I tend to think that instead of a door slam, it is a gradual closing of a door. However, the finality of the door finally closing is what catches people off guard. Because INFJs do a lot of their processing internally, I think that many aren't actually able to see the process of the door closing slowly, just the final "slamming" result.

@jerbear7719

3 жыл бұрын

That is a PERFECT description!

@mcdee56

3 жыл бұрын

Well said!

@beingintrinsic

3 жыл бұрын

EXCELLENT description. I can relate to this entirely.

@tracik1277

3 жыл бұрын

@Kayden Markus Excuse me, but why would you do that?

@Wa_Kanuna

3 жыл бұрын

It's a slam because the other person doesn't see it coming

The INFJ SLAM A.K.A. "you gave me no choice after the 14th 2nd chance" ...I see you're a man of culture as well lol

@berkaytugrel9084

3 жыл бұрын

turk?

@aquariusstar7248

3 жыл бұрын

😂😂😂

@valliestarfire9596

3 жыл бұрын

Lolz.

@michaeldanao6326

3 жыл бұрын

" DOOR SLAM " , Self preservation , not wasting time , a simple yes or no , no in-between , understanding , acceptance , ...

@thoughttank5107

3 жыл бұрын

🤣🤣 thats the real explanation there!!

An INFJs door slam is a gut-wrenchingly final straw. It propells us into another universe for awhile, just to recover from that relationship.

@tyyneviljakainen5108

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly. This is how I cut off my ex BFF. No more back stabbings. I always felt when I walked out of the room that she was insulting me - and I finally had a prove. Last what I said to her is : If next life exists hope we don't meet. My mother said once...I never liked her why she is your friend?( I said to her didn't find any better yet) my mom was right about her as my gut...she was basically insult me for 20 years and called me at 4.00 am to complain about her problems...quite 2 faces bi..ch she was. For me when I slam the door I pass them by in a shop like they were strangers. As they really are.

@ABFPV584

2 жыл бұрын

I literally slammed the door and quit my job today, and you are correct. I feel wild haha

@michelacherchi

2 жыл бұрын

And even after "healing" sometimes still hurt when I think about it though... reheating a soup, I learned is no good, now... don't doing it that anymore in this life time

i sometimes think us trying so hard in relationships gives people this false sense of security that we will always be there no matter how they behave, which both causes them to feel comfortable treating us badly if they are so inclined, and makes us eventually cutting them out of our lives all the more jarring.

@cindybills677

3 жыл бұрын

That's exactly what happened to me.

@ClayArnall

3 жыл бұрын

that's a good way to say it

@isobeltotten4402

3 жыл бұрын

@Waleed Mohamed it's more of reaching a no-win scenario for me, where continuing the relationship only means us both getting hurt and the only path forward is out, but i get what you mean, sometimes you just look at someone and you're like, yep, downhill from here, though to be honest i don't at this point trust myself to make these kinds of decisions just on that

@tyyneviljakainen5108

3 жыл бұрын

and I think most people see us as dumb/ clingy because we care and forgive them all over again. Being kind is not same as being dump/ naive. And I did finally find a friend who actually I can call a friend

@JR6191947

2 жыл бұрын

True

And there it is: a healthy INFJ would avoid an unhealthy relationship from the get-go. That one lesson took me the better part of 30 + years to internalize. Today I am aware of those red flags and take them seriously.

@louisejoel

3 жыл бұрын

It can take that long to identify what healthy is

@jaclynwright9684

3 жыл бұрын

@@louisejoel It has definitely taken me that long. :'(

@carol5606

3 жыл бұрын

Oh boy. Isn't that the truth! I think - also - when we are older, we've made greater peace with going it alone. So it's not as difficult to recognize and receive the red flags as portents of trouble. But yes - it took a life time.

@kristianjensen5877

3 жыл бұрын

Yep, it takes time to get the "formula" right when it comes to other people, but when we do, it's quite liberating with no need to slam the door, because it was never really opened fully up in the first place. First thing to learn is "the law of equivalent exchange" so to speak - once we start noticing whether people reciprocate our efforts or not and notice red flags, it becomes much easier to manage which relationships to invest into and which to just let die on the vine and never develop into anything significant.

@carol5606

3 жыл бұрын

Kristian Jensen Well said. I've learned to slide angularly out. Sometimes that's not possible, but most people don't even notice.

Thank you!❤️"it doesn't feel like a decision" "to everyone around it seems rushed and impulsive but to the INFJ its literally been 8 years in the making"

I am guilty of the door slam. I have had several people tell me they were shocked at my ability to "flip a switch." But It's absolutely an intuition thing.

For me the door slam would come after so much time and trying. It happened a few times but when it did, it’s like the Decision was out of my hand. I am not angry but accepting that the relationship has come to an end and not one more minute can be invested. So a door slam to me is completely letting go of someone in an instant as a form of protection with a final mental result that that person is not right for me.

@infpbubble7549

3 жыл бұрын

I completely agree! I'm an INFP but I haver certainly done the 'INFJ door slam' myself when someone in my life has gone too far and shown they are not a nice person to be in my life. I think because I come across as soft, people think I will put up with it and when I don't they are quite surprised and confused

@DrArleezahMarrah

3 жыл бұрын

❤️

I agree that most people we run into havent worked on their emotional intelligence. Something I've also noticed is being self-aware and emotionally intelligent sometimes repels people too. Having a personal growth mindset can be intimidating or uninteresting to some people.

@isla4953

3 жыл бұрын

So agree with that

@keineangst93

3 жыл бұрын

I know right!?!

@stevepeterson5943

3 жыл бұрын

Yep, good points. My mentor observes most relationships as being "wide" but not "deep."

