Karna and Achilles, the two strongest servants being summoned to the same side absolutely stomp the other faction. It's just not fair lol

Yo the goat is backz

One thing to beat mordred with more is that seigfried was a equal to karna in close combat and karna was equal to sun gawain the same gawain who stated that even without his sun buff he would beat mordred and even stated if he wasn’t focus on another fight (artoria vs Tiberius) he would have won against her mind you this was a no buff heavily injured gawain as this was after the lancelot fight which he lost and got a mortal wound from And semiramis without prep loses to jack first she can’t use her kings poison as because of her double class skill she needs to be inside the garden to use it and jack can instant kill her with her NP as if these conditions are fulfilled knives will pop up of the target The target is a woman The time should be night And there should be mist And jack also has the distinction that you can’t kill her just once and say it’s over you need to kill her multiple times as because of her being 10,000 dead spirits each death only removes a few of them Also the feats you had Iskandar thing agility is not speed he is fast but his not that agile because of his body size And for cu alter that didn’t actually matter as karna at that point was already heavily weakend having his saint graph already destroying itself in the arjuna fight and getting hit more by a NP from cu alter and cu would have died if it wasn’t for medb teleporting him out and healing him Also the artoria alter feat you forgot her skills first mana burst actually boost her stats on top of instincts which lets her predict where medusa was going to hit mind you in there fight she was mostly standing still and again speed not agility As shown in stay night itself cu was stated to be the fastest servant that checks outs as while yes medusa and sasaki are more agile his faster like archer emiya blitzing curse arm who has the same rank agility as cu is while yes more agile is slower then archer And to make it even more clear Enkidu after makithis stats A+ was only hitting lionhearts attacks not actually chasing as while yes it made enkidu more agile and can block now he can’t chase as speed wasn’t increased

@Marionic9001

8 ай бұрын

I had that Karna/Siegfried >/= Sun Gawain > base Gawain > Mordred scale in my script originally actually, but thought it was kinda unnecessary, because Mor & Siegfried already fought & there were many things that showcased ones superiority in that scenario already. "semiramis without prep loses to jack first she can’t use her kings poison as because of her double class skill she needs to be inside the garden to use it" - I already touched up on this in the video but let’s go over it again: One of the Apocrypha materials makes the claim of Semiramis only being able to use Sikera Usum inside Hanging Gardens, while another contradicts it by saying that it’s her main weapon if she doesn’t have the Gardens or is Assassin (directly in response to her having the Gardens as Caster normally). Then in FGO, she is always depicted in her double summon form (like in Apocrypha) & seemingly uses Sikera Usum multiple times in the game (for example, her normal animations seem to have it & she used it against Cu Alter in one of his Interludes ect). Now, FGO’s credibility when it comes to Semiramis’ abilities may be taken with a grain of salt, since over there it's been implied at least once that she can just insta-summon Hanging Gardens without prep, but I think it’s valid interpretation that she should have Sikera Usum as Assassin, but loses it to only using it inside Gardens, if she gains them as NP, then all the statements can be treated as valid. I suppose I could say this is arguable, but that’d be rather strange, because then double summon Semiramis would literally be NP:less normally… "and jack can instant kill her with her NP as if conditions are fulfilled knives will pop up of the target" - That’s not how the attack works though? She needs to still make contact with the target with her knives, it’s literally shown in Apocrypha when she attacks Jeanne & fails (and in FGO animation). The point is that even though her initial slashing attack doesn’t really have impressive power, it still cuts because the knives are transported within opponent after the initial hit. It can be blocked still with other things, nothing says it can't be (also in neutral battleground it wouldn’t be night ie. advantageous terrain for one participant). "And jack also has the distinction that you can’t kill her just once and say it’s over you need to kill her multiple times as because of her being 10,000 dead spirits each death only removes a few of them" - Again, exorcised by random featless modern mage. All the things that Semiramis is not. "agility is not speed, Iskandar is fast but his not that agile because of his body size" - Quote from Fate/complete material III: World material - Records of Heavens Feel - Servant System: Servant's status p.014, regarding Agility Parameter's definition: ”Agility: QUICKNESS AND SPEED OF REACTION.” "And for cu alter that didn’t actually matter as karna at that point was already heavily weakend having his saint graph already destroying itself in the arjuna fight and getting hit more by a NP from cu alter and cu would have died if it wasn’t for medb teleporting him out and healing him" - Yes, that’s right, that’s why he could manage one Vasavi Shakti & died. It was still a f*cking Vasavi Shakti though. But where are you getting Medb teleporting him from??? We literally see him get hit & he reacts to damage by saying that it burned him all over & needs to take a break and then retreats. "Also the Artoria alter she was mostly standing still and again speed not agility" - Reaction speed is part of speed… "cu was stated to be the fastest servant that checks outs as while yes medusa and sasaki are more agile his faster like archer emiya blitzing curse arm who has the same rank agility as cu is while yes more agile is slower then archer" - Or this is more instances of stats being inconsistent with actual feats… I think Medusa was said to be faster on straight line while Cu was faster in close combat, while both have same A Rank agility, one should (at least based on this one piece of info) conclude that Agility parameter is combination of reaction & movement speed...

