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@jerrysstories711

10 ай бұрын

I've always thought those British villains sounded extra sinister in part because they have extremely restrained body language but enunciate their words. So they willfully block the more basic candid humanizing communication channel and work strictly through the channel that's within our conscious control. Makes them inscrutable and detached from human qualities like mercy. Could that be part of the effect?

@wandilismus8726

10 ай бұрын

Isn't American the Accent? I mean englisch is the original, American just a cheap copy ... as if China copied it 🤣

@yuki-sakurakawa

10 ай бұрын

I wonder if films made in the Southern US portray the antagonists with a northern "yankee" US accent since the north were the oppressors (according to them), though their fight for independence failed.

@yuki-sakurakawa

10 ай бұрын

Just a thought, but the rebels are actually the bad guys. They're the terrorists. If they want to change the empire, they can run for office. The empire is trying to establish law and order and are hunting down terrorists, especially since they stole top secret info and blew up a space station with tens of thousands of hard working servicemen whose families have no one anymore. In conclusion, the American accent is the bad guy accent. British accent is for law and order (BUHM BUHM) It's fine. You didn't know star wars was a propaganda video made by the terrorist leader Osama George Lucas. 😂

@yuki-sakurakawa

10 ай бұрын

That stereotypical nasal New York(?) accent @8:40 is quite grating to my ears. Texas (at least modern) has a pretty decent and charming American accent.

When I was a kid growing up in the US with a British dad, I remember one time asking him if he was evil after watching so many children's films with British villains and American heroes!

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

Really?? Can I quote you?

@flogiston824

10 ай бұрын

😂😂😂

@dianem8544

10 ай бұрын

!!! What did he say? I once asked my dad if there were cars when he was a kid and he got mad at me.

@AintThatJustTheWay

10 ай бұрын

😂 What was his response?

@none4530

10 ай бұрын

@@DrGeoffLindsey Yes of course!

British accent just sounds serious and authoritative. it's not just good for villains, its also good for professors and wise characters, as well as charming romantic leads.

@maryamkim1281

9 ай бұрын

You mean southern English non-cockney accents. British accents vary tremendously.

@Badookum

9 ай бұрын

@@maryamkim1281 Yeah the cockney accent is hilarious. Its the British equivalent of the American Redneck accent.

@zander6907

9 ай бұрын

@@maryamkim1281 yep, I would love to listen to a Geordie villain tho

@TheScodia

9 ай бұрын

@@zander6907 I don't think its possible. Geordie + Villian = impossibility. Its too friendly

@claudijatzandrapova3347

9 ай бұрын

@@zander6907ah-way wi' yer mun.. reet proper villun like xD

The irony of using Rocket Racoon as an example of an American accent is that in the comics, he had a cockney accent.

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

And is it true that the High Evo is a Brit in the comics? In which case it's not Hollywood that's "made" him a Brit. Ah well.

@BOABModels

10 ай бұрын

@@DrGeoffLindsey I've not read any of his strips but when I've seen him in cartoons, his accent is transatlantic or 'otherworldly' maybe.

@RTotaleXVII

9 ай бұрын

@@DrGeoffLindseyin the comics he’s originally from Manchester! I’d always wanted to see Christopher Eccleston portray him.

@harpo345

9 ай бұрын

And doubly ironic that cockney is probably the origin of the southern long 'a' sound - (rhyming 'can't' with 'far' instead of 'cat'). Everyone apart from working class Londoners would have had the short 'a' before the 18th century (including Shakespeare).

@rudeboysandokhan442

8 ай бұрын

@@DrGeoffLindsey Haven't seen the film yet, but in the comics he was from Manchester and educated at Oxford. I know I should have read him (in my mind) as speaking with an RP accent, but I always found it more amusing to read his sinister, faux-sophisticated dialogue with a working class Manc accent a la Karl Pilkington. I know. I'm easily amused.

😂 I love how Christian Bale as both an example for a Brit as a bad guy and Brit as a good guy within 15 to 30 seconds

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

I had Daniel Day Lewis in Gangs of New York then Lincoln, but the former got trimmed out

@Gigantotherium

8 ай бұрын

@@DrGeoffLindsey Boy, that would've been an especially good comparison, given that the two films are set at the same time!

@aliveslice

8 ай бұрын

TIL Christian Bale is British...

@peanutbutter6720

7 ай бұрын

⁠@@aliveslice Welsh to be even more precise. Though I believe he refers to himself as English given how much more time he’s spent there.

@LukaszVT40k

5 ай бұрын

Hey Paul! AAAGHHH!!!

I think it's due to the fact that a British accent sounds more intelligent, and an intelligent villain is scarier.

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

Yes, like wearing glasses. I think it stems from an association with expensive education. I probably should have included this.

@randylahey2607

9 ай бұрын

I think it's because the English used to run the world and not nicely. So people rightly associate the English accent with evildoing.

@anomonyous

9 ай бұрын

Perhaps. It 'is' a specific type of proper King's English. A rural English accent wouldn't work the same. But neither would a proper American accent.

@Blissblizzard

9 ай бұрын

@@anomonyous Guy Richie is gutted that cockney is dying out and roadman is so dull, bruv.

@KopKing11

9 ай бұрын

Wrong, we are villains but not intelligent.

Always thought it was because the English accent is associated with intelligence, and the bad guys are usually very intelligent.

@philroberts7238

10 ай бұрын

But never intelligent enough! (It would take a brave film studio to suggest otherwise.)

@AdrianColley

10 ай бұрын

It's part of the anti-intellectualism streak in American pop culture.

@Theomite

10 ай бұрын

I always associated it with "educated" because their syntax and vocabulary always indicated a more well-read background than most trad American education. They'd use more eloquent sentences that reflected an experience with poetry than the simple, practical conversation used by Americans who *maybe* read "Casey at the Bat" in school.

@annasolovyeva1013

10 ай бұрын

Unintelligent and low-class villains speak mock Russian accent. Zey speak like zis. Gpprr. (P = Russian R).

@kevinshort3943

10 ай бұрын

I thought it was because the English accent is associated with intelligence, and Americans are scared of/intimidated by intelligence.

I love this, because my mother hated her strong Yorkshire accent, so she basically forced me to do the ultra stereotypical British Villain accent all my life, and whilst I can tone it down to fit my Sheffield surroundings, it is a whole lot of fun to talk like a villain every once in a while.

@kitethetwinblade

5 ай бұрын

Lean into it and just sing 'Be Prepared' in the shower and on the walk to work every morning. :P

@TheSulross

5 ай бұрын

Yeah, if a villain doesn't sport a British accent, then am getting up out of my seat and going to get a refund for my ticket My favorite villain voice of all time is the Shere Khan voice from Disney's Jungle Book - it's the grade A maple syrup of villainy voices

@viktorarsovski1685

3 ай бұрын

And here's me propagandised to all heck thinking that the villainous accents were "chosen" to resemble German accents or at least as close to German, like Allen Rickman in Die Hard Yes I know he wasn't German but he had a really convincing case thinking for a good part of my life that he may have 😊

@davidlloyd7597

Күн бұрын

​@@viktorarsovski1685German or eastern European. The tradition of RP speaking villians doesn't appear to be as strong in Australia or NZ

As stated in the video already, a British accent can be used for old and wise people, this is another reason why it is commonly used for villains, especially those who seem to have everything under control and are very calm, even under heated circumstances. In short, British can sound calm, that's why it fits with calm villains

@TheSulross

5 ай бұрын

but a British accent also works extremely well for doing psychopathy with posh

@TheMastermind729

2 ай бұрын

@@TheSulrossbut that comes from the juxtaposition of calmness and psychopathy

My favorite British actor playing an American, complete with perfect American accent, is Hugh Laurie in “House MD”. In one episode there was an impressive scene in which someone hangs up the telephone on House. So House calls back impersonating someone else by using a fake British accent. My mind was blown as I realized Hugh’s accents had reached “Inception” levels.

@AdrianColley

10 ай бұрын

Personally, I liked the fake-British accent affected by Samantha Jones on _Sex And The City_ when she was facing an RP-speaking English waiter who suspected (correctly) that Samantha was impersonating a member in order to use the swimming pool. The actress (Kim Cattrall) was born in Liverpool, but raised in Canada. Her American accent sounded perfectly natural to me, but her faux-British accent was a delightful horror.

@bryanreed742

10 ай бұрын

It's reminiscent of Tatiana Maslany, who is Canadian, playing an English character posing as a Canadian, and in the very same episode, playing an American character posing as her English character...and all the accents are subtly different.

@OscarOSullivan

10 ай бұрын

⁠Wouldn’t someone working as a waiter from England have a regional accent

@annelyle5474

10 ай бұрын

@@OscarOSullivan Perhaps natively, but they're probably putting on an RP accent to give an impression of sophistication. Very few people over here speak true RP any more, as Dr Lindsey has pointed out elsewhere

@OscarOSullivan

10 ай бұрын

@@annelyle5474 Thanks

Jeremy Irons as Scar is legendary. He belongs with Darth Vader in the league of villains

@undead.rising

10 ай бұрын

Ironically, if you haven't noticed, James Earl Jones who voices Darth Vader is the voice of Mufasa, Scar's brother whom he kills.