@sonnenschein553

3 ай бұрын

This

I know the feeling you are talking about.. the door slamming not being voluntary. It is almost as if something just clicks in your head. You don’t want to give up, you’ve tried everything, for far too long, but there comes a moment, kind of like the last piece of a puzzle falling into place and it simply clicks. You see the whole picture for what it is, you see that there is no point anymore. Its a kind of an acceptance.. and you just let go. I remember when I broke up with my ex years ago. I remember the feeling as clear as day. We were arguing in the car (not yelling or anything but arguing over the same things as we always did).. and he said something to me which was like a last drop that overflows the glass.. and all of a sudden, a moment of clarity. His voice faded away as he continued to talk and I slipped into the inner world where this process was taking place. A sudden, very clear, very final realization that there was nothing more I could possibly do or say that will change the situation. I remember it was raining, I zeroed in on the drops on the window as I sat there and peacefully accepted this realization. A realization that once I walked out of that car, I wouldn’t look back. For me it was our final ride together, for him, what was to come would be out of nowhere. He dropped me off, I walked out and didn’t look back. That’s was it. I didn’t plan it, I didn’t want it.. but I’m grateful for it.

@MA-vf2ir

3 жыл бұрын

YES, Yes, yes! Exactly how this happens. I can relate to this soooo much. This is exactly it

@ejaws1720

3 жыл бұрын

Hi fellow INFJ's- I'm 79 yo now and a nice guy "codependent" people pleaser who has been loyally hanging on to a woman more than 30 years younger & finally feel a bit liberated from the struggle involved not so much in keeping the love alive (that never dies) but I'm intuitively resigned to accepting its better to stop putting my energy into something that won't well at best after 11 year effort- know when to fold & let it go bulldog.

@carol5606

3 жыл бұрын

Love - You described that so well. I was there with you. And the rain too. So reflective of the truth. That moment of clarity catapults you into another reality in spite of yourself. And it's an isolating moment. Like taking a breath after you've been holding it for so long and you come to your senses and you realize that you can breathe again. So with the catapult, once you've landed, it is good. And you go on. And the pieces resolve themselves - more quickly than not - because the internal landscape has changed and it's just a matter now of realigning it all to where the axis of the gyroscope is now pointing. Let me add this to end my comment. For me, I was always responding to an inner leading. I didn't recognize what that was or where I was even headed, but I knew it was there. And now that I do know, I can say without hesitation - these reckoning moments are good. There is a higher destiny at play. May we each find it.

@love1111

3 жыл бұрын

@@carol5606 Carol, that was beautiful! You have articulated the feeling way better than I could. I have always had trouble communicating my inner world to others, but word for word, you spoke to my soul and I felt understood. Thank you for that, really! 🙏🏻

@carol5606

3 жыл бұрын

Love Thanks Love..... We walk on. 🙂

When I have cut somebody out of my life it becomes a full removal and I have no more contact with them. and I think that is what people pick up on is the door slam is that once we've decided that we have done all we can the other person is not doing what is needed on their end for the relationship to continue we just walk away clean. This is because we are not feeling the need to be in a relationship in this desperate drive that we have to be there so much so that we're willing to put up with any bad behavior on the other person's part because we are so desperate to be with them. INFJs are not desperate to be with somebody we want to be with somebody. now this includes friendships as well I would rather be completely alone with no friends at all than to be with people who are verbally emotionally abusive to me. I also don't want somebody and even a friendship that has no ability to understand that I need alone time. So for relationship just doesn't work for me I don't see a reason to remain in it and I don't see a reason to keep the door open because I'm not desperate to have that person in my life. INFJs are social friendly loving caring people. But we are not desperate.

@lowkee777

3 жыл бұрын

Exactly 💯...I couldn't agree more

@elisa48092

3 жыл бұрын

true true

@suesteig3025

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you, agree 100%

An INFJ don’t want gossip, backbiting or talking about others, it’s considered low and disgusting by a INFJ. Progress is key, when our progress is being mocked and diminished it’s clearly the relationship (friendship, family, work or partnership) won’t work. I really love how you explain this, thanks 🙏🏼

To me this feels like something died. I may watch a relationship deteriorate for a while but if there's any life left I'll keep trying. Then there's a point where it's really dead and nothing more can be done. You just know it.

@NoInsurance

2 жыл бұрын

Did it today. To me if felt like I had to kill the situation that was killing me, mercilessly.

@JaymePaladino

2 жыл бұрын

@@NoInsurance You had to. You knew that. It gets to that point where the boundary has finally been crossed and your integrity is at stake. It's not that it doesn't hurt. Hurts like hell. But it's grief. Not heartbreak. I congratulate your courage. Poetic, man. I love the way you wrote that.

I try not to 'doorslam' in an intense way anymore, I just stop investing in the friendship or relationship slowly and then it naturally disappears over time. When I was younger I would do it in a more dramatic way and yeah, other people would be kind of shocked, especially in regards to romantic ones. I just think that to an INFJ it almost feels like a personal failure if a relationship does not work out or works out in a good way and therefore, when we come to the point where we realize it's not working, all of a sudden all the investment we made feels like a waste of time and energy and when we feel energized (after the doorslam) again then we would rather not spend more energy on that person at all - if that makes sense?

@algrabit1116

3 жыл бұрын

The sunken cost!

@kendallwright7222

3 жыл бұрын

Makes perfect sense. I fully relate.

@infjnomad

3 жыл бұрын

so much sense!

@louisejoel

3 жыл бұрын

My door slam is more like a revolving door but people don't see that so it remains closed

@sunset9729

3 жыл бұрын

Same I just withdraw. I put into it what I get out of it. Usually fizzle out until she leaves.

in some general friendship scenarios I've door slammed a couple of times and they keep thinking it's a matter of forgiveness and that I can't be with them because i can't forgive but it's not about forgiveness , I don't even think of it like that, it's just that I cant have you in my life anymore, i just cant handle you and when i tell them this somewhat inderiectly it just doesnt register that i can forgive but not let them back in

I think the people in the groups are saying they "door-slammed" someone for a reason, when they should be saying they "noped out" of the situation. The door slam you describe sounds like a final recognition of the fact that the relationship is over. You said realization. Your point is that it wasn't a conscious decision, but an intuitive knowing. That sounds right.

@anthonymancini3372

3 жыл бұрын

Yes, the door slam happens when the relationship/friendship gets to the point that it just doesn’t make sense anymore. Whether it’s when the INFJ realizes that he/she has been messed with by a narcissist (and possibly his/her enablers), a manipulator, or even by a group of people that consciously excludes him/her from social activities, he/she will use the door slam if all efforts that have been made to remedy the situation have failed. The door slam is not done as a means of revenge or punishment but rather as a means of self preservation in order to maintain good mental health.