@kurt4356

8 ай бұрын

@@Marionic9001 one thing semiramis didn’t use her NP she can make poison with her item construction if she did use it robin hood would be dead as the air itself would be poison but cu killed the guy and in FGO’s data book itself it still stated she can invoke it in her throne as with double summon her main NP is the garden while without it it’s her kings poison Exorcism that is the church line of work and semi is not a mage the one that killed jack was probably a person with church affiliations as semi and mind you that jack was not at her strongest as both her NP’s are part of the stories turned NP’s not things she would have in her life as a vengeful spirit And yes quickness and speed of reaction iskandar already saw saber about to use her NP it was his movement speed after that let him dodge not reaction Agility no medusa has A+ agility cu has A and no agility is yes qiuckness reaction speed as that is what being agile is and movement speed is how fast one’s movements are you can reach to something but too slow to move dodge it as ability is define as to move quickly and easily. "though he was without formal training as dancer or athlete, his physical agility was inexhaustible" ability to think and understand quickly. "games teach hand-eye coordination, mental agility, and alertness" Yes what they say in the material fits in agility that doesn’t mean it’s speed as reaction quickness is not speed of moment/ fastness there under agility you just used a statement that is still not speed medusa can reach to cu and dodge but she is not going to go in a chase like saber alter did because while yes she increased agility but medusa was still faster she can reach and dodge she wasn’t fast enough to chase just wait reach quickly Agility-quickness Speed-fastness Both can have high reaction speed but that doesn’t mean there the same

