So basically the more polyrhythms we stack, the closer we get to the sound of Mr Krabs walking sound

@rockfri

2 жыл бұрын

who would have thought that Mr Krabs walked in polyrhythms? 😂 9:14

@dianagbm

2 жыл бұрын

#facts

@MrSpeedyAce

2 жыл бұрын

Funniest comment I've read in a long time 😂😂😂

@felipepestana

2 жыл бұрын

Ultimate prog master

@revimfadli4666

2 жыл бұрын

Mr Krabs type beat

Ultimately one must be able to feel the musicality of a polyrhythm for it to be valid. West African drumming makes much use of 6 against 4 to produce tightly interwoven patterns that are the basis for dance and song. People native to the cultures in that region understand these rhythms with ease and fluency. I needed extramusical analogies to comprehend them, including transcriptions in western rhythm notation. It took a little woodshedding on my own before it clicked, but once there I never had to think about it again. We use polyrhythms all the time without knowing it in our everyday speech.

@Sqlut

3 жыл бұрын

This is very interesting. I knew West Africa tribes but also Native American tribes used a lot of complex rythms during ceremonies and now I wonder if this knowledge did not spread out to Detroit for the "birth" of electronic music.

@robbes7rh

3 жыл бұрын

​@@Sqlut -- such direct connections are unlikely if we're talking about the latter half of the 20th century. It is interesting to note what African musical characteristics did remain in the African American culture that developed and thrived more or less independently of the wider Euro-American culture of North America. And certainly, an emphasis on the lively and sensual physicality of dance is one of those characteristics. And rhythms such as the shuffle are resultant, if in a subtle fashion, to a polyrhythmic approach. Also, I would argue that the sort of wild abandon of solo and heterophonic vocalizing that emerges in certain predominantly Black church services and early "Race Music" recordings of Rock 'n Roll, heard against a steady pulse marked out by percussion instruments, one finds polyrhythms manifesting in higher subdivisions of the metric pulse. Such phenomena emerge in a subliminal mind frame and are uniquely associated with the North American Black subculture of which the music played in urban dance clubs is certainly a part.

@GreenToast01

2 жыл бұрын

6:4 polyrhythms are the same as 2:3?

@samuelt8602

2 жыл бұрын

For those wondering what a 6:4 / 3:2 polyrhythm sounds like, just think african bell carol

@Gonachigo

2 жыл бұрын

Wtf

Shapes would work better if they had a sweeping line like a clock, and when the line intersects a corner, a sound plays. So for 3:4, it would be like a clock with a triangle pointing to 12, 4, and 8, and a square pointing to 12, 3, 6, and 9.

@duality4y

2 жыл бұрын

very interesting

@alexbanks9510

2 жыл бұрын

Kind of disappointed this isn't where he went with it. It seemed like the obvious next step to me

@digitalnomad9985

2 жыл бұрын

and have them concentric so you sweep with the same arm.

@surikoshiro140

2 жыл бұрын

The only issue with this idea is the shapes are not circles, so the sides won't line up with a uniform movement around a given "clock path." In this way, the line that sweeps in a circle will cause the actual contact point with the given shape to change velocity along the shape to keep in time with the circular motion in a non-circular path. But I agree this whole idea does give a more promising way to visualize and compare rhythms.

@zecuse

2 жыл бұрын

@@surikoshiro140 That's not the point of this. We're using regular polygons. This means their vertices will be spaced regularly around the circle (clock as OP said) and that's what we care about. Not the concentration of points representing the edges of the shapes along the circle (e.g. a triangle would concentrate around 12, 4, & 8, but we only care about the 3 vertices at 12, 4, & 8). In other words, this takes the rectangle visual and curves it around into a circle. The line is just rotating around the circle about its center like a radius and therefore a revolution around any of the rectangles (shapes in OP's case) takes the same amount of time as any other because they're both just a 2π rotation by the same line.

