Unfortunately his readback was not recorded properly. Or was it all he read back when the taxi instructions were isseud after vacating?

@Votlon

3 ай бұрын

Not recorded properly, sounds like an issue I don’t find acceptable :( what is up with aviation lately, I feel scared to fly almost

@Bowchickawowski

3 ай бұрын

If you pulled this from LiveATC, this channel is tower and ground so sometimes parts are missing in the archive.

@gulthepilot

3 ай бұрын

He just said 34...he hasn't heard cross 34 for whatever reason...thats how he ended up on 34...however atc could've asked him to read back that instruction as well n give him some more grief...doesn't sound like a radio issue imo.

@BlueSkyUp_EU

3 ай бұрын

I don't think any relevant communication is missing here. He read back "34, hold short of runway 24" and then taxied via 34 towards 24 😄

@capchuckpriceutyoub

3 ай бұрын

Well, to be clear, ATC said “Cross 34, hold short 24”. Pilot read back “34, hold short runway 24”. At that point, ATC should have made pilot clarify that he would *cross* 34. And when pilot turned onto 34, there was an opportunity for ATC to say something like “Why are you turning onto 34, you are directed to cross 34”. So while the pilot did screw up, there were a couple of opportunities for ATC to correct the pilot before the incident.

Buddy was more worried about the emphasis on the paPa than the taxi instructions

@ChaseWatkins.

3 ай бұрын

“Did you hear how hard I paPa’d that papa?” Meanwhile not listening to the CROSS 34…

@vincelam1998

3 ай бұрын

He also stopped putting the emphasis on pa-Pa once he felt the pressure 😂 unless that was someone else/his instructor onboard Edit: after another listen, the voices sound similar but I think they’re two different voices

@PepeDeezNutz

3 ай бұрын

Lol

@jaysmith1408

3 ай бұрын

One of very few times I’ve heard the technically preferred “Puh Paw”

@RetreadPhoto

3 ай бұрын

@@jaysmith1408which serves zero purpose when talking to a controller a few thousand feet or a few miles away. It was meant for long distance with poor signal to noise ratio. Pompous BS to say TREE and PUHPAAAAAA in most instances.

"Oh, so you don't want to tell me how you ended up on that runway? Well, you're going to!"

@QemeH

3 ай бұрын

To be fair, it's the proper way anyways. I understand the angry curiosity of ATC to ask, but the correct way would've been to instruct him to cross and once he is clear, simply tell him: "Possible pilot deviation. Ready to copy?"

Controller almost had a heart attack, poor guy.

@QemeH

3 ай бұрын

His sigh said it all.

He definitely heard the controller but was too embarrassed to answer lol

@alexanderwalley2639

3 ай бұрын

The one saying “PaPaa” was a student. If you listen carefully you can hear a different voice after the incident

@OhMySack

3 ай бұрын

He was absolutely task saturated and his brain shut off. It's no excuse but it's what happens when the tasks are coming way to too fast for a beginner. Throw a severe mistake into the mix and it's shutdown time. His instructor had to take over as witnessed in the last communication from that aircraft. If you haven't, jump in the left seat and get thrown into a busy system and see how well you fare.

@remigiochilaule1961

3 ай бұрын

Too embarrassed or too arrogant

@hackxy1165

3 ай бұрын

@@OhMySack Only thing i dont understand is how did the instructor not catch on his student wasnt cleared and countinued

@OhMySack

3 ай бұрын

@@hackxy1165 And that is the $64,000 dollar question that I posed in my more recent response to this video. IMO, this is more on the instructor in the right seat than the kid in the left seat that went full blank-out when he hit the wall of saturation for his level of resource management.

You can hear the panicked shake in the controller's voice after the event when he gave instructions to the landing aircraft. Bless his poor heart.

the southwest pilot barely hung up the phone at Washington National and now we got a new incursion video.

@Righteouspope

3 ай бұрын

If it's the DCA incident, SWA pilot was cleared. Ground controller gave crossing instructions without coordinating with local for Runway 4. She had also been on position past 2 hours at her request.

