Thank You for doing this.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

All the stress and work is worth it thanks to awesome comments and supporters like you! We appreciate it.

I'm coming up on (1) year of riding the Pivot Shuttle SL XTR and I agree 100% it is blistering fast. All of my buddies I ride with have full fat bikes, unlocked Levos, and one is a Luna with 160nm bafang motor. All of them go beyond the 20mph limiter. On some of the climbs I have to work hard to keep up, but when we get to flat or downhill sections good luck catching me on the Shuttle. We got to the point where they always want me to go 1st on the downhills we ride lol. Amazing bike when used for the right purpose. The team at Pivot have been incredible to deal with on a couple small issues and I also got to meet the guys from Fazua and they have been super helpful with some tuning. My bike is a large and weighs 40.5 lbs ready to ride. Hard to beat, literally. Expensive but it was worth every penny in my opinion. Great review!

@simony2801

18 күн бұрын

Far too expensive.

How would the new Santa Cruz Heckler SL compare to the top bikes you had (the Trek, Pivot, and Transition)? Thanks!

@duffyrides

8 ай бұрын

This is what I was hoping to hear about as well. Hopefully they release a video that addresses this soon.

This really cements my opinion of the transition as my next bike. Thank you guys so much for doing this shootout!

Great work on this series! I think this category is the gateway for those of use who started out on analogs but where life gets in the way of all day grind fests. For me, the ebike is a time machine, allowing more laps and more smiles. It also levels the playing field for those that are not as athletic. Not to feed into too much confirmation bias, but I bought a Relay PNW edition a few months ago after doing my own research and am so happy I did. You didn’t touch on my other use case for the Relay which is popping out the battery and hitting up the bike park. It’s so good!

Awesome video and literally covered just about every popular motor. Congrats Transition!!!! They make the best bikes hands down.

Exceptional work guys. In producing these it must take so much time and patience (and insect repellent!) It's massively appreciated and great to watch. 👏🏿👏🏿👏🏿

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you very much! And yes. We got 6 stings during the week! Not fun haha.

My Relay is finally coming next week ! Great vids Guys. You just assured me that I’ve made good choice ordering Relay back in February. Cheers 👍😀

Knowing nothing about light e mountain bikes, the presentation and content of this video was excellent. I learned a lot. Thanks guys!

@TheLoamWolf

4 ай бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it! Thanks for watching.

Great roundup! Thanks for the excellent review and solid recommendations.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Much appreciated!

As someone who owns the Orbea Rise and a Santa Cruz Hightower, I’m getting the Specialized Levo SL. I’ve ridden the new Heckler SL, the Pivot Shuttle SL, and the Levo. The Pivot is really light, but feels more trail than downhill. The Pivot is gorgeous in the desert sage color with Kashima coat. I was tempted to but it for the looks alone😂. The Heckler is nice, but honestly the Fazua system feels dull and seems to have a serious delay applying power. The Levo SL to me felt perfect. Just enough power help nicely with the climbs, but not so much that it sacrificed any playfulness downhill. The bike feels like a Porsche 911 on trails, and a Troohy truck downhill. A definite quiver killer.

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing. We appreciate your input.

@jbatlanta

5 күн бұрын

Taking the rider's weight into consideration.....my 110lb girl rides the specialized levo SL mostly in eco(lowest) power, and kicks butt on the climbs. She refuses the high power settings as "uncontrollable" 😅

Great series! At the rate of ebike launches you'll have to do another round up in 6 months. Maybe do a series capping it at $8-9k/bike? Keep up the great work!

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

We are thinking of that for next year! It'll be rad to see how they perform.

I would have loved the Relay but went for the Shuttle SL back in February as I really needed something to get me back out after illness, having to remove the battery also put me off a bit. Glad I made a good choice as it was my first real experience of e-bikes (other than a trial on the Forestal that backs up everything you said). So far the Shuttle has done everything I could want . Quick blast on Rocket to 40 miles on breeze, gentle trails to full on Lake District epics. I've watched all the videos in this group and they are spot on, keep them coming.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you very much and stoked to hear that you like the Shuttle SL! It's a rad bike.

I went with the 9.7 EXe. For myself, I wanted something that felt as close as possible to a regular bike, quiet, but that provided a little help. I might have checked into some other rides had this video come out before I jumped in, but I'm still pleased with the bike regardless. Thanks for putting this together, looking forward to future reviews.