@the98themperoroftheholybri33

10 ай бұрын

@@undead.rising he is also Thulsa Doom in Conan the barbarian. Therefore all 3 must be within the same James Earl Jones universe

@anndeecosita3586

10 ай бұрын

@@the98themperoroftheholybri33I i am confused how JEJ sounds English

@sarahudson108

10 ай бұрын

He is from Mississippi , so the two brothers had different accents .

@maryamkim1281

9 ай бұрын

​@@anndeecosita3586probably his training and time spent in England.

Lots of reasons but it’s also opportunity. British actors see an opportunity and take it. It’s also a lot more fun playing bad guys. My favourite is Hugh Grant’s revelatory performance in Paddington 2. He was like a man reborn after all those tiresome romantic roles and obvs having a ball

@VunderGuy

8 ай бұрын

Because villainous roles aren't tiring especially when they all sound like they prefer guzzling down jars of marmite all night b

@windhelmguard5295

8 ай бұрын

i always had the suspicion that staring as a villain and hamming it up like crazy, in a film that is very clearly not deserving of their talent, is what acclaimed British actors do when they feel like going on vacation without actually taking days off.

One British accent you are very unlikely to hear in any movie; the West Midland Black Country accent. It's not exactly popular (like the milder Birmingham accent) but there is something special about it. The area became a heavily industrialised during the 19th century hence the given name.

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

I'm afraid I haven't yet seen it, but I believe Peaky Blinders has given some midlands accents a bit of visibility.

I appreciate the symmetry of Christian Bale and Daniel Day-Lewis showing up as American bad guys and American good guys.

@captainobvious9188

10 ай бұрын

It wasn’t until this video that I realized my own list of favorite actors are pretty much all Brits. Daniel Day-Lewis’ performance of Lincoln is one of my favorite individual performances.

@TheEudaemonicPlague

10 ай бұрын

Just yesterday, I learned that Cecil Day-Lewis (Daniel's father) was Poet Laureate...and in the 1920s, was forced to write pulp mysteries (under the name Nicholas Blake) to make a living, with the first third of the first one making fun of the genre, but found himself falling in love with the character, so he wrote fourteen more. Sorry, just had to share that...

@jaxsazerac4904

10 ай бұрын

Shakespeare

@teebzbstd

10 ай бұрын

When u hear Christian Bale with his birth accent, it has such a villainous sound to it.

Anyone who can put his boot on your neck without spilling his tea or sounding agitated is clearly evil.

To me, I think there is a common theme in the use of the British accent for the villain (negative) and wizard or butler (positive), which I would describe as 'sophistication'. I imagine that subconsciously, there is a link between an accent such as RP with education or academic interest, which then shows off either positively as wise, or negatively as machiavellian.

@TheSulross

5 ай бұрын

and additionally, a British accent works extremely well for doing psychopathy with posh

@dstarfire42

3 ай бұрын

I agree. The use of British accents for villains is nothing more than a scriptwriters shortcut. One of the most common villain archetypes is the person who is intelligent, sophisticated, and financially successful. An RP accent conveys the intelligent and sophisticated aspects in just a few seconds and is reinforced every time the character speaks. Without this, you'd have to spend extra time showing the villain being genuinely intelligent and sophisticated (and not just faking it for gain, which is a completely different archetype). Then you'd have to reinforce that throughout the movie maintain that juxtaposition of positive traits with villainous acts.

@Arkylie

3 ай бұрын

I'd agree. As I was watching this video, I was expecting it to wind around to mere classism (reverse classism? classism pushback?), but it seems it's a bit more complicated. But yes, it feels like there's a spectrum between educated RP and uneducated hillbilly/Cockney, yet it's not a strictly moral dichotomy like I might have assumed. Hence the villains who are intelligent and calculated (even if sadistic) get an RP accent, while those that are brutish get the opposite. Has Lord Vetinari ever been on film yet? I'd totally expect an RP accent for a character like that.

George Sanders as Shere Khan is deliciously sinister and what makes it work even better is that it sounds so charming too. Jeremy Irons is similar, but his voice has a slightly harder edge to it.

@annep.1905

5 ай бұрын

I always thought it was the deepness of Khan's voice, rather than his accent, that made him sound villainous.

One of my favorite uses of this trope is Wes Anderson's Fantastic Mr. Fox, where all the animal characters are given American accents and all the human characters are given British accents

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

Ah yes, good point. I happen not to have seen it.

@inisipisTV

10 ай бұрын

Very notable in the Original Star Wars. Besides all the Empire are played by British actors, while the Rebel soldiers and pilot, though being played by British actors have been dubbed to have an American accent.

@TheFatController.

10 ай бұрын

I found that annoying.. An English book, for English kids, made into a crap movie by Americans where they are infallible good guys.

@ellencoleman4604

10 ай бұрын

​@@TheFatController.Yes and it wasn't just the accents, the characterisation was also changed to be 'American family where the Dad's having a midlife crisis'. Overdone and unrelatable to a little English girl, I was very disappointed.

@swee2251

10 ай бұрын

@@inisipisTV I mentioned this to my friends when we watched that movie, but they didn't understood what I meant at that time. This was during the early 1990s and we were very young. We had never heard anyone else talk about this at that time. It took a lot of explanation and more Hollywood movies through the years for them to notice it. I think I noticed earlier because I had a British teacher in elementary school. The friends I met later had never met a British person at that time.

Hugh Laurie fooled so many Americans into thinking he wasn't british when he played Dr. House. I was familiar with him in his older roles like Black Adder and Jeeves and Wooster so I was just flat impressed with how well he pulled it off. There was one scene though where he laughed, and his laugh had a british accent. It was hilarious.

@tomfields3682

10 ай бұрын

So did John Mahoney, Marty Crane on Frasier.

@CyanideSunshines

9 ай бұрын

I found this hilarious because as a Brit I grew up with him in his comedy roles . I forget that we get American tv more than America gets ours so obviously they wouldn't know him as well

@AnnaReed42

9 ай бұрын

I get a kick out of noticing when a particularly good fake accent slips. I've gotten better at noticing it over the years, but I think Hugh Laurie as House was probably one of the first that I noticed the odd slip. It was very rare, though! I grew up watching Brit Coms on PBS every night, so I knew him from the shows you mentioned.

@TheCarrShow

9 ай бұрын

@@AnnaReed42 He did have the odd slip, especially in the first couple of episodes. But his American accent became very convincing over the years. Also, his natural accent isn't a stereotypical British one, so a lot of Americans thought he was doing a fake British accent.

@TiffyVella1

8 ай бұрын

I remember him from University Challenge. Good Old Lord Monty.

You wouldn't believe how much aggro I got as a kid because my mother deliberately pressured me to speak "properly" (i.e. Received Pronunciation) despite us living below the poverty line. She just managed to alienate me from EVERYONE I spoke to. It has taken me absolutely decades to undo her accent-conditioning... but relating exclusively to villains seems to be a permanent thing for me now.

@johndoyle5706

5 ай бұрын

That would've been very tough for you and I felt sorry for you after reading your comment. I think it was George Bernard Shaw who said something like; when one English man opens his mouth to speak another English man instantly despises him.

@johndoyle5706

5 ай бұрын

And my father who was Irish made fun of me one day when I was very young. He said I was a little Cockley always dropping my h's. I made an instant decision to continue to drop my h's. Parents eh?

@Vinemaple

4 ай бұрын

Once I, a short, slightly built man, started standing straighter and more upright, on advice of my physical therapist, I quickly noticed people reacted much less positively towards me, and were often downright combative. So I started hunching again, and now everyone is happy to see me again. I still find this troubling, even though I was never in any danger from it.

@RageMagikarp

4 ай бұрын

Same-same but different, I grew up in a poor area of the deep south in the United States and my parents made sure we didn't speak with southern accents because "people will think you're stupid." All that did was make all the other kids think that we thought we were better than them, talking with a generic American non-accent as opposed to the local accent like a normal person.

@xrayban2

Ай бұрын

It's the same with people speaking natively another language and forced to speak the main one.

I can assure you that the British accent will live on. I grew up on British tv in America and when I was little I had a slight british accent when I spoke. This was corrected later on but it made for a great amount of laughs among my family for many years😂

I always found the choice of accents for the orcs and uruk-hai in the Lord of the RIngs movies quite interesting - they all have English accents, but the Uruk-hai have more middle-class accents (although given how gravelly their voices are, it's more difficult to tell), whereas the plain old orcs all have pronounced cockney / London accents. "We're not going no further 'til we've had a breather!"

@cncshrops

10 ай бұрын

'... breever...' perhaps?

