M113k deserves a mention and should be in S-tier

@richardvank

7 ай бұрын

The M113k is good for the A-tier, but M155 should be 100% in the S-tier

@livinglegend8953

7 ай бұрын

M113 > Anything we not even talking ab the great potential this platform is becoming these days

@ctykckcktyvc7558

6 ай бұрын

had to be de rated from factory in the sl55 as the standard 1000nm of torque ate gearboxes too quickly, such a good low reviving engine

@can_opener755

6 ай бұрын

@@ctykckcktyvc7558 funny story, my father had a '01 CLK55 with a standard M113 5.4L. He decided to tune it to a similar spec to the CLK DTM and converted it to a M113K. Suffice to say, the transmission didn't enjoy that, and while it still lasted 25,000ish miles under the insane load, the torque converter eventually failed, and it needed a transmission to move...yeahhh the M113 platform is incredible, but the rest of the powertrains of that era weren't capable of handling that type of power through it for long

@newb529

6 ай бұрын

On my 2nd 113k

N63 with that S tier potential and F tier reliability

I’m a bmw guy but the m156 in c tier is crazy. That’s a legendary engine and should be in a tier or at least a tier

@kbcarroll

6 ай бұрын

I'd accept putting it in C tier due to reliability problems. But referring to it as "respectable power for its time" when it was the most powerful naturally aspirated V8 ever built "for its time" is an odd miss. And then the M159 is the same motor with all the problems fixed only makes A tier?? M113 and M159 are S tier. In 2003 MB made several of the world's fastest cars in multiple segments and you can find those cars still smoking Mustangs 20 years and 200k miles later. That's S+ tier.

@babypluto3746

Ай бұрын

@hugodugf9321 basically everything BMW has ever done is C tier when compared to Japanese vehicles so chill out homie

M156 in c-tier is a crime. Otherwise great vid as usual!

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

That’s completely fair, glad you enjoyed!

The M156 is such glorious sounding V8, love that engine.

M113/M113K is a Top Tier engine. The performance they have while still going 250,000+ miles makes them pretty unique. None of the more modern Mercedes engines you listed have a better combination of power/longevity.

@DT-7727

3 ай бұрын

The later versions of the m156 on the w212 and w204 are close but the m113/m113k can't be matched in reliabilty wise

The M156 is a legendary engine, surprised you’ve rated it so low especially in comparison alto the rod bearing throwers on the M3 & M5. M156 was AMG’s first love child post merger I’ve experienced most of the engines in your video and maintenance wise the M156 just requires frequent attention to oil and serviceable items such as injectors and seals.

@taliyy_

6 ай бұрын

As a bmw guy m156 was my first love and i agree

@waisoserious3017

6 ай бұрын

That's crazy that th S65 is S tier but M156 is C. More power, more reliability, more widely adopted.

@Itsamugsgam3

6 ай бұрын

Im not gonna lie there was some Beamer bias here if my m273 gets hit that hard the e92 m3 engine has no right to be in s tier lol

Great video as usual. I have a BMW 550 with the N63 I've owned for nearly 10 years with almost 100K miles on it. While I agree the engine can be problematic my own personal experience with the engine has been fine. It was one of the first applications of a HOT V where the turbos are mounted in the V which attributed to many of the issues. If properly maintained it can be reliable and has very decent power.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Thank you, that’s great to hear and proves that reputation isn’t everything.

@brokeq50boi80

7 ай бұрын

⁠@@running2redlinewell also the main thing with the n63 is also that BMW will give there engines technical updates. Which will usually just take the original engine and just fix the reliability problems most of the time. So there’s technically a n63 and a n63tu which has some of the issues addressed. It’s weird that the s63 didn’t inherit most of the reliability problems and then they did the s63tu which fixed most of the reliability problems that it inherited from the n63 lol. Weird that taking an engine and having the m division do their thing to make it a m engine fixed most of the reliability problems.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

I didn’t realize that was a thing but that’s super fascinating. It does make you think if some of the issues come from trying to cut costs when the M division has a bigger budget. Thanks for the info!

