There could be a Sherman Tank sitting in the dealer's yard and they would tell you that your 1/2 ton pick-up will pull it just fine!!

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

LOL! That made me chuckle

@mesanders1113

3 жыл бұрын

Lol back when I got my RV the first thing they asked is what size truck I had and it's towing capacity

@adame924

3 жыл бұрын

Hi@@mesanders1113 Did they ask about payload? if they did I'd like to go to that dealership :) I think payload is the number 99% of people exceed before anything else.

550 LBS est tongue weight + 40 LBS propane + 40 LBS battery + 10 LBS weight distribution brackets + 150 LBS of cargo in storage compartment + 100 LBS clothing and bedding and gear in side the front half of the camper = 890 LBS looks about right to me. Try and remove everything that did not come with the camper from the factory and I bet the tongue weight will be about 550 LBS. This is why a lot of rigs are over weight all that stuff adds up fast.

Love this episode Patrick! We just did our NuCamp 400 with a Surline and a floor jack. Came in pretty close to the advertised value by NuCamp. Everyone should do this! We still need to measure again with freshwater tank filled. Thanks again for sharing your story to make us campers more educated.

Thank you Patrick for this video. It’s a help to know and be able to do the weight the campers are when you are pulling them. Thank you for this video. Glad to know to do the tongue weight and scale.

Trust but verify!! Great video. We always tell people just because the trailer says it weights something doesn't mean it is always does. Same with tow vehicles. Just because a tow vehicle says it can tow 10k lbs, doesn't mean the vehicle has the available payload to handle to tongue weight. Thanks for sharing your experience and I hope it helps someone. Stay safe and happy camping

I have a 2018 1985 and use a sherline scale. My tongue weight with my typical load is 680lbs. First thing is when you weigh the trailer it has to be level, I weighed my level and then a 1/2 bubble off level each way, it can make 100 - 150 lbs +/- difference. The tongue weight listed in the brochure and the Lance website is based on the dry weight. Dry weight includes two full propane tanks, but not factory options, dealer options, water or cargo. On the Lance website if you use their “Build your Lance” feature and add in your options you’ll get a new tongue weight estimate. That estimate won’t include batteries which are dealer installed although the lithium option might be included. One thing that will increase your tongue weight is the type of Weight Distribution Hitch you’re using, many Lance owners use the lightweight Andersen Hitch, under 60lbs. What I do to reduce tongue weight is put heavy items like tools, an axe, a few spare parts etc go in the rear exterior cargo hold. The black and gray tanks usually have at least 5 gallons in each unless its right after visiting the dump station, that plus the 6 gallons in the water heater helps counter balance the fresh water tank which I run at about 1/3rd full unless I won’t have hookups, but even then I don’t fill the tank until I’m close to my destination. I limit the storage area under the couch to things like extra blankets and other light items. If all else fails I just load the refrigerator with extra beer to counter balance the hitch weight 😃. On a different topic, I know you had a slide issue before and I’m sure you don’t want another one so I would make sure that the stabilizers are always down per the Lance manual when the slide is out or is being retracted/extended, the slide may twist or rack otherwise. One thing to check before extending the slide on the 1985 to is double check that the TV is still locked to the wall, if it comes loose down a bumpy road it can catch the slide. Have fun.

@volocty

2 жыл бұрын

Hey CL, do you think stocking with Lite Beer will help?! :-)

@RandomCyrChannel

2 жыл бұрын

Really great comments. I learned several things. Thanks.

Hello Travelers, Glad your Tongue Weight turned out OK. Did what you did and checked our manual so when we decide in the future to buy a small vehicle to tow with our motor home, we'll be good to go. Sure do like your videos. I came across this really neat hint awhile back: If you are boon docking, download about a gal of your gray water in a milk carton, and use that water to flush the toilet, thus saving your fresh water for showering. Have a very Merry Christmas. ~~ Karen Calypte

That was our biggest problem when we started rving back in March. I had an f150 that was rated to pull 9500 and a cargo weight of about 1800. We bought a 31 foot travel trailer that weighed abou 5800 lbs. With a cargo capacity of 1800 lbs. and a tongue weight of 640. We bought a used wdh by blue ox with spring bars rated for 750lbs. We figured out pretty quick this was a problem. So, I bought 1,000lbs. Bars and added helper springs to the f150,which helped. I weighed at a cat scale and realized my tongue weight was over 1100lbs. So, then we bought 1500lbs, which helped even more. This pretty much was maxing out the f150 cargo capacity, but it worked ok unless it was windy. We finally a couple of weeks ago traded the f150 in for an f250 and I finally feel pretty safe out on the road.

@oldsalt8011

3 жыл бұрын

F150 is about useless except for pulling a garden trailer.

@jasonbrushett3

3 жыл бұрын

@@oldsalt8011 what an absolutely ridiculous comment

@theantiqueactionfigure

3 жыл бұрын

Just about every half ton on the road pulling a 30 foot travel trailer is legally overloaded!

