I am out here QUIETLY quitting on black men actually I fully quit since I was a teenager - so a good 20 years as I have seen their bullshit long before this was even discussed on social media. I don’t have the time nor energy to explain to anyone why I’m not sticking for BM. I do think black feminist women struggle to separate GROWN black men from black boys in their families whether it be sons, nephews cousins grandchildren. When they are of an impressionable age support black boys but it comes to a point that you leave those toxic men and yes that includes those in your family. Just because we share the same skin colour and maybe bloodlines doesn’t mean we need to support them. They happily dont respond with the same energy.

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

And how exactly do you do that when you have black make family members that you have to see on several occasions ? Do you throw away the entire family relationship/dynamic because these people ( BM) are part of the family structure? Also being a black boy wont mean anything for long if you are not receiving the proper training of what it means to be a good husband, human and adult. You're going to end up just flopping. A lot of us don't look at Asian or white women and blame them for the degeneracy of men in their cultures because we know there are bad apples everywhere. I'd love for us BW to be relieved off that burden because 9/10 bad BM are a result of black mothers who spoiled them and refuser to make them take accountability for their actions meanwhile treating their daughters like mules and slaves.

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

I love and wholeheartedly agree with this comment. BM can be extremely exhausting

@tamarapowell8982

Жыл бұрын

@@tondaniraluswinga2590it’s called conditional love 🪱 for 🧠s

@gregorywalker6802

Жыл бұрын

Black women are the least desirable women of any ethnicity in the US according to the Research recently done 🎉by the dating sites........ According to the CDC statistics 80% of Black women are Obese....... Nobody likes you Masculine, Competitive, Unappreciative and Entitled Black women....lol

@OCDandme123

Жыл бұрын

@@tondaniraluswinga2590 bs I have seen black men who were disciplined and guided by strong level headed disciplinary mothers still turned out shitty so let's not blame the women for shit men it's societal conditioning to why these men are colorist black kids are the most disciplined group yet they turn out like this you can't raise a good mn you're just wasting time so throw down your cape

This is the same way of thinking that keeps women in abusive marriages. It's perfectly fine to turn your back on some people. In fact, it is also ethical.

@destinyking6049

Жыл бұрын

That language could be used to throw the baby out with the bath water on any argument ever. Unless your point is that we should turn our back on all black men because some might be abusive?

@lindalawson4296

Жыл бұрын

I read “some.” I’m not sure what you read.

@deecunningham9719

Жыл бұрын

Actually it is not. You are collapsing a few things in this comment. No one can heal another person and no black woman can save a black man. Rejecting the disposability of a person is not the same thing as choosing to be in an intimate relationship with someone who is hurting you. Also there are many black men in our lives who are not our intimate partners to whom this ethic also applies. we can practice/ demonstrate respecting the humanity of black men even when they are unhlealed and choose not to be intimate or in relationship with them. you can have love (COMPASSION/EMPAHTY) for a person and not be in relationship with them due to harmful dynamics. Black feminism is not telling anyone to be hurt or subject themselves to harm. you can always take care of yourself and recognize or advocate that unhealed (former) partners, brothers, fathers, nephews, etc. not be thrown away by society or institutions.

@sumarew

Жыл бұрын

Completely agree with you. I think it's very arrogant, narcissistic and foolish to think you can change another person especially if they don't want to be changed. As a woman I've always thought about what type of father will I be giving my children and it has served me wonderfully!!

@naledimbeje1449

11 ай бұрын

patriarchy produces gbv and men who (predominately) perpetrate gbv. this doesn’t absolve them of accountability and women of the justice they deserve - but rather it is the recognition of the system that perpetuates these harms and social dynamics. abolition and the love/compassion ethic Kimberley said!

Yeah... no, I can't agree with this... not only is this strategy (of getting BM to change) tiring and thankless, it doesn't work. This is not how men operate (or get motivated to change) and it's detrimental to black women. BW do not need to be the sacrificial lambs IN THE HOPE that BM will someday change.

@FightNightChampion778

Жыл бұрын

Totally agree. Really they want pookie and nug nug to change.

@FightNightChampion778

11 ай бұрын

Stop dating pookies duh

As Black Feminism is NOT a monolith anymore than Blackness is, I will respectfully step aside and let those who wish to 'lovingly' treat with BM (and deny them the ability to learn about the consequences of their actions and the ensuing accountability that leads to learning and GROWTH) do so. May your efforts be successful. As a feminist, I will continue to work towards increasing equality, expanding human choice, eliminating gender stratification and ending sexual violence. But y'all go ahead and do you though. Be blessed.

@ColoradoFalls

7 ай бұрын

BYE . YOU WONT BE MISSED . ITS NO ONES JOB TO SAVE BM BUT BM. GET GONE

@Demerarachica

7 ай бұрын

@@ColoradoFalls lol. The ONLY authority you have is over yourself, certainly not me. By all means, express your paltry opinion but leave the directives to someone who knows me in real life and whom I actually respect. Please and thanks. I stand ten toes down on what I said. If you need it said in French, Spanish or Portuguese so you can FULLY understand because you're not grasping the English version, all you need do is ask. 😘

Ironically Black women are one of the only demographics that generally don’t base our loyalty on what our men can do for us. We out here genuinely trying to save everybody. Despite, as Kimberly point out, colorism/sexism/misogynoir. It’s truly WILD to think about.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

She didn't say that yall should save us though, you have black male relatives no??