@user-os6mt2lf3p

3 ай бұрын

How you liking the 9.7, I'm looking at those as well.

@mikeriley1475

3 ай бұрын

@@user-os6mt2lf3p I'm extremely happy with it. For me, it provides an excellent compromise between a full power e-bike and an acoustic bike, where I get just enough assist to make longer rides more enjoyable.

@mikeriley1475

3 ай бұрын

@@user-os6mt2lf3p I love it. I ride it as much as I can, and only ride my regular bike about once a month or so as extra exercise. It's easily my favorite bike.

Great reviews!! Thanks for great reviews

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you for watching and the kind words! We appreciate it.

Thank you, appreciate this review.

@TheLoamWolf

6 ай бұрын

Glad it was helpful!

Owning a 2020 SC Heckler and pre-ordered a Heckler SL now… I‘m so ready for a lighter ebike! ❤

Great good guys!! I have a turbo levo gen 3 looking for a Sl and going probably on the light side. Going to be probably looking more with the fazua stuff it looks like better unite I think. Thanks for making my life easier.

Love the honest reviews, as always. I totally understand about being split down the middle. I have been riding my Shuttle SL since December and my girlfriend has had her Fuel Exe since July of 2022. Sometimes we switch bikes and can agree that while each other's bike is pretty nice, we both chose the right bike for us. Worth mentioning, neither one of us has had any issues. I would consider the Transition for additional stability. But, I can accomplish that by throwing on a coil, when I need to. Mainly, I don't want to have to remove the battery to charge it. Thanks, again.

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Awesome thank you so much!

This has to be the best light weight MTB round up ever done on you tube Loam Wolf rule ❤ LET'S GO

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you very much! We appreciate you.

Great review! Good to see you made adjustments to some of the the bikes power settings to get the best out of the bikes. Some manufacturer settings are a detriment to the proformance of the bikes for sure.

Any thoughts on how the Santa Cruz Heckler SL would have done in this shootout? Too bad it wasn’t released in time to make it into this comparison.

@moosicman101

4 ай бұрын

It would’ve won.

My home town 👍 stoked to see you guys shredding the trails.

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Awesome to hear!

Well done! Super nice shootout! 🙏🏻👍🏻👏🏻💪🏻

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you very much! We're glad you enjoyed it.

Watched & loved the whole series, now this final group review and just thumbs up! Nowhere did you mention (at least I didn’t catch it) the adjustability of the Nm on the Giant bike, it can be tuned down to 75Nm or 60Nm to save battery on longer days. I am a full size (fat) e-mtb owner looking to switch down into this newer SL category. Great series, thanks! 👍

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thanks and good point! It may have actually been in there and gotten edited out of the already long round table of rants. haha. But good point!

You guys did an amazing job on this series! I am trying to get my Dad to get an ebike. The orbea seems like it would be perfect for him.

Great roundup! Still looking forward to an in depth on the Heckler SL. I was all in on the Relay, but the lower builds are too heavy. The Heckler SL seems to fit the bill on the build I want. Looking forward to your take.

@jimm244

8 ай бұрын

Ditto. Word for word my exact thoughts.

@QuakFu

8 ай бұрын

Thats the problem with so many of these test bikes. They get sent the top spec and by the time you get the "average" persons build, they are 5 pounds heavier

I love these group tests, in depth reviews, slick video 👍 I have the H15 orbea with the Cascade 150mm link on pre order together with a 160 mm fork upgrade, it should make a great bike even better. This new crop of bikes just keep getting better. I’d take the Pivot so or the Transition 🤙🤙

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Awesome thank you! And enjoy your sweet new bike!

Thanks for this perfect video, 1 week ago I did buy the specialized turbo levo sl carbon 2023 with the new 1.2 motor. Got it for 7100 dollars my bike shop made me an offer i couldent say no to. Had the first ride on it last day. And what a play full bike, for me the power is more than enough and on the downhill Parts the bike feels so good.

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Great to hear! Congrats and enjoy your new bike.

Got a Relay on order for nest year. Can't wait! I do wish more brands made light EMTBs with removable battery though. Saves one from having both a E-bike and a meat-bike.

Great series once again. Down to earth review

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thanks very much!

Even my 35Nm KSL has allowed me as a family man to hit trails more often and still be home to cook dinner.