@brokeq50boi80

7 ай бұрын

@@running2redline no problem man. Just figured I’d put that out there. I only found out because I was doing some research on the s63s because I wanted a 2015 BMW m5. Then I fell down the rabbit hole and learned about their engine codes and stuff. So whenever you see the engine code and then see tu after that’s the technical update which fixes some or most of the known issues with the previous one.

@brokeq50boi80

7 ай бұрын

@@running2redline also it might be because the m division has a higher budget but, I think with the n63 it was mostly a case of it was the first time they did a hot v engine.

S63 is literally upgraded N63. How can it make such a leap from D to S tier?

@brokeq50boi80

7 ай бұрын

Because the m division doing their thing with the s63 fixed some of the reliability problems it inherited from the n63. Then the s63tu, the technical update fixed even more of those issues.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Nailed it here ^ that’s my same reasoning. Thanks for watching.

The 06-early 08 M273s were the engines affected by idler gear failure. I did my research before buyingy S, so I went with a 2009. It’s an excellent engine. Quiet, silky smooth, and gobs of torque to propel the big chassis around. Mine’s at 163k miles and doesn’t leak, burn oil, or make any abnormal noise. The only maintenance it has received are the rear PCV cover, thermostat, and oil cooler gasket, as that did eventually start leaking. Shame that they’re more known by their early production faults, as I’d put the later models right up with the M113.

@Itsamugsgam3

6 ай бұрын

I actually have an 08 myself and have only really run into standard maintence(thermostat etc…) at 146k. The biggest issue to my understanding is the timing chain guides tho I believe the problem was fixed with 09 but it’s a one and done 1.5-2.5k job at a reputable shop. Least I’m not throwing rod bearings lol.

@SensorJunior

6 ай бұрын

I have a later one, 2010. 220k km on it. Runs smooth and has a really fun power output. Really fun to drive (e550 coupe) No problems, at all

You should include the technical update versions of some of these engines. The N63TU3 in newer -50i models and Range Rovers is a vast improvement over the earlier iterations.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Had I known that’s what they did I totally would have. It’s neat that BMW lets an engine run a little than fixes its issues.

@stefanomarcellino6701

6 ай бұрын

I was wondering this also. I love the newer N63 in the m850i

@aix4319

6 ай бұрын

Quite so, if the improvements is significant, shouldn’t him put this engine into different section?

As an American that drives a C63 I was stunned the M156 didn't get more love.

Thank you so much for all the effort and craft poured into this channel bro!! As a RUF fan that last h.m. is like the ⭐ on my 🎄

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

I’m glad to hear you enjoyed! That’s much appreciated, and I couldn’t help but to include the RUF it’s just too cool.

I have a 2021 C63S with the M177 and it rocks. No engine issues so far with almost 17k miles, and I rip it pretty much every time I get the opportunity. Power delivery is consistent up the gears and it never feels like it's being pushed too hard. I think it could easily handle 700hp, but I don't want to void my warranty two years in.

I feel like the VW W8 should have at least gotten an honorable mention Probably a lot more work but a German i4 tier list would be amazing

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

I’ll see what I can do! Thanks for watching, and yes the W8 is super interesting. Maybe a W engine list

@akazi1582

7 ай бұрын

​@@running2redlineim not sure theres enough of them though

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

You could definitely be right, I’ll have to look into it, it would include w12 and w16s but there aren’t a ton of those either

@nooooooooooo6uoki67

27 күн бұрын

not really a v8 though :^)

The 4.2 FSI 32v isn't the correct engine in the '12-'15 RS5 and '10-'17 RS5,. Their V8's share more similarities to to the V10 in the R8 of the era.

Thank you for the making this video! Currently an owner of a 84 928 with a 4.5L 16 Valve gen 1 V8. At the time this engine had come out it was a beast. Still one of my favorite v8’s to drive and hear doing over 60+ mph.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

I’m sure that car is a head turner, Porsche really doesn’t miss!

