It's crazy how self aware they were of their own mistakes and how ready they were to admit it.

@drunkensailor112

10 ай бұрын

And after that they did so much right with the dreamcast. But people didn't understand how great it was

@valletas

10 ай бұрын

Its funny because from other reports it showed that it pretty much was not the case in sega internaly until the very end of the saturn when they started to restructure everything for the dreamcast

@goatbone

10 ай бұрын

These are private documents, no admission here.

@Omar_E11

10 ай бұрын

@@goatbone Well they knew their faults internally, and they did admit it to themselves. A lot of companies tend to blame everything but themselves

@SomeOrangeCat

10 ай бұрын

@@drunkensailor112 There was no customer goodwill left by the time the Dreamcast came out. Sega had *destroyed* the fanbase that the Genesis built.

As someone who was born shortly after Sega stopped making consoles and started making games for other platforms, stuff like this is always interesting to me.

@hard4games

11 ай бұрын

It was a totally different world back then...

@theelightbearer4254

11 ай бұрын

Agreed! The Dreamcast has to be my favorite console of all time, and as a kid I had faith that SEGA would release the Dreamcast 2! I STILL have hope that one day they’ll try one more time

@Vulpas

11 ай бұрын

@@theelightbearer4254 I wish they'd try doing a budget handheld like Switch, Game Gear 2.

@Tornado1994

11 ай бұрын

@@hard4games SEGA will be Brought back into the Hardware Business in 2024-2025. TWO Startups are going to make that Happen: Twin Seeds Enterprises and MonKing Games.

@HollowRick

10 ай бұрын

Wow it's so strange to think there's kids who never got to see sega systems being released :/ makes me feel old 😂

Sega's top management in Japan made so many stunningly stupid mistakes that I genuinely think they were trying to kill the company.

@snesmocha

9 ай бұрын

Old Asian men be like that

Fun fact: Pico is still an active console. Despite SEGA ceasing all console production, somehow they managed to keep making Picos. There are even some official Pokémon games released for the thing!

@stanb1455

9 ай бұрын

incorrect, discontinued in 2005ish

@Slithermotion

9 ай бұрын

Yeah 20 years ago that would have been true.

@gobobby25

9 ай бұрын

@@stanb1455 🤓

@Spoon97

2 ай бұрын

There's still master system games in brazil

Ill never stop being upset about the Akiba SEGA building

There are also references to an Elder Scrolls Arena Saturn port, Absolute Doom (either an old title for Final Doom or Doom 64), as well as multiple Sega Model 3 games that never got Saturn ports (SCUD racing, VF3, Virtua Cop 3)

So we finally know what sank the Sega ship Too much hardware, not enough software. At least Nintendo had the dignity to not immediately scrap the Wii U when it was failing. When you have the Genesis, Sega CD, 32X, Sega Saturn, Game Gear, AND the Sega Nomad all existing at the same time... God, do you think you're stretched just a *little* too thin, guys?

@edwest2263

11 ай бұрын

Well, Nintendo immediately scrapped the Virtual Boy. But yes, a lot of ill-will from customers due to their HW blunders. Nintendo showed you could get away with that only once.

@Liam3072

11 ай бұрын

It seems what killed Sega eventually was what make them successful in the first place: the strategy of throwing everything at the wall and see what sticks. Too little sticked to the wall after 1995.

@goatbone

10 ай бұрын

Nintendo kept it simple for the consumer

@apollosungod2819

10 ай бұрын

If Tom Kalinske and Joe Miller worked at Nintendo of America, it would have been Nintendo who would have gone bankrupt plain and simple without even having to hire Bernie Stolar to finish them off.

@goatbone

10 ай бұрын

@@apollosungod2819 Doubtful

I think the best thing I found in there is a misspelling of "Duke Nukem 3D" as "Duke Newcomb 3D"

@KapitanKaos

3 ай бұрын

What about Crash Bandigoo?

4:40 Game Gear's market position is FAR from undetermined. Sega knows it is underMINED by their own Nomad while the competitor's Game Boy has the low end casual market.

@hard4games

10 ай бұрын

I misspoke there. Thanks for the correction!

As SegalordX would attest, those sports games are what carried Sega in the US. It was the console that appealed to teenagers and young adults compared to SNES that was really the "kid friendly" system.

In the US Sega panicked and relased May 1995 at E3 instead of sticking with their September launch. Had they waited until September the launch games would have been more polished and they would have matched Sony's price. Instead, the panic launch in May was too expensive system and rushed games.

@SweetBean92

11 ай бұрын

It probably wouldn't have affected the hardware much if at all, but yeah the software could have used the time

@inktendo

11 ай бұрын

It wasn't a Sega of America decision at all. Sega of Japan DEMANDED they'd launch the Saturn earlier than expected because their were afraid of the PlayStation

@edwest2263

11 ай бұрын

@inktendo Yes, these emails prove that SOJ was responsible for the terrible decisions at Sega. A lot of people assumed that back in the day, probably because word got out from SOA employees.

@lazarushernandez5827

10 ай бұрын

The early US launch also caught many retailers off guard: Kaybee toys was one of those retailers that was not in the early launch loop, so they lost out to their competitors who were. They vowed never to carry another Sega product after that, which had an effect on the Dreamcast.

The PlayStation was 299 but you had to buy a game and a memory card. I don't understand why no one ever calls them out on that

@TurboXray

11 ай бұрын

Because packins were for parents and kids with no money. I was glad at the time.. "I'll buy a memory card if and when I need it. And I'll buy my own games - just give me the base console as cheap as you can".