@tamarapowell8982

Жыл бұрын

@@sme-dm5gzeven black male relatives love should be conditional. Anything else?

@FightNightChampion778

11 ай бұрын

You trying to save pookies

It's a "loving ethic", but it's not always a realistic ethic, nor a worthwhile one. Sometimes you have to thin the herd to keep the bulk of the stock healthy.

@timtim9o5

Жыл бұрын

"thin the herd" jesus, that's some kind of mindset you've got there.

@patrickdavenport6254

Жыл бұрын

@@timtim9o5 It's absolutely necessary.

@birdiewolf3497

Жыл бұрын

@@timtim9o5 What do folks mean when they say this? Be explicit. Are we talking about genocide? This is exactly why the loving ethic is necessary, because it gets genocidal very quickly without it. Like yall want them dead for real? Is that the plan?

@louenatnine51

Жыл бұрын

@@birdiewolf3497 I hope you don't actually think there's no median between genocide and an explicit focus diverted away from a particular group? Obviously most folk don't want black men dead, but more importantly, we also don't want black women dead, and it seems that more women have been sacrificed to the project of male restoration than the actual number of men that have changed. Most of the comments here speaking "thinning the herd" or "ignoring bm" are solely talking about shifting the focus toward the empowerment of black women and girls, and allowing black men to step in and help their brothers, in their own way. Realistically, a loving ethic only gets so far and requires positional power that black women just do not have. If *you* want to continue doing that work, no one is stopping you.

@soul-deeplevel-up6179

Жыл бұрын

​@@birdiewolf3497Don't be obtuse... it means not replicating them. Not allowing certain things to continue into subsequent generations. No different than a quarantine. No one is talking about k!ll1ng or sterilizing anyone. But no one is entitled to legacy, children, to have their ideas live on, etc. Certain things should die. And yes, misogynoir is one of them. Deprive it of oxygen, of resources, of support... come correct to black women or be cut off

Oooooh that’s a hard ask lol considering how the collective of blk men behave towards blk women. The only blk man I’m pouring that kind of unconditional love into is my child. Hopefully we raise the next generation of men to be responsible, hardworking, intellectually curious, kindhearted, empathetic men of integrity.

@carlad.4428

Жыл бұрын

"Hopefully." But why even keep reproducing them knowing you have nothing more to cling to for collective change except "hope"? Do you have any idea how many generations of delusional BW before you uttered those very same words? And look where remain today as a race because...hope.

@ToriUptown

Жыл бұрын

y’all won’t bc you already hate the men they’ll become. you can’t hate Black men and think you’ll raise a healthy Black man.

@dionawilliams6594

Жыл бұрын

Yup!

@OCDandme123

11 ай бұрын

It won't work

@FightNightChampion778

11 ай бұрын

Well, if you black follow Jesus' laws and marry before you carry, you would not be in this predicament

I have empathy but I don't F with them. I can love them from a distance and Im not doing ish for them.

I always struggle with this because it go back to black fems being the savers. It reminds me of the scene where Eli Pope tells Olivia that everyone is worth saving. But my question is at what cost? Where is the self Preservation. When does our natural Instincts to save ourselves kick in?

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

when you learn photosynthesis.

*Not a trolling question* I’ve drawn this same conclusion from black feminist thought. I’m left wondering though, why should (in your opinion) black women subscribe to this work, and what benefit do they receive? It’s clear how the community benefits in the long run, but do black women stand to gain anything from all this emotional labor? Is the work solely for the next generation of black girls to finally thrive and not necessarily this one?

@OCDandme123

Жыл бұрын

I agree

@soul-deeplevel-up6179

Жыл бұрын

Good question. Does the community benefit in the long run? Does enabling and rewarding bad behavior, mistreatment, and apathy towards you benefit a relationship in the long run? I think not... one person pouring into a bucket while another bores holes in it does not result in a full bucket.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

Honestly I've never seen a black feminist online make the same message as this young woman has, infact she's the first black women I've seen mentioning this and I've been online for two decades now can you point me to the others? Asking kindly I'm genuinely interested in what other black feminists support this message.

@birdiewolf3497

Жыл бұрын

It is necessary because disposablity politics gets genocidal real quick. So it just acknowledging that we quite literally can't function as a society leaving men behind. That is just not a rational or realistic solution. So we have to think about how to implement a path of reconciliation if we want to achieve the goals we set out for. So it is like do you just want to be mad (which is totally fair and valid) or do we want to implement change? If we want to practice feminist politic, it has to be about changing things. And yeah, it is hard to do that work. It isn't easy at all. Like imagine the emotional labor it took to get our right to vote. And black women were dealing with the fuckery of men and white women. This ain't me saying we need to devote all our time and attention towards men. Particularly in the personal. But we do need to come up with something on a more broader scale. And that means engaging with whatever is fucking these niggas up. Having compassion for that and actually seek to resolve the issue. I get it. It is hard to give a shit about these men when they don't give a shit about you. And half the time they don't even give a shit about themselves. And yeah, the chances of us reaping the benefits are slim.