@Marionic9001

8 ай бұрын

@@kurt4356 I rewatched the scene, I seem to be misremembering that she said the NP name out loud n that scene, my bad. Also, just FYI, judging from the description, the air won’t automatically become poisonous, Semiramis can add the effect to it (or anything else she wishes), but doesn’t necessarily have to. Can’t find the other instances she used it in FGO, so for now I’ll settle for admitting that I may be wrong about her using it there canonically, though it’s is still usable in gameplay (but so are some other things that Servants can’t canonically access readily, so take it as you will). I’d like to think it still supports the claim that it becomes her main NP if the Gardens aren't available to her… But I guess without Sikera Usum my argument of Semiramis beating Jack becomes far more arguable. All Semiramis needs is one hit to poison Jack dead, but Jack may not be able to kill her in one hit if she has her chains/shields still, but may be able to maneuver past them. "Exorcism that is the church line of work and semi is not a mage the one that killed jack was probably a person with church affiliations as semi and mind you that jack was not at her strongest as both her NP’s are part of the stories turned NP’s not things she would have in her life as a vengeful spirit" - Exorcism & dealing with spirits is regular magecraft, it’s not church exclusive. The rando who dealt with Jack was not once implied to have any special powers nor connections either. Jack not having NP’s ect. has nothing to do with difficulty in which their spirits were banished. And what are you talking about, Semiramis is mage lol. Also, a correction to your last claim of Jack needing to be killed multiple times. She just needs to be killed once & then the spirits emerge to posses you, which must be exorcised (or killed I guess, as Servants can harm spirits). Forgive me for dismissing all your claims on Agility Parameter not equaling speed, since I already posted DEFINITIVE statement of what Nasu & franchise in general has defined the word to mean. There is no room for argument in a cases like that. Fate defines Agility as QUICKNESS AND SPEED OF REACTION, can’t be much clearer than that if you want people to understand you refer to combo of movement & reaction speed. It doesn’t matter how Quinness Records or whatnot may define the word as, since this is what the franchise refers to when talking about it. Here’s a link just to be sure: typemoon.fandom.com/wiki/Encyclopedia/CM3#Servant's_status (Again, taken from ”Fate/complete material III: World material - Records of Heavens Feel - Servant System: Servant's status, page 14) "iskandar already saw saber about to use her NP it was his movement speed after that let him dodge not reaction" - Iskandar was still on his chariot when the light fired & we visibly see him going ’oh sh_t, i didn’t make it to her in time, plan B, plan B!!’ and still he hasn’t moved, then does. Hard to find more epic last-microsecond reaction feat imo. "no medusa has A+ agility cu has A" - Medusa as Sakura’s Servant has plain A Rank tho. Kojirou on the other hand has A+, but Cu is still deemed overally fastest. It’s not just feats that contradict these statements, but other statements too, ya know.

@kurt4356

8 ай бұрын

@@Marionic9001 semiramis chains and shield were not even able to beat mordred with her fame boost as the owner of the garden and the territory boost she gets by being in her territory and the throne boost she get by being the throne room and again no the NP doesn’t became her main just because there is no hanging gardens yet she it becames her main and use it outside the throne if she doesn’t have access to the power of using the NP AKA the double summon With double summon she requires the garden first Without it she can use it anywhere As stated in the profile itself jack is not 1 child that has 9,999 more inside its the hive mind if you kill her current form and there spirits still there she can just reform The one to kill jack is jeanne who literally just purified all souls inside And semiramis is not a mage in a sense she is not like current magus she has no wide range purification spell only Magecraft she ever did was lazzers chains shield and familiars which yes she could kill jack but like any other spells in the verse but has no way to purify all the spirits before she reforms And again it doesn’t contradicts the stat as the stat doesn’t mean speed your using his statement but mot understanding what those words even mean non of them describes speed Speed is defined as the ability to move the body in one direction as fast as possible. Agility is the ability to accelerate, decelerate, stabilize, and quickly change directions with proper posture. Quickness is the ability to react and change body position with a maximum rate of force production Literally not the same quickness is not speed Medusa was literally moving from one side to the other by sheer speed While saber boost her agility to change directions to block medusa’s attack medusa’s agility was not up to her levels of speed that was why she was jumping in straight lines if agility and speed were the same she would have been able to just spin around not jump from one side to the other literally we see the difference between the two Cu when pushing in one derivation was literally so fast he just teleported but had to stop to stab emiya Cu when pushing straight was blitzing curse arm but when he was trying to stand still and hit him curse arm was now able to dodge Hercules was so fast he when he launched himself to emiya he was so fast no one could react but when he had to hit he became slower and was block by saber Achilles when using his speed running NP was movin in a straight We literally have examples of multiple showing of which between raw speed and agility