Give this man some subs, I love these videos and will keep watching for future engine videos!

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

Really appreciate that!

The N63 got a "Technische Überarbeitung" in 2013, solving most of the issues it had from the beginning. So i would put the "normal" N63 in D tier, but the N63TÜ in the B or A tier

@running2redline

3 ай бұрын

I learned about the technical updates from these comments and looked into them. They really do make a large difference and it’s a wise way to maintain quality

The 4.2 FSI not being in S tier is a total crime. The BMW M3 V8 of the same era wasn’t better in any way and yet it’s S tier.

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

That’s definitely fair and valid, thanks for watching

The M113 is arguably the most reliable V8 of all time, alongside the 1UZ… should belong in S-tier.

@stroock6394

6 ай бұрын

i have a 1999 LS 400 and a 2005 E55 so looks like i'm doing a good job lol

@sethsteener

6 ай бұрын

@@stroock6394 damn… jealous! i have a 2005 E320 that I wish was an E55 haha. you are doing a fantastic job!

@niko9126

6 ай бұрын

@@sethsteenercouldn’t have said it better myself. Had a 99 Gs400, now I have an 04 E55. Was looking at gs400’s today and it’s crazy how much people are asking

@cohenday1377

2 ай бұрын

The M60, M62 and S62 are also indestructible and yet he ranks the S65 above them all which has serious flaws namely the rod barings and throttle actuators. This guy is just fucking stupid the M113k is one of the most well-known and respected German V8's the fact that it isn't on this lists is reason enough to disregard the list as a whole. He also put the M156 in C tier an engine which is held higher regard than the M113k and most of the other engine on this list.

@markomaric903

2 ай бұрын

​@@stroock6394 i would buy 2005 E55, but I think those are to old cars now, and who knows who drove it, and had it maintained well or not. On the other side if you have to rebuild all engine, i think it would cost a fortune

Great video!

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Thank you, I’m glad you enjoyed!

Love these tier lists. Genuinely curious how you don’t have more subs.

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

Much appreciated!

Something I’ve always found myself doing, is going straight to Google to search these cars simply to see what they look like. Took me over an hour to finish this video because of Google to Google to see pictures of these cars. I think it would be awesome if they were included in the videos! Great video as always 😊

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

I’ve never thought of that but that’s a really good point. I’d love to do it but the issue would be finding that many non-copyrighted images of each. I’ll look into how it may be possible though, I am glad you enjoyed the video and greatly appreciate that!

2011 and newer M156 is a perfect engine, it did have it’s things between 07-11. Also the M113K is by far the most reliable V8 in this list.

Great video! Hoping for you to do a Japanese V6 tier list in the future :)

@running2redline

5 ай бұрын

Will definitely make it happen at some point!

No mention of the EA898? One of the most thermally efficient engines put into a production car. 320kW and 900Nm. Eats up km like it's nothing. The very best engine for long distance high speed driving.

As far as I know the S65 have also bearings problems. I would switch places with the S62

@cheberlo

6 ай бұрын

Bearing problem is consequence of poor maintenance and bad oil, nothing more, I've owned s65 m3 e92 for 4 years, not a single issue, my dad was bmw engine assembler in Germany back in the days, he owned s62 (m5 e39), and to this days he refers to that engine as one of the most reliable cars that he ever owned. I said all that just to let you know that most of the problems in bmw's engines is consequences of poor maintenance. Edit: not only bmw engines, most of the German "unreliable" engines aren't unreliable if you maintain them properly, maintenance is expensive, but still, its a performance engine and they need proper maintenance, maybe there are unreliable engines that doesn't depend on how you maintain them, but i didn't have any experience with em yet.

I feel you could have added the Diesel V8s from BMW, MB and VAG in there as well since there aren't that many of them.

I'd almost put the Audi 4.2 into the S tier. A truly remarkable high revving V8 that produces solid output, great reliability and tune ability and has featured in a number of legendary vehicles which have withstood the test of time

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

I’d have to agree with that, thanks for watching!

