As a black male fan of Tolkien, I find the clamor for more "inclusion and diversity" to be a symptom of disingenuous envy and a lack of creative drive. Tolkien was a European writing a fantasy world for Europeans based on European myths, legends, and cultures. OF COURSE the characters will be European in appearance. If someone wants a story of that scale set in Africa, or India, or the Han Dynasty period, then PUT IN THE WORK AND WRITE IT. Stop begging people to fit your narrative into a cultural work that wasn't designed for you. Stop calling people racist because they had the audacity to write in their own cultural context. If you want a black Aragorn, then create him and a good story around him. Whining, virtue signaling, blaming, and shaming only denigrate the people that engage in such activities. In the end, evil can not create. It can only twist that which is created.(Tolkien paraphrase) UPDATE: Wow, didn't expect this kind of response, thanks to all of you. Good to know that there are still soldiers of Gondor holding the line!

@gathenhielm9977

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly. Avatar the Last Airbender is a fantasy show based on East Asian cultures and traditions, has not a single white character and guess what? It's one of the most popular and beloved series in the goddamn world!

@Lonovavir

2 жыл бұрын

The anti-entertainment industry doesn't do creativity as it requires risk and work.

@jannickpedersen546

2 жыл бұрын

There is brown people in Arda, just east - where the show and movies are not mainly set. We never see easterlings home nor the Haradrim, but we know there is brown ish people. But i guess leaving that out and focus on SJW was a better choice xD

@fattiger6957

2 жыл бұрын

I know there are epic legends and stories in East Asian and Middle Eastern culture and I'm sure the same applies to various African cultures. I'm tired of woke idiots acting like European myths and stories are the only ones that exist and thus those have to be taken and "adapted" for other people. It is the height of laziness and more than a little racist on the part of those woke people.

@TheAcad3mic

2 жыл бұрын

You big silly, don't you know that as a Black man you are only allowed to identify and enjoy characters that share your racial profile? which is why things you think you like need more black People shoved in, even if it doesn't make any particular sense whatsoever, or makes things worse.

"Updated for a modern audience" is one of the most insidious phrases in use. It's right up there with "The new normal" and "For your own good."

@paranoyd70

2 жыл бұрын

Or the phrase they use..."Don't question the science." If you can't question science, which was founded on asking questions, then its no longer science, but is propaganda.

@TheEffectOfMass

2 жыл бұрын

That's a good way to date something and make it useluess just a few years later.

@josephfisher426

2 жыл бұрын

If it were only about negative stereotyping, that would be one thing, but all too often it's "updated because we don't trust the audience."

@2Sherm

2 жыл бұрын

Hence, Hollywood's fatal attraction to remaking classics. Always are less than the original.

@jiga6832

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah let's take timeless tail and just force bunch of woke shit that will be irrelevant in few years bc we can

Amazon:"What if we butcher something you love?" LotR fans: "Ride! Ride for ruin and the world's ending!"

@Sin526

2 жыл бұрын

DEATH!!!

@Mr_Roboto

2 жыл бұрын

Wheel of Time made me sick.

@Sousabird

2 жыл бұрын

@Anon Anon I more meant how it got pretty much everyone up in arms, though your response was also perfect.

@QueenAleenaFan

2 жыл бұрын

DEATH!

@Gabriel-wn6oc

2 жыл бұрын

Deaaaaattthhh!

I was re-watching the Peter Jackson LOTR movies this weekend, and aren't these movies ALREADY EXTREMELY DIVERSE? It appears that the movies/story depict a 'Fellowship' of 'people' from COMPLETELY DIFFERENT SPECIES all working together to achieve a common goal? I mean, isn't it already EXTREMELY DIVERSE to have ELVES & DWARVES & HOBBITS & 'MEN' & ENTS & Wizard/Supernatural creatures all being portrayed as 'EQUALS', while learning to RESPECT each other's 'cultures', and WORKING TOGETHER as a team to save the world from being controlled by pure evil?

@Sousabird

2 жыл бұрын

"Never thought I'd die fighting side by side with an elf" -"How about side by side with a friend" "Aye, I could do that"

@leroyrodgers6089

2 жыл бұрын

This really soothed my soul to read this. Yes the books are highly diverse just as you said, Dwarves, Elves, Men, Women, all equals. But of course your comment makes too much sense. The message makes no sense.

@darkwoods1954

2 жыл бұрын

We all know that by ''diversity'' they mean more black people.

@msc8090

2 жыл бұрын

But you gotta ask yourself the real questions: how many gay elves were there? Was there a non-binary trans-woman? See, not really a good movie...

@StreetPreacherr

2 жыл бұрын

@@Sousabird "Aye - I could do that."

I'm glad this fandom held ranks and resisted this trash. Stop letting them call us bigots for defending the integrity of a story!

@RoninDave

2 жыл бұрын

they're still going to air it regardless

@midnightgreen8319

2 жыл бұрын

@@RoninDave yes they are, but most people are rejecting it. At the end of the day, these are businesses, when they lose enough money they will have to change, or disappear.

@RoninDave

2 жыл бұрын

@@midnightgreen8319 unless it's a massive write off tax scheme

@midnightgreen8319

2 жыл бұрын

@@RoninDave the most expensive show in history? I really think they believed they could pull this over on fans.

@RoninDave

2 жыл бұрын

@@midnightgreen8319 multi-national corporations and billionaires play different games than we because they can afford to. Losses are good excuses for taxes. Also good for money laundering and countless other schemes

I like that line "it's like putting a mustache on the Mona Lisa". I'm not completely against remakes, but I am against the trend that movies and TV are basically built on the following premise: 1. Take a well-developed IP. 2. "Modernize" it to the point where it's unlikeable and a far cry from the original IP. 3. Market the sh!t out of it. 4. Make money from it. 5. Wait for the bad reviews. 6. Blame the fans and people for "not knowing what they like" or better yet call them "racists" or whatever insult you choose. 7. Leave the IP in some kind of lucrative but morally and creatively bankrupt state. 8. Choose new IP. 9. Repeat process. It's happened to too many franchises.

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed1️⃣0️⃣0️⃣

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

Remember when you could sit down and just watch a good TV show like Breaking Bad Or Yellowstone? Those days are so rare.

@ctrlaltdebug

2 жыл бұрын

3.5 astroturf some "super fans" on social media to promote the remake.

@TheBlockbuster1982

2 жыл бұрын

Out on my mind right now I can tell two remakes/rebootes what was actually really good, Mad Max and Judge Dredd

@Letheanscheme

2 жыл бұрын

Useless knowledge make you look smart at a party: the mustache on the Mona Lisa is a reference to a famous Dadaist artwork by Marcel Duchamp, where he took a print of the Mona Lisa, drew a mustache on her, and wrote L.O.O.Q.H. at the bottom which is kinda a phonetic acronym for the french 'elle a un cul chaud' which means "she has a hot ass." the point of dada is kinda like the complete breakdown of art... that anything can be art, whatever the artist says is art... including art that has already existed, with an irreverent contribution/modification slapped on it to update it to the modern time, changing its interpretation, and making it lose any of its original meaning. It is a particularly apt analogy, because the act of doing this is somewhat of an insult to the original work, and artists can't impose new meaning on something that was made in a different time with different values, without insulting and defacing the original artistry. yes it is new, yes it is clever...but it did not require the same level of process skill and technical material skill to execute, so Duchamp makes it very clear what it is to take a masterpiece and reinterpret it with modern trends of thought.

The excitement over "we know this is really going to upset the fanboys" is the most revealing part. When you write something just because you know it will upset someone that makes you a troll and whatever you wrote a shitpost. These talentless trolls are writing billion dollar shitposts.

@fattiger6957

2 жыл бұрын

It doesn't even get much of a rise out of people anymore. Remember how much hate Ghostbusters 2016 generated? Now look at Cowboy Bebop. They people who made that tried the same "attack the established fanbase" tactic and all they could get was a few days of mockery before everyone forgot the show existed. Fans are just desensitized to this now.

@gianna526

2 жыл бұрын

Idk why people use the term "fanboy" as an insult. I know it's supposed to mean something like a unintelligent person just following what's popular or blindly following something with no prior knowledge, but calling me a fanboy and being happy that I'm upset isn't a great own, it's honestly gross and they need to shut up. It's a fantasy story, we should be allowed to enjoy it. There's nothing racist or sexist or just plain wrong ideals in the story, so why is something that needs to be updated? If it were racist, sexist, or have obviously bad plots and themes that were shown as good, of course we'd have to change it a bit, since we understand that stuff is wrong and shouldn't be supported. LOTR doesn't have those things, therefore they have no right to add in their own stuff, and to change and remove existing things.

