"Fahrenheit has more steps within the useful temperature range" We have this brand new invention here called a decimal point

@zoomerenhd

4 жыл бұрын

Was just about to make that exact same comment XD.

@Rudabaugh

4 жыл бұрын

@Marcin Berman What are you talking about? "There is a fixed amount of digits" in between two chosen numbers? (E.g 1 & 2) Uhhh, no. There isn't. There is literally an infinite amount of numbers between 1&2. (or any other numbers)

@Thinwhiteduke1185

4 жыл бұрын

@@Rudabaugh ...He means there's a fixed amount of digits in the display and the software that's controlling the temperature.

@benjaminlavigne2272

4 жыл бұрын

@@Thinwhiteduke1185 but i'm guessing Dave did not understand Marcin's comment because of how easy it is to add more digits to the screen.

@zuda8919

3 жыл бұрын

lol congratulations, being so hung up about our systems of measurement. Must be really fulfilling

having done daily work with both a Hako 880D, Metcal automatic and an old Radio Shack Digital Weller clone I can honestly say that a classic ceramic core soldering pencil works just as well as the automatic integrated core system for surface mount work and most through hole. Unlike the integrated heating element system though, the separate core/tip last far longer. The hakko and the RS both never had an issue with their heating cores in 6 years, where as the metcal ate 100$ in tips a year. I'm willing to wait a few more seconds to heat up, if i dont have to buy an FX880 in tips every year....

I have a Hakko FX888D. It is ready to solder within 10-20 seconds depending on the job. I only paid about 100USD for it on amazon. I do not do a lot of soldering. I am only required to use it about 5-10 times weekly. But for my small workload it's the best bang for the buck. If I was doing Louis' workload of course I would want better. But if you're a hobbyist or have a small customer base, don't look any further than the Hakko FX888D. The issues that Louis describes with the temperature isn't nearly as big of a deal as he's making it out to be in those instances. EDIT: Another point that Louis fails to mention is the cost of maintenance. We all know that a Hakko device is more than likely going to last longer than the Chinese knockoffs that he is promoting. That is not my argument here. What he fails to mention at all is the cost of the tips of the older tech FX888D vs the newer tech FX951-66. A tip for the old tech is approximately 5 bucks. The same tip in the new tech is over 4 times that at approximately 22 bucks. Tips go bad no matter how well you take care of them. If you go with the newer tech, the initial cost isn't the only premium you will be paying. Now my original statement stands. If you have a heavy workload, then sure. Pay the premium and buy the better product. But if you don't need that . . . the FX888D is the best bang for the buck if you want genuine Hakko quality.

@spartan456

3 жыл бұрын

I started with an 888D as well, as a matter of fact I still regularly use it. However, one thing I would like to say is that the cartridge style of irons are in a completely different league. One day I got lucky and a friend told me about some FM-202's on eBay for $200. They came with the stand, brass sponge holder, 2027 handpiece, and the dumb little card to lock and unlock the station. Seller was willing to take best offers as well, so I asked if I could get one for $175, and I was able to. I was similar to you, not really doing that much soldering. Maybe 5-10 times a week. I'm still in that same zone actually. But once you try using one of these cartridge stations you'll just wonder how you ever put up with the older ones. I like the 888D, it's a great station, it really is. If it wasn't, I wouldn't still be using it as much as I do now. But the comfort and utility of the cartridge ones makes them completely worth it in my book. The tips may be more expensive, but you'll be replacing tips on the cartridge ones just about as often as you would be on the older ones. It may be 4x more money per tip, but if you're replacing them once a year then it's not that much of a problem at all. Just having the ability to rapidly swap tips, while they're still hot and the station is still running, is a complete game changer. You might think "I never change tips", but when you have a handful of different tips to choose from and swapping to them takes all of 10 seconds, you'll inevitably find yourself changing them all the time as you progress through the repair. Being able to swap to a knife tip after using a bevel without having to wait ten minutes is amazing. When I use the 888 I'm reluctant to change tips because I'll have to wait for it to cool down, or deal with handling a very hot chunk of metal and trying to secure a new tip on if I want to save time. So I just rarely find myself wanting to change tips when I use it. The real benefit of these cartridge stations is the incredible ease of changing tips, it makes your workflow so much simpler and less time consuming.

@BaradaNels

3 жыл бұрын

@@spartan456 I can definitely see the usefulness of changing tips on the fly. With that said, I would never do this. Specifically because I calibrate the temperature every time I change the tip using this: www.banggood.com/DANIU-FG-100-Soldering-Iron-Tip-Thermometer-Temperature-Detector-Tester-0-700-p-952899.html?akmClientCountry=America&&cur_warehouse=CN Don't get me wrong. I am all for saving time. But my soldering jobs are normally multi-tasking events. I recently built a few Mechanical keyboards. Took me like 4 days to make them all. But during that time, I took care of 100 other things that needed done. Finally, for the price you paid . . . I would have done the same thing.