@oldsalt8011

3 жыл бұрын

@@jasonbrushett3 no, its true...Ok a small pop -up or s jon boat

@jasonbrushett3

3 жыл бұрын

@@oldsalt8011 it's not true I happen to own 1 .....it is more than capable of anything you have mentioned. Absolutely ridiculous comment again!

When you crossed the cat scale (a few vids ago) the front and rear axles of the truck added up to 6200 lbs. In the Tundra introduction vid you reported the gcwr of the truck is 7100 lbs and the max payload is 1305 lbs, which would be an unloaded vehicle weight of 5795 lbs. Subtracting the trucks scale weight, which included the tongue of the Lance, from the unloaded truck weight would reveal the actual payload was 405 lbs at the time you crossed the scale. So my question is, what changed between now and then to end up with over 800 lbs on the tongue, before adding water? Part of that answer, I’m guessing, is that you probably had your weight distribution bars engaged when you crossed the scale, which would have put some of the tongue weight back on the trailer axles. If that is right, I think one more pass over the scales with weight distribution detached would give a definitive answer to this tongue weight question. Regardless of the above, I agree the mfr should post tongue weight on the placard. It’s a serious safety issue.

@lindaballard6387

2 жыл бұрын

Adding weight behind the fulcrum will affect tongue weight a lot. Try using the scale with a passenger in the rear of the trailer and then have them walk towards front to see the difference.

@ReflectedMiles

Жыл бұрын

They can't really placard a variable--at least any number that would be very meaningful.

@jamesr208

Жыл бұрын

The weight of the trailer varies too, yet every manufacturer is required to publish a GVWR, or maximum. No reason there couldn't be a tested and rated max for the tongue. They don't test and publish it b/c they don't have to, which leaves the customer to figure it out as Patrick did.

@ReflectedMiles

Жыл бұрын

@@jamesr208 How deceiving do you think a max-tongue-weight number could be to an average RV driver? Is it determined structurally? From road stability? I suspect the invitation to confusion and/or misuse would be greater than any potential benefit. I could see RV dealers complaining about it dissuading buyers who then thought their tow vehicle had to be capable of the max weight instead of the actual, operational weight, and then we’re back to the situation in this video where actual, loaded weight needs to be known. With my unit, I can change my tongue weight significantly just by what the levels are in my three tanks. Then there’s the equalizer hitch, when applicable, and its settings…

@jamesr208

Жыл бұрын

@@ReflectedMiles It would be no less deceiving than publishing a tongue weight based on the "dry weight" the day it left the factory, without any cargo or even a battery, which is exactly what every manufacturer is doing right now. And I care far more for the safety of my family and other RV'ers on the road around me than for RV dealers and whatever they choose to complain about.

Hey Patrick, thanks for this one, well done. Love the transparency as always. It is very unfortunate that there is no penalty for perjury in the RV industry. I have discovered the same beast lives in the automotive world as well. Just like ghost busters, who ya gonna call? If they had put the truth on the sticker, the conscientious buyer like yourself would not have bought it. According the advertised numbers that RV manufacturers put out, and the numbers that automotive manufacturers put out, it would take a 1 ton to pull that kind of tongue weight. That being said, the same problem i know exists in the automotive world. They go the other way though. They are conservative on the advertised abilities in the weight they can handle. Proof: even though you are using a weight dist hitch, the Tundra is doing the job. It is more than capable to handle that kind of pressure on the frame, hitch, and everything in between. This all comes from years of fleet management Patrick. I do find it amazing that the Tacoma pulled it though. Toyota is my brand for sure...no other like them. The dealer i bought the Tab from sells Lance as well, we have had this conversation about that very camper you have. 1000 lb potential for liquid alone in that unit. There is no way the tongue weight will ever be 500 lbs. Your Tundra is fine with it i am sure. Happy Holidays to you and Patty Ron + Cindy

Oh my....that is a huge difference! Glad that you investigated.

Thanks. I just went back to my vehicle manual and did some figuring.

A bit off the subject but i wanted to say congrats that you made your 25k subscribers goal! We love watching you.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much Cyndi! We were pretty excited to see it happen on New Years Day. I never imagined that happening when we started our channel over 3 years ago.

"If the manufacturer would just weigh the tongue before they ship the trailer ". That would involve them being honest and transparent! Those words don't exist in the automotive or RV sales business! Imagine everything else were not told..... Great video.

@TravelswithDelaney

Жыл бұрын

Thank you!

Good info and well worth the time to watch. We have a 2185 with a 915# advertised hitch weight…by rookie mistake I bought the 1000# sureline scale and pegged it quickly. I have done the math and loaded going down the road with a equalizer hitch, full LP, water and gear I think we are 1500 #s. No problem for our F250, but certainly I never felt confident in our Yukon XL capacity.

My tongue weight varies greatly depending on weather I have the motorcycle(s) in the rig. The bikes reduce my tongue weight because a majority of that weight is behind the axle. Good info.

When this is actually booked to your truck, your hitching system also adds to the weight. So you could actually be 1,000 with water

I bought a neat tongue scale recently from e-trailer it wasn’t that expensive and has been extremely useful in setting up my trailer.