@Marionic9001

8 ай бұрын

@@kurt4356 "semiramis chains and shield were not even able to beat mordred with her fame boost as the owner of the garden and the territory boost she gets by being in her territory and the throne boost she get by being the throne room" - What are you talking about? She totally was slamming Mor around with minimal effort and her shields blocked even Clarent. Also is this argument in favor of Jack or what’s going on…? I may be misunderstanding something here, but are you’re insinuating that her performance vs Mordred would translate to inability beat Jack, or something? If base Semiramis without Gardens was like 100th of her power-level with it (if we’d go by official stats the gap is be far less obviously), I’d argue Jack to be such a fodder that in scenario like that her only option would be Maria The Ripper one-hitting, while Semiramis’ would be any of her poisons one-hitting, whil she's the one with defensive options. We keep repeating this same point if she has Sikera Usum or not, as I’ve told you, both Apocrypha materials can still work together with my interpretation considering it's implied to be usable in FGO & by the second material that says that it’s main weapon without the Gardens. BTW, something interesting I found double checking those Apocrypha materials, Double Summon is referred as Servant trait in those actually, and as ’rare Personal Skill possessed only by a few select Servants, permitting them to simultaneously possess Class Skills from two distinct classes’ and not special thing attached to Semiramis this one time, but norm for her getting summoned (seemingly…). Either more contradicting material on Semiramis, or she is always Double Summon & my interpretation of Sikera Usum kinda has to be the way it works… or maybe she can be summoned as vanilla Caster and Vanilla Assassin still and those are the extra special circumstances and Apocrypha material refers to those kind of special circumstances (for. some. reason.) at random, when it refers to Sikera Usum becoming main weapon. Who know lol "jack is not 1 child that has 9,999 more inside its the hive mind if you kill her current form and there spirits still there she can just reform" - I don’t know what else to say to you than go and rewatch the anime I guess, Jack got arrowed to death & rest of the spirits flooded out of the dead body, trapping everyone that were close by, she didn’t respawn nor nothing, I have no idea where you got the idea from .....interestingly, now that you mention it, all the other times Jack has died in Fate didn’t even feature the release of the spirits, like for example, London Singularity has her just die & disappear like normal Servant, so maybe the spirits appearing was in response to Reika dying in front of her or something? Dude, dealing with spirits is basic magecraft crap, let alone basic caster crap. Semiramis has her attributes as Caster as Double Summon. In life, she was referred to as Mage Queen & witch, from Age of Gods, I dunno why this would be new information to anyone, it’s like questioning if Sieg counts as a swordsman. Again, it doesn’t matter what you think words mean in comparison to Nasu and the franchise think it means. QUICKNESS (moving fast or doing something in a short time) + SPEED OF REACTION (self-explanatory) The feats you brought up demonstrate that Servants travel and reaction ect. speed is not the same. Of course it’s not, I’ve said as much regarding to that Cu vs Medusa statement. Agility Parameter is literally given on basis of BOTH, so its literally combination of two. If I was gonna pretend I knew how this stuff works as good as it’s creators do, I’d give out some example of Servant Humpty Dumty or whoever having B Rank Agility, thanks to their travel speed of C and Reactions of A are pooled together to form Agility stat. Like that Cu vs Medusa speed statement implies, among other similar stuff. Reading these comments you give now about travel vs reaction seem to agree with me on this though…? So that’s kinda weird, considering you originally said Agility is not speed. Sorry if I misunderstood something, and that was your point the whole time? Regardless, I still find it weird that peeps that react to some of fastest attacks in their respective Grail Wars, such as Iskandar & Alter have low Agility stat, sure, it’s just likely due to their slower travel ect. speed bringing the overall total down, but c’mon, by how much lol.

