I feel like the "it should be so tight it hurts" idea comes from when the uppers were usually made of leather and would stretch a lot with wear, while nowadays, uppers tend to expand less

@erichuifitness

Жыл бұрын

Cool if this is true!

@faizt6795

5 ай бұрын

@@erichuifitness😮😢😮😮😮i ok 👌 men jag 😮o

Awesome video, I think you did a wonderful job explaining shoe differences and uses. I hope more people watch this video as it is very educational. Kudos to Scarpa for sponsoring the video.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Phil :) glad you enjoyed it! Very psyched scarpa are supporting the series! New one coming out in 2 weeks :)

Good to see resoles being promoted and also that multiple resoles are fine to do, my blancos are my go to trad shoe, had them resoled once so far. But will keep getting resoled till they fall apart!

The first climbing shoes I bought was the Scarpa furia. I love those shoes. Most of the time, they fit my foot perfectly, but can be painful on a bad day (especially on smaller holds). For that I have another pair, Scarpa reflex. They are very comfortable, and perfect for those days when my feet just don't want to be bothered. I think this is also illustrating an important point. Your feet are living things, and living things change. Having different pairs for both performance and comfort can be very valuable (if you can afford it of course). Edit: I had already been climbing a while with borrowed and rented shoes when I finally bought my own pair. If I hadn't known what style I was aiming for, I would probably not have bought Furia as my first pair. The second pair has two purposes: comfort and slab/smearing.

Learning so much while getting into this sport. Thank you.

great information. Really hit on alot of my questions. Thanks

Great information! Keep the Videos coming :)!

I remember when I found out that the rubber thickness on shoes differ. I had a shoe with very thin rubber and man did it wear down fast xD Awesome video!

Awesome content man! Great thing to do the comparison between brands. My first pair of shoes were the La Sportiva Tarantulace, then the Otaki and my third Tenaya Ra. With Tenaya I was surprised that due the narrower shape of the shoe the size was 44EU vs 42 EU in La Sportiva Otaki. I'm 42.5 street shoe, my first shoe was a 45 and it was a bit large for my foot (particularly due the wider toe box). Appreciate the content! I'll stay tuned for the series. 🤟🏻

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah man, even across brands there can be a huge difference. I know I size down a lot in La Sportiva vs Scarpa (41.5 Scarpa to 40.5 LaSport).

Excellent video. Really informative. 👍

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks Mix! 👊🙂

Thank you, I am glad I subscribed to your channel!

Great video, Robbie! I've recently started to use a shoe press to speed up the breaking-in process. It's been a revelation! In the past every pair of shoes I have ever purchased have either grown by at least half a size by the time they are fully worn in, or they at least feel like it. If I choose a pair that are comfortable in the shop but snug, they invariably feel tight on the crag/climbing wall for a few sessions. Cue the shoe press! A couple of bunion blobs help to create a "last" the shape of my feet, and I pop them in the shoes for a few days. Adjust the press for length and width, nothing too dramatic, but enough to make those first few sessions more enjoyable. Once the sole starts to go, as long as the upper doesn't get damaged, a good resole definitely capitalises on the shoe inner having already moulded to your foot shape.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Woah really!? That's really interesting. Can you send me a pic of the press? DM on insta maybe? I am very used to wearing in climbing shoes. I don't really ever find that process too difficult. Usually takes me half an hour to break in a pair until I feel pretty comfortable in them and climbing well in them - maybe a day or so until they are prime. I definitely wear my shoes super snug and they never expand to the point that I feel they are too baggy on me.

@SteveLong-Mountaineering

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips I have to admit that my new Scarpa Instincts fitted perfectly straight out of the box , which is the first time that's happened since Ninjas! So I think that you are right about the shape of the last. It would be great to have some sort of fitting system like Clark's Shoes do, so that the trial and error could be removed from finding the last that suits you best. It seems that I've finally found the perfect last for my foot shape after 40 years of climbing! I think my mistake in the past has been to ignore a bit of space for example at the heel sides, or above the foot just before the toes, so that when the boots wear in, those baggier bits provide the "give" that makes the start to feel sloppy enough to end up wearing socks towards the end of their life. On the other hand I'm certain that painfully tight shoes damage rather than improve performance. I'll send you an Instagram DM of the shoe press (BTW Pat Littlejohn told me he's used them for years...) Mine only cost about £15, well worth it after decades of buyer's remorse whenever a new pair of shoes hurt at the crag - definitely easier to break shoes in at a wall than at Gogarth! But maybe now I've found my ideal last and watched your video, the shoe press will become a "just in case" insurance policy only.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

@@SteveLong-Mountaineering I'm definitely going to look into that shoe press - even though I don't need it personally, I know lots of folk who'll be interested. I've spent countless time fitting people into climbing shoes at demos - that is what I've done for work 1-2 months of the year every year for the last 5-6 years. Awesome work, meet loads of climbers and great conversation, kinda gutted that covid might have put and end to this... but in that time it's been really interesting to see just how varied peoples feet are and how what really works for some, doesn't work for others. The instincts however fit A LOT of people!!! It's ridiculous actually, they are an amazing shoe, and that last must have a very common shape. I seem to have a foot that perfectly fits most shoe shapes... I'll admit that I fit all Scarpa and Lasportiva shoes. At a Boreal demo before covid I fit every shoe they had, and I've owned 5.10s in the past and always fit them (aside from the anasazi velcro giving me one hell of a bunyon/lump on my big toe... but that might have been from wearing them too tight when i was a youngster). On that note, totally agree that wearing them too tight is the wrong way to go. Causes damage to the feet, reduces performance of the shoe, I also think it decreases durability long term, and being in pain climbing sucks! Anyway, glad you've found a last that suits! Defo experiment with the Grip2 rubber on your next resole with your instincts ;) My favourite is the VSR's, but resoleing a VS/Lace with grip 2 is the same thing. Assuming you went for the oranges that is :)

Love the video and detail! Really helpful myth busting here. After a quick Google search I found that the phrase "Chinese Whisper" from a sinophobic idea from the 1800s that Chinese people spoke in a way that was deliberately unintelligible. It associates the Chinese language with “confusion” and “incomprehensibility”. I know you didn't mean it that way (you were referring to a game of telephone) but that's where the phrase comes from.