Thanks Patrick. A very eye-opening subject for all to be aware of.

@TravelswithDelaney

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you

Wow. When I first saw you towing that camper with your Tacoma a was a little concerned. You see I have a 3rd tacoma and tow a 2700 pound camper and would never think of towing anything more than 3500 pounds total. At 2700 pounds without weight distribution the tacoma would squat badly, porpoising was bad. I had to use a weight distribution hitch. However, one of the problems with weight distribution and a single axle trailer, what I have, is that due to the extra weight now transferred to the trailer axle, you can easily exceed the max capacity of the trailers axel and/or tires. I was amazed that you bought a new truck during your trip out west. This new trailer is sure giving you a lot of content for your site, thanks.

You and the comments below are excellent information... Thank you!!!

Really useful video, nice work. Thank you.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Glad you enjoyed it!

I'm not surprised many out there are in the same boat. Truck has the tow capacity but payload is usually the weak link. When you add the occupants weights, fuel weight, tongue weight, hitch weight, any cargo in the bed most would be surprised to find they are over the rated payload of the truck not to mention possibly the RV itself. I am pulling a Jayco TT with my 18 Nissan Titan and my tow capacity is fine but I am close to payload capacity if not over(varies depending on my cargo in the bed). I have changed to E rated tires on the truck which reduces payload because of their weight but I feel better regarding possible blowouts. I also added Air Lift Air springs again it helps level out the truck to insure the steering is not affected but does nothing positive to the actual payload capacity other than add more weight. I feel pretty good towing but I am looking to upgrade to a truck with a much better payload and heavier tow capacity as well. Some considerations are if you have excess payload available in the RV to add overage in the Truck to the RV but be sure to do it safely regarding positioning.

Hey Patrick - great video ! I have a relevant story along these lines. I purchased a Lance 2465 in Dec 2020 to tow with my new Chevy Tahoe. Since it was winter and I had not yet purchased my Blue Ox Sway Control hitch, we stored it at RV dealer until April 2021 pickup. Tahoe can handle 8200 lbs and 820lbs on the tongue. Brochure said 665 lb tongue (estimate)....fwd to our pickup and the dealer said it was 800lbs on the tongue but hitch would make it a non issue. We hitched up and the Tahoe was not happy even with the hitch. We weighed the tongue....940 lbs !!! After some difficult discussions with the dealer we traded down to a new, Lance 1995 model (390 lbs tongue per brochure). Finally picked up the new Lance 3 weeks ago, dealer said 600lbs on the tongue. The Tahoe was fine with the new model, level and stable while towing. I loaded up the new metal front cargo tray with at least 200 lbs of cargo and used my new Sherline weight scale and it says 620-630 lbs (with all 3 filled propane but no water and minimal inside items just yet). I will weigh again with full water and update this as appropriate. I TOTALLY agree with you that RV manufacturers should be REQUIRED to weigh and post the factory finished weight (w/full propane since that is how people will use them) . It's a safety issue and a consumer rights type of issue - its too important to not change this.

@TravelswithDelaney

2 жыл бұрын

I do wish we had went with the 1995 model instead of the 1985 just for tongue weight. They are very similiar layouts but your tongue weight is about 300# less. Hopefully you are loving your new trailer. Thank you for sharing that story with me.

@southlakeowendrive

2 жыл бұрын

Yea but how can they sell you a trailer for your half ton pickup if they tell the truth?

Incredible. I just ordered the 2021 Lance #2465 (the heaviest Lance) and bought a truck BASED on manufacture’s info so I knew what wt I could SAFELY tow with it. Thank goodness the man from the company I ordered from made sure I bought a truck based on 10,000 lbs towable wt. but I’m still worried. You are absolutely right. If tongue wt prior to shipping, (with all those options included), was on the sticker, we would have actual accurate information figuring out CCC. Many people don’t realize how much the CCC changes based on those options and it’s not on a sticker ANYWHERE! So thank you. This was an eye opener.

@localpatriot2931

Жыл бұрын

I have had a nightmare with my 2020 2465, in the shop waiting for repairs 18 months out of 23 owned. Should have expected disappointment when they filled all the tanks for a “test” and forgot to drain them before hooking it up to our Nissan Titan for a 600 mile trip home over 2 mountain ranges Have you had Dexter axles replaced? Water leaks from bad plumbing connections? Failed slides? Defective thermal windows? Forgot to seal under counter sink that waterlogged and swelled the counter? …

Outstanding video. I think that, based on seeing some rigs rolling down the road, people don't pay attention to their weights. We saw a truck and trailer pass us today on our way home from the coast. It looked like the truck was popping a wheelie!.. Scary part he was doing about 70 mph. Crazy. But you are right.. this is an easy fix at the manufacturer. Just post the tongue weight (dry) so we know. A gallon of water is 8 lbs. I can do the rest of the that math.. thanks Patrick. Great video.

Weight added behind the axle will reduce your tongue weight. Like a boat you have to be careful about weight distribution when you load it up.

