If you like the work I do, then you can support it here: www.paypal.com/donate?hosted_button_id=D8LSKGJP2NL4N Thank you very much indeed for watching my channel.

@leahmarieezra877

2 жыл бұрын

Question: Sorry to put this here, but could you make a KZread about rank in Sanditon? We are trying to determine if Charlotte is higher ranking than Colbourne. Very Lizzie/Darcy-esque. Thx for your video about rank in P&P!

@dishamukherjee8488

2 жыл бұрын

Hello! I recently discovered your channel and am enjoying the contents of it thoroughly, specially the close readings. A request, would you please consider doing a close reading of what events made Mr Darcy partial and then fall in love with Lizzy? Since we know the narrative from Lizzy's point of view of events unfolded. I would very much love to hear you pick apart the evolution of Mr Darcy's emotions. 😄

@beartladeburca3741

Жыл бұрын

Q

@viktoriyagora6948

2 ай бұрын

Ви

I'd always thought that Lydia was trying to "steal" Mr. Wickham from Lizzie and seemed really proud to have done just that when she came back all gloating about being the youngest but first to be married.

@tomriley5790

2 жыл бұрын

Yes and I think her belief that Lizzie had a high opinion of Wickham served as a character reference for her and probably made her more vulnerable than she might otherwise have been.

@sarasamaletdin4574

2 жыл бұрын

I think in light of this video it’s more that Lydia got a crush on first sight of him and became upset that Elizabeth seemed to like him as well and felt a bit jealous because Wickham gave her attention at first. So she needed to gloat a bit because if she was the main character of the story Elizabeth would have been an antagonist (not that Lydia hated her, but she is the older sister seen more beautiful and respected who Wickham noticed first).

@pamelaschutz1248

7 ай бұрын

Me too. Exactly. Gloating.

@christinehall6441

7 ай бұрын

I think she was a typical young and pleasure bent narcissistic teen. No respect or empathy for the predicament caused to her family members reputations. She was proud of her illicit relationship with Wickham prior to forced marriage.

Isn’t it interesting how for most of the novel, Lydia is practically an exhibitionist when it comes to her attractions and intentions, but when she is at Brighton, her letters to Kitty are secretive? It’s the only time that we are witness to the intimacy between Kitty and Lydia. There’s something sad in the fact that Kitty’s personality is entirely ignored, and that the person she is closest to in the world is her self-absorbed, capricious sister. Also, another reason why the family was not concerned about Lydia’s behavior all along was because Kitty was there, kind of as a built in chaperone. As soon as they are separated, Lydia lets loose.

@MsJubjubbird

2 жыл бұрын

She knows it's wrong. Lizzie and Jane have told her enough times, she has seen how her older relatives behave, she's had an education of some sort, she is the daughter of a gentleman in a god-fearing household and goes to church every week. However, when she writes things she has the capacity to use restraint and think about it, as writing takes time. But when it's action in the moment, everything is immediate so it is harder to check yourself. As her parents fail to do so either, there's no restraint to stop her exposing herself.

@msk-qp6fn

2 жыл бұрын

I honestly felt sorry got Kitty when the story ended. Then again, I guess she is now better off with having more interactions with Elizabeth and Darcy while Mrs Bennet is occupied with Mary.

Videos like this clearly prove that well-written novels like Pride and Prejudice are actually made of several novels hidden into one. I can easily imagine Austen outlining every character's individual journey beforehand and then, from each one, picking only the scenes that serve the general "main" narrative's purpose and filtering them through Lizzy's eyes. This is masterful writing!

@thebuttermilkyway687

2 жыл бұрын

Agree! This is one of the (many) reasons I call her the greatest novelist and this the greatest novel of the English language. She puts it all together. Next to her art, Charles Dickens is just a cartoonist.

@dusty4502

2 жыл бұрын

Interesting. I'd never thought of that but it makes so much sense

@huypt7739

2 жыл бұрын

Wickham has no good reason to run away with Lydia. Weak character; just a weak creation of crisis for Darcy to be a hero and rescue Lizzy indirectly with wow money!!!

@archiewoosung5062

2 жыл бұрын

@@thebuttermilkyway687 Yes, Dickensian female characters are caricatures whereas all of Austen's have the potential of further development

@archiewoosung5062

2 жыл бұрын

@@huypt7739 Surely for Wickham it's more fun to run away from his debts in Brighton with a young girl, even if he soon bores of her...he couldn't care less about her or her family's reputation...demonstrating just how despicable he is.

Since Wickham was the only officer that Lizzie had ever shown any interest in, I always thought Lydia loved the mistaken idea that she was stealing Mr. Wickham away from Lizzie as much as, if not more than, she loved Wickham himself.

"She is a great fool for going away if she liked him" was said about Mary King, but it could have easily been about Lizzy leaving to visit the Colins and leaving Wickham uncontested. I think Lydia is so focused on winning Wickham and competing to miss the fact that Lizzy isn't interested in him. Lydia wants the recognition of being the first married and upstaging her sisters by having the most handsome charismatic husband. I think Lydia still wants to think Lizzy a fool since it boosts how clever she is.

@KathelleStrandom

2 жыл бұрын

Excellent point!

@tomriley5790

2 жыл бұрын

More to this I think initially Lizzie very much was interested. Despite Lydia's resentment of her older sister she clearly had an appreciating of Elizabeths intelligence and sense and this both probably led to her believing Wickham to be more desirable and encouraged her to trust him. I don't think Lydia was in any way aware of the change in Elizabeths opinion or view of him, infact the book goes to quite a bit of trouble to explain that Elizabeth doesn't make the rest of her family aware of Wickham's character. It's not clear if Elizabeth tries to warn Lydia about Wickham (it's not mentioned as far as I remember) eitherway it's likely Lydia would have interpreted it as Lizzie trying to protect her own interest in Wickham.

@Sarana.

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly what I thought as well!

@angelalewis3645

2 жыл бұрын

Very smart! So Lydia, unlike both Mary King and Elizabeth, never “went away,” until she went to Brighton, to which place Mr. Wickham was also going. Good on Lydia for never being a “great fool!” 😂

@lubnah3521

2 жыл бұрын

Zaneel. Hmmm... I had the impression that Lydia didn't notice her sisters much. She did want to be married first or to dance more than her sisters and knew that she was the tallest. But these are general thoughts. I don't think that she was specifically aware of or cared about Liz' interests or feelings.

Adding to this I would argue that while Wickham obviously chooses Lydia because he believes we can get away with seducing her and then most likely abandoning her after he's had his fun, I feel an undercurrent of spiteful revenge against Lizzie since by the time Lydia goes to Brighton it's already clear to Wickham that Lizzie sees through him. I think he sees in Lydia an opportunity to hurt Lizzie before (in his mind) she can damage him by revealing his character to others.

Actually this question has bothered me for a while, and I cannot disagree with your reading of it. Now I know that my shock of Lydia's elopement was due to seeing the whole story through Elizabeth's eyes only. My blindness is rightfully a statement of Austen's writer genius which will never end to surprise me.

This is a truly fascinating analysis, Lizzy actually ignores Lydia as much as possible so her not knowing Lydia’s preference is just right

I can’t imagine the amount of time it takes to pick a topic, thoroughly research it, and script out talking points for a 45+ minute video... and deliver a video almost weekly. But you make it look effortless! Another great video - thank you x 10000!

