I own a 7 speed manual and it takes a little getting used to. Not so much the dog leg 1-2 change but the 2-3 and 3-2 changes. This is because the gate is narrow and the spring bias is on the 4-5 plane. You therefore have to be accurate and positive in your change from 2 to 3 to avoid selecting 5th. When changing down from 3 to 2 you again have to be positive and precise or the bias in the gearbox may make you select 4th. You soon get used to the gearbox and after a couple of hundred miles the gearbox became second nature. I don’t track my car but it does gets driven in a spirited way across quiet roads in the North East of England on a regular basis. The negative comments about the dog leg gearbox are mainly from people who have only driven the car a few miles (or not at all). I have also driven the flappy paddle version and like that, but I was on a tuition day with Aston Martin I’ve now done about 9,000 miles in my car and wouldn’t swap it for anything. The muscle memory is there even if I haven’t driven it for a month or so. I am, however, what the gentleman in the Bamford Rose video describes as a ‘Manual Purist”.

@pascal-regisdelfosse1852

3 жыл бұрын

Ditto. Same findings

@petebungay953

3 жыл бұрын

I'm absolutely sure all of this is true Steve and love how your car looks (assuming you're chesby on PH) and yes, I've only driven the 7-speed manual on a test drive but I suppose the question really is: "Would the manual V12VS have been even better with a 6-speed rather than the dogleg 7-speed?" Obviously a hypothetical question but worth asking all the same. Out of interest, do you use the auto rev-matching on downshifts always, sometimes or never?

@pascal-regisdelfosse1852

3 жыл бұрын

@@petebungay953 Hello Pete, from experience, having only had 6-speed manual gearboxes and having this "dog leg", I would like to give my opinion in addition to that of Steve. The 6 speed gearboxes are great overall and give a very natural feel in use. On the other hand, this "dog leg" is pure, intuitive in a sporting use. Passing the 2-3 is a delight, like in some racing cars. As 2-3 is the most commonly used gear, I particularly appreciate this direct, straight sequence. In fact, the first gear is so torquey that, except when starting, we don't come back to it anymore. The gearbox then behaves like a 6-speed gearbox. We forget this first gear. It's a little trick, the car being very torquey, if you forget to shift back into first gear, you can start in second! As Steve said, it takes a little time to get used to it at the beginning but very quickly it becomes intuitive. Going back to a classic 6-speed gearbox, I'm missing something. I don't know why Aston Martin's engineers installed this gearbox: - high torque which forced them to multiply the gearbox ratios? - I don't know why Aston Martin's engineers installed this gearbox: high torque, which meant they had to multiply the gearbox ratios. - To give a driving sensation derived from the competition in the sequence of gears? - Other reasons... What is certain is that this gearbox is sensational. It makes this car even more unique by giving it a strong, highly personalised character. A unique driving experience. Translated with www.DeepL.com/Translator (free version)

@stevecheshire8129

3 жыл бұрын

@@petebungay953 Yes I am Chesby on PistonHeads. If you only drive the 7 speed for a few miles (less than 100) you will think the six speed is far superior because the change comes naturally. The 7 speed takes some learning but after a 100 miles or so it becomes second nature. The engine is so torquey you don’t require the extra gear but having driven about 10,000 miles in mine I wouldn’t prefer the 6 speed gearbox.

@stevecheshire8129

3 жыл бұрын

@@petebungay953 I sometimes use the AMShift Rev matching on down shifts. I have never used the full throttle up shift.

Great channel and really appreciate the effort you put in to sharing your extensive knowledge and experience! I was recently lucky enough to buy a 7-speed manual. While the paddle shift is a good bit cheaper and may well be easier to hustle, the greater challenge of the manual was very much part of the attraction. Sure, you have to concentrate on what you are doing and where you are in the box. Sure, I've done 1 to 4 and 2 to 5 and 3 to 6 early on. But after 600miles, before putting into storage, I found that you soon learn the different loadings across the box and it becomes increasingly more intuitive and more rewarding. Absolutely no regrets from me!

Very good/interesting. I used to have a manual Vantage, still have a manual F355 which is wonderful with the open gate. I'm a manual guy, but I get your point on these 7 speed boxes. I think I'd go for a paddle shift for the first time on a late Vantage.

manual 6 speed car , paddle shift for the 7 speed. The 6 speed box is just a joy to use imo.

Very helpful and interesting review... I myself favour the sportshift method on my N430 - and actually enjoy lifting momentarily off the accelerator to get the sweetest shift possible...

Another interesting video mike. Well done. Please can you do one on gear oil additivies / kendal on the early manual v8s specificially?

