The main difference I've often felt is that lategame lol carries always become glass cannons, while lategame dota carries always become raidbosses

@cuongdo3352

21 күн бұрын

LoL carries late game: RPG damage dealers, who need tanks and healers combo backing them up. Dota carries late game: actually quite diverse: some can tank the whole enemy team while dishing out remarkable damage (like Spectre and Medusa), some are slippery hit-and-run powerhouses (like Slark and Anti-mage) but some are also RPG damage dealers, who need tanks and healers combo backing them up (like Drow Ranger and Sniper). EDIT: I actually had written this comment before I watched the clip. The video covers it incredibly well. I shouldn't have posted such a mood comment.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

In Dota, the carries are the ones one-shotting people whereas in LoL, they're the ones getting one-shot

@Zancibar

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron I feel like one of those Dota was supposed to be a League.

@doku-ritsu8718

21 күн бұрын

​@@Acex2ronso, which one is dota and which one is dota?

@saigipson1546

21 күн бұрын

@@Zancibar nope lol

The main difference is that in the lategame a carry in dota is a strong and, sometimes, tanky, right-clicker, which shows the product of all the farming needed to achieve that point. In league of legends, you are a bag of gold that gets oneshot without any kind of counterplay if there is a character called "Rengar" in the game

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

That's why League has GA--you can get one-shot twice in the same fight!

@MrFancyGamer

21 күн бұрын

the best counter to this is proper team play, which we all know can be an absolute joke without any voice comms lol

@winslycan1309

21 күн бұрын

League also has raid boss hard carry as well. Lilia, Shyvana, Evelyn, Master Yi, etc. are your DOTA hardcarries. Riot just nerfed them out of existence. And the Windshitter, don't forget them

@bardfall9555

21 күн бұрын

​@@Acex2ron They need to nerf assasin reduce tank scaling and remove the bounty system. League is getting more and more boring with how regid the meta is. I feel like only top and jungle mattered in league unless riot decide to say no and balance them to oblivion. But refuse to nerf op champs.

@Cricket0021

20 күн бұрын

@@bardfall9555 i had a game where my kai'sa was 0-5 AND she still had a bounty.

As someone who has played both games for a long time, I find the differences between the two games really fascinating. They sometimes look similar if you haven't played both, but it's almost like they're made for completely opposite types of people. Not just in their gameplay, but in their fundamental design philosophy. It's no wonder most Dota players can't stand League, and most League players never get interested in Dota.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Couldn't have put it better myself! League isn't Dota, and Dota isn't League, so they'll never be each other and arguing over which is better is pointless. But it's still fun to discuss the differences between the two biggest names in the genre.

@kanade2605

21 күн бұрын

Yes exactly Remember when early 2010s everyone compared one to each other but after years they are fundamentally different

@Cricket0021

21 күн бұрын

dota is more of an old man's game where as LoL is more of the arcade-y type

@basti_lol

20 күн бұрын

@@Cricket0021 no one could think of a worse analogy than what you just typed.

@gambaru55

20 күн бұрын

@@basti_lol well there arcade skin on league and mythical skin on dota

I love how in Dota the definition of a carry is p much just "given enough gold you become unstoppable" and that can mean anything from a sniper shooting up highground to an insta killing es with daedalus

@carljohan9265

10 күн бұрын

What's also really fun is that dota has moved more and more towards a design that lets heroes play multiple types of roles. Yes there are some heroes that are meant for specific things but the role flexibility is mcuh greater than it first seems. Take terrorblade for example. He's long been seen as a definitive hard carry, and for good reason. However I've seen people take a look at him and go "hmm, I can use my illusions to scout, I got a strong attack buff so I can deal damage even without items, I can make illusions of enemies which turns their power against them and this spell is completely item independant, and I can save my carry with my ult. Yes I'll play hard support terrorblade that sounds good". Ogre magi is another one. He might not be able to play as pos 1 but he can absolutely build himself into a brawler that bashes people's faces in, or a support mage that focuses on spellcasting, or some sort of hybrid. Omniknight can either be a support who saves his carry, or a fighter who protects his friends in the process. Dark Willow can either be a highly disruptive support or a straight up ranged assassin. Hell even heroes like crystal maiden and dazzle, the quintessential definition of a support hero, can play as a mid laner and become a monstrously strong right clicker with the right build. There's so much flexibility in what you can do in dota.

@Elephanthobo

4 күн бұрын

​@@carljohan9265unfortunately, that means the knowledge check on individual heroes is that much higher. There's so many unexplained and overemphasized mechanics in Dota that starting is a huge hurdle. But it does seem like as long as you play your own game, you can just ignore heroes and just focus on the items, which simplifies the lategame by a LOT.

@carljohan9265

4 күн бұрын

@@Elephanthobo No, you must certainly can't ignore what your team is doing because that's how you end up being the one who farms creeps half a screen away from your team dieing and then get (rightfully) blamed for that loss. Map awareness is absolutely critical and being where you need to be is more important than getting that 300 gold.

@MangaGamify

4 күн бұрын

@@carljohan9265 League used to be the king of flexibility or any build, but with their kind of game philosophy they just nerf any build they don't like like AP Yi, on-hit neeko, semi-tank Vayne, old ADC Thresh and the ancient crit Alistar. There's also crit Aatrox but only works in URF. League is the only moba who's carry's time gets worse and worse as the game gets longer if both sides are equal(neither is feeding, but with same items, League ADC always gets 1 shot first), unless the ADC gets ultra hyper mega fed and ends early so the assassins cant buy items, its the only case ADC is strong.

@iHaveGrudgeAgainstUT

4 күн бұрын

Dota's design is basically gold funneling, puting all the resources on 1 or 2 player, where league tries to spread out resources. LoL also had gold funnel meta before but it was boring to play and unfair.

EE risky farm joke goes hard lmfao

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Fifty-FiftEE NEVER DIES

@sbastianbrilyanto4722

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron PLEASE TP TOP

@Acex2ron

20 күн бұрын

@@sbastianbrilyanto4722 DROP YOUR STICK, DROP YOUR STICK

@ZweiKyozumi

19 күн бұрын

I am so good and bad at this game at the same time !

>"there are no magic damage carries in Dota" >Pos 1 Pudge slowly creeps in, starts to rot and heal back and chew your ass off with his ulti Dismember"

@johnlloydvillanosa3582

21 күн бұрын

he forgot about muerta

@Chasodey

21 күн бұрын

@@johnlloydvillanosa3582 Muerta is magic damage, yes, but she is closer to Drow or Medusa or Sniper in her type of gameplay when Pudge is something completely different (I personally play Pudge as Pos 3 and into damage build, it's so fun to see people MELT)

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Ah shit, not again. Someone build Mage Slayer + Shiva's pls

@Chasodey

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron Fortunately, mage slayer isn’t that popular right now although Sviva both hurts and helps Pudge (Aghs+Bloodstone is a dopamine factory)

@szyren8793

21 күн бұрын

@@Chasodey Necrophos used to be like that too

And then there's Morhpling a whatever carry that thing is

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

He's a marksman, but also a statstick, but also a tank, but also a caster, but also....your Earthshaker?