@soul-deeplevel-up6179

Жыл бұрын

"Disposing" of the bad apples does not equal the devolution or extinction of society. And even if it did, I see no purpose in the eternal existence of the human species, if women and girls are to be subjugated within it for eternity. If that was our future, then knowing that, why should women opt into that? Sacrifice their bodies and lives to immortalize that? Why can't the men engage with what is "messing" them up? Can't they do this before we work together? In fact, they must, otherwise black liberation will just be replicating whiteness, which is patriarchal. We would then have to turn around and fight for liberation from the same people we fought alongside for "black liberation".

Im wondering if this is in a way ‘enabling’ bad behavior? Like the parent who keeps giving resources to an addict and never lets them hit rock bottom. Therefore never giving them a real reason to HAVE to step up? The idea of ‘what you permit you promote’ also comes to mind. In giving men a pass over and over, are we in a way actually DELAYING their growth? Like a 30 yr old still living in his moms basement.

@patrickdavenport6254

Жыл бұрын

It is 100% enabling bad behavior.

@DoraWinifred

Жыл бұрын

Absolutely agree it is enabling bad behaviour. It’s akin to the bad partner who does something wrong profusely apologises and then you let them back in and the make the same mistake again and again to the point where it’s just words and they know you’ll take them back regardless.

@FlowerDarkly

Жыл бұрын

As far as addiction goes, there is no such thing as rock bottom. If you want people to get better, you have to help them. Of course that means waiting for them to want help. You can’t force someone to change. That does mean accepting and nurturing people willing to put in the work to change even though they may start from a very distasteful state.

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

@@FlowerDarklyI agree. That term is outdated. I think as long as someone is willing to participate in their recovery that help should be there. And boundaries are part of that.

And this is approximately why I could never be a black feminist, I’m willing to throw the baby out with the bath water (in this Instance BM) and focus solely on the betterment of women and girls (to be clear, I’m not a hypergamy girl). Unfortunately, I lack the emotional bandwidth to put any labor towards BM. At least someone is willing to do it and all i can say is good luck and good riddance.

@Shalondria

Жыл бұрын

Lmao ❤

@patrickdavenport6254

Жыл бұрын

Why should you be apologetic about that, because Kimberly says so? She is wrong in this regard. We as black women do not owe it to black men to suffer at their hands. Those who are not invested in us and our well-being are owed absolutely nothing.

@msbranch2879

Жыл бұрын

@@patrickdavenport6254 No seriously like I usually agree with Kim but I refuse. I’m tired of us always being the compassionate ones when we’re rarely shown compassion. Maybe I just ain’t healed but I’ll pass on that 😭

@illhurtu5866

Жыл бұрын

⁠@@patrickdavenport6254when in this one minute and 50 sec clip did she say or even alluded to any of this? Why do y’all have such binary thinking? Why is everything black and white with y’all?

@yoyodre

Жыл бұрын

Toxic. 🙄 Just like us, you cannot exist without us. Throwing away an entire segment of your community would result in your own extinction. Some of yall be going out of the way to argue against nonsensical points that were never argued to amplify your own traumatic biases with none of the self awareness to see you are the shoe on the other foot of the type of men you want to divest from. Sinking to the bottom together.

Is it not also a self-loving ethic though, to not put up with mistreatment? Like, we have to love men (at least our fathers, brothers, relatives and friends worth loving) and believe in them and that they are capable of change but we don't have to personally change men or baby them. And we definitely don't need to settle for a partner not our equal

Black feminism is the thing i clung to after a series of traumatic experiences with men. It is really hard and I aint perfect but it's valuable, and hearing men disparage it, not knowing how much it's keeping us loving towards them? Wild.

@Frey12

Жыл бұрын

I don't know what reading she is referring to. So, I don't know what she means.

@carlad.4428

Жыл бұрын

It's YOUR fault for thinking it's your job to "protect" grown ass men in the 1st place. No other races of women say or do this! THEY. ARE. MEN. And in this global patriarchy it is hardER to let them sink or swim.

@jayyy735

Жыл бұрын

Ive always thought the same thing. Its amazing that this is one of the major themes of Black feminism and many of us BW do subscribe to this and all that parts of Black feminism. Yet many men and will never know this

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

@@Frey12 Same I'm confused I've never heard black feminists promote loving black men I would like to know most seem to promote dating out.

@tamarapowell8982

Жыл бұрын

@@sme-dm5gzthey actually do so much that they put bw that date out more so than they support

Tuh, not my black feminism.

Could never sorry. If that means I’m not a Black feminist then so be it lmaooo pro Black women and girls 🤎 das about it for me. Not doing the harder work for niggas that don’t care lol not tryna save men that don’t want to be saved. Its futile.

@ToriUptown

Жыл бұрын

so you’re pro Black girls but not Black boys?

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

There are some seriously problematic BW snd girls. Just as nasty as the BM, how do you deal with that?

Is this unknown? I think that sector is very aware that the traditional black “feminist” continues to center black men to their own detriment. That’s almost the point.