Hello, Clay. Great analogies. I pushed away from the dinner table, and walked away, at 21 years of marriage. No one understood, I’d known, we could not make it to the rocking chairs,... at least, 8 years, before. For me,..I kept trying to “explore” the thinking process of my spouse,... and constantly received, disgust, frustration, and outright angry irritation, for my need to connect and understand. Cable snapped. No more sand through the fingers. Done. Self preservation, kicked in. Door slam, seems like a good description. INFJ... and Narcissist. So common. So doomed.. Thanks for the clarity.

@SpraggieEdits

3 жыл бұрын

beautiful comment, hope you can find someone who understands every fiber of your being

@sayusayme7729

Жыл бұрын

🦋

Unhealthy Infj’s have a hard time defending themselves. They’ll door slam when they are humiliated, used, betrayed instead of telling the perpetrator. I don’t have a hard time telling it like it is with my husband and best friend, but others that I don’t have that deep of a relationship with I’d rather just leave their lives. Setting up boundaries and not being such a people pleaser has helped me retain more friends and get less hurt by the little things I pick up on that most ppl don’t even notice. Being an infj gets much easier the older you get. Also learning to mirror peoples behaviour and not fixing everyone and everything all the time helps. I value my time and wisdom and don’t give it away so willingly and freely anymore. I listen to friends problems and tell them I hope it gets better for you 😂😂 I’ve really saved myself with this new outlook on life. Sometimes I feel guilty but that usually comes from religion and this martyr mentality. Besides, people hardly take advice, they need experiences that change them, words don’t work.

This is an incredible breakdown and so true. The last time I doorslammed someone was last year. I had been dating this guy and I thought things were going well. And then he started to breadcrumb me, messaged me less, etc. I was really upset because I had put myself out there and had come out of my shell. The moment I felt I could relax he pulled away. I became unsettled and I wanted out. There is absolutely no reason to me to give my time, attention and feminine energy to someone not interested so I pulled the plug and sent a short, cold text message informing him he would not be wasting my time. I'm sure it caught him off guard, but I felt like that was the only way to maintain my dignity. It felt good at first but I nursed my wounds privately and it took me a long time to get over the disappointment. While it may be emotionally immature, I still think it's better to leave an unpleasant situation early rather than to linger and hope that the person will come to their senses. Now I know this act of swift termination is called the INFJ door slam 😊

@mqh2411

2 жыл бұрын

They won't come to their senses. Because their very own senses told them to make bad choices.

“Would a 100% healthy INFJ need to door slam people?” We’re never 100% truly healthy. We’re just good enough to get by.

I believe a healthy infj can "micro doorslam" If they sense a relationship is not heading into the right direction (meaning they know their boundaries more clearly) and use their third slot Ti in a way an intj would use their Te (as second slot) and not care too much about hurting peoples feelings but still respectfully address boundaries that are being crossed, this in return building respect and creating healthier relationships and ending bad relationships early on.

@instar9737

3 жыл бұрын

Sometimes you need to be a bit selfish to actually do more good in a relationship. High Fe users throw you with a lot of Fe to satisfy their Ti which makes them unconsciously selfish; it is good to be aware of this. I hope this makes sense, just a thought I had :)

@sayusayme7729

Жыл бұрын

Ty

An analogy of the doorslam that I had used to explain to an acquaintance before I ever knew about this topic was this: Since I'm a very perceptive person I picked up every tick of his. Whenever I noticed one of these, it'd be like a drop of water falling into a bucket that's teterring off a ledge. No matter how big or small the ticks were, they'd add a drop into the bucket. Once the last drop falls and tips over the bucket, that's it.

A nice Example would be: Trying to start a car (turning the key) again and again but the engine refusing to start and stays stiff. You try and try until the battery dies; with no hope left (you even leave the useless key) you will walk alone and not look back. Thanks for your time!

I don't usually comment on your videos even though I watched quite a few of them over the past months. But I feel I need to express how important this is. This video really helped me understand myself, a few of my behaviors and why so many of my relationships don't work. You're describing what I went through with a few friends, my mother and my ex (we stayed together for 9 years and I feel I spent 6 of them draining myself trying to reach out and fix things). For each of these relationships, I went crazy - obsessing really - clinging to hope and trying to fix things until I just couldn't anymore and it became obvious it was useless. I also agree on the fact an healthy INFJ wouldn't find themselves in relationships like that to begin with or would just "detach" themselves and wouldn't expect so much. Anyway, thank you for this and for opening so much. Might sound a bit dumb but you make a difference in the world.

@ClayArnall

3 жыл бұрын

thanks for the comment :)

@sandwitch5185

3 жыл бұрын

@Cherry Muse you are so right, it might actually be the reason why I started doing this to begin with

Things I love about you INFJ’s: You give great advide, and are able to guide me to the right direction when I feel lost in life. You are true empaths and such wise people. You are easygoing yet deep. You are so inspiring and motivated people and you never seem to give up on anything. You are such great people, thank you for existing

@carol-ri4ms

3 жыл бұрын

Awwww so shweet of you. I need the INFP’s in my life to help me with my creativity and fun and feeling understood. Cheers! 😘

This describes me exactly. Literally, I try, try, and try for far longer than everyone else would. Everyone else could be Tellin me to give up on this person-even the person themselves-anh I still won't give up. Only after the person pushes me away or all my options are exhausted will I finally door slam. In answer to your question, though, I don't think any INFJs can ever avoid the door slam. Primarily, it's because people change and have different ways of coping with life stressors which cause tension in relationships. For example, you could meet someone who's totally warm and open at first. Then, as life begins to happen-family deaths, illnesses, and other traumas-the other person begins to shut down in response to the pain. The INFJ will literally go into that relationship repair mode until the other person pushes them away one too many times. Once the door's been slammed,though, it'll take monumental effort on the other person's part to open the INFJ back up. That's me, anyway.

@ClayArnall

3 жыл бұрын

good points.