As someone who has flown into TTN in a c172, PA44, C402, and A320 I can promise you the amount of traffic at TTN with all the flight schools makes for a difficult time. You have to be on your game because the controllers speak fast and you have to be familiar with expected taxi routes and your sequence in the pattern. Once my students were solid on radios they would be taken to TTN to test their radio readback and compliance skills. Good catch by the controller.

@einokalonen1313

3 ай бұрын

Nothing special there, the instructions were clear and the taxiway continued straight ahead. "This will be a full stop termination" also shows that the airport was familiar to the pilot. I hope he made it home safely by car. 🙄

@littlestevey4172

3 ай бұрын

Good thing a F9 A320 wasn't landing then instead of the Cessna.. It sounded like the pilot on N278P was 18 years old.

@KitYeeScott

3 ай бұрын

The controller did require a full read back, but did on the next pilot. So he knew he was partially at fault too!

@AnotherDoug

3 ай бұрын

@@einokalonen1313 "This will be a full stop termination" was said by 321CT, not the pilot taxiing along runway 34

The sigh from the the Tower was telling. Thanks for posting!

paPa became Papa once the fun was over 😂

Whew, I was getting bored of it being the tower's fault

@RobisonRacing68

3 ай бұрын

LOL!!!!!

@zacharypiech2930

3 ай бұрын

So true!

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

Yeah, this one was definitely primarily the pilot's fault, though Tower should have caught the incorrect readback. (PIlot read back "34, hold short 24," which means something very different from "cross 34, hold short 24." Pilot both said and did the former, not the latter, despite the clearance being the latter. Could have missed that part of the clearance while running an after landing checklist or some such thing.)

@fuhkerz

3 ай бұрын

​@vbscript2 It really does illustrate why proper readbacks are so important and also how powerful vocalizations can be. It's entirely possible that in the moment when he "read back" 34 short 24, in his head he knew it was "cross 34, hold short 24". But after taxiing a bit, he recalled what he SAID rather than what he was TOLD and "34 short 24" became "turn on 34, hold short of 24". Saying things aloud really can help catch mistakes in repetitive tasks, but along those same lines, saying the wrong thing aloud can have the opposite effect. (I assume the reason is similar to how people are said to recall the last time they remembered an event rather than the event itself which can lead to compounding errors on incorrect recollections.)

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

@@fuhkerz Good point. And that emphasizes even more how important it is for controllers to pay attention to readbacks and make sure they're right! The controller caught his first incorrect readback here, but unfortunately either didn't catch that one or just let it go.

I'm just going to assume that this was another example of what happens when the instructor is busy talking to a student about the flight before the brakes are set and the engine is shut down.

@pattyhaley9594

3 ай бұрын

First things first.

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

Good point. If the instructor was on board, the instructor might have been talking as the controller started the taxi clearance, which might have led the pilot to miss the "cross" part of "cross 34, hold short 24." The pilot only read back "34, hold short 24"... and that's exactly what he did.

Legend has it tower's still asking how he ended up on that runway to this day

@bardo0007

3 ай бұрын

It's on repeat in that young pilot head for sure

@matthewrammig

3 ай бұрын

It’s only been 8 days.

@notsureigaf

3 ай бұрын

@@matthewrammig Big if true

@matthewrammig

3 ай бұрын

@@notsureigaf the date of the occurrence is at the very beginning of the video. Your comment is going to age great in about five years😅

@notsureigaf

3 ай бұрын

@@matthewrammig thank you Matthew, very cool!

Controller said “Taxi F, Cross 34, Hold Short 24”…. And he said, “34, Hold Short 24” This is a perfect example of why we should ALWAYS read back complete taxi instructions. Glad everyone went home safely.

@Jonund

3 ай бұрын

@@genegade he was supposed to CROSS 34 on F and then hold short of 24 on F. He turned on runway 34 instead of crossing. Had he read back completely and correctly, this likely wouldn’t have happened or happened at the threshold of 24, not mod runway.