Great videos! Every beginnger should take 45min of their time watching all 3 videos ;) Some climbing shops have salesman that dont know much about climbing shoes. These people usually tell you to downsize further and offering the most aggressive, downturned shoes no matter your usage or performance. Sometimes tell you totally wrong information about a thin or wide shoe. A lot of hearsay they just picked up.

As someone who sells climbing shoes, is amazing to see the misinformation climbing friends bring and resistance to assistance most folks have. Good to see proper information about a number of topics, especially resoling as many people are unaware of resolers and plenty around my locale no longer resole because the in city ones are atrocious; can spot the clunky work across the crag. An aside as to pain, always have to compensate for the break in. I wear the Chimera and Mago, and out the box the appropriate size are impossible to get my feet in without a little trickery. After several sessions, the shoes are perfect for even long onsights or repetitious projecting of sequences.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Yep, I guess regarding pain it’s a bit of a personal one as to whether it is actual pain or just discomfort/irregular feel. I also have to use various techniques to get a brand new Mago on my foot (plastic bag trick) but when it’s on I can’t say I’m in pain, it’s just tight. I do feel that a lot of climbers who aren’t used to wearing downturned shoes and having their toes scrunched up say they are in pain, when actually it’s more like mild discomfort and just not being used to wearing that type of shoe. Of course it’s all down to personal opinion and I feel it’s sometimes better for climbers to get a shoe a little bit bigger and learn that way that they need to get a half size smaller next time than get a shoe that’s way too tight for them.

@atti1120

2 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips @Robbie Phillips i just bought the mago downsized half EU size from street shoe, and not sure whether to return them. Yes they feel completely fine when not standing on them but as soon as I stand on them / the toes, it is PAINFUL! I would never dare to jump down on them from a boulder problem as they are now lol 😂

@RobbiePhillips

2 жыл бұрын

@@atti1120 the mago is a very downturned shoe with a specific shape. It will be a more uncomfortable shoe than others for those not used to it. What are you mostly climbing (indoors/out/style/grade/steepness?) If its really painful then I'd recommend moving a half size up and in 6 months if they've bagged out too much, then you have a nice comfy pair of shoes, and you'll know for next time that a half size down will be better. But having a pair of shoes you dont enjoy climbing in will just suck!

After many pairs of painful shoes I went up a size 43 in the Scarpa Instincts from my street shoe size 42. They are comfortable but not super tight and I don’t feel this affects my climbing significantly. They are my go to shoe when my toes get tender and it allows me to climb longer or for multipitch and enjoy climbing for longer. I have a pair of VS for outdoor and a pair of VSR for indoor. When I want to climb harder I have a pair of instinct S for indoor and Boostic for outdoor. Interestingly the S fits tighter in the same size 43, but I don’t mind since it is a slipper and it feels better to have them fit snug. I had to go a half size smaller in the Boostic 42.5 since there was a small pocket in the heel if I went with the same size. All my shoes are larger than my street shoe size which goes against the common advice that you need to go 1-2 sizes smaller. My advice is to try on every shoe since the last can be different and will fit differently from the same manufacturer. I would also recommend to try shoes on a demo days since shoes can fit well in a store but will feel different after 2 hours of climbing. I definitely love having 2 pairs for outdoor and 2 pairs for indoor. I know I always have a technical shoe for difficult climbs as well as a comfortable pair for the end of the session. This is definitely a luxury. If I were to only choose one shoe it would probably be the VSR as it does a little bit of everything.

Thank you! Finally somebody confirms my suspicions, how can you assume you always have to go X number of sizes down from your street shoe if sizes have never been consistent from brand to brand? I tried many models when buying mine and ended up with the same size I use regularly, 42.

@John_on_the_mountain

2 жыл бұрын

I wear an 11.5 US generally in street shoes (Adidas, New Balance, etc) and went with a 12 US Black Diamond shoe based on reviews. First climbing shoe ever. Glad i didnt follow the "size down" advice because my foot squeezes into those like Cinderellas step-sisters.

I am really excited for your next videos

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

So am I 🙂

Thank you .It is very clear ...

This video is SO helpful! I just watched another video where the guy was saying you should get shoes two sizes smaller than your normal shoe, and that's a major turn off. So grateful you made this video, thank you!

@morganwilliams2863

Жыл бұрын

Really depends on the shoe, foot size and shape. I’ve known people who buy shoes too small which made them climb worse and one where it fit okay for the first couple of sessions but grew slightly too much

Love the vid, Resole=king, not having to break in shoes is nice =D I agree different shoes for different things, and if you buy a decent pair of beginner shoes they can stay with you as your backup and slab shoe when you get your other shoe resoled. I love my Helix 3rd resole but I also have a instinct vs and a solution comp. Big tip use the shoe for what its made for.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

“Use the shoe for what it’s made for” - couldn’t have said it better! 👊🙂

Great video. Thank you

most entertaining climbing shoe video i've ever watched, well done : )

Really great video. Thanks to this video I learned about lasts and fount your blog. There is an image on which shoe got which last, but the resolution is low. Where can we find the original? I went from a vapor with a poor fit to instinct with a great fit, but my toes still hurt a bit. I wanna try some other shapes.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey man, what image do you mean? If you DM me the pic on Instagram @robbiephillips_ I’ll try find it for you

I struggle a lot with finding new shoes.. I’ve climbed for a year now in my tarantulas which are way to big for me. I wear 41.5 in scarpa hiking shoes and the tarantulas are 40.5. I tried moving over to scarpa and bought two pairs after a huge sale at the local store. As I’ve quickly become better I wanted a more aggressive shoe so I bought the booster S and instinct, they are both size 41. I get them on with the help of plastic, but I can’t stand up straight without it being immensely painful.. I’ve skied all my life and I’m pretty used to tight fitted boots and pain in my feet, but this is beyond me! My toes are VERY curled lol