One of the most accurate explanation of door slam I ever listened to👍

Great video Clay. It took me time as well but i think most healthy INFJs overtime realize that they are ruled by their Ni and it is almost impossible to go against it once the decision has been made. Personally, it almost feels like im suffocating if i try to go against it because of that deep feeling of Knowing that is final. And i think it is so strong and final because Ni takes time and patterns to come to that level of understanding. The time that we try to make things work, it is working subconsciously registering everything that is happening and connecting them that when we are done , we are really done and there is a sense of peace knowing we gave what we could to make things work and can step away now. I also think INFJs when in their early twenties or younger are very idealistic in relationships, thinking they can fix everything and ignoring their intuition , i think its something like an Fe overdrive , but as they get older and their logic function starts to balance their Fe they become more realistic and self preserving , which is more healthier in my view. Thank you for posting as always. You voice everything i've always known somehow in perfect words every time and i feel understood.

@presentlybikepacking2535

3 жыл бұрын

Well said

@carol5606

3 жыл бұрын

Very true about the change as we mature. And that is liberating too. To accept the truth.

I was in your last scenario. Codependent , very young with a bold leader narcissist. I had to discover it over time . Overlooking that he was enjoying controlling and torturing me. Yes our silly door slam is usually after years of your kind behavior, not realizing they are enjoying your caring and any misery they can give you. Older sibling same thing. Parent same. I had to decide I was more valuable than taking this stuff.

@mercedesharrison5550

10 ай бұрын

I door slammed my older sibling and parent as well. It was over ten years of understanding and trying to work it out until I realized it’s no use.

My childhood best friend is an ESTJ. I've known her for almost my entire life, 30 years. It took me years to even recognize that I was in an unhealthy and toxic friendship with her. Multiple times I had tried to cut her out, but she was and still is a very persistent person. Finally, last year I decided to set a healthy mindset and expectations of what that relationship is and ever will be. I have stopped trying to fix or mend that relationship. I have in some sort of way door slammed her in my mind, if that makes any sense? I don't try to connect deeply or really on any level with her. I don't invest much into her problems that she comes to me with. I don't involve her in any way with things that happen in my life. I almost just see her as the parent of my kid's friends. Meanwhile, I think she still believes us to be great friends while in my mind we are more of acquaintances, people who used to know each other. It was as you had said a realization that this friendship can never be a healthy one and there was nothing left there for me to fix.

@ClayArnall

3 жыл бұрын

yes I think that is the exact problem. By my ESTJ's definition, the definition of relationship is much simpler than mine. I hesitate to make generalizations about all ESTJs, but I suspect that me pulling back and being 'more shallow', is her idea of us having a great relationship. On the flip side, me being myself and trying to go deep is extremely overwhelming to her. I don't know how to solve that problem.

@AnnieTyzak

15 күн бұрын

ESTJ 😂😂😂😂😂 WUT

The minute 1:10 is so real, if I don't have a really deep level of emotional intimacy is hard for me to take relationships serious

This described my marriage to the T....I left after 16 years and quit my job simultaneously. People thought I was having a mental health breakdown. Thank you for expressing exactly what happened in my situation.

I have 1 or 2 good friends. A bestie. No! I dont even share deeply with them.

In my opinion and experience, INFJs aren't built for relationships even though we desire the deepest connection only a relationship can offer. Like dreaming to be in the NBL but being shorter than average height. I've never been married, not even close. Relationships are so far out of my reach it hurts. And the cherry on top is when people express their curiosity as to why I'm still single, as if a guy like me should find ease in finding someone, when it's got to the point where I believe it's impossible, defying the Laws of Physics itself.

@stevepeterson5943

3 жыл бұрын

I hear ya barkin big dog. There are some INFJs on KZread with good healthy partners, spouses. Gotta be the right person for sure though.

I think that infj tends to ends up in relationships where they were chosen as opposed to be the choosing ones. Because of this, they’re will end up in a deficit and a slamming door.

I appreciate your sharing of your own experience in this video. I have only door slammed one individual in my lifetime, after a ten year close friendship and like you said, "working" to grow and fix the relationship for about the last five years. Only when I was healed enough emotionally myself and no longer such a people pleaser, was I able to end the relationship and go no contact. I have never regretted my decision. But I needed the help of a professional to do it. It was that hard. I don't believe I will ever need to door slam anyone again. I'm a much healthier INFJ now because I did the emotional work to heal childhood woundedness and no one with any hint of narcissistic or borderline or other controlling tendencies will ever get that close to me again. I can easily avoid deeper relationships with people who set off my radar because I am no longer needy. And I know the signs of a controlling person and stop them with their first attempt. That's usually enough. They'll look elsewhere then for their next target.

Man, I teared up when you gave your analogies... it breaks my heart. No one sees it and they think it’s a choice or something I can reverse... I try to warn them that I’m slowly losing hope since it makes me cry and try to work harder and become more desperate fix everything only to be dismissed. I don’t want to doorslam people I love and care for, but you’re completely right about it’s just like this involuntary realization and just like that the love and care vanishes. Makes me feel heartless, disgusting, and gives the impression that I never cared in the first place which is far from the truth. 😔

Another great KZreadr said it perfectly once: it's not that we slam the door on them, it's that they close the door on us. We try and try and try until there's nothing left and it is only then that we walk away. Then the other person is like "?!?!?" and we're like, "What is it they are confused about?" For us, we've been banging out heads on the wall for a long time while they go on acting how they want and only when they realize we are not there do they have any clue that something has gone wrong. It's really quite remarkable how two people can have such different experiences.

One good friend is better than a thousand aquaintances. We are just fine with that.

I think as an INFJ we forget to maintain a proper boundary and often over deliver too much.... If we start to maintain our boundaries properly and prioritise ourselves a little more, narcissists won't be able to feed on us too much and stay away, and other people will also stop from giving us there whole negetive emotional barden..!

For myself. It’s more like I gently close the door. Hope has gone and realisation replaces optimism!

Clay....sometimes a marriage, long term partner or friends, the relationship has run its course & they run out of gas & they end...relationships teach us, they grow us, they teach us about ourselves & other people....we are forced to understand impermanence....the Buddhist create beautiful Mandalas of sand ....then at some point they brush the sand art away...a practice of impermanence....these topics are soooooo relevant....Our relationships with people are GOLD....(not all people think this way) I commemd you in understanding how valuable people are....we live, we learn & we become better people....we choose better. Everyones in their own little world...wise people express interest in other peoples worlds & bridging those worlds. Excellent work......blessings, love & light to all......

