A little bit of math. Arcsin(0.5) = 30 deg, which is exactly 1/3 of a 90 degree arc. So, your estimate of 10 sec delay for a half-extension is precise.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Good to get a bit of mathematical confirmation! 👍🏼

Nothing is better than some good engineering video in the morning. And I like that you do it without scripts

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Indeed! For performance reasons, a lot of servers disallow scripts, so I try to do as much as I can without them...even thought the script functionality can be really fun! :)

@LookOutForNumberOne

11 ай бұрын

@@Oearth 10 years of Space Engineers is long enough to use the standard welder. BuildAndRepair is the real solution.

Great content! The only thing it left me wanting was a demo of it fully in action printing a ship.

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I Know! At one point I showed the big mining ship hologram that I did wind up printing with it, but just spaced on showing it during videos assembly.

Very cool engineering. Way more braining than i do admittedly. I just make a spinning "propeller" style welder and have it collapse down and the glass surface off the front of the welding "propeller" becomes the floor.

Space engineer is impressive as is your 3D printer!

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks Ben! Just printed another ship with it yesterday - it was fun to watch!!

You could do essentially the same thing with two rotors, instead of a zigzag pattern have your projector move in a circle. First rotor on the end of the pistons handles the overall rotation, with an arm of blocks extending out however far you want the circle's radius to be. Second rotor on the end of the radius arm handles counter rotating the projector to keep the projection oriented the same direction. Just set the speed low and group the rotors together with a button for "rotor lock on off".

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

I wanted that to work too, but unfortunately it didn’t give full coverage. There’s a discussion below from another viewer - it has the same flaw as the checkerboard pattern. There’s of course many designs, and the one I showed isn’t even necessarily the best, but it does work, and doesn’t miss blocks…plus is cool to watch. :). Appreciate the thought!!

@SetsunaInfinite

Жыл бұрын

I found great success with a rotary welder head and a “plunger” that is pulled by alternating pairs of pistons. Welder # determines max width and height and plunger determines depth. It can print very large things with dramatically low amount of welders.

Ah Yeah! I'm going to take that challenge. I've been wanting to do the "springy thing" printer for a while. It looks fairly simple, sensors mounted on the welders to tell the pistons to retract. Using the info you provided will give me a start. Figuring out how to get it from Xbox to here is the learning curve.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Can you ratchet up that challenge and make it scriptless? It’ll be epic if you can recreate it!! :D

@antonioscendrategattico2302

Жыл бұрын

I feel like such a dumbo for not realizing that it would really be as simple as putting sensors on the welders :D But it does seem really interesting - recently I made an automated grinding arm that would shave off the top layer of anything put in its pit, then lower itself until it found another layer of blocks to grind, complete with a mechanism to make it stop once it reached the bottom. All timer blocks, rather fun though not without its issues (especially if you add new stuff for it to eat while it's still chewing on a previous meal).

@Sinpsycle

Жыл бұрын

@@antonioscendrategattico2302 Yeah that was it. I also put in a 3rd sensor to tell it when to retract. Speaking of TB, I recently started on a server w/ very specific scripting limitations (they hate IIM). I put IIM on a PB, a TB to run it for 10 sec and another to run that TB every 2 min 30 sec.

been getting back into this game and stumbled across this video, JUST WOW!

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed Xan Tosh!! :D Much appreciated.

Awesome work! Small note: breaking torque is only applied when the block is turned off entirely. It doesn't brake when it should stop moving or is reversed

good idea but a little complex and limited in server keen with only 5 welders but i want to see a printing time laps if possible !

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

If the Keen servers limit the number of welders, then this build model could be extended in double, triple, or probably even more coverage to make a single welder go farther - could be really useful! It’s actually super simple, and worked really well! I almost did a printing Timelapse, but I felt the video was already getting a bit long - maybe I can revisit it later and show a build!

@mz00956

2 ай бұрын

How about building a propeller. Welder, space, welder, space, ... That should cover a radius of 20 blocks, more or less

Very cool!

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

It was a very fun build!! :D

Bluto/Brutus! Takes me waaaay back! Ah, to be a kid again! McCoy wasn't a mechanic, he was a doctor. Unless, he stayed at a Holiday Inn Express.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

There’s apparently a whole Bluto/Brutus controversy I unearthed while getting that image - who knew!!