Had an older levo sl with less power. Loved the bike and hated the motor. Would consider a kenevo with newer motor. Thought about relay, but at 49 pounds, I should just get a levo expert. Thanks for showing, look forward to the show.

The chain discussion gets me even more excited about the gearbox ebikes with belt drives.

@jmanswat2457

8 ай бұрын

I have yet to break a chain on mine. I'm fairly confident most chains break because of shifting under load- and made even worse by the electric motor. Cycling and shifting fundamentals are essential for riding ebikes.

@burnx45

Ай бұрын

@@jmanswat2457 I have over 7,000 miles on my 2020 Specialized Turbo Levo and haven't ever broken a chain either. (4,300 miles on the original motor and 3,000 on replacement so far) I let off the pressure a bit before shifting. I have 2,000 miles on my SRAM XO 12 speed chain with no wear so far. I use Finishline Dry Lube on the chain after every ride if it's more than 20 miles. A lightweight ebike I'm interested in that is full power is the new Cannondale Moterra Carbon SL for $8,700. It's 43.4 lbs with a 600Wh battery and Shimano EP801 motor.

Great video series

Good review. All of these are great bikes. I did some testing of my own and was torn between the Giant and the Trek. I decided to go with the Giant for the price I paid, motor, and Live Valve suspension, which really seemed intriguing to me and couldn’t be happier. The versatility of the 85NM motor was what sold me, along with the great deal I got :-). It’s such a fun bike and as far as Live Valve is concerned, I think it’s a perfect match for this bike and once you get it dialed in and learn how to use it, it’s a fantastic system. No more forgetting to open the shock for the downhills like I sometimes do on my traditional pedal bikes :-) Shout out to The Path Bike Shop in OC, CA. Got my Giant there and the whole experience was awesome!

@TheLoamWolf

2 ай бұрын

Thanks so much for sharing and we’re stoked to hear you are loving the new bike.

I love that you have a lightweight shoot out to compliment the full power. On my end, in no way am I purchasing any of the most expensive of any brands bike, so I am looking for bang for the buck. Some of the hold ups in some of the bikes seem to be limited to the Top end bike (live valve, one piece bar/stem) so I am curious as who the "lightweight emtb overall winner" would be for those in the $7-$8k range. I currently have a 2019 Rocky Mountain Instinct PP. With the chain breaks, were lightweight chains in use? I am curious if it was decided to put lighter more expensive changes that would work great on an XC bike but not good for the e-bike.

Thank you for reaffirming my decision to but a full power e mtb. Went for an Orbea Wild no regrets with the power or weight.

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

You are welcome! haha. Glad you enjoy it.

This was a great series! Please do an in-depth series on lower cost bikes. I work at a Giant and Pivot dealer and can say that the Shuttle SL is excellent here in Minnesota where we do not have big climbs. Im sure the Giant would be excellent too BUT these are expensive bikes and many of us want a reasonably capable bike for much less money.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Great suggestion! We will work on that for sure!

Great review! Very curious how the new Hecker SL compares head to head with the Transition Relay?

@battleboardstudios6952

9 ай бұрын

Yeah hopefully the Loam wolf will give us their thoughts

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Very different due to the travel and plus feeling suspension of the Transition vs the Heckler SL. We've not had enough time on Heckler SL, which is a very fun bike, but let's just say since we're not the biggest VPP suspension fans, it wouldn't have taken away the awards given for most of our crew. Still a rad and playful bike and in the right terrain, it rips!

I agree with the bar/stem combo complaints. Great pointing out the chain weaknesses - any chains worth mentioning? I'm impressed with the Transition Relay (the base model) so much that I'm considering that over a Transition Patrol. The less expensive Trek and Levo SL might be runner-up options.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

We've had great luck with KMC chains so far.

I Will be buying in this segment, possibly this fall. The decision will probably be between the Relay and Heckler SL. I have a Hightower and a Sentinel and assume some of the ride quality differences will extend to the e-bikes. The Sentinel is a clear winner in the gnar, but the Hightower is more balanced and what I’d choose for a long day of varied terrain. Both are great. I have a frame warranty issue starting with the Sentinel, and how Transition does or doesn’t handle it will probably be the deciding factor. The Shuttle SL would be a contender, but I can’t get past the steep-ish geometry, given the type of riding I’m going to be doing. I may still visit Tempe for a factory demo though.

Full power is a handful on really steep, tight tech. Thinking about going down to an SL.