@spartan456

3 жыл бұрын

@@BaradaNels Something worth mentioning, a lot of these higher end stations actually calibrate the tip automatically. The T12/T15 tips from Hakko for example all have a barcode on the very end of them. On the FM-202, you can slide the tip's barcode end into a port on the station, and after a second or two it will recalibrate to a new profile specifically for that tip. It's actually super fancy. But yeah, I can see what you're saying. If you wanted to ensure the tip is really working the way it's supposed to, you'd either have to get an external calibrator, or have a station like the FM-202 that can calibrate them automatically. If you don't have a station with built-in calibration, then you really won't be saving much time with the cartridge tips, since you'd have to use the external calibrator to check them anyway. RE the multitasking, this is actually what I like so much about the cartridge stations. At work I regularly use my old 888D (I bought it myself and brought it to work after I bought the FM-202). The thing about my job is I am almost constantly interrupted. I'll sit down to start something and 30 seconds later I could have to turn everything off, get up, and do something else like talk on the phone or help a walk in customer. The 888D is super incompatible with this kind of constant, interrupting workflow. I turn the station on, it warms up, I tin it up, then I have to stop. I turn everything off because I have no idea how long I'll be away, it all cools down. I come back to it 5 or 10 minutes later and have to wait for it to all warm up again, re-tin everything, and hope I can solder what I need to before I get interrupted again. The 202 on the other hand warms up in less than 10 seconds. If I have to shut my 202 off to go do something it's not that big of a deal, it'll be ready to go again in a negligible amount of time. I would have to say that my biggest complaint is these types of irons have been around since, like, the late 80's and early 90's. They've been patented for at least 30 years, but there are VERY FEW consumer level irons that utilize the technology. With how long these irons have been around I would think that there would be way more consumer level ones that are cartridge based, but there just aren't that many at all. In fact, the only one I can think of is the PACE ADS200. And that is still $100 more than what I spent on the used FM-202. I was really happy to see a cartridge station appear in that price range because it's still pretty affordable, albeit on the high end. It would be great if more companies would do the same thing. Cartridge irons have been around for decades, there's no reason they should still be confined to $500+ stations.

@BaradaNels

3 жыл бұрын

@@spartan456 www.ebay.com/c/1331539188 Found an FM-202 for only 180 on ebay. Seller seems reputable. I will consider it. I still don't think my workload would ever require that . . . but having another iron on backup and taking my 888D to the office sounds like a good idea. Would need to buy another exhaust fan too. So another 50. We'll see. It's obviously a quality iron.

@androiduberalles

2 жыл бұрын

My 888 is working great for my hobbyist level stuff I wonder what a little aluminum foil would go between the heater and the tip. I'm not gonna try it but would be interesting to see if it helps conduction.

In my country, the FX-951 costs around $450 after tax, while the FX-888D is $170 after tax. Also, price isn't the only thing. When it comes to soldering stations, you might want to buy something that's not going to set your house on fire. You might want to buy something with a warranty. You might want to buy something that will last a while.

@mr.simulator4724

6 ай бұрын

sometimes you want to buy something that can actually solder.

I just use a bic and bendy straws to solder my work

@InvidiousIgnoramus

6 жыл бұрын

Dillon Nollid wait, you don't use a candle? You're fancy.

@cameronsmith5968

6 жыл бұрын

I use hot glue #Lifehack

@KX36

6 жыл бұрын

I just phone a premium rate number and breathe heavily on my solder joints.

@NoMoreBsPlease

6 жыл бұрын

Dillon I use a pencil and a wall charger.

@DannyGruesome

6 жыл бұрын

No More BS Please poppin them sockets huh? Lmao

The old technology stations are still worlds better than a $20 iron that just plugs into the wall. I use the hakko fx888 every day at work with no issues. It heats up in a reasonable amount of time for what I do. I also have one at home that is overkill for home use. So maybe it’s just because I’ve never used a new technology station, but I have absolutely no issues with the fx888. Plus replacement soldering tips are relatively cheap and readily available. Although now I would like to use a new station just so I could really see how big of a difference it makes.

@310shadow310

11 ай бұрын

Which station do you use? I'm looking into getting one

I have a old-style Weller Magnastat station, and i am totally satisfied with it. Not the most fancy thing ever, but it is extremely reliable. I got this thing from a company i worked at over 10 years ago, and the company had used it for 10 years before that. Only thing i had to change in all those years were some tips, and since the tips don't have the heating element in them they are very cheap and can be swapped out in seconds.

With Celsius you can use decimals for more precision where it's needed, but the scale reference points are what makes it better imho: 0 is freezing water, 100 is boiling water. You can easily gauge a temperature based on those limits, and even more precisely knowing that 37°C is body temp & 50 is sunny desert. In Fahrenheit every reference point is random numbers: 96°F is internal body temp, 32°F is freezing water, 212°F is boiling water etc

@mjc0961

4 жыл бұрын

Fahrenheit excels for outdoor weather. 0 is freaking cold, 100 is freaking hot. Whereas Celsius devolves into random numbers here: the same range is -17 to 37. A scale based around water's phase changes is useless for weather and human comfort. For everything else, sure. Celsius all the way. But weather in Fahrenheit or GTFO.

@RayRay-mv9wn

4 жыл бұрын

​@@mjc0961 0°C gives great gauge of weather, if it goes under zero, you must expect snow or frozen rain instead rain, ice on roads etc.

@NytronX

4 жыл бұрын

@@mjc0961 Well said, I agree completely. With that said, I wish we would use the metric system for distance type of measurements.

@bencze465

3 жыл бұрын

@@mjc0961 -17 doesn't really differ from -16 or -18 in terms of comfort. There's no threshold there, or at 37 either. Sure it's fun to have barrels (32 gallons? depends which barrel after all it's different for wine or beer), fingers (7/8 inch, how intuitive) or even knots but it's not very practical, and even amusing how some try to hang onto these. I mean I like steam machines, but they belong in a museum...

@tedsmart5539

3 жыл бұрын

@@bencze465 We talking Imperial gallons or US gallons???

When looking for a source of the knockoff Hakko FX-951 I came across a number of even simpler and cheaper stations that seem to use the new technology, with quick heat-up times etc.. the nice thing is that they are even cheaper.. The common name I found is T12, which seems to be the type of tip connector/handpiece they use.

@Louis Rossmann -- for PACE tweezers the "old tech" TT-65 are the ones where the handle gets hot -- there's special grips (which they should have installed by default instead of selling separately) available to mitigate this. The MT-100 cartridge tip tweezers don't have that problem that I'm aware of.

This guy is great! Got to love a tech guy with a personality-that simply talks no bs talk!

Louis, have you tried the TS100? That thing is an absolute beast. It's marketed as portable, so you can power it from a battery or just a wall-wart. Even compared to full-fledged stations, it's still very impressive. Great example of where technology is at nowadays, and anything less for higher price is simply disappointing.