Excellent video, compliments on the narrative! Earned yourself a sub :-)

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

Thank you - much appreciated Nigel! :D

It would be easier to use the hinges on a welding frame and the pistons on the projection. The welders would keep the same mass. You can then centrally mount your pistons... preferably opposite of the welders and starting out fully extended and retracting as the projection is built.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

I'm having a little trouble visualizing how the welders would be able to move while recessed in the station's landing platform and just visually keeping the platform's clean smooth surface with also a retractable projector. Can you explain a little more? I assume you're talking about a different design without the platform requirement and making the projector assembly retractable into the floor - so it's just a welder and projection setup. If so, then I completely agree. :)

I have seen something like this before and thought it was very cool how you explained how to make it, I was thinking, also, What if you put the Welders (3 blocks apart) on a Piston that you set to go In and Out and stack these to make a weld wall ? or Under the Landing pad.

My main concern: this is slow. It would probably be faster to weld it by hand at this point

@alexiskaas907

2 жыл бұрын

Is that a joke? I can't tell...

@assimilater-quicktips

Жыл бұрын

@Linux user I've hand welded plenty of large grid ships. I'm also saying this having used his 3d printer on the DadSpeed server prior to the jiggle update mentioned in the video. He has the piston on a really low speed because you need to be able to inspect it as it's welding to make sure you aren't running out of components while it's welding. Adding this adds extra time to have to wait at each level while it spins around. Compare with a simple small grid welder ship you can stuff with a bunch of components and fly around the projection with. Basically it's a trade off. As all engineering involves trade offs. Do you value speed? Or do you value low pcu? Personally I'd want it to be faster / easier than flying a welding ship around at least

I use a mod with "Twin welders" it has twin drills and grinders its amazing I use this I didn't add the hinge as it was too complicated for my brain(I didn't try at all) so I made my own based on a paused moment of your preview of yours working Testing it now

i like it :) keep on

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

Thanks @Bighoffa! The Engineering will continue... :D

Interesting. I do wonder if it would be more stable to use a double rotor system, because while you seem to have gotten it to work on your multiplayer server, I can definitely tell that some multiplayer servers will not be so kind to it. Having just two rotors, with one being in the center and the other being out on a stick from there, and then the projector being out on another stick from the second rotor seems like a more practical and klang-proof system. Maybe you could experiment with it for a second video?

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I think some other person mentioned that down below, and the double rotor is where I started on the sketch pad, but when he built it, came to the same result I did in that it also missed a single block right in the middle (like where a light or sensor would be) - assuming the duel rotors, welders and all that had the same kind of reach and spacing. But you used the right word at the beginning..."interesting". It was a fun design and at one point I adding 2 more hinges on each axis which doubled my movement from 2 blocks to 4 blocks - but it didn't look as good all folded up and retracted into the floor. I've moved on to a rotary design shown in a 3-D Printing II video where I'm still striving for that very small form factor with minimal welders that can still weld up fairly sizable ships...it's a work in progress still, but has some promise. :)

Any chance you could throw up a blue print? I'm playing on the Keen offcial servers limited to 5 welders per person and looking for a design like this but it looks kind of intimidating to recreate by hand.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Definitely! (on the blueprint). It’s actually pretty simple, but I totally get how it seems a little overwhelming with all the hinges and movement! I’ll repost here when I get it up.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Made a blueprint for you. The timer blocks for full automation are in a separate area from the actual printer so aren't include, but are pretty basic to set up - I provided the timing delays for each timer block in the Blueprint description. Hope it helps! Maybe once you set it up and play with it'll become more obvious. steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2824001970

I love your design, and will be replacing my large welder wall. Thanks for rhis.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

I didn’t test the stability of it, but theoretically I realized I could of added more hinges to the existing ones in sets of 2, and extend the reach 2 more blocks. But like I said, didn’t build that and actually test it with either weights or an actual ship like like it did the one in the vid. Let me know how it works for you!

@kinggrizzly13

2 жыл бұрын

@@Oearth my initial plan is to try this design for small grid building. I’ll provide feedback when I start. I have quite a bit of excavation to do first. :)

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

@thirteenbytes. Later, I added a rotor off to one side of the Large Grig Projector, did the swap out thing to a small grid rotor head, and put a small grid projector on it. Built a small grid drone with it - worked great! Good Luck!!