Great reviews gentlemen! I'm really hoping the new SRAM transmissions prove to have much better longevity on ebikes.

@OscarHernandez-xx2je

6 ай бұрын

Hopefully Pinion will become more mainstream

If you guys love the Relay, you should REALLY try the PNW version. It's everything you said and then some!

I really do love them all and would take any one of them , I've got a 21' sl with a Specialized shop just 20 mi from me , the choice was simple

Really good review thanks guys. You have helped me limit my choice to the Giant or the Transition. I read that the Giant had an annoying habit of resetting the power settings after each ride. Do you know if this has been rectified?

@Nickporter17

5 ай бұрын

That was resolved with firmware

really enjoyable vid!

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Thank you!

Great reviews. Like really good. Disappointed the Santa Cruz didn’t make it in the final video.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Yes we were bummed to not have it in time as well!

Great job 👏🏻

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you! 😁

Fantastic video, really appreciate all the thought and time put into this! However, I'm constantly frustrated when bike reviews are on team or top of the line packages. A $14k bike is not in the budget for 99% of people, so ultimately this video wasn't that helpful. Would love to see videos focused on models your audience can actually afford and would be interested in!

Without trying them, I was choosing between the Transition Relay and Propain Ekano and ended up with the Ekano. Would be epic to see a shootout between the Relay and the new Heckler SL :) Thanks for an epic video but, very entertaining and well put together compared to many other mtb shootouts.

@TheLoamWolf

7 ай бұрын

Thank you very much!

It would be really handy if you discussed the motors in a bit more detail. I used to have a Shimano EP8 powered e-bike and I really disliked how the power cut out really quickly at higher cadences. From memory I think it was any cadance over like 110rpm, the power would cut out completely which was horrible when you were going from a descent to a sudden climb and you shifted down to a lower gear pre-emptively so that when you hit the steep climb you could blast the cadance in a lower gear to get up the climb without losing too much speed with with the EP8 if I did this the motor would just go dead and would take way too long to kick back in so I would just lose all of my momentum. It was a horrible motor in that regard. It was quite torquey but didn't like high cadance so I think the EP8 was better suited to a lazy or old rider who wanted to just grind along at low cadance and let the bike do the work. I switched to the Bosch Gen 4 and it is SO much better. You can go up to insane cadance and the motor just keeps pushing. It really makes the experience that much better when you can blast a higher cadance for a couple of seconds in those scenarios and the motor is happy to comply. If I test rode any of these other motors and found that they behaved like the EP8 then it would be crossed off the list of potential purchases immediately.

First off, absoloutely awesome series. A question: Thoughts on which bike would be best to ride with non-ebikes? I have many friends/family who don't ride as often and would prefer to be on a lightweight e bike for a bit of a boost when coming on 'acoustic' pedals? They don't need max power output, just looking for a small boost. A quiet motor would probably be a major asset, not directly advertising to the rest of the group the situation.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you! The TQ and Fazua are certainly quietest bikes in the mix. HOwever the Fazua we rode in the new Santa Cruz was a bit louder than the Pivot Shuttle and Transition.

Great review, Thanks! I am demoing the Giant Elite +2 this week. I did not care for the non elite version, too heavy and not nimble enough.

@Nickporter17

5 ай бұрын

How'd the demo go? Did you like the bike?

Coming from a stumpjumper evo and canyon torque:on cf8, I'm looking at a lightweight to eliminate the other 2 all together. From personal experience, I feel like 60nm tq and 38-48lb is the sweet spot... Any more torque and mtb tires hold you back. More weight and brakes become more an issue. The giant is the future... tunable power with more compact and efficient battery cells.

After watching this review several times I still feel you GUYS some times do not get some of the SL bikes positives. Full power bikes are TOO heavy for 90+% of women. How about rounding up a gaggle of girls and have them do the SL review! My wife would not be able to lift a 55lb bike on to her bike rack. Love the vids by the way.

Great review! Just wondering if you guys played with the mission control app to see if you could give the Levo Sl more uphill grunt?

@RealDriver8

8 ай бұрын

Would sure like an answer on this too

@sdtrailrider8070

8 ай бұрын

@@RealDriver8 From what I understand, the stock settings are somewhat detuned to maximize the battery. You're not getting 100 % boost unless you go into the settings.

Relay, one comment, if the battery charge port is inside the frame, how will a range extender work on this bike (once released)? Personally I view a RE as a "must-have" for this ebike category.