@Lastofhiskind_

18 күн бұрын

​@@Acex2ron he's you, he's me, he's everyone

@Hesuklista

8 сағат бұрын

​@@Lastofhiskind_it could be you, it could be me, it could even be a- *sniper assassinate*

In League you get to scale all your abilities through your items, where as in dota, your skills will scale far more with just raw experience. For carries, their late game potential usually comes down to how these abilities synergize with key items, where as supports and mid-game based mages scale mostly with getting levels to scale up their damage, and use items for utility. There aren't a lot of crit items in dota, but assassins attain it mostly through skills that give critical strike. Phantom lancer is hard to kill because his ultimate makes illusions, and illusions get to benefit from health scaling of strength, and the damage from agility.

@rapeeps

19 күн бұрын

Well said, it's spot on

5:25 100% slow in dota doesn't actually make a hero completely unable to move, but instead sets their ms to 100, which the minimum ms for heroes and is one third of the average base ms.

@ChadKakashi

19 күн бұрын

100 ms is almost as slow as not moving though. You move like a geriatric snail crawling on glue.

@kayne7380

16 күн бұрын

​@ChadKakashi could still blink compared to root where you can't. I always found it weird that at 100% slow, you can still walk.

@camilog777

21 сағат бұрын

@@kayne7380 Too OP, nerf CM base move speed pls

A support main here. I haven't really played dota 2 in quite a while, but I feel like it's a lot more necessary to support for your hard carry whereas in LoL, I think very little of abandoning an underperforming ADC in favor of helping a higher performing player. I think it's because of the abundance of hyper carry champs who can 1v9 with cataclysmic late game damage in other positions like Gwen, Bel'Veth, and Master Yi. A snowballing Yone is worth far more of my attention as a win condition than a 0/3 Jinx. Hell, there are even support champs like Senna and Pyke who can hard carry if I REALLY don't trust my team.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

This is a very good point that I'm bookmarking for the Support video! Because of the nature of League, it's a lot better for the team if the support abandons the underfarmed (or just plain bad) ADC and goes to gank mid or top, or joins the Jungler in applying roam pressure. But it's also the case for Dota, where if your lane is lost beyond salvaging, it's better to sack it and the carry goes to farm the jungle whereas their 5 support goes to support other lanes. This usually means that the enemy has to do the same, sending the 3 and 4 in response, thus opening up the lane for your carry to farm!

@psychokuca302

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron lemme enter another comment XD Recently(since they added Void grubs) roaming supports had more success over non roaming ones, cuz of the map pressure and a fact that any role in League can be a “carry” role. And I mean any, cuz even on something like bard or soraka or Nami one good combo or rightfully placed ward can turn a fight around, cuz how different dote and league is

@IonPerseus

21 күн бұрын

​@@psychokuca302 nah man, dota is literally the same, perhaps you haven't played a lot of dota sups

@gambaru55

20 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron but carry in dota still can scale hard because jungle camp in dota in safelane is same size as whole camp in league. there also portal to top now. make carry/support to gank offlane or otherwise. while league biggest thing you can farm is siege minion cause jungle camp worth little for adc making it harder to scale like other winning role

@gambaru55

20 күн бұрын

@@psychokuca302 in dota when you play turbo 3 minute is minimum time you gonna get gank while minimum 5-10 minute you go out of lane. in all pick is 5 minute for early gank and 15-20 minute to leaving lane. as post 5 you shouldn't leave your carry alone if you carry jungle you protect the lane and warding jungle. but as post 4 you the one who most likely to roam to give either post 3 get more xp or helping other lane.

You may think the pos 1 carries in dota, wait till you see the late game pos 5 snap who left to jungle at min 40 and reenters the game with Daedalus+25 talent and 1 shots your 3 cores

One of the things that feels the most different being the carry in League is that in the early game it feels like there's less to do; in DOTA it's pretty common to farm up to a farming item and rotate in and out of jungle to more efficiently get gold. In League I was surprised that the jungle is off limits (because of junglers) and that 'picking up' lanes for exp/last hits when that lane's core is backing/dead is not common place (usually supports).

@existentiallamp

18 күн бұрын

at least earlygame, you just dont have the damage to kill jungle camps. camps are super tanky early on and if you arent the jungler you take way too much damage and time to really make it worthwhile to kill camps. as for why you dont see people oicking up waves, i think its mostly just that it takes a lot of time. it takes like 20 seconds to walk to a lane and the summoner spell teleport has a 6 to 4 minute cool down thats better used to try and turn a fight

@cynt4416

17 күн бұрын

It's ALOT of things to do. You will be overwhelmed. Assume that you win lane and force the lanner to hug the tower, now you can deepward their jungle. Go with your own jungler to compete for crab/worm/herald/dragon. Or just make their jungler life miserable. Or even tower dive other lane. I literally don't have time to do them all as a jungler even if I don't intend to invade.

in DotA the hardest position to play is Hard Support(the carries support) - the life of the carry becomes very easy if you have a really good support; a good support will stack, pull, denied and die for the carry; all position main goal in the DotA is to make space for the carry to farm, most people don't get that, that's why they lose; and the priority of Position 1(Carry) and Position 2 (Mid) can change of who gets the farm; position 3(core offlane) never has prio to farm, he always takes the unsafe farm and always prioritizes to make space.

From my personal experience (as a newbie in league and old-time player in dota) it's much more fun to play carry in dota than to play adc in league. I like dota's macro and item build choises much more. Items in dota can offer you cc, movement, survivability in form of extra health, armor, lifesteal, dispels. And in league it's just damage, attack speed, crits. While some items have additional passive components, they don't feel that interesting. What makes playing adc a literal torture for me is the fact that all adcs are just glass cannons which get one shot by everyone else. You need to have incredibly good positioning and your team has to protect you from enemy assasins/bruisers diving and deleting you in a fraction of second. But there is no reason for them to protect you because in league everyone can carry and your damage dealing capabilities don't matter that much, since anyone else can dish out pretty good damage while also having better mobility / survivability / cc. As an adc you build only damage to keep up with everyone else, while some tank builds nothing but hp and armor but has abilities that scale with his health, allowing him to deal good damage while also being harder to kill. Playing assassin is a high-risk/high-reward playstyle. While playing adc is basically very high-risk/low-reward. I can deal much more damage when playing lux support, hitting enemies from an actually safe distance, which is harder to cover with a built-in dash that every new champ has. Or I can go toplane with some easy to grasp frontlane champ, just turn off my brain and run into enemies. Or i can play assassin and just insta-gib most characters without breaking a sweat. I'm not really good on akali but damn sometimes I roll my face on keyboard and miss half of my abilities and still manage to easily kill some poor squishy without almost any counterplay availible to them. And I can kinda do all this stuff while playing carry in dota, since there are so many different carries with different playstyles. But even when I play drow, who is similar to adc's in league (long-range glass cannon), it's still much more fun. I actually have items which help me survive like pike, bkb or manta. And my team actually plays around me because I'm their main source of damage, so I can usually expect that my support will help me if I get jumped and my frontlaner will lock down enemy team so I can shoot them. It also doesn't help that carries are supposed to scale well into late game, but due to snowballing, players being easily tilted and surrender option available at 15min mark, most games just end before adc can even hit a major powerspike and become an actual character that can do stuff.