@HollowRick

10 ай бұрын

​@@TurboXray"if and when you need it" you need it from day one for the majority of games unless it was an arcade title

@SomeOrangeCat

10 ай бұрын

Its called "Being better at marketing". Didn't matter the asterisks that followed. Sony masterfully put the idea that the console was "299". That number is all the consumer saw.

@TurboXray

10 ай бұрын

@@HollowRick Yeah? I guess I must have imagined it because I didn't. And guess what.. I bought it when I needed it. Thanks for challenging my own experience with the PS1 when it came out. I'm sure everyone is grateful... smh - some people children, I swear

@TurboXray

10 ай бұрын

@@SomeOrangeCat and that's literally all you needed to own the console.

I miss Sega.

@Wockes

11 ай бұрын

Same, it was so different back in the day with the whole Mario vs Sonic. Both Sega and Nintendo had a personality. Microsoft and Sony feels more like 2 corporations making whatever sells the most currently.

@justz00t48

11 ай бұрын

@@Wockes Master System was my first console so Sega hits right in the nostalgia. They really had great stuff to offer especially in innovations for Arcade.

@goatbone

10 ай бұрын

​@@WockesSo true. Although they have made some good things it is really in contrast to Nintendo who are a powerhouse developer.

@LordYggdrasill

10 ай бұрын

SEGA doesn't make hardware anymore, but they're still petty badass in my book. Whether they're developing or producing, SEGA is still putting out some of my favorite games.

@justz00t48

10 ай бұрын

@@LordYggdrasill Don't get me wrong I still love the games Sega makes. It's just sad to see that as all they pretty much do these days when they were such a powerhouse when I was a kid. The consoles were big but going into arcades in the 80s and 90s their presence was massive. They really made hardware that stood out compared to the competition in the arcade.

Man, a series of poor decisions left consumers feeling confused and new consoles didn't have the marketing, game selection, or price point needed for consumers to invest. I'd like to think there's an alt reality where Sega thrived and Microsoft never got off the ground, but who knows?

@macuser7048

11 ай бұрын

Tom Kalinske seemed to see what was wrong and knew how to fix it, but the higher ups were too stubborn to listen to him.

@macuser7048

10 ай бұрын

@@vesperf3830 Japan was too stubborn and jealous. Tom made the right decisions.

@Kalvinjj

10 ай бұрын

To be honest I can't see a market where Microsoft wouldn't try to enter, given PC gaming has been a thing for so long, basically why they entered anyway with the original Xbox.

@macuser7048

10 ай бұрын

@@Kalvinjj Yeah but Halo was originally gonna be a Macintosh exclusive until the last minute when Microsoft snatched it up for XBOX.

@Kalvinjj

10 ай бұрын

@@macuser7048 whoa that's interesting, I know Apple gaming has been a thing on early computer days but it kinda vanished later (and let's not forget the forgotten Pippin), imagining now a world where Apple decided to invest more in getting games into their computers again, would be quite interesting.

Supersonic was just the name of the genesis bundle. I imagine it would have just been the Genesis with a Sonic 3 cart, and a Knuckles cart. Also, makes me wonder what if the saturn had sega cd backwards compatibility? Could have made it more appealing to some, and a safe upgrade path for sega cd owners.

@Liam3072

11 ай бұрын

This would have made the Saturn an even more convoluted and overengineered machine than it already was. You'd need to add yet another processor (a Z80), plus a DSP, plus a PSG. Same for Genesis and 32X backward compatibility.

4:53 Pico continued to sell in the Asian markets for a long time, particularly Korea and Japan. They were still making games until the mid 2000s, I think. Long enough that, as a result, Pokemon have legitimately appeared on Sega hardware. American and European markets, yeah, it was pretty dead.

4:20 "Scrap value" Oh wow, over a decade ago, I bought what seemed to be a new old stock copy of Genesis 6-Pak. I bought it from a major Japanese seller, intended for sale in mainland Asia (I'd guess maybe Hong Kong or Singapore or likewise). It was a USA cart (with a "Sega Genuine" sticker on the back, while I defaced to open the cart to verify the PCB inside looked genuine) repackaged inside a cheaper box, one resembling Game Gear software packaging, with no instruction manual included.

Netflix getting ready for a new series

Literally the black box of the Sega💣

@macuser7048

11 ай бұрын

white in Japan

I'd be curious to know if Nintendo had similar internal documents from say 2015/16 about the failures of the Wii U.

@user-tl4fi6oy8d

11 ай бұрын

Probably not. I remember in the 90s after the N64 wasn't as dominant as Playstation people were saying it's the beginning of the end for Nintendo: they might not bring another console out after this one, maybe just the next one (no one knew what it was yet) and that's it.

The SuperSonic pack was a Genesis 2 system with Sonic 3 and Sonic & Knuckles included, it was released but it was just a normal Genesis 2 box with a sticker on it.

Thanks Tony, great overview!

Its basically several pages of Sega shitting their pants in terror.

Anyone else see similarities between Sega's rise, brief time ahead of Nintendo, and fall, compared to WCW's rise, brief time ahead of WWE, and fall?

@bcyrx

11 ай бұрын

No, wrestling is dumb. 😊

@macuser7048

11 ай бұрын

What about Image comics?

@Loader2K1

9 ай бұрын

Well, to paraphrase Vince MacMahon, Sega screwed Sega.