It's interesting how Lizzie is, in some respects, an unreliable narrator where Lydia and Wickham are concerned. In lumping Lydia and Kitty together, as you point out, we are misdirected into taking Lydia's attachment less seriously. It strikes me that Lizzie takes her sisters, Jane excepted, so unseriously that she exerts minimal attention to understanding their inclinations, and we, as readers, follow her lead.

@jogibson5851

2 жыл бұрын

I've often wondered why Kitty is there at all as a character. Aside from hyperbole - five daughters to marry off somehow seeming very much worse than four - she never seems that essential to the plot, but its clear now that Austen created her with the purpose of misdurecting us. As Dr Cox points out, having not one but two silly girls gushing over Wickham effectively camouflages that one of them actually has such an overwhelming crush on him that she will be persuaded by his seduction of her. Incidentally in the wonderful Lizzie Bennet Diaries - a modern day P&P adaptation done as a vlog - there are just three sisters (Jane, Lizzie, Lydia) while Mary is a first cousin and Kitty is - you guessed it - a cat!

@dorothywillis1

2 жыл бұрын

In spite of being the Heroine, Elizabeth is not perfect. She doesn't notice some things, and misinterprets others, just as we all do.

@EDDIELANE

2 жыл бұрын

Not only that, I think she got this habit from her father.

@chrisd725

2 жыл бұрын

Yes once you point it out like this, Lizzie seems downright neglectful of Lydia, as you say, like Mr Bennet. I feel quite sorry for Lydia. At least Jane and Lizzie paid more attention to Kitty after they got married.

@misscarolinasousa

2 жыл бұрын

What you said about us following Lizzie's lead in what we pay attention to is so spot on. One of the things I love about Austen's writing is everytime we go back, there's a treat, a new layer of meaning that changes things and, consequently, changes us as readers. Following Lizzie's lead in her treatment and perception of Lydia gutted me when watching The Lizzie Bennet Diaries bc at one point I was confronted with how I mistjudged and neglected Lydia.

This is interesting. I had never put Lydia’s behavior in the lottery tickets scene together with Wickam’s gambling. I thought it only to accentuate her being scatterbrained. It is a brilliant touch. No one is better at characterizing “ridiculous”than Austen. Thank you for your analysis. The next time I read P&P, I will notice more subtleties.

@mjamitche5245

2 жыл бұрын

I think Dickens is the best at characterizing "ridiculous". But, Jane Austen's characters are still very vivid while being more realistic.

I believe that Lydia's infatuation with Wickham became more single-minded while Lizzie was staying with Colinses and traveling with the Gardners, and her designs on him were solidified at Brighton. So, naturally, Lizzie would not have seen that attachment and partiality form.

Austen is such an acute writer of families. I wonder if the fact that the older Bennett daughters have more sense of decorum and moral norms than the younger might have some correlation with their father's engagement with parenting. He seems to have been the closest the family had to some kind of moral compass, a post he abandons over time. Jane and Lizzy have a more-or-less accepted view of correct behavior, Mary (seeing the approval the older girls get) goes a bit over the top in the morality department, and Kitty has little and Liddy almost no sense of propriety, being more under the influence of their mother. By the time the younger girls come along, Mr Bennett has practically thrown up his hands and given up, to the point of letting Liddy go off to Brighton with questionable guardians. It isn't really odd that a family of five daughters (or sons, for that matter) should find five such distinctly different personalities and attitudes, at least to anyone who knows large families -- as Austen clearly does.

@SouthCountyGal

2 жыл бұрын

Your interpretation and mine are similar. I think Lizzie and Jane had the most stable early childhood, before Mr. and Mrs. Bennet tired of each other. Mary is the rule enforcer, trying to hold them all together and find some stability. Kitty and Lydia are benignly neglected by their mother and almost completely dismissed by their father. Mrs. Bennet has done what many lonely wives do, making allies of her youngest daughters rather than acting as their parent.

@joanwerthman4116

2 жыл бұрын

Interesting point, although I think the fact only Jane and Elizabeth frequently stayed with the Gardeners had more to do with their superior characters. Their parents would never have made nor set such good examples of propriety or felicity in relations between husband and wife.

@SouthCountyGal

2 жыл бұрын

@@joanwerthman4116 Oh, I like this idea! It makes a lot of sense.

@Ea-Nasir_Copper_Co

2 жыл бұрын

@@joanwerthman4116 Interrstingly, it's quite likely that the Gardiners married when Jane was about 12 or 13, given that their eldest child is eight at Christmas. They would have been role models for Jane and Lizzy during adolescence, but later they may have been too busy with their own growing family to do much for the younger girls.

@helene4397

2 жыл бұрын

Mr Bennet would have not taken any part in raising his daughters. They were solely on the responsibilty of their mother, and if possible nanny.

In the 1995 serial, in all the scenes they are together, Wickham glances at or mentions Lydia. I thought that was an interesting touch implying he was actually interested in HER, not Lizzie. It's interesting to see the opposite is true in the text, I never noticed it before.

It's as if "the officers" was a boys band. Or the cast of a CW sort of TV show aimed at teenagers. They're all pretty and everyday a different one is the favorite, depending who's singing lead in the latest song or who's got the best storyline in the latest episode. And Lydia is a normal 15 year old, but with too much means, too much access and not enough supervision.

@kellysamons3722

21 күн бұрын

Great comparison.

Enjoyed the discussion. It occurs to me that Mrs Bennet and Mrs Phillips were probably very like Kitty and Lydia when young!

Oooooh. I completely missed that Lizzy had not been there and that she ignored Lydia so often that she was not a reliable source on the subject! I also missed the very strong hints about Lydia''s competitiveness. I'm always seeing new points of view and subtlety from these videos,, and I love it. English class was never this interesting!

I think Lydia had her eye on any man in a uniform. In the States, we call girls like her boot-chasers. Lizzie was always trying to rein in Lydia and Kitty's wild antics and I am sure Lydia resented it. Running off with her sister's perceived suitor was a way of getting back at her. She also was tired of being the youngest and wanted her independence. Her friend Mrs. Forster is described (I think by Lizzie) as a very young woman and she was married and free from parental control. Lydia wanted the same.

@susanfabian1521

2 жыл бұрын

I think that Wickham was also getting back at Elizabeth by ruining her sister.

@SchlichteToven

2 жыл бұрын

But then she'd be under her husband's control, and whoever he would turn out to be, he probably wouldn't put up with Lydia flirting with every officer in the regiment. I wonder if Lydia did end up continuing her flirtatious ways after she was married. I don't see why her personality would have changed just because she got married. I would not be at all surprised if she ended up having affairs with other officers.

@heathergarnham9555

2 жыл бұрын

I can see the Wickham marriage essentially being 'open'. While Lydia wouldn't stop her flirting, neither would Wickham. He would continue to seduce young ladies.

@faithworldleader6891

2 жыл бұрын

@@SchlichteToven Yes, but Lydia is not a great thinker and that aspect would have probably alluded her. Also, I think Col. Forster was probably very indulgent with his young wife and she might have thought Wickham would be the same.

@MsJubjubbird

2 жыл бұрын

@@SchlichteToven I don't think she thought that through. She just saw being the first of her sisters to get married and having a wedding where she was the centre of attention. Both Wickham and Lydia were probably not faithful. They also didn't like each other after a while to add fuel to that fire. I think she is boy crazy in general. She wanted Mr Bingley to choose her without having ever seen him. Had he paid attention to her, she would have gone for him. She basically wants to be the centre of attention and she is a woman while the militia are men, so she is an oddity. However, and officer is exciting to her because they're much more accessible in many ways and there is the whole knight in shining armour thing. Wickham is very alluring to start with- but then people want what they can't have and they particularly want what others have- and because he pursues Lizzie then Mary, she wants him even more. He's the top prize rather than her love interest. While she prefers him, it's not deep feelings and more a trophy- "I got him and married him while you both lost him ha ha". Had someone Frank Churchill-like rocked up in regimentals, she'd feel the same and replace Wickham.