Would a 100% healthy INFJ need to door slam people? It depends...if by door slam you mean ghosting(blocking on socials, no warning, change of address) without any explanation, definitely no. Although, some people refer to door slam as being like a "dramatic all of a sudden change of dynamic in the relationship between INFJ and the other" where the INFJ goes from 100% investment of nurture and caring for the other person to not even 50%-50%, but lower, somehow(at least from my awareness) conciously doing so to PROVE to the other person HOW IT FEELS not to be cared for or listened to. Yes, it's still unhealthy to me, yet a bit more fair. Let's go an extra step, a bit more "healthier". What happens when you predict someone's behaviour because you understand patterns and whateeveeeer, you know the drill...and after a couple of months of trynna making it work and they fail MISERABLY, sometimes not even trying, all of a sudden you're like "fuck this, I'm out"...Is this door slam? Is really the person I was dealing with really that immature, blind, un aware why I've done what I've just done? Do I really need to bother easing myself out instead of the "slam"? Some of my friends came back and asked me why am I so cold all of a sudden and I ask them: "what did you do to keep me around you"? They all go silent. Anyway, my point is... my door slam shouldn't hurt more than the lack of care coming from the other person towards me because relationships are transactional no matter from what angle you perceive it, although I'm open for anyone to challenge my view on that. Thanks for reading :D

@dharmadharma3960

3 жыл бұрын

"what did you do to keep me around you?" Golden

@mqh2411

2 жыл бұрын

all relationships are transactional, exactly my thoughts

Wow, Clay, you gave me an AH HA moment. I relate100% to your experience of your door slam after being married many years and trying EVERYTHING to try to make the marriage work.( I too am an INFJ, and I just found out I was.) I was married 23 years and for the last 10 to 12 I years tried EVERYTHING I could to help make the marriage work. One day I literally felt the shift in my being. It was an instantaneous KNOWING that I had to get out of that marriage then. . After all those miserable years of struggle I felt that click of KNOWING inside my being and I KNEW the marriage was over. Thank you Clay for sharing your experience. I am so relieved that there is another person who literally had that shift in consciousness after years of suffering. I've never heard anyone else explain it like you did. Thank you again.

Oh this hit deep. You put it so well people always think it’s something sudden or uncalled for. No it’s not and never has been. I try and I try and I try but if I’m not being taken serious or taken for granted or stay unappreciated it just hits this point. I always compared it to the red string that connects me to others as snapping. And as much as i want to accept them often times the door slam also comes from not being accept the other way around. Given how infjs cut past the mask someone’s wearing I’d like to think we often love someone for who they actually are but who they often struggle to be themselves. That potential so to speak. I believe that when that door slams shut I have tried everything in my power to make the other person be loved and feel loved but if it’s not reciprocated or taken serious I will eventually run out energy to try. Like i still hold love for that person even if to an extent I also have hurt inside my heart but I’m not naive enough to continue to give all of me when my cup stays empty. I believe that a relationship can only grow if two people r in it to water the love and to achieve things together on a level that allows compromise and mutual understanding and respect as well as communication and comprehension of what is said without it constantly being taken as argumentative. The people I’m now close with in my life I can be honest with ...the good and the bad and neither of us takes it as “manipulation” rather than constructive criticism because we love each other and we show up for each other. Infjs rarely ever act like this out of nowhere I’m sure to some that’s true and others pride themselves but I think people fail to see and understand our inner workings till that string tears and slams the door shut behind them. In my opinion people don’t understand the value of real connections they don’t know how to reciprocate, be loyal and genuinely caring and I just refuse to deal with it. I want people that want to grow with me and be the change the world needs so much, anyone who keeps me from that disrupts my peace of mind

"would a healthy infj...need to door slam someone" ...once I rid myself of my own co-dependence, my radar became much more clear and keen at detecting "off" people...(I do not accept the current trend of 'quicky-disorder-diagnosis', so I just say "off") ...so the answer is, the healthier you become (for all types), the more discerning that you are in relationships and in all decisions. regarding the 'quicky-disorder-diagnosis', I feel this to be a dangerous trend, especially the narcissist-labeling--as over diagnosing people can minimize the "real deal" for others really going through it, and can pigeon hole someone who may have had one bad moment ...that is just a side note, and I do not think your mention of narcissism here falls into the QDD, but it came up for me:)

You're right. The core INFJ issue is we keep trying to "fix" things instead of being present with and allowing those very things to be. We push so hard to "repair" that we push the other (and the relationship) over the edge while we in exhaust ourselves in the process. Research about long term relationships has found that EVERY long term happy relationship has unresolvable problems. We INFJs cannot tolerate those long term unresolvable problems, so we slam the door. I think the lesson for us is to stop trying to perfect our relationships and to allow them to be the messy unpredictable things they really are. Life aint never gonna be perfect.

A true door slam is when you have exhausted yourself in every form and fashion to fix a relationship or you have come to realization that such a relationship is not healthy for you or the other individual. I personally dont feel the door is ever truly closed, but I am not going to make any effort to repair the relationship. I forgive the individual but I AM DONE.

I think most people lack the depth of self awareness it even takes to know why they feel what they feel or what they are feeling. This usually comes from an emotionally rejecting and invalidating childhood wound. For years I walked around like that because my environment was not verbally validating nor emotionally intelligent so I lacked the vocabulary to even express what I experienced. Neat topic.

Wow, I finally have a name for it. I’m 58 years old and I understand what happened. I think I’m an INFJ, and I walked out of two friendships and I was done. One happened 23 years ago. Friends called me to ask what happened to the friendship. I really couldn’t explain it. So they pulled away from me. Less than a year later I got a phone call from a friend, she said that I was the first of many who left this particular person. Your whole talk sounds just like me and the way people treated me when I ended these two relationships. Thanks for the information.

This makes so much sense to me. I was also married to an ESTJ for 19 years. I did my utmost to help him with his PTSD for the last six but it was never enough. Finally one morning I told him he had to go. No drama, no argument, just a quiet yet firm realization that I will not participate in this for another moment. Once he was gone I immediately began to forget all sorts of things about him! Our children have to remind me! I know i'm over two years late but hank you for this!