This ended up being such an interesting watch, especially for X-Women of all things, which I had no idea even existed till now, maybe Tony could do some digging on that lost X-Men spin off at some point, since very little information exists on it and could be a fun project none the less.

4:03 I had to look at it again, like $130 for Sonic 3 & Knucles? In 1996? Then I realized it's a console bundle.

More interesting honestly than the Nintendo PlayStation what-if is a scenario in which the Sony Playstation became the Sega Playstation. Reportedly, after the collaboration with Nintendo fell through, Sony tried going to Sega and received interest from Sega America but got turned down by Sega Japan. Had the American division won out, I think we’d still live in a world where the main console war was Sega vs. Nintendo.

Sony is probably bigger than Sega. They have deeper pockets. Microsoft also. They have lost millions to get their platform up. The companies can survive the loses if they lose. Nintendo has to be careful also to survive.

@purplemist7

9 ай бұрын

Luckily for Nintendo, they're expanding into other markets with their parks and renewed interest in adapting their franchises to the big screen. It'll be interesting to see how they continue to grow as a company as the years progress.

Sonic helped Sega overtake Nintendo for a short while. Then Sega decided it would stop making new Sonic games for a couple of consoles. Nothing on the 32X, nothing on the Saturn. Why would they do that? That'd be like Nintendo being like "No, we don't need a new Mario game on the N64. Just port Super Mario All Stars and release Super Mario RPG on the N64 as well.".

@SomeOrangeCat

11 ай бұрын

Sega was never as smart as Nintendo.

@Omar_E11

11 ай бұрын

There was a new Sonic game in development, but there were complications during the process.

@SomeOrangeCat

11 ай бұрын

@@Omar_E11 Those complication were Sega being Sega.

@Omar_E11

11 ай бұрын

@@SomeOrangeCat Fair enough lol

@SomeOrangeCat

11 ай бұрын

@@Omar_E11 They were fools to cancel Sonic Xtreme. It looked unique enough to set itself apart from what Nintendo and Sony had as far as 3D platformers went.

indeed every day someone digs up something new out of this massive document, like that's the first I've heard of a genesis cart that combined sonic 3 and knuckles, would've certainly been cost effective. one other tidbit I came across was vectorman 3? so yeah a ton of new info coming out of this thing for sure.

@protocetid

10 ай бұрын

We have a proto of the combined S3&K cartridge, it’s the just the final games with a few teensy differences.

@darktetsuya

10 ай бұрын

@@protocetid oh wow! well I can't imagine the complete cart being much different from the existing S3K so that's not surprising.

@protocetid

10 ай бұрын

@@darktetsuya Actually because of Sonic 3 and S&K's weird development there must be various prototypes of a unified S3&K that differ from each other substantially. The games were originally one before Sega realized the cartridge space required to house S3&K in its entirety was too high, are you aware of the oldest and quite unfinished S3 proto available? It was made after they decided to split the game in two, so earlier builds would not only be different to that one but also have the S&K zones that were purposefully ripped out of our proto. Following the release Sonic 3, I guess they found a way of combining both games in a cost effective matter or toyed with the idea of just releasing an extra expensive cartridge because they took the almost finished games (I was mistaken, the additional S3&K content is very close to final but does have its differences) and worked on a S3&K complete for a while. It was to bear the name of Sonic the Hedgehog 3 Limited Edition, we have two protos of it. Like I said before, they resemble the retail stuff very closely. We don't have pictures of the Limited Edition cartridge sadly.

Nice just in time hard4games video

Mans been hittin the gym! You look super healthy!💪

@hard4games

10 ай бұрын

Thank you! I've been trying. 🥺

@lovingthesauce

10 ай бұрын

@@hard4games it clearly shows buddy!Hard4gains😎

I remember seeing a Sega Pico out in the wild as a young child. I was excited to see it because I had a Genesis so to that tiny baby brain of mine Sega = Sonic 😂

But how about Sonic Twist instead of Tiara Boobowski could be Sally Acorn?

Hidden Palace released some Protos that were probably what supersonic referred to

I loved my Mega Drive and so, the Saturn was almost a clear decision (I did fancy the joypad of the PS). But what I couldn’t understand was the lack of recognizable Software. I guess a good Sonic, Landstalker or Soleil and Golden Axe would have made the purchase a happy deal. But only new IPs or Arcade games have launched and automatically the games could be compared with Sony. Sega didn’t even try using their strength and showed complete lack of business perspective… still until this day. A VF, Sonic, Ecco and Golden Axe should be on every console each Generation. It’s not. A HD remake of Ecco, Nights and Golden Axe is so easy and would bring at least a small cash flow for bigger projects. In a way, Sega should look more how Nintendo is doing it. Where is Virtual Fighter, Soleil, Phantasy Star, Nights, Golden Axe, Story of Thor and Ecco… how can a company fail so hard to auch big franchises.

If the Saturn was $299 like the PlayStation, I would have bought one for sure. I remember being 7 and scouting out which console to buy at Walmart.

@G.L.999

10 ай бұрын

Sega back then couldn't have afforded to do something like that even if they really wanted to. Just like the Dreamcast and many others, the Saturn used many "off the shelf" components to manufacture and distribute the console; thus increasing the price. Sony never had these issues because they already owned their own semi conducter factories capable of producing such hardware without the need to look for partners outside of their division like Sega, Nintendo, and Microsoft would. And Sony owning their own semi conductor factories gave them the advantage of selling their hardware as well as their software at a cheaper price point; cheaper compared to even the Saturn's software prices since their software manufacturing was from an outside corporation and licensing fees were needed to distribute said software. Nintendo's software thing will be for another day. That's all I can say at this point in time.