@timaidley7801

10 ай бұрын

@@cncshrops that's what I remembered them as saying, but I went back and had another listen, and it sounded like 'breather'

@jossland1628

10 ай бұрын

@@timaidley7801 That's exactly what they are saying. A breather is a rest, to have time to breathe. So, a breather.

@chadmelonite9999

10 ай бұрын

​@@jossland1628They know what 'breather' means. They are discussing how it would be pronounced in a cockney accent.

@cow_tools_

10 ай бұрын

Well, several of the Uruk-hai were actually acted by New Zealanders. The implication there is sort of that the orcs are an Old World rabble and the Uruk-hai are newer (although they barely talk much, so it's a bit of a stretch).

I really like the way the Andor series updated the old Star Wars cliché of American accent good, British accent bad. The rebels speak an odd hodgepodge of working class American, British, Irish, Scottish, and Australian accents, anchored by Diego Luna with his heavy Mexican accent. It drives home the point that the rebels come from all different planets. The imperials all speak posh RP, and Karn the social climbing imperial collaborator speaks an uptight high class American accent showing how he doesn’t quite fit in anywhere.

As someone that has Lerner English as their second language, videos like this are so fascinating. Accents and language in general are so complex, but how people deliberately decide what accent to use to deliver a certain emotion is incredible.

The “I can’t stannim” scene from “Singin’ in the Rain” is one of my all-time favorite movie scenes. ❤️🙂

I’ve always wondered why British singers sound American but only when singing. I think it’d be an interesting video idea.

@digitalnomad9985

10 ай бұрын

@soltanikian "I’ve always wondered why British singers sound American but only when singing. I think it’d be an interesting video idea." Brits and Americans sound American when singing rock, blues, jazz, or related pop styles. Americans and Brits sound "posh" when singing classical styles like Handel and most formal choral type stuff, opera and the like (if in English). Also, "accent" is not just the sound of the phonemes, it is also emphasis (literal "accent), and pitch and inflection. When singing, all of those other things are ironed flat by the tempo, pitch, and dynamics of the score. And the vocabulary and word choice is ironed flat by the lyrics.

@n0oOoO

10 ай бұрын

i think americans have a more melodic accent, in the sense that when they speak their words flow together, whereas for british people their accent consists of a lot of stopping and starting e.g. saying 'wa'er bo'le' instead of 'water bottle'. its quite hard to sing with that accent because it doesn't allow you to hold the note as the missing letter is represented by a change in breath, caused by restricting the throat. so its easier to change the accent which allows the singer to hold the note and keep the melody flowing Also british people tend to miss out letters and don't enunciate words, which makes the lyrics harder to understand. i dont think this is a major factor its just one consideration. that being said this is all second hand knowledge so i might've explained this incorrectly or missed thing out, hope it helped a bit though.

@leeprice133

10 ай бұрын

​@@digitalnomad9985yeah, one article I read basically says that a combination of pretty much unavoidable things that happen when you sing (lengthening of syllables, increased vocalisation, less precise articulation) just naturally create a fairly neutral sound that happens to share a number of features with General American.

@lordhoot1

10 ай бұрын

​@n0oOoO I don't really believe this. I think the accent when singing certain kinds of music is a convention associated with the form. Blues, rock and roll etc are after all American-derived genres and the earliest British practitioners were imitating American singers they idolised. Then it just became the convention. There are loads of exceptions though, all the way back to the Kinks in the 1960s who made a choice to sing in their native accent. More recently British rappers of the 90s tended to imitate Americans while performing, but as the UK rap scene matured they gradually dropped that in favour of more authentic UK working class accents.

@petegarnett7731

10 ай бұрын

@@digitalnomad9985 The beatles did O.K. with their natural Liverpool accents!!

While an imported Japanese video game, Xenoblade 2's English dub, localized in England, is delightfully absurd if you think too hard about the accents. The heroes consist of 1 Northern English, 2 Southern English, 1 Scottish, 1 Welsh, and about 5.5 Americans, while the villains are almost entirely American. It gets even stranger when you consider that the RP speakers have completely isolated themselves while the _Glaswegians_ of all people form the local empire.

@bagelman2634

10 ай бұрын

And they conquer Wales

@moritamikamikara3879

10 ай бұрын

I was about to object when you said that Rex has a southern English accent until I realised you were referring to the second new character (Yay spoilers)

@WhitePaintbrush

10 ай бұрын

I would really love to know what the decision-making process was behind which accent goes where.

@westminsterabbey.6916

10 ай бұрын

Was the 6th American guy going through an identity crisis?

@angeldude101

10 ай бұрын

@@westminsterabbey.6916 I mean... you _could_ say that. It wouldn't be _completely_ wrong. Or maybe it would be more accurate to say it was the 5th that went through one. (As you might expect, _it's complicated.)_

I think it really just boils down to the enunciation. It's associated with authority when words are so clearly and deliberately spoken, which lends itself to calculating villains. Put that together with a deep voice, and you get your fatherly figures or your villains. I was always stuck with those two roles, even in high school, because of my low voice. And while I did watch/copy enough Monty Python to be good enough to trick Brits including my Londoner roommate, my roles didn't generally use a British accent, and certainly not RP intentionally. But the way I enunciated my words in any accent did always bear some resemblance to RP.

Dr, I like your style of presentation. Good pace, camera no too near, clear delivery. You’re quite good at this

I read about 10 years ago that there are so many British actors, or US actors with a British accent as the villains in Hollywood movies because US actors don't want their 'good guy' image tarnished. I think because of the British theatre tradition, British actors focus on the acting rather than image, thinking that good acting will be more memorable than being a good character in a movie. And to me that's true. Alan Rickman, Tim Curry etc have always been some of my favourite characters because they were able to convey the evilness of their characters so well. But to US-citizens, that doesn't matter. I remember Lena Headey recounting that first of all, no one wanted her autograph at a US convention when she was seated in a line with 'good' characters from Game of Thrones, and that she even got spat on by a 'fan' of the show. With an attitude towards actors portraying evil characters like that, it is no surprise that the majority of Hollywood blockbuster evil characters are not portayed by US actors. I imagine their agents have convinced them that the only course after playing an evil character, will playing nothing but evil characters.

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

Really interesting comment. Though of course America has a great tradition of character actors.

@s4098429

10 ай бұрын

Very good observation. I agree. In Hollywood movies characters can either be played by actors or celebrities. Most American‘actors’ are actually celebrities. Brits are always actors. Looking at Australian actors in Hollywood, most are trying to work as actors not celebrities; they can’t use their Australian accent at work. So they can never play ‘themselves’ in a movie. Tom Cruise, Brad Pitt etc they are always playing ‘themselves’ no one takes much notice of their character’s name, their just in new exciting situations each movie and are acting out how they themselves would behave if it was real, at least in the eyes of the viewer.

@chong2389

10 ай бұрын

I still have a difficult time watching American actors in Shakespeare's plays. If the actor has 'celebrity' status it exacerbates the unbelievability. Some things do not 'translate'.

@stevieinselby

10 ай бұрын

One of York's most locally celebrated sons is the actor Berwick Kaler, who for 40 years or so has starred as the pantomime dame in the city's annual panto. He has in the past done a few bits for TV, but turned down a role for The Bill as a bad guy, because he didn't want to have his panto persona associated with that kind of role ... although that's pretty niche and quite different from a Hollywood star turning it down!

@tankermottind

10 ай бұрын

@@chong2389 To me no Shakespeare sounds right unless it's done in OP. Modern RP is way too stiff, formal, American sounds absurd, and both ruin the meter and rhyme of the poetry. If it doesn't sound like it's being performed by Welsh pirates, it's not Shakespeare.

The war of independence was Brits fighting Brits for not treating them as Brits.