@kinggrizzly13

2 жыл бұрын

@@Oearth I hope you can guide me a little! I built the printer but something looks off. Here are my settings so far for each hinge. Lower Hinges (LH#), Upper Hinges (UH#) with Velocity, Current Angle, Lower Limit and Upper Limit respectively as follows: LH1 0.5, 0, -90, 0; LH2 -0.5, -90, -90, 0; LH3 0.5, 0, -90, 0 LH4 -0.5, -90, -90, 0; UH1 0.5, 0, -90, 0; UH2 -0.5, -90, -90, 0; UH3 -0.5, -90, -90, 0, UH4 0.5, 0, -90, 0 I still have to set other settings, but I hope to get these correct first and I hope this makes sense , thanks! :)

@kinggrizzly13

2 жыл бұрын

After reviewing your video for the 100th time, I think I see my error - maybe! I'll make notes! :) Yes I am excited to get this to work :)

Your hinges are doing something a piston could do. Why not just use pistons? I see four hinges extending in a direction that one piston could do. I appreciate being able to print with less welders.

@Oearth

3 ай бұрын

Great question! In this case, I wanted to have the smallest form factor possible so the mechanism could fold up and retract down below the platform. Pistons are great, but getting horizontal movement in 2 directions plus blocks attached the piston heads (even if on the side of the head) takes up a huge amount of space. There was also the piston heads which take up that factional amount of block that would mean making an even bigger hole in the platform - in contrast, the entirety of the hinge fits inside of a single block with no 'scraping' against other blocks. This allowed me to fit the whole mechanism in a 2 x 2 block hole with ease. so it was all about making it as compact as possible...plus it looks cool when operating! :D

Clever. Would be easier now with the event blocks.

You ... you ... you invented a Cuisinart ship printer! I am curious though - rather than trying to eyeball timer blocks, could that part be made easier with event controllers, that would proc based on a hinge's angle?

@Oearth

2 ай бұрын

@StyxRiverGynoid I think you could do this with event controllers, a person would just have to read the angle on two hinges to know the that unique position (one from what I called vertical and another from horizontal) to move to the next stage - you'd still need 5 or 6 for each unique position just like the timer blocks, but it is doable I think. Probably the primary reason I did not use the Event Controller is because it wasn't in the game yet. ;-) Thanks for the thought-provoking comment - love it!

@StyxRiverGynoid

2 ай бұрын

[Edited to fix typos and a missed part re pistons] @@Oearth I haven't had a chance to load up and try this, but my thinking was, 1 timer block to handle the beginning, to give specific velocity to the hinges from the fully idle positions. So from 0 velocity to + or - as appropriate to the top series of hinges. I figure the TB is best for this since you can use its G bar to add velocity to the individual hinges easier. An event controller that monitors the angle of the last hinge in the first series, that procs when that hinge reaches the end of its travel, This EC procs the first hinge group, the one in motion, to reverse. At the same time, a second EC detects the end hinge of the group in motion reaching the end of its travel angle, and *it* procs, to begin the second group of hinges to also reverse (so from stowed to transition). That should then have both sets moving - one oscillating on X axis, the other now on Y axis. I'm not sure if this is where another TB might be better for this EC to proc, because then it can handle the reverses, *and* the pistons though, for the Z axis. Then you just have one final EC that detects the arms reaching the very end of their travel in all axes, and procs one last TB that reverses all hinges back to stowed positions and turns them off. So total might be 3 EC, 2 TB Downsides: You have to juggle the velocity for each hinge to get them to move smoothly. There's no way to detect if the hinges are binding in some way during the weld process. Something tells me that an abort would be a nightmare I also wish one of the variables ECs will proc from was incomplete welding due to lack of comps in the chain, but AFAIK that's not available in anyone's scripts either, si I imagine the game code itself doesn't include that in the APIs. TBH, this is frakking brilliant, and is what Space Engineers is all about! Even if my idea for an alternate for controlling it worked, I have a feeling your original implementation may be better since it steps the process through in more discrete blocks so easier to debug. Needless to say, you got a well deserved sub from me!

I have watched the vid and really like the idea but I woul like to see it print just to see it work

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I know! A couple other people mentioned that and I really should have, but I just didn't think about it and the video was getting long. I remembered to do that in second printing video, "3-D Printing II" where I made a compact rotational printer. I will try to do better!! :)

I use a system more like a 3d printer, obviously you can’t use belt drives in SE but you can get close with wheels on a track in the x direction, then I push the entire track in the Y direction using a piston. Then I have a rotating line of 5 welders and I can weld most of my ships 10x10 crossection without even using the track, only needing to use the track system on larger projects. I just hate messing with hinges and timer blocks.

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I totally get it - many ways to create the "printers"! =) This was just 1 use case I thought was interesting to share - a landing platform, doubling as a welder platform, with a compact printer and fully retractable assembly. I like your rolling track idea...something on wheels. Do you think it could be made to work reliably without the pistons, and use the wheels themselves for propulsion?