@gerardtrigo380

3 жыл бұрын

I must add that for stability between 5% and 15% of the total weight of the trailer should be on the tongue.

Am surprised at this as well, agree with TexasScout that the Strain Gauge would be a better indicator, but am a believer in the Weight Distribution Hitches (even though I do not even have a trailer, just agree with the concept). The move to the Tundra was a good decision! And in the end, the game at play is stay under the GVRW on both units, thereby not voiding Warranty and having to deal with an insurance claim not being covered in the case of an accident.......Merry Christmas You Guys....

Interesting video thanks for sharing

Eye opening! We're fine for now, but it's very useful info for the future if we want to get a different camper from the 400.

Thanks for this. We own the exact year and model. I pull with a 3/4 GMC but I might check the weight distribution hitch now.

The Lance 1985 base weight is 4245 and you probably have 450 pounds of options added to the trailer. Throw in 70 pounds of batteries, 360 pounds of water, several hundred pounds of food, pots, pans, clothes, etc. and before long you've got a heavy trailer. What's the total weight of the trailer at the CAT scale? Your tongue weight should be 12-15% of that weight. 15% of GVWR (6200) for a 1985 is 930 pounds. Looks like you didn't make that calculation yourself. The info is on the Lance site.

Very interesting topic. Many RV owners often don't realize that they tow illegal amounts of cargo. I always think about it when we leave campsites and have full tanks on our ways to find dump stations after boondocking. Obviously this would be a major issue once you are involved in a accident and the police starts weighing you RV.... Our Lance 2445 e.g. has a very low tongue weight for it's size. We are always try to pack enough in the front to stabilize our drive.

@azclaimjumper

3 жыл бұрын

If an RV owner is involved in an accident you can be sure Police will be weighing your RV & tongue weight to see if you are illegally OVERWEIGHT. KNOWING your actual tongue weight when loaded prior to each trip should be mandatory.

Very good video to be thinking about tongue weight. Although the trailer has two axles, it has one fulcrum, and the tongue weight is effected by the weight distribution forward and aft of the trailer's axle(s). You need to look at the trailer's GAWR (Gross Axel Weight Rating), which, for your model, is 2900 for each axle and 5700 for both, excludes tongue weight (which is carried by the tow). If you were to weigh your tow and trailer, you would get four numbers: Tow's two axles, trailer's combined axle, and the total weight, or GCVWR (Gross Combined Vehicle Weight Rating of the tow and trailer). By balancing weight inside the trailer, you can shift weight from the tow vehicle's axels to trailer axle(s) and vice-a-versa. For example, 500 pounds in the very front of the trailer has a different effect on the tongue than 500 pounds in the very back of the trailer. Knowing the weight of the Tow's weight pre and post-hitch (with all passengers inside), you can easily calculate your tongue weight (which is the difference between the two), and adjust weight accordingly, so as not to exceed the GAWR (Gross Axel Weight Rating) of the tow or the trailer as well as the GCVWR, which you are not supposed to exceed.

For these scales I was told by the manufacture that if you change the weight in the trailing you must lift it off the scale and put it back down or it won't accurately read. Not sure how much of a difference it would make just passing on what the Vice President of Manufacturing, Karl, told me. :)

The Owner’s Group for Lances has a good write up about calculating your vehicles’ weights. I believe the sticker on each individual Lance Trailer is on that yellow tag on the Lance as well as on your sales invoice. This should include the weight out the door from the manufacturer with all options, 1 tank of propane, and one battery. Also show, but not included in the above number is the weight of a full fresh water tank.

Agreed. If different model of trucks are required to have their payload on the door frame, travel trailers should have their specific tongue weight on their stickers. We are in the market for a 2295. I'm estimating tongue weight by taking the manufacturer's "dry weight" figure and estimated tongue weight, getting that percentage, then jumping to the max weight of the trailer and using the percentage to calculate the tongue weight from that. In your case, that figure generates a tongue weight of 803 (closer to your initial dry weight in the video). So, it's not perfect, but helps you figure out if you are overly optimistic on your tow vehicle's capabilities. Picked an F250 for that reason.

Wow. Surprised at this too. Your taco must have been way over limit.

Another great video!! Thanks😍👍🇨🇦♥️‼️I just figured out ours, and we are fine, even with fresh water.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

That is awesome!

Based on our CAT scale weight of our Lance 2375, we were close to 1100 lbs which did not cause so much of a problem with our payload of our existing F150 when loaded, but we were over our Rear Axle Weight Rating by some 450 lbs or so. Since no amount of redistribution of weight in our camper is going to reduce the weight for our Rear Axle Weight Rating, we got a new truck, an F150 with the Heavy Duty Payload Package, which achieved what we need to do. Thanks for the video, very informative.

@TravelswithDelaney

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for sharing your story. I think this happens more than people realize where payload is ok but the rear axle is over the weight rating. Glad you found a solution.

The manufacturer estimated tongue weight was surprisingly way off! This was a great video Patrick because we should all know our tongue weight and obviously we can’t rely on info provided.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you Randi! We were really shocked how far off it was.