Did any of you try the Relay in a mullet set up at all? Review was awesome!

Very nice! ❤ Bit unfortunate Santa Cruz came a little late, though.

Now that you guys have ridden a bunch of SL bikes and full power, can you do a short break down on why you might chose one over the other?

I believe a key point for the SL ebikes that wasn't fully appreciated (or highly scored) here was weight and noise of the motor. The point of SL's is to be the closest Mt bike experience without it feeling like a motorcycle. To me this disqualifies the Giant entirely because of its 80nm motor. After some custom tuning I think most will find 55nm of torque to be plenty of power. I love how quiet my fuel exe is! Although that might come at the expense of efficiency (when compared to the pivot shuttle sl, which my friend has, Shuttle seems to get better range). I will also say that even with electric assistance, linkage and frame suspension kinematics still matter- which lends to the bikes perceived "speed". I can still tell the difference between my fuel exe and previously owned pivots. I will be getting a Pivot again in the future.

Scott Lumen seems to be for older riders (60+) that just stick to mellower trails, but could use the boost from the motor due to "getting older." I could see myself riding something like that once I'm retired. I probably won't be lapping jump lines or mega tech then. For all e-bikes I switched from full power (YT) to the Trek. The Trek provides "enough" power while remaining light and stealthy. I only want one bike and the Trek fits the bill for that. Cost is no objected I'd have a full power bike and an analog bike, but unfortunately cost is an object, so the mid-power bike covers most of the bases.

@jx5012

8 ай бұрын

You might be surprised. I’m 67 and still love the tech and jump lines. The Lumen doesn’t interest me at all. The Transition would be my pick. I own a Fuel Exe with a 160 fork. A great bike but could use slightly more power.

Great review! As e-bike user my go to bike is Trek Rail and first think is getting rid of bar combo (worst thing ever). Once you try full power e-bike then you never want to go back to SL.

I don't have an emtb YET, but I want a lightweight lower power emtb. Rode an Orbea Rise M20 in Bentonville for two days, and it really opened my eyes to the whole 'lightweight emtb' thing - can actually bunny hop it!

@jasper_of_puppets

9 ай бұрын

Yeah, the light ebikes are great. I been riding full fat since 2019 and really enjoy the full power, but they are a bit cumbersome and hefty. But I recently demoed and subsequently bought the Giant Trance Elite. Like the award says, it really is the best of both worlds! Lightness, agility, and the fun of a lighter bike without having to sacrifice the alluring power of a full fat. I looove it!!!

@jokermtb

9 ай бұрын

Cool - one thing they never mention is that you actually have to lift the dang thing into a bike rack or truck!@@jasper_of_puppets

I’d be interested to know the weight of you guys. Just as I have a Kenevo sl with less power than all these and don’t feel like it’s underpowered at all. I ride in trail 60% power -100% support most of the time. Only the steeper climbs I put it in turbo. But do only weigh 70kg, I feel a lot of these sl E bikes struggle when heavier riders use them.

If you were to put the Kenevo SL in the mix, where would it place?

Question… if one was to throw a 160mm air-spring in the Pivot SL 36, and play with volume spacers, do y’all think that would be a more balanced ride? Get down into the 64.5 HTA in the low setting. The fork not keeping up with the rear end seemed to be the biggest hang-up in the review. I’m about to pull the trigger on that bike but I hate feeling under-forked. Thanks for the great series fellas.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thanks very much. It would certainly slacken out the front end a hair and give a more aggressive front end! That combined with some burly casing, high volume rear tire and you'd have a killer machine but ultimately, nothing will make up for rear wheel travel! As amazing as the Pivot is, it still only has 132mm of travel, BUT that is plenty enough for a lot of riders, so if that's you, then get after it! Hope that helps.

great video to watch. the pivot looks awesome shame theres no display, the trek looks awesome but needs 60n, big shame about the forestal but that will teach them for a 15000 euro price tag here in the uk. great content guys

@TheLoamWolf

2 ай бұрын

Thanks for watching!

I think the story here is the Giant. After bringing so many subpar to average bikes to market, they produce this ripper. I'm sold.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

We have not bee blown away by many Giants, including in our recent eMTB Shootout, but this bike has us seriously considering a purchase! Props to them.

I didn’t like the one piece handlebars at first but they grew on my over time, now I really like them, however I wouldn’t pay that much for a set of handlebars (mine came with the bike).