1:35 Nitpick: "A polyrhythm is created when you play two different subdivisions _which aren't multiples of one another_ at the same time" 3 against 6, 2 against 4, or 3 against 12 are not polyrhythms for instance (for each, the second rhythm fits into the first).

@pavlenikacevic4976

4 ай бұрын

Indeed, that's why 2:3:4 in his example is the same thing as 3:4

2:3:4 is effectively the same as 3:4 since 4 is a subdivision of 2. That is, it doesn't add any unique syncopation - although using different voices for different subdivisions may provide some variation.

@EarleMonroe

2 жыл бұрын

This is exactly what I was thinking. Same with 6 and 3

@WhydoIneedafuckinghandle

2 жыл бұрын

Came here to say this. Same with any number & its exponents...I think... The lower values become redundant. Like (1:)2:4:8:16 etc. 3:9:27:51, but also 3:6:12:24. It's the whole point, to put 2 or more numbers that don't divide by 2 & itself in juxtaposition. I might be a bit wrong somewhere, I'm not thinking this particularly well through lel

@decare696

2 жыл бұрын

no, you're right. Properly phrased: when you have a poly-polyrhythm with components n and m and m is a factor of n, then all beats of m will also be beats of n, so adding or removing the m-subdivision won't change anything

@AP-dc1ks

2 жыл бұрын

@@decare696 Poorly phrased again. When N and M share factors this appears. 6-4 is just two times the 3-2 rhythm because two is a shared factor. Edit: Dan seems actually spot on except the typo of exponent instead of multiple.

@WhydoIneedafuckinghandle

2 жыл бұрын

@@AP-dc1ks Thanks, good to know. It's because I was thinking of 2^n specifically, then 3^n - got myself mixed up - you're right, multiple is sufficient, making exponents redundant. Quite aptly so. Also, it's been like 19yrs since I had my last lesson in maths; I can't remember anything properly...

All you had to do to make the shape one work better is stipulate that every shape has the same perimeter. The dot would move at a constant speed then.

@nicolacornolti7796

2 жыл бұрын

I also visualized it inside of a circle, that could help using a rotating radius

@RagingViperGamer

2 жыл бұрын

If you inscribe them in a circle you can have the point go around the circle and click whenever it hits a point

@adamsmith7630

2 жыл бұрын

I was imagining this, then unrolling the shape on screen into a line with a point where each corner was. Stack two of these lines on top of each other and draw some stems and you're basically just re-creating the staff, combining the two concepts.

@grahamdunning

2 жыл бұрын

@@RagingViperGamer yes, it's constant angular velocity (but not linear velocity) - would work well

I don't usually comment on videos, but I wanted to thank you for all your hard work in teaching us these things. Your videos are a refreshing way to learn and you explain things really well. Thank you.

@Oddquartet

4 жыл бұрын

Thank you so much. That means a lot to me.

@Sqlut

3 жыл бұрын

@@Oddquartet for real tho, if you search "polyrhythm" on youtube and scroll through the thumbnails, your way of explaining it is out of the box AND visually accurate, I knew you'd explain it better BEFORE even clicking on it, and almost did not need to see the video to understand because the thumbnail is also damn good at explaining the concept

@klartnet

3 жыл бұрын

i think so. the out-of-the-box explanation in this video, it was helpful for me to understand the polyrhythm more accurately and more detail. although it's a video from a year ago, still VERY helpful.

3:30 fat beat. Already vibing

@Flashback_Jack

3 жыл бұрын

3:48: More oontz-oontz-oontz in this one. Just needs a few tss-tss-tss-tss!

This is much better than the previous video. The 1,2,3,4,5,6,7 sounds like flamenco indeed. Thank you for your hard work.

@cavemann_

2 жыл бұрын

Nice observation!