I got a sonic watch from that Quaker Oats mail in.

Where can I find these documents?

Maybe there could be Jazz Jackrabbit 3D.

I only had a SEGA bc someone gave it to me for free when they got their SNES haha, never liked the controllers or games, it just sat collecting dust until I got my SNES.

@dfloper

9 ай бұрын

Had Sega and Nintendo. SNES had the best games, sound and graphics, also the joy-pad was excellent. Megadrive had a terrible joypad that was hard to use but it was servicable. Sonic 1, Sonic and Knuckles, Moonwalker, Alisia Dragoon, Truxton are some excellent games that did not exist on SNES. Also Megadrive had an excellent Yamaha FM chip that was making some unique sound not possible on the SNES. SNES was amazing as well. MarioWorld, Zelda, SuperMetroid, F-zero, Pilotwings, Axelay, R-Type, Super Probotector, Mario kart, Donkey Kong Country, Killer Instinct. Some games i remember that defined gaming for me as a kid. When PS arrived i never bought it, since i did not know any of the games for it, and when i managed to play it only found 2 games to be of interest to me . Ridge Racer, and Wipeout but not enough for me to buy it.

0:58 Yup, that right there

Every when all my friends first got ps2s when it came out. We all were way more hyped when we heard someone had a Dreamcast.

They invested to much in hardware.should of not done half the hardware they done and invested more in games and next generation. I put the dreamcast up against the ps1 and not the saturn

@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire

11 ай бұрын

Blame Sega of Japan fighting against Sega of America, causing them to try and fix things in their market when nothing was shared internally

@davew7833

11 ай бұрын

@@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire would of beaten nintendo if held out abit longer .nintendo messed up when went with Phillips over Sony. If they wouldn't of done that Sony wouldn't of made the ps1.i think some of the team from sega went to Microsoft like atari .think in a Parallel world we would still have nintendo and sega battling it out .with no Sony or microsoft systems

@j_c_93

11 ай бұрын

It's should *have and would *have, not "should of" and "would of"

@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire

11 ай бұрын

@@davew7833 Nope, Nintendo was going to be screwed with Sony because of the stuff Sony wanted from the contract in terms of royalties, and they messed up by not adding CDi functionality because that would have been a console way ahead of the times if it used the SNES sound chip as a redbook streaming device (or just stream sample data as if it's a cartridge) and the SNES graphics hardware would have worked great since that was the CDi's biggest weakness.

@davew7833

11 ай бұрын

@@BottomOfTheDumpsterFire they agreed to the terms and then panicked .could of possibly renegotiated instead of just dumping Sony with out taking to them.thats why nintendo had to go with the wild card of the wii with motion control and the ds with touch screen and the switch with being portable and home console

I clicked this thinking "What did they do now!"

This is so sad

Where's the link to these leaks?

As one of hardware add-ons of Sega Genesis.

In college for economics class I chose to do a presentation on Sega and their downfall. This is a few years old but from the research I did Sega had 4 major sources of revenue... consoles, arcades, arcade hardware and license. When the Sega Saturn bombed they lost a ton of money but because Sega was making so much money owning their own arcades and also making arcade hardware they where able to make up for it. When the Dreamcast came out in 1998 the arcade industry in America and Europe totally collapse while in Japan it survived but there was a massive drop in revenue. I went over all the yearly revenue for Sega from 1996 to 2001 and you can clearly see a massive drop in arcade/arcade hardware revenue in 1999 and 2000. This was the money Sega needed to sell the Dreamcast at a lower price but at a big loss. In late 1999 Sega lowered the Dreamcast to 99 dollars (how I got mine back then) as they wanted to sell as many consoles as they could before the PS2 came out. Sega sales person from USA said that by the end of 2000 no one was buying a Dreamcast and their sales almost dropped to nothing as everyone was waiting for the PS2. When Sega says they almost went bankrupt they are not lying. What saved them was the CEO of CSK who forgave their debt to him and later gave them millions of dollars. Sadly Sega was bought out by Sammy in 2004 and Sammy changed Sega for the worst. lot of talent left and now they barely make any games with no new IPs

To be fair after being someone that had a mega cd and 32x Sony was the best destination at the time as sega had majorly messed up .

Sega and Nintendo is so much fun (better in this regard) than playstation

Saturn wasn't beginning of the end, 32x was.

@synical13

11 ай бұрын

The CD was the beginning, the 32x was five nails all at once and the Saturn added a couple more. Honestly, the Genesis/MD was their only real success, IMO. I witnessed the downfall in real time, it was depressing, but that's how it went.

@Tornado1994

11 ай бұрын

@@synical13 Sega CD sold 6 Million LTDs and was pretty successful for an Add on. Not sure what you mean.

@iiOmarSP

11 ай бұрын

@@Tornado1994 Thats pretty much how it went, even more so cause its existence was mentioned all the way one month after the system launched there

@TurboXray

11 ай бұрын

@@Tornado1994 majority of those sales were up front... the SegaCD slowly gained a reputation (and not a good one). And 6 million compared to the total base system sales? Just to fracture your base? I'm pretty sure that's what they mean...