@gianthand8130

2 жыл бұрын

@@fattiger6957 I think people have gotten use to the idea of being disappointed now.

@EvilDoresh

2 жыл бұрын

@@gianna526 They dislike established fans because they might not have the _correct_ political opinions, so they claim they're "toxic", or are "gatekeeping" the fandom with their evil insistence on stuff like "continuity" and "logic".

@haroldb1856

2 жыл бұрын

Woke remakes are 100% trolling.

Galadriel was so good in Fellowship. I really liked her other worldly/ creepy vibe. It looks like Amazon made her just another protagonist.

@fattiger6957

2 жыл бұрын

I never even thought she would make a good protagonist. She's was mysterious and more than a little otherworldly in TLotR. Making her the main character will just strip away what made her intriguing in the first place.

@gianthand8130

2 жыл бұрын

Galadriel in the Amazon series screams “I’m unremarkable “.

@irena4545

2 жыл бұрын

@@fattiger6957 Well, she certainly COULD be a good protagonist, but you would need a GOOD writer to write her arc, not some generic strong, "brash and angry" wahmen BS...

@EvilDoresh

2 жыл бұрын

@@fattiger6957 She was like a straight-up fey. She might _look_ human-ish, but you get the impression that her thoughts were much less so.

@clogs4956

2 жыл бұрын

@@gianthand8130 she screams: I'm a human with pointy ears! Which Galadriel most definitely isn't.

"You stood on the shoulders of geniuses to accomplish something as fast as you could and before you even knew what you had you patented it and packaged it and slapped it on a plastic lunchbox, and now you're selling it, you want to sell it!" -Dr. Ian Malcom

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

💯💯💯💯👍👍👍. Such a true statement.

@toodlescae

2 жыл бұрын

You were so preoccupied with whether you could, you didn't stop to think if you should. To paraphrase Dr. Ian Malcolm The direct quote references scientists so not appropriate. Lol.

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

@@toodlescae It’s very appropriate, in my opinion.

@chatteyj

2 жыл бұрын

Hollywood.. ah.. finds a way

@DefineHatespeech

2 жыл бұрын

Degenerates…uhh….find a way!

Lord of the Rings, is the Helms Deep of all fandoms. We hold them here or all geekdom is lost.

@razor6888

Жыл бұрын

Tolkien and the world he created has been corrupted and spat upon... The time to hold has long past. It died with the hobbit films.. Jackson was well intended, but butchered it . And this latest bile retching mess throws disrespect to fantasy that was held most dear. . Fantasy and Sci Fi culture has been destroyed beyond repair. You already missed when to stand firm. Its already dead. At least we still have the books :-)

“Evil cannot create anything new, they can only corrupt and ruin what good forces have invented or made.”

@Hero_Of_Old

2 жыл бұрын

Thats not the actual quote

@toh6261

2 жыл бұрын

@@Hero_Of_Old "You Shall Not Get By Me"!!!!!!!

@xSilentZeroXx

2 жыл бұрын

@@Hero_Of_Old "Idiotic Pippin! Jump in there yourself on the morrow and let us not have to deal with your chicanery any longer!"

@wheelwork9600

2 жыл бұрын

Where’d dat quote come from?

@Kyle-sr6jm

2 жыл бұрын

"Liberals cannot create anything new. They can only distort and corrupt what Conservatives have made." Or even more simple "Everything woke is shit."

It’s like in the great stories Mr. Frodo. The ones that really mattered. Full of darkness and danger they were, and sometimes you didn’t want to know the end. Because how could the end be happy. How could the world go back to the way it was when so much bad happened. But in the end, it’s only a passing thing, this shadow. Even darkness must pass. A new day will come. And when the sun shines it will shine out the clearer. Those were the stories that stayed with you. That meant something. Even if you were too small to understand why. But I think, Mr. Frodo, I do understand. I know now. Folk in those stories had lots of chances of turning back only they didn’t. Because they were holding on to something. Frodo : What are we holding on to, Sam? Sam : That there’s some good in this world, Mr. Frodo. And it’s worth fighting for.

@GodwynDi

2 жыл бұрын

Such powerful sentiment

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

💯💯💯

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

@@GodwynDi Indeed.✅💚

@logicerrormusic

2 жыл бұрын

This is what they're destroying. For nothing.

@ThinWhiteAxe

2 жыл бұрын

Damn who cuttin onions in here

I remember when The Force Awakens was being advertised and I started to get invested in the Extended Universe, with some of the things Luke Skywalker could do and I was so excited for it. Then, I learned Disney had expelled the Extended Universe, and I was like, okay… Then, it began, and my hope burned like Anakin on Mustafar.

@makeitsonumberone1358

2 жыл бұрын

I went to see it with high hopes, come out the cinema thinking "wtf was that?" And no one online was slating it, then the 2nd film come out, (carn't remember its name and i havn't seen it, apart from clips) and everyone else caught up, i was so hoping with the mandalorian that it would reset the sequels like doom cock said would happen, then i see luke building the hobo huts and though "doom cocks full of shit and im done with star wars"

@Nothinglastsforever

2 жыл бұрын

The moment they killed off Max von fucking Sydow within 10 minutes of the runtime I knew it was going to be bad. Who in their right mind would write a character for someone like Sydow to be immediately killed off? By the time they killed Han I rolled my eyes and wanted to leave the cinema. I never watched another Star Wars sequel again.

@EvilDoresh

2 жыл бұрын

And the biggest irony is that they've started to borrow from the EU again because they can't come up with anything else and/or to try and win back the (toxic) old fans.

@Justen1980

2 жыл бұрын

Obi wan kenobi: Though I've grievously maimed you I have spared your family jewels, Anakin... Anakin: THEYRE BURNING OFF IN THE LAVA AAAAHHHHHHH

@ChiodosBlowsDogs

2 жыл бұрын

The EU was so much better than that shit they expelled it's not even close. I just do my best to double think myself into no acknowledging the sequels and sear into my brain that the EU is still canon and it works until I see something bring up the sequels. I don't care that I'm in denial, I'm happier there.

The thing is that race swaping a character for the sake of inclusion is insulting to both ethnicities involved. They're basically saying that the original white characters are either worthless, bad or defective and they need to change; and that the black race being use as a substitute doesn't have original heroes or historical characters worth exploring and that the only way for them to be worthy of attention is to give them the character/positions of previously established white characters. (You can use/copy and paste this whenever someone needs to hear/read this.)

@EvilDoresh

2 жыл бұрын

It's pure tokenism, except with an almost religious bend.

@muhaoai4693

2 жыл бұрын

The sad thing is once upon a time, that kind of thing wasn't _too_ bad since it helped establish that a story takes place in a different universe or continuity from the original. As an example, a character who was male in Space Battleship Yamato in the original anime was replaced with a female counterpart in the remake. Likewise, when Marvel made the Ultimate Marvel comics and introduced a Nick Fury based on Samuel L Jackson, it helped reinforce the idea this was a whole new continuity unrelated to the original Marvel universe. Now, though? Yeah, basically tokenism. When they introduced a Samuel L Jackson-styled Nick Fury to the mainline Marvel comics, I just started calling him Black Fury because he's NOT 616 Nick Fury. I refused to call Miles Morales "Spider-Man" when they introduced him to the mainline Marvel comics because he's NOT. Not when Peter Parker is still around. Hell, Miles Morales doesn't even have his own hero name, since I've seen toys of him marketed as "Kid Arachnid" or simply "Miles Morales". It's not like a situation with the Flash, where it could just as easily be Barry Allen or Wally West under the mask because the costume is essentially the same.

@garou12

2 жыл бұрын

which is why i hated what reeves did w the batman

@TheEvertw

2 жыл бұрын

I absolutely hate race swapping. Those who advocate it are worse than the people who white-washed characters 50 years ago. The white-washing was partly a practical matter, that skilled actors of color just weren't known or available to the producers at the time. Sure, that made white-washing self-perpetuating because colored actors didn't get a chance to prove themselves or hone their skill, but that was not a conscious choice by the individual producers: they just sought the best actors they could use for their movie. That is actually an example of systemic racism: racism due to how a system works instead of individual choices. But it got corrected, and rightly so. Now we have excellent colored actors, and they get to do great movies. It has come as far that people attack movies because characters weren't race swapped. That is evil and must be stopped. As you say, if people want more colored actors, let them write movies specifically for colored actors. Just like the wrote films specifically for certain white actors, because their previous work inspired them.

@dinoblacklane1640

2 жыл бұрын

@@muhaoai4693 huh thats actually the funny thing about Mile Morales his race under the suit means more than the suit itself

Never stop gate keeping, keep the degenerates out of our fandoms.