@connor3288

6 ай бұрын

Timing chains.... Engine out job... Chain guides that break.... Happened to my friend's S4.

@nirfz

6 ай бұрын

Isn't that the engine that had so much carbon buildup when not often driven hard that it started running badly? I remember several german tuning and mechanic reports/articles/forum treads where that was a huge issue. Intakes had to be cleaned either checmically or mechanically for a lot of money, just like their 10cylinder in the RS6 they once had.

@connor3288

6 ай бұрын

@@nirfz Direct injection only gas engines is so stupid, and engineers who built them/management who signed off on them are idiots. Toyota does it right by having both port and direct injectors, I believe ford also does that but only on some engines such as 3.5 turbo, maybe 2.7 turbo as well.

@nirfz

6 ай бұрын

@@connor3288 I have heard that it was especially bad with that V8 engine the R8 ahd RS4 had. I have seen Mercedes going a different way in a Diesel engine they got from Renault: the "recylced" air that gets back to the intake to reduce emissions on cold engines in that specific case is taken *after* the particulate filter. Sure the filter might be earlier to replace in the long run, but the intake side stays clean.

I feel the m156 and s65 should be in similar spots as they both have detrimental issues which could cause engine failure. Not many old s65s driving out in public like the m156 is.

Thank you for breaking down such large group of engines into a clear classification. You did an amazing job. One small comment for the improvement is that you haven’t mentioned the money aspect. Generally, how much does it cost to maintain and keep these german beast in shape? Monthly or yearly. Theay are all different in terms of this either. I know prices for parts and labor may differ, but you could have provided general numbers. But I think this would make your guide ultimate for V8s.

@running2redline

4 ай бұрын

I’m glad you enjoyed the video and I appreciate the support. I do like the money figure and will touch on it in future videos, thanks!

Long live the V8 🔥 These wonderful engines should be cherished before everything goes boring EV.

This list was much more accurate than your V10 one, well done

We have a 2011 550 with N63. Very nice running engine and very fast! When it works it’s a lovely car to drive. We needed to have the top end done (thank god it was under warranty). We have maintained it very well well and it has 100k miles on it now but we are thinking of selling due to other reliability issues

2:55 The S62 was used in the Wiessmann GT aswell

To note, the bmw n63 has gone through many updates. The n63tu solves the injector issue as it removed the pzeo injectors also found in the n54 i6 engine and used the injectors from the newer n55. There are also n63 tu1 tu2 and tu3 now. This also applies to the s63.

Great tier list! My dad owned a 2008 X5 4.8i(N62). The sound of the engine will always brings me back to my childhood. Unfortunately my dad had to get rid of the car for the same reasons that the N62 is on the D tier. It started when we noticed issues with the head gaskets. Then the engine began to eat oil like no tomorrow. It started to leak coolant in its last three months and then it leaked oil. We often kept a drip pan under the car because of how bad it was. My dad kept putting in work to fill up the oil and coolant. The gas mileage was also pretty bad. We often got 12 Miles per gallon. The only reason why he got the car with a V-8 at the time was because he felt that the inline 6 option was seriously under powered. Eventually he let the car go and now owns a 2023 X5 40i (B58).

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

The B58 is a phenomenal engine so I’m sure that’s loads of fun, 2008 X5 is still a really cool car as a whole and that V8 does sound sweet. Glad you enjoyed the video!

@jamescarl6187

6 ай бұрын

Sad to hear. They are good engines just Bmw used crappy materials for the gaskets which gave it a bad reputation

The EA825 was actually co-developed by Porsche and Audi.

Audi Engine EA825 shown here is in fact an EA824. SQ7 and SQ8 were never equipped with the EA824, both at this time were Diesels. The EA825 came first time in 2020 in the SQ models. Also Lambo used 825 but EA824 was built often altough they differ also massively between s and RS models (Crank- and Camshaft, different Turbos, different cooles and Audi has used different gearboxes).