@laurencefraser

10 ай бұрын

More accurately it was brits fighting brits over the fact that one lot REALLY wanted to get away with tax evasion. (with the taxes they were paying being much lower than those than brits elsewhere were obliged to). Representation doesn't show up until after the rebels had commited to violence, first in a note that there was no hope of convincing Parliament to agree to their position of 'no taxes, ever' unless they had their own MPs, and then after the fighting had already begun, it shows up in rebel recruitment propaganda. (oh, and before the war had started the rebels had conducted a months long campaign of murder and arson against loyalist colonists... which had resulted in, between the deaths and loyalists fleeing to what would become canada, the loss of about a third of the population of the 'american' colonies.) Keep in mind, the oh so horrible tax (which, keep in mind, was the lowest anyone in the empire was paying) that was being rebelled against was impossed in response to a Previous tax rebellion, under circumstanses where most other governments at the time would have sent in the army to put down the rebels (organized refusal to pay tax being an act of revolt). The previous tax had been even More generous: A one time levy on the colonies for a percentage of the expenses of the troops that were garrisoned there to defend them during the war that had just ended. Note: this was only the expenses incurred during the war, only for the troops actually defending the colonies that were asked to pay it, and only a fraciton of that cost. ... it gets better: The war started due to colonists In Those Colonies conducting unsacntioned raids on neighbouring French colonies (which, of course, the french objected to, and so sent soldiers to go deal with it... which, of course the British government objected to, and so declared war, to Protect Their Citizens... you know, those colonists we're talking about?)... and, of course, being a war between two world spanning empires, fighting promptly spread around the globe (it was functionally a world war). The British won, but it Wrecked their treasury. Hence the taxes). The stamp tax? It was a little bit punative (though, again, still the lowest anyone was paying), but Mostly it was easy to Collect. The really fun part is that, upon attaining their independence, the colonies promptly found out Just How Much of their defence, adminsitration, and infrastructure was being subsidised by taxpayers back in Britain. The domestic taxes needed to cover those expenses Well exceeded what the British Parliament had ever asked for, and have only gone up since. (oh, and the claim that it was a war against oppressive monarchy? No, it was a war against a democratically elected parliament. The only thing the king did in the whole sorry affair was write a letter to the colonies pointing out that not paying taxes and taking up arms against the government were rebellion and would need to be treated as such, and clearly no one wanted that so maybe don't, ok? Because A: He wasn't actually a very compitent king and B: The advisors who he would of course ask for information about the matter when it was brought directly to his atteniton (via a letter from some of the colonists) were the very ministers who had made the decisions that were being complained about, who, of course, informed him that it was a minor issue already well in hand and not something he had to worry about (this wasn't some sinister plot, at the time, so far as they could tell, that was entirely the case!) This is what you will find if you actually look at the records of the time rather than post-war American propaganda. Including, I should note, in those records kept by the rebels themselves (in as much as any were). Or at least, it's certainly closer to this than to what you will encounter in American primary schools or a certain musical. .

@stellabrando9308

10 ай бұрын

@@laurencefraser Interesting.

@tulliusexmisc2191

10 ай бұрын

@@laurencefraser There are some useful points in there, but they are in the company of some very unorthodox claims. The British government in the 18th century was far from democratically elected. Both the word and the idea of democracy were anathema to even the more radical politicians in the UK, and indeed most other countries. Only a small minority of Britons were allowed to vote, all of them wealthy, nearly all of them men, and none of them in the colonies. Even among that minority, voters were far from equal: numerous MPs were elected in rotten boroughs with a handful of voters, sometimes only one. And that is before we consider the still powerful House of Lords and the Crown, and the sadly still-familiar corrupt influence of vested interests. I mention the democratic deficit not just as a pedantic quibble. It is central to the political movements that led to the revolution. The preferred goal of most of the influential colonists was not to continue living in a tax haven, nor did they want to return representatives to parliament in London. That would have been hopelessly impractical with 18th-century communications, they would have made up an insignificant minority, and they would have spent most of their time dealing with British affairs. The colonists wanted a say in making their own laws, not England's. In the years leading up to the American Revolution, few colonists thought they could or should become independent. The expectation was home rule, with colonies electing parliaments with some degree of power, but still ultimately answering to the king. This appeared perfectly viable at the time, especially if one considers Ireland as an example (this was before the union with Britain), and it would prove an effective model many years later for the dominions. But for decades, Westminster had refused to devolve powers. Considering how Charles I's arbitrary taxes had led to the English revolution, Britain instead had pursued a policy of no taxation as a sop to the wealthy figures it needed to keep onside. This was an unhappy compromise: the colonists didn't get what they needed most (influence over their own affairs) and the government didn't get what it needed (revenue). Perhaps it is no surprise it didn't last.

@alexanderguerrero347

10 ай бұрын

@@laurencefraserI mean who really wants to pay taxes.

@M2Mil7er

10 ай бұрын

@@alexanderguerrero347 people who want to live in a civilized nation. But it's not enough to just pay taxes, but to compel their governments to ensure those taxes are spent in a way which enhances the common good of everyone in said nation, instead of subsidizing private companies which extract that common wealth to hide in offshore tax havens. That's who.

Wow! This is a superbly narrated series of sequences and beats that all make for an incredibly coherent and succinct lecture. Bravo!

Good stuff! I appreciate the sheer amount of effort here- really putting in the work!

I think it has less to do with colonial past and more to do with class. America doesn't have a rigid hierarchical class/accent system. We do have class of course, but it's not identifiable by accent. At least, not in the upward direction. We do have some accents that would be considered "low class" by some (sadly), such as Appalachian, deep Southern, certain Black American accents, maybe even thick Boston/New York/Philly accents. But we don't really have "high class" accents. We used to, as heard in some of the old Hollywood clips you shared, but all that is long gone. There is no widely recognized "posh" American accent. So, when we want to make someone sound posh in a movie (evil or otherwise), the best shorthand is to use a posh English accent, which most Americans still recognize as being high class (and it's not hard to jump from high class to evil). I think it's that simple. Edit: Yes, as many replies have pointed out, there are some uncommon accents that may be considered upper class in America, but they are not encountered on a day to day basis. In fact, many of these accents are individual idiolects, usually of wealthy elderly people with some kind of specific speech training. On top of that, on the rare occasions that normal Americans DO hear these kinds of accents, they will actually tend to think of them as sounding vaguely British. People unfamiliar with transatlantic accents often wonder why all old Hollywood actors were British. For the most part, if you ask an American to name a "high class" accent, they will almost always indicate RP. (They will probably just say "British", because most Americans don't even know there are multiple English accents, let alone many more British ones)

@tacitozetticci9308

10 ай бұрын

yep I think that this was a central point to make

@razzle_dazzle

10 ай бұрын

I think there is a "posh" contemporary American accent, but it's only subtly distinct from General American. Think Lucille Bluth or Frasier.

@papaicebreakerii8180

10 ай бұрын

@@razzle_dazzleit’s more abt word choice and less abt the accent itself

@jeff__w

10 ай бұрын

There’s also the related phenomenon of Hollywood “Roman empire” epics, e.g. _Spartacus,_ _Ben Hur,_ where the patrician Romans speak with RP (or RP-inflected) accents and the plebeians or slaves speak with US accents. Like you, I don’t think that’s a transfer of something having to do with the British empire. It seems like more of a “class thing.”

@jared_bowden

10 ай бұрын

Its also interesting to note that the old 'American posh' accent (Transatlantic) itself was heavily influenced by RP and that this was a conscious decision, since (unlike RP) almost no one grew up speaking it, so associating RP with 'poshness' goes back at least 100 years.

There seems to be a class element here too. In Star Wars, the officers of the Empire are all British, but the rank-and-file stormtroopers all speak in General American.

@xhagast

8 ай бұрын

Well, it takes a Brit to pull it off, remember Tarkin and Princess Leia, Peter Cushing was GREAT.

@LonesomeTwin

6 ай бұрын

You'd think general Americans would be able to shoot better then

@Vinemaple

4 ай бұрын

I still feel like the Imperial officers, and especially Darth Vader, speak with more of a Trans-Atlantic accent. As did Ewan MacGregor.

I never comment on videos but I have been binging yours for the past week and you've easily become my favorite creator. I'm a college student newly getting into linguistics and I appreciate the passion and effort you put into your videos. I hope I meet many people like you and hopefully become one myself

Your segue into the sponsorship bit was so smooth that I actually listened to it rather than skipping ahead on the progress bar like I usually do in most cases.

@johndoyle5706

5 ай бұрын

Really! It drove me mad and really detracted from my enjoyment of his clip.

The other factor in the prevalence of English RP accents in villains may just be a practical one. The villain in a film is often a far more difficult character to do effectively than the often one-dimensional hero, so Hollywood has had a long history of turning to British theatre actors with their drama school backgrounds and experience with Shakespearean roles to play them.

@mustardsfire22

10 ай бұрын

Especially when it wasn't usually the case that the British actors were considered attractive and manly (ex. Sydney Greenstreet or Claude Rains) compared to the leading American actors like Humphrey Bogart, Jimmy Stewart, John Wayne, etc. I'm sure some part of it might've also been colonial history that even sympathetic Brits or Brits otherwise on the side of the Americans were often portrayed as dandyish or unmanly in some way.

@sirilandgren

10 ай бұрын

@@mustardsfire22 Very good point! I also think the Shakespeare angle might come into play in the sense that we expect villains to speak in a more theatrical, less down-to-earth way, which often borrows from traditional theater (with Shakespeare as its poster boy).

@iprobablyforgotsomething

10 ай бұрын

What might also play a part is how an accent is an easy way to immediately identify a character from others, but they'd want it to be both something 'different' and lowkey dramatic *but also* well received and easily parsed by our American ears . A 'familiar foreign-ness' if you will. Enter : the (varying) British Accent, stage right, via Villain Insert-Name-Here!

@ellencoleman4604

10 ай бұрын

​@@sirilandgrenSome people also believe that Hollywood historically 'queer-coded' their villains. It would be interesting to look more into whether that played a part or whether it was more of a byproduct of the theatricality.