Man, I like this video because it tries to teach technical (as in the technicalities of shoes) lessons about shoes to newer climbers, and I want to underscore the value of that. Understanding shoes gives you not only placebo confidence, but also genuinely can drastically improve your climbing. With that said there were a few things that I heard that I thought could have been clearer, or more accurate: 1: When talking about lasts and fit of a shoe, the last is not the whole story. In many shoe brands, a single last is used for an enormous number of shoes, and can often not be the end-all be all for shoe fitting. For example, La Sportiva has almost all their performance shoes on their PD 75 last, but many of those shoes vary in volume, because of the material and fit of the upper and closure mechanism. The Miura Lace is extremely low volume when compared to something like the skwamas or Miura VS. Some of these shoes also have varying amounts of downturn, which can also affect fit (Otaki's come to mind as one with less downturn than say a futura) Your conclusion about fit overall is definitely right though; just keep trying different sizes and lasts and brands and shoes until you find a few that "stick" and go with those for a while. I've found that with the FZ last, as well as with the Mad Rock's Drone and haywire. 2: Tech/technical is a term that is used non-stop by people in the climbing industry for a million things, and I don't think you hit the nail on the head with your definition. In competition settings, tech normally means toe/heel hooks, and so a shoe would be described as technical if it were great at those two things e.g. had a bunch of toe rubber. According to La Sportiva, Tech is a fit a shoe can have, specifically an amount of downturn a shoe can have. It's less downturned than a solution, but not flat lasted in the slightest. Shoes like the TC pro fit into this category. Tech is also used to refer to incredibly precise footwork, and may be where people get the idea that downturned shoes are more "technical." I've never actually heard your definition of technical in the climbing context before, simply meaning to be specialized for a specific style. Scarpa uses the term "Specialized performance" for their shoes like that. You even use this term (specialized) later in your video to describe the Mago. I have heard some companies label their top shoes as "High-Performance", or "aggressive", but I don't hear the moniker technical used like you describe it here. In any case, while it's nice to act like there's a clear and cut definition for it, the industry can't agree, and climbers certainly can't agree on what technical means. Therefore, I think it is misleading to give a specific definition in the context of shoes, and apply it generally. I think it is good to dispel rumors about downturn meaning more better, or making you climb better, though adding bonus misleading information isn't the way to do it. 3: Yes, softer rubbers do not last as long as stiffer ones, and as an extension many softer shoes will wear quicker than stiff ones. For one, often companies will put less rubber on softer shoes, meaning that even IF they did actually wear at a similar rate, the softer shoes would need resoling more often, and not last as long. And at least for vibram, their softer compounds like XS grip 2 have lower hardness ratings (ShoreA) and lower abrasion ratings (tested using DIN) than things like XS Edge, meaning that for the same beating they take, they give off more rubber per mile. The difference in abrasion isn't huge, but it's around 10%, which is absolutely significant. I would say there are more important factors certainly as to why your shoes are wearing down quickly rather than just soft rubber, but saying it isn't a factor and that it's only a factor because you're using the wrong shoes for the problem is just plain wrong. even for edging problems many people prefer a softer shoe, to perform the modern art of smedging. On a similar note, All of Scarpa's specialized performance shoes are using the same rubber (3.5 mm of XS Grip 2, and yes I checked it's 3.5 mm not 3 mm 3 mm is a typo on the EU page for the Furia Air's, Vibram doesn't even sell their rubber that thin) save for the boostic (4 mm XS Edge), so if you're used to climbing in these shoes you would likely not notice a distinct difference between the wear of their softer shoes and the stiffer ones, from furia S to Mago. You specifically call out soft and stiff rubbers though, not shoes, so this fact does not excuse this. 4: As a climber, I have found through experience that even for more slabby terrain, I prefer downturned shoes. This isn't to say there's anything wrong with flatter ones, but I think dismissing the feature of downturn as exclusively an aid on overhanging routes too simple and dumbed down. One advantage of a downturned shoe is that it pre-tensions the shoe itself with a little bit of pressure from your foot, which can add a bit of "bounce" to foot movements, and makes a shoe a bit stiffer as well. another advantage of a downturned shoe is precision (another overused term). A precise shoe is normally one with a more asymmetrical and downturned last, because those features help allow more pressure to be moved from your big toe all the way up the shoe, allowing for more precise and small foot placements. This isn't to say a shoe that isn't downturned or asymmetrical can't be precise (TC pros or Maestro's will set you straight about that), but they do help. I would argue a mago is more precise than a maestro, and part of it is the downturn of the mago. In any case, I would agree that slightly flatter shoes are normally designed for slabby terrain, and more downturned ones are made with the intent to be used on overhanging terrain, though downturn is only one part of what makes a specific shoe fit for purpose. Generally I agree with the content of this video and I think understanding how to use shoes to their strengths is super important. I'm always happy to see youtubers talk about shoes because it means more people will learn about the importance of good shoes, and more specifically, the right shoes for the climb. With all that said, accuracy of information is critical because as you said people play a massive game of telephone and stuff gets lost in translation constantly. Good video and keep up the good work!

Hey Guys,really really informative video, just a quick question who will you be having some horses in your videos?I feckin love horses.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Same! Horses are great. We’ll have to do a horse video soon! 🐴

Another great video Robbie! I gave up climbing about 10 years ago due to constant elbow injuries. Your vids have made me want to really get into climbing again and Dave McLeod's videos on injuries and resolving them has made me feel that all is not lost and I can return to what was my favourite sport. I've booked an appointment with a sports physio and am excited to try and return (fingers crossed). I have tried on my Anasazi 5.10 blancos that used to fit perfect (I am a size 8 in trainers but 8.5 in these shoes, but for some reason my right big toe hurts like hell and leaves indentations in the toe after only 5 mins sat on the sofa! I've tried all sorts to stretch them (they wont stretch much i am guessing as they are lined) but nothing seems to work. Have sat with feet in shoes in hot water, warmed them up, even put water in the toe and frozen them hoping the expanding frozen water will expand them but to no avail. Any ideas? If not at least this video has given some good insights into sizing etc and will no doubt help me choose a good fit and right tool for the job so many thanks!