@CynicalOldDwarf

2 жыл бұрын

Gate keeping and bullying were societies methods of self correcting negative behaviour

@pancakewizard1533

2 жыл бұрын

If you don't keep the gates and build the walls, you get overrun by the barbarian horde.

@travismcclymans5487

2 жыл бұрын

LOOKS LIKE DEGENERATES ARE BACK ON THE MENU BOYS!

@ernestocaro9802

2 жыл бұрын

what did you smoke when you decided to used that username ?

@mariposa9506

2 жыл бұрын

@@CynicalOldDwarf bullying is antisocial behaviour.

What baffles me is that Tolkien has ACTUAL racial diversity in his story, what with humans, elves, hobbits and dwarves. It's not the racial diversity they are going for these days which is literally only skin deep. These races have actual physiological and cultural differences between them and if that isn't real diversity, I don't know what is.

@user-gf7mt3jd1n

2 жыл бұрын

But do they have whamen?

@TallisKeeton

2 жыл бұрын

@@user-gf7mt3jd1n haha :) yes, they got women, or rather ladies :) "never heard of whamen before" they got lady Eowyn - shieldmaiden of Rohan, protector and healer of her people, they got lady Galadriel the epitome of feminine power, they got Rosie Sam's wife who helped their neighbours in the times of hunger, endangering herself, they got Gilraen mother of king Elessar, they got angelic being - Luthien who saved the world from Morgoths tyranny, but no, not whamen :D

People these days seem to forget what the "timeless" part means in "timeless classic." You have no need whatsoever to "update" anything. I parroted the "Evil Can't Create..." line, but I think it's wrong actually. Evil CAN create. It creates problems for everyone and everything else, which otherwise wouldn't have existed.

@tommychantzis6296

2 жыл бұрын

Technicaly the line isn't wrong. Evil didn't create. Problems are just currupted situations.

@kaizokujimbei143

2 жыл бұрын

Evil can only corrupt and twist that which God has created.

@rmmm6725

2 жыл бұрын

Hence evil corrupting

@spacejunk2186

2 жыл бұрын

Sauron created the One Ring, so there is that if that counts.

@tommychantzis6296

2 жыл бұрын

@@spacejunk2186 a twisted perversion of a ring. And more specificaly a twisted perversion of the rings of power the forces of good had already created.

We can't expect these people to write a good Lord of the Rings show because they don't have a moral compass. Many of them even the "super fans" they showed in promos identified with pure evil.

@fattiger6957

2 жыл бұрын

The people in charge of these woke projects don't even have basic storytelling ability. Even when they get to do what they want with their own original stories, they still screw it up.

@Dilmahkana

2 жыл бұрын

Wtf are you saying, these people don't have moral compasses? Come on man.

@angrygnome4304

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dilmahkana you think they do? You think people who identify with Sauron know right from wrong?

@Dilmahkana

2 жыл бұрын

@@angrygnome4304 I didn't fully understand that bit in your original comment. Care to elaborate?

@SamvedIyer

2 жыл бұрын

@@Dilmahkana I think it was a reference to a rather winceworthy joke by one of the 'superfans' (Joel Nochester) featured in the promotional video uploaded by Amazon UK. He mooted the idea of Sauron with a high sex appeal, and imagined himself feeling, "I can change him." This, notwithstanding that Sauron is _supposed_ to be pure evil, second only to Morgoth, with no redeeming qualities whatsoever. The video very soon proceeded to amass many more dislikes than likes, and Amazon UK had ultimately to unlist it. It was obvious throughout the video that, far from being 'superfans', they were textbook examples of the contemporary culture of narcissism, where they want to 'see themselves' in every franchise, and they knew Tolkien's lore very, very superficially.

"It's up to us to bring (this) into the present day." It's up to YOU, whoever you are, to make something NEW.

I'm not a big one for gatekeeping or purity tests in fandom, but LOTR is an exception. It is a cultural phenomenon created by a man who knew his chosen source material back-to-front in multiple languages. His secondary creation was carefully and closely knit as a tapestry. You a civilised man? Then you show that level of work some respect. "How many cats had Queen Beruthiel?" is a legitimate question to ask these people.

@rmmm6725

2 жыл бұрын

Can’t they just google it though?

@rmmm6725

2 жыл бұрын

Yup, 10 cats. One white who was in charge and 9 black who spied for her. I’m not even a fan.

@auser8156

2 жыл бұрын

@@rmmm6725 see you didn’t even know it you had to search it up. Now tell me who the descendant of the person who fled from a recent battle to a beleriand and later went to the place that inhabited the dwelling place of the brother of namo what the son of that guy did? (I think this would be a fun hunt)

@queenberuthiel5469

2 жыл бұрын

"How many cats did Queen Beruthiel had?" Now that's an interesting question.

@queenberuthiel5469

2 жыл бұрын

@Tommy Taffy Nice guess. Truth is. I am not THE Queen Beruthiel. I don't like cats but I don't straight up torture them either.

Its so incredibly depressing and demoralizing seeing the destruction of every form of hobby/social escapism in preperation for the great reset.

@Vito_Tuxedo

2 ай бұрын

You know, I'm not depressed about it any more. All I can do - all I *_need_* to do - is to maintain my own integrity, and that's my armor against the bullshit. Meanwhile, I take a certain satisfaction in knowing that these stupid, destructive assclowns are going to end up resetting themselves, and they'll have themselves to blame for it. 😎

I never used to appreciate the phrase “Standing on the shoulders of giants”. It’s so poignant now

Brown Boy here, I never cared that there weren't any characters in lotr that "Looked like me". There were epic, funny and awesome (inspired awe) in a way that no other films had been. I was in 7th grade when the first one came out and I knew it was on another level. Hearing the comments by the "creatives" helming the series (and anything these days), I am truly baffled. The focus is so much on the demographics the characters check off whilst having awful writing. And hearing the "fans" who try and justify it are even worse. Forget about "representation", what makes a character compelling or relatable is the common humanity. Even if you don't make the choices they would, you can understand what was going on with them because you've been tempted to do what they did, but didn't. I can relate and sympathize with people of different races/gender, etc and want nothing to do with people who "represent me" because they are rotten people.

@etme1000

2 жыл бұрын

The essence of racism is denying our common humanity, and separating people based on trivial accidents like skin color.

I hate the idea that movie, show, etc, has to be altered to "make it for everyone", as The Drinker says here. If something is well-written and well-made there's no reason why it can't be for everyone. People don't have to see a reflection of themselves in a story in order to be engaged and identify with the characters. I also think it's incredibly patronising. It's like saying to black people (for example), "You aren't capable of enjoying this unless you see other black characters on the screen." It's insulting.

@ThinWhiteAxe

2 жыл бұрын

Exactly! I'm a mixed-race female, and I've almost never seen anyone in media who "looks like me", but does that matter when I see a character I can relate to on a spiritual level? No! I adore OT Luke Skywalker because his faith and determination make him a role model for me, it has nothing to do with race or sex.

I love The Drinker when he spouts off about people trying to modernize LOTR for the modern day. His speech at 9:20 is hilarious and spot on and accurate. What isn't broken need not be fixed or fucked with. Why is it so hard for these D-bags to understand. Life isn't fair, you will have to try harder and work harder to achieve something great. Come up with your own world or novel. Don't ruin someone else's work by tweeking it to your own political agenda BS. It is like when other writers try to write Conan stories they respect the core aspects of the character and never belittle him to be a weakling for a stronger female character. They will never write the character as good as Howard but they respect his character and world. You see none of that with these fools pushing these new sword and sorcery films and shows.

@Peanut_Buster90

2 жыл бұрын

BART HE LEGIT HAD THIS SAME TAKE WHEN HE FOUND OUT ABOUT THEM REBOOTING HIGHLANDER! 😏

@makeitsonumberone1358

2 жыл бұрын

Weird fact, he was saying that when i read your post 😱

@clogs4956

2 жыл бұрын

Abso-freakin'-lutely! Even the Marvel Conan writers kept the core of his character; the adaptation of Red Nails keeps strictly to the story and is fantastic. When they wrote extra stories, they were set within the world and the lore, although comics... heh... Spiderman... but I did like the Elric crossover!

@copo2835

2 жыл бұрын

Honestly, I think the first Arnold Schwarzenegger Conan had a pretty damned strong female character. Valeria, the female thief that Conan falls for, is an independently badass character. And when Conan is dying, she defends him from spirits and demons, and offers her own life to bring him back. Not because she is weak, or fawning, but because she actually cares for him. So much so, that she comes back as a fucking Valkyrie to save him during the battle on the mound.