You have to add at least 200lbs for batteries and propane tanks. Water tank placement is huge also.

All signed up for the second channel. thanks fo r the great info .

Interesting video Patrick. I would agree with those commenters/comments questioning the accuracy of the Sherline device and the likelihood that your 1985 tongue weight would be almost 1000 pounds. You added 45 gallons of water which = 375 pounds, yet the Sherline, if I recall the video correctly, reflected a significantly lesser total increase. Is some portion of your water tank supported over the axle, or is it completely forward of same? Be interesting if you could test the tongue weight on a CAT scale. I suspect it's closer to 800 than 1000. Merry Christmas & Happy 2021 to you, Patty, and the royal puppies.

Excellent information.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Thank you

those tanks weight 37-39 lbs full each, with three that's a little over 100lbs, but the best deal is to weight it at the dealer before it's loaded and then after you load it, because these numbers differences can be vast lol!! thanks for all you videos stay safe and happy travels..

Guy when your talking 550 tougue weight that's dry weight at 13% in this case 4,245lbs. You take your dry weight ×13% = 551.85 .so there close . You must look what you have in the camper weight it and the number will change. You should check it when you have the cargo in it .then take the % in this case 13%. I used that as a starting point. Mine was 11% 5, 065 dry weight. 557lbs witch they said was 550lbs so they were pretty close. But I added tanks food, cloths chairs my 2 bins with my hookups extensions etc witch brought it up to 665lbs . Now the camper weights 5865. So the factory is good starting point . You just figure the % from your dry weight in the book to determine there tougue weight and go from there on what more you put in your camper and go from there. But the best thing is get it weighed with the stuff in it .and use that tougue scale. It will change because they say use anywhere from 10% to 15% depending on what the book has for dry weight to get the 550. Use that. But your tougue scale will read accurately . You change the weight you also change the tougue weight as you already know.

Wow that's nuts. Maybe Truman and Bess need to go on a diet, maybe that will solve your problem. 😂 - MJ

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Truman definitely! LOL

That is a huge factor. Be safe.

Yikes! I'd get a second opinion via the cat scale. I don't know what items you have located actually on the tongue, so I would look at their weight. But I seriously doubt it is THAT heavy. Safe travels you two!

The ground must be perfectly level. Even a slight grade can throw it off, by hundreds. I now use a level on the ground. You can't eyeball it.

Merry Christmas and Happy New Year.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

I hope you had a very Merry Christmas and a Happy New Year!

Manufacturers won't do that as many people with 1/2 ton's would walk away, me included. You could always purchase a scale and take it with you, however I guess most people just rely on the brochures. Anyway, great video!! Sure puts things into perspective

Wow that is off pretty good. I agree that the tongue weight should be on the rig as well. At least your truck can handle it so you are in good shape there. If I remember right you said your Tacoma had issues with it. Now you may know why given their weight estimate was way off. Great share y'all. Good knowledge to share.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Thanks William!

This is why I am going from my 1/2 Chevy to a 1 Ton Ram 3500 Dually. I was sick of having to deal with all the weight (Payload) issues.

I monitored the forum and FB pages for Lance and everyone reported similar real world tongue weights loaded and unloaded. Lance just makes a heavy trailer.

FYI, my 2018 Keystone Outback 266RB when I got it home. I weight every piece of what I was putting into the trailer, clothes, food, freshwater, filled propane tanks, everything and I keep a spreadsheet of all my weights on the trailer and on my 2018 RAM 2500, 8 ft bed with 6.4 HEMI. So when I took it to the CAT scale, I was damn close to the axle weights I had cumulated. Yup, weight distribution was installed properly. I really never checked the tongue weight. Keystone is pretty good at providing tongue weight. On the scale is what is important to see what is loaded on each axle.

I was worried about this and bought a scale. Thankfully loaded up mine was barely over the rating that forest river hsf on my camper 179dbk. If I get it empty sometime I plan on checking it then but that’s a lot of work. I’m well within my limits but I do like checking as I load to see how it is affected. I load pretty much lb for lb front to back to keep everything balanced. Plus that’s how the storage is laid out.

If you are going to pull that camper around the USA get a 3/4 ton truck preferably a diesel and your concerns will be over, this half ton towable myth needs to end. If your tow vehicle manual says it can tow 8,000 lbs never tow over 4,000 lbs. Always cut in half what the MFG rating is otherwise you are going to tear up transmissions and engines in the long run, and of course always have a a tow package installed at the factory when buying your tow vehicle. I speak from experience, i have a 2020 Rockwood Geo Pro 19FD total weight is 3500 lbs loaded and tow it with a Ram 1500 hemi, i cant imagine towing it with anything less in power. If your tongue weights are correct you are really pushing it...especially when in actual towing conditions..bumps, dips in roads RR tracks all causing more weight momentarily on your hitch. Really love your channel hope to meet you two some day !!