you could do one for samurai remnant

Hard disagree with your Atalanta vs Chiron piece Tldr >as archers they're on par >Atalanta can just run away from cqc >the Achilles comparison fails The statement you showed on screen never says that Chiron is a better Archer and iirc a statement after the one you posted said that their on par or something similar We also see in the manga and that Atalanta can easily dodge his strongest regular arrows. Her speed alone can deal with his arrows Chiron is better in cqc that's true but you exaggerated how great he is. He lost to Mordred and only caught her off gaurd in that one scene. Against Achilles it's mentioned multiple times that he's using his experience as his teacher and other perception buffs to help him keep up and even then he lost. Chiron isn't beating Mordred or Achilles in cqc. Also as fir what Atalanta could do about she could just run away and create distance. Chiron's np would be gg if it hit but it's reliant on luck. Atalanta has C rank luck so she might survive and this np only works at night. Atalanta's np isn't notoriously easy to dodge. The version used against Jeanne wasn't the same as the normal version and afaik in no other fight is Phobeus Catastrophe dodged. It's literally stated to be good against servants with high agility and low endurance. On the point about Atalanta Alter only fighting 30% Achilles while Chiron fought 100% Achilles. I'd say this just isn't a fair comparison. Atalanta can avoid cqc from Chiron since he's not as fast as Achilles, he can't reach her unless they start upclose and fshe decides not to run early for wtv reason. 100% Achilles also only used his fists while 30% used his spear which is his main weapon. Chiron is heavily buffed against Achilles, he knows his fighting style. He clearly doesn't stomp her ignoring his np. I think Chiron wins but just because of his np, Atalanta's Phobeus Catastrophe might be able to overwhelm him but idk. Sorry this was kinda long

@Marionic9001

7 ай бұрын

You're right, the statement technically doesn't say Chiron is superior Archer, she's just mentally destroyed by the fact that somebody could shoot down her arrows apparently lol (not to mention Chiron did that from far further, in time it takes Atalanta's arrow to travel like 100m, Chiron’s hit her’s from like 10km away with tree’s obstructing him with only basic Reinforcement in his eyes amping him, far from the only skill he can use to boost his archery). "Chiron isn't beating Mordred or Achilles in cqc." - What cgc feats Atalante has that are better than Chiron’s? Getting destroyed by Jeanne & 30% Achilles perhaps? "Also as for what Atalanta could do about she could just run away and create distance" Atalanta can run away from Servant faster than Achilles who's faster than her? "Chiron's np would be gg if it hit but it's reliant on luck. Atalanta has C rank luck so she might survive" - Luck has as much to do with Anteras Snipe as anything really. The NP doesn’t function based on any specific Luck check or the like. "this np only works at night." - It definitely can be fired whenever though, it’s stated in Apocrypha material verbatim that it can activate even without the constellation being present (for some reason) & in FGO Chiron consistently uses it during day (Lostbelt Chiron could even spam his & hit 100% Achilles with it without any distractions seemingly, but I think that Chiron wasn’t exactly 1-to-1 with regular one & may have been stronger, but Apocrypha material implies normal Chiron can also spam it). "Atalanta's np isn't notoriously easy to dodge. The version used against Jeanne wasn't the same as the normal version" - You’re right, that version was stronger. Only Servant Atalanta has feat of hitting with Phoebus Catasthrope is Spartacus, guy who’s strategy is to tank everything thrown at him. "On the point about Atalanta Alter only fighting 30% Achilles while Chiron fought 100% Achilles. I'd say this just isn't a fair comparison. Atalanta can avoid cqc from Chiron since he's not as fast as Achilles, he can't reach her unless they start upclose and fshe decides not to run early for wtv reason. 100% Achilles also only used his fists while 30% used his spear which is his main weapon. Chiron is heavily buffed against Achilles, he knows his fighting style." - Chiron is able to keep up with 100% Achilles in speed to fight him, someone who’s stated to be explicitly faster than Atalanta & she got defeated by Achilles with only 30% speed. I don’t really see how this can be interpreted in Atalante’s favor, it’s simple math. Chiron knows Achilles' fighting style & has his amps, but that didn't allow him to stalemate, it allowed him to WRECK him (also kinda weird statement considering how Achilles claims to fight like nothing Chiron knows considering he doesn't have knowledge of him after he left his tutelage to fight in wars & gain more experience), also Achilles had his spear (& Chariot) in 2 previous fights with Chiron & was still getting kicked around in similar manner to their fisticuffs fight. Speaking of that fight, Chiron also destroyed Achilles’ Chariot jus a moment before it too ya know, so the hierarchy is more like this: Achilles (Chariot, 100% speed, spear, full health) >= Chiron (Bow) > Achilles (100% speed, full health) >= Chiron > Achilles (30% speed, spear, beaten to sh*t) = Atalanta (Angrius Metamorphosis) > Atalanta (base) "Sorry this was kinda long" - Trust me, that was far from the longest comment I’ve had the pleasure to respond to.