@RobbiePhillips

Жыл бұрын

Hey man, if you’ve not climbed in 10 years i wonder if you’re feet are just not used to th be shoes. Also, back in the day I also found 5.10’s hurt my big toe in exactly the same way yiur describing. I’m not playing the brand game here, but it could just be the way they fit our feet? Maybe try another shoe, and especially if you’re getting back into climbing, it might make sense to get something comfy for your re-entry into the sport :)

@BobBob-ye2my

Жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips cheers for the advice, quite possibly. I did used to be a Scarpa guy before but moved to 5.10 as it was what most shops where I was had to try on. However with all the new signage you mentioned I guess buying on line now is not so much of a lottery in terms of fit as it used to be.

Ok, but how do you find what kind of shape a last might be? I can't imagine trying 20 shoes at random (most stores/REI's won't even have that many, especially if you are looking for a specific degree of downturn or rubber hardness). Is there a way to streamline this so you can target stores that carry shoes you might actually fit?

Bought the Veloce about 2 months ago after having used Boreal Joker plus for almost 2 years. Have to say that its one of the most or if not the most comfortable pair of shoes out there. Its the first pair of shoe that I could keep downsizing but yet feels snug and comfortable. Performance wise the S.72 rubber is perfect for indoor climbing. It sticks to volumes and smears without any problems. Scarpa even made the sole thicker to about 4mm if I'm not wrong and it really doesnt affect its performance whilst extending durability Being so soft I thought it wouldnt perform well on tiny footholds and edging but on indoor routes where the walls around the hold have friction, the veloce can smear on them without any problems. However, i wouldn't buy this shoe without first trying them on. Firstly, you'll be surprise how much you would be able to downsize. Secondly, the heel has a high volume for the men's version so do consider trying the women's version if your heel does not fit. Thirdly, two of my friends tried the shoe and it really hurt their toes eventhough it was really comfy for me so really do try them on. Lastly, the velcro on the veloce is long and thin which may not be as strong as time goes by. But I've seen comments on the velcro popping off on heel hooks but i personally have no issue with it. I guess a tip would be to fit the shoes like a slipper and the velcro would support your feet just fine. Great video on busting the most common myths about climbing shoes!

@Fastman698

Жыл бұрын

Have you still no issues with the velcro? Thanks a lot for this comment btw.

Great video. There really is so much bad advice about climbing shoes out there, and I’ve met so many people who think their shoes should hurt. At one point, I bought a slightly downturned pair of shoes with a center-shaped toe area, medium or possibly high volume. To get it feeling snug enough around the heel and sides, and because I thought it was just what you do, I got them very small. They hurt but I thought I’d break them in somehow. Fortunately, after one agonizing and disappointing day at the gym, I realized that was a mistake and returned them, exchanging them for shoes that actually fit. Turns out I need low-volume classic-shape! Knowing about the different shoe shapes is a game changer. The advice about the rubber stiffness is great too, makes so much sense (and goes against what the person in the store told me). Wish I knew all these things earlier.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

We’ve all been there, but at least now you know 🙂 I will admit, I think my feet have been permanently affected from wearing shoes too tight... it’s an issue in climbing for sure. We need to be kind to our feet! They work hard for us in climbing and in life. Glad you liked the video! 2 more coming up with lots of great climbing shoe tips 😜

Agree 100% But as you probably know on the la sportiva shoes you ve got to downsize a little more tha the scarpas For example on the dragos i go only one number down and it fits perfectly but on the solution comp I ve got to go 4 numbers down to have the perfect fit on the shoe Very nice video !!!

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

I know I go one number size down in LaSport compared to Scarpa.

hi rob, nice tips! would be great to have a review of the new vapor lace from you!

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey man, I think there might be one I did on Scarpa.co.uk blog?

Great video! Though I know it's not any myth or anything, but I feel like you missed out on mentioning huge aspect of climbing shoes - breaking into them or also warming them up before the climb. :) I own many la sportivas (scarpas ain't so accessible in my country) and when I'm buying new pair I down-size heavily to even very painfull sizes just because I know when they break in and warm up they're gonna be comfortable and snug. ;)

@chango3865

2 жыл бұрын

Hey do you have any advice on how to break in?

Robbie, thanks for the video. Very helpful, but I still have questions. I was climbing an instinct VS, best climbing climbing shoe I ever climbed in. But I started getting extremely painful blisters and chafing on the tops of my big toes. Everyone I spoke to with this shoe had the same issue. The shoes are also very tight over my instep and crushes my smaller toes. They are long enough, but the toe is too pointy (narrow) and the shoe doesn’t have enough room over the instep. I have a high volume fore foot. You mentioned that Scarpa uses many different lasts which provide different volumes and shapes. Scarpa doesn’t identify which of their shoes are built on higher, or lower volume lasts, or lasts that fit different shaped feet - high instep, wide foot, narrow foot, narrow heal etc. There is nothing on their website providing this info, so how can you tell which shoes are more likely to fit your feet? I tried an Evolv Geshido, as other climbers said they run wider and have a wider, more blunt toe box as opposed to a pointier toe box like on the Instinct. My feet are about quarter US size different. I sized the shoes in the store so that one was snug, toes snuggly against the front of the shoe, and the other was a little too tight, toes tight up against the front and curled under a bit. I sized this way figuring there would be some stretch despite the synthetic uppers. Initially the shoes felt tight when I was climbing. After about a month climbing in the gym they have stretched so much I can’t pull the straps tight enough to hold my feet in position. The uppers are loose over the top of my foot. A loose shoe obviously won’t climb well. I have tried 5.10 Verduns, but found squeezing of my forefoot there too. I tried Tenaya’s but found they crush my toes from the sides. I have been thru probably $600US dollars of shoes in the last year, and feel like I am no closer to getting a shoe that works well for me. Some climbers tell me to go to the store and try on lots of shoes until i find one that fits. This has not worked for me. The fit in the store seems to have no correlation to how the shoe will fit after a few climbs. And after trying many shoes on I can’t tell which is tight or loose and where - the fit feels so different in the store versus how they feel climbing. Other climbers say “You need to find a store where the sales person can fit you.” I have been to three stores in my area and haven’t found anyone who can tell me which shoes would work for a climber with a high volume foot. If you can’t tell me which brand or model is designed for a larger volume foot, how am I going to know which shoes to consider? I am currently looking at Mad Rock as their shoes as they come in low, medium and high volumes. No stores in my area (Denver Colorado USA) seem to stock these, so my only option is to order them from the factory and hope they fit. Sorry for the long message, but what’s a climber to do? Best regards, - Derrick