How would the new Canondale moterra SL fit with these? Shoot it out!

FULL POWER…..Every Day..All the Way !!!!!! ALL the TIME 😊

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Nothing wrong with that!!

@eugenux

9 ай бұрын

full fat ebike are for knobs and for poser mtb-ers. The only thing they have in common with mtb-ing are the terrain in which the activity takes place. On real mtb trails, fat ebikes are awkward and cumbersome to manoeuvre, give you a heavy and heavily inertial feel and feedback and, on real mtb down the hill trails, fat mtbs are slower than SL ebikes and normal bikes as well; basically, slow full fat ebikes for slow full fat knob riders. (in 99% of the cases)

@apatriotofhopedanjohn4781

9 ай бұрын

@@eugenux Who said anything about fat-tire ebike ? All though I have one and have a blast on it in the snow and on the beach, I have two main ebikes I ride all the time. I love my POLE VOIMA and GIANT TRANCE…. and neither are fat-tire bikes. Thanks for your reply

@eugenux

8 ай бұрын

​​@@apatriotofhopedanjohn4781all ebikes bar the SLs are fat(i.e. heavy) and ride like shi.te..., when you compare them with SLs and, especially, with normal bikes.

I’m looking at switching from a full power or should I say a full weight e-bike to an SL. I have a cube stereo hybrid 160 which is great when you take it into the hills where the chunky stuff is but most of my riding is pretty flat trails. I’m pretty fit and don’t need 85nm of torque with 700wh plus battery. I ride my cube in Eco mostly and have the torque set to 45nm. On steeper longer climbs I will move up to Tour+ which I have set at 60nm. Personally I think the biggest issue with full power e-bikes is that here in the UK, they are limited to 15.5mph. This is too low. It’s too easy to hit the limit on the flat and also on some gradients. You then feel the weight of the bike and it spoils the fun. I think an SL at around 19kg would feel a bit more lively and be less of a drag when you hit that limiter.

Great job, really helped me making a decision. Transition Relay!

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Glad it helped!

I'm probably correct in thinking that this is the first group review of half fat ebikes and a job well done.👏 And if anymore proof was needed that the Loam Wolf is impartial, a specialized didn't get top honours!👍

@TheLoamWolf

8 ай бұрын

Thank you very much and we're also thinking it may have been the first ever lightweight eMTB Group Test! Which we're excited about. And we appreciate the kind words. We try our best to be as impartial and honest as we possibly can!

Great comparison guys nice job, can’t help but feel that if the trek fuel exe if only the tq motor put out 60nm of torque and had slightly large battery to accommodate the extra power it would be a no brained with the near silent operation of the tq motor

@Maxi_Max

9 ай бұрын

No, the guys have forgotten the point of a light ebike If you approach it with that perspective, you should buy a normal one or wait for the Bosch SX

@eugenux

8 ай бұрын

​@@Maxi_Maxthe guys don't like normal bikes or SL ebikes... they've said it again and again, in almost every video. They ride dirtbikes so, the big ebikes are a natural extension for them.

Great shootout and love your picks! Having owned both the Relay and now the Fuel Exe I can attest to the pro's and con's of each and they are great bikes. One thing you kept mentioning about both bikes was the range extenders. With the Relay, its removable battery and how it charges, I am not sure there would be a way to attach a range extender as there is no external charging port. And Trek did a good bit of marketing by sending and extender with the test bike as they are on back order for all of US, with the only people getting them had ordered them a year AGO... The Fazua system to be the best in the shootout really needs a better display. When you're riding steep trails in the PNW the difference between knowing that one dot is either 19% or 1% is kind of a big deal

Great stuff! …sounds like if the Transition Relay with it’s travel, and the Giant “Long Name” with its power, had a baby, That’d be the perfect EMTB!🤔😜

@theloamwolf would love to hear how the Santa Cruz Heckler SL compares to these

Ever since the Relay was announced, it was the most interesting mid-power bike (on paper) to me. I've always been a full power e-biker, and not sure I'll ever go to a mid-power bike, but the versatility of the relay is compelling. Was there any of your crew who would choose a Relay over a full power if you could only have one?