@TheSurrealGoose

3 ай бұрын

The first part of his reply was cut off. He may have repeated the instruction to cross and the tower may have heard it

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

Yes, what he read back is actually what he did (though not sure if he crossed the hold short bars for 24 or not.) Controller should have corrected his readback, emphasizing the "cross 34" part, then hold short 24. "F, 34, hold short 24" and "F, cross 34, hold short 24" mean quite different things.

@DaddyBeanDaddyBean

3 ай бұрын

Thank you - I listened a couple times and didn't catch that detail.

@HenryLoenwind

3 ай бұрын

@@vbscript2 "F, cross 34, F, hold short 24" would even been better. "F, cross 34, find your own way to any hold short point of 24" just invites differences in wayfinding.

I can help explain. Its not uncommon for runway 34 to be used at a taxiway to quickly send students back to the flightschool ramp at KTTN. BUT…..this is exactly why you need to readback the instructions fully with no shortcuts

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

Exactly. And why it is important for the controller to catch and correct improper/incorrect readbacks.

I did my PPL training out of KTTN. It can get very busy and can be challenging at times. The saving grace here is that we ( folks in flight school or renting) generally used to come to a stop well before the runway intersection because the shortest path back to the ramp would be "right on 34, H1,H to the ramp", so there was always the incentive to not land long. Based on 8SP initial tone, he seems way too non chalant. Hoping that he learned his lesson and takes safety more seriously.

@Arcadiez

3 ай бұрын

Well yeah i agree, but i think the ATC should have used better taxi clearance, "left on foxtrot, cross runway 34, continue foxtrot hold short runway 24". Because single pilot and still haven't even taxi off the runway before getting clearance and hear, left foxtrot, cross 34 and hold short 24 might connect as to go onto 34 and hold 24. idk why some ATC are so eager to give taxi clearance as so quickly, fuck some airports where we land with the 737 we can still be 80-90kts when they give you full taxi route plus frequency change, calm down. Still have plenty of shit to do beforehand, we're still in a high speed range. In winter ops we need to exit runway at 5kts, can't do a full readback before we safely slow down(all to avoid runway excursions) ATC way is not wrong by any-means, but to reduce confusion you give exactly step by step. But it's 100% pilot error and no clue why he attempt to cross the runway and he indeed, at least read back to hold short, plus should have seen the traffic.

@MrPilotboy93

3 ай бұрын

@@Arcadiez yeah agreed it could've been more clear. I do think this is a learning lesson to always check both ends of the runway before crossing - even if you think you're the only one on the field. If he had done that, he might of realized it well before the controller almost had a panic attack

I trained out of KTTN and earned my PPL there (Actually earned it with N321CT) I have a lot of experience with this controller in particular and I can say that he is one of the tougher ones. He does tend to make a lot of the student pilots nervous. BUT the schools know this and it isn't anything new. Sounds like the instructor for this particular student has some work to do with those comms.

Oof. I imagine being a controller at a field full of flight schools is pretty stressful.

@RetreadPhoto

3 ай бұрын

Only in some states, or in states with idiot pilots

@ValiantKnight7983

3 ай бұрын

it's largely a reflection on the school. i did my training at a fantastic little mom & pop part 61 school and that place never pulled anything like this.

@XyrousCooper

9 күн бұрын

@@ValiantKnight7983 Couldn’t agree more. My flight school shares the field with a CGAS and have never had an issue like this lol

His silence afterwards was telling. He knew he screwed up and didn't have anything to say as an excuse or reason.

@oldRighty1

3 ай бұрын

"On advice of counsel, I decline to answer this question on the grounds that what I say may incriminate me"

@davidw2739

3 ай бұрын

What was really telling is how he stopped saying paPAH - that's how you know he was goofing off earlier. Hopefully this is wakeup call for him about how seriously aviation needs to be taken.

@davidw2739

3 ай бұрын

Actually, I guess it didn't do much. First he ignored tower, then again gave an incomplete readback. If he would have read back the first set of instructions he would have heard himself say "cross 34" and might not have made the incorrect turn there.