@jensonthebastard

10 ай бұрын

@@mustardsfire22 yeah amerimutts always try to call us unmanly but i suppose if your people invented the modern cuckold ideology (messing around with the farming equipment, weird) and the gay and trans pride flags and strip clubs for trans 8 year olds.... you would have to project that onto other people so you could live in the fantasy that you have won a war and your country isnt brown and gay

One recent and notable example of British voice casting I know of is in the localisation behind Final Fantasy XVI where the producer has confirmed there will be no North American accents used in the English version, only regional dialect from across the British Isles. Further than this characters from the North would have Northern accents, including Geordie. This was done purposefully so that when you heard a character speak, if you listen closely, you would be able to understand a bit of their heritage and where they're from geographically.

@rexex345

10 ай бұрын

FFXVI actually has a reason for the no Americans thing. Which really can be summed up as, CBU3 have used, I think its BBC Radio(?) as their acting source since FFXIVs first expansion. The change over from an American company came down to pronunciation and consistency, which is just horrifically evident since the American is still in that games base game stuff. The Americans had an insanely hard time pronouncing even each other's names correctly or consistently and they really struggled with the more medieval structured dialog let alone have be able to give good performances. Meanwhile the British cast, most of which have both radio drama and RSC credits, were able to speak much more naturally and consistently and even were able to better match various British accents to different regions to provide cultural differentiation. It also very much changed the vocal timbre since being trained in radio dramas, the actors all have a much more naturalistic way of speaking rather than that of a traditional VA... A trick that was actually part of how the anime Cowboy Bebop did it's casting.

@tommeakin1732

10 ай бұрын

Honestly it sounds like a really interesting idea to overlay a bunch of real world accents over a fantasy world in terms of both geography and general cultural patterns. Obviously there's *a lot* that goes into building an accent, but I've even heard it suggested that real world accents (and possibly dialects, I don't remember) often have a "feel" that mimics geography, or has features that are possibly caused by elements of the environment. Like perhaps an accent or dialect from a very flat area may be, well, "flatter", whereas one from a valley-ridden place may have more of a frequent rising and lowering in pitch. Similarly I've heard it suggested that coastal accents may be more nasally, which might have something to do with sea air. I have no idea if any of that is backed up by anything solid, and I feel silly bringing it up tbh lol - but if I'm honest, it does actually feel like it tracks with a lot of accents I'm familiar with. But anyway - it'd be interesting to see if overlaying that theory on a fictitious world could aid in the world feeling more immersive.

Thank you for compiling this.

Always so insightful!

I second the “class” angle more than anything else. You rarely hear Birmingham or West Country or Yorkshire villains (except on the level of local miscreants), and if they were to show up they’d be in danger of not being taken seriously as a threat to more than their hometown.

@Bella-fz9fy

10 ай бұрын

You do get Cockney villains.

@BooksAndShitButNotLiterally

10 ай бұрын

Yep, and you simply never hear a single Cumbrian accent anywhere!

@stickynotemetagaming

8 ай бұрын

​@@BooksAndShitButNotLiterallyNor Lincolnshire, so uncommon it was a major deal when one man on BBC Lincs spoke like us rather than RP, when I think that in regional news we should have folk speaking like proper natives not copy paste southern aristocrat.

@jamspandex4973

8 ай бұрын

Dave prowse, who played Darth Vader, was from Bristol, so I always imagine Darth Vader saying "The force is strong in this un", "whe n Oi left, Oi was but a pupil, now, Oi am the maaaster"

@TiffyVella1

8 ай бұрын

Yes. There are dozens of British accents, but only one used extensively for villains. Its always received. This is about class.

i also find documentaries narrated in british english more compelling, belieavable and serious than those narrated in american english 😂

@zhenia2511

10 ай бұрын

Well, that's easy to explain. We associate RP with wealth and the rich have access to better education.

@ericconnor8419

10 ай бұрын

>British documentary >Here, in the jungles of Bhata-Tuthu, the praying mantis is in search of its prey >3 minutes of very clean and uninterrupted footage of the pray mantis following a spider >american """documentary""" >guitar riff playing in the background >YOU PROBABLY WOULDN'T WANT ONE OF THESE KILLERS IN YOUR BACK YARD >Rapid jump cuts of the praying mantis THE PRAYING MANTIS MIGHT LOOK LIKE A BUG IN CHURCH, BUT THIS NASTY MOTHER-SUCKER IS NOT TO BE MESSED WITH >more flashy jump cuts >THIS LITTLE SPIDER DOESNT KNOW WHATS WAITING FOR HIM, THE FURY OF THE MANTIS IS NOT TO BE UNDERESTIMATED >more flashy jump cuts >the mantis strikes >strange animal growling and screeching noises are dubbed in as it attacks because silent footage is too boring for americans >slow mo replay of the attack in black and white >AND IT'S OVER IN A FLASH >THAT LITTLE SPIDER >SHOULD'VE PRAYED >TO THE MANTIS >Starwipe to the next clip

@truemetalsonic

10 ай бұрын

I've actually seen an editing comparison between American and English documentaries using the same footage - I can't find it again but the English one was very formal and clean while the American one had lots of cuts, sound effects and dramatic wording of everything.

@sandradermark8463

10 ай бұрын

Attenborough documentaries and others on the BBC are so relaxing...

@jupitersnoot4915

10 ай бұрын

Whenever I see a documentary narrated by an American I feel like I'm being talked at by a child lol.

An excellent, informing and entertaining video about an interesting topic. Thank you! RP always sounds like it fits so well to conniving and evil characters.. but perhaps we are very conditioned to think so.

I absolutely love your channel. Thank you thank you thank you!!!!

I was entirely shocked to discover Tom Holland was actually British! I specifically sought out an interview to see for myself, since I was convinced he was American given his Brooklyn accent as Spiderman

@lucie4185

10 ай бұрын

Have you seen the Graham Norton interview with him and Tom hanks where they do an acting class and Tom Holland gradually gets more American the more he acts 😅

@level9drow856

10 ай бұрын

As an American Tom tricked me to. It's always easy for Brits to do our accents but seldom the other way around, unless you're Chris Pratt.

@theadamabrams

10 ай бұрын

Quite ironically, "Spider-man: Homecoming" was shot very far from the UK, while parts of "Spider-man: Far From Home" were filmed just a few blocks from where Tom grew up. (He pointed this out in an interview a few years ago; I didn't come up with this myself.)

@aleman1788

10 ай бұрын

@@level9drow856 It's usually because there aren't as many visas and acting opportunities for Americans in the UK, and they focus on working in the Hollywood where Brits go to "make it big" too. And the wall that the US media industrial complex made to control the amount of foreign entertainment Americans get that might threaten the US media industry. Mind you, many US actors say they can do a RP accent in their resumes. They don't focus on it as much apparently.

@MelGibsonFan

10 ай бұрын

Gonna nitpick here but Holland definitely does NOT have a good Brooklyn accent. I’m not a linguist but I am New York native who grew up right on the Brooklyn/Queens border. There aren’t really even borough specific accents out here, NY accents largely align by class and ethnicity. Tom Holland does have a good generic American accent though.

One big exception here is Jean-Baptiste Emannuel Zorg! Portrayed by Gary Oldman, a Brit, doing an over-the-top southern American accent. Such a great character!

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

It's not really an exception. I think associations with the American South are complex...

@tonyclifton265

10 ай бұрын

you're a monster, Zorg! i know.

@unpakable

10 ай бұрын

The South African/Afrikaans accent is another good one for 'the bad guys'

@tonyclifton265

10 ай бұрын

@@unpakable yup, especially in the 80s during apartheid

@nicholasvinen

10 ай бұрын

I think it was Red Letter Media who were recently complaining that every poor person in a movie set in the USA has to have a Southern accent. They called it a tired old trope and I think they're right. One movie I can think of that lampshaded that trope is Idiocracy.

As soon as the camera cut before Rey could say ‘Skywalker’ I liked the video 👍

❤ Hello! So glad I found your channel! I love this content and look forward to much learning! I lived in a small town (800 people) in the mountains of central Idaho. I noticed speech patterns where an “R” wash inserted in words like squash and wash. Words were “squarsh” and “warsh”. Why? I’ve also wondered how the accents of all the people who settled North America got all mushed up to create all the fascinating accents I hear in America! Thank you for sharing your knowledge with us! ❤

Cutting Julie Andrews off from her big number after "the" made me choke on my drink 😂😂😂

@AdrianColley

10 ай бұрын

Well, we got the gist, so there was no need to labour the point.

@robinbeckford

10 ай бұрын

Mercifully spared, so we were.

@Skiddins

10 ай бұрын

Not half as much as not allowing 'Rey' to finish saying 'Skywalker'.. so all is right in the world ;-)

@minicle426

10 ай бұрын

Reminds me of the parody from the Goodies when someone shot her.