@johnshipley1389

Жыл бұрын

Derrick, ask your local climbing gym if they ever have shoe trying on/climbing days. Some gyms let you try shoes on and climb all day trying different shoes if you put a deposit down to buy

Thanks for the video Robbie! Question: How many of those shoes fit you spot on? Do you still use shoes even if they don't fit you perfectly? The Instinct Family and the Vapor fit me perfectly, but all the other shoes are either too narrow or the heel is too deep. I was excited to try the Mago's but the heel is so deep that it creates a huge air pocket...

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey Jaime, Good question... I actually don’t have a problem with any of the shoes fitting, however I do think I have a reason for this. I always say that fit is different to feel, and quite often people confuse the two. After many years wearing Scarpa I’ve gotten really used to the feel of most of the shoes. I used to think Boosters/Boostic didn’t fit me, but with persistence and getting used to the feel of them, I now find them absolutely fine. Same for the chimera. Instinct have always fit like a glove. I’m perhaps lucky as well as the fit i get never results in air pockets in the shoes, however you can get away with this. One thing to try though if your finding the fit were is going a half size up rather than down. Sometimes that actually works, as going smaller contorts your foot more and can in some cases cause that air bubbling effect.

I can say the shoes/size you wear definitely changes as you keep climbing as well. I feel like you slowly get used to the pain(downsizing)/uncomfortableness as you keep climbing more.

Great video Robbie. Really informative and well presented.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks mike! 👊🙂

@mikerowland8004

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips no problem. My son and I watched your film Blood Moon the other day too. It was really good. He particularly enjoyed it.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Awesome! That was a mad trip 😂 And Madagascar an amazing country! I’d definitely recommend a visit

Great videos Robbie! Your IG sent me here, thanks for the great info

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Woop 🙌 thanks dude

I just bought my first pair of intermediate shoes (la Sportiva Skwarma Vegan) and when trying them on I just instantly felt, that when downsizing or going quite tight the pain completely deletes my power in the body. I took them in a comfortable size and it at least can't be a downgrade from my beginner shoes. Going painful is just no fun for me and since I wont go Pro ever and just climb for fun, I try to go more for comfort 👍

Strange thing is I found the best fit for me is half a size up though my toes still curl down slightly (not painfully though, makes me think of a toe crimp lol).

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Very perceptive, the reason why your toes curl up in some shoes is to provide more power to the toe (the same as a crimp) 🙂

KZread: how many ads can you cram into one video? Robbie Phillips: yes

@hbdc6957

3 жыл бұрын

if you think 3 ads is a lot you should check morgz

"some shoes are better on smaller foot holds" clip of a flat wall starts playing lmao

My right foot is smaller than my left foot apparently, so one foot is always either too baggy or too tight.

That's Hepburn 😉😁, classic boulder with 3 amazing lines 😜

0:43 wow didn’t expect “Chinese Whispers” that’s something my grandma would say lol. Over here we just call it “telephone” or “ broken telephone

The farmer is the best part of this video

I have really awkward feet. And the ONLY shoes I've ever found that actually fit them without pain are the Evolv Shamans (and now the Zenist) which as a decidedly below average climber is annoying, as I look like a tryhard wearing high end shoes, when in reality they're the only ones that don't cause pain.

I get that my toes should reach the end of the toe box. Should my toes be flat or curled?

Is there a compersion sheet between differnt shoe fits? (Low medium high volume) From scarpa?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

There is... but it’s locked away right now. I think we are planning to release a comparison sheet soon.

Well crap. I wish I would have watched this before I bought my first pair. They kept talking me into smaller sizes. Also my second toe is slightly longer than my big toe but I was told there wasn't a shoe for that but it looks like a centre shoe would have been perfect for that...going to look at more shoes now. Thanks!

Thank you for the video! Can you help me find a Scarpa shoe? after 3 shoes, I'm still looking for a good shoe for me. street size is Male US 8. I have a very wide/high volume foot, with a center shaped shoe toe and a small heel. Evolve line doesn't work for me. LA sportiva's have a higher volume that fits me, but the heels are too deep.

@penguins0392

3 жыл бұрын

Scarpa Instincts also had a loose heel for me and I sized down size and a half

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey dude, so.... I would check out the Veloce and VAPOR V/Lace. The former for indoor use mainly and the latter for indoor and outdoor climbing

My new shoes pinch my toes so bad and when I toe a rock it sends a sharp pain through my foot. I tried to get used to them because I was told shoes aren't supposed to be comfy.... LA Sportiva Taratulace was my first shoes. When I got holes in the toes I decided to try the new, more aggressive shoe. What's crazy is it's the same brand and size bit it's sooo much smaller. I switched back to Tarantulace.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey Sydney, this is a really common occurrence. Although the size might be the same, the shape is very different. Tarantula is designed to be comfy, but lacks in key performance areas. You can however find middle ground shoes - ideally look for shoes that are less assumetric and downturned but that still utilise softer rubber, a slight down turn, maybe less rigidity throughout the whole sole (3/4 rubber sole for example). A good example on Scarpa side is VAPOR Velcro.