Exactly why I don’t agree with womanism because although the intention is good the idea that we have to center black men when a vast majority of their movements don’t center black women and it’s giving savior complex/ Stockholm syndrome

Maybe I haven't done the reading but who says black women feminists have to adhere to black men??? This is news to me and I identify as one. I just move through the world with the mentality of "whoever is with me is with me, whoever is not is not." I don't waste energy trying to love on people who don't protect me or want to be in community with me but the ones that do, I will if that makes sense.

Yea, but like, what if we did just throw men away? Like what if we, as a global community of women, just stopped putting up with male violence and abuse? What if we just stopped spending our lives trying to fix a problem in men that they themselves don't see as a problem? What if we just walked away, and concentrated on enriching our own lives and each others'? Like we just supported other women and helped one another and stopped spending any time and energy on men, who commit 95% of all violent crime and abuse and kill us more than cancer and car accidents and war put together? Maybe we just walk away. Maybe we should try that. Cos, it seems to me, we've been trying to "radically love" men into not killing us for thousands of years. And I really feel like it has not worked. I think it's very much the case that we have exhausted that option like at least a couple thousand of years ago. Maybe the true act of radical love is to love OURSELVES and our sisters enough to just . . . leave.

@patrickdavenport6254

Жыл бұрын

Then many of us would not be able to see our remaining value. Too many of us find our value from appealing to or saving men, and not enough beyond or despite that. It's a sad reality.

@Yaurii

Жыл бұрын

Believe it or not, your suggestion has been suggested by many rad fems.

@voxomnes9537

Жыл бұрын

@@Yaurii And so many rad fems of that era of feminism were anti-Black and are now openly anti-sex work and anti-trans. There was and still is a limit to that form of feminism.

@jjpopesupremacy8762

Жыл бұрын

@danishacarter spoke about this in her recent video

@Dave102693

Жыл бұрын

@@Yauriiand my many terfs of the past who were rad fems

I’m sorry but who has the time? Angela Davis already gave us a book and a documentary. Replay works… it’s 2023

I don't think it's possible to reform somebody who doesn't want to be reformed. They don't see any benefit in changing and therefore they won't. Please stop banging your head against the wall.

@soul-deeplevel-up6179

Жыл бұрын

Exactly this. All this talk about reconciliation. But this is never initiated by the abusers, wrongdoer, or oppressors. Why? Because they don't see anything wrong with their behavior. They don't want to change it and will not. So "loving" them just equals an acceptance of that abuse. I don't get what's so hard to understand about that. Forgiveness is the most that can be offered. For our own sakes. Reconciliation takes two. It takes accountability. Remorse. And commitment to turning about-face... they're not interested.

It IS hard. I would also call it stupid, but that’s just me.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

Very hard we are a broken people.

One thing ima do is throw em away. Not there (black feminism in this sense) yet, but I support the girlies that do. Y’all doing the lords work

@ninagrace-lee8323

Жыл бұрын

@@lucymwangi4726😂😂 Girl the way these men are talking about black women? On Beyoncé’s internet? We’re being KIND by throwing them away and moving on quietly. Many of them are extremely vocal at how they want to physically harm us! Uncensored and unprovoked on YT. Not in the mood to placate and reason with unreasonable people for feminism’s sake. I’m so good on that 😂

@FightNightChampion778

Жыл бұрын

Don't put God in tho sinning treason.

Im surprised Kimberly put out a short clip on this. Most people in the comments are not understanding what she is saying. She isnt saying Black feminism is about putting direct labor into changing Black men. Its that when we argue and organize for Black things we include all Blaxk people with the underlying desire to eventually all live together harmoniously. Its not about simply going out specifically seeking to change Black men. as someone well-read in Black feminism, I feel like it takes a thorough understanding of the field to pick up on this.

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

I think based on the clip out of more context its hard to understand the end game point. But I think its created really great discussion in the comments.

@jayyy735

Жыл бұрын

@@hangoutwithme346yes I agree but I also feel like it’s causing people to have a fundamental misunderstanding of Black feminism. And unfortunately this couldn’t derail people from actually learning and studying Black feminism

@birdiewolf3497

Жыл бұрын

Right. It is acknowledging that fact that there has to be a path forward together and applying compassion in an attempt to see them as human which is to see a way out of this cycle of abuse and oppression. Like we not gonna get rid of men or black men, so what is the plan? I get the anger. It is a constant struggle to extend empathy and compassion and Imma be honest I don't have it in me most of the time. But I understand on a broader scale that we do need reconciliation. I know folks don't want to hear or engage with that. Again, I struggle to do so myself. And maybe it ain't you, but somebody does have to think about the way forward. We can't just sit in anger and think that is somehow enough. Feminism/Black Feminism is not just a set of personal values. It is a revolutionary framework that seeks to radically change the structures of which our society is built upon. And turning your back on black men/men in general might feel good (again it I know it feels soooo good), but it's not doing anything in the big picture. We have to think about what our goals are and how we gonna achieve those goals.