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

One of the other pilots on frequency said that they were stepping on each other and then the pilot asked the instructor to repeat what he said, to which the controller replied with the expect phone number instead of asking the question again. Quite possible the pilot never heard the question, didn't hear it completely, or was replying to it as the controller asked the second time and we didn't hear because the controller stepped on his reply. Of course, also possible that he just didn't reply, but that seems kind of unlikely since someone else mentioned they were stepping on each other and pilot asked for the question to be repeated.

My favorite part was in the first 30 seconds: "Would you give that full readback?" No pressure, no sarcasm, no accusation. Just businesslike delivered business. Sometimes what might feel like or be interpreted as redundant is the most useful and reassuring action you could take. And even if it WASN'T polite and terse, always clearly and promptly obey, without judgment (N278SP handled it correctly). And in case anyone feels like taking insult at being asked to repeat(even just to add call sign!), save your reaction for when parked. And we all live happily ever after :)

@Bill_Woo

3 ай бұрын

Of course you noticed that N278SP repeatedly, repeatedly failed to acknowledge instructions following the goof! Stunningly poor. The only excuse that comes to mind was suggested by someone else, "talking over each other". If so, /Furious mode: That overtalk was not eliminated over 20 years ago (by queuing of digital communications, eliminating simultaneous broadcasts) speaks sadly for the future of the species. You or I could have built that system at Radio Shack in 1999.

I learn so much from these videos. I am not a pilot, but I am a boater, and many of the same lessons apply to boating, even though we are moving at much lesser speeds :)

Thank you 🙏 great edit

Atc should have probably requested a corrected read back “34 hold short 24” shouldn’t have sufficed.

The first time he said paPA like a fucking 🤡, I knew it was going to be him fucking everything up.

@llaughridge

3 ай бұрын

That's the correct way to say it.

@remigiochilaule1961

3 ай бұрын

​@llaughridge except he was just styling. It must have been the only thing that was correct in all of his readbacks

@HaroldRutila

3 ай бұрын

11 years of professional aviation and I've never once heard someone say "the correct way to say it" is with emphasis on the second syllable. FAA docs do not support that position either. www.faa.gov/air_traffic/publications/atpubs/aim_html/chap4_section_2.html

@pattyhaley9594

3 ай бұрын

Attitude is everything huh?

@FlightX101

3 ай бұрын

Its not a big deal……wait until you fly internationally and hear people talk lol

Sounds like Sierra pa-Pa needs to learn to listen to instructions and give correct readbacks, not only did he sound like a cocky idiot he proved he was by intruding into not one but two runways

currently professional pilot here - I keep a pen and paper handy to WRITE taxi instructions. (Used to do this on ForeFlight scratchpad - but that isn't efficient enough). No pilot is beyond pen, paper, and hand-writing taxi instructions. I have a shorthand language for "hold short" and "cross" that is precise and clear. This is the small price of a relaxed and perfect readback; the price of going to the hotel each night in peace.

One thing that always gets me with a lot of these videos is how American controllers berate pilots on the radio. For what purpose other than boost your own ego, vent, and make the pilot feel small? The pilot still has an aircraft to control. Everything can be cleared up with a phone call afterwards, and reduce the unnecessary radio chatter. If any of my controllers did this they'd get extra training as it reduces safety. If anyone makes an error, just issue new instructions to resolve the situation.

@jerseyshoredroneservices225

3 ай бұрын

This controller reminded me of a lot of cops I've seen videos of. He kind of seemed to take it personally and get himself worked up.

@bloodspatteredguitar

3 ай бұрын

Yeah, 100% on the pilot in this instance, but in the moment that everyone is shaken up, clear instructions and a phone number are the only things that need be heard.

@johnellis5828

3 ай бұрын

Tell me you don't understand human emotion without telling me. If you're not physically shaken after stopping a serious accident from happening, then you're not human. Moron.

@pattyhaley9594

Ай бұрын

I like your style. No need to be toxically shaming.

that controller was def got the shit scared out of him- you can hear him sigh. Good awareness on his part

The lack of awareness from 8SP is staggering. It was a good thing the other plane was able to stop safely. ..And that poignant silence from 8SP when tower kept asking them what they were doing. They knew they messed up.