@samdeur

6 жыл бұрын

After hearing Louis talk about the heating element being in the tip i thought about the TS100 that could be a great option for someone like me that wants to solder his own keyboard and perhaps later on repair small electronics. Check out Marco Reps where he compares it whit a Weller Like Louis he mentions the heating element around 03:45 kzread.info/dash/bejne/epumpJeJXdWqfNo.html

@samdeur

6 жыл бұрын

only thing that's missing is a nice low cost desoldering iron. The Hakko FR-301 is €300 i could go for the "aoyue-8800" that one is €165 even the larger Aoyue 474A++ is €179 instead of the more expensive Hakko FR-301.. De soldering is full size keyboard with a hand solder sucker seems a nightmare..

@cowwels

6 жыл бұрын

I have TS100 and i will not buy another iron for a long time. I pay $50.

@samdeur

6 жыл бұрын

do you use it for longer period say 1,5 hours ?? doing a large project?

@cowwels

6 жыл бұрын

I use it all day long, but at max 10 min. each soldering. More than that heat is transfer to the iron body. It is just 'incovenient' but hold it for an hour must be unconfortable...

I've used Pace, JBC, Metcal myself. All can get a bit warm after extended periods of use. Some Hakko irons even come with thicker 'antibacterial' rubber grips to counteract that, just like Pace has them for the TD-100, and JBC for the T245.

No real problems with the FX-888D for a starter station, hell, some people may want to solder for crafts rather than electronics repair, for example, and something like an FX-888D is perfect for that purpose, if not overkill, and it's also fine for the hobbyist-level or low-volume electronics repair operations for which it was intended.

Louis, for CD stations from JBC (cheapest ones) you can connect both type of handpieces t245 (standard size) and t210 (for microsoldering), like you did with fx951

...but the 386 has a TURBO-Button! =)

@InvidiousIgnoramus

6 жыл бұрын

jiddschdr Turbo down clocks the CPU anyway.

@JohnCena-iw2vk

6 жыл бұрын

depends on the settings.

@johnfrancisdoe1563

6 жыл бұрын

jiddschdr The 386 doesn't suffer from Spectre/Meltdown like the Pentium II and later.

@KX36

6 жыл бұрын

doesn't matter that the turbo button turned down the clock to 4.77MHz. It was a button that said "turbo" on it and in the 80s-90s, that made anything awesome. :)

@captainbodyshot2839

4 жыл бұрын

@@johnfrancisdoe1563 A security risk that no one has ever taken advantage of in the real world is a small price to pay for instruction pipelining

yeah, but the JBC is so good for flexing on the gram

6:38 Haha - So weird seeing my comments on one of these vids. It's tough to convey to people about what it's like using a "direct-heating" soldering station vs the older style with a separate heater. Until I used a Metcal at work (about 15 years ago), I'd used many of the usual brands of iron, from Antex to Weller, including the cheapo mains irons and the expensive stations with big chunky transformers that heated up much faster. But, I then used the direct-heat Metcal stuff for an hour or so per day, and I've never looked back. I couldn't really justify the cost of a brand-new station for home use at the time, so I bought a second-hand SP-200 for only around £70 on eBay (including a chisel tip, handpiece, and stand). A few years later, I then saw an MX-500 station for only around £100 on eBay, and couldn't resist. That was more than ten years ago now, and the MX-500 is STILL going strong. The tips cost around £11-16 on average, but last easily 4 years or more if taken care of, which is much longer than most of the cheap mains irons last (at a similar cost to a new Metcal tip). It's easy for people to say it's somehow "elitist" to champion the direct-heat stuff, and yes, they do cost a fair bit more new, but I guess you would have to try one for a few weeks to see the light. :p Something like that 951 looks ideal at around $250, and I reckon it would pay for itself in no time. So yes, IMHO, I would say that the extra $100-150 for a direct-heat soldering station is worth every penny. I don't think I'll ever go back to using the older style iron. That's especially true if you don't mind buying second-hand, as the stations are generally very robust and reliable, so it's well worth taking a chance on one, as long as you're not relying on it for "mission critical" use. I sold two of my previous Metcal / OKI stations to friends over 4 years ago, and those stations are also still working great, even with the same original tips that were included.

@electronash

6 жыл бұрын

Oh, wow, I hadn't even seen Dave's follow-up reply of "2nd-hand doesn't count" yet, as I just got back from a weekend break. So, thanks for making a better point, Louis. lol You're right - I would also much rather use a $100 knock-off station or second-hand direct-heat, OR just pay the extra $150 for something like the genuine Hakko 951 than use the older style tech, any day of the week. I kind of expected some of the sillier replies on Dave's vid when I first posted on there, but I would bet that at least 60% of those people have never used both types of soldering tech over many years in both a production environment and at home before forming their opinions. I don't think I'm too biased either, as I'd used all sorts of cheap AND very expensive soldering stations for many years before settling on a direct-heat system for personal use. At the four different electronics factories I worked at (Nortel, Bookhams, AVX, and Syntech), they used the direct-heat stuff almost exclusively (Weller, Pace, Metcal / OKI, JBC etc.). I think that says a lot. lol

I have the JBC and it is possible to change the iron out. It has a DIN (or similar looking) connector at the back

I just use a cheap $20 60 watt soldering iron from eBay. Been using it for almost 10 years.. It gets to full temp in less than 10 seconds. As a hobbyist, why would you need any quicker? Maybe if I was doing board repairs for a living I would get a "modern" soldering iron. But I honestly don't care if the heating element is built into the tip.

Goot soldering stations use the cartridge tips too. It would be great to have your impressions on them. There's a model that offers dual ports, with one being a high-output - 150W if I remember.

Solid reasoning to backup solid skills, your strategic vision is admirable.