@Tornado1994

11 ай бұрын

@@TurboXray Sega CD sold 6 Million, but Sega of America begin gradually cutting off Software from it. SOA made a MISFIRE with 32X/MARS. They SHOULD have listened to SOJ when it was voted down in Early 1994. But they went and ran to CSK, the SAME Parent Company that nearly put SEGA OUT Of the Gaming Business Entirely like NEC and got the project Cleared without Nakayama.

Completely lost interest in consoles after Sega stopped making them. A lot of memorable obscure titles that were a blast to play. I collect games and Dreamcast titles are the newer ones I collect. Too many big selling games today are just corporate manufactured junk. The last games on earth I want to play are Minecraft, GTA, Sims, Call of Duty, and all that 💩. There are a few retro titles I have enjoyed on Steam such as Axiom Verge and I’ve had mixed feelings about Mechwarrior 5. SNK still makes really good fighting games. Arc System Works also has put out some really good games for retro gamers. Sega really hasn’t put out a lot of titles that capture the magic the games did when they made consoles. It seems like DotEMU has done that instead.

Sega is still making terrible business decisions as of today. Nothing is different!

feels like gigaleak

Would Tiara the Manx replace Knuckles the Echidna what if Tiara was in Sonic Triple Trouble instead of Knuckles? Imagine also Commander Keen.

Sega would've been better off not making the Sega CD or 32X, and properly handling the Saturn.

Thanks dad!

Sega 32X,Sega Dreamcast?

4:41 did you really think they mispelled undetermined?

@hard4games

10 ай бұрын

No I just goofed.

New Sub! Dryden, MI Love Everything SEGA, my 7800 was my first, but everyone had the NES: So I was the loser. The Genesis with Sonic & the Sonic 2 Maiiler. I was AHEAD of many of my friend's whos parents were waiting for the new NINTENDO, cuz Mom 'n Dad knew NINTENDO lol HELL YEA VIPERS!

4:40 dyslexia moment

@hard4games

9 ай бұрын

Lol whoops 🙃

Seeeeegaahh

In retrospect, Sega should've gone in on the Nomad as a handheld upgrade from the Game Gear. Instead it was another area where Sega's indecision and attempts to insulate themselves ended up just being more kindling for the flame...

And to think, most of this could have been avoided if not for the 32X and Bernie Stolar

@user-tl4fi6oy8d

11 ай бұрын

Nah, they didn't have the financial power of Sony or Microsoft nor the team of geniuses that always managed to innovate and shift the entire gaming industry like Nintendo. Sega was always reacting. It was only a matter of time.

@aortaplatinum

11 ай бұрын

@@user-tl4fi6oy8d They absolutely had a team of geniuses, multiple actually- SonicTeam and Yu Suzuki's team/AM2 were both juggernauts. And they DID have the cash, before SOA pissed it all away on the 32X.

@TurboXray

11 ай бұрын

@@aortaplatinum Even if those teams... Sega was behind the times in 3D games compared to the competition because they were still focusing (in house) on 2D. Sega even admits to this,

@drunkensailor112

10 ай бұрын

​@@aortaplatinum🤦🤦🤦

@SonofSethoitae

9 ай бұрын

​@@aortaplatinumSoA developed the 32X at the request of Hayao Nakayama. Let's not pretend it was some vanity project.

This 6 minute video seemed to last 20 minutes.

Sega of japan was waaaay too prideful to even listen to sega of america. All of this was presented to the higher ups of SOJ and it went through one ear and out the other. Hell, they didnt even respect them enough to even help them with their own products. When sonic xtream was being made, SOA asked for the nights engine and they couldve salvaged what they had. But the asshat Yuji naka threatened to leave if they continued to use it so it got canned for a 3rd time. After that, they absolutely couldnt stand one another and people saw the writing on the wall. Hell, they heard stories of the infamous sega torture rooms and started jumping ship as early as 1997. This lasted all the way through the dreamcast years and THATS when the Japanese branch knew they where screwed when the dreamcast couldnt compete. There was an developer at SOJ (forgot his name) who made a jpn only game called Segagaga which was a parady & critique on the state of sega at the time which sold abysmally but the point of the game was to get his voice and frustrations out. But hell, i could go on and on but this is fascinating to see that even back then with all of the warnings in their face, they STILL ignored it all and ran 100mph straight into a brick wall. sega was their own worst enemy.

@Tornado1994

11 ай бұрын

No. You have NO Clue what your talking about. The Rabbit Hole is WAY Deeper than you could even understand.

@TurboXray

11 ай бұрын

The irony because it was the everywhere OUTSIDE of Japan that actually made Sega the flagship it had become. If it weren't for the EU and US markets, Sega would have folded early in the 16bit era.

@Tornado1994

11 ай бұрын

@@TurboXray SEGA of Japan MADE Sega of America the Top Brand because the Company Co Founder Hayao Nakayama Hired Tom Kalinske himself and personally brought him on board. Do you seriously enjoy being that Xenophobic?

@EWOODJ

10 ай бұрын

Says the guy missing the point.

@Tornado1994

10 ай бұрын

@@EWOODJ I can basically say this, if you hate SEGA of Japan, you weren't actually ever a SEGA fan in the First Place.

I feel like If they could of released the dream cast before the ps1 they would of had a better chance of staying in the market. Dream cast was pretty powerful for what it was but on the other hand idk the means it would of took to get that out at the time

@Nikori

11 ай бұрын

The PSX generation was with the N64 and Saturn, though-The Dreamcast was a completely different gen. It wouldn’t make sense for them to try to release a console (from 1998) instead in 1994, especially because the technology didn’t exist back then. Both the Saturn and Dreamcast were released before Sony’s launches for both gens.