@bittnerbs

3 ай бұрын

Sounds like a student pilot. Possibly on a solo?

@vincelam1998

3 ай бұрын

@@bittnerbsif you listen to the initial landing and taxi transmissions from 8SP and listen to the transmissions from 8SP after they messed up their taxi, it sounds like two different voices. Probably an instructor or another pilot/passenger

@alexanderwalley2639

3 ай бұрын

@@vincelam1998absolutely, you can hear the difference in the voices, not only in the way they say “PaPa

@oldRighty1

3 ай бұрын

Every video like this is the same approach. Don't answer the question, just say "We're fine down here, how are you?" like Han Solo.

@mtsky-tc6uw

3 ай бұрын

the reply was "huh"....

Pilot kept shortening the read back.

@KennethAGrimm

3 ай бұрын

Makes me wonder if he has a non-linear brain (as I do) making it difficult to remember long sequences.

@Quotenwagnerianer

3 ай бұрын

@@KennethAGrimm You don't have to remember anything. It's called READback. You are supposed to write this down and then read it. No one is expecting you to memorize instructions and tell them back by heart.

Nice seeing so many of my neighbors in here. I'm 4 NM from the Yardley VOR.

@VideoManDan

3 ай бұрын

I've trained at TTN several times in the past before I decided to change my career plans.

I hear " man, let me give you a call tho, once we terminate the flight" . As in " and i´ll tell you who I am " 😄

Puh-PAH!

“Pa-pa” give me a break 😂

@confuseatronica

3 ай бұрын

I didn't think you could actually hear the sound of a little finger sticking out, weird.

@spelldaddy5386

3 ай бұрын

@@confuseatronica😂😂

@absurdengineering

3 ай бұрын

Reminds me of Downton Abbey 😂

@mytech6779

3 ай бұрын

pupuhhh...

@JimNortonsAlcoholism

3 ай бұрын

​@@greg6126It's Pa-pa not Pah-paaaah

I can't stand lazy read backs. This is a prime example of why.

Every once in awhile you hear a controller repeatedly on the frequency making pilots repeat the read back with callsign because the pilot shortened it, or forgot to say their callsign/tail numbers. Some pilots think these controllers are dicks for insisting pilots read back the full clearance with call signs, but this is exactly why! I think the controller should have corrected him with his obviously incorrect readback. Maybe he figured the guy got it and just had a lazy read back, but in this case the pilot actually read it back wrong and did what he understood the clearance to be…minus the hold short part.

Love your channel man ! Keep uploading ! Btw how do you find time to do this and fly at the same time ?

Papa not going to be happy! 😮

That ATC sounds cool. Id like to meet him some day.

That sounded ( or not sounded ) like an instructor clearly letting his student know to not speak on frequency about what you think just happened.

a full readback does NOT mean "say the entire N number"

@webcucciolo

3 ай бұрын

yep, he read the runway, only needed to say if traffic in sight or looking for traffic. Since he did not mention it even in second readback, the controller asked directly

@imzanky6321

3 ай бұрын

@@webcucciolo What? Not sure what you're talking about. N278SP didn't acknowledge that he was cleared to land, and I didn't hear him read back the runway, so that's why Tower asked for a full readback.

@brianlondon4695

3 ай бұрын

At TTN it kind of does. The’ll yell at you for not saying the N

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

@@brianlondon4695 Seriously? They want you to say the 'N'? The AIM literally says to not do that.

@confuseatronica

3 ай бұрын

@@brianlondon4695 eww that sucks but i believe it

Was acting all "cool" on the radio with the paapaaaa amazing how quickly that changed and radio silence when he knew he had messed up. Would love to have heard the phone call i bet the controller was giving him a right telling off.

It takes 2 to tango . Tower can sit in a nice armchair and spit out instructions like it was his last breath but the pilot is in a dynamic situation , busy doing flows after exit runway . Yes aircraft could listen better but slow the F down with the instruction . This is not a race who can speak faster . What happened to put yourself in other situation ?CRM maybe?