@bartsullivan4866

2 жыл бұрын

@@copo2835 You are absolutely correct Co Po and that is one reason why I love that movie. It has a great story arc. With a strong female lead who gives as good as she gets, but also understands her companions bravery and sacrifice as well. But at the same time Conan's struggle in the film does he go for revenge or kidnapping the princess the quest he was sent out on. You see a moral dilemma there. Great soundtrack, villains everything came together. I think Howard would have been proud of the film.

Owning physical media is the only way to protect classic movies and television from revision any more. Books, DVD, download to an airgapped hard drive.

@pgl79

2 жыл бұрын

Agreed - I've got unmolested versions of the original Star Wars trilogy on VHS somewhere...

Claiming stories need to be updated is just a lie to cover the fact that studios don't want to risk creating new stories. Hollywood knows it's a safer bet, to just grab a popular IP because it comes with a built in audience. The sad fact is that they are right. No matter how bad they make it; no matter how angry the fans are; they will still watch it. I've basically quit movies/TV at this point because I refuse to watch anything that is a remake, sequel, prequel, or "modern" adaptation. But it took over a decade for me to learn my lesson and I'm the exception. This terrible LotR show? It will be awful and everyone will watch it either because they buy into the hype or they want to rag on it. But either way, it will make money. Another bad or mediocre upcoming Ghostbusters, Star Wars, Star Trek, Jurassic Park, Terminator, Aliens, etc? It will make money. Hollywood has ZERO incentive to make better media, because the formula (that Drinker did another video on) always works.

@robertbaur837

2 жыл бұрын

Right IP have become nothing more than recognizable brands like Coca-Cola McDonalds Walmart etc no matter how bad or cheap they are for you They are convenient mass produced automated corporate. Junk food for the mind is a good analogy And the funny thing few people recognize the "owners" of the IPs don't even care about real inclusion or diversity to begin with they care about being perceived as inclusive because that's a selling point allegedly making them more appealing for more demographics It in theory permits the ability to SELL more the PRODUCTS to more people because frankly that's what they are But because the original IP is so recognized people will still watch the garbage even with all creativity drained with bland stories which don't respect the source material. The only good thing to come from then is red letter media commentaries lol and critical drinker reviews saying how and why it's awful the real problem is. No one is creative anymore it's only about advertising to make money. There is no intellectual risk taking no willingness to make some thing new to get genuine diversity in an actuality good story

For the life of me, I cannot understand why Amazon decided to plow so much into a series covering obscure Middle earth lore that only hard-core Tolkien fans will know anyway, when they could have produced some original fantasy genre content with a monster budget and avoided this whole brouhaha

@spacejunk2186

2 жыл бұрын

They could have turned the Books into a series with things that Jackson left out. They have the rights, but they focus on the apendices for no fucking reason.

@mizu7662

2 жыл бұрын

Because its easier to make a profit by targeting a pre-existing fanbase then taking the risk of trying to create a fanbase from scratch and possibly failing. Of course, that assumes you don't mangle the work so horribly while 'updating it for modern audiences' that this in built fan base sees it for the shallow disrespectful cashgrab it is and turn their backs on it.

@marcusaurelius5149

2 жыл бұрын

Vanity, arrogance, and degeneracy. They're perverts, no matter what it is they're perverting.

I think it says a lot if - as someone who grew up reading Tolkiens books, watching the Ralph Bakshi's Animated LOTR Movie, to watching the 00s LOTR movies more times than I have showered in my lifetime I literally have no reason to watch this new series other than morbid curiosity on how the Woke mob has claimed yet another one of the things I loved.

@kaizokujimbei143

2 жыл бұрын

Just don't give them money. Pirate it instead.

@Breadking100

2 жыл бұрын

They try to claim it. But they cannot wield it! None of them can.

@ThinWhiteAxe

2 жыл бұрын

"more times than I have showered"... oh dear. Intentional or not, the imagery of a greasy neckbeard nerd is, unfortunately, very strongly evoked by this.

@sakulaeyr9819

2 жыл бұрын

That right there is the biggest issue I have with all these: re-imaginings, reboots, updates, sequels, and prequels - et cetera! IT ONLY REMINDS ME OF THE BETTER CONTENT I'VE ALREADY CONSUMED. I just want something NEW and CREATIVE.

@chatteyj

2 жыл бұрын

@@kaizokujimbei143 Just don't watch it, you know what its gonna be.

It makes me think how fucking fortunate we were that Peter Jackson was able to do Lord of the Rings in that brief window of time where cinema technology allowed it and politics wouldn't interfere.

When they said they were making the Wheel of Time series I just let my shoulders slump and knew it was gonna be this complete crap show. I feel for you LoTR fans. Good luck.

@hibbo1989

2 жыл бұрын

I got three episodes in and just stopped!

@AcesnEights698

2 жыл бұрын

@@hibbo1989 I didn't last 20 minutes before calling it quits. All these woke turds do is taint the originals which is by design.

@verindictus3639

2 жыл бұрын

I feel for you back, man.

@spacejunk2186

2 жыл бұрын

@@AcesnEights698 When Moiraine just told the boys that one of them is the Dragon reborn before they even left the town I reacted just like Mat did in the scene: "Lol yeah of course."

Normies don't care. It's all just content to them.

I'm offended that all these properties are being "updated" for modern audiences, but as far as I can see there still aren't any owls being represented.

@josephfisher426

2 жыл бұрын

That would require making a movie of The Silver Chair, which was basically a giant cannon aimed at these exact faux intellectuals.

But... but....Celtic civilizations were so diverse!

@hometownhero2500

2 жыл бұрын

Like the Irish haven’t been through enough now this shite lol

You don't get to put a moustache on the Mona Lisa. What a perfect analogy!

I don't get it, most of the people bitching about making all this more inclusive don't even watch this stuff. It just doesn't make any sense, they make up less than 1% percent of the fan base.

@markustanbeck9149

2 жыл бұрын

Its about power - the power to mold and shape everything the general public is exposed to. The future is supposed to be border-less, culture-less and history-less. We are supposed to be one happy world population, everyone being ruled by the same people, the international money holders and their bought-off politician class - the memory of another time is problematic, which is why they are so desperate to wash over the past arts, and only allow the new melting pot narrative. The > 1% whom are set to rule this borderless world government, have everything to gain, by making their useful idiots wash out past culture, under the guise of ''inclusion''. By homogenizing all culture, they are in fact wiping out diversity of thought and expression - but try telling that to sheep, who have been told they are saving the world, by getting rid of the evil past, and everyone trying to preserve it. Why are they doing this? The same reason the Communists wiped out they cultural and historical pasts, and outlawed ''wrongthink'' in Russia and China (both countries are now culturally lobotomized and in the hands of dictators, with a cripple population who do not remember where they come from) - because there is power in the stories we tell ourselves, and the ways we chose to view the world. Even today, China and other countries ask the West to censor messages, events and ideas in entertainment they do not like, to avoid people being exposed to it. There can be only one story people are allowed to see, and it will be owned by power-holders and corporations - for the benefit for the happy world population. This is authoritarian in nature, and whether you are a fascist, a communist or just a happy dictator, you love having authority to tell people what to think. Its about power. This whole framework is called a Hegalian Dialectic; Hegel, its inventor, believed that history is always evolving. His concept for the Dialectic is simple, you have your idea of what already is (the thesis), you have your conflicting idea (the anti-thesis), and you have the result that comes from rubbing the two together, to create something new out of their friction (the synthesis). So, the past is the way people currently define it, and it was never good, it was always evolving towards something better (thesis), inclusion and diversity is better - people who defend the past are bad (anti-thesis), now people are at a crossroads (an intersection, like roads crossing) - which is the whole point of the academic branch of Intersectionality. You have to choose, are with you the past, or are you with the inclusion and diversity? If you support the past, you are against us, you are bad. Now we rub the thesis and anti-thesis together, one side will come out standing a little better - things will have changed slightly, we have arrived at a new place (the synthesis). Then you repeat the process, you keep smashing the two together, you keep insisting that the past is evil, that inclusion and diversity is good. It does not matter if you are not including the people that like the past, or that the diversity of thought and expression is shrinking - because remember, this is about power, power over the enemy. Rinse and repeat to force the world to move closer to what you want. This is a core element of Marxist ideology, and is really just a long spinoff from Marxist thought infecting intellectuals. Private Property is bad and should be abolished (thesis), people who defend the past use of Private Property are bad - people who want to have private belongings are bad (anti-thesis). Either you then conquer the people who want the Private property through force (Revolution - angry mob, lots of violence, quick change), or you attempt whats called (The Long March on the Institutions - which means slowly infiltrating and changing the society from within). After Russia, the East Bloc and China failed with the Revolutions (they lead to tyranny and incompetent governments by Communist political aristocrats) - the Communist left decided to go for the, Long March, instead. This is what you are seeing today with the Wokeness, with the whole political thing being pushed on small kids in school - without involving their parents (both Russia and China were big on indoctrinating the kids too). You see it with people getting silenced through cancel-culture, they lose their jobs, they get ousted from their position of being able to work and influence society. Its all about converting every facet of society to sing one song, their song. But what they do not realize, is that this is not going to give them Communist utopia or a big happy world. It is going to give them tyranny. Because they are allowing authoritarians to shrink the freedoms and rights of people they disagree with, and one day, someone with different plans - like say, a world government that nobody elected, is gonna turn around and use these tools on them. The Russians had a term for people who helped the Communist cause, without knowing it. Useful Idiots. Thanks for coming to my TED Talk.