@Enoby_Darkness

11 ай бұрын

yes, I'm sure Sega could've released the Dreamcast BEFORE the PS1 lol, like before the first full 3D console gen really started come on, man

@RelixJesus

11 ай бұрын

@@Enoby_Darkness I wouldnt act like I know everything about the Era especially if you read the last part of my comment. I'm just saying the dreamcast was their last hope of staying around. Just felt if they went about it differently it may of not marked an end for sega in the console market.

@Shima33BB

11 ай бұрын

@@RelixJesus The chips used in the Dreamcast weren't ready until late '97, and were mostly being used for the Sega Model 3 arcade boards at the time. That, plus the cancellation of the 3DFX "Blackbelt" project, and honestly it's a miracle that the Dreamcast came out when it did. In an alternate reality, we'd have a 3DFX-powered Sega system out in 1998, but even with a year advantage, I don't think it'd be enough for Sega to last much past 2002 in the console market.

@Nikori

11 ай бұрын

@@RelixJesus I get what you mean. If things would have been different during the Saturn era, Sega might have saved themselves!

SO THEY WHERE AWARE OF THE FUCK UPS THEY MADE! and the dream cast came too late... ;_;

Was it?

In the 90s, the keyboard warriors believed they were smarter than the individuals at Sega due to the company's endless mistakes. This proves that SOA was self-aware and knew exactly what was going wrong. And this shows that SOJ was responsible for Sega's demise.

@Liam3072

11 ай бұрын

I don't really see SOJ's responsibility in this. What are you referring to exactly?

@WaterKirby1994

9 ай бұрын

SOA wasn't blameless, the fact is that Sega was a mess of a company with everyone doing their own thing back in the 90s. Too much competing hardware & no unity within the company were huge problems.

@ragingrat7670

Ай бұрын

@@WaterKirby1994 SOJ is to blame for their not being unity. They promised to listen and to fallow SOA's lead but they didn't and constantly backstabbed. And any time their was a screw up the head of SOA was to blame even when, and more often it wasn't, it wasn't.

No Sonic game at launch, and the eventual cancelation of Sonic X-Treme was devastating, and could have been avoided. A lot of people were waiting for the next Sonic game before they bought a Saturn at all, but that never happened. STI, who had been making Sonic games since Sonic 2, had been working on a 2D Sonic game, but were forced to scrap all work completed to begin work on a 3D Sonic game. Not only was this incredibly disheartening to people who put so much work into what they already made, but no one at STI had any experience with working on 3D, and many people just quit. What they should have done was had STI finish the 2D Sonic game they were working on, release it as a launch title for the Saturn, and have another team that had people who were adept at working with 3D, develop a 3D Sonic game concurrently to be released later. In this way, there would have been a Sonic game out the door and available at launch, and a 3D Sonic down the pipe to come later on to reinvigorate the Saturn with a much needed 3D killer app. What's baffling is that there were 2D platformers available early on the Saturn like Bug and Clockwork Knight, and while these games weren't bad, they also weren't better than the top tier 2D games on the Genesis. It was the quality of the Saturn games that was disheartening, that the games were in many ways a step down from games on the Genesis.

@G.L.999

10 ай бұрын

Here's the thing though. SoJ could've actually been the ones to make an original Sonic game for the Saturn by themselves without relying on SoA(especially using the 'Nights' Engine). But back then, SoJ higher-ups didn't believe Sonic was good enough to evolve on Saturn. And this was simply because of how poor the hardware and software sales of the Genesis/Mega-Drive and its games were in Japan and was in no hurry to develop a next generation Sonic game at that time since they wanted to focus solely on the Japanese market with their arcades(which was thriving on their home turf). Now Compared to the U.S. and Canada; as well as PAL and South American countries(which saw huge hardware and software of the Genesis/Mega-Drive and its games sales), Sonic was expected to come to the Saturn since Sonic was Sega's Mario back then. Just like how Mario 64 was expected to come to the N64 on its launch date! Obviously the only difference was that Nintendo was able to deliver on what customers wanted back then, where-as Sega could not.

@thuggeegaming659

10 ай бұрын

@@G.L.999 It seems that Sonic wasn't terribly popular in Japan, so SOJ didn't prioritize it. Also Yuji Naka, one of the creators of Sonic, didn't want to make a Sonic game for whatever reason (bitter resentment due to problems years ago possibly). He was the head of Sonic Team at the time, and wanted to focus on Nights, but that also was a mistake. Nights was good, but no replacement for Sonic. What they could have done instead was hired more people, and split Sonic Team into two and divided the work between the two, the Nights team and the Sonic team. Naka and other people proficient with the Nights engine, advising the new members on how the engine works and how to optimize the Saturn for it.

huh....this document does a fantastic job lining out all of Sega's Saturn era faults with alot of brutal honesty........where was this level headedness when the 32X destroyed consumer confidence?! Sega of America told the heads at Japan that the 32X was a bad idea that would only hurt them but they were ignored and triggered the starting gun to Sega's demise in the console market

@BrySkye

9 ай бұрын

Partly because that is not accurate. Sega of America wanted the 32X because Tom Kalinske was absolutely adamant that the Saturn was too expensive for Americans and a cheaper alternative was needed until the Saturns price could be dropped. He had to convince Sega of Japan to go along with the 32X, not the other way around, and they eventually did because they still trusted TK's knowledge of the American market. The devastating failure of the 32X can be pointed as the most significant factor in why SoJ lost faith in the SoA operation. These documents from SoA are what highlight that. TK's priority was always to leverage the existing large Genesis install base, rather than starting from scratch with a completely new system. This is well documented and corroborated by multiple parties in older interviews.