Saturday morning BamfordRose Fix!

Great video and good information, thanks so much. As drivers, we all know transmissions basically come down to preference.. I have a '17 Ferrari California T with a dual clutch as well as a '17 Vantage S manual. I love both cars, each has it's own distinct personality. There is no question as Bramford points out, the S manual takes more concentration to drive well, while the T DCT is effortless, so fast , polished and easy to drive fast. With that said, there is just so much old school fun to the S, the sounds and feel of power of the NA V12 screaming through the gears. If you are a manual person, don't let this video stop you from driving the manual, after 500 miles, it will become second nature. Both are wonderful cars with their own unique personality, I am blessed to have them both.

Really interesting video. 👍

I've had 2 V8VSs with SSII & never had a problem with the Graziano robotised manual gearbox. Key is to treat it like a manual (which is what it is really), curl your accelerator pedal toes on upshift & you'll get very smooth changes.

Very interesting video. I wonder... would it not be possible to engineer some kind of lockout mechanism to prevent an accidental reverse engagement? Obviously such a custom mechanism would be expensive to design and build but if it is possible to do so, wouldn’t that ultimately be cheaper than fixing a buzzed engine? Just curious 🧐 🙂

Prices on S Manuel through the roof today here in the US ( 200K and up )

I’ve somehow got two 7 speed V12s manuals cos they are great. If you know how to type on a keyboard then you will be able to use the 7 speed manual. Nothing complicated and stick it in AM shift to match Rev between gears and make sure you have the drivers window at least half way down!! Pure V12 orchestra. Last of the best Aston V12s

PS: Could you do a short video on why Aston's headlights (v8 Vantage 2016) fog-up at the slightest of temperature changes - and is there anything one can do to mitigate this annoyance... at £6000 a pop, this really shouldn't haappen... Thanks.

So much for scouring the classifieds for a 7 speed manual to replace the 6 speed. There are times I hate that Mike, he's just too damn logical and good. Back to the internet for a paddle shift.

I miss the occasional gear on my nissan micra (its my green offset car), and thats a 5 speed. Two more gears must make the issue quite common I'd have thought. The DB9 rarely has the paddles used unless there's a boy racer or a BMW around.

@graygamingps4503

3 жыл бұрын

How does it hold with modern BMW's?

Mirrors my thoughts when I drove the 7 speed manual V12VS and I'm a massive manual fan and a manual V8VS owner. Do you think this is the same reason the Porsche GT division refuse to use the 7 speed manual and stick with 6 speed on the GT4 and manual GT3?

@BamfordRose

3 жыл бұрын

Hi Pete! What’s a ‘Porsche’ 🤪

@petebungay953

3 жыл бұрын

@@BamfordRose Oh shit, yeah! Wrong forum.

Is there no reverse lock-out solenoid on the manual? My 07 Volvo has one that engages above 5mph.

@BamfordRose

3 жыл бұрын

There is not!

@itsonlymusic1

3 жыл бұрын

BamfordRose yikes!

@eddieentlebucher1920

3 жыл бұрын

@@BamfordRose Wait. WHAT?? Bruh....there is no lock-out from 1 to R??? WTF??? Damn. I've got a pristine 23kms, 09 Vanatge 6spd and have been hunting for a v12 manual. Now I REALLY could care less about the 80 less hp - It's an older, V12 6spd Vantage for me. Forget that 7spd action or paddle nonsense.

good clarification between 6&7 manual vs paddle shift ....i just wonder if LHD 7 speed manual would be little bit more convenient for the driver since he doesn't need to stretch his left arm further instead he would be using his right arm and have better control in 1,2,3 gears

@BamfordRose

3 жыл бұрын

I’ve driven an AMR 7spd LHD and had the exact same conclusions as I draw in this vid, but, I thought it was not appropriate to comment on that seeing as LHD manual shifting with right hand is not my ‘mother tongue’ 👍

@omarr6021

3 жыл бұрын

@@BamfordRose the details you provide in your videos are of great help to us Aston Martin enthusiasts to determine our choice preferences.i wish you can shed some light someday on what is the mechanical difference Between the face lift 2016 onward Rapide in S version vs the non S version both ZF8 speed....

take a 6 speed vantage and upgrade on power if you need

A manual purist! Only if they dispense with synchromesh.

If you want a manual, get the 6 speed...