“And Mary King is safe.” 😂 I love this line. I am fond of the idea that someone who cared about Mary King got wind of who Wickham was and decided “eff that- you are going to your uncle’s, wether you like it or not.”

I think Lydia had her eye on him only after Elizabeth showed interest.

@DrOctaviaCox

2 жыл бұрын

Lydia certainly refers to him to Lizzy as "a certain person *we all* like!" (ch.39). What she doesn't seem to notice in this scene, though, is that Lizzy has gone off him somewhat.

@janet8418

2 жыл бұрын

@@DrOctaviaCox I think Mr. Wickham never loved Lydia, right? And-Lydia was in love with love.

@prairieN

2 жыл бұрын

@@janet8418 yes, Wickham seems incapable of loving anyone but himself

@lisamedla

2 жыл бұрын

@@janet8418 in the end I think it says that her affection for him lasted longer than his.

Wow, seeing now for how long Lydia was interested in Wickham and then remembering your video about his motives/plans, I feel really sorry for her. Her parents failed her horribly! And it's really interesting to see how the "narrator" is so much Lizzy's perspective that so many things are glossed over!

Just starting this video. My impression of Lydia’s infatuation with Wickham is that she was raised by a woman of little understanding whose primary goal was to get her daughters married off as quickly as possible. Lydia is also young and full of high animal spirits, whatever that means. I think it means that she was an impulsive teenager with a pretty good sex drive and nothinj in her character to restrain her. That combined with her monther’s goal made it inevitable that she was going to elope with a mr wickham type.

It’s wonderful of Austen to tell us that the only thing higher in Lydia’s esteem than Wickham is a game of chance. In a way they’re a great match, since they both care about gambling and the pleasure of risk more than for other people.

@geraldineallen

5 ай бұрын

I think that's what makes them perfect for each other. they both get what they deserve!

While I admit, it has been years since I read the novel, but do pull out the 1995 classic quite often. I remember Lydia snipping at Lizzy, “Are going you Wickham all to yourself, Lizzy?” That was my first clue that indeed she fancied him from their first meeting. After, watching your videos going in-depth, I find I watch the film with a greater understanding and through new lens.

Another fascinating lecture - thank you. At the risk of going "off-topic", something the significance of which, in all the times I've read this novel, I've somehow missed: in Jane's second letter to Lizzy, she writes "Poor Kitty has anger for having concealed the attachment but as it was a matter of confidence, one cannot wonder". This really is Jane speaking and shows what a reliable person she is - when, later, the (now) Lydia Wickham describes her wedding to Jane and Lizzy and reveals that Darcy was at present, she (Lydia) immediately is worried because she wasn't supposed to disclose that fact. Jane tells her to say no more of the matter (much to Lizzy's frustration) - and this is entirely of a piece with her sympathy for Kitty for not breaking confidences gained from Lydia's letters.

@msk-qp6fn

2 жыл бұрын

That moment honestly hit the nail on the coffin for my sympathy for Kitty.

@michaellaun3965

3 ай бұрын

I am not totally convinced of the conclusions. For example: I think it could be possible that on the return from Kent Elizabeth had a more selective hearing of Wickham's name due to the shocking tales of Wickham’s past. Due to Lydia's flighty attraction to the officers (flirting with six at once) I perceive that the more serious attraction to Wickham in Brighton resulted from the torn gown which Mrs. Forster should have repaired before sending Lydia her possessions after her elopement. The mention of the gown is not accidental. I could imagine that the tear occurred during a more aggressive sexual interaction between Wickham and Lydia. For Lydia it would mean she would have to marry Wickham and to do that accompany him on his flight from Brighton. That would be the origin of the elopement. To have Kitty know of that altercation would require that it would have had to happen a few days before the elopement.

If Mr Collins started at the beginning of Fordyce's Sermons, at the foot of page three he would have read that it was not "gold, nor emeralds, nor purple, but modesty, gravity and decent deportment that can truly adorn a woman." I'm sure we can all agree. Alas that Lydia should not have marked the lesson.

Ah!! I had recently reread Pride and Prejudice after watching your video on why Wickham eloped with her, and noticed for the first time all the little moments where she shows an interest in him. Every time I go back to her work, I'm more convinced Austen's skill as a writer was so ahead of her contemporaries.

I've read this book so many times, and you still manage to teach me things I've overlooked. Highly enjoyed this video.

Captain Carter, we barely knew ye. 😂

@DrOctaviaCox

2 жыл бұрын

A lucky escape, perhaps.

@kahkah1986

2 жыл бұрын

@@DrOctaviaCox for Captain Carter

Thank you for returning to Pride and Prejudice. I am interested in your thoughts ( if any) about the similarity and parallels between the characters and personalities of Lady Catherine and Mrs Bennett. They are both monsters, crass , socially inept and selfish. Another parallel is the marriage proposals of Mr Collins and D’Arcy. Both are self serving lectures to Elizabeth on their own motivations and requirements.

Love your analyses. I have a question off the Lydia-Wickham issue. Would Elizabeth and Darcy have become engaged without the intervention of Lady Catherine at Longbourn? Darcy says as much: "It taught me to hope..". The narrator voice says explicitly "She [Lizzy] soon learnt that they were indebted for their good understanding to the efforts of his aunt..." (Chap XVI) However, Chap XVIII reveals they almost made a hash of it. Lizzy: "...what made you so reluctant to come to the point at last" Darcy: "Because you were grave and silent and gave me no encouragement"

@markbooth2860

2 жыл бұрын

​@A Byron Thank you A Byron for your enthusiastic support for my question. You clearly have unique and discerning intelligence.

Lydia is boy-crazy in general, but given that Wickham has a type (young, easily gullible), she was easy for Wickham to manipulate. I thought that Lydia had a thing for Lieutenant Denny, though. She seems to flirt with several of the militia. What sucks, though, is her age. Lydia is 15-16 and she has no clue about consent or power imbalance. Something that Austen may not have been aware of is that soldiers that were stationed in Newcastle often got sent to the front lines. I'd like to think that in the future, Wickham died in combat, leaving an older Lydia to learn how to think more critically about life. And that she'll find a better love with a more stable soldier.

@prairieN

2 жыл бұрын

I love this!

@lasentinal

2 жыл бұрын

The age of concent in the UK, was 12 until 1875, when it was raised to 13. It was raised to 16 in 1885.

@laurenturner3578

2 жыл бұрын

There is some indication of their future - if I remember correctly, Jane Austen indicated that they had several children, Wickham was kicked out of the army for his profligacy, and they spent much of their lives mooching off their family, especially Jane and Bingley, who were too kind to get rid of them quickly.

@thebuttermilkyway687

2 жыл бұрын

Jane never put anything in her novels without a reason. I'm certain she knew of that detail, like innumerable others that she put in (it takes a dedicated reader years to uncover them).

@marietgagliardi

2 жыл бұрын

Lydia would not make a very good wife. I imagine she will always be chasing after some man. She and Wickham deserve each other

I am an older sister of sisters. I did experience my younger sister being very interested in the young man I was dating, as I started dating, when she was too young to start dating herself. She was trying to compete with me. And to this day this behavior still defines our relationship. It is annoying to say the least. But perhaps such is the fate of younger sisters. It does not stop at trying to get the attention of the young man who walked me home, but to having better education, to having a better house, .... better everything. Exhausting for her. Jane Austen wrote the part of Lydia very well.

