I very much so understand and do not dismiss the argument that his family has said they do not love the adaptations so therefore it is safe to say he might not as well. I very much so respect that argument. But I also know I personally disagree with my family on many issues. So I don’t necessarily want to put the opinions of the son on the father. Though I very much so understand and respect that approach.

@silasmoody2539

4 жыл бұрын

Hi

@derpimusmaximus8815

4 жыл бұрын

Let's be honest, there are so many songs in the books, the movies would have had to be musicals to really bring Tolkien's vision to life.

@jamesfrederick.

4 жыл бұрын

You’re a moth that’s funny I’m a tree frog

@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy

4 жыл бұрын

Well said! The only thing (I think) Tolkien said himself was that he didn’t believe the books could ever be adapted into films. That’s a far cry from knowing how he would have felt about Jackson’s films. As a Tolkien fan, I was nervous and skeptical about the films before they came out, but I was more or less delighted with them.

@nviz47

4 жыл бұрын

Hey the rating videos are fun! Do them how you're doing them or change it if you like - they're fun! People need to chill.

I am totally on board with your “Flaws of Popular Authors” idea!

@TheSamfrog

4 жыл бұрын

I'd watch the crap out of that. It'd really help to appreciate an author's growth and improvement even more

@merrittanimation7721

4 жыл бұрын

I would watch the hell out of it.

@NCPalma

4 жыл бұрын

Big agree

@shosty575

4 жыл бұрын

So no video about Joe Abercrombie 😁

@darmokandjalad7786

4 жыл бұрын

Sounds like a great way to never get another author interview lol

I think that if Tolkien could watch the films, he would write a 10 pages letter praising Peter Jackson for all the great work he did, and then a 30 pages letter explaining why he hates them.

@Admire

2 жыл бұрын

I think he would have loved watching the world, parts of the story and be in love with the score which is still the best movie score ever created

@buzzwithdrip6347

Жыл бұрын

@@Admire maybe if Titanic's score didn't exist

@buzzwithdrip6347

Жыл бұрын

He would not like the lack of depth and violence in the movies

@Dino23968

9 ай бұрын

Question: I’m looking for a high fantasy series that has these qualities: -An epic mythology set on a different planet(like a space opera but set on only one planet instead of a whole solar system or galaxy) -Characters that are different non-human races -A variety of alien creatures -Has science and technology but leans more towards magic, miracles, and mysticism. -So many elements of the world screaming many different cultures, both ancient and recent, while other aspects surrounding the characters feel futuristic and otherworldly -A world that feels somewhat familiar while still constantly reminding us how different it is(like Star Wars or the Stormlight Archives) -Light and positive themes of love, honor, friendship, loyalty, sacrifice, and faith verses the dark and negative themes of tragedy, corruption, betrayal, and genocide What are some recommendations that match all of these?

@Ppanos423

9 ай бұрын

@@Dino23968 A Princess of Mars

Characters without arcs are like iconic characters like James Bond and they work fine

@NoMereRanger73

4 жыл бұрын

Exactly. :) Indiana Jones is another good example. I’m pretty sure there’s an entire episode of the “Writing Excuses” podcast dedicated to iconic characters.

@RestingJudge

4 жыл бұрын

Captain America to an extent, his personal philosophy remains unchanged he impacts the world, but the world doesn't impact him.

@carterdahl9654

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah that's called a "static" character and can absolutely work, I usually see it in villains of a seris. Randal Flagg from the Dark Tower is a good example of this or Ned from Game of Thrones

@JambleBramble

4 жыл бұрын

I agree, but also think a lot of people see gradual shifts or smaller arcs and act like a character is stagnant if they're not wildly different at the end of a story than at the beginning.

@eodico

4 жыл бұрын

Bond does have an arc. It is the flat arc

As Alfred Hitchcock said, suspense beats surprise every time.

@totallynotalpharius2283

4 жыл бұрын

It doesn't matter if we see the bomb under the desk, it matters that the character doesn't know

@supremeleadersmeagol6345

Ай бұрын

Someone let the Rings of Power writers know about that

I absolutely love that Daniel acknowledges when he sees that someone has called him on something and strives to do better. This is something that is missing from politics, religion, and society in general. This is one of the reasons I follow this channel. Good job staying humble amd always trying to improve Daniel.

@castlebroknhed8065

4 жыл бұрын

@Atharva Deshpande I have never met anyone who, after a well reasoned critique of their political view, said "You have a point. Maybe I should look into this more."