I won't change anything about my dark side or "door slam." Because I've put patience on top of patience and put aside my own feelings of discomfort and unhappiness long enough that by the time I blow up, THEY EARNED IT!!!!

I think the door slam is after going through the same cycle of being hurt or disappointment or being taken granted for over and over again. Giving chances many times yet there is no changes on the opposite side. Btw what you describe is very accurate.

Hey Clay, INFJ here. Thank you so much for your insights because I found myself in this type of situation about a month ago. I was in a friend group and at first everything was going great but then as time went on I didn’t feel like there was any progression. I felt like I was pouring so much into the group to try and relate and develop deep emotional intimacy with everybody. I’m not mad at anyone specifically but was getting frustrated with not feeling accepted and valued for who I was. It seemed as though my time and energy was wasted and I always thought something was wrong with me. I don’t think a lot of people can go as deep emotionally like INFJ’s can. Like you said, “It was a switch.” I thought to myself one day that I just needed to disappear and maybe they wouldn’t notice. I felt like it was finally time for me to move on and find others who would value and accept me for I really was and I’m still in the process of finding people who can relate emotionally and intellectually on a deep level. Sorry if this is a little rambly but I definitely need to get this off my chest.

When it's over it's over. What many call friendship is just parasitical not reciprocal. All I expect is reciprosity and mutual respect. Most people want superficial, we need meaningful.

I think we tend to door slam because when we get in relationship we're all in , that's definately my default mode in friendship , especially close friends . It's a constant challenge for me to dial down that idealism , I wanna take it to a fever pitch and sometimes that's not appreciated at all and that's where I run into trouble . I really enjoy your content , you have a calming voice and also you leave no stones unturned , thank you for sharing .

I’ve narrowed down my level of effort to ‘three strikes you’re out!!!” So at least I can have a limit to how much I’m willing to put in before I’m done.

Great question...."Does a healthy INFJ.ever need to door slam? The door slam for me is finally letting go of a rellationship that I can longer invest in...I just quietly unplug from it!

@ClayArnall

3 жыл бұрын

The question that still remains though is why didn’t you chose a better person to have a relationship with in the first place? The door slam only occurs because we get into relationships with people that aren’t healthy for us. So when I ask that question I’m really asking would a healthy person more easily see the signs earlier so that the whole thing is avoided.

@lucaencarnacion626

3 жыл бұрын

​@@ClayArnall That's a good point... although sometimes, the intuition that makes a person intriguing to get to know is misguided. You think someone is healthy and right at first, or at least interesting enough that you feel a compulsion to get to know them. By the time you realize there are fatal flaws and incompatibilities, you've already invested too much and it's too late to avoid having to choose between staying in a draining relationship and a door slam--maybe sometimes because the other person has come to rely on you, so even if you did try to create distance, they keep pulling you back somehow. I think you might be right, though. As I've matured and grown to recognize the signs that my relationship-building attempts are futile, there have been a couple cases where I just acknowledged "This relationship is building to nothing" and I've been able to step away just enough to still respond to them if they initiate interaction, but otherwise not put myself out there. Even though I don't completely cut them out of my life, though, that still feels like a so-called "door slam" to me because I'm not cultivating the relationship in my heart anymore, almost as if I don't see the person as important anymore, and the interactions I do have with them are surface-level, almost fake. I know that sounds callous, but I think it's a defense mechanism, because when people matter to me, they *really* matter.

@martinahavelkova9828

3 жыл бұрын

@@ClayArnall I would say that people develop this skills. You are not born to know everything. As you said - you have to learn to believe in your intuition. It doesn't mean you are not healthy, it's just a process. Secondly I was born to narcisistic family - so I had no choice if I want to be with them or not. Just recently I realized that what they do is not ok, I tried everything and nothing is gonna change. It's still painful that my ideal dream never becomes true, but I just accept it as it is and it finally feels very liberating. Because it's reality and not just my dream, which the second side doesn't share. I lower my expectaitions of them and stop wanting something they dont want to give (even if they say they do to keep me staying). My third idea is about narcisistic behavior. They are very skillful in manipulation. They use false promises you want to hear (future faking) to keep you stay. They use lovebombing at first and then if they don't want to let you go. They are blaming you for every their fault (mirroring) and since you would try everything to keep this relationship you believe it. Maybe if you were mature you would recognize it sooner. But you get this from try and error I guess. And still I'm not sure if you can be completelly imune to this. Because of our idealism and williness to try hard.

@kabiba73

3 жыл бұрын

​@@ClayArnall I think it's that when they started the relationship or friendship, they weren't as emotionally healthy. Years later, with emotional and personal growth, the person's flaws become clearer, and the needs/wants that aren't being met. Their introverted intuition is quietly picking up on red flags, semi-consciously filing them away, and then one day, a larger event or behaviour makes the truth evident and unavoidable - they must leave.

This definitely describes the "Door Slam" process accurately. Its not an abrupt process for us, though our actions do change abruptly as a result of it. Personally I think that even the 100% healthy INFJ would still have the door slam, as it is impossible to know with 100% accuracy a person's personality. Even if we have realistic relationship expectations, those expectations can still be torn asunder if some hidden aspect of a person manifests.

the point about us INFJ’s having different definitions of friendship is something i’ve been thinking about for ages but not able to verbalise so accurately. i’m still at school and in a large friend group, but i don’t consider any of them friends because i can’t even be myself around them, they don’t understand me because our relationship is very surface level. whereas they think we’re great friends, i’ve pretty much mentally demoted them to ‘people i have to see daily’ and nothing more, which is why they’re shocked when i’m unbothered by not being able to see them during this lockdown as school is online. just different definitions

The door slam is a process of setting boundaries. Now all the INFG needs to do is NOT return, which forms that wall that they cannot get around to gain access to you. Excellent stragety. This simplified my life and brought calm.

