rolling shutter has caused something in my frame to look highly distorted. Also after shooting someone in my studio with a helmet on, I realized the camera had trouble finding their face both waist up and chest up, and it could never find the subjects eyes. I would expect that is because the eye to sphere ratio is off and the persons nose and mouth are obstructed. So I don't think face and eye tracking is going to work for football, but this will require more testing and this could have had a great affect on my results. In retrospect, I should have explained where I was coming from and walked people though the images in real time, I thought I was speeding things up by cutting down the images I was showing. However, my evaluation is still valid for how the camera will perform shooting the position in the sport I was shooting.

Unless they make global shutter, eshutter is useless esp. on Sony.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I hear the A9II is good, but I am with you.

@forgewire

3 жыл бұрын

Foto4Max funny that Sony whatever sensor readout speed is about 1/150 sec causing rolling shutter sonyboys unable to notice.

What sort of nonsense is this!? A modern camera review focused on taking...stills!? This is blasphemous!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Can you imagine???????

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Brace yourself! I’ll be making more. 😛

@mrg6424

3 жыл бұрын

John Gress Until recently, no, not at all! Looking forward to more content of this nature. Great & very necessary material!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks!

I think this was user error, I’ll wait for a sports photographers review

@y_h_d1638

3 жыл бұрын

It's correct review.

@barrytakespictures8947

3 жыл бұрын

Y_H_D I’m a sports photographer with an R5 And I’m hitting 95% there’s no way he’s missing so much

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

@Barry please post a video with your results. I think it would hit 95% of the time on some sports, because it did great on quarterbacks throwing and people running but the vast majority of the time I shot wide receivers. It also would have probably done better if I framed it looser. I also plan on testing it with a different focus point and case. What case and focus point are you using?

@barrytakespictures8947

3 жыл бұрын

John Gress auto case and face detect

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I noticed yesterday when photographing someone in my studio wearing a helmet, that the camera could not find his eyes or his face, so I think face and eye detection are not going to work when it comes to football.

Wow. I had no idea the R5 was so terrible in focusing. Think of it, 23%, 15%, 50%, 33%, 34%, and 33% out of focus. My old 30D was worse but every camera I've owned since then (1D Mark III, 1D Mark IV, 1DX, 1DX Mark II) has been better at focusing. Thank you for exposing the R5!!!!

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I actually think the AF in this camera works quite well. And I have owned a 1, 1n, 1VHS, 1D, 1D II, 1D III, 1DX2 and every 5D camera. I think I may have failed to properly communicate my approach and what I was doing. This as become clear to me as I have seen other people make videos on this topic, claiming almost everything is sharp, when they're shooting easy to focus subjects, like children tossing a football or people running. The easiest thing for any camera to do, is track a person running at average speed or running at high speed in a straight line. When I shot these types of scenarios with the camera, maybe 10% of the images were out of focus. But one of the hardest things is to follow a tightly framed subject that is running at full speed, changing direction, jumping vertically and horizontally at the same time, while catching a football, often times with their hands between their face and your camera, plus a ball. So the reason why I focused on the wide receivers and not the quarterbacks, is because I wanted to know how the camera would perform in an extreme situation. Also after shooting someone in my studio with a helmet on, I realized the camera had trouble finding their face both waist up and chest up, and they could never find the subjects eyes. I would expect that is because the eye to sphere ratio is off and the persons nose and mouth are obstructed. So I don't think face and eye tracking is going to work for football, but this will require more testing. In retrospect, I should have explained where I was coming from and walked people though the images in real time, I thought I was speeding things up by cutting down the images I was showing.

AF system was overhyped plain and simple.

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I actually think it works quite well. It nailed simple things, like people running, or throwing a ball, but once I knew it would nail those easy moments, i switched over to one of the most difficult things to AF, so I think the statistics should be seen from that perspective.

@njrtech

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress maybe so but it's no A9 or 1DXMIII

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

@@njrtech Yeah, no one said it was and those small MP cameras are no R5.

Looks more user error to me, if you see other people having perfect tracking with the R5

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

What is the error? Because I would love to fix it.

@siegfriednoet

3 жыл бұрын

@@JohnGress do you normally use Canon camera's ?

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

Yes. Since 1994.

@y_h_d1638

3 жыл бұрын

It's correct review. r5 eletronic shutter cannot be good as A9 is

@JohnGress

3 жыл бұрын

I wonder it it’s even possible today with a large mp sensor.

You lost credibility when you said auto iso.