@crass1943

7 ай бұрын

@@Marionic9001 she could just be suprsised? Afaik he's never said to be better. Idk if all these factors you're mentioning are true in the Ln. Send the statements my way if you can tho. She didn't really get destroyed by Jeanne but wtv. Chiron doesn't scale to those guys either. He's inferior to 30% Achilles and likely Jeanne. He's not faster normally and as a centaur it's debatable, afaik he just implies that he's faster. Going by FGO atlantis Chiron in his centaur form buffed to high heaven is still inferior to 30% Achilles. "Even Achilles, renowned for being a fast runner, couldn’t dodge this Noble Phantasm. There is the demerit of only being usable once a night, but it won’t miss the target unless the timing is wrong." You can't use Jeanne avoiding 1 massive unfocused AoE blast of Tauropolos and say that makes Phobeus Castrapho notoriously easy to dodge. It's clearly stated that he's predicting his moves because he taught him and this is supported in Atlantis. He didn't wreck Achilles? He lost in every adaptation of the fight. In the anime they were mostly even in pankration but with Achilles still winning without too much damage, he was still able to fight . In the manga Chiron got 1 good suprsise attack going then he got his arm broken and shortly after Achilles ended the fight in 1 punch. Achilles dominates him in every adaption with just his fists and pankration, Achilles 100% pankration > Chiron pankration everytime . My memory might be bad here I don't remember Chiron destroying the Chariot or Chiron ever fighting Achilles with his spear in hand and doing well. Idk man I don't see how you can think Chiron is in anyway above Achilles How I see it Atalanta vs Chiron in archery is ??? Their probably comparable but who knows maybe Chiron is better Cqc would definitely go to Chiron because he can actually fight in that range but he doesn't scale to people like Achilles/Mordred/Jeanne. Atalanta can avoid that tho by running away. If it's centaur Chiron I admit he'd win since she can't really avoid cqc and his stats would be better than regular apoc Chiron. Still I don't think it's as bad of loss as you implied.