@placeholdername3907

2 жыл бұрын

Mr krabs walkin

@digitalnomad9985

2 жыл бұрын

I would have liked to hear a primes only series: 1,2,3,5,7

- Tool has entered the chat -

@DeliciousVicious777

2 жыл бұрын

- Meshuggah welcomes Tool-

@XK49

2 жыл бұрын

Omg someone made a Tool joke in a video about music theory xD

@TheTylrBllmn

2 жыл бұрын

gross

@jonathanromo4104

2 жыл бұрын

Gojira liked "- Took has entered the chat -"

@juicedelemon

2 жыл бұрын

@@TheTylrBllmn uno reverse

As someone who plays rhythm games, this is a really good and easy to follow visualization of polyrhythms! I also loved how you you used POLYgons to visualize POLYrhythm :P

@mattd6085

2 жыл бұрын

"poly" means more than one, so of course polygons would visualise a polyrhythm, it wouldn't work any other way.

@jugemujugemugokonosurikire4735

2 жыл бұрын

Yo what rhythm games do you play? Asking as a fellow rhythm gamer myself.

@mr.nazareth4501

2 жыл бұрын

Honestly I used to hate OSU but at least it's not FNF... Right?? Plz don't tell me u play FNF

@hicalebih8902

Жыл бұрын

@@jugemujugemugokonosurikire4735 sorry for late response - Main rhythm game I play is Cytoid, I also play Groove Coaster, Project Diva, Takio, and Rotaeno

@BGDMusic

Жыл бұрын

@@mr.nazareth4501 fnf is just osu mania but worse anyway i'm not op but i usually play mania

The attention to detail in this video is amazing! I love how the highlighted part at 2:42 is playing louder in the left ear, which subconsciously helps you focus on it

9:14 "Mr Krabs has entered the chat"

I like how, the more subdevisions you add, the more it sounds like the 1 2 3 4 5 subdevision, just with a geiger counter ontop of it

@hydrocharis1

2 жыл бұрын

Integer Becquerels

My god, the blend of graphic design, music theory and technology on this channel... I was wondering why I liked this video so much when I randomly stumbled on it. Now to binge on some of these other videos, great job!

Now imagine these polyrythms together with the dimensions of different sounds (horns, strings etc) and frequency for each 'hit'. This really shows complexity of music, and are the dimensions left in these visualizations compared to sheet music.

Love this. Great visualizations that make it easy to understand. Thanks for doing this. Subscribed.

One way to improve the "speed" issue of the shapes approach is to stack them concentrically. Then you could have a radar-style circular sweep, where each time the sweep hits a vertex it plays the sound.

This is an excellent visualization! I *can read music and still found this awesome! It was fun seeing and hearing your poly rhythms.

Very beautiful video! It changed my perception.

The best video on Polyrythms, hands down! so easy to understand and foolow. Thank you so much!

Cool exploration! I'd like to see some visualizations of polyrhythm with third or fourth patterns triggered probabilistically based on the second or third pattern, respectively - or with pattern starting place occasionally "rotated" to a different time.

9:18 the striking sound just turns into popcorn cackles.

Fantastic video! So simple...genius!

Brilliant execution!!

This is like watching a video created by my thumbs about how I play kalimba. Polyrhythms sound so pretty on the kalimba 😻

This makes understanding more complex polyrhythms so much easier!!

Thank you for all of this. The rectangles helped the most.

Killer vid as always!

Nice visual! Thanks!

The divided rectangles are basically the same as notation though, its just inverted. With notes the beep occurs on the thing, with the rectangles the beep occurs on the little gaps between the things. But make the gaps bigger and round the rectangle and you get notation. I think parallel lines of different lengths where a dot travels at the same speed from side to side couldve been a truely valuable other representation

@cheshire1

2 жыл бұрын

I think it is very valuable to make the notes thinner and less round. Also the notes in the notation at the beginning of the video aren't aligned properly the way the rectangle divisions are (in the 4 against 3: fourth note at the bottom should come after third at the top, but looks like it's slightly earlier). I think this is because spatially separating e.g. into groups of 3 and 4 makes it easier to identify which rhythm you're dealing with, but it doesn't help visualize the rhythm.