@Stranger_Strange_Land

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips Thank you. I'll check those out

hi guys! need help! im looking to purchase the scarpa drago i measured my foot to be 26 cm in length, according to the sizing chart by scarpa, i should get size EU 40.5 - 41, will size 40.5 fit me perfect?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey man, it’s not quite as simple as that because width and general foot shape also comes into it, however I will measure my foot later on and compare 😅👍 Bare with me

I also assumed the softer rubber would wear faster

Anyone knows if La Sportiva labels the last of the shoe on their tag/label the way Scarpa does?

@jkraemo

Жыл бұрын

I think so, at least my two pairs have some letter/number combinations on the size patch. For my Finales its U53/20, for my solution comps it's C37/22

I have one foot half a size bigger than the other, my right shoe fits perfectly but my left shoe hurts my toes... Would you advice buying one pair of shoes to the size of my right foot and one pair of shoes to the size of my left?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey Luke, That’s a tricky one, but potentially a couple of options. 1) find a friend with the opposite foot size difference to you (difficult!) 2) buy two pairs of shoes and sell the half size difference online to someone who has the opposite problem 3) buy one pair to fit the size of your biggest foot - a half size difference won’t make a huge difference for most climbs (only tiny edges on slabs and vertical climbs) 4) buy one pair to fit the size of your smallest foot and using a special shoe stretching device you could try and stretch the shoe. I’ve got no experience of this, but was talking to another climber only yesterday about it. They only used it for fitting (not stretching exactly) but it might work a little? I’ve certainly heard of people who did things like this. Personally I’d go with No.3 and look at 1 and 2 as options.

@lukehutchinson4395

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips thank you for the advice!

If I want to try a pair of new shoes at my local gym shop is it alright to do it bare foot? Or is etiquette to wear socks? I hope the former as otherwise it'll be detriment for the fit.

@RobbiePhillips

2 жыл бұрын

In the days before COVID I'd say yeah, but I'm not really sure how people are dealing wit this stuff yet. We haven't started shoe demos in the UK yet ands I'm not sure how they will look. But I totally agree... sticking socks on is a waste of time (unless you climb in socks)

@John_on_the_mountain

2 жыл бұрын

If you have to wear socks bring the thinnest pair you can find.

@jessemclaughlin9680

2 жыл бұрын

Shoe stores often have those disposable stocking style socks for trying shoes. They are incredibly thin and shouldn't have noticable effect on fit.

So how tight should a climbing shoe be? Is it supposed to be uncomfortable for the break on period then comfortable after that?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hey Chris, there is no definable answer to this as everyone's understanding of what is uncomfortable is slightly different, however I feel that when you get a new pair of shoes its OK for them to feel a bit tight/stiff/uncomfy but shouldn't be causing pain. After 1-3 sessions the shoe should be relatively easy to put on your foot and climbing in it for 10-15minutes without taking off shouldn't be a problem.

great video

Would ballet pointe shoes work? They look similar shape and toughness 😂

The one thing about downsizing, most shoes have to break in. A few first sessions might be painful, however then shoe are comfortable enough (sure it still would be painful you use them for a whole day)

Quick question: if you just bought a shoe and it hurts a little, does it make sense to try to break it in?

@RobbiePhillips

3 ай бұрын

its hard to say whether it hurts or is just a bit uncomfortable. I know that I am never in any pain in climbing shoes, but I am pretty used to climbing shoes after 19 years climbing :) Bottom line, you don't want to be in pain - I'd certainly err on the side of caution and if its painful, go a 1/2 size up.

I go fishing in some very inhospitable places... Q, would climbing shoes be a lasting alternative to sneakers when climbing across wet and dry rock and everything in between... are they as tough as they look ?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Nope. They would not be ideal for what you want when going fishing. However what would be better would be a light pair of approach shoes. They are built with the same sticky rubber as climbing shoes and you can climb easy terrain with them (built for scrambling up rocks). One of my favourite pairs is Scarpa Crux - check them out but there is lots of alternatives out there.

@zwigoma2

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips Thanks bro really appreciate that, they look ideal.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Glad I could help :)

my problem is, I have greek feet with my second toe even longer than my big toe. So in mist shoes the second toe hurts much more because it’s curled much more than the other toes

i got the tarantula green one as my first climbing shoes and got bruised big toe nails on both feet. Took about a year for the bruised nails to go away once I swithed to the comfortable mythos. Fuck the myth it has to be painful, cuase it shouldn't! Climbing should be fun not torturous

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Couldn’t agree more :) Not wore the Mythos but heard they are decent!

yea, i used to be one of the climbers that had my shoe lower and lower when i changed my shoe which infact actually ended up making an infection in one of my toe's(love the type of shoe,but that to say i regretted that allot that i tried fit smaller and smaller size's of that shoe everytime i bought new ones), also yea, you can blame your climbing shoes if you fall off, i tried a pair called spider which i find is probably a better ''beginner shoe'' but it didn't fit my climbing and i found i wasen't able to put allot of preasure on my foot without actually pushing with it(which when i stood on my foot normally just felt i had worse grip than i was used to, which made me bring my old pair back on all the time which is still my favuirte climbing shoe and it is called python(i upgraded to the newest version and love it) as that is the shoe im always used im so used to the way i need to use my foot when using that pair that makes it hard for me to use other shoe's in any way, currently i have Drago, but i feel i sweat allot on my foot when using that pair so mostly gonna get myself my good old python back, resalling i personally have to exsperince with it, but i trust that if the person knows what he/she does it will be a good work, if ther person doing it have no clue howewer i would say i wouldn't want to risk it and would rather buy a new pair which has made me just buy new shoe's when my shoe's wears off

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Totally understand what your saying regards not wanting to change shoes when you feel so good in the old pair. What I have found though is that your feet adapt to new shoes fairly quickly. Just give them time. Dragos are an awesome shoe and actually taught me a lot about how to climb better on smears and toe hooks - pythons are also a great shoe though 👊😜