@ragingrat7670

Ай бұрын

@@BrySkye Some of the blame for the 32x's failure is due to the instructions. Mainly that a lot of people didn't know that they had video 1, 2, and 3 or what it was or how to change to it. That's one of the big reasons a lot of people returned it. Also the small game library didn't help. And no SOJ did everything they could to screw Tom over before and after the 32x. Even after telling him he'd be in charge. A great example of this is with Sonic himself. Sonic was supposed to be what we in the USA saw but they didn't do that in Japan. They also tried to keep Sonic from happening because they already had a mascot in Alex the Kid. There was even the Sally Acorn fiasco just because SOJ didn't like her and wanted Sonic to have a human girlfriend. They didn't want their to be a Sonic the Hedgehog 2 because of the SegaCD. And a whole lot more than just that. SOJ never wanted to listen and thought they knew better about the markets than anyone else.

Sega really really should’ve made the Saturn backwards compatible with the Genesis/Mega Drive. Right out the box that would’ve given Sega a massive advantage over the PlayStation.

@protocetid

10 ай бұрын

The 3D seen in Saturn and PS1 made their forebears look obsolete, might sound harsh but 3D was a holy grail and the literal next dimension. Polygons were seen as the future for the PS1 era and I think the next one too, 16 bit and older systems were thought of as antiquated and were dirt cheap until millennials started going through a quarter life crisis. Backwards compatibility is a consumer friendly feature that I greatly enjoy as someone who lives and breathes the medium, but typical shoppers don't have it high in their console wishlist. People tend to buy a new system almost entirely to play new games on it, PS4 beat the X1 and Microsoft's system had the best backwards compatibility outside of PC.

@SRPC21

9 ай бұрын

@@protocetid I disagree because the PS2 was backwards compatible with PS1 games and I think that persuaded a lot of people to buy it at launch & parents who knew there wouldn’t be a house full of different games consoles. While it’s true that in Europe and America 3D was the future, in Japan 2D games were still very popular (it’s why the Saturn outsold the N64 there). I still played the Mega Drive/Genesis while I owned an N64 and backwards compatibility might of persuaded me to get a Saturn instead.

@protocetid

9 ай бұрын

@@SRPC21 The masses might be grateful for backwards compatibility once in awhile but they don’t care a whole lot. Feel free to go outside of our enthusiast bubble to find out, as numerous as gamers are today we remain dwarfed by casuals. Enthusiasts are usually alone in caring about the history of something, the average person just wants what everyone is talking about and/or is easily available. In the early days of a new generation they might have a couple of previous generation games they might want to keep playing to save money or because something came out for old machines only. Generally speaking, casuals quickly move on. One of the biggest proofs of how little casuals care about old games is in sports titles, I've known all my life that it's a money grubbing genre with annual releases. Then I read an article about how it shamelessly became greedier. You pay for your copy of FIFA, which has been pay to win for many years now, and you play some card game to acquire the best team members. The cards are won through loot boxes which means it’s gambling, they can’t be traded or sold to other players. What does it have to do with people and their tunnel vision for what’s new and shiny? Sports fans have been buying the same sports game every 12 months for eons purely for the updated roster. EA made them even more anti consumer and shut down online services for the older releases so their customers couldn’t go back to them. I don’t know if the things earned in one game can be transferred to the next yearly release, wouldn’t surprise me if they are not transferable. The games remain highly profitable in spite of these ghoulish practices. Got my information from an article that covered FIFA in the 2010s, don’t know how true it still is.

I hated when TG16 quit support in those days with games, was tired of NES and never interested in Sega but always chose Nintendo. Sony fan ever since PS1 launch, never bought another Nintendo console until Wii, and that got old quick. Everyone had a NES in elementary school , one one kid I knew had an Master System and was alien to me with only seeing in comic advertising. Even in the early 90's more kids had Nintendo than Sega products in my circle, but TG16 made me an outsider lol.

@G.L.999

10 ай бұрын

Why on earth did you have TG16 and got tired of the NES?

@thaddeusmcgrath

10 ай бұрын

@@G.L.999 Well got TG16 right when SNES was coming out and TG16 was $99 bucks at Toys-R-Us. It came with a pack in game (Bonk) and free game (Keith Courage). I did not realize Toy-s R-Us was giving TG16 away from not selling. I played all the popular NES games by 1991 and got my first job at 15 and Sega Genesis was too much money. SNES came out towards the end of that year and too could not afford that one. Got my NES Xmas 1987. Glad I got an SNES in 1993 since Toys-R-Us quit selling TG16 and that was the only store in my town that carried it beside Babbage's game store. Babbage's sold only used and never had any. Only one kid in my neighborhood had a TG16 lol.

Is it because of Sega CD?

@ragingrat7670

Ай бұрын

A little. It's more SOJ is to blame.

If they just focused on Saturn+GameGear and Saturn DEV tools instead of Pico, 32x, AND Sega CD, they might have been able to hold on a little longer. Gaming is too homogenized and boring now that they’re out of the console game :c

@dfloper

9 ай бұрын

You said it exactly as how it is. I was a fanatic gamer back in the era of the arcades. Not anymore. I thought maybe it is because i was getting older. And no it is because modern games luck the fan and crazy element of the games of the past. Especially the Sega arcade games.