You missed the Audi chain-driven 4.2 40v (non-FSI), which is totally different from the belt-driven versions. Also, the EA824 and EA825 are both 4.0T V8's but they are completely different engines.

The bmw m60 is such a simple engine, but thats the reason why I love them so much. Very easy to work on, and they are without a doubt the most reliable bmw v8 ever made.

@kvt9212

2 ай бұрын

Are they? Just interested

@davidt.6415

2 ай бұрын

@kvt9212 yes they are! 😁 highly underrated engines of their time in my opinion. They take boost pretty well too if you choose.

@kvt9212

2 ай бұрын

@@davidt.6415 good to know. Got one in my e32 730i and i didn't had any problems till this day. Will keep it now :-)

@davidt.6415

2 ай бұрын

@kvt9212 if you want to hod rod your engine, the quick power mod would be to get a 4.4 bottom block, and get m60 (4.0) heads on top. Use the m60 timing components. Now you have reliable 330hp engine with a good tune.

M177/8 is the best engine on this list without a doubt. Efficient, sounds great, bulletproof, and in the right hands, potential to the moon. Amg has no equal when it comes to v8s

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

Completely agree, I watched the entirely of both the IMSA and WEC racing seasons and don’t recall a single AMG engine failure.

I feel like the 4.2 that was just an adaptation of the R8's V10 should be put on the tier list separately. Just an opinion though! Nice video!

Great video as always 🫶🏼 But here I am, demanding a five cylinder video again🗣️‼️ (give the fiat 5 cylinder a good ranking)

metric units would be helpful for a german engines tier list. : >

nahh the 6.2 deserves to be on the A tier you lost me there

Need a german 6 cylinder video (excluding the i6 engines)

I well be happy to see a race car engine tier list:)

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

I like that idea a lot!

M113 excellent engine, never seen any issues with minimal maintenance.

The porsche 928, also had a 5.6 liter 32v variant in the GTS , also funny sidenote to the gen1 is they saw of the left side of the block and made it the 4cylinder for the 944.

@imfbankfoolsus1026

6 ай бұрын

928 gts is 5.4 350hp..

@patriklenck1735

6 ай бұрын

@@imfbankfoolsus1026 damn youre right, i could have sworn there was a 5.6l out there.

lol I still can't believe VW decided it was a big brain move to put the timing chain with plastic guides at the back of the engine forcing you to remove the engine if you want to do it comfortably and correctly

Was hoping you’d talk about N63TU 1 and on lol

M159 deserved S and the 156 deserves A tier.

Pls German 4cyl when, I wanna see what you find out about and think of the ea888

You forget the BEST bmw v8 that has been in a road cad P60B40 from e46 m3 gts

Great video for comparing german V8, but It feels like the details and research for the video was compromised towards the Audi and Porsche as because you skipped tiering Audi engines by the engine code, you missed that all the engines up to C5 D2 and couple of D3 Audi were timing belt driven(except allroad), skipped the BBK 40v timing chain engine all together, and overall the many diferences between those engines and their strenghts and weaknesses that you had in BMW and Mercedes categories. Keep with the interesting content and carry on.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Thanks, I’m glad you enjoyed. You’re completely right, it’s not because I got lazy with it, more so there was way less documentation online for the nomenclature. I dug as much as I could but information was hard to come by. Hopefully most of what I did find was accurate.

7:30 You mention that the S68 is only used in BMW's X series but I'm pretty sure that it is in the current production 760i (G70)

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

That was a slip, if you look at the applications section of that graphic the 760i is on there. My mistake, thanks for watching.

@TheWeavingBagel

7 ай бұрын

@@running2redline My bad, sorry.

2004-2006 audi a8 had a 4.2 40v with a timing belt and is one of the most reliable engines i’ve ever owned

@Swiss4.2

Ай бұрын

Those were the last truly reliable Audi v8 engines. All the newer stuff with the FSI injection have problems with carbon buildup, injector failures, bore scoring and lets not forget the infamous 4.2 FSI timing chain disaster. Those belt driven 40 valve engines are bulletproof and can easily do over 300k miles if you maintain them right. Theres a Canadian guy on youtube called Veikra who has one at 550k kms or 340k miles, I even saw someone on a forum post about how his A8 reached 800k kms or roughly half a million miles on the original engine.