@mtbmike9866

8 ай бұрын

Their PNW weighed 45lbs with pedals at the shop. I wish it were a few lbs lighter

Great review guys! I have a question for Shawn - You said you're 6'2", how did you feel on the Orbea Rise with its large frame? Wasn't it a bit too small for you? The manufacturer recommends the XL frame for your height. I want to buy this ebike, I'm the same height and I can't decide between the L or XL frame. Please help! :)

@jordanmackay3568

9 ай бұрын

Hi mate. I'm also 6ft 2 and currently own a large kenevo SL with 485 reach. I'd defo go XL and run a 35 stem. I'm changing to an XL as its just a bit too short and I keep falling into the foks. I chose a smaller bike because it's funner and my home trails are snappy switch backs but honestly a bike that fits is just better. Always aim for a bike with 500ish reach with a 450ish chainstay for good balance and you'll be happy 🤘

@mickm8255

9 ай бұрын

I'm 5'9 and have L Rise. The medium is cramped and small if I listened to Orbea's frame size recommendation. What sealed the deal for me though was being able to test both sizes before purchasing. Even if it was only in the parking lot, I could feel the difference. Go for the Orbea. You won't regret it. It's such a fun, playful and very capable bike. I currently have it setup as a 160/160 with a coil rear shock and it's turned a great bike into an amazing bike with just adding that extra rear travel plushness.

Thanks Drew. Awesome content as always. Drew, couples of observations/questions: 1. Big range of bike styles ie lumen v relay. The relay is really e enduro bike. Would habeen cool to see SL enduro shootout, or are there not enough in that category for it's own shootout? 2. Would the heckler SL have won this shootout if it had been ready in time for inclusion do you think!? 3. Do you know if SC will make a 170/170 SL like the nomad/megatower? Thanks heaps Drew. You should have 500k subscribers!!

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Thank you very much! We’ll keep these pointed responses here - 1 that is correct. We think more bikes will be coming in the future but as of now, this was all we could get. 2 no it would not have. 3. We’re not sure but we can sure hope! It would make sense. But we’d be much for stoked if the Shuttle SL came in an LT!!

Always awesome to watch your channel however it is a shame like the big Brothers of Emtb's Trail and Enduro SL Categories. The Transition Relay is near the same weight as my Orbea Wild M-Ltd (20.8kg)

I rode a full power ebike for a couple years and am curious how many of you would trade in your full power ebike for a lightweight and why? Thanks for the great content

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Very tough call... With a range extender it's getting to be a closer decision but still a very tough one! I think its very much rider dependent but we think 75% of our crew will keep a good full power bike as of right now. 630-700 battery is great.

@JJ_MTB_15

9 ай бұрын

@@TheLoamWolf Is that due to how much longer the battery lasts or the extra power it puts out? I've never ridden full powers or SL's so i'm trying to gauge which direction to go.

@eugenux

8 ай бұрын

@Isaac, it depends if you feel as and want to be a mtb-er. If you like the spirit and ethos of mtb-ing. If you want that in your life then, you'll like SL ebikes. If you don't care and all you want is big power uphill and big squishy on the downs, don't bother and keep your full fat ebike.

Great round up, respect the giant, but it is a full power eMTB at 85 nM bike so not sure it should be in this test, but you guys are the experts. Would have liked to know what you thought the range performances were, good or bad, and would like to see where the giant would sit here.

@stephenlord599

8 ай бұрын

Two main consumer criteria not mentioned in this group. 1) Is it going to be your only bike ? One bike to shred everything or another horse in the stable. This is defining for this category for myself and most of my riding buddies. 2) rider weight Even acknowledging the different power and torque measurements there is some cutofff where lower power struggles based on rider weight. This category is straddling the “just enough” so it would be good to see rider weights. At 160# in not and wet through I’m happy on 60nm riding with full power bikes but my 220# riding buddy has a completely different experience To be honest I can feel the difference between 60nm and 85nm but it’s not really translated into riding whereas someone much heavier even if they are fit it will be a completely different experience I think this combines with #1 ^^ I’m sure the transition would be ideal for me especially the other criteria I have with removable battery but not for my bigger riding buddy Another mate slightly heavier (maybe another 10#) has a kenevo sl and a turbo levo .. we do different rides when he’s on the SL We all own multiple bikes but only 1 has 2x emtb and I ride my emtb less than 1/2 the time but when I do I want to know I’m on an ebike especially those after work rides and just pack everything in.