@catherineleclair3450

Жыл бұрын

French anthropologist René Girard wrote of "mimetic rivalry", which may well apply here - both in Jane Austen's novel and the situation you have personally experienced.

@JudyBarrette

Жыл бұрын

@@catherineleclair3450 Thanks. I was not aware of this. Interesting thought.

love this investigation Dr Cox. In Austen, every word counts. I had forgotten ever reading about the cross-dressing incident. You make such a good point - this incident foreshadows Lydia's tendency to ignore conventional behavior and courtship roles. Listening, I was shocked that Colonel Forster would have allowed his wife's newfound female friends to humiliate the most senior male servant in his house (known by his surname Chamberlayne, not first name, therefore in a senior position and possibly employed by the Colonel for a long time) This servant might have been much older than the girls and Mrs Forster. The intention of the prank was for this presumably trustworthy employee to be put on show and laughed at. How would this senior employee have felt to be made into a laughing stock? as a servant he did not have a choice about participating, he had to do what his boss Mrs Forster ordered. The Meryton girls hardly know this servant, but this does not excuse why they have zero concern for his feelings. Were these teenagers standing watching while this man changed his clothes? he would had to have been touched by the girls, e.g be physically laced into the dress, as he would certainly not have known how to adjust the outfit, the jewellery and the cap properly. This kind of physical contact is something a non-related female might do to a child, but not to a grown man, no officer would have agreed to be gussied up like this in respectable mixed company, and the girls know it. The insensitivity, the disrespect for another human being inherent in this "joke" is absolutely appalling. It is a portent of what was to happen later at Brighton. Mrs Bennet later laments that there must have been some impropriety at Brighton by the Forsters, to cause Lydia to elope. She is absolutely right. This playing dressups with servants, as if they were dolls, is exactly the sort of boundary-crossing thing that went on in the Forster household, which allowed Lydia to consider and choose elopement, against all her upbringing. If it was exciting and different, the Forster set were in. Never mind how other people would be affected. No wonder that monumental selfishness and callous disregard for her entire family's feelings is what we remember most about Lydia.

@coloraturaElise

2 жыл бұрын

This is an interesting perspective, and clearly the Forster's household was not the place to keep Lydia in check. But are we sure about Chamberlayne being the servant's surname, and of his age? The story is told about one of the two Harrington sisters having to stay at home and Pen coming by herself to Mrs. Forster's dance. My impression is that they dress up a young servant, perhaps a page boy, who could pass as a young girl, to fool the company who were expecting Pen's sister to be there. The fact that none of the men recognized him seems to bear this out; had he been and older man, no one would have been fooled.

@londongael

2 жыл бұрын

@@coloraturaElise That was my impression, too. He'd have to be young enough not to shave. I'm pretty sure Chamberlayne is his surname. It is a little shocking, though I imagine he would have been able to refuse if he really hadn't wanted to do it - he'd have to co-operate in order to fool the officers.

@a24-45

2 жыл бұрын

@@coloraturaElise I agree that the servant may have been younger. I do have the impression that Austen uses first names for young servants, although I am ready to stand corrected on this aspect of Regency idiom. I did wonder if Mrs Phillip's gown was selected because she is a middle-aged woman, which would have made her clothes more believable on a mature man; whereas Mrs Forster's dresses would have been fashionably youthful and might have looked odd on an older person. But Mrs phillip's gown may have been chosen simply because her clothes were a larger size, and therefore had a better chance of fitting a male. (Mrs Forster may simply have been too petite for her dresses to be worn by a male, even though dresses of the day could expand to accommodate a full pregnancy). I do wonder whether the officers were actually taken in by the servant's costume, despite Lydia's gleeful insistence that they were. As gentlemen, they would have been too polite to comment on or react to the singular appearance (and voice!) of the "lady" they were introduced to. And as bachelors, they might see benefits of giving the appearance of having been outsmarted, in order to flatter the young ladies. Lydia wouldn't think of that, of course; she is too caught up in the "success" of the joke.

@a24-45

2 жыл бұрын

@@londongael I don’t think we can assume that Chamberlayne could refuse to participate without consequences. The Forsters may perhaps have been very caring, forgiving and accommodating employers; but military households like the Colonel’s could also have an uncompromising and punitive management style (see Northanger Abbey). In an era of high unemployment, no social security, no unions or industrial tribunals or decent labour laws, employers of the time could and did make unreasonable demands of their staff, and staff just had to accept it or get the sack. I'm pretty certain that being expected to cross-dress to entertain your boss's guests was not a normal part of the job description of a servant working at a typical gentleman's residence; so it’s not unreasonable for the listener to consider the likelihood that most servants would have been reluctant to do it. If Chamberlayne didn’t mind or even enjoyed cross-dressing, then of course there would have been no problem -- but, thanks to Lydia’s lack of empathy, blindness to the feelings of others, and her obsession with herself that her narrative displays, we are told nothing about this aspect that is so critical to our understanding of what actually happened at the Forsters’. We are stuck with Lydia’s blinkered version of events. That girl is so frustrating.

@londongael

2 жыл бұрын

@@a24-45 Yes, it could have been like that - I'm not saying it couldn't. As you say, we just don't know. The glimpses we get of the servants in Austen's work are fascinating.

I love the way Austen writes from the bias of specific characters, sometimes blatantly, and sometimes more subtly. It is part of what makes her writing such a fun jesting of the foibles she obviously saw in the people around her. Whether she’s sarcastically pointing out that three women cannot dance half the evening with one man, or she is carefully avoiding direct mention of Lydia’s activities while Elizabeth is naturally distracted by her own concerns, Austen does such an incredible job of emulating specific characters in the narrative voice by turns, while maintaining that outside perspective that allows both narrator and reader to laugh at the characters.

Thank you for sharing your analysis on KZread. So interesting and increases my love of and interest in Jane Austen and her novels.

Finding Dr Octavia Cox’s videos (and the associated comments below) has been the next best thing to discovering a new Jane Austen novel. Thank you xx

On reflection, there could be another contributing factor to the emotional expression of Darcy and Elizabeth on the "walk out", apart from the Lady Catherine's role. Lizzy thanks Darcy for his assistance in the case of Lydia. This leads to Darcy's very warm and frank "I thought only of you". And that seems to have opened the dam to expression: his profession of unchanged "affections and wishes". And the rest is history. Darcy, however, later claims (chap XVIII) that Lizzy's expression of gratitude had no material impact. He claims that given the Lady Catherine's intelligence he was "determined at once to know everything " [concerning Lizzy's feelings presumably].

Poor Kitty, always in a supporting role. I'd love an analysis of her character, if there is enough in the text to work with-she's always been a favourite of mine!

I think Lydia was infatuated with Wickham, and I think Lizzy was also right that it didn't take much to snare Lydia. He was the third named interest of hers in a relatively short period of time, and while she hadn't moved on from him yet, there were plenty of reasons for him to keep her interest at least until he finally decided to take her up on it. First he was new and handsome, then he paid attention to Lizzy, then he was part of the anti-Darcy sentiments, then there was his mercenary behavior, and being a major object of gossip and being perceived as being of interest to Lizzy is, I think, enough to explain Lydia's interest, and her frequent mentions of him. Had he not had the opportunity or wish to "acquire" Lydia, I believe she would've eventually moved on to number four. She wasn't exactly being subtle about any of her favorites, but the first two didn't act on it, while he did, and so it goes. So Lizzy wasn't paying her particular attention, but she also wasn't wrong.