@Marionic9001

7 ай бұрын

@@crass1943 I was joking about her getting getting destroyed, she just reacts to it hilariously strongly lol. How do you not know what took place in the scene? Haven’t you read the manga or watched the anime? it’s Episode 4 (chapter 13 in Manga), Chiron is at Yggdmillenia Castle while Atalanta is firing at Frankenstein in middle of forest many kilometers away from the castle. In time her arrow crosses the nigh point-blank distance to hit Fran, Chiron snipes it outta air, despite far greater distance, tree’s obscuring him & only with basic reinforcement in his eyes "She didn't really get destroyed by Jeanne but wtv." - Pretty much did tbf, she conceded that she can’t beat her in her base & needed to use Angrius Metamorphosis, & after her strongest attack (and her being only one to receive actual damage in the fight) Jeanne goes ’Alright, I can beat her’, then Achilles proceeds to interrupt the fight "Chiron doesn't scale to those guys either. He's inferior to 30% Achilles and Jeanne." - Mordred in cgc > Jeanne. Chiron could tank Clarent to shoulder & bang up Mordred with his strikes despite her armor. Chiron objectively fought better Achilles than 30% speed one that was already beaten to sh*t (by Chiron as we all know), which is the one Atalante lost to (I’d also argue Achilles could’ve even walked away from that fight alive, but died because he wanted to stay to comfort her in her final moments & got f*cked into back because of it, the og novel implies this kinda, though I'm not fully sure). Chiron also fought Achilles at 100% with Chariot with his bow & was pretty even. He’s not called one of 3 war potentials of Black Faction for nothing. "He's not faster normally and as a centaur it's debatable, afaik he just implies that he's faster. Going by FGO atlantis Chiron in his centaur form buffed to high heaven is still inferior to 30% Achilles." - The Manga has him flat out stated superior. Now, you bring up fair point with Klironomia amped Lb5 Chiron not seeming faster (I don’t remember if his klironomia was effecting his speed tbf, but it would just be worse feat for Chiron if it was), & I agree that those feats stand in contradiction to the statement of him being outright faster, but I’d argue he’s at least relative due to consistently matching Achilles at 100% not so much as objectively faster. "Even Achilles, renowned for being a fast runner, couldn’t dodge this Noble Phantasm. There is the demerit of only being usable once a night, but it won’t miss the target unless the timing is wrong." - Quote from Apocrypha material: ’It is a conceptual materialization of the Sagittarius constellation, but it is not as if it cannot activate without the constellation present.’ typemoon.fandom.com/wiki/Encyclopedia/FAM#Antares_Snipe As long as the constellation exist the ability is usable, not to mention how we’ve seen Chiron use the NP canonically in daytime in FGO, excellently demonstrated by Lostbelt 5. I don’t know where you pulled that statement from, if it’s from the og novel, it sure is contradicted by all these things… "You can't use Jeanne avoiding 1 massive unfocused AoE blast of Tauropolos and say that makes Phobeus Castrapho notoriously easy to dodge" - All I'm saying that it’s shown to be not hard at all o dodge stronger version of the attack, & it has no real feats to begin with apart from tagging most easy to tag target in series with Spartacus "He didn't wreck Achilles? He lost in every adaptation of the fight." - I meant that Achilles came out of the encounter with his face beaten to mush. He took the W, but Chiron really made him work for it. "Idk man I don't see how you can think Chiron is in anyway above Achilles?" - Please refer back to my chart. Achilles with all his gear is easily above Chiron & base to base cgc, he won, I’m saying that Chiron’s performance is really freaking good in all situations, not that he’s above Achilles, that’s literally not arguable. Chiron fought Achilles using his Chariot in Episode 20 of Apocrypha & to be clear, he didn't destroyed it, but merc'd the horses carrying it, thus why Achilles is grounded for the rest of he series. "Atalanta vs Chiron in archery is ???Their probably comparable but who knows maybe Chiron is better Cqc would definitely go to Chiron because he can actually fight in that range but he doesn't scale to people like Achilles/Mordred/Jeanne. Atalanta can avoid that tho by running away." - Chiron totally scales, when everyone’s got their full kits he’s not too far from Mordred & Achilles, he can & DID fight them pretty comfortably, while without his bow he’s almost equal to weaponless 100% Achilles. Atalanta meanwhile is arguably tied with injured 30% speed Achilles with only his Spear & rest of his kit taken away "If it's centaur Chiron I admit he'd win" - Chiron is a centaur yes. He can transform whenever.

@baziworld

2 ай бұрын

i agree with you my friend i believe atalanta is not weak (i think, she is actually pretty good even compare to these power houses in this holy grail) , but she actually put fight to Jeanne(and should i remind how much strong jeanne is...because she managed to keep upper hand in most of fight,(and i dont' think jeanne was holding back for any reason) at least when it comes to agaility she destroyed the floor with jeanne, she eventually forced jeanne that the only way to defeat her to use her A++ NPs , because otherwise , she either keep coming back or keep up with her)) first, her beast mode allow her to use A+ Agility, clearly above chiron (she even dodged his bows when she faced jeanne in that alley after death of jack..and that was surprise attack, and she wasn't even in beast mode(which meant ,she can move faster)and that was chiron's full charge attack hand to hand is not necacery , but atalanta's beast mode allow her to speed up her thought, allowing her to tolerate damage, even if the fight ending up in close combat(add to that, chiron doesn't have pre knowledge of atalanta's fighting style, unlike Achilles) her np can be overwhelming even for likes of jeanne(who has B Rank agaility) and overall, atalnta's fighting style is based on runing away , allowing foe to take action, and shotting them and taking the off gaurd, she never will decide lose herself in hand to hand combat and leave her edge( that was only against jeanne, because she wanted to give her biggest F Bomb ever) now i don't know who can take W, But i think it is open to argument, or pretty close ,it is not necessary on chiron's side, it need more thought