In my experience i was able to use a t210 iron on a t245 station(the "older" i guess CD type without a cover in the brass barbed wire)

I do have a question though. I burn through tips quite often. How much would you pay for a tip, that is just a tip that you put over your element, vs a tip, that has an element built in? The iron I actually use most often is an Antex XS25. it's a stick a plug in a socket and go, not even temperature controlled.

Louis, I suggest You look into Quicko T12-952 It's the c heapest soldering iron, which uses hakko tips, has a motion detector in the handle to put it to sleep after few minutes, better interface and an oled display for less than 50 $$$$$, I'm using it in my repair shop for 4 months now and for this price I can't imagine it getting any better.

Soldering stations are like welding machines. Most hobbyists don't know even expensive industrial welding power sources are treated as "consumables" in production and especially construction. They exist to join metal and that they produce sufficient number of proper joints for their cost that is all that matters. Either machine needs only to last long enough and produce enough quality joints! Pace make nice stuff but for the cost you could equip most of a workbench, get going, and should they wish to buy a Pace they can AFFORD them. There isn't a hell of a lot inside a Pace or anything else. I just dissected a dead one to save the case for a project box and while the components are clearly industrial quality and I can afford one I will not be buying from them because that extra money will put much more equipment on my workbench! The high price delta means a customer can have a ready spare and still have change left over.

I bought a used Pace HW-50 (50w soldering station) for around 70$. It uses those tips with heating element integrated in them, you can still buy the tips for around 10$ each at reputable distributors. I also have an original Hakko 936 - the benefit of those Hakko 888 is that they're basically refreshes of Hakko 936 (while officially tips are different in practice you can still use tips for hakko 936 including cloned tips you can find on ebay at x dollars for 10pcs set)

You can also build your own JBC station, just buy the tipholder and tip for 100$, build the rest yourself for 100$ and you have a JBC feel and quality for 200$.

@androiduberalles

2 жыл бұрын

You have to include the value of your time in that though.

This new technology might be interesting, but I will keep my cheap (~40€) ZD-937. It needs a little bit longer to heat up, but it will do the job it has to do. I have gotten 3 machines for less than the one you recommended. ZD-937 (~40€), Desolderingstation ZD-915 (~80€) and a hot air station 858D+ (30€).

As someone with not-so-steady hands, i love me some Metcal MX-500. It has the shortest tip i have seen and makes things very easy for me, while with the regular length tips, i could not solder nearly as good.

"If you're holding them for, you know, five or ten or twenty minutes, they may start to kind of burn your hands" I've got an Aoyue and even it doesn't do that.

@super5oldier139

3 жыл бұрын

I don't want to disappoint him, but I've never heard of this problem

Still ended up getting an FX-888D.. Something about high temperatures and knockoff brands doesn't sit well with me

I use the seeed mini soldering iron, any thoughts or experience? I'm only casual so I love it, especially how fast it heats up.

this is really helpful, since i can use the sweet Pace(mbt350, and the hot tweezers never burn our hands) rig at work, i want something better at home and want something cheaper than the full out station. while i like the pace, i am not married to a brand yet. the MBT 350 has 3 channels, our set-up uses one for the iron, one for the hot air or the solder sucker, and one for hot tweezers. this put 3 devices in one unit and helps with bench space.

I had the JBC stand alone station, you can use different handles micro and the bigger one.

a good budget soldering station is KSGER T12, it uses hakko 951 tips and soldering iron and can be found for around $50

JBC NANE Station, is this NT105 Nano Handpiece good for working with macbook mainboards - have enough power to soldering big ground pads etc?

I have a 50+ year old Weller station (well older than me) with the 4 prong offset plug. It was originally in the navy, then spent time in a lab and now its on my desk (I'm the 3rd owner). I used it the other day and found that something wasn't right. Either an element or the magnastat is going out. I get a good hr of use before it starts to malfunction. Model # TCP-1. I hop to fix it up as my de-solder rig. It still has the de-solder bulb attachment, chisel scraper and dip remover. Due to it's age, I'm not going to trust it with my MCU projects but i like using really old stuff in every practical way.

What's the cost of the tips and how often do you need to replace them?

What I understand is, just wait 3 seconds with my old cheap soldering iron :) Without integrated tip to heater element

@ToumalRakesh

6 жыл бұрын

Sure. But now solder a big chunky connector. Integrated heater tips are just immensely superior. One thing I'd say about the JBC though is that it *still* has a better thermal capacity than the hakko IMHO. Your mileage may vary.

@bassome3000ify

6 жыл бұрын

Toumal Rakesh nice input 👍 it does make sense. After all it gets back to feasibility or worthiness

@ToumalRakesh

6 жыл бұрын

Absolutely. JBC is expensive, I love mine, but I honestly could've lived with the Hakko knockoff as well. The only real drawback is their user interface, which is terrible. "Alarm Clock Interface" indeed. A rotary encoder would be superior. Simple up/down buttons would've done the job. Like on the JBC. Thermal capacity may be bigger, but the question is whether it's $200 bigger...

@hellterminator

6 жыл бұрын

+Toumal Rakesh Put on a chunky tip and/or raise the temperature. Sure, it's not as good as a JBC with a high thermal capacity tip, but it'll get the job done. Of course if you're a professional that's an unacceptable waste of time, but if you're just a hobbyist, you can get by with $30 Hakko knockoff.

@thetechgenie7374

6 жыл бұрын

I prefer the weller but the WX series. Just due to also work on a lot of older stuff and well and having 200w is useful and built quality is better then the hakko I tried.

I still use a 30W Radio Shack iron made by Ungar (the one with the screw-on tips). WIth the fine tip (0.0625" chisel point) it does not take too long to recover between joints. With wider tips, even less. If I did as much soldering as you do, I'd probably want something better. This has caused me to consider a Hakko if I find myself needing a temperature-controlled station. Thanks for doing this.