I've watched a few of your videos on P&P. I've enjoyed the book for the story's sake, concentrating on Lizzie and Darcy and the scandal, without really thinking too much about sub-plots and hints of the supporting characters. Thanks so much for opening it all up and making it even more enjoyable 😁

Another wonderful analysis! I know this book backwards and forwards yet your observations always show something I haven't noticed before. JA truly is inexhaustible!

Very interesting video, as always! I love how many subtle subplots are hidden in this novel, so much to discover!

Lydia wanted to be the first of her sisters to be married. She was tired of being last of 5. And she zeroed in on Wickham because he was Lizzy's favorite.

John Mullan talks about the use of the titles of "Mr, Mrs, Miss" and how important the formality if these titles are. So the fact that she drops the Mr is a clue in itself that she's become more informal with Wickham, but to add "dear" too.... Huge alert to the readers of Austen's time!

@Eloraurora

Жыл бұрын

Great point! Like Emma getting mad at Mrs. Elton for calling Mr. Knightley just "Knightley."

@ellie698

Жыл бұрын

@@Eloraurora Indeed. There more closely you can get into the mindset of Jane Austen's contemporaries, her first readers, the more each word brings new levels of meaning. In Austen every single word counts. She lived in a time of letter writing, where the *receiver* had to pay the postage. So she was acutely aware of how valuable space on the page was when putting pen to paper! To receive a letter from Jane would really be something. 😏

When I read your question, I immediately said, out loud, in the locker room, "No. Not always." I'll see if I'm right probably when I get home

I love the way you explain things like this. I have read this book many times, and I have never picked up on things like the way the narrative draws the reader's attention away from Lydia's attraction to Wickham. I read along, going where Austen wants me to go. Your explanations make the book so much more fun. Thank you!

I get a slightly different impression from Jane Austen's representation of Lydia's attentions. I feel like she means to show the mood of the town through Lydia, since Elizabeth is often around her, and Wickham's popularity is crucial to the plot. In particular, I think she means to show how Mr. Darcy's omission allowed these kinds of unfair preferences to continue, while also painting Lydia as rather superficial: being obsessed with the most popular man in town, beyond any of the encouragement she may have gotten from other officers. However you did strike on something very interesting, which made me think. The wording indicated that Lydia "needed only encouragement," and later it is said that Wickham may have been flirting with half the town. Is it possible Wickham was more forward with his attentions towards Lizzy, while still taking plenty of opportunities to flirt with whomever was around? Certainly he had to perfect his talents somehow....

@Nicciolai

2 жыл бұрын

I agree, and I reckon neither of them would have been particularly faithful after the marriage either. Doesn't mean that they wouldn't have necessarily enjoyed each other's company. So many depictions show him getting sick of her, but they both like gambling, going out and spending. They would've made a great pair of scammers.

@katherinewilson1853

Жыл бұрын

@@Nicciolai I got the same impression. That they were simply hedonistic, and he probably regretted his marriage immediately, but it didn't mean he didn't turn it into an opportunity.

@k.h.6991

Жыл бұрын

​@@Nicciolai we are told at the end of the novel that 'Lidia never lost the respectability her marriage had given her.' this clearly implies that she did not stray.

Thank you for such a close engagement with the text, allowing the reader/listener to see the power of carefully selected and intentional language along with the realistic development and placement (appearance and disappearance) of characters and their dialog to the advancement of the plot. Austin's work has the same sense of cinema as Tolstoy's work and the same sense of moral satisfaction as Shakespeare's comedies. Incomparable. You help your audience to understand this. 'Good job, Dr. Cox.

I always suspected that Lydia's interest was strengthened and somewhat motivated by Wickham's interest in Elizabeth. She was competitive, and I think she wanted to prove herself better than her more intelligent and decorous older sisters. She tries to get some jealousy out of Elizabeth after the marriage, but is too dull-witted to realize that she has failed at that. You make a good point that Lizzy was too absorbed in her own feelings to notice Lydia's preference. One might add that she would never have considered Lydia competition in the same way Lydia saw her as competition, perhaps showing some arrogance or vanity. But the way the book is written, I think we're meant to understand that Elizabeth _was_ superior to Lydia in every way, and if she had wanted Wyckham, she could have had him. For my own part, while I don't agree with every judgment of Lydia, I do find the character insufferably lacking in self-awareness, intelligence, and concern for others. She never even glimpses how close she took herself and her sisters to ruin. I figure she eventually had to learn how mercantile her husband was about marrying her, or at least that he's neither an honorable man nor especially in love with her.

@Nicciolai

2 жыл бұрын

or with the lack of self-reflection become quite mercantile too. He's well over 10 years older than her and if he was smart, he'd have got her into his scams, and she would've probably seen it all as a lark. Many women in history have become their criminal husband's sidekick and I reckon she'd have been game.

I haven’t tuned in to Dr. Cox’s channel for many months. My mistake: her talks never fail to impress me. If you are a real Austen admirer then this channel should be a regular destination for you -.as there are so many new insights to be gleaned from these videos.

I enjoyed this very much! I’ve read the book a number of times but was always distracted by Lizzie’s point of view. I assumed much of Lydia’s motivation to have more to do with stealing him away from Lizzie (in Lydia’s imagined point of view) but wasn’t entirely satisfied. I agree with your analysis, and appreciate the in-depth dive into the text. I plan to read Pride & Prejudice again with a clearer head.

Wow! Jane Austen really is master of misdirection. Lydia running off with Wickham really isn't as surprising as we often believe. But since we are looking through Lizzie's eyes, and Lizzie has detached herself from Wickham's charms discounting the signs that there is more between Lydia and Wickham, we miss the clues. This close reading actually makes me lose what little respect I had for Lydia. Granted, she is just a child, but a little narcissist in training! What this reading makes clear is that Lydia's elopement with Wickham was not the result of a momentary infatuation, but a carefully considered and manipulated action. Viewed in that light, and with all that manipulation, Lydia really should have done much better than Wickham! Lydia practically stalks Wickham and gets lots of info on his comings and goings, but somehow misses who/what he really is, perhaps because he is so much like her. Much is made of Lydia's similarity to her mother, but Mrs. Bennet is much smarter than Lydia. Mrs. Bennet hammered into Lydia (and the others) the importance of marriage. But Lydia misses the key component to that concern, the practical aspect of it. Mrs. Bennet used her youthful charms to find a man who raised her social status, owned an estate, provided quite well for her and her children, and appears to be a faithful husband. Lydia gets a man who diminished her social status, will keep her moving a step ahead of homelessness, will always be in debt, and will most certainly cheat on her. Actually, Lydia does not "get" Wickham. If all had gone according to his plan, he would have seduced Lydia and left her in London. Even after being discovered, that is still his plan. Absent Darcy's bribes, Wickham would not ever have married Lydia. That she continues to be unaware of this is astounding.