I just got a 2010 Mercedes S550. I seen it didn’t have that specific year but the video did start at 2011 engine. Anyone know how good this engine is ?

The v8 in the r8 sounds pretty good when going through a tunnel 😊

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

For sure! The original V8 R8 with a gated manual has to be one of the greatest cars ever made.

s62 deserves better. rod bearings aren’t the best but might be because of wrong oil. i put 10W-60 not 30. best bmw N/A engine by far

The 4.2 fsi, has a massive issue with Carbon buildup due to the Internal AGR wich opens the Intake valve earlier in the Exhaust stroke in mid to Low rpm Situations. Otherwise a great engine

To anyone out there who owns a BMW with the N63 TU engine whether it's the TU, TU2 or TU3 it is extremely critical to not follow the BMW suggested oil change interval of 10,000 miles. Change the oil every 5 to 6,000 mi. My TU3 is currently at 40,000 miles and I religiously change the oil every 6 months or 5,000 mi, I have never experienced any oil consumption with this particular engine

@running2redline

Ай бұрын

Interesting, 10000 does seem like a long time. Thanks for the info

Happy 4.0TFSI owner here. :)

imo the reliability issues of the s65 engine should have been mentioned. yes it can be a great engine but there are some major common issues

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

Completely agree, thanks for watching!

M156 should be AT LEAST A tier. It really is the most reliable, well built performance V8 (so m113 excluded) out of Germany.

Looking forward to the 4 cylinders

Isnt the EA825 also developed by Porsche? To my understanding the engine was first developed by Audi, but then Porsche modified it to the current engine. Its also build in a Porsche factory.

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Yes, now that they use it in their vehicles their contribution to it has been much larger. Thanks for watching!

Even though it's not a V8 I would've loved to see a honorable mention of of the W8 found in the Passat and some of the Bentleys. Crazy unreliable engine with pretty low power output for what it is, but amazing sound and incredibly unique design and use in a normal family sedan. Amazing video though!

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

I’m glad you enjoyed, I’ll likely make a video for all W engines, a lot of W12 and W16s with it. Thanks for watching!

The newer Bmw V8 are the best.. Maybe I'm biased but I own anF10 m5 S63TU engine. Eats a lil oil but is super solid and reliable. I have owned bmws since the 90s and the newer ones are reliable and powerful.. Just keep an eye on the oil level tho.. Other than that they are a pleasure to drive

@a1phamalestud

7 ай бұрын

They fixed the v8s 2014 and newer

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Sick car, that must be loads of fun with minimal maintenance worries!

The m119 was in the sl class up until 98 I believe. I have a 97 and it has that engine

hey can you do a best 8 valve 4 cylinder video

@running2redline

Ай бұрын

Not currently, but I’ve started with high cylinder engines and have been working my way down. It will definitely happen though!

You make some amazing content. Inline 4/5 tier list next please 🥺👉👈

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

5 cylinder is coming next, I’m glad you’re enjoying the videos!

I feel like a few reliability problems were ignored on beamers while Mercs got hit way harder for it I’d rather deal with timing chain guides over rodbearings and Vanos. The m156 is an s tier motor if judged by the same standard.

Why is the M119 higher ranked then the M113? The M113 has more torque, better power consumption, less moving parts, less parts and scales amazingly well consider M113K etc.

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

That’s certainly a valid point

M62 had entirety different metallurgy then m60. M60 had nikasil coated cylinders that US fuel dissolved. M62 had acid etched alusil walls. Basically aluminum and silica made up the block, a microscopic layer of the aluminum was removed on the bores effectively making silica the wear surface of the bore. However the timing chain guide is real, had to replace mine at 200k miles. I think that's a fair interval, but some people have it happen much sooner. Thing leaks bad too, even after most gaskets replaced there will also be some stupid o-ring that leaks. After putting 120k miles on mine (230k total), hpde days, and autocross. I'd still rate it at B teir, enough power, reliable enough, but nothing special. However it sounds beautiful.