@dudethisismyemail

Жыл бұрын

I've seen enough consensus opinions on men and women being done with them and in hindsight I agree with them being over it

@dudethisismyemail

Жыл бұрын

I believe fd signifer is at least helping black men who like think like what the video says above

That is harder indeed and not my sister's job!😂

I feel like this when I talk about civil rights for criminal defendants. Most of those rights were gained on behalf of the worst fucking people. Murderers, rapists, etc, it's on their behalf that a lot of limitations on police and prosecutors were gained. But I also feel like centering black feminism on "loving" black men ignores the there is no other way to survive. There is simply no system of power that would privilege us as black women over black men. In dismantling those systems of power, black men will be helped, because it's blackness as a whole that is oppressed. Hypergamy and divestment are not about community outcomes, and some black women would be left behind there too.

I may be misunderstanding but it is no one's job to change anyone. And people only change when they want to change. I think the key is giving individuals a chance and when you recognize they don't have your best interest at heart to move on. One of the things I wish for black women is to not have to save the world anymore while being sh*t on at the same time. There's absolutely nothing wrong with protecting your heart, energy and spirit. And when we stop sacrificing those things for people who don't deserve it, we show love to ourselves. Before someone comments, this is not a blanket application for any group or black men, but divesting from individuals who don't deserve our effort.

Its very arrogant to think you can chamge someone. Black women, start thinking about your children and the conditions youre bringing them into this world. Stop this OBSESSION with black men and think about your children.

@stellastar36

11 ай бұрын

👏🏾

Isn't this the same critique that the hypergamy girls have on black feminism? I've always heard the hypergamy and divestor girls say that they don't consider themselves feminists because black feminism is synonomous with "black male worship" as they've coined it. Also, calling it a "harder ideological lift" is the nicest way of critiquing the black male worship of black feminists that I've ever heard 😂

@patrickdavenport6254

Жыл бұрын

Seriously! Such a lovely euphemism for love at any and all cost. Unfortunately, we as black women always have to pick up the tab.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

Guess I'm confused then because all the black feminists I've seen online have been divestors, can some one school me on this?

@sevenone32

Жыл бұрын

@sme-dm5gz Most of the divestors/hypergamist that I've seen don't like that black feminism is often anti-hypergamy, pro black women's labor, and black male worshipping. The divestors and hypergamy girls care and fight for black women first in their own way, but often dont want to be associated with womanism for these reasons. That said, maybe I'm not paying attention enough and the divestors are calling themselves feminists these days 🤷🏽‍♀️. Everyone's trying to rebrand lol

@ninagrace-lee8323

Жыл бұрын

@@sevenone32I agree with you. These are distinct groups of women that vary in how pessimistic they are towards men. Black feminists are the most optimistic Divestors are the least optimistic. And many would consider themselves pessimists by definition. Everybody else is in-between. Womanists are different than hypergamous black women bc they truly want what’s best for black women ONLY (feminists care about women collectively and are intersectional these days). Hypergamous women in the black community seem to be split on helping black women at all, as that could interfere with class mobility.

@FightNightChampion778

Жыл бұрын

They hate black men you fool

Wow I’m surprised by the negative reactions here! I don’t think the point is for women to martyr themselves personally, date who you want, deal with who you want, don’t let yourself be trampled and taken advantage of on an individual level. But as a community we can recognize the systems of oppression that harm us all and work towards betterment. Like I’m still going to support the end to mass incarceration as an example.

The conversation in the comments is so interesting and illuminatating. To me, black feminism does challenge the idea of disposablilty and encourage radical love but no where does it say "Have no boundaries! Accept and endure whatever treatment from men comes your way!" Challenging ideas of disposablity doesn't equal no accountability and no consequences. That actively goes AGAINST the values of it actually.

@jayyy735

Жыл бұрын

Yea there’s a lot of misunderstanding in the comments about what Kimberly is saying. I like Kimberly, I just think it was a little irresponsible to post a clip like this bc I would’ve expected people to not understand if they don’t have a solid grounding in Black feminist work. So ppl are getting the wrong idea now about Black feminism. Its much deeper than how ppl are taking it and is more about what you’re saying

@jayyy735

Жыл бұрын

And it’s also bc people are taking an individual approach rather than doing a analysis of what this could mean for the collective. But once again, its not always easy for people to do when they have no grounding in Black feminist lit

@Jojo-tf2zp

Жыл бұрын

@Jasmine S. Very true, I have my fingers crossed that this turns into a longer video, not behind the paywall and this was a way to get the people going. I do think there's a lot of misunderstanding, like you're saying that could be easily clarified, referencing the very work we want people to be more framilar with.

@jayyy735

Жыл бұрын

@@Jojo-tf2zp exxactly.. i hope she does a full video too that is not on the paywall too. I would hate for people to be turned off from an entire field bc of a misunderstanding of a central point that really isn’t their fault either. Bc if i had no idea about Black feminism i would probably feel the same way others are.

I completely agree that ethic is very challenging to adhere to and tiring as well. However as a person with a black son, I have no choice but to keep the hope alive 🤷🏽‍♀️

I'm not marching

You know ive seriously ponder why women dont end up being straight hating men considering the amount of damage they do to womenn

@Dave102693

Жыл бұрын

A lot of women straight up do, they just won’t admit it

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

Bc we are taught from a young age to find our value with male approval. IE ‘Don’t upset your father’ all the way to ‘get that ring’

@dudethisismyemail

Жыл бұрын

@@hangoutwithme346 I will say however it might also be transphobic to say that since terfs use it

@dudethisismyemail

Жыл бұрын

It also seems to me reading womens opinions on men that their done with them in general

Does black feminism teach that? I've been acting as if they don't really exist. Men, in general, tbh. I must have gotten the wrong message from it, lol.