@erinsanders4449

2 жыл бұрын

Mrs. Bennet got done dirty in p&p. She was irritating yes, but nowhere near as stupid and flighty as She is portrayed. Mr bennet gets all the praise from lizzie's bias, but he really was a bad father. Well, irresponsible anyway. Not through malice. But still very damaging to their future prospects. It's interesting that we see lizzy lose the rose coloured glasses when she finally has an example of a guy who gets things done for his family. (The financial disparity is kind of glossed over of cpurse)

@ritan2

2 жыл бұрын

I think Mrs. Bennet is every bit as bad as she is portrayed. Perhaps bad isn't the right word, because she generally isn't a mean spirited person, but she is stupid, vulgar, rude, ignorant, and an all around useless parent. I think the real issue is that Mr. Bennet isn't portrayed as badly as he should be. While Mrs. Bennet is just dumb, Mr. Bennet's failings are more moral failings. Mr. Bennet does get off light, especially in the many films. I think Jane Austen is harder on him than modern filmmakers. Despite being funny and witty (and some of the book's best lines come from his mouth), he is clearly not a good parent and not a particularly good husband. He was charmed by the beautiful young Mrs. Bennet and made a bad choice in marrying her. Despite that, he allows Mary, Kitty, and Lydia to become as empty headed and useless as their mother. He allows/encourages his daughters to disrespect their mother, and he fails to guide and discipline them (even when warned by Lizzy). He fails to see Jane's heartbreak, even mocking it. And most importantly in Austen's eyes, he does not invest in his daughters' futures, leaving them at the mercy of Mr. Collins for their future financial security. Both are equally bad parents (a staple of Austen's novels), but his wit and love for Lizzie make Mr. Bennet seem a bit better than Mrs. Bennet. But the ultimate villain in Austen's world is a man who does not care for his female dependents - and that is certainly Mr. Bennet. I don't think Lizzie ever had rose colored glasses with respect to her father. As a witty person herself, he appreciates his wit. She loves him deeply and they share a special bond, but but she has always been aware and embarrassed by his shortcomings, hence her intense response to Darcy's letter, but most especially when Mr. Bennet carelessly disregards her advice not to let Lydia go to Brighton.

@erinsanders4449

2 жыл бұрын

@@ritan2 thank you. I agree with what you said.

@gayzell850

Жыл бұрын

@@erinsanders4449I agree. Mrs. Bennet was keenly aware of the consequences of the entailment which is why she was so insistent on Lizzie marrying Mr. Collins and why she was always complaining about it to Mr. Bennet since he was complicit in it being put in place.

@cg8397

24 күн бұрын

​@@gayzell850No, the entail would've been put in place by the male ancestor who originally acquired and built on the property. Mr. Bennet could've had it removed but that would require legal assistance, including paying off Mr. Collins a sum equivalent to what the property was worth.

Just one question that had not occurred to me before- why doesn't Elizabeth tell her father Mr. Bennet about Wickham's past. The book goes to quite a lot of detail about her not feeling it was proper to embarras Georgiana by informing "her general acquaintance" but she does tell Jane and was very aware of Lydia being in danger if she went away with the regiment. I also discovered recently that Pride and Prejudice was the only book Austen published where she sold the copywright rather than on comission so she only made a fraction of the profit, seems awfully sad for such a great book. Another point given that at the time reading novels was considered frivilous (and Pride and Prejudice was considered to be so!) I think that Mr Collins sermons, Lydia's fate (although averted) and indeed to an extent Mr Darcy's response to Elizabeths rejection of him were an atempt to ensure that Pride and Prejudice didn't seem to condone scandalous behaviour/impropriety. I can see a formidable aunt being pointed to these passages in order to be persuaded that Pride and Prejudice was "improving literature" and served to point out the dangers to young women of running off with dashing young officers :-) !

I always thought Lydia had affection for him and was the main driver behind her going with him on their “elopement”

Thank you for your analysis! I have really never noticed Lydia continuously mentioning Wickham! This is interesting

I very much enjoyed this video. I've read many of the comments and have noticed that Lydia is described as 'boy-crazy'. We never talk about boys being 'girl-crazy', yet my understanding is that post-puberty hetero boys spend an awful lot of time thinking about girls/women and what they'd like to do with them. Lydia is out-going, gregarious, and has few (any?) inhibitions. But is she any more interested in men than other girls - without the ability to follow boy bands? I think part of her flirtatious behaviour is about enjoying attention and getting power, such as it is, through her sexuality. She appears to have limited interests other than chasing men, but what did she do before she hit puberty? If a girl like her were alive today (and I'm sure there are many) and had better parenting, an education, and the much greater opportunity to direct her energy in other directions, might she have been different? Or would she only be posting selfies all the time and be vulnerable to online sexual predators? I'd like to think that with the right guidance she'd at least have got into drama or basketball. Edit: Immediately after posting this I found this video, The Psychology of Lydia Bennet (which I hope Dr. Cox won't mind me adding because I think her video and the other work well together) kzread.info/dash/bejne/pZqFtMmictuboc4.html

It's always been a point of interest to me as one of the most pronounced faults in Lizzy that, when Charlotte marries Collins, Lizzy is extremely shocked and disappointed in her. She can't imagine being so mercenary and marrying for money and security rather than love. It actually takes a lot of time for her to sort of 'forgive' Charlotte for it and act as usual by the time she visits her. But when it looks like Wickham is doing the same, the guy who was just buzzing around her, she waves it away as how things are and how it's only right that he should try to be with someone that would give him money and security even if he doesn't love them. It's interesting that she's so blinded that even him slighting her, honestly in a worse way than Darcy did, is treated as nothing, but in anyone else, the same behavior is abhorrent. A lot of the other things are from her having been deceived or anger from the bad things Darcy actually did, but this is an instance of open hypocrisy on her part that has no excuse.

@liliax9147

2 жыл бұрын

I wonder if she doesn’t seem to care since she is not as invested in him? I should really reread the book!

@londongael

2 жыл бұрын

Lizzy enjoys Wickham's attention, but she doesn't care about him the way she does about Charlotte. I don't think she considers Charlotte mercenary, as such - just that she can't imagine voluntarily being stuck with a partner she couldn't at least respect, even for material security. She knows Charlotte is intelligent, and that Mr Collins is a fool. She's seen how that pans out, for different reasons, in the marriage of her own parents.

@NoGirlsOnTheInternet

2 жыл бұрын

@@londongael There are a few lines that kinda made me think it's a bit more than just knowing Charlotte won't be happy. "She had always felt that Charlotte's opinion of matrimony was not exactly like her own, but she could not have supposed it possible that, when called into action, she would have sacrificed every better feeling to worldly advantage. Charlotte the wife of Mr. Collins was a most humiliating picture! And to the pang of a friend disgracing herself and sunk in her esteem, was added the distressing conviction that it was impossible for that friend to be tolerably happy in the lot she had chosen." Charlotte's unhappiness is more the icing on the cake rather than the whole of it. There's also shortly after that; "Between Elizabeth and Charlotte there was a restraint which kept them mutually silent on the subject; and Elizabeth felt persuaded that no real confidence could ever subsist between them again. Her disappointment in Charlotte made her turn with fonder regard to her sister, of whose rectitude and delicacy she was sure her opinion could never be shaken" She's outright bitter and angry that her friend chose money and security over love, but doesn't feel any of that upset with Wickham, who she also believes to be upstanding and good.

@ritan2

2 жыл бұрын

I don't think that this is quite fair. Lizzy doesn't feel that Charlotte is being mercenary; that's not the source of her disappointment. Her disappointment stems from her settling for a man as awful as Mr. Collins. Lizzie had always known that Charlotte's views on matrimony was not the same as hers, but she didn't think it would cause her to sink as low as Mr. Collins. She forgets for a while that Charlotte, a plain, older woman without a fortune who is past the usual marrying age and about to become a burden on her parents, does not have a lot of options. Lizzy recognizes that many people marry for money; that's not what she finds abhorrent. It is the deceit and disrespect that causes people to marry without affection or respect. She doesn't let Wickham off the hook for dropping her for Mary King and her 10k. She just isn't upset about it because she is already becoming aware of what he really is - she doesn't really care about him. That's why she accepts what Darcy says about Wickham so easily; she already had a sense that all was not as it seemed. And there really is no comparison between Wickham and Charlotte. Charlotte accepted the reality of Regency society and marriage for women. She only sought a good establishment and she was honest in attaining it. *And she held down her part of the bargain.* Charlotte is a good, no, an excellent wife. On the other hand, Wickham uses deceit and manipulation to achieve his goal of riches. Despite having lots of honorable options, he lies, cheats and steals until it catches up to him and then he leaves. He does not hold his part of the bargain, and he is certainly not a good husband.