@BrettWoodPiano

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah mad respect

@newfish1802

3 жыл бұрын

CastleBroknhed I absolutely agree with you. I have just recently started watching Daniel and his respect of opinions and answering honorable is epic. Daniel is also funny when he can be and I feel whenever he throws something funny in that it fits well. I also find it hilarious when he throws an opinion out the window to be funny but then treats it respectfully after

@curranfrank2854

3 жыл бұрын

@@castlebroknhed8065 I get what you're saying but if you're talking about their overall political view, that's a very difficult thing to change. Like I lean pretty progressive now, more so than I used to be, and I have A LOT of different reasons for why that is. I could see changing a political position I have based on a good criticism (and I have done that in the past) but I think unless you present the best possible argument against my views I'm not going to change them based on one debate/argument. And if I did I probably had a superficial attachment to them in the first place

The quick cut after the lotr is scifi comment was great

@averongodoffire8098

4 жыл бұрын

LoTR... being sci-fi... HOW?!???

@And-ur6ol

4 жыл бұрын

@@averongodoffire8098 don't you know? The palantir is just computers connected to satellites. There is no magic in LOTR. Gandalf carries a shield generator, which he uses against the balrog. Joking aside, calling LOTR sci-fi is like calling My Little Pony grim dark horror. It's just so off :D

@averongodoffire8098

4 жыл бұрын

Anders Doktor Lol don’t give them any ideas😂🤣🤣 but ya really weird to hear

@calarakien

4 жыл бұрын

@@And-ur6ol i dunno man, those ponies fill ME with existential dread anytime i see them

@alexandredeleu7147

3 жыл бұрын

​@@averongodoffire8098 Hi ! This is a very interesting idea, and i agree with the comment saying thet LoTR is actually Sci-fi. First : I am a Sci-fi guy, and not really a Fantasy Guy. Let me explain : It is all a matter of definition. The most accurate and satisfying definition of Sci-Fi i have ever came across was the one given by French Scholar Irène Langlet in her book : "Science-Fiction : Lecture et poétique d'un genre littéraire" (Reading and poetry of a genre). She gives her definition of Sci-Fi : (I roughly translate it in English) Sci-Fi is a genre where the Author draws conclusion from a supernatural/technological postulate known and accepted by the characters in the book. in other words, the Sci-Fi author invents something that do not exist in real life (a machine, a robot, space travel, communication with the Aliens........) ans expands this idea to explain what these elements changes life of the characters. From this définition, i cannot see how LoTR would not be Sci-Fi : it falls under the définition of Sci-Fi. 1- you disagree with the definition : Well, it is the best definition I have ever come across, because all the sci-fi I have ever read falls under the definition : maybe give me a better one ? 2- You disagree because Sci-Fi is technology and Fantasy is magic. I think this is a misunderstanding of what makes Sci-fi and fantasy what they are : The postulate in the beginning of the story is not important, it can be whatever you want, but it has to be not existing in real life, what is important is the conséquenses of the postulate. Plus, I think that magic in fantasy (I have not read a lot of fantasy !) is treated like science. The mages are scientists that study a natural phenomenon and start to use it… how different is it from scientists in Sci-Fi that try to understand the “magic” of hyperspace travel ? What is the fundamental difference between Alien Races and Fantasy Races ? Maybe it is the Word “Science” that bothers you : replace it by the first word used to describe Sci-Fi : “Speculative Fiction”. Fantasy speculates around the idea of the existence of magic and fantasy races, just like what you think Sci-Fi does with tech and alien races. Another proof : there are so many books that are “between” fantasy and Sci-fi : - Star Wars : Fantasy races/Alien Races, The force treated like magic in classic trilogy and like a science in the prequels - Grimnoir Chronicles : the magic is treated like science… and the powers are given by an Lovecraftian-like Creature ! - …….. All that to say that Fantasy is Sci-Fi, and Sci-Fi is fantasy, due to the fact that the two are not different in nature. I believe this so strongly that I am always shocked to see the reactions this statement provokes !

What makes a movie great? It certainly has nothing to do with the source material behind it. One can definitely argue that the LOTR movies have flaws, but not showcasing characters like Tom Bombadil or skipping Saruman's takeover of the Shire are NOT flaws. Just changes. Film is a different medium. It functions differently.

@Kadaspala

4 жыл бұрын

Taking away Frodo's agency against the Ringwraiths through resisting temptation and perserverance to instead have Eowyn just rescue him is a change that I thought was pretty bad though. Kinda destroyed the reasoning on why he was accepted as the ring bearer on the adventure by everyone.