James Tenney wrote a player piano roll on a similar concept, which was the harmonic series: the root note pulsed once a cycle, the octave pulsed twice, octave+5th pulsed three, etc. All the way up to 24 harmonics. Audibly, it produces these beautiful pitch cascades. You would've gotten something similar if you'd have kept going. (edit: the piece is named Spectral Canon).

Thanks for this great video!

This is a very good visual representation of polyrhtyhms! I'm gonna draw this on my white board for my students! Great work!

Dude, that was AMAZING.. I am listening to Periphery with another understanding of the music right now after your vídeo. As an amateur musician, polyrhythms was always kinda of unreachabke and hi-level for me.. Thank you!

This was very helpful!

I first learned about Polyrhythms using the rectangle method. It helped me to see the gaps between each beat at a different rhythm; it widens by the difference of the two rhythms as it approaches the middle, then narrows again. I would count the length of the gap, and then sort of reverse-engineer the polyrhythm from there

I am a visual learner as well. The very last poly-poly-rhythm (7 to 1) reminded me of Spanish/Flamenco music. While the second to last (6) had an African beat to it. Hey that's my ear. Either way, I learned something!!! Thanks.

Pass the Goddamn Butter

Very cool video. I’ve always visualized time like this but thought it was just me. Visualizing odd times like a Big Band leader or classical conductor using their wand to keep the time. It would be cool it you used different pitches for the different polyrhythms. Thank you for posting this

Thank you so much for the explanation, I’m a visual learner and starting to learn drums and polyrhythms are such a struggle and this really made it that much easier to understand 👌

@mattd6085

2 жыл бұрын

If you're just starting out drumming, focus on regular patterns until you are solid as a rock. Polyrhythms will come naturally once you've mastered the basics.

@spicymcchicken2272

2 жыл бұрын

@@mattd6085 thank you so much 🥺🙏

@mattd6085

2 жыл бұрын

@@spicymcchicken2272 no probs, just remember the fundamental point of a drummer, to keep good time. Some of the world greats weren't polyrhythm masters but they were like human metronomes. A solid 4/4 beat will always sound better than a sloppy 15/8

Brilliant, finally I got it

Very intuitive approach to tackle polyrhythms. I now very clearly see why this can be very useful in writing. (other than 3/16 rhythms in a 4/4 environment.... I overuse that, cuz... well I often make stuff (hard) Trance (& acid) stuff. And it is a mandatory rhythm there. Also, delays may only have a 3/16 delaytime. It objectively is the best delaytime in 4:4 though) Edit: LOL, that 2nd visualization is basically like a step sequencer. That is more or less my default way of thinking of rhythms... As most music I have made in a digital environment. I did also play guitar, but that was done way more on feel. So no clear picture with it…

Spot on!

Wow, this was a great explanation! I first realized polyrhythm when I was learning Beethoven's Moonlight Sonata. In bar 5 is where you have a triplet against an 8th note.

wow this is beautiful

5:45 I thought of the exact same thing but also thought about pitch when you were talking about the two axis of sheet music

I like the rectangles method. I did an excel spreadsheet that looked like this a while back.

We are gonna get there

This is excellent. In my opinion, you have to put the same perimeter in the two shapes, in order to make to point travel at the same speed in both shapes. Cause the timeline goes at the same speed anyway. But I really like the animation, the details, and explanation! Thank you for sharing.