@ClankerWanker

Жыл бұрын

@@Oearth the issue is that you can’t have wheels be used for 2 axes of movement without adding a bunch of weight and making it too complex. Was much simpler to use a piston

Any idea on how one would coordinate it with the pistons extending a bit every cycle?

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

With the new event controller block it would be fairly easy I think! You'd set the event controller to look at the angle of the hinges, probably just the 2 middle ones extending it sideways and the 2 middle ones extending forwards. When all 4 reach a collapsed position of zero, then the event controller could trigger the vertical piston movement to move it up one block. At that point you could maybe set a delay on the first timer block that starts the cycle so it starts after the piston completes the vertical push and also simultaneously stops the vertical piston...you'd just have to set the piston speed so it coincides with that timer block delay. I think those couple things working together might do it - might need another timer block so you can trigger 2 things at once (start a cycle and stop the piston) but I think it would work with minimal changes.

I would just have used 2 rotors, with the axes offset by 1 large grid block. Obviously both spinning at the same speed in opposite directions. That'll move the projection in a circle with a diameter of 2 large grid blocks, reaching every small grid block. No timer blocks needed.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

I originally plotted that out and wanted that to work (much simpler), but it had the same issue as the checkboard pattern - it misses a spot in the middle.

@Pystro

2 жыл бұрын

@@Oearth Just did the precise math. You're right. At the point right in between the welders, there's about a quarter large block of space that's not covered - with 1 block offset. And if you increased the offset to 1 block diagonally it doesn't cover the block in the center of the circle any more. What if you changed the welder pattern from a square grid to a hexagonal one (in the x direction keep a spacing of 3, but in the y direction go 3 out and 1 to the side; or in other words, shift every other row of welders by 1 block)? My math says it will work.

i reckommend going slower than 0.5, i usually do 0.1 or lower tbh. but i also mostly played on laggy pvp servers, where if you moved to fast, you would miss alot of internal components with the welders.. painfull

This looks amazing, though I honestly don’t understand any of it. Trying to research and find simplified designs for an automated printer that would work on PS5.

New to Space Engineers - I dont understand how to setup the timer block actions to move the hinges. Not sure what to set the actions as.

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

@MercurioZA If you look at a Hinge’s properties, you’ll see all kinds of setting for velocity of hinge, range of motion, even just turning it off and on. When you open a timer block properties, then click on the “Setup Actions”, you have available I’ll the functional components (like a hinge), timer block is attached to in the build. Pull down the hinge into what looks like a quick action slot on the bottom of the screen. When you do, a list of all the properties of that hinge will show up, and you can select the things you want it to do (turn on, reverse direction, etc.). Hope that helps!

I am working on the Timer blocks, but confused on what the Setup actions would be for TImer Block 2 to 6.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

Timer 6 is probably the last movement to retract the whole thing, so it's 'Reverse' on both the "sideways push" group, and the "forwards push" group, as they should both be fully extended at the end of the full travel. Timer 2 is probably the first forward push that in my video goes for 10 seconds of the full 30 seconds of travel (to have it move only 1 block). So on Timer 2, it does a Reverse to start the movement, then Timer 3 turns the "forward push" group off after the 10 seconds and begins the sideways traversal. When Timer 3 finishes, Timer 4 simply turns the "forward push" group back on so it can finish it forward travel for 20 seconds (completing the full 30 seconds of extension. Hope that further detail helps!

@kinggrizzly13

2 жыл бұрын

@@Oearth Aha!! I appreciate you taking the time for an excellent explanation! Thank you!

@kinggrizzly13

2 жыл бұрын

@@Oearth I have good news! I was able to print my first small grid ship in my survival world! This was an awesome learning experience of the game mechanics. Thanks much for the inspiration.

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

That's fantastic news!! :D And yes, the games creativity in design mechanics just keeps expanding as you do more things...very addictive to keep doing things to see what is possible!

I use a track I have made that is in a straight line the projector sits on the track on a platform attached to 6 rotors and 6 tires to hold it onto the track while I have 4 welding arms made entirely out of hinges with 1 piston on each arm for vertical movement the projector just jerks back and forth as the arms move higher and higher and bam I got a ship.