@k-dawg58

2 ай бұрын

Yes Which why m60b44 hybrid is the best way to go Then that for puts in a tier we can call it as S60 concept

@cmkm54

2 ай бұрын

@k-dawg58 the hybrid build is awesome. That may be the route I take when mine kicks the bucket. Only thing is I have a factory vanos engine. So my ecu is not going to like that being removed and finding a tuner for it is not fun. Maxxecu standalone seems promising tho.

@k-dawg58

2 ай бұрын

@@cmkm54 I see yeah that’s my plan for mine I got the spare m62 ready I might bore out for stroker

@cmkm54

2 ай бұрын

@@k-dawg58 read up on boring these things over. Sleeves are mandatory with the alusil block.

S65(based on s85) and S63(based on N63) should be tied with M156 and M157, all are impressive high performance engines plagued with reliability issues. M273 from 2008+ is decent, I'd put it in the tier same as the M60, another otherwise fine engine with reliability problems in its first few years of production. In fact it's probably more reliable than the M278, which I hear many horror stories about, particularly about problems with bore scoring. M113 and all of its derivatives belong in the S tier. these engines can produce M car levels of performance and retain bulletproof reliability. it's the closest thing to a German LS if there ever was one, and easily one of the best engines Mercedes has ever made.

the 4.2 litres audi in the s5 is completly different from that one in the rs4 / rs5,just same displaicment

The N62 is actually a very good engine and if taken care of can last a very long time. The issue was bmw used bad seals which made the engine prone to leaking but if addressed and the problems fixed/ the engine rebuilt it is a very very good engine much better then the M62 and N63

@chesapeakemotorwerks

6 ай бұрын

I agree with this. While the N62 has some expensive problems, they are generally more reliable than the M62TU and once addressed it's actually a great engine that produces significantly more power. The only glaring issue these days is really the valve stem seals which can be expensive to fix, but other issues now have aftermarket solutions that help reduce repair bills. For a daily, I'd take it over any of the hot-v successors. Overall, I'd probably rank them as S62 > M60 > N62(TU) > M62 > S63TU > M62TU > S65 > S63 > N63.

thank you

v6/i4 list next?

You left out a very important 8cyl from Vw..... the W8, predecessor to the w12 and w16 in Bently and Bugatti.

Personally id not rate pure oem output or aftermarket turningcapability into account for ranking. In my eyes id rate from all of those bmw engines following into s tier: m60(as bulletproof as the m113, super loved in e3x communities, some alpina 4.6s were dynoed around 400hp), s62(the best out of the m62 generation with doublevanos improvement!), s63, m113, m155(where you've got the carbon built-up information from?), m156(apart from the valvetrain no real issues)...A: M62,M119(more of a counterpart to the m62 in many aspects), m117(would be s tier if taking amg 4v option),m116 and n62(because if well maintained and with a lowtemp thermostat improved/precared is one of the best modern v8s), S68,S65(has to many flaws and broke up to much with its ancestors)...everything else b c d

Definitely some bias favorable to BMW in this video. You called out the M156 for its issues and put it in C tier but didn’t call out the BMW S65 and 62 motors for their rod bearing issues.

@maxgr7723

7 ай бұрын

S62 isnt so bad regarding rod bearings. They just got the wrong oil for the daily use(should have been a 5w40 or 5w50)...they timinguide is more of a problem in my eyes

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

Must have been a coincidence, but I do agree with that assessment. For what it’s worth I’m actually a big Chevy guy, thanks for watching!

83k miles on my m156 regular maintenance, and she still rips like she's brand new

As m60 dude With the hybrid build m60 is the goat for 90s German v8

N62 is higher than D tier. The reliability concerns are a bit overblown imo.

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

That’s completely fair, thanks for watching!