@robanks3895

10 ай бұрын

@@robinbeckford That scene has to be one of the best movie opening scenes, and Julie Andrews has one of poshest English accents! IMO

The relationship between RP and american high class accents is an interesting one to raise, as they really are very close. Growing up, I always used to be confused by it when I would see members of the same family, one of whom used this high class accent and another who didn't. Frasier and Niles vs their father, Archer's mom vs Archer, etc. I would always wonder "How come that one is British but that other one isn't? Weren't they raised together?" I think the explicitly British Stewie Griffin is an intentional play on this trope. While Frasier Crane might not sound British at all to an actual British person, there is enough of a connection there that my young American brain couldn't, and largely still can't, tell the difference between their speech and RP.

@simonvaughan6017

10 ай бұрын

As an English viewer of Frasier, what bothered me was that, although Daphne was supposed to come from Manchester, her family apparently came from London (and Dick Van Dyke's London at that).

@joegrey9807

10 ай бұрын

@@simonvaughan6017 I vaguely remember reading that the producers wanted a Manc accent, but 'one that Americans could understand'. Which worded like that seems a bit patronising to both Mancunians and Americans. Either that or she couldn't get her native RP (middle class Kent?) background to do a decent Manchester accent. But yeah her 'gor blimey guvnor' brother was bizzrre.

@simonvaughan6017

10 ай бұрын

@@joegrey9807 The Moon family: Daphne ("Mancunian" accent), played by Jane Leeves (from Essex/Sussex); her father, Harry ("Mancunian" accent), played by Brian Cox (from Scotland); her mother, Gertrude (cockney accent), played by Millicent Martin (from Essex); her brothers, Simon ("cockney" accent), played by Anthony LaPaglia (from Australia); Michael (Scottish accent), played by Robbie Coltrane (from Scotland); and Stephen (RP accent), played by Richard E. Grant (from Swaziland).

@EebstertheGreat

10 ай бұрын

The accent you're thinking of is actually Transatlantic, and the parents and children having extremely different accents is quite realistic. The Transatlantic accent was deliberately learned, not one anyone spoke from a young age. Even the children of people who always spoke with a Transatlantic accent would still acquire a more general American accent unless they were trained otherwise. Apart from that, the children of people with foreign accents typically acquire domestic accents anyway. If a family moves from South Africa to the U.S. when their children are still infants, those children will develop an American dialect, not a South African one (though they may retain some features of their parents' dialect).

@harryselwind

10 ай бұрын

@@simonvaughan6017 Not forgetting her father-in-law (eventually), Martin Crane, retired Seattle cop (American accent) played by John Mahoney from ...wait for it...Manchester! ...Well, born in Blackpool but moved to Manchester at a young age.) Then, of course, there's Eddie, played by Moose, but a Jack Russell, a breed originating in North Devon....

awesome channel, thanks mate

That Super Bowl advert with Tom Hiddleston and others is beautiful. There is something so chic about villains with the Queen's English/RP accent (and also about Roman emperors and Nazis with the same accent)! From the Galactic Empire to the Fire Nation, to Bond villains who drive Jaguars, they are sound so posh and chic!

@ErnestPiffel

2 ай бұрын

Have you heard Tom Hiddleston reciting poetry? ….swooooon!

In that ladt clip, Jude Law and John Bishop's faces sum it up perfectly. That towie accent from Chris Pratt is ridiculously accurate! It's great to see more Americans attempt regional british accents.

@GazzaBoo

10 ай бұрын

It's true, I've watched that clip twice and snorted rather loudly both times.

@Turn1t0ff

9 ай бұрын

But, us English, Welsh, Scottish and Irish only have one accent you know, British. I remember seeing some American friends reactions to regional dialects just across England. I introduced them to Birmingham, Wolverhampton and Dudley, all around Leicestershire, even towards Staffordshire. Then I played for them videos of people from Somerset, Wiltshire, North Yorkshire and down in Berkshire. 1 American was from near Pittsburgh, another 2 were from northern Florida, and the last 2 were Texan and Californian respectively. They were gobsmacked as the only English accent they'd heard other than mine was the RP of the British accent in movies, and barely being able to differentiate the subtleties between. They all loved Brummie and Cider country dialects unanimously though. It was also quite a rewarding endeavour to open the ears of folk who had previously only expected all English people to speak in that one particular movie villain accent.

When I watched Arcane, I thought it was odd that characters from the same city all had different accents. Some were British, others American, and one character even had a German accent.

@George_M_

10 ай бұрын

It's a city people come to from all over. IE, it's the US, only a citystate, accent wise.

@connorsimmons8781

10 ай бұрын

@@George_M_ I'll admit I know next to nothing lorewise about the game, just what the show presented. But I think its notable that the rich people in the city had British accents why the people in the under-city had American accents.

@MikaKahdarmon

10 ай бұрын

Huh, which character had a german accent O.O?

@connorsimmons8781

10 ай бұрын

@@MikaKahdarmon Viktor. Unless it was a Russian accent. I just searched for a scene where he speaks, and it sounds vaguely eastern European. Either way, I looked on the wiki and it says he's from the undercity the same as most of the other characters, so there shouldn't be that big of a contrast.

@MikaKahdarmon

10 ай бұрын

@@connorsimmons8781 Oh I was wondering if you actually meant him because I was pretty sure he has a Slavic accent. As a German I actually envy his accent, because it sounds kinda hot xD

I was randomly thinking about this topic and here's a video about it👏👏

Very comprehensive! This must have taken days to produce. You are correct in asserting that accents across Australia vary. A few geographical "places" have a remarkable RP accent, indistinguishable from say, Royalty. They strove to become more British than the British. They are mainly: private grammar schools in South Australia, and a handful in other states, especially Geelong Grammar in Victoria. (Alexander Downer is a prime example of that institution.) I know. I am one of those individuals.

Mark Strong is always excellent value for money as a villain. Christopher Lee and Charles Dance both give off a “by the time I’m finished informing you of all your failures, you’ll be begging me for a quick death…” vibe as villains.

@georgezee5173

2 ай бұрын

Charles Dance came to my restaurant a year ago. Boy was he intimidating...

I think part of it is that a lot of villains seem to have the mastermind angle built into their character and as an American I can definitely say that many Americans associate an upperclass British accent with hyper-intelligence. Also Americans in the not so distant past viewed the British as being likely to persuade others to fight on their behalf, whether it stemmed from the various European coalitions that Britain funded against Louis XIV and Napoleon or their use of native forces in the Indian subcontinent I know that in the lead up to WWI and WWII many Americans were paranoid about the British trying to "drag them into a European war". So that might explain part of the reason why there is a lingering association between English accents and "masterminds" in charge of a bunch of henchmen. I doubt that many modern day Americans are aware of a lot of the history behind the trope, but I wouldn't be surprised if the tropes originated at a time when Americans still had that history in the forefront of their minds. As an aside i also wanted to mention Michael Fassbender in Prometheus and Alien Covenant is a cool example of the British villain accent. He plays two different androids in Alien Covenant, David and Walter. David has a fairly upper class English accent and Walter has a pretty generic American accent. David is a self aggrandizing, scheming character and Walter is selfless and duty bound.

@user-om2ti8jj1f

10 ай бұрын

Interesting observations.

@cardenuovo

10 ай бұрын

I’m not sure about the historical trope, I haven’t met any Americans familiar with history who view the British as geopolitical double dealers, historically, mostly because we ended up adopting that very mindset ourselves. The British basically invented the concept of geopolitics but that’s another story altogether. Anyway, I think you hit the nail on the head with the intelligence thing. Villains are always intelligent. And to us Americans, an English accent is always perceived as more intelligent. It’s actually quite extraordinary how far a British accent can get you here in modern America. Why that’s the case is another matter and probably a mixture of various factors. The rest of the world quite openly admits to preferring the sound of an English accent over an American one, but which possibly leads us to subconsciously believe we speak a “lesser” version of English. Interesting topic nonetheless.

@freebornjohn2687

10 ай бұрын

@@cardenuovo Wasn't geopolitics invented by the Greek city states?

@ImOk...

10 ай бұрын

It’s a few factors: intelligence, coldness, composure, class, charm-all that can be associated with a stereotypical wealthy Brit-are perfect characteristics for a smooth criminal.

@mydogdeli

10 ай бұрын

Interesting take (pretty sure you meant Louis XVI, not Louis XIV though).

Thanks for including the high evolutionary!

Good for you getting a mention in The Economist Dr Geoff. congrats!

Is this related to what TV Tropes calls 'The Queen's Latin'? "This trope is used in film and television fiction set in the past (or a fantasy counterpart culture heavily based on the past) where characters speak with British accents, even though the film is not set in Britain and the characters are not British. Sometimes the actors are Fake Brits, and sometimes the cast all have British accents except for the sole American star."

@algebraizt

10 ай бұрын

100%. I think Queen's Latin is stand in for the character having racial/cultural/imperial superiority beliefs. This is Latin in the most authentic old Roman way we know. The actor is Italian and really studied with historians to try and get the accent to sound with our best interpretation of what Ancient Rome would sound like kzread.info/dash/bejne/oZ53j9yNiLano7w.html Compare that to say Caesar from HBO's Rome. Much more what we're used to with the 'proper' British accent.