@louenatnine51

Жыл бұрын

By *love*, she's saying more so that it teaches practitioner's to continually hold space for the possibility of transformation in individuals and groups. Even men ... unfortunately. I myself also just ignore them on a day-to-day, though. I'm not interested in that work lol

@Yaurii

Жыл бұрын

Yes. Black feminism ideology is very invested in BM

@ObservingtheMatrix

Жыл бұрын

@@Yaurii it’s very invested in community

@Yaurii

Жыл бұрын

@@ObservingtheMatrix mmk

@patrickdavenport6254

Жыл бұрын

To put it simply, not necessarily. It depends on who you follow.

Yes. Think The Will to Change by bell hooks.

@boababtree165

Жыл бұрын

As soon as I saw the title of this video I thought about Bell Hooks lol

Will they love us when we ain't shit

This video is disappointing and intellectually dishonest. It completely ignores the black femicide rate (nearly 4x higher than ww) that is perpetrated by mainly BM. BW are not simply washing our hands bc we don’t like their shitty podcasts or dating preferences. We are having to contend with unchecked violence, sexual assault, and murder that we have very little protection from. I can understand BM not wanting to give up on BM bc I only recently began to shift my perspective. But to completely IGNORE the actual danger we risk being in their vicinity is hurtful and disappointing.

@bdott1538

Жыл бұрын

Don’t know if it ignores…it’s simply stating the difference in the ethics. Granted she may not find valid reasons for divesters to exist…but their reasons ARE 100% valid. And her point that it’s not Black Feminism…is very much correct. Men can’t parse the difference, but we know that actual feminism doesn’t let go of men.

Greetings from Spain!

Hi - maybe its because I'm old. I joined your Patreon and I can never find these videos. Like is this a clip from a longer video? And if it is how do you find the longer video? When I use the link and try to view a podcast in apple podcasts the "newest" video is from 2020, and if I log into Patreon the "newest" video is from 5 days ago. Please advise.

I must have missed this part while learning about black feminist. I mean i havent read all the text but im interested in reading more but personally i refuse to put any labor towrds black men.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

This is actully my first time hearing a black feminists say this I've gotten used to them saying the opposite.

makes me think of what it truly is to want a better society for all, the people i disagree with or am harmed by, its a necessary step to believe they should get the same rights and treatment as i think i and my loved ones deserve, even if i'm not so sure i feel like like those enemies deserve them :/

Where did you get that Ladies Night shirt? I need it so bad! 😍

"Help me I'm poor" The phrase that stays on a loop when I get a taste of the truth and amazingness being told behind the pay wall 😂❤

Kim you’re just trolling us now.😂

The title alone. Whew!!!!!

We’ll said. bell hooks also spoke on this issue. 💕

pretty good video, thank you 😉

I personally would not be alive if not for this specific kind of love Kim is describing, and you can check my comments on this channel for proof. While I'm not advocating every Black woman perform self-sacrificing emotional labor in the attempts to change someone (bc you can't control that outcome anyway), what I am pointing out is the chain reaction from being loved when I otherwise would have succumbed to the eventual fate of patriarchal violence. I woulda been or made another statistic. Now I've devoted my life to paying it forward for Black women as a whole, and I'm even (successfully) helping one experiencing a mental crisis right now. This is how the cycles of violence are interrupted on the individual level. Love/compassion may not always defeat hate, but it's essentially the only thing that can. And it was all the more impactful because I *didn't deserve it*.

@lowtech42

Жыл бұрын

The abolition of identity-based structures of oppression like patriarchy and racism etc can never be achieved from an equally ego-based approach. The current reactive cycle we find ourselves in is consistently doubling-down on identity politics as the contradictions of racialized patriarchal capitalism become increasingly intense, polarized, and deadly. We end up with more individualism in the time when more collectivism is necessary. "What about me?" vs. "What about us?". It's fighting fire with fire when the obvious, albeit not easiest, remedy is to fight fire with water (egolessness). This would mean the eradication of imposed social identities altogether. I genuinely don't know if the modern left is willing or able to come to terms with the implications of such an absolutely radical, even philosophical position. It is likely outside the scope of leftist thought because it would essentially dismantle opposing political ideology. We may just tear ourselves apart before sacrificing these categories society deems to be a core part of the human experience; even if it means there would be no mechanism of oppression to enact, even if it means true liberation. It's reminiscent of the quote "we can imagine the apocalypse before we can imagine the end of capitalism".

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

Im glad you made it but-Is there a way though to say ‘I love you’ but I draw a boundary at this behavior. When you’ve changed for real come back and be loved with less walls. Because I don’t want women to live as collateral damage to men’s growth?