It's definitely involuntary. No one really wants to give up. It is what it is. This is not a decision. You've described it perfectly. It's as if a switch is flipped. The gas is gone. It makes no sense, to continue to put precious energy, into something that's not working. I feel like I wipe my hands of things, and move forward. This is after I've exhausted myself with trying to make, whatever it is, work. No drama. Just move forward. It's involuntary. I don't intentionally think; Oh, let me just shut it off. It just happens when things can't progress forward in a healthy meaningful manner. I thoroughly enjoy your videos. Thank you, for taking the time to compose them and share. 🤜🤛✌

Door Slam= When we determined we are done with it, we are really really really done with it. No more ideals or perfection, we are willing to take all responsibility for ending it, just so we can end it. I guess It is a way we say to ourselves that we need to accept we cannot deal with it anymore and don’t have the solutions/maturity for this relationship. I don’t know if there is a formula to whether if we ever need to door slam people, but even if it is I believe it would be an idealism. Which, is something INFJs should not be drawn into?

Personally, it feels like a realisation of a truth that was there but i couldnt fully see yet, but kinda always was trying to see. I don't feel like its a choice etiher. Great video!

Who else gets taken aback when someone says you "suddenly " ghosted them when in reality you told them several times sometimes over years to change? Then when you're done you're the bad guy?

@AmyMichelleMosier

2 жыл бұрын

“It’s your fault.” A sign of an unhealthy relationship.

I am so impressed about the fact that you can describe my feelings and thoughts so accurately every time! Better than I ever could do myself.

People want the benefits of a relationship but, they don’t want the responsibility.

I am an INFP and I only have a few friends. My idea of a friend is of someone who would be upset if I were to be hurt etc or if anything were to happen to me, and I would feel the same for them. That is quite rare to find.

I was in a really close relationship with a friend for about 5-6 years and it ended this way. He was the first person I met in college who I really got along with and could talk to about philosophy, linguistics, sociology, etc. and he meant so much to me. We both dealt with pretty severe depression and anxiety and I always put his needs above mine. At different points we had a FWB situation that at the time seemed to work well but near then end of our friendship (when I was in a relationship with someone else), it was incredibly toxic because he couldn’t accept that I didn’t want to have sex with him. He got very emotionally manipulative and verbally abusive and I would still try to be there for him. I’d drive to his place to rub his back until he fell asleep and buy him groceries. Then one day he crossed a line and I knew intuitively that I couldn’t stomach having him in my life anymore. I felt so much lighter after and now whenever I see him in town I feel nauseous and can sometimes even have a full on panic attack.

The sand analogy is SO true! I will fight and I will fight and I will fight for us.. But once that last strand of hope is gone, you'll probably never see me again. All of my feelings are gone in a split second.

I guess Door Slam is taken seriously because you not only cut off the person from your life, you become emotionally unavailable. You wouldn't even flinch if that said person would have an accident after the door slam, like a psychopath. Anyways, I try to not expect much from people and I fail. It's integrated so much inside me that I feel so unsatisfied with friendships or relationships. I never did Door Slam though. I don't invest much in relationships now a days. People don't care much and are totally cool with it while I keep thinking if I did something wrong and then they go away from my life so I no longer care about putting any effort unless the other one put some effort and prove themselves first.

This truly is the single most accurate way to explain the door slam. It feels almost automatic. It's like you're stuck in the dark, feeling around and grasping at just about anything to find your way and then all of a sudden the light comes on and you can see everything clearly. I think it's got something to do with inferior Se that we naturally ignore so much, until one day when enough stress, pain and pressure builds up that maybe our own bodies out of self protection forcefully push us to actually see the Se fully. It's elusive, whether it's facts you're looking to find to back up your own internal arguments or some actual thing in reality, oftentimes when you look you can't see it so you assume it's not there...when in fact it has been there all along.

A strong healthy relationship is my goal. Once I see that my partner is not mentally capable of or not interested in working towards a healthy strong relationship..door slam. I lose ALL interest. There is this weird calm that I feel in the moment as I make the final decision to walk away because there is no resolution.

I agree with this 💯 %! By the time I door slam I feel I have tried everything I could and see no other way to try to fix this. Communication and respect are not alot to ask for. And if you have certain questions and concerns at a certain point in a relationship and no matter how hard you've tried your partner refuses to talk about it...this is where the door slam comes in for me. Especially when I have heard and been willing to meet them halfway with their concerns and I can't even get a conversation out of them. There is no hope in me ever being valued in the relationship and that's when the closing of the door begins!

Yes. Yes. Yes, and yes. Thank you for speaking the language! It is so great to hear another person saying these words. Great breakdown!

It is also very applicable in the dating scene. I have been chatting to a girl I was interested in, trying to find emotional connections, but then after a few days my intuition was just like: nope, not gonna happen. The only conscious tough decision about this was that I told her the honest truth straight away.

I call it “alignment” with someone which is strikingly very rare to find. I often find myself evaluating others when i meet them for the first time and see if they align with how i feel. If they don’t then relationship would feel suffocating or uncomfortable that i can’t take another minute to be with them. The only solution for this was to shut them off from my life completely (unfriend, block, stop seeing each other etc). I think this is due to the rational part of us that only wants the best for us. It dawned on me that people don’t see things the way we do hence getting confused about why we did things the way we do.

This was so SO interesting and well explained. As an INFJ myself, I can only confirm that. And it's fascinating to watch it explained as I probably didn't fully realized it was an INFJ thing. Some people have never understood how I could door slam people I seemed so fond of.....you have explained it so simply with the image of the sand running through the hands. And it really happens out of nowhere, like a switch. I also agree, that this is probably an unhealthy trait. We shouldn't reach this point and know to walk away before the emotional burn out

My thought process to the ‘T’ in relationships. A friend is someone you BBQ with everyone is an acquaintance for me. I don’t have a lot of friends either.

I’m an INFJ. When I slam the door, it’s only after I have tried everything else. I feel like I have given my all, that’s why when I walk away there’s no going back. It’s like all possibilities as I know it has literally been exhausted.