I love this explanation of Lydia and Mr Wickham. I've read Pride and Prejudice probably a dozen times and am still surprised to have that relationship explained in this way. I really enjoy your chanel, Dr Cox.

The detail here is just amazing! Continually in awe of Miss Austen and you, Dr Cox, thank you for another wonderful video!

Thank you so much for sharing this! I absolutely can't read subtext in books so this is super interesting

I can't help but think that Wickham took off with Lydia to spite Elizabeth.

@artwriter76

2 жыл бұрын

Yes, I've always felt that was part of his reasoning, and a further snub at Darcy too.

I would have loved to have seen a continuation or Part II of this Novel. To whom would have the other two girls marry? Lydia and Wickham’s marriage unraveling? The mother’s lack of class, immaturity and lax rein on Lydia and Kitty really showed in the girls! Surprised that the first two young women turned out fairly well. Mary was in her own world.

@dorothywillis1

2 жыл бұрын

Mary married one of Uncle Phillips' clerks. Kitty married a clergyman who had a parish near Pemberley.

@londongael

2 жыл бұрын

@@dorothywillis1 ah, good to know! 😂

Great Video !! I would love so much if you made a video on this subject : "Did Mr Wickham notice that Darcy loved Lizzy? And is this one of the reasons he eloped with Lydia ??" Thank you for your good work !

That was fun! Seeing the illustrations, some of which I own too, made me appreciate them even more.

Do you think that Lydia Bennet had her eye particularly on Mr Wickham while in Meryton?

@nickwilliams7547

2 жыл бұрын

Hi Octavia. I think Lydia certainly had her eye on Wickham from the moment she first saw him, but I'm sure she would have transferred her admiration to another officer had he actively snubbed her. She seems to be more keen on the general idea of a man in regimentals than on a particular individual, and once snubbed by him she would have soon shrugged it off and moved on to the next Wickham, Carter or Denny.

@londongael

2 жыл бұрын

Yes, but that would probably have faded when the next handsome young officer came along, if Wickham hadn't encouraged her, as he presumably does, in Brighton. Lydia doesn't seem capable of falling seriously in love. That said, I think the elopement was her idea - Wickham just wants to leave town in a hurry, to escape his debts. Suddenly, Lydia is there, and the easiest way to keep her quiet is to take her with him - certainly, he has no intention of marrying a girl without money. I sometimes wonder if Lydia is quite right in the head. She is literally unable to take anything seriously. There is a range of senses of humour in this "light, bright and sparkling" novel - Mr Bennet is too caught up in his own clever, sardonic humour to be a good parent, Lydia simply sees everything as a joke, several characters, including Jane and Mary, have no sense of humour at all. Elizabeth and Darcy eventually balance each other out - he learns to take himself less seriously and she to temper her wit with a bit of humility. Food for thought, as always, in this video. I had noticed, and found very odd, the cross-dressing incident, but just put it down to the questionable company. The point you make about the blurring of gender roles is illuminating.

@susanrobertson984

2 жыл бұрын

Indeed I do. She was jealous of his attentions to Lizzy. Don’t hog him, she says at some point.

@briteddy9759

2 жыл бұрын

Yes and no! Yes Lydia was infatuated with Mr. Wickham, but had he disappeared from the picture, she would have moved on to someone else just like she did from Mr. Carter to Mr. Denny to Mr. Wickham. She is only 16. It would worry me to no end if she was my daughter or granddaughter! But I see her first and foremost as a wild teenager in need of parental guidance!

@londongael

2 жыл бұрын

Replying to own comment to add that it's similar to other "out of the blue" elopements and relationships in Austen's novels - all subtly seeded, when you look back. Julia Bertram and Mr Yates, Penelope Clay and Mr Elliot, and, the tour de force, Jane Fairfax and Frank Churchill.

Thank you for your fascinating videos, which always go so I'm depth. I'd been influenced by the 1995 BBC adaptation, which showed Mr Denny being her main guy, so it was good to look closely at the actual text.

This is one of my favorite analyses so far, because I know it will change how I read the novel the next time.

I truly enjoy your thorough delving into Jane Austin's stories. Thank you so much.

Great. Thank you. So clearly and nicely put. My enjoyment of this and other novels by Jane Austen I have read has been enhanced by your close readings. I had not clocked quite a lot!

I think we're meant to sort of miss Lydia going on about Mr. Wickham, but it was always clear to me - from the moment she pouts over his pursuit of Ms. King - that she's quite put out to have met a masculine version of herself. Yay narcissism. There's definitely also an aspect of the relationship that is BOTH of them sort of 'sticking it' to Lizzie; Wickham, being slighted when she calls him out, and knowing how Darcy feels (he's also revenging himself on Darcy), and Lydia, because her older sister has everything she actually wants (family approval, attention, freedom, etc). Austen is careful about it, but it's clear that Lydia and Wickham are both not great people. Wickham is just farther along.

@prairieN

2 жыл бұрын

Although Lydia is a child and being self absorbed and not having capacity for understanding long term consequences is age appropriate I always saw her as an indulged but also neglected (by her father) child who would have been very susceptible to predators like Wickham

@Mr3kiwis

2 жыл бұрын

We have to be careful not to judge Austen's time by our own. At fifteen, back then you were no longer a child. Lydia would have been considered a young woman of (just) marriageable age. Our modern expectation that at 15, you'll be an immature, self-absorbed brat (aka "a teenager") does nothing to help our young people to develop adult qualities. I know girls of 15 who are sensible, friendly, responsible and can put aside their own wishes to help to take care of the house and younger siblings. I realise they are the exception in our day and age but a lot of it has to do with upbringing.

@mjamitche5245

2 жыл бұрын

@@Mr3kiwis I agree with you. I see a lot of very decent girls now days at 15. In fact, I think many are better at age 15 than a few years later in college. I don't know if that has to do with the temperance of being at home, being put in charge of things in the household and younger siblings by parents, but still not able to drive or spend much time away from home. I do find that more girls with nice families and good parents are getting into trouble at ages 18, 19 or 20 now days.

I love your channel. It makes me see characters and passages in a new way, and see clues that I can't believe I missed once you bring them to light.

Another awesome lecture! Thank you for this channel.

This is the second pride and prejudice video I've watched of yours in a row. These are fantastic! Thank you!! I love this!

I honestly missed the entire lisya attachment to Wickham even if I have read the book numerous times. I just sort of dismissed it as teen fun, well until the elopement. It wonderful to find new takes on my fave Jane austen and other literary works, thanks for sharing 💕

Omg, I just love your channel, such a great find. I absolutely love you thoughts on Lydia can you talk about the Lucas’s more

Wonderful - good fun to listen to and first time I’ve thought about that question. Thanks very much!