@JohnSmith-fg9pz

2 жыл бұрын

It's not about them watching it, it's about destroying what you like and showing their Power.

The hobbit came out in 37, ive family who took that book to war with them, from North Africa to Germany. They are digging at the roots of a fantom that goes deeper than they could possibly imagine

Drinker makes a crucial point. Tolkien’s works were specifically meant to be a mythology for England. Meant to replace the loss of England’s own mythology with the Norman invasion. Which makes Tolkien’s works far more than just fantasy: That’s what separates Tolkien from Star Wars, GOT, MCU and so on. It’s of a completely different genre. You won’t find the Iliad in the fantasy section. And Tolkien is of the exact same cloth as Homer’s works. It’s fantasy secondary to the fact of its mythology. As all mythology is fantasy. But all fantasy is not mythology. So as a mythology, Tolkien’s work is something far more valuable to English culture than mere fantasy. Incidentally, Tolkien’s work became more than just English, it expanded to much of Northwestern Europe. As Tolkien couldn’t deny the Nordic and Germanic influences on England. But he stated multiple times that the olive skinned Southern Europeans, mentioning the Italians and Greeks specifically, would not be representative of the characters in Middle Earth. Once in his letters, once in a letter to his editor, and most specifically in response to a movie script. So the appearance of his characters was important enough to him to mention it on at least 3 different occasions. So stop gaslighting Tolkien fans into the absurd reality that Tolkien didn’t have a vision for his characters appearance. Both as races and as individuals.

“Let this be the hour when we draw swords together. Fell deeds awake. Now for wrath, now for ruin, and the red dawn. Forth, Eorlingas!” - Theoden

@c-secofficer123

2 жыл бұрын

Spears shall be shaken, shields shall be splintered..

Every time I see Galadriel in that armor my immersion is broken. And nothing was more immersive than the Lord of the Rings. What would be extremely late model medieval plate armor in the real world on Galadriel who should be a peaceful elf 5000 years before the War of the Ring. It just flabbergasts me.

@EvilDoresh

2 жыл бұрын

Ironically enough, she is a thousand times scarier with her nightgown and that all-knowing smile of hers.

@Arphemius

2 жыл бұрын

A peaceful elf? You didn't read the Silmarillion, did you? It was almost constant warfare against Morgoth and later Sauron. To believe she would be a wallflower for thousands of years of warfare is ludicrous.

I'm such an "originalist" Tolkein fan that I could barely stand to watch Jackson's movies. Another thing Tolkein had that the current-day "creators" lack is that he was an academic philologist who created fully-realized languages as the basis for the expansive lore of Middle Earth. To bowdlerize his work for "modern" sensibilities is like remodeling the Alhambra with a steam-shovel . . . to misuse a quotation from another great author of the time (Aldo Leopold).

@emile1365

2 жыл бұрын

Bowdlerize? More like infantilize and fladerize.

@spacejunk2186

2 жыл бұрын

Add to this the extreme meta way he wrote his texts. He treats the entirety of Lord of the Rings as if he is translating a copy of the actual Red Book, to the point where anomalies and quirks found in real historic chronologies and documenta (which Tolkien worked with a lot) can be found in the books. Suddenly it matters who the narrative voice is, who copied the books in this fictional universe, and if the copy Tolkien fictionally translated has been extremely altered over the years or not. Who knows, maybe a Gondoran scribe thought he knew better than Legolas about certain thing and just changed shit (Scribes in the middle ages did not really care that much about the sanctity of the original or made change notes to their copies). Maybe passages were straight up invented to highlight some status of a person that appears in passing who is important in some other context we don't know about. The Silmarilion is even more extreme in this. There you can see Elven scribes coping about Balrogs killing people, it's hilarious. People have analysed these texts to death, mostly Christopher Tolkien. You dont fuck with them.

@pjetrs

2 жыл бұрын

Never knew about this, where can I find some more info about this meta writing? Do you have any interesting reading material or something for me , because that sounds amazing

@davidkulmaczewski4911

2 жыл бұрын

@@pjetrs I'm pretty sure it's at least implied in the prologues and appendices of The Lord Of The Rings books. If not, then check out Unfinished Tales and Book Of Lost Tales 1&2. One very interesting bit is the fact that the Hobbit names we use -- Frodo, Bilbo, Sam, Merry, and Pippin -- are just translations into English, with their actual names being Maura Labingi (Frodo Baggins), Bilba Labingi (Bilbo Baggins), Ban, or Banazir Galbasi (Sam, or Samwise Gamgee), Kali, or Kalimac Brandagamba (Merry, or Meriadoc Brandybuck), and Raz or Razanur Tuk (Pippin or Peregrin Took). Tolkien said that Banazir meant "half wise", hence Samwise. Also, "razanur" was a bird of prey, and "raz" a name for apples, hence Peregrin and Pippin. And I believe "kali" was a word for happiness, hence Merry.

@haroldb1856

2 жыл бұрын

Jolly good. I also found fault with Peter Jackson's changes to the story. Dwarf tossing? No, thanks.

Ultimately, the fans of LOTR will just watch LOTR, not a bastardized Amazon version of it that misses the entire point.

@deriznohappehquite

2 жыл бұрын

Real fans of LOTR will read LOTR, not watch any of the bastardized versions.

_The Lord of the Rings_ has been a cherished classic across demographics for years. But now suddenly the story *NEEDS* to be “updated” for “modern audiences,” for no given reason? And suddenly the fandom is “toxic” because we won’t just stand aside and let these vandals burn down this thing we love? Tolkien’s story is a timeless masterpiece. I for one will never let these hateful bastards sacrifice it on their altar of race-baiting, misandry, and corporatism. Gatekeeping is absolutely essential now. _They shall not pass._

LOTR fans have been burned by the Hobbit Trilogy already, fool me once, shame on you, fool me twice shame on me. We ain’t falling for this shit again

@harbl99

2 жыл бұрын

Who didn't like "bing bing wahoo!" platformer Legolas?

@spacejunk2186

2 жыл бұрын

Who didn't like watching Dwarves burning delicate furnite like its nothing. Fucking DWARVES. The dudes who were made by the personification of the idea of making things. Worst scene in Unexpected Journey.

Galadriel was supposed to fair and beautiful, so beautiful that she was enchanting. This version looks like an angry Karen about to ask for the manager.

@EvilDoresh

2 жыл бұрын

It's like a failed attempt at a Brienne of Tarth with long hair.

Nobody is allowed to touch Tolkien's work. Read his books, watch his interviews, look at his art. Boycott anything after the death of Christopher and Priscilla!

"Gate keep everything forever, like have a 6 month wait period before you can get into a fandom, prove yourself and earn it" - Critical Drinker. Homerun!!!! I’ve seen so many things I love get wrecked by fake fans only interested in controlling them I’ve stopped keeping track of them. A quick example, Dungeons and Dragons used to be fun, now it’s coasting on it’s brand name. The game was last good around 2009, 4th edition was the beginning of the decay.

@MRJTD99

2 жыл бұрын

The alphabet club ruined 5E

@bfnvalley

2 жыл бұрын

@@MRJTD99 I hate saying it because they genuinely seem like nice people for the most part, but I blame Critical Role for that. They encouraged that portion of the fan base way too hard and now it’s consuming everything.

@theWebWizrd

2 жыл бұрын

If you believe that D&D has only been in decay since 2009 then you are literally rejecting reality. D&D is perhaps more popular now than it has ever been. It is obvious that there is an enormous interest in tabletop RPGs now that has not been there ever before. It has certainly changed some aspects of its design, but everything screams that is has been a huge success.