@zachattack83

3 жыл бұрын

Always good to stay below makes it safer and more enjoyable

@dianehall5345

2 жыл бұрын

billg1527- Thank you for your comments. After watching this video and reading through the comments, my head hurts! I tend to agree with you regarding a 3/4 ton. I really like this Lance winter package for New Hampshire. We have lots of steep grades. Because the cargo capacity is only 400lbs, I would want to load up the truck bed and would welcome the 3/4 ton! ~ Diane

On my single axle 3000lb dry weight trailer, says tongue weight is 400lbs, but that specifically doesn't include the heavy distribution hitch, 2 50ish lbs batteries on the tongue, as well as the propane (supposedly includes the tanks weight) and of course water and storage, which on my trailer are both in front of the axle so would put about least half on the tongue. So thats probably 800 tongue weight (before dist. hitch cranked) which is almost 50% of my mid size truck payload capacity. Throw in 2 people and a dog is 420lbs, a loaded cooler, my solar panel and battery I bring, a 100lb generator, tools, a camping box and a 60lb ebike and I'm pretty much 100% loaded. I don't take my generator a lot of the time but still not much extra weight to play with. I'm going to try and weight it with the bathroom scale method and hopefully eventually take it to a truck scale station.

It would be interesting to see what the tongue weight is when your weight distribution hitch is connected. As you know, the weight distributions hitch takes weight off the tongue and distributes it to the axles of the trailer and the tow vehicle. It wouldn't surprise me to find that an 800 lbs. tongue weight becomes 600 lbs. with the hitch connected. (How the dealer would measure the tongue weight with and without the hitch is beyond me.)

When they say dry tongue weight that's with out the 2 propane tanks and the 12 volt battery plus no water in tanks.

I noticed the cover on the up and down buttons on the Smart Jack looks cracked. I had one of these jacks on my Lance 1685. That same plastic cover cracked over time from the sun. During a camping trip we had a rain storm. Water got underneath that cover, shorted the electronics underneath and the jack extended all the way out. That tipped the whole trailer, bent the rear stabilizer jack and bent the jack shaft on the Smart Jack. If anyone has a Smart Jack you should check it out very carefully to make sure the control panel is really sealed. At the very least install an off-on switch at the jack itself so you can control when the 12 V power is on to the jack. I replaced the jack immediately after returning home with a different brand.

@TravelswithDelaney

2 жыл бұрын

Thank you very much for that information John! I am going to double check ours.

Hey Patrick, weigh my 2019 Lance 1985 today and I don’t have the Murphy bed and only two full propane tank , no water ,grey ,or black , one 12 volt battery, and very minimal cargo . Tongue weigh was 800 lbs . This is Nuts !

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

I know! It’s love to know how they got 550# for the brochure.

The reason they don’t list tongue weight is because payload limits usually hit well before towing limits. And no one goes to the RV dealer with the right vehicle for towing. They are a family with a Honda Pilot they think anything under 6k lbs will work for towing. The guy whose been selling RV’s for 2 weeks wants the sale so he’s not gonna say anything. Lets be honest, if you knew the tongue weight, would you upgrade the truck, or downgrade the trailer ;)

Like I told you in an earlier video. With fresh water/hot water, Propane and 2 6 volt AGM batteries I had 123 pounds of remaining cargo capacity in my 1985. I would not believe any thing they said.

Great video. I like that coupler pin lock you have. Where did you get it? I see it is not in your Amazon store. Thanks

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

That is just a cheap set from Menards actually.

Thanks for the info my rule of thumb is to always have more truck than you need

Our Outdoors RV weighs every trailer that comes off the line and puts a sticker in each trailer.

Just watched the video...that is unbelievable, that estimated weight is way off. My question is, what is your weight distribution hitch rated for?? When I got our BlueOx, I got the 1k bars just for good measure. Do you plan on upgrading your hitch to accommodate the weight?

If I recall, you'd towed that with your Tacoma (briefly) prior to getting the Tundra. If your automatic TRD-OR was similar to my manual, the payload is 950lbs (based on my door sticker). So, basically, with a full freshwater tank, you were over the payload when you drove off the lot. I have to agree with your statement that RV manufacturers/dealers should be more aware of what they're building/selling. They shouldn't knowingly let you drive away illegally overloaded. We're currently looking to upgrade our 2018 Tacoma TRD-OR for this exact reason. With the T@B 400 hitched up and a driver/passenger in the cab, we're pretty much right at the payload even with an empty bed. I'm looking forward to the added capacity of a full-size, but will definitely miss the ease of parking the Tacoma.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

You are correct about us starting out with the Tacoma. After we went to the CAT scales the first time, we knew we needed to upgrade to the Tundra. We did love the Tacoma though.

Just retired wife and myself are done with tent camping we like the pull behind trailers set up and then have the truck for exploring my question is does in the weight distribution hitch and sway trailer hitch all that ad in to your tongue weight and then I know where distribution takes wait for the trailer and put it on your truck that should also add two Or remove from your trucks capacity

We towed our 2375 Lance 5,500 includes propane tanks, electric Jacks and water heater in my Manual. They advertise on sticker lower weight without adding propane tanks electric jacks. Tankless water heater would be lighter.