Love Bamford Rose, but this video is utter bull. The auto blip and flat shift are optional, so you can turn them off and on at will. And even though you may be a manual purist, it doesn't mean that you want to be fully engaged in the process of driving every single time. So the option to have auto blip on the down shift especially is extremely useful on the drives where you don't want to be heal and toeing yourself. Also, the idea that when using the auto blip/flat shift basically means you are using a gear paddle, is utter nonsense. You still have to depress and raise the clutch correctly, with the correct speed, whilst shifting the gearstick to the correct position. It is still far more involving that just pulling a paddle. Sorry Mike, disagree totally with you on this one.

@BamfordRose

3 жыл бұрын

Hi. Thanks for your comments. Sorry the vid prompted you to respond in this way. Perhaps you missed that I did say the auto blip and flat shift novelties would likely be turned off by serious manual users? On the drives when you don’t want that ‘full on’ manual experience and the auto blip is “useful”, doesn’t the fact a driver doesn’t want or need speed matching in those occasions (like 99% of how manual users drive their manual cars) mean there’s actually no benefit from a speed matched blip? So if there’s no need for it, just change gear without it, why have a throttle blip? That seems as pointless to me like how anti-lag crackles designed to keep a Turbo spinning have crept into naturally aspirated cars on overrun! If you wanted a speed matched shift, do it yourself! The main point here, and I thank you for bringing it to my attention because I overlooked it on the vid, is that the Bosch engine management system on 7spd does not allow a proper heel / toe shift done manually by the driver - whereas the 6 speed Ford Engine Management system does better, hence the need for the gimmicks??!! The flatshift point I was making is that if you use flatshift it does remove so much of the skill of a shift, that you might as well pull a paddle and you’ll be quicker on the road / position for it. It might well be a tad more involving to press the clutch pedal, but compare that flat shift process and driving experience to paddle-shift, and in general, 6-2 shifts at much greater shift speed and without the over-rev risk to name but one positive in favour of paddles, and it’s my opinion that the paddle-shift returns the better overall experience. I like 7 speed, but I think the 6 speed manual is better. I said 7speed is fine when not in a hurry, and because of the gate / faff, I’d sooner not take 7 speed on a track. I said the 7 speed is niche (for enthusiasts), 7spd will likely be worth a premium, and I clearly stated a gearbox is highly personal, but I’d go for a paddle-shift. So where exactly is the “Utter Bull” in there?! it’s a balanced appraisal, which I did back-to-back with the paddle-shift. Gearbox interaction is as personal as exhaust note, ones loud is another’s quiet, and I made that clear in the vid too! There is no right or wrong answer, only the answer which is right to you! So to call the vid “utter bull” is missing all those points I made across the entire vid, and a bit harsh to say the least.

@mpanayi1

3 жыл бұрын

@@BamfordRose thanks for the reply. You are correct, and I suppose my comments do read a little harsh, which was not the intention! The utter bull part I am referring to is the assumption you make that a proper manual purist always wants to heal and toe, hence the functions are potinless. You spend almost a third of video discussing this assumption/position, when in reality it's a pointless talking point as you can turn it off and on at will, without impacting other parameters of the car (like for example in M2s to turn off autoblip also means turning off stability control). I fully understand your point of view about these functions, but presenting them as a negative aspect of the gearbox (which you do) is nonsense. The rest of your points are valid however! It is a challenging gearbox to use, and for track work you 100% want a paddle shift. Anyway, apologies for the harsh sounding words, not my intention, I just didn't agree with you in this one! And cheers for the all the content you are putting out, top stuff!

@charlesharris5642

3 жыл бұрын

I’ve driven both the 7 speed manual and 6 speed manual and I personally have found the 7 much better. After driving it for 100 miles or so you very quickly get used to the box and I would argue you really don’t have to think much about what gear you are in anymore than you would in the 6 speed manual.

@morecarsneeded

@chrisscott4896

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks for another fascinating video. My experience is limited to 10k miles on a 6-spd manual V12V (as well as 20k on a DB7GT), and have never used a paddle shift (!). You've certainly put me off the 7-spd manual, which I've never tried. I had presumed problems with the 1-2 dog-leg could be side-stepped by using 1st as rarely as practicable. What I hadn't appreciated was that the inevitable lateral spring-bias in favour of the 4-5 gate would make it easy to overshoot the 2-3 gate on a downshift into 2nd... But I write this mainly to comment on the presentation of these videos. Steve is an engaging personality, but do we need to have face contact with him throughout his briefings? I would prefer in this particular case to have seen him stirring that tricky gear selector, even if that meant seeing only the back of his head! Also, an inset of the RPM gauge (and even the speedo) would always be useful in these driving sequences, if that were technically possible. Thanks again, and keep up the good work!