@kingkusnacht

4 жыл бұрын

@@Kadaspala Sure, and comparing things like that are fair game, but this is a "smaller" element. I think one has to look at the overall picture, and I think the trilogy exceeds in telling a compelling fantasy series. Remember: Making a film is so much more complicated. E.g. Tolkien can write "Frodo was confused", but showing this in a film is so much more complicated.

@kingkusnacht

4 жыл бұрын

@Bosnium It's not that simple my friend. My point is that while the sentence "Gimli was sad" takes up 3 words of a large book, it could take up to a minute to visually execute it. Screen time is more valuable. There's just no time for irrelevant plots, unimportant characters and many side-quests in well-made films, whereas books have all the time in the world. Film is a more difficult medium to create.

@kingkusnacht

4 жыл бұрын

@Bosnium oh yeah, I agree with that. I just wanted to showcase the difference between writing a book and making a film.

@persephone3892

4 жыл бұрын

I love the movie ending and Tom Bombadil was redundant. Honestly LotR is one of the best book to movie adaptations

Brandon Sanderson has big plan on how the cosmere will end. "The earth opens up and kills everyone and thats the ending." "Damn, he figured it out, we gotta change!"

@reillywilloughby

4 жыл бұрын

Nah, that wouldn't work. There would need to at least be a supernova to destroy the cosmere. Too many planets involved. What actually will happen is Cephandrius will collect all 16 shards and become a new Adonalsium. Then kill everyone.

@moonisusman4072

3 жыл бұрын

@@reillywilloughby cephandrius is Hoid right? I'm not completely caught up on the cosmere yet.

@reillywilloughby

3 жыл бұрын

@@moonisusman4072 yep! Cephandrius is one of Hoid's names. That is a bit of a cosmere deep lore fact, so don't feel weird that you didn't know it!

In the bit about a character not needing an arc... Totally true! Back in university, my writing lecturer called them "The travelling angel" archetype. He argued their purpose was to improve the lives of other characters, often having an impact on their arcs. Examples he gave were Mary Poppins, Ferris Bueller and Gandalf.

@tahunuva4254

4 жыл бұрын

... Or Xavier, Renegade Angel for a literal yet also fipped version of the trope.

@nicholaus3248

4 жыл бұрын

Um... *Uncle Iroh*

@Ghostlyape123

4 жыл бұрын

I think of Prince Ashitaka from Princess Mononoke in this context. He’s a genuinely good person all throughout and consistently badass, but the interesting part is how he helps others and how they change as a result of him throughout the story.

@gokbay3057

4 жыл бұрын

Static Characters are fine. Especially if you are not following their life story. It makes total sense for not every character featured in a book to have arcs and changes during the limited time our story shows them.

@tlf2818

4 жыл бұрын

Agreed. Although (and I understand that's not what you were trying to say) Gandalf has an arc.

A creator that would rather surprise the audience over having a fully consistent story is basically saying "I only expect people to read/watch/etc my product just once."

@alexrexaros9837

3 жыл бұрын

>my product Consoooooooooom

@turtleboy1188

3 жыл бұрын

And then be remembered forever

To the point of Tolkien's possible take on the LOTR: Professor Tolkien made it clear that his intention was to birth a true English mythology. The movies helped to accomplish that goal. His personal tastes aside, I think he would have been gratified that his books were made into movies.

@jameslowe8141

4 жыл бұрын

Agree. It also should be pointed out that he sold the movie rights so if he didn't want a movie he shouldn't have done that.

@gokbay3057

4 жыл бұрын

@Salve to Cat Overlords especially since he wrote Hobbit for children. Like LotR was supposed to be a epic so the movies being an adventure epic makes sense. Hobbit was an adventure sure but it was not really supposed to be an epic on the level of LotR. And they tried to make the movies as such. Hobbit is a great story but it's not on the level of LotR. (Also Silmarillion>LotR or Hobbit, don't at me).

@tlf2818

4 жыл бұрын

@Salve to Cat Overlords Can you, pretty please, elabore on your hypothesis that Bombadil molested the hobbits? I'm super intrigued (no irony).

@T00THY_0RiFiCE

4 жыл бұрын

@David Humphries You look like Review Bro (ReportOfTheWeek)

@jodhod1498

4 жыл бұрын

When did he say that? Can you provide a link?