In using a weller wlc100-and wouldn't mind upgrading/ updating(?) To a digital would you go for the weller1010na or the hakko fx888d? I'm not really interested in buying a knock off but stuck for days on the two I had mentioned... Any inputs would be great

I just want to know why Hakko sells the FX-950 analog station in every other marketing region EXCEPT for NA! They even show in the parts list, a 120v transformer, so it's not like they couldn't sell it here in NA.....

While it seems that is a pricey hot air station from Pace, I'd be interested in your thoughts on the Pace ADS200, which also appears to compete with the JBC and Hakko 951.

I have a Weller 1010NA and I love that thing. Mine heats up really fast and always works great. Mind you I am not a professional but it far exceeds my usages.

If you have a good sensor position and know your system, you can get a very close temperature control on the "old" technology. You just have to avoid simple regulator types. Edit: Time to reaching the 350°C target temperature is mostly defined by the power of the reating element... So JBC implemented stronger heating elements. Great.

I have an Atten 980d that I use for a lot of through hole stuff, it heats up quickly (much quicker than those in Dave’s video), the tips work fine and cost very little... but I also have a Metcal MX 5241 which is a noticeable step up but with more costly consumables. I actually picked the Atten up as a cheap backup iron but I actually have both in use and setup for different jobs.

@homersimpson9257

6 жыл бұрын

I have the same as you. But i just regret that a little. I bought some tips but the tips of the hakko one of louis are much better. So this Atten works well despite the old technology but the tips aren’t perfects. When it will get money back of using it, i will buy the hakko one.

@Si1983h

6 жыл бұрын

Homer Simpson it uses the same tips as the Hakko 888d but I’ve actually found the temperature stability to be superior to the Hakko (the Atten 980 has a dedicated temperature sensor (unlike the cheaper but identical looking Atten irons). The Metcal will always be better (it shouldn’t be at £900) but the Atten still gets use!

@stinkycheese804

6 жыл бұрын

Please quit overusing the word actually. Thank you.

@homersimpson9257

6 жыл бұрын

Stinky Cheese « Love Actually is everywhere » Hugh Grant

@Si1983h

6 жыл бұрын

Stinky Cheese okay... actually on second thoughts...

I have an fx888D and it works just fine. I had a shitty $15 iron before and it’s a major upgrade. Besides the tips are nice, last long and are easy to replace.

Would you get the $100 Chinese Hakko knock off or the $50 KSGER that can use hakko tips, can be modded to use JBC irons and has a better UI?

Hi Louis, would you consider reviewing one of the Quick 202D stations? They are similarly priced at ~$130 and they aren't knockoffs.

Thanks Louis,,,, I really like the honest tips you give on tools,,,,, It really helps I've had some really bad irons.... but i love this one..... Thx Man

These days you can buy lots of different controllers for T12-T15 hakko tips for around 20 USD or less. Kits to build a small soldering station (box, encoder, connectors, a tip and holder) can be had for about 35 USD. You need a power supply, but still, over-all you can have Hakko soldering quality for about 50USD or maybe less. You can also buy fake Hakko tips for about 3USD/piece and they work amazingly well! I have several of them and for a hobbyist, this is more than enough. The TS100 is even a better package with a much smaller desk footprint and perhaps better ergonomic!

Back in the ancient days I used a Weller workstation with a little temp dial and a pencil iron with chisel slug tip, and it would solder heavy 16 gauge wires into sockapex stage lighting connectors, all day long. 24 wires per connector. And the English fractional system is mostly far superior for too many technical reasons to list. We never should have gone metric. The reasons were mostly silly.

Another TS100 convert here, after owning two traditional soldering stations. The first thing I did after trying mine out was order another one to have a backup in case the unthinkable happens. I needed something that could do high power joints because I work a lot with drones (whose main power wires can easily carry 100+A), and once you crank up the temperature the TS100 *will* do them - which is nothing short of miraculous when you consider how tiny it is. And of course it's an excellent all-round iron, good for SMD work too if you order the special narrow tip.

@GlishaSo

Жыл бұрын

still on ts100 after 4 years ? or you founded something better ?

@fallingwater

Жыл бұрын

@@GlishaSo I now mostly run a KSGER T12. It's a fixed soldering station so a little more ergonomic for benchtop work, also it runs cheaper T12 tips. But I still have my two TS100 as backups and if I need to solder somewhere else. However, there is a better portable iron today - the Pinecil v2, effectively an evolution of the TS100.

@GlishaSo

Жыл бұрын

@@fallingwater ok cool i love to see that i am on same way i had 1 ts100 and before few months i purchased T12 and now using them both how i feel but yeah t12 have cheaper tips and its own power. nice yeah i saw pinecill v2 its sick but still i think i am good with this one and will wait maybe little more for it or not change it at all we will see :) and to be honest these days im fighting to find good soldering wire in EU idk. sometimes mechanic from ali is ok but still searching for good one. i had 250g old one loctite it was amazing but now idk if you have some rly good to recommend tell me :) tnx

The PACE rework station I use at work is excellent - but it cost NZ$3,500.

The complaints about not wanting to spend a couple hundred dollars due to poverty are, to me, a bit irritating. I'm on disability, and while I'm immensely grateful to my province for allowing me to not be dying slowly on the streets in complete abject poverty, I don't exactly have a wide margin of error in my personal budget. I have to contribute to supporting my family, pay for housing and all other expenses on a comparatively tiny amount of money, especially in a very expensive Canadian city. I have been putting away small amounts of money, once a month, in an envelope for almost a year and a half, since I started watching YT electronics videos and learning, from scratch, everything there is to know about both modern and 'antique' electronics. Most months, I'm able to save $20 or so, and with patience and mental resistance to spending the saved money, I'm within a few months of being able to put together a rudimentary lab and start playing with this stuff. Ideally, I hope to be able to make some of my own money with this knowledge (thanks to Louis) and support myself despite being unable to work a normal job due to major health issues. I understand I'm quite blessed to have a government willing to help me, and I also understand that even in more wealthy nations, there are many people in far worse poverty than I am. If you really want this, however, it is absolutely worth your time and a few dollars a month to save up slowly and patiently; the knowledge here is worth tons of money if properly applied, and if you've been wstching these videos from people like Louis and Dave Jones, you've been given a ticket to tons of profit with in detail explanations on every aspect of running this kind of business for absolutely free. In the not to distant past, all this knowledge available here on YT would have cost tens of thousands of dollars and at least four years in a university. If you are serious at all about this, even as a hobby, you can amass the money for gear that is slighty more expensive than the lowest hanging fruit, for a massive increase in quality; you even have access to detailed knowledge and reviews about these products here, again, for free. I know this will piss some people off who feel they still won't ever be able to afford this stuff, but I suggest anyone who feels they can't to just try putting a few dollars away each month. You'll be surprised how quickly it feels like you grow your savings and the end investment is absolutely worth it, even if it takes a few years.