@damian9303

9 ай бұрын

Even today, it seems bizarre that they still hold onto the MegaDrive in such high regard within some developing nations when those same regions have access to probably a PS2. It makes you wonder where SEGA would be if they continued to innovate without backing down.

Saturn > PSX

@ragingrat7670

Ай бұрын

I disagree simply because of Mega Man X4, X5, X6, Legends, Legends 2, and Tomba!. Don't get me wrong I wanted to like the Saturn the most but the only game they had was Nights.

I feel that Sega, knowing how much it decimated its Gen IV and V sales due to poor handling of the CD, Neptune, Nomad, and Pico between I994 and '96, knew that the Dreamcast would've been its Do or Die moment, regardless of how well its resources performed or how it would've sold when the Gen VI consoles literally started development in between: Now, we know that Nvidia and 3dfx were both pushed to the curb when the former failed to deliver on the NV2 and for unknown reasons Sega opted for NEC's PowerVR II to serve as its GPU; what we don't know is how Sega and Nvidia would be today had the NV2 not called back a Black Screen when Sega was introduced the rushed product for testing and development in I996, the PlayStation 03 may have not ever gotten to use the RSX Reality Synthesizer after it started development in 200I and both Tensor and RTX technology probably would've shown up in a console by now had Sega remained First Party and Nvidia were to become an Exclusive Partner (I would suspect Ampere or Lovelace would've been the architecture to debut DLSS and Hardware Accelerated Raytracing for consoles, as Turing's incarnation of DLSS and RTX was not ready for Primetime), there are so many "What if?" scenarios that I feel could've happened if certain things between Gen V and VI went well and one can only imagine how it would've impacted the industry had we still had a proper full~time Fourth Competitor in the market today. That being said, Sega has been pretty aggressive on the front of Acquisitions since 20I5, with Atlus and Rovio being the obvious big names of the bunch: This has led to gradual speculation from the fanbase (though the Business space is uncertain on saying anything until concrete evidence exists) that Sega could very well be plotting for a potential return to First Party if it keeps going in the profitable direction that it has been with its handling of acquired IPs, I personally wouldn't envision this happening for another Ten to Fifteen Years even if there were anything to such claims but it would be nice to see one of the biggest powerhouses in consoles finally dominate the industry once again; articles dating back to Late October of 2022 do discuss that Sega may have something planned on this front come 2026, but unless if Intel or Nvidia is involved (by then, we should have Nova Lake CPUs and preparing for the Post~Blackwell Era GPU; I don't expect AMD to be involved at all with this one) I don't know which form such a project will come in, it would be a comeback for the ages if this is pulled off successfully though and wishfully it will establish a new era where the definition of Console Exclusive delivers enough incentive to purchase a unit for the first time since Generation VII of the industry, even in spite of how Digital Only titles, PC ports, and Emulation have dug into the demand for a console over time.

@G.L.999

10 ай бұрын

Nvidia may have been pushed to the side back then, but Nintendo has been keeping them afloat for years at this point and is still in business because of them. Unlike 3DFX sadly.

oof.

but what about Sega didn't die it was murdered? huh? that's all I see on the KZreads... I've been lied to!

First

first

I wish Sega at least snagged 3rd place to boot Microsoft out of the race. I'd much prefer Nintendo and Sega both be competing still, they really spurred each other on well. And they're not woke like Sony and Microsoft.

@purplemist7

9 ай бұрын

Hate to break it to you, but Nintendo is "woke", at least by your definition of the word. They delayed the release of a war game after Russia's invasion of Ukraine and made a reference to a LGBTQ couple in one of their games (hint, it was highly anticipated), to give you a couple of examples. It's funny when people try to ignorantly claim that a company is on their side.😂

@damian9303

9 ай бұрын

I agree in regards to Microsoft, they became too self absorbed in their status quo throughout the release of the Xbox One to where the Xbox Series doesn’t feel that far apart to be at all innovative enough to warrant purchasing. But I can’t say the same about Sony with the PlayStation, it feels so full of life and charisma in contrast.

I quite enjoyed the sega Saturn and sega genesis. I really hope Microsoft is able to acquire them and continue making Alien games😅

@protocetid

10 ай бұрын

oh look another Xbox/PC guy who wants Microsoft to monopolize the video game market

@SonofSethoitae

9 ай бұрын

Microsoft buying Sega would be bad for consumers

@indi.saga.

9 ай бұрын

@@SonofSethoitae Do explain, please.

@protocetid

9 ай бұрын

​@@SonofSethoitae The consolidation of AAA studios under Microsoft is bad for consumers, including for Game Pass subscribers who will benefit in the short term only.

@SonofSethoitae

9 ай бұрын

@@indi.saga. The more giant corporations buy their competition, the less competition there is. Less competition means fewer, lower quality games for higher prices, because people have no where else to go for games.

So what’s this video about?

@ArpeggioPegasusMusic

11 ай бұрын

I mean, have you watched it?

@hard4games

11 ай бұрын

It's a mystery! The world may never know.

@gregorsamsa79420

11 ай бұрын

I just hope that Sega isn’t evil.

Game Gear's market position is being 'undermined' not 'undetermined'

@hard4games

10 ай бұрын

Lol you're right! Didn't catch my verbal error. Thanks for the correction.

@zorkzamboni

10 ай бұрын

@@hard4games 👍

consider me H4H4G

@hard4games

11 ай бұрын

Oh my!