Can the winner of this vs battle fight the zero servants? Even though some battles are completely one sided

@Marionic9001

8 ай бұрын

I see, make the two winners of these vs vids fight like in a tournament bracket sort of way. I don't know, it'll be while before I'll do more of these, and when I'll do, it's probably going to focus on different Fate work entirely (like Prototype could be interesting), though I've once considered doing all Apocrypha Servants fighting STN & Zero Servants... don't know how'd I exactly do it though, but it would be long as sh*t if I went with 1v1 battles.

@ethancamacho7615

7 ай бұрын

@@Marionic9001 On another note, I keep seeing in the other comments that Semiramis Sikera Usum can't actually work outside her hanging gardens, do you know where that statement came from? If that is the case how about this: The battlefield is set during the day so Jack can't use their Noble Phantasm and likewise Semiramis can't summon her Gardens. Jack's Agility is ranked A and her Strength C, while Semiramis Agility and Endurance is ranked D. Do you think it's possible for Jack to run up to Semiramis and stab her in the neck or head to claim the win? Considering Semiramis has no feats outside her hanging gardens and maybe she actually is on Jack's level outside her gardens but we really can't be 100% sure that is the case. Oh and she did use her chains to trap Jeanne twice outside her gardens, so it can be part of her equipment.

@Marionic9001

7 ай бұрын

@@ethancamacho7615 It’s definitely FAR more arguable than with Sikera Usum that’s for sure. We can’t say if they are equal or not, but my view on the matter is that they should be at least relative enough that they can react to each other & damage each other (based on Semiramis casually doing so to high-tiers in Gardens & assuming she’s AT WORST 100x weaker outside of them, whilist Jack in all honesty belongs close to tier like that, though may have the speed advantage) Jack can use her NP in daytime, it’s just not effective at all. If all 3 conditions are cleared, Maria The Ripper cut’s through opponent from inside, but if not, it simply deals very ordinary damage. Semiramis would clear 1 condition by being female, & Jack can add The Mist to clear 2, unless Semiramis disperses it, but regardless, she’d take more damage from Jack than their attacks would normally do upon successful hit, so it’d be pretty effective. How I see it, the fight would be over in one hit for both. Jack can kill Semiramis with Maria The Ripper or even her knives normally by going for vital hit, while Semiramis can still use various other poisons even without Sikera Usum, but she just can’t turn stuff in to poison in AOE attack. Any of her poisons can likely OHKO Jack, there’s change of Jack getting saved by surgically removing the poisoned parts, like limbs, but only if it’s not critical hit, while Semiramis can likely also heal if she’s not critically hit… though Semiramis is the only one in this match with defensive options with her fish scales & magic chains & without The Mist interfering she can likely block Jack with them, assuming she has access to them outside Gardens like she does in FGO (Gardens amp her Magecraft), so she would still win more likely… unless Maria The Ripper without all 3 conditions still nullifies her physical defense like it’s full variant, which requires curse resistance to block, then Jack is more likely to win, but if all 3 conditions aren't cleared, it likely lacks the curse effect (since the curse is stated to be literally the inside-out cutting part which activates only with all 3 & we saw her cut Jeanne & make no outer damage till the curse activated, so it can likely be blocked without curse resistance if only 1-2 conditions don’t have the knives teleport into you). Though, Semiramis has few questionable feats in FGO that would put her easily above Jack in scaling, like, there are instances of her fighting actual high-tiers outside the Gardens, but it’s hard to say how relevant she exactly was in those scenarios; for example, she fought & poisoned Cu Alter when working together with Robin Hood. Being able to pull that off at least implies she’s far superior to Jack, but context is bit dubious, like Robin could've laid all the traps he could so they could catch Cu by surprise & they still got whacked in that fight ect…

Jeanne d'arc scale when?

@ajharris2690

7 ай бұрын

cx3 i guess

Bro likes astolfo😏

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