Nobody has forced Porsche to do anything at VAG, since the Porsche family is the majority shareholder within the Volkswagen Auto Group. Furthermore, Volkswagen has not built any V8 engine, only Audi, since Audi's developments are not always shared with VW but vice versa, that is, VW must share its developments with Audi, Porsche, SEAT, Skoda, etc. All of these are guidelines coming from Porsche SE (the company, not the brand as such), which also does not share its developments with Audi or VW.

The gen one v8 from Porsche should have been split into 2 the original 77-84 was amazing the 85 on had reliability issues the 84 and prior didn't have

M113K … my favourite engine 👌

I wouldn‘t group the Audi 3.6 and 3.7 together as they are not related to each other. The 3.6 was developed from the Golf GTI inline 4 soley for the Audi V8 and has a bore of 81 mm. The 3.7 is a destroked 4.2 with an 84.5 mm bore.

Great video… dude do Japanese i4’s!

@running2redline

Ай бұрын

Much appreciated and will do!

Cant wait for an Inline 5 tier list *-*

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

Good news is that 5 cylinders are up next!

@MigotRen

6 ай бұрын

@@running2redline Looking foreard to it. I will never get over the sound these make. grandpa had an ur-quattro. Sadly i never got to see that thing as he sold it years ago. Friend has an audi 200. Even with just 136hp that 2.1 5E sound with a remus exhaust it sounds amazing. I myself have been an rs3 owner for a year now. 2016 with the ea855 (not the evo). Still, Technically very impressive engine - aside from some powerrobbing carbon build typical for the pre evo era as they just have direct injection. Thicker oil and a catch can can help. But overall very solid. Amazing responsiveness for a high power turbo engine. Vvt all arround and avs on the exhaust valves. Water cooled turbo with an additional trailing pump to avoid coking. As for reliability Properly warm it up before giving it the beans, keep up the oil changes every 10k km, preferably not the 0w30 longlife stuff and they just keep going. Even with a 420hp stage 1 at 125.000km now, no signs of problems. Ive heard of cases of timing chain elongations, but so far no signs of that either and the camshaft sensors usually catch that before it breaks. Power Potential, especially with the evos is crazy as you can just mount bigger port injectors on those. I mean iroz gets these to over 1400hp with so much boost one of their intske manifolds exploded. Engine was fine lol No wonder you pay 10k+ on an s3/golf r. Basically the same car but that extra money all goes into that overuild drivetrain. How much 1 cylinder can change the character and that dq500 gearybox can handle 1000Nm with a clutch upgrade (800 stock) which is leagues ahead of all the other vw DSGs

@running2redline

6 ай бұрын

RS3 is one of my favorite street cars, that's absolutely awesome! Interesting how much abuse they can handle.@@MigotRen

@MigotRen

6 ай бұрын

@@running2redline If you want some reading material, there is this quite elaborate self study on the 855 EVO by audi static.nhtsa.gov/odi/tsbs/2017/MC-10127901-9999.pdf i havent found such a thing for the pre evos. But this little article should give a nice overview. (czgb, last iron block variant) australiancar.reviews/Audi-RS3_CZGB_Engine.php

Awe man I use to own a ‘15 RS5 and was so excited to see where he’d rank that unique engine and then he skipped it 😂 well S tier for me!

you guys notice how from the early 1900s to late 2000s there was a trend of making the engines bigger with each new model, but since the early 2010s it's just been downsizing already downsized engines

@running2redline

7 ай бұрын

Now that you say that, it’s abundantly true for nearly every list I’ve done, especially German. Interesting to think about.

4.0 tdi with its astonishing 930nm

VW/Audi tech here. The early audi 4.0T seen in C7 S6/7 RS7, D4 A8 Are JUNK! Rampant turbo failures leaking to engine failure. They do make crazy power and don’t have many other issues though

I believe cls63 had m157 from 2011-2018 too

I will take my M119 to the grave. Such a good engine, and it sounds sooooo good with a PROPPER exhaust setup