I have a problem with a scale that converts "pressure" to "weight". that thing has a fluid inside that is compressed and you are using a cheap (less than 5 bucks wholesale, yes I sell them), gauge that has an accuracy of +/- 15-20% full scale. You need to find a more accurate scale that uses an electronic strain gauge.

@JoeGraves24

3 жыл бұрын

I would question any scale that isn’t calibrated to a known weight

@adame924

3 жыл бұрын

Is there a scale that you would recommend? What do you think about the bathroom scale method ...where you use a couple 2x4s and a couple pieces of pipe?

@TexasScout

3 жыл бұрын

@@adame924 Any of the Trucker "Cat" scales can give you the weights.

@adame924

3 жыл бұрын

@@TexasScout Yes agreed, I'm 20 - 30 miles depending on direction from the closest cat scale. I was looking for something I could use before a trip to gauge tongue weight depending on our setup.

Thank you for this video. I work full time in the RV industry and I’d say 90% of people towing are over capacity in one form or another. They all go by tow capacity which is the last thing you should go by. Cargo capacity, hitch capacity, more important. I’ve seen a brand new ram 1500 with a cargo capacity of 922 lbs trying to tow a 30 foot trailer. Tongue weight has to be at least 1200, people in the cab, 500, additional box cargo 400, eq hitch etc. This is over 1,100 pounds cargo capacity too much but still probably under the manufactures towing capacity. That is a car with an open trunk, not a tow vehicle!!!!!! I would never tow anything with an SUV or 1/2 ton truck. What is a 1/2 ton truck? Think about it, 1,000 lbs!!!! I had a fellow come in with a bmw suv saying I think my trailer might be too big. I measured his tongue weight and it was close to 1,000 lbs unloaded. His hitch rating on the car was 550 lbs. he was scared and he should be. Thank you for putting out an honest video as most people have no business telling other people what they do and think is safe. Most times it’s not and someone is going to be badly Injured or killed because of it. Do your own research, don’t take a manufacturer, dealer or salesman’s word. It’s your life, your liability in the end. Warranties and insurance could be null and void in an accident. Do take the risk or cheap out on an inferior tow vehicle. If you added your eq hitch to your tongue weight you would be well over the 1,000 lbs hitch capacity of your truck. Thanks again and stay safe.

@ReflectedMiles

Жыл бұрын

Odd, since the lowest payload number I could find on any recent version of a RAM 1500 is 1,540 lbs., 4x4 and decked out with a crew cab. The more base units are rated around 2,000 lbs. and over. I do agree that a lot of people tow above their vehicle's rated capacity. I have no problem towing a good size trailer with a GMC 1500, but I don't have much on it or in it when doing so.

@tommccormick5140

Жыл бұрын

1/2 ton truck will have a dry weight of approximately 5,000 lbs. Not 1,000 lbs.

@garyvanderhoeven808

Жыл бұрын

@@tommccormick5140 I’m talking about cargo capacity. It’s on the label inside the drivers side door. That’s passengers, cargo both inside the cab and in the box, a possible canopy and the hitch weight of the travel.

@tommccormick5140

Жыл бұрын

Payload is only 1000? On what truck?

Interesting THANKS

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

You're welcome

wow, I'd have to get a second measurement with a separate device to verify. Our 2075 is around 500# using the weight safe hitch and separate CAT scale measurements for reference.

@markmlynarski1386

3 жыл бұрын

Mike, I wonder if it’s because you have your kitchen in the back (which would cause an uplift on the tongue-and I think would reduce the tongue weight) and the bathroom closer to the trailer axle.

Wow we could really use that tongue scale it would be helpful we just went to a CAT scale and weighed everything and I think we’re over our 4000lbs capacity

This is one of the things we ask among others . If we don't get a straight answer, they get no sale.

Partrick...sorry for the slow response to your video. Couple of things I considered in reviewing the weights were: 1-Anything in the Generator bay? (Your Honda with fuel is 50+ pounds; quarts of oil/Fuel Stabilizer; jug of fresh water) 2-Your electric stabilizer motors, propane, that frame for the 'Coffin' tray, a Fantastic Fan, and a Smart Jack add some weight. 550 + 250 pounds of payload = your 800 pounds w/o water weight. Easy to add that 250 pounds. I agree that tongue weight with add-on accessories should be on that sticker, but name one manufacturer that does it?

What's scary is you didn't have the Tundra when you first picked up the Lance! What was the capacity for that vehicle? Thankfully nothing bad happened before you upgraded your truck. Great video (as always!)

Great Video. It would be nice to see this all done on Certified scales.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

We went to the CAT scales and verified it was accurate

Was the power jack an option? If so that is about 75 pounds or so. Did you add a second battery? Just trying to toss out ideas. I would say food, pots and pans, clothes and under-storage maybe another 75-100.

The manufacturer should have weight out the trailer after rolling off the assembly line then put it on the tag. The dealership can't alter the numbers on the tag because there already imbedded in their. What would help if they had a scale at the dealership so you can see for yourself with your tow vehicle hooked up.

WoW!

Crazy how far off they can be just unreal. Be safe and Happy New Year

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Yes....we were quite shocked. It wasn't even close to the printed materials.

