That safety mechanism is brilliant.

@exexpat11

4 жыл бұрын

Modern Cartridge Conversion Cylinders could learn something from the Rear Part of this conversion. The Safety is very innovative!

@elementalist1984

4 жыл бұрын

I really find it hard to believe that this necessarily allowed people to do something they weren't already doing. By which I mean I doubt everyone was carry their revolvers with one empty chamber. Though I guess some of today's people are dumb enough to carry their semiautomatic pistols with an empty chamber

@kevinamerio8105

4 жыл бұрын

Agree!!!!

@beargillium2369

3 жыл бұрын

If the hammer were pulled back even a little by mistake, the hammer then comes to rest directly on the firing pin... Doesn't seem too brilliant to have an automatically deactivated "safety...."

@paradigmstudiosca

3 жыл бұрын

@@elementalist1984 There are plenty of accounts of people carrying revolvers with the hammer on an empty cylinder. A tap on the back of the hammer (maybe from a stray arm bouncing when riding a horse) can set it off. I'm sure people walking around and not riding carried all 6 loaded pretty regularly, but riders often wouldn't. At least, that's based on what I've read, anyways...

How can anyone give this a thumbs down? This is history with a brilliant professor in Ian. He not only knows how to shoot the gun, but it’s history and “anatomy” as well. I love to hear him explain the gun, and who knew just how many different models were made? That’s the really interesting thing about the site. But without a first-rate teacher it would all be for naught. One of my favorite sites and my favorite professor.

@calvingreene90

2 жыл бұрын

Some dangerous lunitics are triggered by the sight of guns.

@cymond

Жыл бұрын

@@calvingreene90 Or they just want to discourage KZread from showing them similar videos. I sometimes remove things from my watch history so the algorithm won't keep recommending similar videos.

@cymond

Жыл бұрын

Or maybe it's because some people only like shooting videos, not table top videos

@calvingreene90

Жыл бұрын

@@cymond There are three little dots in a vertical row of the description box of the recommendations. Clicking on them gives you the options of not interested and don't recommend channel again.

@cymond

Жыл бұрын

@@calvingreene90 Yeah, but that's a reactive option for after the fact. It works well for specific videos, or specific channels. Sometimes you want to undo a video you already watched. I once accidentally watched part of an animal cruelty video. KZread kept recommending similar videos from other channels. I gave that video a thumbs down and then removed it from my history. That fixed it. (The video was something like "cat playing with bunny" but the rabbit was clearly terrified and the cat was tormenting it as a prelude to killing it. The idiot humans were off camera talking about how cute it was. After that, I started getting similar videos. Apparently there's a whole genre on KZread of watching animals die horrible deaths under the guise of feeding your pets.)

That whole safety thing is pretty ingenious.

Ian, you have got the coolest job ever.

@SouthernSociology

3 жыл бұрын

@@jabr0n1 A man of kindness

I have always wanted to know how the Thuer worked - trust FW to not only tell me but even show me, these vids are so addictive and Ian has such sensible down to earth delivery, I bet the late "Ivan" Hogg would have got on well with him!

Beautiful. And that safety is amazing.

Simply Amazing!

I would love to see the MP-18 listed in that auction. I understand you've already recorded all these videos, but if you ever get the chance to examine one again, i'm sure a fair number of us would appreciate it. Surely the first production sub gun ever made deserves a spot on your wonderful channel.

That safety feature is really clever. Easily the most interesting feature of the conversion as a whole. A remarkable early revolver safety mechanism.

@beargillium2369

2 жыл бұрын

Doesn't look like it would be "safe" at all .. think about it, the only thing keeping the safety in place is the hammer.... Kinda self defeating... Like a seatbelt that automatically releases if you press the brake.

@LostShipMate

Жыл бұрын

@@beargillium2369 Its single action. You would have to pull the hammer to full cock, and then press the trigger. Its not going off by accident.

Brilliant, and a nice little gun !

Great explanation on what worked, and why it did not work. Great looking gun, I own a 49, but its all original.

Thank you for this upload! Awesome

Being able to safely carry all 6 chambers loaded is great. Other than that there is no advantage to this over just black powder and percussion caps. If this was competing with percussion cap revolvers, I would say it is great. This was competing with SAA revolvers though, so I fully see why it never caught on. Like you said though, they were not allowed to bore all the way though the cylinder. They did well with what they had to work with. If I was around then and was looking for a nice carry piece, I might get one of these and bore it all the way out, assuming a standard .32 would still fit. A bit of machining but I think it would had been worth it.

@cymond

Жыл бұрын

According to InRange, many percussion revolvers had a half-way notch between the chambers to rest the hammer, allowing a percussion revolver to safely be loaded with all 6 rounds.

