Protokatzbalger... nice term. I think in the Rüstkammer in Vienna we have a similar weapon and they named it: Jagdschwert (hunting sword). in contrary to the Jagdmesser (hunting knife) which is a single edged weapon, same hilt, same cross guard and same secondary equipment in the scabbard.

Thank you for making videos on the landsknecht! In my opinion you're incredibly underrated!

@VirtualFechtschule

Жыл бұрын

You're welcome! There's more to come in the future! :D

@arikroberts7049

Жыл бұрын

@@VirtualFechtschule I'm very glad! I was having difficulty finding info before you!

As someone who is in the process of growing a handlebar mustache I must say: cool mustache my dude

Looking forward to the sparring video. Before you mentioned it was a LE custom, I thought it looked like a shortened Malleus Todesca with a messer hilt. It has "one-handed estoc" vibes, just lovely.

I love your videos! I hope you keep putting more informative videos out!

First, I have zero envy towards you for having such a beautiful and unique piece made by Landsknecht Emporium (which at this time have put custom works on hold), one that I would also want to have at some point. Zero envy, none whatsoever, don't even mention it! 😤 I think we overplay the messer hilt construction in trying to assign a category. If the blade is thin and pointy (which is what your piece seems to replicate) then it's just an estoc (stocco). Italian stocco blades could also cut (i.e. not just poking metal rods), right? But the emphasis was on the thrust, which I believe was the novel aspect compared to other blades, especially in the armour combat context. If the blade was wider with a bit more meat around the tip, its role is as for later side-swords, so it's just a side-sword (lots of early side-swords didn't have finger-rings and complex sweeps on the guard). If you want to concentrate on the hilt, it's a messer, but the problem is that messer is also connected to a system of fighting, and I'm not sure if these are well suited for that system (not that they can't be used like that, you have shown that they can, but more so that they can be used much better outside the messer systems due to the extra length). I'm mentioning this since a katzbalger (as the short, stubby blade with a round tip) seems to be this weapon that had a particular role in combat. I don't see your piece fulfilling the same role, so connecting the two sounds wrong to me. On the other hand, if you see the katzbalger as the side-weapon of a landsknecht (which may have been how they saw it in the period), then just call what you have a katzbalger (no need for the proto prefix). And if you insist on separating the types, I read someone say Katsmesser... it sounds like a better name for it than the unfortunate implication of the proto prefix. But hey, you are confused by all these names and the endless discussion, I get it. Why let this upset you? Just let me help you by taking it off your hands. 😏

Nice video! With a sturdy single edged blade or a back edged blade (that is not unusual on these swords) it seems that half swording techniques might be even more efficient. The replica is really nicely made, btw :-)

Very interesting. I've noticed this type of sword myself but never thought to call it a proto katzbalger. To be honest I just thought it a primitive or ornamental cousin of the side sword.

@VirtualFechtschule

7 ай бұрын

Well, you're not wrong there. It's definitely a cousin to a sidesword, but the cool thing is that we see these in the hands of Landsknechte so often that proto katzbalger is a sensible term to stick to them. :)

@martinsmith9054

7 ай бұрын

@@VirtualFechtschule When I was a youngster I looked at all the renaissance prints I could find. I do remember seeing it, your post jogged my memory.

good stuff

Wooo, finally! If one could ask, what would one of these set you back?

idk, katzbalger have pretty distinct stubby blades. If you have messer grips and long thin blades, but just with curly cross guards... what makes it a Katzbalger at all? besides that landsknecht have been depicted holding them? don't other people also wear S hilted messers?

@superrobotmonkeyhyperteamf3194

Жыл бұрын

Many so called Katzbalgers did have very pointy and long blades though, early ones as well later ones. There are also "Katzbalgers" with messer like constructions. And other people did wear those kind of Messer. Theres a huge variation and i wouldnt be surprised if many of them(short stubby ones) were fakes as some experts suggest. The term itself is historical but rather refers to a certain type of person not a weapon or Mercenary as far as i researched and some historians also view it this way. I remember no military records where they referred to Katzbalgers as such and people prolly did make that distinction.

👍🏻👍🏻👍🏻

Could this be what was used for Egenolff’s/Paurenfeindt’s/Ol’ Man Lichty’s Kurtzes Schwert techniques?

@VirtualFechtschule

Жыл бұрын

Potentially, although that might have been a longsword as well, given how they were a bit shorter than most feders are.

How do you use it? If in doubt, stick 'em with the pointy end!

Katsmesser or messerbalger?

The hand in the bottom left corner...

But why real Katzbalgers went shorter

@DreynHarry

Жыл бұрын

I would say because their main focus of use have been the battlefield as a secondary weapon to a pike/helbard/pole arm. there you have had no room for a long bladed sword. you needed something short and sturdy.

@connorperrett9559

Жыл бұрын

To add to Andres' point, a shorter secondary weapon also seems better for campaigns if you are also carrying a large weapon like a pike or a two handed sword. More comfortable to carry on your person the 95% of the time during a campaign that you aren't actively fighting.

@superrobotmonkeyhyperteamf3194

Жыл бұрын

Did they? they rather seem to get even longer especially toward the 1520-1530 and later. Most confirmed originals also are longer than what is considered the typical Katzbalger length and proto katzbalger were quite long as well so it rather seems like the length stayed consistent/got increased and the shortness just being a matter of perspective etc. Not to say there werent shorter ones but it seems that they were longer than expected.