@SadFace201

21 күн бұрын

Haha, the FF15 mentality is one of my most hated attitudes in League. Like, I feel like half my games in League don't even make it past 3 completed items because one of the teams will quit. Why even plan a build order at that point when you only need 2-3 core items per game.

@savekla

21 күн бұрын

@@SadFace201 The saddest thing is that mentality isn't necessary completely wrong. As far as I know, people on higher ranks FF15 much more often because players are better at using their leads. So when one team snowballs, they won't give their enemies a chance to comeback. People know that and just end the game at 15 min mark because sometimes there is literally no reason to continue playing because of how snowbally the game is. Also playing when behind in league is extremely frustrating as there isn't much you can do, especially when playing with random people. It's much harder to comeback in league than in dota imo. The game is just designed this way, since rito want short mathes that end in less than 30 minutes, and too many possibilities for comeback might prolong the game too much. And because of that I think a lot of people don't put much effort in playing. The commitment is low, so to speak. Why try hard when others in your team might lose their lanes so hard you'll have to FF15? And if you fail because you haven't tried hard enough, it's not a big deal, since you can just FF15 and try again! Absolutely ridiculous game design. That said, on lower elo it's still very much possible to win even when you're behind, because people there aren't that good at the game and prone to making stupid mistakes which can cost them the entire game.

@SadFace201

20 күн бұрын

@@savekla Oh yes, I'm aware that League is far more snowbally than dota. The lack of mechanics that can be leveraged in League means that there's very little you can do to comeback barring the enemy team from royally fucking up, which happens rarely in higher ELOs. That's why they used to have that statistic many many years ago that in pro-play the team ahead at 10 min has a 90% chance to win the game. I'd assume that still holds true today since Riot hasn't really added anything that would significantly encourage comebacks.

@cynt4416

19 күн бұрын

Much more fun for you, less fun for the 9 other player playing with you when you get fed. Adc in Lol still need team to help him function even if they are fed. Support player will still feel like they make a difference late game. But top lane in lol have the same problem as carry in Dota. When they are fed, they are both tanky and deal high damage, making the match much more oneside and turn to a boring stat check.

@savekla

18 күн бұрын

@@cynt4416 I'd rather have someone named "Carry" be stronger than average and able to actually carry the game, instead of dying to a sneeze in their general direction. I mean, if you are weak early on and spend at least 20 minutes farming for items to play the game, than it better be worth it in the end. Carries in dota start off weak and through levels and items become late game menace. Carries in league feel like they need levels and items to just be on the same level as others, if not worse, since they don't have built-in survivability, mobility or utility that other roles have, while everyone else has those thing and still can deal damage pretty good damage. Still, carries in dota rarely get hyperfed so much they can really 1v9 without any help from their team, especially at higher skill levels. Even if they do get a good start, carry without team will have hard time dealing any damage if they are playing against at least somewhat competent players, as they'll just get kited/cc'd, all while there is no one to hold enemies in place with cc, or save them with utility spells/items. No matter if you have ton of damage and bkb, enemy team can still cc you with abilities that go through bkb and focus you with all they have, which is almost always a guranteed death. I honestly rarely feel like I'm having less fun because my carry is popping of. If I stop doing my thing, they will usually get overwhelmed, since I'm not helping them either directly or by applying pressure somewhere on the map. And if the enemy carry is fed, than of course I'm going to have less fun, since I'm currently losing, duh. And there is plenty counterplay and ways to comeback when you're behind. Unless the score is like 0-20. In late game, supports, just like any other role, still can have huge impact on the game. At the very least, they can provide their team with vision and useful utility items for save/buffs. Most support characters have incredibly powerful spells, which can be gamechanging. Dazzle's W is Tryndamere's ult for a teammate. Vengeful Spirit's ult allows her to swap positions with a champion, which can be used to save teammates or ruin enemy's positioning. Crystal Maiden's ult can deal tons of magic damage in a team fight. Ogre's buffs can greatly improve his team's survivability and dps. Good supports are often the ones focused first in teamfights if possible, because they can easily turn your good engage into a lost teamfight by saving their cores or cc'ing your team. Not to mention that early game falls almost enterily on support's shoulders. And again regarding whole thing about fed players being unstoppable. In league toplaners and junglers become 1v9 deathmachines. But champs that usually play those roles are pretty strong even in early game. So they get to play from the start and get to play even more if things go their way. While carries in dota are weak at the start, but become stronger than anyone else late in the game. Makes more sense to me that someone who's weakest early becomes strongest in the end, Instead of someone who is already pretty strong early becoming even stronger as time goes by.

Something you missed about the prevalence of melee carries in Dota is actually attack animations. Aside from most melee carries having faster attack animations than ranged cores, they also don't have to deal with attack travel time. This means that it's generally easier to last hit and assuming stats and items were the same, a faster animation means more damage. It's been evened out a lot but Terrorblade was a huge addition because he had the same attack point as Antimage. And back in the day, Antimages attack animation was considered so good that some players would buy blink dagger and only level stats.

The biggest difference in League and Dota is, in non-pro games, one person cannot win a game in League, but one person can lose it. Meanwhile in Dota, as long as the carry is fed and head and shoulders above all the other players in terms of skill, he alone can win a game, even if one or two of his teammates are actively trying to lose.

Just a small note; Muerta was not the first Magic Damage carry; Outworld Devourer, Leshrac, Tinker, Dazzle, and Sniper were at one point all magic damage carrys. Tinker and Dazzle got nerfed into support roles (Dazzle was originally there, but Tinker was a carry since the WC3 days). Sniper's headshot and shrapnel got reworked to not work on buildings and (for headshot) be bonus attack damage rather than a magic dmg tick. Lesh and OD are still quite strong but not popular because they require a decent amount of skill. Also DotA doesn't have many items that improve spell damage directly (Parasma, Veil, Shivas, & Kaya's various upgrades), but they do still have a lot of items that improve spell damage (cooldown reduction, range increase, spell lifesteal, int based magic damage amplification, repositioning tools, etc.)

Another great vid~! May we please have one on the differences between Supports in Dota and LoL as well?

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Gimme a few days :)

Spell based carrys do exist in dota2( pudge, Lesh). However unlike league, dota isnt about skillshots and bursts, not always. So when it comes to spell based carrys, they are tanky mfs who you wont be able to deal with. Pudge as a pos1 doesnt out damages you, he out healths you.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Pudge is a relatively new addition to the carry role, but that is true! They're DPSes for sure, but they just ramp up damage over the fight. Guess that's another archetype to add to Dota's carry roster

@sh1ro9

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron relatively new is.. well I guess relative. Pudge carry has been a thing since they reworked agh and if I'm not mistaken, it was Matu who made it popular in ti11. But again, about spell based carries, they have existed for a long time but most of them are very risky picks. You have heroes like pudge and lesh who wanna out-live you and you have heroes like OD, Silencer, Winter Wyvern who wanna right click you down asap.

@imfinishedgrinding638

21 күн бұрын

​​@@Acex2ron Not really relatively new. It was very meta 2 years ago after a series of buffs, got reworked into his current Aghanim's and his 3rd skill becoming an active and we got to see it in action when TI11 rolled around and boy was he contested a lot before playoffs. He didn't do so hot later coz Leshrac was a better alternative and both didn't do well either when wraith pact and damage reduction strats crushed them.