@ian1352

3 жыл бұрын

The point is why spend two to three times as much on a soldering iron when the cheaper one will work just fine? Here the 951 is at least 2.5x as expensive as the 888. The 888 is already quite expensive by local standards. Budget variable soldering irons can be had for a quarter of the price. And they're what most people buy because even the cheapest Hakko is a luxury.

The FX-951 has a build in AMD FX CPU. Or how do you think it even reaches such temperatures?

I went for the JBC and happy i did.. cost me a lot of money but it will last me forever. The Hakko 951 is 368 euro here which is what the JBC cost so i went for the JBC.

I bought myself a used Metcal MX-500 (the old one without the display) for 150€, probably one of my best investments ever.

You can use any ripoff station because integrated tips are great, even just a cheap "12-24v 75w mini adjustable handle," which I use with a solar panel for outdoor soldering.

This was really helpful. I have a low budget (I'm a teenager with a min. wage job) and I was about to buy an fx-888 instead of a hakko t12 tip station made by a company called KSGER but now I think I will change my mind. I guess I was more motivated by the hakko brand name than anything else.

@CompGuy66

2 жыл бұрын

I would say go for the KSGER T12 tip station. I am a university student who has been using a cheap $20 soldering iron for over 10 years and I finally decided to look into a better soldering station. I honestly wish I knew about the KSGER and other affordable t12 tip compatible stations earlier. I thought that good soldering stations still cost $250+ so I just stuck with my $20 station which would take forever to heat up and only has one tip making it impossible to work with anything that has a lot of densely packed pins. Only recently did I discover that there are a lot more options on the market. I honestly feel so dumb that I put up with cave man era tools instead of finding the time to do some research.

@joshbryant1133

2 жыл бұрын

@@CompGuy66 thanks for the comment. I got it a couple months ago and I'm LOVING it. It takes, at most, 5 seconds to warm up. And the tip to handle distance is fantastic. My only issue is the temperature fluctuates a little (±5 degrees) but that might be my fault because I tried to calibrate it and I didn't know I needed a soldering iron thermometer. Other than that it's a fantastic piece of kit.

The hakko fk888 is a very high quality soldering station for a hobbyist. these fancy technology soldering stations may be better for professional work but I'm not certain the average Joe who does soldering here and there would benefit much from investing in that.

Another great "new technology" station is the KSGER T12 station. If you get one that's from Ksger, not Shine now or Quecoo, I think you'll be very happy, because I know I am

The only problem is, where do you find the *good* clones? There are at least just as many, if not more, bad clones out there. How do you know you're going to get a good one, even if you do find the listing? People who make cheap knockoffs have no incentive to make sure they're not going to burn your house down.

Do the Pace stations have the heating element and sensor integrated with the ceramic?

If the heating element is in the tip, how much does the tip cost? I have an old Weller and the Radio Shack Model that is actually a Hakko that uses their tips. Both have separate heaters. The size of the tip is the most important point. The more massive joints require the larger tips. The Radio Shack model was useless because it only had the tiny tip that could not transfer the heat to any joints unless the joint had little area to heat. Lucky for me the Hakko tips worked just fine.

It makes sense. Most of these older tecgnologies had _at least_ two seperate objects' surfaces interfacing before reaching the tip, and _at least_ a good inch of materials+layers between the thermal sensor and tip. As thermal energy build in or drain from the tip, it takes a good while for the sensor to know that. With age and use, inner surfaces (those you can't easily service) of heater elements, tips, mounting parts - they wear and oxidize, causing decreasing surface contact and thermal conducticity. With all this baked into one part, we (to most extents) eliminate these oxidation issues, we can better control galvanic contact, and we can move both the heating element amd thermal sensors riiight up there where we need it. As an added bonus to hobbyists who favor the Hakko route, some knock-off tips have gotten seriously good for a very affordable price, and the Quicko / KSGER / Insert-(re)brand-here T12 stations have also gotten pretty dope for $40'ish with the cheapest handle and a few T12 tips, or another 15-20 with an onboard PSU. There are the self-contained irons like the TS80 and 100, although personally I perfer one that is more ergonomical and plays better with T12 tips (because of cost and availability).

What do you think about the chinese TS100 soldering iron? I bought this as a hobbyist and for only 56$ you get a soldering iron with the heater in the tip with new tips costing around 12$. So far I can't complain about it tho i can't imagine that as a professional it's ideal.

I am waiting for a t12 soldering iron to arrive, I will most likely have to mod it (it depends on how the chinese fab house does it), but it costs 1/10 of the hakko and takes the same cartriges as the hakko and based on some videos it does quite a good job.

What's your opinion on Metcal stuff? I only ask because at work, I use a Metcal SP200 for production soldering.

Could you please compare ts100 to 951?