The hobbit left such a sour taste in my mouth, my predisposition was to hate this even before I knew anything about it. Also Amazon is GARBAGE

@heartysquid

2 жыл бұрын

It's like an inoculation against stupid...a minor controlled amount of stupid to prepair you for the the mass invasion of stupid.

Nobody messes with Tolkien's Legendarium and lives!

Thank you guys. Amidstt all these shitstorm of "real" tolkien fans and all it is really comforting to see some people still have a common sense and respect for the amazing creator of an amazing story. Even in my country (which doesnt have any real wokeism) my friend who is supposed to be a hıuuuge tolkien fan cant wait see the series and I havent even seen the trsiler because I know very well they disgraced tolkien's legacy. Thank you guys again, raising your voice against this ridicilous events

The books and the original trilogy are the only Versions worth a read/watch.

@leosalonen1564

2 жыл бұрын

they aren't going anywhere either

I've been a member of many of the various LOTR fan pages on social media for years, it's awesome that these communities can still thrive decades after their source material has been wrapped up and finalized. I know the Rings of Power community is just getting started but there's almost no engagement on these pages with most posts getting less than 10 reactions within the last few weeks. There's only a few thousand followers per page and it's mostly just Art posts, vapid speculation or statements of dissapointment. Sometimes I wish I could be optimistic like some of the people on these pages, I wish I could be excited for a new dive into tolkiens universe, but I just cant bring myself to get hyped for this generic, soulless fanfiction.

@gianthand8130

2 жыл бұрын

Even when the Amazon series is released, I’m still gonna be talking and posting a lot more about the LOTR trilogy and even Hobbit Trilogy than with the Amazon series.

@SamvedIyer

2 жыл бұрын

Essentially, you state here the lack of passion among these 'new age' supposed fans of Tolkien who are rather eager for the Rings of Power; that same passion which actual fans well-versed in Tolkien's lore have, so much so that they engage in intense yet genteel discussions. Am I right?

@gianthand8130

2 жыл бұрын

@@SamvedIyer Can’t say I’m surprised that there is a lack of interest for Rings of Power among so called “new age” fans when compared to the interest older fans have for Peter Jackson’s Lord of the Rings Trilogy

@SamvedIyer

2 жыл бұрын

@@gianthand8130 My understanding is that they are not so much fans, as mindless consumers of any product that is a mesh of CGI, action, and "the message". They claim to be lore buffs, but they could not be trusted to know a thing if their lives depended upon it.

I think the phrase "a fandom that reads" is extremely poignant here. LOTR fans are willing to read not only the 1000 page original trilogy, but also the other myths and legends, such as the Silmarillion. A group of people willing (and able) to do that are far more sophisticated than your average fan.

I read Lord of the Rings when I was like 11 and it touched me so much I thought it was a real story not fiction.

Thanks for speaking for the majority of the world. So sick of them ruining great shows.

A trailer being ratio'd is unheard of ? Ghostbusters 2016: Hold My Beer.

Lord of the Rings is the last bastion for fantasy, the oldest and strongest. All others have been corrupted, polluted, and overrun. This is the modern Minas Tirith. Do we had the strength to hold firm against the tides of destruction? I can only hope...

@chasehedges6775

2 жыл бұрын

💯💯💯💯💯💯.

@berengustav7714

2 жыл бұрын

Hoooold!!!

One of my favorite book is The Tale of Waring Three Kingdoms, based on Han Chinese civil war during 206BC, written in the Ming Dynasty in 1200AD. I would be mega mad if people start putting fake diversity in a TV show/movie there. (Like the absurd Great Wall Movie)

@Anonymous72686

2 жыл бұрын

If Hollywood adapt this story, the plot as follows:- - A Caucasian man came to China and teach Kong Ming how to win The Battle of Red Cliffs.🤣 - Liu Bei is not worthy, and being replace by a made up character, his sister, Liu Lian.🤣 - Liu,Guan,Zhang brothers become Liu,Guan,Zhang sisters.🤣 - Zhang Jiao is a black man, and lead the Yellow Turban army to rebellion because they are constantly tortured and ill treated by those privileged yellow skin royal blood.🤣 Great Wall movie to me was a guilty pleasure, because it is not actually history, that is fantasy, Tao Tie monsters and all. Also i like Zhang Yi Mou cinematography,he just know how to make movie look beautiful.😀

I had to cancel "prime" one way or the other, so I gave them a detailed reason as well. Listed 3 productions that were good and discontinued, then went on a rant over the woke stuff. Let them have it their way, I just don't care about it anymore.

I really enjoy adaptations when they're done well. What if "The Taming of the Shrew" took place in a high school? You'd get "Ten Things I Hate About You." What if "The Odyssey" took place in 1930s America? You'd have "O Brother, Where Art Thou?" I like remakes less, because unless they can capture the initial spirit and tone of the movie, they tend not to turn out so well. Then you have what "Rings of Power" does, which claims to improve upon the source material by altering it at a fundamental level. They're giving us "RAID: Shadow Legends" and claiming it's "World of Warcraft," but better! Please. To paraphrase Dr. House, that's not a unicorn, it's a donkey with a plunger stuck to its face. I'm heartened to see this trend of diversifying existing ideas slowly eat itself to death, though they'll murder plenty more IPs before they're done. I just lament the generation growing up with this garbage won't have anything iconic they can really call their own. There will come a time when we'll get back to original ideas, but sadly, it is not this day.

@herheartbeats5727

2 жыл бұрын

In fact, today's "The Taming of the Shrew" actually exists : it's all the stories about women pining to the charismatic thug who abuses them, then turning their own subsequent rage to the 90% other men in form of demanding sexist and authoritarian laws to "protect" themselves...and another cycle goes...

"The Message" is a disease.

Timeless works of art don't need to be "updated for the modern audience" - by definition.

@etme1000

2 жыл бұрын

"Modern" is simply another word something that will become outdated the next day after it comes out, and be relinquished to the dustbin of history. This is because the more "current" one tries to be, the more time-bound one is, and thus effectively out-dated the next day. I.e. the very opposite of time-less.

3:06 You're right, this is the wrong fandom, the one that reads. I know a lot of Tolkien readers and despite of all the different jobs that we have, of all the different career paths that we took, we have one thing in common: We read, A LOT. And not just the sources (i.e. what Tolkien wrote), but also a lot of academic essays regardings his works. And most of us have been doing this for over 20 years, even before the Jackson movies. It's not a fad for us, not something to engange with for a week and then move to the next thing. It's a fucking part of our lives.

Star Wars was able to be destroyed (or at least greatly diminished) by the terrible new movies, partly because it was always a movie franchise with natural unanswered questions about what happened to our Heroes. Lord of The Rings is different partly because it is a closed story and one where many people are most connected to the books rather than the movies (or at least I know I am, though I think the LOTR movies is the best movie trilogy of all time). The original material is a bridge to far for those that want to rape and pillage to ever sully. It's Legend remains forever safe in Valinor, untouchable. The story, like the Ring itself cannot be destroyed by even the most devastating dragons fire. Let them come. They will break upon this fortress like water on rock.

@davidbowles7281

2 жыл бұрын

Star Wars was already destroyed by the prequels, but Gen X moved on.

@SamvedIyer

2 жыл бұрын

@@davidbowles7281 The prequels did not destroy Star Wars. Too large a portion of the fandom was both too slow in the head to understand the story, and so self-entitled as to choose to be disproportionately affronted at the only very occasional instance of ropey dialogue (some of which is still sensible in the character's emotional context, such as Anakin's strong feelings for Padme in Attack of the Clones).

@davidbowles7281

2 жыл бұрын

@@SamvedIyer I can assure you I understood the lack of a story in the prequels. The prequels were the Disney movies before the Disney movies. They're all terrible.

Well, we'll always have the books.

You sir are a hero for the work you do calling out the PC bullshit in media nowadays and the thought provoking content you put out. Bless you you magnificent bastard 🍻

Amazon has chosen to make Rings of Power more about wokeness than Middle Earth. They fired their world renowned Tolkien expert, Tom Shippey, right after Tolkien's son died and replaced him with a DEI lead who criticized Tolkien’s work as problematic. Middle Earth has myriad peoples of color, Amazon just lazily chose not to include them in Rings of Power and race swap characters instead. Tolkien purposefully based middle earth on N. European lore to create a mythology for the English. All of the DEI activists are perfectly fine with Wakanda just the way it is, but they want to change Tolkien’s English mythology to fit their diversity quotas. It’s a completely hypocritical double standard. If you don't support blackface, you shouldn't support whiteface either.

The rants are therapeutic.

Somebody asked me a couple of weeks ago if I was going to watch the new Lord of the Rings TV show and my answer was very brief "No" They then asked me why not, and I proceeded to tell them "It's obviously woke, and if I even sniff Woke I won't have anything to do with it." They had nothing else to say to me after my response.