@priqe

21 күн бұрын

@@imfinishedgrinding638 Im 99% sure he meant relatively new in the lifespan of the game. If you picked carry pudge 5 years ago you were going to low prio, no questions asked.

@Acex2ron

20 күн бұрын

@@priqe Yeah, as an old school player, anything past Pango and Willow registers as “new” to me. Gimme a pension already lmao

I love this video it hits the nail on the head of what i feel is different and helped me identify what I was feeling

What if for the next video you're talk about comeback mechanics in Dota and League or how is it to close the game between two games? Or is it already included in your gold mechanic? Thank you.. :3

Love your content my guy. I can tell you're actually knowledgeable in both games and their nuances

1 thing you forget is how sustain work in both lanes, in dota 2 with courier you can kinda make any lane work as long as don't get countered in the draft so you spam regen and just exist and its almost impossible to snowball dota 2 game and finish in 20-25 min when average game time is 40+, league is other way around, you not only limited on sustain but because game balanced around dodging spells not tank them if you start taking dmg in the face you lose laning phase in few min and after that you probably don't have time to farm/comback since enemy can from snowball finish at min 20-25

Riot pretty much dismantled AD Carry role as "carry" and made every role being able to carry plainly through damage. AD Carries are now simply "marksmen", AD mages with more periodic and less burst damage. Basically you have only 3 roles in League: jungle support and laner.

You can carry with any role in DotA, not just pos1. Pos2 has the most impact early on due to leading exp and Runes. Pos3 is dynamite, most of the time they have to be active (in a good way) once the laning stage ends, so having a more active and efficient pos3 is decisive. Supports can carry in many different ways. If an Enchantress can deal about the dmg of cores with only half resource, she carried the game. A Rubik who always manage to use enemies Ultimate also has most impact. A Nyx who solo kill enemy carry over 3 times is definitely the game changer. DotA decide who did the most based on Imapct per Gold/Exp

Great video I personally have hopped between playing league and DOTA casually for many years, and I definitely agree with a lot of what you said! Thanks for the great video and keep up the good work

I would say that even in dota there are countless times when even a pos5 (support) can feel like he's carrying the game, highest damage dealt etc because of the match up or skill level

Very lovely video. Great comparisons and as a Dota player, I think you hit the nail on the head. Maybe except that Dota has been trying to make the intelligence carry role more of a thing in the recent years by introducing many magic and intelligence-based items. However, they also naturally introduced the counters. I think the intention of releasing Muerta was a breaking point since they introduced Revenant's Brooch (what Meurta carries on her back) before she was released, transforming physical damage into magical. I think it still needs some tweaks, but the very fact that Bristleback is often picked as a carry is indicative that you can sometimes pick a spell-caster carry.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Thanks for this comment! And I agree on the Revenant's Brooch. I think it's a good item in theory as a counter to armor-stackers like Axe and Timber, but still needs some tweaking. The removal of Khanda Rapier meta was a step in the right direction!

@wumi2419

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron I'd say actual armor-stackers in dota are agility carries, as they get a lot of base armor, which also helps them to feel less squishy despite having less raw HP. And in general magic resist is usually lower than physical resist unless you specifically build an item to change that. Brooch has lost a lot of popularity after it stopped working with crits though.

@arnesieper8332

4 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron khanda rapier was so nuts. i have lost counts of the times a PA or sniper with khanda rapier ruined a great game. basically the moment you saw those guys in the draft, you had to go blademail on enitre team. not a fun 6 weeks in dota

I think that the hardest role, at least in dota 2 is the support, but good video man... Also, HSR OST, nice

@bryanudi

21 күн бұрын

Depends on the point of view. Support needs a lot of good mental and decision making, but its honestly the easiest role to climb

@marcmarcell5982

21 күн бұрын

Penacony battle music slaps bro

@adamhercik581

21 күн бұрын

In pubs, not really, but in pro games, the supports are the blood of the team, that's why team captains are often pos 5.

@parham1023

21 күн бұрын

Pos4 is the hardest, than pos2. Depending on the meta. Rn these 2 are the most important roles. Yes, you heard that right. lol playeres: carrys aren't always the most important role.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

About 10 years ago, I would have agreed. But ever since they added free wards, free courier and flying upgrade, glimmer cape, stacking gold, tormentor, and twin gates, Wisdom Runes, and all that other jazz? I've never had so much gold playing as Lion!

Most carry position in Dota2 : Early hard time, carry the team at last Most carry position in LoL : Always foreshadowed by their support of another teammate lol

One scaling mage from dota that bears mentioning is Leshrac. Lesh has even seen brief periods of meta relevancy as a pos 1 on multi-core lineups, but he's been meta in every position at least once so perhaps that's not so surprising. There was also the period where all the carries went midlane and the safelane would often be casters/playmakers, but that was just the pos 1 being mid, rather than a caster being pos 1. I agree with the point about everyone in league being a carry while dota has the pos 1 win condition you funnel into, but I think it's worth mentioning, just as a point of interest/discussion, that power creep has been taking dota more down the league route. There is enough farm on the map to have 2-3 highly farmed cores now, and supports have seen a lot of love to the point where even your pos 5 can sometimes get a few big items and the pos 4 often turns into a 4th core. Plus with talents, aghs shards, and what not, adding extra power to casters, a pos 1 with bkb on cd could potentially just die 1v1 to even something like a lich or crystal maiden. That being said, I definitely prefer it this way to how dota used to be. I'm do not like league's extreme damage creep, and idk if I'd say dota has it right either, but at the very least I'll take CM solo killing the 4 items PA over the days when she'd be lvl 8 with brown boots and wand at the 30 minute mark. I also think there is a lot more that could be talked about with item differences. Dota doesn't actually have that many generic dps items like league. Most damage items come with some kind of survivability stat while league has a ton of items that are just damage. And maybe it's just me, but I feel like, as an adc, building tank just doesn't really do anything. I know tank kog'maw has seen some success, but there is so much damage that building just a bit of tank doesn't seem to make a difference, and if you go too far into tank you don't do enough damage. Then of course there is Blink Dagger, which makes marksman type heroes so much more vulnerable. I've always been curious about what effect blink dagger would have if you added it into league. Oh and thanks for making me feel old with that mordekaiser bit, but it doesn't make me feel as old as realizing how few people even remember the old runes and mastery system. I mean how many people would even know what you are talking about if you brought up "Thunderlord's" now?