@andrebenites9919

2 жыл бұрын

But, of course, the sides would become smaller and smaller as you go up. But, that is kinda the point, the beat of the square will be faster than the triangle by definition, and this will be shown either in the speed or if you make the velocity constant, the width will get smaller accordingly

@briantriesart

2 жыл бұрын

@@andrebenites9919 Thank you! :) Last words about it, cause at the end of the line I think all of these options are correct in some way. Imagine you have two lines (as you see at 6:54) same length. if you fold each one into regular polygons (without changing the length) you will get what I said in my comment. So the timeline is always the same speed for both figures (cause is the same song), but you will hear more beats cause you have more divisions in the line. But... probably I am wrong. thank youuu

@andrebenites9919

2 жыл бұрын

​@@briantriesart Something that we can also do is put those regular polygons inside a circle. And make a dot go the same speed around the circle. (Or we can make it travel on the shapes, but respecting the angular velocity). A lot of different and interesting ways of representing.

the multiple layers of rhythms reminded me of Ballet Folklórico México Danza. pretty cool.

it's amazing how the pattern changes when you focus only one side and when you switch the focus. Good visualization, but I prefer a circle with a rotating ball.

This is awesome, you laid this out simply & beautifully I had a similar concept in my head after playing Zelda: Breath of the Wild and started imaging the green stamina meters as quarter note heads

Great video! Thank you!

3+4 sounds like some melody. 2 notes + 2 rythms = music! Awesome!

This is very useful

Love the shapes! I think that marking horizontal lines across both shapes at each corner on one shape would help you to see the order of the beats.

...GREAT VIDEO , THANK YOU VERY MUCH...

I'm wondering now if I've used polyrythmns before and not noticed it (probably not). I always thought it was just a way to say "the drummers realllllly good", I knew polyrythmns were a thing but I could never discern them when I heard them in a song. This was an amazing visualisation, thank you for this

I think the whole shapes thing is great. The way you can make it uniform speed is to match the total perimeter of both shapes. Then, both dots can travel at the same speed and still get the polyrhythm concept spot-on with a more intuitive (in my opinion) derivation of the visual aid. I think a circle is also a great candidate for understanding this concept. When you take the subdivisions and put them on a circle with a chosen point to signify the loop of the pulse, when you "unwrap" the circle into a line, it becomes very clear the rhythmic relation between the subdivisions. So much so that if you split each line segment the length of each line would perfectly correspond to the rhythmic ratios of the polyrhythm written on a single voice. For example, for 3/2 you would get two line segments of equal length in addition to two more that are half the length of the others.

Bueno vídeo bro, gracias por sintetizar un tema tan complejo al menos para mí.

Very very interesting!

This is really cool. Maybe they used rectangles like this back in the days before computers to figure out polyrhythms.

Brilliant, easy (kinda), well done; i subscribed; thanks.

6:50 feels like when the house is so quiet you can hear the sink in the bathroom dripping while also listening in on the clock ticking on the wall

Brilliant !! . Thumbs up + subscribed.

Brilliant.

If you want to hear a 1:2:3:4:5:6 at high frequency, then on a keyboard, play C3, C4, G4, C5, E5, and G5 at time same time. You've definitely heard this before, it's just major triad with some reinforcement. Adding a seventh term isn't accessible in 12-tone equal temperament scales, though, so it would maybe sound pretty different to ears that are used to western styles. I tried adding an A#5 to the above and it sounded a bit weird, and tuning it downward by ~30 cents actually did make it sound less tense to me, although I didn't have the precision to get it right on a 7x frequency relative to C3, so who knows. Maybe it wouldn't sound weird to people at all.

Another visualization is stacking the shapes while aligning their centers. Higher subdivisions have a bigger inner radius than others. A rotating radial bar can track the passage of time. What's more, you can rotate an individual shape to change its phase relative to the others. When certain the number of subdivisions begins to look like too much, you can use star shapes instead of regular polygons. Odd numbers may be difficult with star shapes though, but you can always just snub a point and/or pit to add a vertex. Of course, you'd have to readjust the angles so that all vertices are equiangular.

If you ever come back to this, I have a suggestion that came to my mind. In the linear bar visualisation, you could change the colour of the current box when the click sounds and then fade back to the original colour while the indicator move through the box. I'm also am a visual learner myself, and I felt like that would have helped even more.