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I love tracked things with wheels!! I haven't had the greatest success myself (lol), but still really like the concept!

it can only work if piston have enough strength to move the ship that you build

hinges can transfer items why not make the platform move with the welder so ship weight isn't a big factor on the hinges

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

You could do it either way - move welders instead of projection - but this was just about this particular design, and also wanting it to double as a landing pad. Landing a large fully loaded mining ship on platform might cause similar sag issues? Only an engineering effort will know! :)

I'm a tad disappointed you didn't actually show the welder in action

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I know. In hindsight, I should of squeezed in a fast forward of it welding the large mining ship that I showed as the holographic projection. Didn’t even think about it until some folks mentioned it here in comments - I was too focused on the actual mechanism!

Keen Servers are limited to 5 welders. If you are clever those 5 welders can print a design 23 large blocks wide...by however long.

How can we do something like this with only a 5 welder limit on the official keen servers? Best I could do was to imitate a “welding wall” by having a row of 5 welders over a rotor that was offset by 5 conveyer blocks linked to another rotor which got the weld arm to do funky circular gymnastics but it worked (though slowlyyyyyy) to make a rather large ship. The downside is that it has to be in space to avoid gravity interference and instead of a piston arm I ended up using a modified mining ship to pull the projection through in order to save on PCU costs associated with pistons 💀 I just wish there was something more elegant that could safely be used in gravity but I can’t come up with anything

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

I didn't do it (obviously) as I was also going for a very compact setup, but I think you could add 2 conveyor tubes to both sets of the hinge movement groups and extend the movement from 2 to 4. Adding 2 more would go to 6. If you then used just 4 of the 5 welders allowed, I think you could print a ship that's 12x12 large grid on 2 of it's axis...which is getting to be a fairly large ship. It's theoretical until it gets built, but it should work.

2 rotors would accomplish a very similar effect.

no demo :(

Astroneer printer

Nice design, but I didn't see a single ship being printed...?

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

I thought about printing another ship with it and doing a quick fast forward, but the vid seemed a bit long already. Plus this is all done in Survival, and I really didn’t need another ship - though I suppose it would of added a bit of flair to the vid! 🙂

@alecisla

2 жыл бұрын

@@Oearth So you were in a survival world in multiplayer I guess? Then that would be understandable, coz if you tell me you were in single player... But you made a really nice video, with a very cool idea and design, showed the printer, showed how to setup everything, the idea behind the design... I'm pretty sure nobody would complain for having to watch another 2 or 3 minutes of footage to see the printer working. I mean, it would've been the cherry on the top of the cake! :D

@Oearth

2 жыл бұрын

You got it exactly - Survival Multiplayer.

For large ships, it is better to have the projection as a station because on servers, "ship" grids phase into each other from time to time, also inertia tensor is not a standard option on servers. However, BOTH parts of the Hinge definitely offer many printing solutions. Rotational disc welder also has its flaws as you mentioned. There are better designs out there; the modern printing design race is super Low PCU and scaleable, time-saving(options to customise the print layer time and area) without programmable blocks and stable on servers. Great video; thanks for sharing. Here is an old printer you asked for, I don't use it anymore; it's considered old-tech nowadays. kzread.info/dash/bejne/aKKf0LtsXaavn84.html We moved on to something better. no pistons, low PCU, minimum welders and even welder moving speeds

just make it in space and use 5 welders for every ship size

So I must do maths or I must gather more materials and build a wall ? I think I'll build the wall

useless what really helps - shielding around welders and layer-printing

while your setup is cool'n'all, its too complex, my wall of welders and a piston will do the same job faster, and I dont need alot of brain power to set it up :D

I took a square of conveyors then added hinges every 2 blocks and turned them so they formed a near perfect circle. I then added some extentions using conveyors to the furthest corner hinges and then slapled 3 large grid pistons on each. After that I added my welders. The entire welding ring is connected in all 4 corners by 4 pistons " I used merge blocks the connect the grid then grinder them off" the circle of pistons and welders hangs from the ceiling and the projector is in the floor on 1 piston a rotor and a hinge. The pistons start extended at a maximum of 8.8 meters. They just reverse using a timer then extend repeatedly until the ship is conpletely. It's a pretty cool build even if a little large its roughly 6000-7000 pcu I believe although it didn't end up looking as cool as I thought it would. It kind of looks like an anus that massages the projection until its complete. Lol! But whatever it works really well. After that the piston on the floor extends and the hinge turns 90 degrees to land the stick its attached to onto a grinder then the ship or whatever lands gently on a small row of landing gears. Or explodes whichever.

@Oearth

Жыл бұрын

@Mr Nobody The end of that comment was absolutely perfect and priceless!! "...then the ship or whatever lands gently on a small row of landing gears. Or explodes whichever." XD!!!! This is the Way!

@bobbyvandyke143

Жыл бұрын

@@Oearth Clang! Lol