I'm in film school right now because for a long time I've been sick of the state of film and television so I'm hoping I can ultimately develop my own studio without caving to ideology first. I just want to tell the story. My professors have all been saying things about how "we're the ones who can control the message and change the world" so we should be putting messaging in our work. Professors also talk about how difficult it is to get funding and it's easier to take existing works and "transform" them into something "new". Worse still is when getting together with other students to workshop each other's stories and most of them easily have storylines with the focus of wokeness. (Systemic racism, Marxism, Capitalism is evil, and holy frick there are a boatload of stories with gay people for the sake of diversity). I won't to give them my constructive criticism and say, "People don't like the woke stuff" or "ideology before the story is a BAD idea" but I also know I'd get kicked out so fast. My point is, the next generation of filmmakers isn't looking too great because the disease is also being taught.

I imagine there are a lot of people like me for who LotR runs deeper than something like marvel. My grandfather on my Dads side read him the hobbit. My Grandfather on my Mums side is from New Zealand and loved Tolkien. He read her the hobbit when she was young and read it to me too. My parents started reading Fellowship to me until I was old enough to read the books myself. My kiwi Grandfather requested that “Concerning Hobbits” would be played at his funeral and that tune always reminds me of him and home wherever I am. I doubt I’m unique in this sense, comic books and sci fi are obviously big parts of people’s lives but this is a cultural thing not just some random IP to be fucked with.

Sad thing about this, there are a ton of people who will be sitting home on the weekend having no clue or care what they are doing to this show. In turn Amazon will get the views they want and consider it a success and continue to pump out more seasons like a crappy fast food chain.

@fr0ck360

2 жыл бұрын

I would take every opportunity I have to make my clueless parents not watching this trash show. Kinda sad they don’t care, because they just want to watch something

@francois9018

2 жыл бұрын

My sister is a "die hard fan" of the lord of the rings, she read the book and all the hoo haa. When we watched the hobbit, she still liked it enough. When I showed her what they were doing with the rings of power she still shrugged and said she'd watch it, because it has the lotr mark on it. So many people are just starved for entertainment they'll watch anything instead of doing something else.

@DC0118

2 жыл бұрын

@@francois9018 Unfortunately, your sister sounds like the ideal customer for alot of this kind of media. I'm reminded of the redletter media quote that gets circled around alot "Stop asking questions, just consume product and get excited for next product"

Looking at what's happening to Lord Of The Rings is much like looking at what's happened to all the religions of the world. The original message is fractured into sects with different interpretations, different versions, becoming more extreme, until they're all disagreeing, all fighting each other, name calling, claiming theirs is the better version, supporting evangelists to flatter their cause and bring converts to the fold. Same thing is happening here, to a treasured story, that Amazon didn't even care about - until Peter Jackson made a ton of money out of it. Punish Amazon by rejecting Amazon. It's the only way. The new Harper Collins reprint of Lord Of The Rings book covers were enough to make me shudder. Taking them from Rings of Power illustrations indeed... The scorn from Tolkien fans was severe indeed. I noted in comments that many had collected multiple book sets (with one claiming to have collected 'all' of them), and didn't come across one who planned to include the new Harper Collins set. This might make antiquarian book sets rise in value in the eyes of the true fans.

"What is popular is not always right, what is right is not always popular." - Albert Einstein

Drinker “…it’s one of the most beloved stories in the fantasy genre…” dude fuck that Lord of the Rings is one of the most beloved stories in human history.

Drinker please don't stop with the clips. I love having a daily dose and these small clips that are pulled are just ripe. Thanks big fan!

The Lord of the Rings is one of the best selling books of all time! The sheer arrogance that movie producers, directors, and writer have thinking they can improve on it is astonishing! I'm not giving this new one the time of day, Peter Jackson did enough rewriting to make me angry. This is beyond everything.

I just wish more people would read the book

I remember when Cruel Intentions came out, them saying it was an "update" of Dangerous Liaison's so people today could identify with the characters, etc. Even though I was never interested in the original book movie or Cruel Intentions, I remember thinking why? do the people who "need" it updating not have empathy or abstract thinking? It's very mush like that now but turned up to about 10,000.

@fattiger6957

2 жыл бұрын

Hollywood people don't seem to understand that humans don't change that much, even when hundreds of years pass. That's how and why we have myths and legends that persist for hundreds of years.

I think the whole idea of changing the original work to avoid offending modern audiences is down right condescending. People really need to be protected from ideas they find problematic 20, 30, 60 years after-the-fact? I submit that they do not. If anything it gives us a chance to notice the positive changes that we've made in our society and remember the mistakes of the past. I'll give an example. I love the Michael Shayne detective movies from 40's with Lloyd Nolan. They're absolutely great in their campy humor and cliché detective film noir greatness. However, their portrayal of African Americans is problematic at best. I, as a viewer with the power of 80 years of hindsight on my side can see that that is the case. Does that mean I feel the need for these elements of the work to be changed, however inaccurate to the time they might be so that I can feel warm and fluffy knowing there is no, and never has been any racism in the world? No. I can enjoy the parts that are good and condemn the parts that are reprehensible without any need to change the content. Why should we fear seeing the mistakes made in the past just because they might make us feel uncomfortable? Is it not better to accept that they happened and attempt to correct going forward? Not to be hyperbolic, but this is like not teaching the holocaust in history class due to us finding it abhorrent. I seem to recall there being a famous phrase about those not who do not study history being doomed to repeat it. Perhaps erasing cultural representations of history is not the correct move going forward. I don't think I need to even go in to the subject of attempting to correct works of art that have been praised for decades and how absurd and narcissistic it is to think you can improve upon the original work. Simply the concept of erasing problematic ideas from art created in decades or centuries past is absurd enough on it's own.

@michaspringphul

2 жыл бұрын

excatly. But in my eyes it doesn't stop there. It is a greater downfall in society in general. If someone cannot deny the Holocaust anymore (bc he is silenced or canceled), there is no space of debating over it and show the overwhealming evidences we have to prove that it happened. The freedom of speech is in stake, when you look ate the bigger picture. It spreads in entertainment and public spaces like cancer and throws us centuries back.

I fell in love with Tolkien's world when I was 18 (42 years ago)! and have re-read The Trilogy at least every other year since! The audiobooks (narrated by Rob Inglis) are brilliant for anyone who doesn't have the time to sit & read them! I was truly afraid when the first movie was announced, but I was blown away by the way they captured the magic & the spirit of Middle Earth & the complex & fascinating characters who lived that epic story! (NOT The Hobbit, they bumbled that one by dragging it into 3 parts!) I've watched these Hollyweird activists DESTROY my beloved Star Trek & Star Wars (among so many others), but despoiling Tolkien's world in this way is heinous and absolutely unforgivable! It gives me hope for humanity that fans of this timeless treasure are not standing by in resignation while criminal activists pushing "The Message" 🤨🤬 get away with it scot-free! Boycott this disaster, re-watch the original Trilogy and even better, read or listen to the books! And speak up, no matter how many times they delete you!

Just like with the Wheel of Time, preachy woke re-writing of classic, great story telling unnecessarily. Peter Jackson's cinematic epic of LOTR will never be beaten.

@JohnnyZenith

2 жыл бұрын

I waited for a Wheel of Time series since the late 90s. That series is perhaps the worst I've ever seen.

@matthaus2537

2 жыл бұрын

@@JohnnyZenith yeah the 1st episode turned quite a few main book plot points on its head. The whole Dragon Reborn could be male or female was ridiculous and didn't make any sense.

@edmondmarell5632

2 жыл бұрын

I'm glad someone mentioned this, because Wheel of Time crossed the line from dumpster fire into landfill conflagration. I don't want to do hyperbole here, but that monstrosity has got to be in the bottom 3 or 4 worst TV shows I've ever seen. It was an overpolished piece of trash that jumped between characters too often, had some of the worst dialogue I've ever heard, and as another gentlemen in this comment thread said, screwed up or flipped some of the major plot points from the books. I saw that entire damn series instead of calling it quits after the first episode because I promised my buddy I'd watch the whole thing with him. Never again. What a fuckin nightmare. Preachy and woke encapsulates it perfectly Matthaus.

The lord of the rings is supposed to be a Legend. It is written as a legend. It is written so well it makes it a legend. Why change it? It makes the changes a affront to the original text. Which is why we are all upset.