@davevanderzwet1209

8 ай бұрын

@@stephenlord599 I had pulled the trigger on the fazua powered e bike as I wanted a lightweight less than 20 kg bike, very happy with what I have although a full powered passed me the other day, but dont we hate show offs. My bike performs brilliantly so no issues, just have to put some work in to keep right up with the full fats.

I'm partial to the Giant Trance Elite (because I bought one!) but I knew it wasn't going to win best overall. However, I'm glad you guys basically created a whole new award just as a recognition for how significant it was for Giant to have created it. There's no other bike like it right now, and I love that there are very few sacrifices to make with the Trance Elite. Lightweight AND full power? AND range extender while still being lighter than every 'full fat' ebike? so much WIN

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Agreed and thank you very much!

@techne9992

9 ай бұрын

How is 44 lb a sl?

@jasper_of_puppets

9 ай бұрын

@@techne9992 There's not a universal standard or definition, and not every manufacturer goes by the 'SL' term... So it's whatever the hell you want it to be. As far as the Giant goes... It's certainly not the lightest, but most people would consider a 44lb, full-powered ebike to be pretty light. Also, Giant's website claims the Trance Elite 0 is 41 pounds in a size medium. I don't know if the Loam Wolf guys weighed their size L bike with a scale, but there's that.

@Nickporter17

5 ай бұрын

​@@techne9992because it's a whole tier less than 50 lbs

@eastcoastlife3547

5 ай бұрын

Getting my Giant elite + 1 can’t wait 👌

Did you guys put the Levo SL to 100%? By default it only gives 80% power in turbo.

@rjcamsr

9 ай бұрын

That’s right. To unlock the full potential, the power settings need to be bumped up in the app. Under controlled hill climb tests, the Levo SL has been as fast or faster than the 60 nm bikes.

@RealDriver8

8 ай бұрын

There are a few of us awaiting a reply on this question.

@cleoent

8 ай бұрын

@@RealDriver8 maybe the silence is the answer?

The best thing these bikes do is help people with health conditions. I am type one diabetic, and the power saves me when my blood sugar is crashing and I need to keep up with friend on non-ebikes. I have a big full-power, I am going down to an SL as I want the feel of an analog, but enough power in an emergency when pedaling too hard. This review helped. However, please god review the lower levels of these models. This applies to the 1% of bike consumers...

I love your guys reviews. My only critique is that you test the highest end version of every bike. No one is buying those ones. I wish you would get the mid version of each one. If you buy a 10+ thousand bike in 2023 you are doing it wrong.

@mattcardarelli

7 ай бұрын

Unfortunately it’s all about what the companies send them. They all end up sending them their high end stuff. Pinkbike has talked about it in depth on their podcast

@neilrasmussen2063

6 ай бұрын

The problem with mid price comparison is the mixed bag of where costs were cut, one will have better brakes, the next better suspension etc. If it's all top spec then the review is about the frame and the part of the bike that won't get changed. Mid level reviews often end up describing which component ended up being the limit of the bike's performance, I can't stand them.

@Nugemart

3 ай бұрын

And why the bike industry is now bombing, greed led to screwing a great community.

@neilrasmussen2063

3 ай бұрын

@Nugemart LOL, I think you mean a delayed response to an unusual spike in demand. I'm not aware of any industry that comes close to the level of customer focus and passion for the sport mountain biking has.

@kostak2171

3 ай бұрын

Definitely this! Pick bikes in the 6k-8k range!

Looking at SL's to get into ebikes here

One piece bar stem was cool back when Klein paint jobs were all the rage.

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

😂😂

The transition is on my short list

What would someone recommend for laps around local areas and also adequate for possible lift access downhill park stuff or would that be asking too much from one bike lol

@steveg56

7 ай бұрын

That bike would be the relay imo

Fuel EXe is my pick, especially with its new 2024 spec and pricing update this week!!

Could you please do a review for a group of lower spec versions less then $4000 or $6000 ?

@TheLoamWolf

9 ай бұрын

Yes we will work that for next year!

May I recommend including an older rider in the test group ,@59 and 35+ years of mt. biking I am looking to extend my rides and an e-bike is the solution for us older riders. To have a perspective from an older rider would greatly benefit our buying decision. Ty

@TheLoamWolf

7 ай бұрын

Thanks for sharing your insights.

question of noise... I've heard Ebikes have a rattle while descending??

what a review,... ohh yeah its a solid bike, nothing really changed from the previous battery except the bigger battery.... My 10 year old son could tell the same :D