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

I read "Leshrac" in your comment and I started building Mage Slayer out of habit lmao But in all seriousness, Leshrac does deserve a mention in hindsight, even though I think he's better as a Pos 2. I'm not sure if it was TI5 or TI6 where Leshrac was in pretty much every match, and Sumail was absolutely rolling with him. Very good point though on how the abundance of resources have changed the game over the years. Right now, I actually believe that Pos 1 is in the weakest it's ever been (and that says a lot, the role is still quite strong) with the nerfs to BKB and the abundance of supports with survivability items. Thanks to the gold changes, and Ammar, we're starting to see a lot of carry offlaners as well. The TTK is actually what allows item actives to be so much more useful in Dota. I've been stunned for over 6 seconds as Sven, but still lived long enough to pop BKB and Satanic just because the TTK is so low, whereas even a 1 second stun is enough to end my life, even as a Xin Zhao, in League. And my Hextech Gunblade Mordekaiser lives on in memory (and TFT)

@HeavensBane53

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron Pretty sure it was TI5. Baumi has a neat channel, StoriesofDota, that covers the history of certain heroes by looking at them through the lens of their TI performances, and my recollection from the Lesh video was that his super OP patch, 6.84, was during TI5. I started dota the winter between TI2 and TI3 when he was played support, though, so I still have strong memories of him as that, and he's been an offlaner plenty of times as well. In fairness, Pos 1 is probably the role least often meta for him, I feel like there's only a few patches when it was anything but a rare, very niche, pick.

@okupant880

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron Indeed, pos 1 is really vulnerable these days and as a support main i am almost always certain that we can jump even a strong farmed pos 1 alone like its JJK and end him. I've been playing dota since 2012/2013 and i still remember the days when 30 minutes in the enemy carry that has been in the jungle all game would reveal himself like an anime villain and solo the entire team with no help or any difficulties. Sure, it was the early days when on a fundamental level players were a lot less knowledgeable and skilled, and what is now considered herald level game would have been a mid to high skill game.

@otsokarhu9695

21 күн бұрын

Blink dagger kind of does exist on league. It's called flash and every champ has it on a 5 minute cooldown.

@Lastofhiskind_

18 күн бұрын

​@@otsokarhu9695 5 min CD? Wtf seriously?

In DOTA not all magic heroes are supports. There's Storm spirit, Invoker, Tinker, void spirit, etc that scale well into the late game

Very nice video, a lot of interesting insight! Excellent music too.

I'm sooooo glad someone finally talked about stats. Every time someone complains about balancing issues in League, I just tell them it's a problem of poor core stat design, and most can't comprehend what the frick I'm talking about. Ok, you actually covered literally every point of why Dota is much more grateful to balance. Lane compositions, active items, League's broken AP scaling, general game tempo, ttk, objectives. Awesome video.

Some points i'd like to add about magic/spell based carry in dota -divine rapier in dota gives 25% spell amp as of patch 7.35 and as of 7.35d it can be toggled between 25% spell amp or 250 attack damage. -revenant's brooch is an item that turns all your right clicks into magic damage but has a big mana cost per hit. -bristleback and pudge carry exist (existed? not in meta right now). some carries also has good magic damage (gyro, luna, arc warden, slark) but since the scaling is worse, they still build for right clicks. but yeah i do agree that in terms of pure power, magic damage scaling is higher in league than dota.

@aminhastam6769

19 күн бұрын

Pudge carry still exists Bristle carry has high pickrate on dota2protracker

@alexudumitreu1583

14 күн бұрын

You'll be surprised to know that bristle back does only physical damage hahahahha

@kiplibinkecle

14 күн бұрын

@@alexudumitreu1583 it is still "spell" based and even if the argument is "he still right clicks", he still wants to spam the spell to gain damage stacks from his ult. also, his quill stack damage is still boosted by kaya and its variants, rapier spell amp, and neutral items that boost spell damage.

If you ignore Revenant's Broach, I think the only real magic damage pos 1 left in Dota is Arc Warden. Most other pos 1 heroes that deal magic damage are better described as mixed damage heroes (Lina, Faceless Void, Juggernaut, Meepo and so on). That said, Revenant's Broach now means that a lot of physical damage carries can shift entirely to magic damage. Means that PA can five shot your 9k HP Centaur, and kill your 2 supports from off screen with the triple dagger. Also, the reason Muerta is played as a supprt is not because she is not good as a core. In Dota, a hero becomes a support if they can do well without items. They become a pos 4 support if they are also good with items. This means that gold is being used more effectively - it goes to the heroes that _really_ need it. It's also why Marci and Dawn are played at pos 4 - they don't need gold to be effective, but they are really good at using gold to get even more effective at using their kit.

nice quality video man, hope it pops off

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Thank you! Hope you do as well in your next game

Nyx can burst a spectre before she gets out of his stun. Mages do have options to scale. It's just that the ways to utilise them are inconvenient. Unless your combo naturaly involves doing an auto attack for the longbow mr shred and being up your enemy's armpit long enough to press a veil, eblade and a dagon.

Hearing "this actually allows for more dynamic composition" and realizing you are talking about league made me do the pikachu face, ngl

Pos1 magic dmg dealers are common in the past, they're not meta right now so we dont see them so often

in Dota, Carry is only the hardest role if you have never played a moba. If you have base knowledge on how the game works then the hardest is probably Mid or position 4 (they have similar roles)

in dota, you can either be a right click carry/pure damage or a magic type carry and there's hero's who can do both like Lina, Zeus, Ember and Void Spirit

The difference is in league your screen gets this gray shade while you watch netflix

great video! as someone who plays both games on and off, i find that being a pos 1 is so much more enjoyable than ADC, mostly because i love the melee carry archetype (my mains are Jugg, Sven, and CK), but also for basically every reason that the roles differ lol

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

You'd be better off in Toplane if that were the case!

@thechozopandash

21 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron funny that: i am actually a top lane main in LoL! primarily Urgot, Gwen, Tryndamere and Jax

@Cricket0021

21 күн бұрын

its also because position 1 carries don't get blown up in one second during mid game/late game

@IonPerseus

21 күн бұрын

​@@Cricket0021so, in LoL is it common thing to die in 1 frame after 20 minutes on ADC? I'm just new to the game and I was playing with my buddies when that happened to me several times, thought my build is bad or I don't have some crucial items to survive

@Cricket0021

21 күн бұрын

@@IonPerseus yeah. there's a champion in league named "rengar" that deletes adc's and squishies in one jump. literally 100 to zero in one jump. its not that your build is bad, there are just characters in LoL that are made to delete squishies in one or two button presses

awesome video ! another thing I noticed is that DotA has often point-click homing CCs while almost everything in League is a skillshot so it's a bit more wary for DotA carries btw, wouldn't you consider Obsidian, Necro, and Tinker as Hard Carries? at least in DotA 1 they were due to their extreme mana (though in the case of Necro it's more on like being tanky, extreme mana, and AoE %health shredding); there's also Kardel

@marsryo6569

21 күн бұрын

I dont think OD and Tinker are the archetypical hard carry. They both really want levels fast, and so they go mid. OD also doesn't really farm very fast. Tinker can also really die very fast if he gets jumped on from fog. Necro can be played as a pos 1 though, especially with the more recent aghs change where he just becomes a raidboss.

I'm not super experienced with LoL, but one difference I felt when it comes to laning as a carry is that the absence of denies makes last hitting a trivial thing in league, wave management becomes much more about dodging skillshots and shoving wave, which reduces some of the load from your mind. In a high level dota game, every single last hit in lane is a hard fought battle.

@fadhilyudistira8819

15 күн бұрын

with how cheap each minion are in League, missing up to 3 per wave doesn't make a dent to team's financial performance in a short run and one can makeup the difference by forcing the opposing laner to retreat. In my experience with DotA, though, my fellow laner often scold me whenever I failed at last hitting because my laning style has always been closer to LoL's, even before I become acquainted with the game.