Louis , I want to thank you for all the things I've learned with you, you are a great teacher!...but sometimes you repeat so many times the same thing that I fall into sleep :)

If you have a good iron, even the ceramic heater type with separate tips, you will not have slumping. Temp control is important, and most lower cost irons don't have the best. For most users, a variation of several degrees isn't likely going to cause a problem though. If you want tight temp control you have to spend more on the iron... I have used the Pace MBT and PRC 2000, they never slumped in temp when working lots of connections. Cheaper Hakkos are not at the same level. They are fine for consumer grade light use though. If I am working professionally, with soldering being a primary focus of my work, I am spending extra money on my iron, $350-400ish in the low end. Thats not set in stone but a benchmark, there may be good ones that are a bit less. A cheap knock off iron may heat up quick, but have poor temp control, that varies. If I even had someone turn up my iron to anything over 700*F I would kick them. You can do everything you need to do at 600*F max. My level of training... I can fix bullet holes in multilayer circuit boards. With the soldering standards of NASA use for space flight. There is no such thing as allowable tolerances in that standard. (Well at the time of my training, it may have changed in the past decade or so since my training) F vs C... Both are fine. If you are worried about the difference between 1*F and 1*C you're priorities are off. For soldering you don't need that fine of adjustment. You will usually make changes of several degrees at a time, so 10*F vs a change of 5*C I use F simply because I am used to it, and familiar with it. C would work fine if I was familiar with the scale. Pace makes good stuff, they are very expensive... If you use a nice Pace, even with the ceramic heater with separate tips, you would see the difference between them and similar Hakkos. Pace was the only soldering station I was allowed to use when working military aviation, as they were temp stable to within a single degree I believe, vs a Hakko which is something like 5-6*... Hot tweezers... Have you actually ever used the Pace version? You may not be understanding what they mean. Not saying that is the case. But they could mean constant 20min never stop use, but most would never do that. There are starts and stops. There is a lot to consider when selecting a proper iron, that many might not think about.

I replaced all my soldering equipment recently I went with a Xytronic LF-1660ESD with curie heat technology it's a dual station and it comes with a micro pencil and micro soldering tweezers from Vetco Electronics delivered for $119.51 and then I bought the Quick 957DW+ hot air station from Adafruit for $112.96 so for $235 basically for all new equipment I feel like I got a hell of a value for the money.

I just brought a JBC CD-2BE Soldering Station to replace my £9.49 Silverline 100w, and to my amazement the JBC is a wast of time! it could not solder 2mm solid copper wire to 0.3x25mm Nickel! The JBC has 130w but its not up to the job, I build EV's so I solder 2AWG and solid 2mm copper daily. What I'm thinking is wrong with all the newer irons is they don't have any mass to retain the heat, and the temps are far to low, I like my iron at 550-600C.

I just bought the Hakko and it's by far the most impressive soldering station I've ever used . It's ridiculously good.

IMO, all irons, even in the $100 price range, should use tip cartridges. They don't seem to cost more to make. I repair music equipment, older guitar amps with point-to-point wiring, old thru-hole PCB's and some newer, smaller stuff. I've been using a Weller EC1002 station for 25-30 years. I want to get a new iron with faster recovery. Considering the FX-951. Also, I'm wondering how the new Pace ADS200 will be? The FX-951 is 75W. The Pace is 120W which for my use, may be better with higher thermal mass tips. The Hakko comes with a setback stand which is optional for exta cost with Pace. Do I need a setback stand? Probably not.. The Pace will sleep after 10 minutes. The Hakko is hugely popular with parts availability galore. Will the Pace become popular? BTW, the transformers used in Pace are Chinese made. A lot to consider. I think I'll wait for the reviews of the new Pace station before deciding.

Thank you for not buying into the hype. I thought you were going to promote it. But as a user of the old style hakkos. All I really care about is that it just works.

great video Louis, I've not spent $256 on all the irons I own and 4 I've had over thirty years, I have about 8 irons and the dearest is a $50 weller, I'd like to afford better irons but so far the ones I've got have done everything I need, ok it may take a minute to heat up but hopefully I'll live around 80 years so 1 minute is fine

Interestingly, the even older tecnology was Weller Magastat where the heating element is separate but the sensor is the tip, because it senses the temperature based on the magnetic properties of the alloy uesd in the tip.

People I know don't normally spend money on the hot air station, they just buy the rework station that has supplies for air and vacuum. The MBT-301 and MBT-350 being the primary two for all-in-one units.

Louis after hearing you talk about the heating element and the tech behind it. i wanted to ask you about the TS100 OpenSource portable soldering iron. it uses the same tech you mentioned here.. if i understand you correctly buying that $66 soldering iron would be better than a FX-88D. my use case is soldering a couple of mechanical keyboards getting in to the hobby.. Here's a nice vid about the TS100 it stars getting interesting around 01:35 Would love to hear your opinion perhaps even try one out ?????

@tunahankaratay1523

4 жыл бұрын

The only problem of TS100 is the difficulty of grounding the tip. But if you invest some time, it will be fairly ok.

lol @ $100 station. As a hobby guy I'm using a $12 ceramic core style amazon china iron. I finally know part of the reason I've been struggling so much.

In other other words: it's like trying to fix a water leakage by keeping removing the leaked water from the pavement, when the actual solution would be to fix the cracked pipe. "Cracked pipe" - being the current competition based "economic" system/"laws".

8:30 Thats strange to see. I have the FX888D and it gets up to temp waaaaay faster than that. When you tell it to go up to 750 degrees (F) from nothing, it gets up there in like 3 seconds.

@DemonKingOFFICIAL

3 жыл бұрын

It’s not ultra quickly. It’s just faster than this.

Any word on the PPD 861D? Meaning: is it just a knockoff of the Quick 861DW, or is it really the "newer release" or "same product assembled in a different factory" as many sites claim? There's about a $100 difference in the two, with the PPD selling for ~$200 and the Quick for ~$300. They look very similar, but there are obvious minor differences.

Try TS100 please!!!!