@lowtech42

Жыл бұрын

@@hangoutwithme346absolutely, I agree with you. I also learned from people, BW in particular setting boundaries with me. Self-preservation is important and boundaries can model what healthy love and behavior should look like. What either approach boils down to is empathy over disposability. Thank you for your thoughtful comment 💜

@asdic888

Жыл бұрын

​@@hangoutwithme346The setting of boundaries is exactly what transforming maladjusted behavior entails. Besides, you can't give of yourself if you don't protect yourself.

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

@@lowtech42I hear you. 🙏

That’s WAAAY too hard

have you ever seen walt disney 's the hunchback of notre dame because everything you're talking about is very relevant and close to what is going on in that movie because that movie contains the eulogy of a man who was born gypsy

@molinj.7174

Жыл бұрын

We don’t use that word, it is considered a slur by roma

@BrainsWorldChannel

Жыл бұрын

@@molinj.7174 i never said you did all i'm saying is that your message is the same message in that movie

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

How is it similar? Im confused.

@BrainsWorldChannel

Жыл бұрын

well have you taken a look at that movie in the light there's a lot of black and white supremacy in there

Its 2023, how can an educated black woman still think like that today?? On the other hand, black men really need women with this type of mindsets to keep going, and lots of women feel purpose and fulfillment in doing all that, so more power, I guess My question is, especially after the bama rush video, how is it any different from white women of supporting white patriarchy and power? I guess the fact that they are protected by their men..?

patriarchy produces gbv and men who (predominately) perpetrate gbv. this doesn’t absolve them of accountability and women of the justice they deserve - but rather it is the recognition of the system that perpetuates these harms and social dynamics. abolition and the love/compassion ethic Kimberley said!

I agree with Kim but, I think more of the focus needs to be on being compassionate and loving to young Black men and boys in our community. Not necessarily the grown Black men. Our cousins, nephews, sons, boys in our neighborhood, etc. If you have Black men that you are close to platonically, you have an understanding of how they live life. And it’s a life of a lot of fear, heartache and pain. They do not feel protected or loved or cared for by society and the trauma of their ancestors impacts them today. Compassion is key. I want better for all Black people. I am from the hood. So many of those men just have no guidance, no security, thrown away by society at birth. How can they be great if they’re thrown away bc they are struggling?

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

They don't need compassion. They need real life lessons and responsibilities.

@ERoss338

Жыл бұрын

@@tondaniraluswinga2590does this apply to women too?

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

@@ERoss338 no, BM and black boys dont need compassion from BW. Maybe they need it from BM but definitely not from us BW. Growing up us BW never received compassion from BM and we made it out alive. So that's what my comment meant.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

Well put comment Tori I have a relative who has a similar thought process to this mixed with some of the women here who hate black men, I know that she tries her best to compartmentalize her hatred of black men for us even I find my self doing the same with black women because of how broken we are as a people.. It's hard to love us when so many hate not only each other but themselves it's bad out here.

@ERoss338

Жыл бұрын

@@tondaniraluswinga2590 that’s cold no? Everyone deserves compassion.

Al Reynolds literally said this bullshit regarding Nia Long. He is obsessed with idea of black love as opposed to actual healthy love. He feels she should ignore her ex fiancé cheating and take him back for the sake of “ black love”. In his thinking Nia’ s self respect and dignity do not matter, just keep the man.

Interesting take as usual although I find the sentence "the desire is not to trumple on Black men" at 0 56 formulation somewhat problematic. Wouldn't the inversion of the terms to "the desire to not trumple on .. " better convey the idea?

This is why I wrestle with if im a feminist or not.

I don’t feel I can divest fullly. Because I feel like I need my dad , my brother, uncle etc it’s not just about romantic partners. It’s about the people I am in proximity with in community. I don’t see my work with certain black men as different from the work with my mother or the women in my life who have internalized misogynoir and anti blackness. I do this work with everyone. Now I do need folk to meet me half way . I am not saving anyone who has already sank to the bottom of the sea floor

No.

SPEAK ON IT

I think y’all have been conditioned to see the struggling black man as authentic and the upwardly mobile black man as an enemy to the struggle. Either way, idfwu 😂

💓

A lot of anger, contempt and hatred, both in the comments and in the video. Maybe what I heard said about places like this wasn't wrong. What it be.

this is just sad at this point! and not even slightly convincing. Where have you been the last 50 yrs.... wow! just stop! get some help! also don't sink with the ship.

You can hold people accountable, protect your space on a personal level, and still hold compassion and want better for other people, including black men. The rhetoric around these issues in my opinion is racist. It’s possible to hold the thought that we need to address violence and misogyny in black spaces but that I can also find racism and mistreatment directed toward black men morally wrong and abominable. I don’t get how completely shunning black men is a fix when the problem is it solely black men but an American and global society that has always devalued black women and black people. People really need to get off of social media and stop believing the worst behaving people represent the whole.

A lot of black people live in a fantasy world where white supremacy has played no parts in emasculating/stupefying black men and defeminizing black women, this is where the confusion comes from how can we better ourselves when the majority of us don't even know what the problem is let a lone care until it's a inconvenience.. Perfect example of this is trump VS Obama the standards are completely different for black men and HIGH as hell when you consider what we go through every day with these people. Stop kicking each other in the butt for not being perfect and work on you and yours we are all we've got.