@Jesses001

Жыл бұрын

@@cymond Some do and some do not. Many modern production ones do.

very neat idea

Another very cool gun.. Thanks for sharing it Ian. I really love that conversion plate.. Kind of a shame about the ammo they had to use. I guess that is all they could do though.

Great video. I knew the cylinder was front loaded, but was unaware the safety worked like that. Disassembly of the gun to reload is not that great of an advantage over a percussion cylinder. Interesting dead-end that took 150 yrs. to be revived (Krist)

From many years ago, I remember another revolving pistol, not a conversion, that used a different system to avoid the White patent. The cylinders were NOT bored through, a .32 ? rim fire cartridge was fed into the front of the cylinder and a thin flanged bushing was inserted over the cartridge, the small flange protruded from the front face allowing for insertion and removal of bushing and cartridge.

I would love to see some more strange ammo types like with the exploding ammo from WW2.

Smith & Wesson's patent had not yet expired for the Rolin White bored threw cylinder. Alexander Thuer's design was to circumvent the White Patent which Smith & Wesson bought until it ended in 1868. About 4,000 Thuer conversions were made and are extremely RARE!

The colt pocket 1849 is a very cute little thing, isn't it?

I cannot begin to understand what the patent office and courts were thinking to allow ONE patent for a specific method to create fully drilled cylinders to mean ALL forms of drilling, cutting and perforating would be requiring royalty payments.and that NOBODY got around the patent by e.g. forming singular chambers and pressing them into a ring to form a cylinder.

hey i was wondering in your intro you have a footage of the firearm with danger strips all over it hitting i think ballistic gel, could you tell me what the video is if you can, anyway i love the videos you post you have taught me so much thank you.

Would love to see a video of the Griswold & Gunnison revolver, If you can get a hold of one that is.

Im surprised that no one made a modern version of this instead of 5 or 6 fireing pins on a conversion cylinder would be a lot cheaper

@TylerCroom-xe6ou

5 ай бұрын

Little late but there is in 32 s&w

Pretty clever...

If they had that safety for the cap and ball cylinder that would be amazing to carry back in the day.

Sweet love it

Was the central primer on this ammo unique for its time, or were there other centerfire cartridges by then? Sure is an odd concept either way.

This seems like a down grade from a percussion revolver. You've basically got a paper cartridge with brass instead of paper. I mean you got to disassemble the whole thing to reload

Pretty gun

5 years and only 10 dislikes he realy is gun jesus's

@JohnSmith-hd2tl

3 жыл бұрын

I don’t like your profile pic.

White certainly demonstrated why patent laws are an impediment to progress didn't he.

@ZGryphon

8 жыл бұрын

+Jason Clark More practically, the patent official who decided a bored hole somehow constituted a non-obvious invention, and therefore granted White a patent for it, demonstrated why patent laws need to be administered more sensibly than they sometimes are.

@richardelliott9511

5 жыл бұрын

@@ZGryphonPatent laws are in place to protect inventers from copy cat manufacturers with no investment in a given design. What seems obvious about a bored thru cylinder now was certainly not back then. No one had used such a thing up to that time. Colt was offered the use of this patent 1st , didn't see the practicality of it so turned it down. Later it was offered to S&W which did license it's use. Ian tells the whole story in another video, can't remember which one though. The bottom line is that even with paying White a licensing fee, S&W managed to screw him over with the fine print of the deal. Apparently design was his game not business management.

@treatb09

5 жыл бұрын

more of an impediment to corruption

@JohnDoe-ee6qs

4 жыл бұрын

@@richardelliott9511 a patent should only give a designer the right to collect royalties on that idea for 25 years from all that use his idea, patents are an impediment to progress, it would be far better if everyone could use new ideas with the designers still getting their cut

@richardelliott9511

4 жыл бұрын

@@JohnDoe-ee6qs I think you have just described what the patent system is intended to be. Yes, fundimentally, it may impede progress at some level but without it progress would be impeded even more because there would be no incentive for the small inventor to bother. Only the designers with the financial resourses to exploit their own inventions would get anywhere. Unfortunately the system has been corrupted by greed, not only of inventors but also of companies willing to risk litigation by ignoring the royalties on someone elses patents. I'm sure there are lots of examples of small time designers making it big on their designs. You might ask J M Browning or Sam Colt what they thought of patent law, it made them both rich men. On the opposite end are Rollin White and Mickael Kalashnikov. Rollin White sold off his rights way too cheap. He had no idea how important his patent was to become to S&W or how much he would have to spend to defend that patent against other less scrupulous manufactures, leaving him broke at the end of his life. I'd be willing to bet that Kalashnikov wished that some form of patent system existed in the USSR (not a great example as patentable designs done while in the employ of a company or government facility are usually assigned to that company or facility, with the actual designer recieving nothing or just a small bonus). Anyway, although while not a perfect system, it does have it's place.