This is great

I have heard all of these rhythms, and beaten out a few of them at hippy forest festivals and living room jam sessions back in the relative innocence of the 2090s, those really were some days… R.I.P to my beautiful old 1950’s Mamba and all the other instruments that were lost to fire not long ago.

Thank you!!!

The last rhythm makes me unreasonably happy

Well I was thinking of rock'n'roll and now i've thought of something new. Therapy triangle, therapy square. Whoa nice music numbers!

Great video thx

Yo 2:3:4:5:6 really slaps. It sounds like there are just Two separate rhythms happening at the same time and it's great. I hear it almost as 2:5:6 and 2:3:4 It's honestly really fucking cool.

Sounds like (simplified) traditional African drumming rhythms. Polyrhythms are as old as humanity. Loved the video.

The 1-5 poly sounded like a tango rhythm with an extra quarter note and that felt really dancy~

The most salient feature of a polyrhythm - any polyrhythm - is a pattern that is a symmetrical Palindrome. 2 against 3 will look like this: § : > | 3 against 5 § x x o x > o x x o ” or “

Good stuff. I'm trying to play two of Danny Carey's songs, have been for a while now, so MAYBE this will help. It's pretty cool that, for me, I get the feeling of a circle (or another shape) when I listen to some of Tool's songs. This may have something to do with it! Too bad you can't tag Danny Carey on this. He many find this interesting.

FWIW, I used graph paper to block out the sub-divisions - I put pitch info at the bottom of the set where you chose the pattern. I made up one master and copy it. Especially helpful if you're trying to pass a 7 over 3 line around the band.

The dots on the shapes look like they're going at different speed, but really, the dots are going at equal speed on the circles in which the shapes are inscribed. Many-sided shapes seeming more and more like circles isn't so much a problem. You could simply change the shapes for circles with notches, it could be pretty intuitive.

@IONATVS

2 жыл бұрын

Alternatively, have all the shapes concentric and scaled/rotated so their first vertex is shared. Then you can either use a radial “dial” marker sweep across them at a constant *angular* velocity or draw their shared circumcircle and have the marker point ride that, playing when it hits the vertices, which by definition will be the only points touching said circumcircle. And for larger shapes you can either replace with points along the circumcircle, as you suggest OR exaggerate the non-circle-ness of the shapes by making the edges steadily less of a true line and more of a concave arc as the shapes get bigger. Or replace them with star polygons of the same number of vertices. lots of ways to make more distinct shapes with same number of points.

Genius!

Good idea! I think at this particular subject the distances should be equal to show equal time signature. Maybe the time marker dots could go on the outer circles of the two polygons instead of the sides? Also if you want to use the height of notes for distinction I would recommend you to give the lower note to the polygon with less number of vertices.

that second last one! absolute fire, I adored the way that sounded! it's 2 against 3 ag 4 ag 5 ag 6, right? amazing

The 1 vs 2 vs 3 vs 4 vs 5 has and African flavor to my ear. Congrats.

This was awesome. I rather enjoyed the shapes for simple polys.

This is a genius idea. I don't teach music. But if I did, I'd use this video.

And now we know what they used as sound for car blinkers!

the shapes' marker will also travel at a constant speed if you make sure the shapes' circumferences are the same or overlay both shapes and have a line go around like a clock, making sound whenever intersecting a corner

5 over 4 over 3 was pretty cool. Not too busy with a maximum amount of syncopation

Everything on the one!

I never knew I know this naturally. All of the rhythms are in my head. Had I studied music I'd have taken to it naturally.

@I_SEE_RED

2 жыл бұрын

no time to start like the present

You could have the perimeter of the shape be constant so the speed can be the same, but I agree the bar method is easier to see. edit: or just use a circle with dots in rings. I think there is an app that does this.

I will put in the Playlists

"This might help someone understand" thank you

Thanks! I have written some music that is 7 v 4 but I had no idea this had a name.

KEEP GOING.

Glad you did 6:5:4:3:2 its Jacob Collier's favourite polyrhythm, and its also a major chord