@arvintob

13 күн бұрын

in league, a really mechanically skilled player with counter pick harass you so hard you can't even CS at all, that's what the Lux/Caitlyn reference in the video is, you're so perma pushed even at the tower, so in a sense that's how you deny, the last hit mechanic is more in line with dota's gold mechanic that allows for more comeback options (and helps due to the gold reduction when you die) I've experienced that many times where i was just really skilled gapped and counterpicked that i couldn't play anymore, wave management on the other hand is a bit different, there's a few videos on it mainly freezing lane (by only last hitting in the simplest sense) forcing the enemy hero to overextend, if that guy doesn't have a flash on CD, he's basically a sitting target for a gank for overextending

11:09 blud really called his mid clinkz pos1 with a safelane medusa on the team

Fun Fact: Ogre Magi doesn't gain INT or recieve INT stats on items.

Hey, I remember the time when Lord Miracle was at his peak. When he played Invoker (the spellcaster), he was legit pos1 while his carry (Matum or Notail I'm not sure) was kind of pos2 for the team.

The interesting thing I recently noticed in dota is that since new frontiers patch(I dunno about the previous ones because I didn't play for a very long time and got back to the game right after new frontiers got released) It's also possible for a hero from different position to become a n unstoppable force who will truly carry the game. Obviously not every hero but there are some offlaners and midlaners who outscale even some of the hard carries. For midlane the most noticeable would be OD. He doesn't need to buy dmg or attack modifiers because his dmg output comes completely from his Q. So only stats he has to focus on are attack speed and mana. However 5/6 slotted OD outdamages juggernaut, Anti-mage, Medusa etc. The only carry he cannot outdamage with full build in any matchup is Drow ranger simply because of how absurd amounts of agility Drows ulti provides on top of ignoring armor. Another example would be Tinker who is often called a "pos 1 played on midlane" the idea for this hero is that you start with him on mid, however you need your safelaner to pick a hero who actually has some early game agency and spike on 1/2 items instea dof 3/4 items(like Ursa, juggernaut, Slark etc.) so Tinker can just flash farm entire jungle after laning phase. On offlane I noticed particularly 2 hardest scaling champs which are Slardar and Centaur Warruner. Both of those are icnredibly powerfull when 6 slotted and while they may not deal as much dmg as pos 1 carries do. Their tankiness allow them to become a true unkillable raidboss who just runs wherever he wants, stays on top of whoever he wants and kill them just 2/3 seconds slower then pos 1 would. Slardar(with correct build) can easily get to 5000 HP, about 130 HP regen/sec with about 70% armor while magic resist si provided by BKB while 6 slotted. So he is incredibly tanky, and still smashes everybody with 500 dmg per auto attack further amplified by his enourmus 20 armor reduction. Centaur on the other hand can get to 10 K HP during a teamfight when 6 slotted and with bought shard. And since all of his abilities, except hoof stomp scale with his strenght, he is gonna deal huge chunks of dmg to enemies and burst the down even in late game

The reason melee carries are the norm in dota is because they have better scaling skills and better attribute scaling. Melee carries in contrast to ranged carries gain better strength and agility meaning better hp, armor, atk speed and dmg. They also tend to get better scaling skills such as faceless having a time lock which basicly amplifies all his right click dmg. Drow ranger's ult amplifies her agility when in range but she is too afraid to be in the fight because she is squishier due to having less strength and agility attributes. There are also laning advantages for melees not only the dmg block chance but also quelling blade, you also have items like manta that gives better illusions for melee. I like your video, i feel like 90% of the info is correct i just wanted to be specific on the melee vs ranged topic in dota.

@Acex2ron

20 күн бұрын

This is very well put! Though there are items with different scalings for melee and ranged champions in League, like Eclipse.

There are lots of range carries in DOTA…. Ever since they removed the mini blink on abyssal blade, range carries usually had the best win rates in DOTA ie lina / Medusa meta.

question completely unrelated to the video: what's with the gold border on Faceless Void's healthbar? (at 4:48)

You forgot a certain evil mastermind who took a support hero in DOTA 2, turned it into a hard carry, and laughed all the way to winning TI9.

@Acex2ron

20 күн бұрын

I ‘member, but unfortunately that was a 1-patch thing and they nerfed it out of the game

I think the part when "Mage in dota doesn't scales with items" is a bit misleading. Sure, the damage is fixed to certain amount for most heroes, but items scaling the mages by giving them 'options' other than damages. For examples, silencer's 3rd skill started by being single target, but with item Aghanim Scepters, it makes the skill into aoe+ground target. Another "Mage core" items like bloodstone, octarine core, or RO also scale the mages pretty well (spell lifesteal, cd reduction, and spell amp), but not in 'raw damage' departement. Also also in dota, other pos other than carry can snowball and manfight the other team alone too, y'know? Its just that recovering in dota is quite easy since the map is big and there's creep everywhere Still, your video were informative and fun to hear into. This is but a small addition fron me :)

The *REAL* key difference for carries from League and DotA 2, you will get called racial slurs in Russian in DotA 2

@YayaBunWa

20 күн бұрын

And even if you do your job, your mother’s sexual integrity will be called into question if/whenever somebody else makes a mistake.

You didn't mention how abilities scale which is a HUGE reason why melee carries historically have had such a bad time in LoL. But honestly, in Lol you can have roles other than ADC also carry late game, which doesn't really happen in DOTA without large skill difference.

"dota mages don't scale" that's really not the case anymore. there are now SO MANY decent spell dmg dealers that are among the strongest late game heroes in dota. i would even go as far and say it got switched. if you look at dotabuff heroes with longest match duration you find SK, AA, ES, Techies etc. TB, Naga etc. are now early game heroes that want to flash farm and finish fast, while a 6 slotted Enigma can solo kill anyone.

@hendysetiawan5508

21 күн бұрын

Correct. Even lion if being let to scale. He can finger 5 man to half HP, probably also one shot 2 of their supports. Skywrath, OD, even Zeus is super strong with late game items.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

You know what, after playing a 65 minute game against SK and his cancerous Aghs the other day? I can’t say you’re wrong! Their damage doesn’t scale the same way PA’s or Void’s does, but they are nasty once enemy BKBs are down to 6 seconds. They’re still not gonna be played as 1 tho simply because they don’t right click towers as easily. But then, like anything in Dota, you can draft around them and get tower damage elsewhere.

@wumi2419

21 күн бұрын

It's an interesting dynamic. Carries usually have some way of speeding up their farm, which allows them to get their 6 slots faster. But if everyone has 6 slots, carries aren't that much stronger. Techies is just cancer most of the time though. Citing Baumi, "1 vs 9, techies vs fun".

patience, that is the difference between carry in dota and lol. I've noticed that carries in lol tend to get more impatient the minute it hit a 30mins mark, dota on the other hand 30 minutes is just the start of mid to late game depends on your hero. If you are picking a morph for example, it is very crucial for you to be patient because it'll take you to have 3 to 4 items to feel that you are playing a carry

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Even some Dota players can get impatient! I've had my fair share of Voids trying to be the hero and landing a 3-man chrono only to have no followup lmao (tho admittedly, that Void is sometimes me)

The main difference is, in League my 6 items Zeri can go from 100 - 0 in .05 seconds if i mistep A PIXEL. No matter how fed i am. In Dota my 6 items muerta has counter play options to deal with the bullshit the enemy is trying to throw at me.