Wow! I've never heard anyone put it quite this way. When you talk about your marriage it's like your describing mine. Over 17 years of being married to my ISTP husband (I'm an INFJ) and he seems fine, meanwhile I'm still trying to fix everything and keep it going. He really is a good, honorable man, but we do not see life the same at all. I feel lost, overwhelmed, ashamed of myself that I am not perfectly fine and happy too, and at a loss as to what to do, yet trying to accept that the way things are are the way they are going to be possibly forever. The only questions now are, "Can I live with that?" "Will I hate myself for it in 10 years?" "Am I being selfish or irrational?" "Am I really ok with giving up the things that I want most just to keep peace and not forsake the promise I made at our wedding as a naive 17 year old girl?" 🤦‍♀️ If someone had told me life and love would be this hard I would have hidden in a cave somewhere and only came out when there were no people around. So, noone would get hurt, including me. 😔

@Mari_2024_sha

Жыл бұрын

I understand it so much... Married at the age of 19, now I'm 28 and have completely different needs, but afraid to leave my husband.

I'm 58. I'm too old to tolerate anyone in my life who isn't willing to work out conflicts in the relationship. That would be every single one of my in-laws. I have already emotionally slammed the door on all of them. I think they know it on some level and are hurt and angry but oh well.

In your Christianity Video. I can really identify with you- my grand father was a missionary, my husband was a Church Minister. I was “led to the Lord”. And felt obliged to try it out. As an INFJ I saw through what was happening in the religious world and what I was experiencing. I discovered that I could not trust my husband. Our marriage was really a no go but Within the twenty odd years we cooled and tried to make a go of it, to no avail then he died from medical problems. Now I am facing my retirement. Such is life.

Ooohh! I see you have a two cameras setup now! (1:10) Nice camera slider going on there!!! 🤜🤛

The day when that doorslam happens, people fail to understand that takes a lot for that to happen and it's truly devastating for an INFJ. I've found myself having to privately grieve after the fact. Experiencing that has allowed me to go within myself and work on my flaws, issues, etc. It almost allowed me more time for self reflection and to learn things so that later down the road I'm better able to choose what's healthier for me as a person and as an INFJ. I'd like to say that it's allowed me to save myself.

once again - great points, very accurate descriptions! thank you for sharing! the one that stuck out to me was about the need for progress in nearly everything we do, including relationships (totally agree!!!). it made me think of something else: I've been realizing that a long-lasting childhood friendship is seemingly going nowhere now - no progress in emotional intimacy like you mentioned here, and all that (though I have raised the issue a number of times with them, and we sort of have talked about that, but to me, it still seems/feels like we're stalling) - and recently I decided (consciously) to be kinda less active in that relationship to try to slowly 'slip out' of each other's lives - at least I thought that's what I've been trying to do, BUT that point about progress made me think if I was actually trying to kinda 'spoil' the relationship to go backward in the 'progress' of it so that there would be SOMEWHERE to go; to communicate less, so that when we DO, I'd feel like this level IS enough for me, you know what I mean? does anybody think it might be a thing?😅 it's probably a case for a psychotherapy session, lol, but I thought it might be an interesting thought to share 🤔😁

I have door slammed once. It was a friend who I realized was narcissistic and just using me to start her business and for praise. I did forgive her often and gave many second chances. I eventually recognized the red flags, took time away from the relationship, then tried again. I realized it was hopeless and decided not to contact her again. I left communication open at that point, but have since quietly defriended her on all social media and blocked her on messenger. It's now final.

I don’t normally comment on videos, but I have been watching your videos for a while and feel that you truly voice my thoughts. It’s comforting to have you elegantly discuss me, because that’s what it’s it feels like. Thank you

That was so well articulated Clay, it made me cry, it was so on point! I almost didn’t watch it because I am little tired of those door slam vids, but I am glad I did. Your are really good at going at the bottom of things and coming back with clear way of explaining it. Continue your good work, I really enjoy your channel ☺️

thank u so much for the audios on spotify!

Your description of the breakdown of your marriage paralleled my own experience a great deal. Thank you for your insight.

Thank you this is such a good video on the topic, it reviews so many sub ideas and and questions i have on the door slam topic :)

Great video Clay. I get frustrated and lose hope when I begin to feel the (unhealthy) relationship is like the movie Groundhog Day and it shows no signs of change or improvement.

The way you expressed this totally resonated with me. The amount of effort I invest in family and intimate relationships has resulted in me walking a tightrope in hurtful situations that have left me feeling drained. The wierd thing is that I still have no clue when I'll eventually run of chance after chance after chance...I just wake up to the painful realization that today was the last time.

Very timely topic, for me at least. It is reassuring to know I’m not the only one who experiences that last thread snapping and resulting realization of “it’s done.” I still wish I could do more, but there’s nothing left to do. Thank you for sharing your thoughts, insight, and experience. 👏👏👏

You really speak to my soul. Even if this is the only outlet I speak about this subject. Realizing I'm an infj has helped me understand myself more than ever. Never felt like I fit in on this earth but finally knowing I'm not alone helps a lot with accepting myself. Ty so much...

I was so excited to see you'd posted AND picked this topic! Thank you so much for opening up about your personal experiences with us. I agree, we're always seeing that potential! I've held onto many a sliver of hope. I also believe that a failed relationship can be viewed as a sunken cost, personally! Can't give up- perfectionism. Also, with a religious upbringing... and opinions of family on a divorce... I could understand that could be an additional reason for staying too long. I relate to you in a lot of ways, although I'm not a parent. Also, I love that you use the word 'semblance.' Idk why, but I just really love the word 👌 All in all, I think I just wish that I could have that final realization that leads to the doorslam a lot sooner, if anything. I'm very confident in any doorslam I've done, it just always feels like it comes years after it should. I'm loving the variety of angles and different filming methods, recently!

Each word is gold.

Towards the next of the video where you speak about the toxic relationship dynamic, that is really true. It’s beautiful. We tend to not set boundaries with our relationships because we have such a need to people please so then we take so much abuse and we are always the one trying to fix the relationship until we are so empty and so burned out and we literally have nothing else to give. So if we can recognize this specific behavior and going forward make it priority to set boundaries then we won’t ever ever to the door slam because we will by default not let someone get that close who is toxic for us.

I can see myself in your words... so much. I feel seen. It is hard to explain why I get drained with certain relationships and why I keep investing in them no matter what (even if it doesn't seem to make sense for other people.... and I see myself suffering... but I don't want to quit just yet). Your explanation gave me some very good clues. Thank you!!!