I’m sure someone has said it but 8SP is a flight school airplane. It’s where I got all my ratings. TTN can get very busy with two flight schools and like 40 training aircraft as well as Frontier flying out of there and lots of private aircraft.

I trained for a while at KTTN. Good airport, but yeah, this is not the sort of mistake one should ever be making even though it gets busy

Looks like N278SP simply got their taxi directions wrong; they were supposed to cross runway 34 on Foxtrot, then hold short of Runway 24. But they read back the taxi instructions as "34, hold short of runway 24"; instead of crossing they turned onto Runway 34 itself and maybe got confused where they were.

@user-yi3yx2fn7g

3 ай бұрын

Well, pa-PA read back the "hold short" part but failed to do even that sooooo....

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

@@user-yi3yx2fn7g Did he? Did it actually say anywhere that he crossed the 24 hold short bars or was the controller just yelling at him to stop because he wasn't supposed to be taxing on 34 in the first place? Seemed hard to tell from the video to me.

@FarikoUnited1

3 ай бұрын

@@vbscript2 My interpretation is the controller was upset they were on 34 to begin with when they should have crossed over it and been at a different intersection and not that they impeded the landing plane in any way,

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

@@FarikoUnited1 Perhaps, though with him yelling "Stop! Stop! Stop!," it sounded like he thought they were about to continue taxing across 24 and conflict with the landing aircraft.

Whoopsie. Good response as it unfolded.

That “PaPA!” turned back into “Papa” real quick after he was told to call a number.

I think that pilot knew he'd end up on this channel and didn't want to broadcast over the radio how he fucked up.

@virginiatyree6705

3 ай бұрын

😂 someone has some splaining to do.

@ellend7680

3 ай бұрын

Hopefully he learned to work the radios properly or give up being a pilot. These are people's lives and professionalism is required. No cowboys.

Sounds like a different voice in the last couple of transmissions. Was there an IP on the plane who allowed this to happen? That'd be remarkable.

Had similar happen to me at KATA (uncontrolled) on a calm day. I called out 3 times in the pattern setting up for final on 23 and some moron pulled on to 5. Aborted, flew OVER him and never could get their tail number. Infuriating.

I wish we had more follow up info on these. I would love to hear how these phone calls are going.

Finally not tower’s fault … was about time

It seems like the pilot was trying to avoid having to answer and you could definitely see why. But when ATC slowed down and clearly said We have a number for you to call when the pilot came back on you could hear the resignation in his voice. You just know he was thinking, Ah crap I'm busted

Oh boy, that was close.

For a moment that Papa pronunciation made me think that this was Downton Abbey, Trenton NJ style.

This looks and sounds like another error due to instruction distraction. An instructor, with the best of intentions, can become so busy trying to teach proper theory and procedures to a student that he fails to pay attention to the potential dangers of the dynamics of the present. I think this MAY fall into the category of "non-pertinent conversation during operations in a critical movement area." Let's maintain a sterile cockpit and allow the operating environment and radio procedures of the airport movement areas be the teachers themselves while we keep our mouths shut about anything other than what is happening dynamically at the time.

paPa was an audible display of his hazardous attitude. Brought back to humility when he realized he f'ed up.

2 in one day.

Trenton can be busy now. There are two flight schools there and frontier and a ton of bizz jet traffic. The controllers there are always solid there, but they have a big job. They keep an eye on the flight school planes. It's not a relaxing day at work for that group.

Having trained extensively at this airport, I can tell you it’s busy and some of the contract controllers aren’t the greatest (some of them are). In the past one of them specifically has caused complete losses of SA in the cockpit because he berated the pilots on the radio rather than understanding it’s a heavy training environment. That said, it’s still a runway incursion and needs to be addressed.