@maxyourjourney

3 жыл бұрын

@@TravelswithDelaney yeah thats not safe glad yall checked it out

I have a f150 king ranch . It has 1500 lb leaf springs stock . Hence f150. I installed. 5 leaf, 2500 lb leaf spring with 5 leaves . Hence f250. Problem solved . $1100 parts and labor .

It seems like the Dealer should make sure the manufactures specs are accurate if they want to keep selling the product. It could be a safety issue if the tongue weight is marginal on the TV.

@herb7877

3 жыл бұрын

I agree with you in theory. You used an operative word "should". Reality; "don't". Most sales reps either do not know how to work the numbers on the tags (my experiences are they do not) on the truck and/or RV to insure safety compliance or don't wish to inform the buyer. It's triply important that the consumer knows how...

That’s one of the reasons I got a 1995. For some reason the tongue weight on the 1995 is significantly lower, I actually have to add fresh water to get to 750 lbs...

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

I have heard that about the 1995.

Dry weight typically does not include propane, batteries, and of course your stuff. 1000lbs is what I would have expected for your trailer.

The manufacturer will never do that because most people come to the RV dealer with a 1/2 ton truck

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

Sad but true

@ TexasScout - I was thinking the same thing, what’s the accuracy of the scale from the manufacturer, and does this particular unit have extra error due to aging or some kind of a faulty mechanism? I would want to crossing check my measuring tool against a known good tool in order to trust the measurement. Another quick sanity check is by measuring the squat on the truck. You would have to know your truck. If you ever load your bed with a heavy load with known weight like sand bags, then record squat before and after and save that number. Of course this has to be done on a flat surface and the load needs to be as close to the back of the bed as possible.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

We got the same measurement by going to the CAT scales.

That's crazy, not even close. I wonder if it would have made any difference if you put your bed down. Granted it may not change the overall weight, but it would spread some of the weight toward your axle and not directly over the tongue (just a thought). Certainly, adding propane and a couple Battleborns can't add 350 pounds. I guess I might find some surprises when I do mine as well. Thanks for sharing! Steve

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

We were totally shocked by how far off it was. It was definitely a good thing we upgraded to the Tundra.

I’m curious about mine now. The claimed tongue weight is about 1100lbs. I wonder what it is when I’m loaded

Unfortunately, RV manufacturers don't have a clue about weight, weight distribution, or GVWR (Gross Vehicle Weight Rating/Maximum loaded weight of a vehicle) and GCWR (Gross Combined Weight Rating/Maximum towing weight of a vehicle). Their main objective to make it look pretty and stuff as much as possible into the unit while making it as inexpensive as possible to guarantee the maximum profit possible per unit. These units are basically at their maximum weight capability GTW (Gross Trailer Weight/Total weight of a trailer) and Payload (Total weight of any cargo and passengers) simply by loading your toothbrush into the unit. There has to be a complete and total reevaluation and reengineering of how RV weight standards are applied, similar to how the standards are applied to the manufacture of commercial vehicles. RVIA is a joke, similar to giving the bank robber the keys to the bank and asking the robber to lock up the bank at closing. Something has to change. Consumers are paying a very heavy price in the loss of property and life with the overloading of their RV, risking themselves and everyone they encounter on the highways. Safe Travels and Happy Trails. Stay Safe. Great video. Thank you.

Hi Patrick, what is the height of the trailer tongue from the ground when leveled? Thank you.

@TravelswithDelaney

3 жыл бұрын

I do not know off the top of my head. I will try to get a measurement next time we are out.

I NEVER, EVER, EVER, tow with water on board. I will get a close as possible to my destination before filling up. And, I only fill it if I absolutely HAVE to. I carry gallon jugs for the commode in case we stop and NEED to run water down to flush.

I'm way over tucked vehicle weight plus payload 2060lbs is 7050lbs trailer loaded out is 3500lbs actually tongue weight with full water tank and 2 full 20lbs propane tank's and 2 wet cell batteries is 500lbs hitch is rated for 500lbs not using a weight distribution hitch . Have this setup just over a year rv sales man told us we could tow 10,000lbs never towed before tow vehicle f150 5.0 4x4 towing mpg 14 average under all conditions and grades. Just happy thing's fell into place more or less by accident , now after a year i had time to study all this, this all fell into place and I'm confident I'm towing safely. ..Safe travels .

Well I believe it’s all about convincing there prospective buyer there smaller tow vehicle can handle it because keep in mind most of weight distribution hitch manufacturers will tell you there should be about 15% Less tongue weight than it can handle when reality it’s a lot less

When you went to pick the trailer up with the Tacoma I was like....Umm no to heavy. Tacoma’s have a 350 max. I was concerned about most trailers with my Tacoma. The T@B 400 or Casita was it. So after 10 years I decided to go to Tundra so I wasn’t so restricted. Im still look at the 400. As a truck driver for 36 years I am really skeptical of manufacturers and what they post on the stickers. With your load leveler and sway bar then shifting some of your weight you’ll be fine.