Not all of the well-spoken Hollywood villains have a true British accent. Many use the "transatlantic accent", which is American with British inflection - an accent which hardly exists nowadays, and was unique because it could only be taught - it wasn't regional to anywhere.

@renshiwu305

6 ай бұрын

If you speak with a Transatlantic accent, you're probably over the age of 85. Everybody I can think of with that accent is dead: Franklin Delano Roosevelt, Gore Vidal, William F. Buckley Jr., George Plimpton, etc.

@LonesomeTwin

6 ай бұрын

I give you Jason Statham. His accent shifted westward with his fame.

Thank you, really interesting

Your cut at 11:01 had me dying lol.

That cut at 11:24 was the greatest thing I've ever seen. Another great video!

@graywz

10 ай бұрын

YES!!

@mark_a_schaefer

10 ай бұрын

I was just about to make the same comment. Also, the one cutting Julie Andrews off was pretty phenomenal as well.

@slavecek

10 ай бұрын

This video has heaps of visual/editing gags like that - more than I've noticed ever before. It looks like dr. Geoff's has been stepping up his editing game recently, in addition to his always fascinating and gripping content. This vid made me laugh out loud several times.

@Stitchxavi

10 ай бұрын

I love British subtlety

@csorfab

10 ай бұрын

it was 9:07 for me, the eye-roll of the "can't" guy just killed me, the pacing was just so perfect

When I was a kid, most of the bad guys in Hollywood movies had German accents, by the 80s they had Russian accents. In the 90s they had South African accents, and then in the 2000s, they all have Arabic accents. The English bad guy was a welcome occasional exception. (Come to think of it, Dr Geoff sounds a little suspicious.) 😮😅

@julianbrelsford

10 ай бұрын

I think this is particularly true in action movies, where the audience in the US kind of wants villains who represent whatever group USA is at war with right now.

@2besavedcom-7

10 ай бұрын

eg: Red Dawn (1984) Russian bad guys. Red Dawn (2012) Asian bad guys.

@ElectrostatiCrow

10 ай бұрын

It shows who Hollywood and the general American public sees as the enemy at the time.

@walterclements_

10 ай бұрын

@@julianbrelsfordhuzzah for discovering us foreign policy

@soniaalvarado5372

10 ай бұрын

Lethal Weapon 2, 1989, the South African bad guy (played by an English actor).

Excellent video. I was waiting for Alan Rickman as Hans Gruber and was not disappointed.

What an excellent analysis...

Some years ago I watched a video (which I can't find anymore) of an interview with a british actor and he was asked why english actors sound so much more intelligent. He replied that american actors usually start in commercials and on TV while british actors tend to do stage acting so they develop differently and sound more "high brow".

@peteymax

10 ай бұрын

I’d say there’s a reason why you can’t find that . . .

I always assumed it was because of the colonial history of the British empire. The fact that "the sun never sets on the british empire" makes the accent instantly recognizable as that of the oppressor/conqueror. It also make sense that you tend to see the accent used by upper class and authoritarian villains because that was the perception of the empire they represented.

@xhagast

8 ай бұрын

The Brits are truly evil: they stole the sun phrase from Spain. Pirate born, Brits.

Interesting. I was told it was because classically trained actors were often used for a good villain role in HW and RP comes with the territory for Shakespearian theatre. A happy accident that no one questioned and therefore stuck

This guys the smartest guy on KZread. I've always been super interested in accents... Way certain groups of people pronounce certain things and why but unfortunately grammar you something that I've always struggled immensely with... And I think that carries over into whatever field this guy always discusses cuz I can never make heads or tails videos but i really wish i could...lol...😢

„Crank up the poshness“ is one of the lesser known Scooter songs.

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

I love comments that are going to make me spend ages on google.

@fuckdefed

10 ай бұрын

I can find no evidence of this song anywhere, could you provide a link to it?

Romans are usually cast from British actors in historical films, but occasionally you do get an American actor as a Roman and it does seem strange and almost comical

@ObsydianShade

5 ай бұрын

I know--was just about to mention that! I find it hard to not imagine Romans with British accents, probably due to watching "I Claudius" when I was younger, but many others since then.

2:55 the example that immediately sprang to mind was Jason Isaac in 'the Patriot' was verging on hamy at some points.

A good yorkshire accent is always a good guy accent, I can't even imagine a villain having a yorkshire accent. Imagine Sean Bean as Bane... it just doesn't compute

Hopkins has some vestiges of a British accent in his role as Lecter: for example, when he meets and talks with the senator in Silence Of The Lambs, the way he pronounces "Maam" is very British, and is often wrongly subtitled by presumably American subtitlers as "Mom" as that's what it sounds like to an American ear.

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

Yes but I think it's clear he's not trying to be British. Tbh he's not an accent guy.

@michaelhawkins7389

10 ай бұрын

Anthony Hopkins? are you talking about? he was born in Wales which is part of the United Kingdom so he is British -Welsh

@michaelhawkins7389

10 ай бұрын

@@DrGeoffLindsey Anthony Hopkins is from Wales and is a native UK speaker

@AlexCGib

10 ай бұрын

@@michaelhawkins7389 He obviously means that he is not trying to play Hannibal Lecter with a British accent. He did not say that Hopkins is not British. Read the sentence fully before replying

Its because villains are cool and British accents are cool 😁 Truly love this channel. Thanks from North Carolina in the US!!

"It can'ts." "Caaaah-nt." "C-nt?"

What a great video... great channel even. I hadn't come across this channel before. Thank the almighty algorithm🙏

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

Thank it and you! I appreciate the comment.

I am hæf American and hɑːf English, so I am torn between good and evil.

@alexandrashvydun8726

10 ай бұрын

you're divergent

@simonvaughan6017

10 ай бұрын

@@alexandrashvydun8726 From an American point of view, I'm Euro-divergent.

@karaqakkzl

10 ай бұрын

you're jolly gay

If it is ever a consolation, do know that us Americans find British accents super cool and it will likely not fall out of fashion here any time soon.

I feel like the british accented badguy simply represents competence. The big bad must be the maximally competent badguy.

This is a great video, I'm an aspie who's tall and dresses dark so with the RP voice this makes so much sense as to how I'm received by people.

You missed a great example of British-y American accents in Emily and Richard Gilmore in Gilmore Girls. Richard's mother is British but it's alluded to that Emily's family "arrived on the mayflower". Both have accents that sound very close to RP and this reflects the fact that they are incredibly upper class and display many behaviours that one would take as typically British rather than American. They're a great example because the show is from, and set, 20 years ago but the elder Gilmores are certainly old-skool and from a by-gone era.

As an US american, I've never put much stock in the grudge angle... to me it seems more that (as is my personal experience) there's a certain air of refinement, or at least a character's belief that they are more refined, that comes with the specific british accents chosen for villains. You don't typically 'blue collar accents' in british accented villains, and I think that's a result of filmmakers wanting to emphasize that the villain is not merely powerful or evil, but specifically that they are haughty. In the US we have a very strong history of people who do terrible things with the wealth they gain, that gain them more wealth to do bad things with, and they have historically tended to affect different patterns of speech and accent, specifically to differentiate themselves from those they see as lesser than themselves. This manifests most readily as a british accent as opposed to much more _common_ accent from somewhere in the US... its an accent that... _doesn't_ belong with the rest. Its not that it's otherness is what makes it evil... but rather, that being evil has chosen to other itself from everyone else.

@DawnDavidson

10 ай бұрын

Excellent point. It’s referred to as “putting on airs”. Interestingly, as a choral singer, I was taught to “Britishize” many vowels as a way of getting a “purer” sound. It’s mostly about holding the long note on the first vowel of a diphthong, rather than the ending vowel. Also, dropping hard American R’s almost altogether, making my “English singing dialect” non-rhotic. A classic example of this is “heart,” which when sung would come out “hah’t” with perhaps just a tinge of an r right before the t. I always thought this sounded like the whole choir was trying to sound snooty. :)

@Svensk7119

10 ай бұрын

That was extremely eloquently spoken. Well said!

@philroberts7238

10 ай бұрын

@@DawnDavidson The counterpoint to that is that even today the Brits tend to sing most genres of non-classical music in quasi-American accents. (Except for certain kinds of folk singers, who often choose to sing in an accent midway between English West Country and a generic Irish.)

@benholroyd5221

10 ай бұрын

As a Brit I'd agree, I've never taken it as anti British. Further Romans alway tend to be British accent. I think it's just a gravitas thing.

@benholroyd5221

10 ай бұрын

@@philroberts7238 I'd agree it sounds American. I think it's just a result of certain types of singing. Further you do have lots of identifiably British singers. Although early British hip-hop had lots of overtly American accents. Whereas now it seems to me almost completely British.