I would say most of it is the turn speed. Items and tankiness have an impact. But the ability to be to do damage while experiencing near 0 movement loss is so strong as a mechanic that in a different game called Starcraft, it's essentially the sole reason why Terran is viable.

please make a in depth video about the importance of turn rate and animation cancelling in dota

It's been a while since I last played Dota2 (6 years?), but isnt magic damage scales with int now? While not necessarily right clickers, there are many magic carry like Leschrac, Tinker, Invoker, Pudge (str hero as spellcaster carry), etc.

EE caught a stray bullet lmao

You should have a video about "Tanks" in DOTA and League.

Also, thanks to Attributes and the skill tree where you can either pick a support trait or a damage trait in Dota, any hero can become a hard carry!

That str agi intel system bring some durability onto the table for pos1.

nice video, i have a question for who plays both games, is it much easier to discern champs and minions in lol than in dota or it is just me who never played dota?

@32Singder

21 күн бұрын

probably second, you'll probably get it after 5 mins they have different health bars

@Chasodey

21 күн бұрын

Well, it all comes to amount of time you poured into a game. As non League player I can have a rough time distinguishing chars while with 5k hours in Dota I can see every minute detail of every hero. But I would say there are much less sets and cosmetics in Dota which will completely turn your hero into something ridiculuos and hardly distinguishable without knowing imo.

@savekla

21 күн бұрын

@@Chasodey True. When I started playing league after dota, it was often hard to discern characters with skins. Especially since there are so many characters that look kinda same. I saw a dude with a sword and because of cosmetics I couldn't tell if it's wiego, garen, yasuo, yi, or perhaps even aatrox. And when it came to the "female support spellcaster" characters, with cosmetics they were almost indistinguishable for me as a new player. At least Dota's cosmetics dont change characters color palette that much (usually).

@ponjun3970

21 күн бұрын

in the past? yeah it's easier to discern in Lol than in Dota( well dota 1 specifically). Because Dota 1 has a hero/character asset which has the same character asset as the creep/minion, which is Na'ix/Lifestealer. Many got baited into thinking it was just a creep.

In reeg, top, jungle, mid and adc are all capable of being the team's main DPS and wincon. The ADC just feels like one of the gang. If you're a carry player in dodka and want to carry in league, you could pick any role bar sup.

You've forgotten to mention brooch that gave magic right click damage. Unfortunately it was nerfed in 7.35d

Honestly leagues pos 1 is the mid laner and not the ADC. There is a reason that Faker is the GOAT.

The fact that you can play like shit and still make a detailed video about adc just proves how OP the ability to speak is!

How long that passive damage reduction was on melee heroes? It has been a long time since I last played dota2 (more than 4 years).I know there was a shield you can buy for passive damage reduction but as passive I never knew that.

@momochiyoda2960

16 күн бұрын

in the patch that they remove that shield. they added the shield effect as an innate ability to all melee heroes.

@quatron9561

16 күн бұрын

@@momochiyoda2960 Ah I see, thanks for explaning.

first? Anyway, i really enjoy these videos as a league player! Never really got into dota, have tried it but found it way too difficult. I find it really interesting seeing these comparison videos where its not just constant shitting on the other game for absolutely no reason

My friend, ranged carries are much more. widespread than you think. Here is list of the ranged-carry heroes that could be witnessed in a pro scene: Lina (physical) , Zeus (physical), Muerta, Troll, Shadowfiend, Templar Assassin, Luna, Razor, Arc Warden, Leshrac, Morphling, Weaver, Medusa. And this is not even a full list.

@imfinishedgrinding638

21 күн бұрын

Extremely varied too. None of these guys play any similar to one another. Sadly the only ranged carry I can play competently is Gyrocopter.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

Oh for sure! I got the most popular heroes played primarily as Pos 1 over Dota 2's lifespan on Dotabuff, and that's where I got the info. I'm just hesitant to put a few of those as ranged "carries" since Arc Warden is played mid, Razor is played offlane, etc. Also idk whether to classify Troll as a ranged carry since he's in melee form like 80% of the time

@IonPerseus

21 күн бұрын

Ranged troll is a joke, and lesh just doesn't rely on his attack damage, he is eager to get as close as he can to maximize his W and R dmg

@Dokurider

16 күн бұрын

The point he's trying to make is melee carries are nonexistent in LoL compared to Dota

@arvintob

13 күн бұрын

@@Dokurider melee carries exist in Lol, they're called fighters, they're generally in the Top Lane solo (sometimes played in mid and at one point in lieue of the ranged carry), in general top lane is mostly for Tanks/Fighters/Bruisers and certain niche ranged scaling carries like Kayle, there's also niche ranged carries to counter but they're generally have to have a decent team composition and teamwork to pull off

Great video, thanks for the effort and comparison! I want to give some feedback for 12:25. Magic damage is king in lategame dota. When bkb's are running low lategame magic damage becomes very important. For most heroes magic resistance is not as high as armor is. This is why Reventant's Brooch was created for physical damage heroes to use this fact lategame (look at Mars double rapier rev brooch build). Pos 2's like Storm and Leshrac and scale extremely well into lategame and there are a plethora of items that boosts their archetype to punch at the level of traditional right click carries. In conclusion, saying Dota's design philosophy for magic damage is that it falls of late game is a very outdated concept and items released in recent patches allude to this fact.

@Acex2ron

15 күн бұрын

You know this is a very well thought out comment and I can't disagree. My take on this is that lategame, carries are still at the top, but it's just we've started seeing the emergence of the ultra late game phase as well in the past few years. 55+ minute thrillers, your team's starting to stack neutrals for Tier 5s, when your 5 CMs are starting to get BKB-Aghs and solo win teamfights. I would even say that in this iteration of the game, the power of magic damage is like some sort of reverse bell curve, where it goes down towards the midgame when people start to buy Glimmers, Pipe, BKB, and Shroud, but then it goes back up once the Glimmers get sold and the Aghs get bought. SK Aghs is the main offender. Sieging high ground in the lategame against a Sniper or Drow + SK with Aghs Bloodstone is probably one of the hardest things to do in Dota. I mean you might as well give em back Shrines with how hard it is to go HG and the insane rubberband comeback gold doesn't help. Also, since you mention it Revenant's Brooch is a horribly designed item. You spend a whole game itemizing against a physical damage carry, and then they buy Brooch and laugh at the 10k+ gold you've spent on armor items? I guess you could say the same with Nullifier, but even then it's a gimmicky item to use. Hopefully IceFrog can go back to the drawing board with this one. Thanks so much for the feedback, and the insightful comment!