Plus, I think the fact Lizzy didn't notice Lydia's interest in Wickham can also be down to her fatal flaw of prejudice. Her father regularly dismisses Lydia, Kitty and Mary as "silly girls" and Lizzy does as well which I think leads her to dismissing everything her younger sisters (particularly Lydia and Kitty) do as silly and frivilous and not worth paying close attention to. It always did rub me the wrong way how Mr Bennet and Lizzy treat the younger girls and personally I think that if they had actually stepped in to try and help correct or redirect the supposedly "silly" behaviour then perhaps the problem of Mr Wickham could have been avoided entirely. Unfortunately not.

@mariavi33

5 ай бұрын

This is even clearer when you contrast it with Georgiana Darcy, who was only saved from Wickham because her brother took what was happening seriously and immediately stopped it when he found out. Mary King’s family probably did the same for her.

@edithengel2284

4 ай бұрын

To be fair, Lizzie and Jane did step in frequently to try to curb Lydia's excesses, most notably when Lizzie had the discussion with her father concerning Lydia's going to Brighton. She and Jane cannot be blamed for Lydia's behavior, as if anyone were going to be able to correct it, it should have been their mother and father. It's my opinion, however, even if Mr. and Mrs. Bennet had been much more effective parents, it would have been nearly impossible to control Lydia's behavior. Lydia's self-indulgence and impulsiveness went beyond the normal teenage level, and I don't remember her ever expressing love or consideration for a single member of her family--and mostly she gloats over them, especially Kitty. But her father ignored her (when possible) and her mother actually encouraged her in terrible directions, so some kind of catastrophe was bound to result.

Great work, super nerdy, thank you for making content (:

How are you doing dr octavia thank you for wonderful cultural channel as literature lovers and foreigners subscribers as overseas students want to increase our cultural level improve our English language as well i gathered main points about famous character you mentioned Jane Austen described Lydia bennet in pride and prejudice as having high animal spirit sort of natural self consequence she is attractive charismatic she is also reckless impulsive stout well grown girl of fifteen with fine complexion good humoured countence in chapter 46 summary when Elizabeth returns to her inn she finds two letters from Jane first relates that Lydia has eloped with wickham second that there is word from couple they may not be married yet although they are not married they have Been convinced to do so provided that wickham debts are paid and Lydia receives small yearly spitend Lydia elopement the view of that time society were strict living together without marriage was banned under imminency of social exclusion of whole family . Lydia and wickham were impror match financially speaaaking Lydia had little money to bring to marriage and he was only soldier also earning little himself in Austen time gentry couldn’t just marry for love we appreciate your great efforts stay safe blessed good luck to you your dearest ones happy mother to you all mothers we in Arabic countries celebrate mother day as well as you in England best wishes for you your family friends

Another excellent video 💕

You’re good at what you do. You’re really really good.

Such an interesting subject! Thank you!

I don't have the book in front of me , but it seemed to me that Mr. Wickham showed some particularity for Elizabeth. Lydia felt, as the youngest, a desire to compete with her sisters, especially in the matter of marrying early. She may have also thought she was succeeding in taking Wickham away from Elizabeth.

I love your analysis of these works! Very good points on Lydia! Can you do more videos on Sense and Sensibility and on the topic of how it is Marianne and Willoughby spend so much time alone together unsupervised.

Nice job!

Lydia did have her eye on Wickham. For a girl her age looking to be married handsome charming fun Wickham is great catch. What does not come through convincingly is Wickham's interest in her, except as a party girl to laugh and dance with.

So glad I found your channel! Such intelligent insights! Could you please do more from Mansfield Park? You are my favorite!

Very interesting and entertaining video. Well done for finding so many illustrations of attractive young Regency men 😁 I found particularly interesting the analysis of Lydia’s willingness to upend conventions around gender roles.

It is also interesting that while there is some of Lydia's interest in Wickham prior to Lizzy going to the Colins' house, she also continued to show some preference for Denny, the narrative voice seems to be telling us that a lot of Lydia's attachment occurred while Elizabeth was away (Both Elizabeth and Mary King are out of the picture), and that Lizzy's preoccupation with her own troubles is what misled her about Lydia's preference.

Very educational, infeef!! Thanks so very much!

I love how the tv version gives you a tip off at the ball when he’s talking about missing one person and holds the gaze of Lydia as he says it. I felt it was a nice way of foreshadowing what the narrative voice reveals. It’s hard to adapt the films because there’s so much thought but unsaid. I always felt like Jane and Kitty were underwritten. Especially Jane who is so passive. Thanks for a great close reading!

Lovely analysis.

Dr. Cox, would you please consider doing a close reading of Mansfield Park to determine whether Mary Crawford had any suspicion of Fanny’s attachment to Edmund? A straight reading suggests not, but there are a few phrases that make me wonder... For example, when Mary comes to Fanny’s room to practice her lines and says that she will be embarrassed to say them to Edmund’s face, and then asks Fanny, “Could you do it? But then you are his cousin, which makes all the difference” or something to that effect. That gives me pause because I wonder if it’s a clue.

@clpearson991

2 жыл бұрын

And perhaps Mary felt with Fanny married to Henry, her way would be clear to Edmund...

I have three older sisters and cannot help but project my experience onto literature that depicts sister relationships. I feel great sympathy for silly (bratty?) little sisters like Lydia Bennett and Amy March. I think a stronger argument could be made for the sibling rivalry theory. Lydia has experienced a lifetime (yes, comparatively short, but still her undiluted lifetime of experience) of being dismissed by her older sisters and neglected by her father. She has watched Lizzie be preferred and prized by their father probably for as long as she could remember and recently she saw Lizzie being offered attention from someone considered universally attractive. I think Lydia has felt a build up of frustration and resentment so when she sees an opportunity to compete in the only competitive sport allowed to young women - attracting a mate desired by others - she becomes determined to assert herself. I think Lydia’s perspective is way off. She shares the same flaw as Lizzie. Both sisters are so self absorbed that they are each ignorant of the what is happening in the other’s love life. Lydia cannot see that Whickam is no longer attractive to Lizzie. Lizzie cannot tell that Lydia intends to make a conquest of Whickam. I can’t help but feel kind of sad for Lydia. It seems like there was a youthful lack of foresight in her actions that will lead to regret. My own experience was that becoming an adult and leaving our parents’ home allowed me to make friends with my sisters and let go of any resentment I felt against them instead of weaponizing it and hurting myself. But who knows. Maybe I’m not being fair to Lydia. Perhaps she never regretted her marriage. I appreciated the observation about Lydia and Whickam’s shared love of gambling. Maybe Lydia rejoiced in finding her soulmate and only regretted their lack of financial resources.

In my mind Mes. Bennett was exactly like Lydia, when she was Lydia's age. Mr.Bennett is not a good father, because he feels he is a failure because he has no sons. I may be completely wrong, but I had that feeling the first time I read the book in the 6th grade.

Thank you for Thais video. I had no clue before ! Regards from Spain

I really suspect Wickham was a feather Lydia set out to get for her cap because of the way the older girls were praised and the younger were belittled. Without the goading she might have safely flirted with 6 officers at once. I wonder if given a few years of better treatment the younger ones would have grown to be just as sensible as their older sisters. The Bennets are certainly not model parents! This whole story could be a Cautionary Tale for Parents of Young Ladies.

@Mr3kiwis

2 жыл бұрын

By 15, that boat has already sailed; the formative years come much earlier. Kitty has a bit more sense than Lydia and does respond to correction so there is hope that with morally good companions and much sensible conversation, she can improve but I believe (and I think Austen implies) that she can never equal Jane or Elizabeth.

"... and Kitty." 😣 I had to pause the video because I couldn't quit giggling. After all, that's the perfect summary of Kitty!