00:38 As you go further west, that changes. In Southampton we say cant not carnt. bath not barth. grass not grarse. I . Northerners use short A, west country uses short A. The First American colonists were from this region, they sailed from Southampton and Plymouth. Hence they took this lingustic style with them.

@anonymoususer2756

Ай бұрын

I’m from Northern England and I have the short A sound in “class”, “bath”, “dance” and “grasp”, but the broad A sound in “can’t”, “rather”, “banana”, “half” and “calf”.

@SparkThaMetal

Ай бұрын

@@anonymoususer2756 Its also goes even deeper than that, because within each region the different classes tend to speak differently. Eg in west country you have private school types who speak like royalty with received pronounciation, but the accent of the actual locals is pure west country. I dislike the whole trap bath split as defined by academia. Rather than drawing a line across the country but including west country with estaury and received pronounciation, it should really be a line drawn around London. But as i aid, even then that isnt accurate a seahc region has multiple accents. But you dont need a map to define it really, just a sentence : West country A and northern A are basically the same, its the estuary and RP accents that are the odd ones out.

Very cool video, it's interesting the kind of relationship that British and American accents have in film. I'm very curious to see how or if other Anglosphere accents enter into this world of tropes. There's been a few NZ accents in animation lately, I wonder what their connotations will begin to have. Unfortunately I don't have great hopes for my accent (Australian).

@DrGeoffLindsey

10 ай бұрын

I think Americans feel positively about Australians, but they often can't tell the difference between Aussie accents and London.

Hated the ad in the middle, but loved the rest of it! I'm glad you mentioned panto -- I think UK acting is heavily informed by theatre. Panto plays a big part in that. Americans often seem to like the big, lovey, almost camp theatricality of many classic British actors (especially in their baddies). We can really ham it up and chew the scenery, playing to that panto tradition. With added RP, that adds an element of legitimacy to something that would otherwise be seen as "tacky"/cheap with another accent. Thus you have Alan Rickman as the Sheriff of Nottingham or Tim Curry as Frank'n'furter. There's something delicious about that juxtaposition of the OTT and restrained in that way. When the acting is more restrained as well, but there's still a hint of that theatricality (Scar, Shere Khan), it can then be more unsettling. There's a sense of danger and the outlaw -- a villain who seems restrained and "civil", but harbours these bursts of dark flamboyance. (This also touches on ideas of the posh Britain man as effete, and the "gender outlaw", which probably also goes back to the fop and the rake in English literature.)

As a British child my family moved to the US for three years and I went to elementary school there. A lot of my favourite TV programmes at that age had creepy British characters - for example, Smith, in Lost in Space. I was acutely conscious of my own “accent” while among my peers at school. I hadn’t even noticed that I was modifying my speech to have a school accent and a home accent. In fact it wasn’t until my parents attended a school Christmas show, of which I was the narrator. Afterwards, they expressed shock at my semi-American accent. From this distance, I suppose I’m curious that they should have been surprised. After all, what child wants to be different, to “not fit in”? Hence I chose a different accent to fit in at school and at home.

I was actually just thinking about the Mid-atlantic accent right before this was uploaded lol. Would be pretty cool to see it used more often in today's media

@captainyulef5845

10 ай бұрын

I learned how to speak this accent through Wikipedia ^^

@halsawyer9930

10 ай бұрын

@@captainyulef5845 My parents and a lot of their friends spoke the Trans-Atlantic pronunciation in one form or another. I had to make a conscious effort to get rid of it in my early 20s.

@captainyulef5845

10 ай бұрын

@@halsawyer9930 Of course I don't speak with it constantly, it's just fun to say random stuff in it sometimes lol

@thisisnotaustin1

10 ай бұрын

@@halsawyer9930 they all spoke with it casually? how come?

@halsawyer9930

10 ай бұрын

@@thisisnotaustin1 They were both educated at private academies in Philadelphia in the 1930s, it was simply natural for them to speak that way. The same with the people in their business and social circles. They were not as extreme as Cary Grant and Katherine Hepburn in the movie Philadelphia Story, but some of their friends certainly sounded just like that.

Thank you for the video, very informative. I would add Henry Cavil as another Brit who is known for playing a good guy on the big screen, (Superman, Geralt of Riviea) and speaks with his own accent in interviews.

This is very informative from a Danish point of view. In all honest when a British or just with any British accent I listen more then I do when it an American accent.

1:05 out of topic but I just love that commercial, saw it on Top Gear

RP sounds to an American ear like upper class-except most Americans don't think much about class distinctions (other than by wealth), so it just sounds like Power, Authority- as well as Charisma/Compelling (something it's important to listen to), Education/Wisdom/Learning, with just a dash of sexy or threatening Other/Foreigness. The Charisma/Compelling factor is that we've always heard RP through important BBC news reports (often news reels of especially important events) and, particularly, through British drama, both Shakespeare and TV drama. When I was growing up, almost the only time I heard non-RP accents was when Monty Python was making fun of them. I missed All Creatures Great and Small and didn't care for Eastenders, which few Americans watch anyway. So what was RP to me? Diana Rigg. Patrick Stewart. Wesley in The Princess Bride. Obi Wan Kenobi. Jeremy Brett. Jacqueline Pearce. Masterpiece Theatre, years and years of classic Doctor Who that made Scottish actor Sylvester McCoy use RP. (In his case, it came out RrrrrrP.) The point being, we Americans didn't have to listen to the Boris Johnsons of RP. Most of us barely ever heard the Queen. What we did hear was a lot of quite charismatic British actors whose voices we find very easy to listen to- seductive is too strong a term, but shades of arresting, compelling, commanding, magnetic. Villain characters need that kind of magnetism. Also, villain characters often have to be clever masterminds. David Attenborough is far too sweet to come off as such, but he exemplifies the fact that another major way Americans are exposed to RP is through documentaries and/or interviews with scientists and experts. Again, it means we tend to hear authority, of one dort of another, in that accent. It doesn't take much of a tweak to make it an evil authority, or, conversely, a mentor figure (or Captain Jean-Luc Picard.) I'm puzzled why the accent/trope of the butler has persisted. You're quite right, and that foesn't fit any of what I just said. Anyway as a kid who grew up on Doctor Who and Blake's 7 and Jeremy Brett's Holmes, I feel oddly cheated by the BBC - they were holding out on us! - and have spent the last decade or so familiarizing myself with all the other British accents, which is how I stumbled onto your delightful channel. Thank you! (And I am now firmly a fan of the Thirteenth Doctor, not least because Scouse, Sheffield and whatever type of Yorkshire Jodie uses made a pleasant change and were surprisingly easy to follow- I guess Americans feel at home with diphthongs!)

@ellenbryn

10 ай бұрын

PS sorry for the typos. I would edit them, but I would just put in a different set. Arthritic fingers and 2040 eyesight are a bad combination.

@lordchickenhawk

10 ай бұрын

@@ellenbryn You said, "I'm puzzled why the accent/trope of the butler has persisted. You're quite right, and that doesn't fit any of what I just said." Dr Geoff did mention that RP was used for the more high class type of servant roles. Batman's butler (heh heh :) Alfred was also a sort of mentor to Bruce Wayne and while C3PO was played for comic relief, he was meant to be a "protocol 'droid" to act as a multi lingual translator at the courts of the powerful

I wonder if the through-line in RP-accented characters and archetypes you mention is that of coded authority: whether it's the threatening power of the villain who must be overcome, the wise counsel of mentor, or the gravitas of noble protagonist (Sir Patrick Stewart, for example, as both Captain Picard and Professor X, played well-respected leaders and authority figures). Because the RP accent is one of authority -- kings and queens, royals and aristocrats -- it becomes a shorthand for a character with a form of authority, which is then read alongside other markers to build and reinforce our expectations of the character's role in the plot.

Accents are great when actors really get them down. The first time I ever saw Bob Hoskins in a movie was as the detective in Who Framed Roger Rabbit. His hard-bitten New York-ese is a blast to listen to. Then you turn around and listen to him as the senior manager of the housekeeping staff in Maid In Manhattan and he sounds very RP. Another Brit who's great at accents is Gary Oldman.

Just found your channel. Instant subscribe.

I feel like it's actually more common for the bad guys to be German, Russian, or some other notable enemy country if they're not speaking the same as the main characters.

@belnonaudh1313

10 ай бұрын

Maybe, but I usually find it when it's deliberately made to be drawn attention to (like James Bond, or war films, etc). As a child I never saw Lion King and thought Scar was noticeably British, for example.

@annasolovyeva1013

10 ай бұрын

I'm a Russian and I learned English somewhat close to RP pronunciation. Intonation, however, is still tricky for me, because Russian and English intonation structure is different. So, I may sound rude or threatening even if I didn't mean anything like that. Now I'm your generic villain LOL.

@A.J.L84

9 ай бұрын

I tend to agree, especially the Prussian junker type and later Russians. I would say Continental Europeans in general though. For example Jeroen Krabbé as General Georgi Koskov or Andreas Wisniewski as Necros in The Living Daylights.