Some changes people make are simply out of the realities imposed when adapting a work from one medium to another; basing a movie on a novel, basing a TV show on a comic, etc. Other changes are done for the sake of conformity and orthodoxy. And still other changes are done for the sake of a dominance display. This is because acknowledging and accommodating the greatness and inner character of a great work of art is the very opposite of establishing dominance; it’s an enacting of humility, to recognize and respect great art. It’s an admission we aren’t the center of the universe, that we might be in the presence of someone or something that is saying something important enough for us to shut up and pay attention for once in our lives. And some people can’t abide that; they cannot stand it at a fundamental level. These identity politics and social justice lunatics are generally miserable people who cannot tolerate the idea that they aren’t the center of the world and that people are not going to just endlessly conform to their demands. I’m not talking about the people who conform out of fear, or laziness, or ignorance, and I’m not even talking about the people who cynically use the crazies as a tool, like the various media corporations. I’m talking about the people who always get the ball rolling on this shit. I’m fairly certain that Amazon didn’t spend eleventy hojillion dollars on the rights for this show with the intent ahead of time to make it work…but the creative types inevitably insist it must be woke, whether out of ideology or fear, and the suits always go along with it because it’s nothing to them but product anyway. And the ideologically soaked lunatics that foist this shit on us want to prove to themselves and others that they can compel even great works of art to conform to them; they’re meeting Tolkien on a log bridge, like Robin Hood and Little John, and they’re determined that Tolkien’s gonna move, not them. The fact that the fans hate the changes is a feature, not a bug; dominance displays require a conflict. You can’t win a fight if there is no fight, so they intentionally pick a fight with the fans by making the changes they know fans won’t like. And while they can’t make the fans watch, they can however make whatever changes they want, whether the fans like it or not. And making changes the fans don’t like gives them an opportunity to display their power. It’s all vandalism; they might as well call themselves Visigoths and just admit their desire is to destroy for the sake of showing they can’t be stopped. “Power is not a means; it is an end. One does not establish a dictatorship in order to safeguard a revolution; one makes the revolution in order to establish the dictatorship. The object of persecution is persecution. The object of torture is torture. The object of power is power.” George Orwell, 1984

@luckyduck8375

2 жыл бұрын

They are pissing on it to claim it

@florbfnarb7099

2 жыл бұрын

@@luckyduck8375 - Pretty much, and they only claim it out of spite.

@michaspringphul

2 жыл бұрын

exactly.. and they drive also on Goebbels saying: "if you repeat the same lie over and over long enough, it becomes the truth."

If I'm not mistaken Tolkien wrote the Lord of the Rings and it's world as a desire to create a unified archetypal mythology for the British Isles based on its folklore and stories with a undertone of Christian morals and values. Turning it into a GoT clone is a spit on it's face especially since those books were written as a realistic and nihilistic opposite to Tolkien's books (Pilgrim's Pass YT channel has made a few pretty good videos explaining this). It would be like adapting Charles Saunders books, that he wrote to have an African centered story in a pre-history sword and sorcery setting for African-Americans to relate too but is ignored by African-Americans, and hire non African actors for diversity's sake and use it as a mouth piece for modern day politics.

My favorite part is when Amazon fired Tom Shippey and then brought in a "Baptized by pink dye" to interpret the source "bible" whichever way suits her/studio agenda. It's not a virus, it's a cult.

I think one reason this fandom held has to do with one of the essential elements of Lord of the Rings. It’s not just a story, it’s something more. It’s a work of fiction, but everything it says is true. It’s a thing that, beyond telling a story, it speaks of a way of living and thinking. I think that’s why people gravitate to it.

57 year old Tolkien fan here. Been a fan for decades before the word 'fandom' happened. Don't mess with us. We're fuckin' everywhere, and we care.

if they wanna modernize, they should do it with stuff like Bible and Kuraan, those should sit down nicely with fandoms, right? Right?

@Kyle-sr6jm

2 жыл бұрын

Yea. Charlie Hebdo.

I remember the old days when I was a dumb fucking kid who laughed, cried, and cheered when something pivotal happened in a film or show regardless of whether or not it was well done. I didn't know what good writing looked like at the time nor did I care. Now, if feel like shit because people like the younger me, who raved about shitty movies and series because we didn't know any better, could be part of the reason why entertainment media as a whole is deteriorating. The latest members of these large corporations may have felt inspired by those overwhelmingly positive reviews it garnered from halftards like me to do what they're doing now. If that is the case, then I am truly sorry. Sorry for indulging in unhealthy garbage, sorry for initially defending the garbage makers for their actions, and sorry for ruining everything for future generations. P.S. I'm gonna be a Sophomore in college soon, the "younger me" is in reference to when I was a toddler, early high schooler, and everything between.

@Emarella

2 жыл бұрын

There's no need to feel ashamed for liking what you liked, even if it wasn't objectively great quality. That is not at all what people are up in arms about with LOTR (and many, many other franchises that have been misrepresented and mishandled). You're not personally responsible for the actions of the entertainment industry. Like what you like. Critique what you want to critique. Live and let yourself get swept away by a story that moved you. And, if you want to, dive deeper into just why a story made you feel something. There's a lot of value in that, even in stories that weren't told as well as they could have.

@coreys.2456

2 жыл бұрын

​@@Emarella Thanks for the kind words. I should have probably have specified that I wasn't referring to LOTR when it came to stuff I liked that was bad. It was more about stuff like the Star Wars sequel trilogy, Jurassic World series, and Game of Thrones season 8. I initially loved those things because I didn't care to see past the label. Now I understand why they're bad (mainly thanks to Dishonored Wolf and the EFAP crew) and only watch the best parts of those films (fight scenes, notable lines of dialogue, funny moments, interesting concepts, etc.) for inspiration. With every piece of media I consume, I learn what to do and not to do when it comes to writing a story. I'll be doing my damnedest to make the narratives I create as extravagant as they are well-written. One day, if fortune is on my side, I can tell (or rather show) those stories to the world whether it be through novels, comics, video games, films, or shows. And you, Drinker, and every other potential critic can feel free to offer feedback. If I fuck something up, feel free to let me know (respectfully, of course). If I did something great, tell me so I can maintain (and possibly enhance) its quality. Whatever the criticism is (so long as its constructive), I'm more than happy to receive and act on it. Have a splendid *insert time of day here*. :)

I'll just make a comparison. Jane Austen: there is a reason why every few years we have an adaptation of one of her works set in the original period and those more truthful to the book and aesthetics are the most popular and beloved. Every year you have a version of this or that story set in modern times for modern audience, but 99% of them are straight to TV C-class movies that are forgotten once the telly is turned off/ channel switched.

I remember when the very Tolkien community thought that "gatekeeping" was mean. I was called an idiot for thinking that "nerd" culture should be gate kept from normies, now we came full circle, haven't we?

I do like the old Miss Marple movies but Im from germany, so hopefully they reboot it with only german actors speaking german so that I can feel welcome. There just isnt any other way I could ever enjoy these movies!

@etme1000

2 жыл бұрын

You're right, mein freund. It's the same old racism, just clothed otherwise.

I take it that what they mean “updating for a modern audience” means adding a good dose of pedophilia, joggerization, and contempt for real fans.

@clogs4956

2 жыл бұрын

And simplifying words with more than four letters.

@shastasilverchairsg

2 жыл бұрын

Add incest, sadism and grown men pushing young boys out of a window.

4:08 "He gave us a nice happy ending." Yeah, about that, read the rest of the book and see how beater sweet the ending actually is.

They released some more footage on Amazon Prime Brazil last night. I'm not sure whether to laugh hysterically or burst into tears for 8 year old me. When a truly diverse book isn't diverse enough...

@spacejunk2186

2 жыл бұрын

Oh shit, what did they show?

Amazon’s Rings of Power is kinda the participation award in storytelling…

Remember, the same people that are subverting/blackfacing original caucasian characters are the same people that say that readers can only be inspired and see themselves in characters of the same skinn color. That is why they are putting aside caucasian characters by replacing them with hollow characters of other ethnicity/colorfacing; because in their minds it will lead to caucasian childrens to feel de-franchised and not be inspired by heroes to do the rigth thing and feel empowered and do something productive with their lives. This also falls right within marxist idiology and agenda. If people grow up feeling powerless and uninspired they will become hollow adults that will do nothing with their lives and do nothing positive like changing or preventing the communist crap that the ruling class wants to implement on said people.

Making a perfect adaptation is an art in itself and that's what Jackson and the crew did with LotR. From perfect casting, through perfect filming locations, perfect music and even deciding to make the movie so prop heavy (instead of using too much CGI so it would not hold that good in the future). How great it would be to see his vision for Silmarilion... if only we could.

The irony is the taking over fandom and someone else’s creation, is actually like what Sauron would do.