@KelvinClimber

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips well most of my time climbing is in python, but i don't really have the small headed look that say that i will not use diffrent shoe's at all, just saying that cause im so well adjusted to python i just find that the better shoe iv ever used, the Drago shoe is alright in my eyes, but ive notice they feel better if i use socks in them and i never really used socks in climbing shoe, othervise my foot get sweaty in them, my guess is that i keep my Drago but go back to python, well ive actually used one python and one solution before while climbing, and i can't forget the time i climbed in one croc and one python shoe xD, let's just agree that the superior shoe is croc, it really learns you to push hard on your feet, before you ask i had an infection in one of my toes so in like half a year i was just campusing, after that iv used one shoe and one croc, well im defantly giving Drago a try, but not adjusted well to it yet and it feels weirdly not good for heal hooks and toe hooks compared to how python felt doing it, Drago is very nice as long as i don't need to do any toe hooks and heal hooks in my head

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Hahaha that’s brilliant! 🤣 Crocs vs DRAGO vs Python 🐍 CROCS WIN!!! ok so... it might be that your foot doesn’t fit the DRAGO very well, however my experience with them is they do feel very weird when you first get them. It took me a few weeks with my first pair to get the feel for them, but when I did it was like a light switch and I loved them. I would just keep playing with them, give it time, if it doesn’t work for you then at least you know they are not the shoe for you 🙂

@KelvinClimber

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips yea ik well croc's is best to work your foot precision but it very bad as when you use it it feels you have no preasure, but if you need to work having presure on your foot it might be a good one to use hehe, and yeah that's what im doing with drago right now but with them just simply feels off for me so i think i gonna get a new python, but of course gonna keep the drago as a substitute shoe hehe

Which is your favourite scarpa shoe? Trad, Bouldering, lead, everyday?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Haha difficult. I don’t like to split them into discipline so much as it really depends on the footholds I’m standing on. But in terms of versatility I’d say: Trad: Maestro Sport: Instinct VSR Bouldering: Drago

@whiplashDBTB

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips why VSR over VS?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

I prefer the stickier softer Grip2 for most of my sport climbing. The exception would be on some types of granite or slate where I need to stand on really tiny edges - but I’ve found that grip2 is plenty stiff for anything on limestone or sandstone sport

robbie, how much do you down size your vsr's?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

I’m 41.5 in all Scarpa climbing shoes and 42 in Scarpa approach shoes (but I do wear quite tight approach shoes). When VSR’s are on my feet they are tight but not painful - very snug fit (no air pockets)

@jdsc100

3 жыл бұрын

Robbie Phillips awesome...what’s your street euro size? I’m only going half a euro size down in the vs/vsr and wondering if it’s worth going smaller. Great channel btw

@jdsc100

3 жыл бұрын

Robbie Phillips sorry, guessing 42ish in street

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Yeah exactly, 42 in street. But that’s why I said Scarpa approach, because I’m sure in different brands or different types of shoes I’ll change slightly. It all comes down to the shape of your foot vs last of shoe, that’s why saying a straight size number comparison is such a tricky method to use for fitting shoes. I would go more for feel and use that number comparison only as a guide.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

And thanks man, glad youre enjoying our videos :)

Should my toes be curled at the end of a fairly flat shoe or is that to tight? I have one size down from my street size. Scarpa Origins.

@RobbiePhillips

2 жыл бұрын

They shouldn't be too curled on latter fitting shoes. Their design is meant to allow for more support without the curling of the toes.

I don't understand how people are sizing down from their normal shoe size. I wear a 10.5 normal shoe, and a 10.5 climbing shoe is impossible to get my foot into. I have to size up to a 11.5 - 12

Just need to add for completeness, When do we resole?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Before the rubber sole wears through completely. You don’t want a hole in the rand (the rubber layer under the sole)

@sufuming

3 жыл бұрын

Robbie Phillips, is resole due similarly for holes developing around rand?

I actually went two sizes up from my street size and it still hurts 😢

*me after 4 months of climbing with la sportiva standard shoes lend from my local bouldering gym*: Bought Scarpa, because I literally knew I would be addicted to this sport for the rest of my live so I might as well get a good pair right away (I cried myself to sleep due to the money for two nights though)

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Oh man! Shoes can be expensive. I think with quality shoes you pay for the build of the upper and construction, which means you get more longevity when you take into consideration resoles. As i said in the video, some of my SCARPA’s are on their 4th resole and still going strong! Hopefully you won’t have to buy another pair of shoes for a while 😜

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Oh man! Shoes can be expensive. I think with quality shoes you pay for the build of the upper and construction, which means you get more longevity when you take into consideration resoles. As i said in the video, some of my SCARPA’s are on their 4th resole and still going strong! Hopefully you won’t have to buy another pair of shoes for a while 😜

Since i bought tenaya shoes, my feet didnt hurt and its precise, effective and performance is on point.

@x3i4n

3 жыл бұрын

Tenaya mundaka. The wide shape is perfect.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Awesome! Glad you found a shoe that works For you :)

So, why do holes in shoes show that you use your feet well?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

It works both ways... if you have poor footwork you can cause holes in your shoes, but like I said on the video, if you have good footwork you tend to wear the rubber down in the same spots repetitively causing more wear and tear on them :)!

In my experience soft shoes wear down faster when climbing on rough/sharp rock outside

I speak for almost all climbers when I say that finding a fit and size that is right for you is a nightmare. Most of us don’t have 150ish£ a pop to experiment with different shoes. A lot of us are working on a tight budget and literally can’t afford to make a mistake when buying shoes

@RobbiePhillips

3 ай бұрын

go to a boot demo where you can try them out for free. Its very useful

I have the same problem, I really love climbing shoes.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Don’t we all 🙂

@mikafull

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips There are climbers out there, they always climb the same pair of shoes and buy it again and again. Crazy 🤪

I still size them to be painful; if I don’t they end up bagging out after they break in.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

I think if you’re in pain then perhaps the fit isn’t right? All my shoes are super tight, but certainly not painful. Also I often think newer climbers mistake pain with discomfort, as tight shoes aren’t something people normally wear in everyday life. Climbers get used to it. Bottom line, I think actual pain is a sign that something is wrong and we should never be putting our feet through that.