Most normal day at trenton mercer

Complete loss of situational awareness by that pilot. We latch onto his pronunciation of his call sign but it does give us a brief insight to what his brain is doing … once he realized he’d made an error, that little voice lilt was all gone. Let’s hope the sheer terror of being on a runway instead of a taxiway - evident by his inability to respond or process what the controller was asking and telling - will convince him never to be so unfocused again. What would have been the harm to simply stop before making the turn onto the runway and radioing the ATC…”confirm left on 34?” 74Gear (Kelsey) always says even when he’s sure he knows something, if the other pilot isn’t sure and asks him to confirm, he does anyway

I have seen this a few times as a CFI and it never hurts to brief before you move as well as write down instructions. His radios are lack luster as he has multiple failed read backs.. cfi needs to have a chat with him

I fly outta TTN for pilot training, and was actually supposed to be there on that day lol. But I could only imagine how 1CT was feeling having barely come close to clipping 8SP. 8SP's lack of situational awareness is insane, if you're not sure where you need to go, just ask, don't just blindly taxi on the runway.

Where is this?

Got to pay attention people.

SP read back "34, hold short 24" and the controller did not correct him, so I guess he understood he should go onto runway 34 and not cross it!

Keep that tablet on and the airport diagram on. When in doubt don't cross. Just stop and get hand held to the ramp.

So, exactly what takes place in these post-deviation phone calls?

Planes crossing runways while others take off or land seems like a regular occurrence now...

Why did the Tower not instruct him to turn right at A, transit taxiway A and cross runway 16/34 at the far end of taxiway A? This would have removed the need to cross the live runway 24?

Welp. That's gonna be 2 if not 3 debriefs for ya. Good luck living that one down paPa

Sounded like two different people answering the radio in N278SP, the smart ass papa guy that shortcuted his read back for landing and crossed the runway when he should not have and then another dude that answered when the controller told them about the possible pilot deviation phone call. His earlier half assed response to the controllers instructions and this action crossing an active runway without clearance would seem to indicate he does not take this piloting stuff seriously. Had construction going on at the airport I fly out of and was given taxi instructions that included using a runway recently, I asked the controller to repeat and stopped and asked before crossing the runway that was active even though he cleared us to cross when giving the taxi instructions after we landed, not something to play around with, particularly in a small GA plane with large passenger jets around. Making the "wrong turn" onto the inactive runway would be no big deal, controller would give him some shit about it, but encroaching on the active runway? That is not cool. Dude probably likes to go home and listen to himself on liveatc...or he did until this happened.

Distracted pilot on taxiway.

As a controller myself, the controller has to listen to the readback as well. Pilot did what he read back "34 Short 24" (poor phraseology), save for the hold short error (possibly due to lack of a hold line, guard lights or signage). Thats how he found himself on Runway 34. The Controllers job is to catch and correct that readback/hearback error, especially with intersecting runways and training pilots. Dont forget to say the words "Runway" and "Hold Short" in your RT kids! Its just lazieness not to, we are all guilty of it (on both sides of the mic) and we all know better (except student pilots who are still learning, and we ALL have to be aware of that).

How you pilots can hear and process all that quick speech over a radio (and repeat it back) is beyond me.

@Falcon2.39-1

3 ай бұрын

It really is like learning a new language. There’s a certain cadence to the order of things that are said over the radios and once you familiarize yourself with what those things are, and the airport layout, you’ll pick up on it fairly quick. It’s like learning to drive when your dad tells you to make a left here, right here, this lane, that lane…

@jerseyshoredroneservices225

3 ай бұрын

This controller was one of the more difficult ones to understand. The main key to understanding them in general is to anticipate what they're gonna say. It's much easier to hear them clearly when you're already know what they're gonna say and you're kind of just listening for anything that's different. It's kind of like anything else that comes at you quick and requires a correct response. The more experience you have the more you know what's about to happen and have yourself prepared for it.

Two times this could have been stopped if the pilot would have just looked down the runway they were crossing. Both times they were oriented such that they would have a great view of what was landing . . .

I just don’t think I should finish my flight training, I don’t think I’ll have fun with it anymore.

01:48 can heard stress in his voice and the breath...