As a man, I 100% agree with you. We are just shit as hell. And I hate myself and will never deserve a date.

🦇

There's a love you need to have for blackness that believes that all black people deserve peace and love and an equitable life. Including the ain't shit niggas. You can do that and date outside of your race (not exclusively), date only black people, or choose singleness. But you can't love black people and want better for them only if they're good.

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

I think thats an example of compassion meditation and I think thats where it can and should end for many women. I love and pray and want the best for you but that doesn’t mean I let you in my space to cause havoc.

@ToriUptown

Жыл бұрын

agreed. growing up in poverty and the hood taught me this.

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

Exactly, its extremely tiring this conversation.

@tondaniraluswinga2590

Жыл бұрын

​@@hangoutwithme346 letting a dusty into your personal space is a you problem. Dont associate lack of boundaries on your end with compassion.

@oihcam22

Жыл бұрын

I’m sorry but Black men that are serial rapists’ do not deserve a good life especially when they’re running around stealing it from innocent people.

I have been saying this for years, and I’m a black man.

So I’m a black man, and I’m right of center (I generally believe in color blindness, corrective capitalism, evo psych etc. but definitely wouldn’t call myself right wing) and I’m a subscriber to this space because I enjoy having my views challenged and genuinely love black women to my best ability. My problem with this video is that no true Scotsman fallacy(appeal to purity) of who is and isn’t a black feminist. The other problem I have is no matter how much critique black men launch towards black women or how much black women levy towards black men the two groups are inseparable. Like there’s no ethnicity that’s ever lived where one gender is that much ahead of another. Yes men historically have been ahead of women but if we separate it by groups or race there’s always been a chain linking them both to the success or failure of the group. I say that to say we’ll need each other down the road no matter what one says of the other

@dudethisismyemail

Жыл бұрын

So a centrist

@lotusjumpingspider8761

Жыл бұрын

@@dudethisismyemail somewhat but I probably lean slightly right.

As long as black feminists reject gender roles there will be no mass coming together of traditional BM and liberal feminist BW. No judgement on either side but the standoff will remain.

As a man, I would look forward to the posters proposal of feminist ( not women) leaving men. A start would be by not using anything invented or supported or put in place by men.(😆) It's a start, try it and see(😆)

@magicalgirl7903

Жыл бұрын

Right, because only men ever invented or worked to create something and if they even did , it was without violently keeping women out of any of this nor stealing women's work, erasing them and then taking credit. Oh yeah, such an intelligent take you have there. Also, you're proving one point: your very shtick is to keep lording things over us because you consider that your right and your manhood and you see us as lesser beings. Sexism 101 in your comment.

@sme-dm5gz

Жыл бұрын

grow up bro..

@heyoka33

Жыл бұрын

@@sme-dm5gzThe attempt at shame( i.e something is wrong with your view point) doesn't even speak to the truth of my comment. (😆) The lack of even being able to refute the comment speaks for itself.( Otherwise you would have )(😆)

I know you see me as the enemy, but I understand that the vast majority of these women do not represent feminism. Although I don't agree with everything that you say, I feel like you don't want to destroy me. You don't wish me harm. Unfortunately, I can't say that for many black women. I have live in shades of grey and make things better for the next generation. I have my own life to live and my experience is a guide but not the standard.

I am white male and like your stuff. Very interesting. I do think there is one thing that needs correcting: "white standards" of beauty are NOT why Black men are attracted to white women. this isn't white culture causing this. Black men are considered VERY attractive by non Black women. Asian women are VERY attractive to white men. White young women are VERY attractive to Black men. This couldn't be true if it was simply about "white standards." White standards would mean EVERYONE of every race found only whites attractive. That is hardly the case. Really.

@bekaz13

Жыл бұрын

asian women are only attractive to white men bc they're (incorrectly and fetishistically) seen as exotic, delicate, and submissive, unlike white women who are no longer willing to put up with their bs. and whether white women are attracted to black men has no bearing on why black men are attracted to white women

@hangoutwithme346

Жыл бұрын

Its not just about attraction. It also has its roots in consumerist beauty. IE Skin bleaching creams worldwide, double eyelid surgery for asian women, fake hair etc. Men have also been conditioned to be attracted to perceived submissiveness. As well as the display of one dimensional hyper femininity in pornography. This also ties into socioeconomic factors of rich/ ‘polite’/ historically white standards for women. It’s complicated.

@louenatnine51

Жыл бұрын

I'm not sure where you're getting your conclusions? Any empirical deep dive we have on race and attraction consistently makes it clear that across all ages and demographics in the United States, white men and women are perceived as having the most attractive features. Are you referring to the oft-used OkayCupid blog post? Even those mentioned that black men were second-to-last in attraction based on race, and white and asian women were about on par.

@Kcelloo

Жыл бұрын

You should really look up the study made by OKCupid, it has very interesting statistics! No non-black group of women prefer black men, they are all negative, for example white women prefer white men and latino men over black men. Also black men prefer all other races over white women. You are right though about white men prefering asian women.

@hr9336

Жыл бұрын

You’re absolutely right buddy. See how well they listen?

Why are you trying to make me pay for patreon!! These clips are gold 😭🩷🩷🩷