@enniedrufu6845

3 жыл бұрын

Robbie Phillips Maybe, every time I get them tight and comfy, they bag out after I break them in which leads to me not being able to perform well on smaller heal hooks. Could be because my insanely sweaty feet 😅 When I break tight shoes in they usually become reasonably comfy after breaking them in.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Yep I would agree with that. I don’t size my shoes baggy from new, they are definitely tight. But I think it’s really important we don’t risk lasting damage to our feet. I know I have some deformations of my feet from wearing shoes that were too tight/bad fitting from when I started climbing.

@enniedrufu6845

3 жыл бұрын

Robbie Phillips I get that! My feet have definitely paid the price 😅

@enniedrufu6845

3 жыл бұрын

Now that I think about it, I probably just need to stop wearing my shoes for such long periods of time during my sessions, that’d probably help the stretch. Thank you though for the convo, much appreciated!

HOW MANY PAIRS OF SHOES DO YOU OWN MY GOD I am so jealous… bro is literally sponsored by scarpa that’s mad

the only problem i have with choosing the right shoe is, that you have no idea how the shoe will feel like after a month of wearing it.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

True! I find if you don’t buy them too painfully tight then most shoes break in nicely. If you do go overkill though then it’s possible you just have a painful pair of shoes 😕

@andulasis6283

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips i see, i will take this into consideration when buying my next pair! thanks for the great video :) Ps: have you tried the Furia Air yet?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Yep - their definitely a very specialist shoe. Great for indoors and smearing on sandstone. Limited uses though. In my mind they’re the shoe you but when you already have a couple of pairs that do different things.

@andulasis6283

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips i see. thanks for the feedback :)

really youtube? 12 adds on a 15 minute video!

I had to size up from my normal size and my climbing shoe is still very tight

"Adam Ondra has entered the chat"

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Has he? Where?

My big toe is sticking out the end of my current pair. RIP wallet.

@lividmatter4862

3 жыл бұрын

Haha, had the same for my first pair of solutions. Bought a pair of theories, they fit awesome!

@MJ720

3 жыл бұрын

@@lividmatter4862 Yea, got 2 pairs of shoes now, both with holes in. I really need to get them resoled before a hole appears

@Fred-oz3tw

3 жыл бұрын

classic

No they shouldn't. Pain lowers concentration.

I have been told by so many people that veloce's are good beginner shoes, and I have absolutely no word's to describe how much I hated them. Idk. Maybe I'm just weird.

@miketkong2

Ай бұрын

Yup that sure doesn’t tell us anything useful. BUT, if you DID have some words to describe why you hated them, you could actually help someone which would be pretty cool. I just got a pair of Veloces thinking they were an intermediate climbing shoe. I would say these are more for beginners because they prioritize comfort and aren’t designed for toe hooking anything more than the easiest toe hooks. I’ll say that I found them to be super comfortable because everything is so soft around my feet, but for harder climbs, the softness equals not as much support and not enough protection for example, if I put a ton of weight on the top of my toe or bang my toe against the edge of a hold or the wall itself. It’s gonna hurt which is not good and is why I’m watching this video. I’m looking for another pair of shoes for harder routes with more armor around the top and heel of my feet. Also, the lack of support through the arch of the foot with the veloce is kinda cool for chill stuff, but is missed when trying smaller toe holds, like anything less than about a half an inch.

6:36 bro that's a FlAt wAlL

*sigh* only if i could afford climbing shoes :(

Robbie, did you know Ferrari builds tractors?

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

Yep! That was the joke 😜

Yeah the downsizing thing definitely is a myth at this point. Please care more about foot shape and shoe shape match up

im guessing chinese whispers is like a came of telephone?

Cram yer feet in and get on we it.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

🤣

Oh, Robbie, you are informative, but maybe drop the 3 Stooges comedy.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

What!? Don’t you like my crappy jokes!? 🤪

@georgecarlyle4826

3 жыл бұрын

I admire your climbing, and your passion (hey, I'm from Bearsden, now in Melbourne, so feel an affinity). And enjoyed your Australian trip. But I'm sorry, the humour is a bit schoolboyish.

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

That’s cool, I never grew up

@va7oloko

3 жыл бұрын

@@RobbiePhillips I appreciate the humor xD

Totally useless info, get some shoes that hurt, they'll stretch over time like any new shoes and mold to your feet. You'd be an idiot to get shoes that fit you right away

@RobbiePhillips

3 жыл бұрын

As I said above: I think if you’re in pain then perhaps the fit isn’t right? All my shoes are super tight, but certainly not painful. Also I often think newer climbers mistake pain with discomfort, as tight shoes aren’t something people normally wear in everyday life. Climbers get used to it. Bottom line, I think actual pain is a sign that something is wrong and we should never be putting our feet through that.

Absolutely useless information for someone new trying to fit new shoes delete your channel

Hey Robbie. Informative video, and well edited. However my climbing buddies and I have noticed an irritation - your overly-enthusastic pronunciation. Tone it down a bit dude! You don't have to be so excitable on every sentence you say!! Be chill, just like the sport. Other than this, decent climbing content.

@MF-CLIMB

3 жыл бұрын

Gregor Thomson hey Gregor, informative comment and well put together. However I have noticed an irritation - your overly moany comments. Cheer up a bit dude! You don’t have to be so negative in your comments!! Have fun, just like the sport. Other than this, decent comment.

@gregorthomson4350

3 жыл бұрын

@@MF-CLIMB... Good, original content

@cafeaulait69

3 жыл бұрын

Don't like it don't watch the video

@gregorthomson4350

3 жыл бұрын

@@cafeaulait69 constructive criticism should be appreciated my friend.

@lizosaurusrex

3 жыл бұрын

That's just rude, dude. You're bagging on someone for their high stoke and their careful enunciation? Weird. Go do something fun today, maybe smile a little.