Mantap bos

hi, Ian !!! an old good video ...!!! but i want say something, the wheel recoil shield that turns on the left is not a safety, but it is an ejecting device of spent brasses ... bye bye 👋👍

Interesting. How cool would it be to fire one of these?

It's a close combat revolver, up to about 60 feet the accorece should be good enough.

“Damm! We should have kept that guy Rolland White!” -Colt

Why would i buy a conversion kit when i could just do what tuco did in good the bad and the ugly?

I will always be amazed that White managed to patent the idea of drilling a hole all the way through something. Yeah, yeah, I know it's a little more detailed than that, but still: it's a hole drilled all the way through. That invention itself is incredibly obvious and should not be possible to patent. The only question at the time was "why would you want to drill it all the way". It's fair to patent the ammo, but it's not fair to patent a *hole*!

I think it was a smart conversion. Needs to be made again but in 32sw or ?

The problem with it is the bullet needs to be slightly wider than the casing so that the bullet gets the same lead on steel interference fit that holds the bullet in cap and ball revolvers.

have you seen Jim Corbett's dangerous game rifle at the auction? I think it would be a good gun to do a video on if you can get your hands on it

@ForgottenWeapons

9 жыл бұрын

I had a limited amount of time there, and spent most of it on experimental pistols - didn't have a chance to get into any of the big-game rifles. Sorry!

I can see why many would revert to the original cylinder, as cartridge loading in this case does not appear to be any advantage, however the "snap cap" safety is just bada$$, So Victorian and useful at the same time!

@cymond

Жыл бұрын

It seems like a thin, sliding metal disc that blocks the hammer could have been retrofitted to many percussion revolvers.

wounder if any gunsmiths ever tried drilling out the ring at the back end of the cylinders, might of been something i would of tried, i assume they also made these in .44? i wounder if any commonly available cartridges of the day would fit in the cylinders without modification

@TomaszWota

9 жыл бұрын

"wonder"*

First rimless cartridge metalic ammo?

How would you eject a spent cartridge in one of these firearms? i'm very curious as to how this was done.

@gunnarkvinlaug7226

5 жыл бұрын

They would fall out by themself.

Is the estimated selling price the numbers in parenthesis at the end of the description?

@ForgottenWeapons

9 жыл бұрын

Yup.

i wonder what cartridge caliber this Colt Coversion is in???????

@Uukassiu

5 жыл бұрын

.31, Ian said this at the beginning of the video.

Was there ever a cartridge conversion which was simply a replacement cylinder for cap and ball pistols?

@cymond

Жыл бұрын

Technically, that's not possible. The cap & ball hammer does not have a firing pin. Unless you're referring to the system like modern conversion cylinders. They're a two part design that must be disassembled to reload. The back of the cylinder has a disk with 6 firing pins. You remove the cylinder from the gun, pull the back plate off, load new ammo, put the back plate on, and reassemble the gun.

It's a Ross rifle.

It really irritates me that nobody else could drill the entire cylinder at the time. I believe in patents and I think they are important, but that particular patent is unfair

I guess Mr. White did not want to bother paying to sue his old employer for patent infringement since this development had inherent problems, his patent would soon expire, and he was near broke from prior lawsuits.

I thought he worked for that other auction house. I thought it was kind of their channel and Ian was the host. But, it's his channel and he is freelance?

@ForgottenWeapons

9 жыл бұрын

I'm not an employee of either auction company, and the channel is completely independent. I go where the awesome guns are. :)

@The1Helleri

9 жыл бұрын

oh okay. Do you get paid for reviewing them (like is it a job). Or is it just interest based (a hobby).

@ForgottenWeapons

9 жыл бұрын

***** They pay me to do the videos, but they don't tell me what guns to do or what to say, and I charge a flat fee with no relation to what the guns sell for. It's a really good collaboration, because it gives them publicity and gives me access to some phenomenally rare guns to bring to you guys.

@The1Helleri

9 жыл бұрын

Yeah it sounds like an ideal arrangement. I have a never been into guns that much. But since I found your channel I have been. The way you present the information, talking about history, anecdotal stuff, mechanical properties, and impact. It makes it all very interesting for me.

Just a comment for the algorithm.

bad design, but it did keep the aesthetics of the original gun. too bad it just isn't very good.

That ring piece looks more like it belongs to a sewing machine than a gun. Not the brightest kit for sure.

Kluge. Pronounced "klooj".

What a horrible thing to do to a perfectly good Colt.

This is so painful to watch. Mistaking the Ejector for a Safety. The Safe position is between the firing pin and Ejector, where the lug is. Please do your research more carefully.