@EdeYOlorDSZs

11 күн бұрын

@@Acex2ron Thanks for the quick response! Have a great day

Your carry can't deal damage if you don't stay alive long enough to do any. I took offense to that - karthus That's it I'm inting but I was always going to do that - sion

Where there is Star Rail music, there is a comment about it. It's the law, and I will abide by it. (Great work as usual btw)

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

I also threw in a Genshin track in there for a bit of variety

In the department of laning stage you didnt mention denys and creep aggro

Btw pos 1 Leshrac has almost always been a thing. Gyro pos 1 is also entirely magic damage early on.

@Acex2ron

21 күн бұрын

I see Leshrac and I build Mage Slayer and suddenly his spells hit like a wet noodle, but good points though. Gyro just turns into a one-man teamfight late game dealing magic and physical damage!

I do think you're forgetting about quite a few ranged hard carries in dota such as luna, TA, Medusa, and gyro

Other hero: They're playing under tower, we gotta respect that and avoid diving lvl 1 undying: Is this some kind of peasant joke that I'm too tank to understand?

Magic carries aren't that meta in dota because at the end of the day physical damage is the only damage type that determimes on how slow or fast you destroy enemy buildings. I know that might sound weird as it is the same in LOL. but dota heroes can buy back. And often if even one enemy core bought back it will lead your team that is not careful to over commit then die or straight up just lose the game.

Dota has a ton of items to scale with magic damage, and Magic damage heroes are more likely to be the ones who've dealth the most damage to the enemy by the end of a match. Zeus, Lina, Timber, Veno, QoP, Necrophos, Leshrak or even supports like Jakiro or Techies are often the ones who has the highest "damage dealt" on the end match stat screen. Kaya gives raw magic amp, but Veil gives spell damage taken debuff, Eblade gives you temporary -40% resistance, Aghs often opens new avenues to deal damage (Qop, Necrophos), Parasma puts another -25% magic resistance, Octarine reduces cooldowns to spam spells more often and Refresher allows to double up your combo in a lategame fight to deal tremendous damage. With all of that plus mandatory 1-2 defensive slots every hero needs regardless of position (for casters it's usually Windwaker and Linkens/BkB) you easily fill up your full inventory. Not to mention that Rapier now has Spell Amp mode. Carry is always a righclick core because you need to quickly take objectives while the enemy team is dead - that is the most reliable win condition. In those drafts where you have structure damage from pos 2 (Tiny, Lesh) or pos3 (zoo heroes) you sometimes see Necrophos or like Doom emerge as Pos 1 (but that's rare). Also that is the same reason why heroes like Riki never stick as a pos1 outside of low(ish) end pubs, because they take forever to kill the base.

Uhhh I couldn't help but notice are you using Star rail penacony battle theme music as background? DAMN NICE TOUCh

9:55 isnt it every 4 min after first drake ?

muerta was played as support only at debut. after the tweaks, she's played as pos 1

11:59 mfer forgot about shotgun morphling back when EBlade was an agi item. Also, there's about enough mid or offlaners that can snowball on their own enough to carry, see your usual ember spirits, tinkers, bristlebacks, legion commanders and so forth, who get a 2-0 or 3-0 advantage in their lanes and then win the game for you.

ADC right now doesnt have an identity. Their role is supposed to be the constant damage dealer that counters tank. ADC counters tank since they can wither them down Tank/bruiser counters mage/assassin because tanks can survive their burst and smack them or heal up before their cooldown comes back up. Mage/assassin counters ADC with their instant burst of damage and blow them up. But why every role for some reason one shots the adc and dish out the same damage as they do, even the tanks League right now has a damage issue. Where even the tanks gets deleted in 2 secs or tanks deleting anyone. Riot will be buffing crit items maybe they can now go build 2 defensive items without hurting their damage output

@pvshka

16 сағат бұрын

Nah. League has fundamental design problems. Adcs will never be able to viably build defensive options.

Up until i quit league, as a support i had felt over the years that the tower was becoming more and more of a big stone pillar giving you a false sense of security than an actual , you know, deterrent for the enemies

@MangaGamify

4 күн бұрын

It's a long story, long story short; it's because of esports; half the time of the entire game would be hugging towers waiting for someone to make a mistake if not dive aka no action just pure hugging, so it looks boring to sponsors if not investors. It's also the reason why they introduced drakes, so they have to come out and contest it, thus some esport "action" . It is now today so anytime there's a 3 > 2 advantage they dive.

I wish Melee carries were in League so badly. They are so fun in Dota and I wanna play something like Yi or Trynd bot lane for a change.

I think any core in dota can be carry too there are "midlane carry" heroes such as TA and sniper , you also have offlane carry heroes like razor and huskar.

@VinniePaul91

21 күн бұрын

Yep, especially snowball carries that need a good early game actually cant function from the safelane. Lesh, QoP, Storm, and recently even Puck can all end up hard carrying a game but only out of the midlane because they need the head start on levels.

@VinniePaul91

21 күн бұрын

*QoP really only up until last year she sucks now her stat gain advantage is less relevant and it's become easier to weather her insanely strong orchid and bkb timings with the larger map

BKB is one of the reasons Mages suffer as a damage dealers.

15:14 did you say "Hyper-carry like Bane or Spectre.."?

@lolbajset

19 күн бұрын

vayne or spectre

I wish league itemization wasn't made for literal toddlers, and still nothing you buy saves you from getting oneshot by the enemy assassin who just flashes and uses 6 dashes to touch you once into you just evaporating into thin air

@cynt4416

17 күн бұрын

Assassin is the weakest class that get completely countered by one spell call exhausted. Or a decent team with reliable frontline and good support.

I swear, I had this playing in the background and I was dead confused why HSR music was playing.

One important difference in LoL is not in how the carries function but in how they lane and how the game plays out. Dota has the safe/suicide lane dynamic. The late game carries often don't lane against each other. But in LoL lanes are symmetrical. The two carries always lane against each other. Which means that, unless you have a chill even lane where the teams both go 0/0/0, one of the two late game carries is going to win lane and come online earlier than they normally would and one is going to be pushed even further behind and never reach the point in the game they're actually capable of doing anything. Having the two carries lane against each other means a lot of the time one is going to win and one is going to lose lane and it will warp the midgame.

You missed the Dota SEA Meta where everyone is a carry, no one plays support and buys wards. If someone picks support they also just buy carry items, and every game goes 40+ minutes

When it comes to item scaling, dota also incorporates alot of defense in their carry build, butterfly with evasion, falcon with hp, bkb etc, Making carries way tankier than league adc where they buy an item with DAMAGE, crit (Rng damage), attack speed (faster damage) and a passive that deals MORE DAMAGE.

@Lastofhiskind_

21 күн бұрын

I really like how dota manages to give every hero tank and dmg items in 6 slots. Meanwhile league champs are just dmg item heroes. No defense for them. Weaklings.

@cynt4416

19 күн бұрын

@@Lastofhiskind_ That's what I hate. They don't have a defined role in combat. They are both tanker and damage dealer when fed, making it a much more one side battle for the winning side, while also making other role feel worthless since it's would reach a point where the match is decided by 2 carry duking out with each other.

@Lastofhiskind_

19 күн бұрын

@@cynt4416 every hero can be tanky and dmg dealers at the same time making the game intense. I don't understand why league cucks cry so much about how differently dota works. Grow up and touch grass.

i htink the recent esl birmingham, with carry luna, gyro. weaver show at least in comp, its not only melee at all .