OK, so if it is a student pilot (which it really sounds like it is) the tower issuing a PD, what is likely to happen? Will he be grounded and forced to go through more training, or will the CFI tell this poor sap he's not ready for flight?

@callumwatson6685

3 ай бұрын

Depends on the tower if they push the issue any further.. but from what I have heard usually expect a call from the feds after about what happened. May be a slap on the wrist for the CFI and or a possible retraining class. Also a good idea to file a report regardless on the pilot side

2:14 Controller says "proceed through that intersection..." Is that acceptable terminology rather than cross runway 24?

On an unrelated note... 'nvreisp' STOP STOP STOP. How insanely fast and shortened the ATC says the callsign. I could never pick that up (I'm no native speaker, nor a pilot, but still...)

It's pretty uncommon for someone to not make 34 or even Delta when landing 24 at KTTN. It's possible he was unfamiliar with taxiing back to the west ramp from Foxtrot, also Tower will tell us to taxi down 34 almost everytime so complacency definitely played a huge role in this runway incursion.

There have been a lot of these close call recently. What the h*** is going on?

Dude, if you just ignore the tower they'll go away, and you can do whatever you want to.

This is my home airport!!! I know allll of these planes and the controllers.

@alpenglow4243

3 ай бұрын

Do you know the story here?

@kevw172

3 ай бұрын

its all told in the video the pilot was supposed to cross 34 on F to hold short on 24 I dont think he was supposed to turn left on 34

@vbscript2

3 ай бұрын

@@kevw172 He definitely wasn't supposed to turn left on 34, but he did read back "34, hold short 24" rather than "cross 34, hold short 24," so possible he misheard the instruction - and read it back and executed it as he heard it. A full read back and a correction to the readback from the controller likely would have prevented this.

Can you explain to me how'd you end up on that runway? " I Googled it."

Got anything on DAL 2728 that declared an emergency this week?

i used to work at signature flight support at this airport as a LST! we would conduct fuel operations for not only our ramp, but also the flight school and frontier airlines at the terminal. i talked with the controllers on frequency everyday to transition the fuel truck from our ramp to the terminal. i’d also occasionally get the opportunity to fly into trenton, park at signature and work my shift, then fly home. these are some of the most patient controllers working here. especially with how big infinity flight group has gotten (50-60 cessnas now) as well as all the other training aircraft from the local area.

Too many close call in the last days. WHAT'S WRONG WITH THEM?

34 ... 24.... 54... what's the difference?!?!?

How can you have a pilot deviation in a private plane such as a Cessna that just sounds odd how can there be a pilot deviation in a privately owned plane

😮

pa-PA!

pa-PAH read back the "hold short 24" part but failed to do it anyway. Tower is talking so fast it's REALLY hard to understand.

@MajorMinor12

3 ай бұрын

It's likely they were going to hold short of 24. The tower was asking why they were on the runway, meaning Runway 34, and not on Foxtrot, as expected.

@jerseyshoredroneservices225

3 ай бұрын

It's complicated watching this video... Controller is acting like he did drive out onto runway 24 but He may not have. We don't know how accurate this animation was. As the other guy just pointed out controller may have been asking why he turned onto 34 rather than crossing it as instructed.

@fuhkerz

3 ай бұрын

​@@jerseyshoredroneservices225I think the panic in the controller's voice came from the fact that pa-pahh had taxied that far down 34 before he noticed. Given that the pilot had already made one big mistake and was on a runway he wasn't cleared to taxi on, it's probably best to issue a stop command at that point to fix the situation rather than hope or assume he will execute the second half of the instruction and actually hold short of 24.

Takes nothing to transition from paPa to poop A …

“How did you end up on that runway?” Is this really a question? There is only one possibility of how he ended up there…..he isn’t paying attention and did not follow tower instructions. It’s odd to me that tower is giving him the option to explain it away when there is no possible excuse. Him

2SP got too cocky. Karma took it from there.

I had to double-check that my KZread player wasn't set to 1.5x speed. As a casual member of the public who listens in, I couldn't here the call signs or instructions. Controller talks too fast