I picked up the HAKKO FM-2028 handle for 30 bucks and homebrewed the station out of old junk I had lying around and it outperformed my FX-888

South Park “they took our jobs” hahhahaha

Hey Louis now there is a Diy For T12 Soldering Station try search on ebay or gearbest or china online shop you should check that , but i dont know if that diy station is suitable for professional use , why not you tell me what did you think about cheap diy t12 station

Rather than spending the 100 bucks on a knockoff chinese hakko 951, I'd spend the money on the excellent TS100 soldering iron, which is an ideal low cost soldering iron for hobby use. Paired with a 24V DC power supply, it's very powerful at 65W and can handle just about anything you throw at it. I've done fine soldering and soldering of heavy gauge wiring with it, and it performs very well. For everyday use in a professional environment I'd spend a bit more on the soldering iron of course, but for your typical DIY hobbyist which needs a versatile iron that can handle a variety of different soldering applications, the TS100 is a very good and cheap choice, and is better built than the typical chinese knockoff stations.

@therealb888

6 жыл бұрын

Skauber I feel so bad I didn't buy the TS100 before now it's $100. I remember it being 30-40$ 😢

@Skauber

6 жыл бұрын

Depends on which bundle and where you buy it. Aliexpress still has it for 65$ (free shipping, depending on your location) including two tips, but no power supply, or even 56$ with one tip. Here's one example, even has a box, which is the same I purchased: www.aliexpress.com/item/TS100-Mini-Digital-Electric-USB-Smart-Adjustable-Soldering-Iron-Set-with-2-Solder-Iron-Tips-K/32839724274.html?spm=2114.search0104.3.83.17e45b8fXcEshP&ws_ab_test=searchweb0_0,searchweb201602_4_10152_10151_10065_10344_10068_10342_10343_5722611_10340_10341_10696_5722911_5722811_10084_5722711_10083_10618_10307_5711211_10059_308_100031_10103_10624_10623_10622_10621_10620_5711311_5722511-10152,searchweb201603_25,ppcSwitch_3&algo_expid=0fc66160-5188-4d6b-a8a3-c92e6989b1bc-11&algo_pvid=0fc66160-5188-4d6b-a8a3-c92e6989b1bc&priceBeautifyAB=0

The 50$ TS100 (available on ebay and aliexpress) uses the same technology and is very compact.

What's the old and new technology called? How am I supposed to know if the soldering station I'm looking at has the new tech?

i use a soldering iron about once a month, my weller wlc100 does fine for me, and it is only 40 bucks.

The ERSA i-Tool is pretty much the best of both worlds... Separate heating-element and Tip but with the Sensor placed very close to the tip. Kinda sad that they aren't more popular outside of Europe because they do make some quite nice tools. www.farnell.com/datasheets/57060.pdf

I bought a station kit from ebay for 27 bucks, uses modern cartridge "tips", made a power supply for it and voila! Really makes a difference. Heats up in 9 seconds, convenient.

@therealb888

6 жыл бұрын

MrJohhhnnnyyy Hey pls pls give me a link to buy it. Is it temperature controlled with feedback?. Pls reply.

@mrjohhhnnnyyy5797

6 жыл бұрын

b888 You can find the link below the video on my channel "t12 kit review". If I'm gonna whack the link right here, this response might go straight to spambox. You won't see it at all, I've been there.

i use pace desoldering irons because they are the best i have ever used also they have had the element built into the tip since like 1983. i will say the pace tips don't last as long as they should though.

JBC - BT-2BWA is 10€ chaper then FX-951 in EU

An almost criminally deceptive graph at the beginning where you are required to notice that the y-axis on the first graph is 20-350 whereas on the second it's 280-350. The second graph's yawning chasms would appear as small bumps on the first's steady state line.

@Monkeh616

6 жыл бұрын

You're also required to notice one is for heating time from cold and one is for maintaining set temperature under load.. It's not deceptive if you can read.

@rossmanngroup

6 жыл бұрын

It is as I called it enemy propaganda, I just loaded it up to make a point

@LemoUtan

6 жыл бұрын

+Monkeh - fair enough. Although Mr Rossman had already explained that 'propaganda'. It's the kind effected by the juxtaposition of those graphs as a visual montage - Eisenstein'n'all that. Nothing to do with text (which I can manage adequately, thanks).

@nexaentertainment2764

6 жыл бұрын

Not just that, but the irons recovery time is *gasp* 5.5 whole seconds! Wow, what are you gonna do! Time is money! Chop chop, I lost 3 cents of my time just waiting here! Honestly it might important for a professional like Louis, but for most home users, hobbyists, or people not doing super heavy work, it's almost irrelevant. Better spend 2.5x as much on an iron that recovers 5.5 seconds faster! Yeah! Sound advice! Or just buy a knock-off station! Yeah! Honestly a knock off isn't a bad idea if you're just getting started. But you're still better off with genuine gear most of the time.

@KX36

6 жыл бұрын

it's not "deceptive", it's "statistics".

After watching a few reviews on youtube I've just bought a KSGER station that is compatible with the Hakko T12 tips and it is the most comprehensive solder station I have ever used and allows you to calibrate multiple different tips. Not only that, the solder pencil is way better constructed and much more reliable than the knockoff pencils which can be very intermittent. Also the Hakko user interface is totally brain dead and a real pain to use. I have two of those knockoff fx-951 stations and they have now been put back in their boxes and are now sitting in storage. But I agree the fx-951 and other direct heat technology is far superior to the old style heater element sense technology. But you forgot to mention Metcal which came out over a decade ago which I believe uses RF induction heating and curie temperature monitoring directly at the tip. Also I might add I have a PACE sens-a-temp iron and it has been my workhorse iron for more than a decade. PACE maybe expensive but it's still a good reliable quality product and I believe they have a new direct heat technology iron. I believe you should support your local manufacturing as much as you can because a service based economy repairing stuff won't carry an economy and make it prosperous. Only value adding can do this. The chinese know this and is why they are so keen to steal manufacturing jobs from anyone they can.