Thank you! I swear when I found out certain authors tweaked their stories that way it seriously irked me! I get it IF an author finds a better way to tell the same story, but don't sacrifice plain sense for "shock and awe." Bottom Line: the integrity of the story matters more than trying to outsmart your audience 💯

@AnnekeOosterink

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah, also, if your audience has figured out the ending, doesn't that mean that the ending is a logical follow up to the first part of the story? It should mean the author has done the work of making the ending make sense, and has foreshadowed appropriately.

@Nimroc

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah this is something that always annoys me, besides if a story works even while knowing/predicting the twists, then that is the best testament to the twists actually being good. Also the irony with authors changing their plans in order to surprise the fans is that it might get to a point where not doing so would be the real surprise. If there is any fans left by then.

@Serai3

3 жыл бұрын

I figure writers like that are writing for the sake of making money, not for the sake of serving the story.

6:06 Best example I can think of right now is Uncle Iroh from Avatar. He definitely seems like the kind of person who has had his character arc long before the events of the series. He doesn't really undergo a lot of change as a person during the events of Avatar, but remains my favorite character in the series (and one of my favorite characters of all time).

Not really a hot take: Just because someone is overrated doesn't mean he/she is bad

@jmparker78

4 жыл бұрын

Very much agreed here. I don't know how many times I've seen an author dismissed as "overrated" as if that's the same thing as saying "not worth reading". Like, on a list of "top 25 best fantasy series" I saw, someone objected to the Harry Potter and His Dark Materials series being on the list, and the only reason why was that they're "overrated". The thing about being "overrated" is that it's purely a subjective word. If 100 people love an author/book/series and 1 person doesn't, that 1 person might call it "overrated" but it's clearly just his opinion and not mainstream. If I take a look at Goodreads and note that a book has thousands of four-star reviews and hundreds of five-star reviews, and only twenty or thirty 1-star reviews, I'm probably still gonna read it and decide whether or not I find it "overrated". But if I do, that's just my opinion. I've been known to recommend books I didn't personally like that much just because the person asking for recommendations clearly has different tastes than me.

@thelasthandbook6704

4 жыл бұрын

Yes. I liked the Kingkiller Chronicles. Didn't love them, didn't hate them, just thought it was a competently done work of fantasy. I'm afraid that for awhile I lost this sense based upon the way the fandom treats the books, both in a positive and (nowadays an increasingly) negative way.

@Nimroc

4 жыл бұрын

Well, overrated doesn't even really work as a term without a point of reference anyway. A bad story rated mediocre would be just as much overrated as a good one rated great, and that is even aside of the whole can of worms that is subjective opinion.

@SHADOW1414

4 жыл бұрын

@@thelasthandbook6704 I actually really recommend Kingkiller on audiobook, the way the story is set-up, I think it's meant to be listened to.

@Serai3

3 жыл бұрын

Not to mention the fact that "overrated" is an extremely subjective judgment.

Okay already seeing the difference between these episodes. Last one was like, bad world building is bad and here we already have Brandon Sanderson is overhyped. If that isn’t a spicy comment in the book community I don’t know what is

@pavelowjohn9167

4 жыл бұрын

Maybe, maybe not. "Sanderson has been over-hyped" might get some folks going, but there are some really spicy takes out there that Daniel has already waded in on. For example, "Modern YA is lazy, formulaic writing that panders to the least admirable parts of teen culture today" is a nice, spicy take that I've seen on some channels. I don't necessarily agree with it, but I can see how it has just enough merit to spark an entertainingly heated debate.

@christopherrousseau1173

4 жыл бұрын

@@pavelowjohn9167 In general modern YA is lazy, formulaic writing. You do have a few gems in the dirt, just like most modern movies are lazy, formulaic drivel but again you have a few gems in the rough... There are always exceptions which is why it is not always good to argue using generic terms and lumping everyone into a group. Are all Americans rich, greedy, self centered jerks? Are all Canadians the most polite, respectful people? Are all Chinese ..... Are all Africans....? You get what I mean?

@turtleboy1188

3 жыл бұрын

He is overhyped, there is so much hype around him that no matter how good he actually is there is proportionally more hype around him than he really should have. Just being more reasonable about him would seem like hate, even if it is positive because of how much hype he has, like he's the only writer in the world.

Singing a song in an audiobook would be impractical for an obvious reason. Someone needs to write the tune. They would then need to convey this to the narrator who may not have training in music theory, even if they CAN sing. Often a writer doesn't hear the tune in their head, rather the rhythm and poetry of the prose.

@blakejensen1470

4 жыл бұрын

I still think that the songs of the Lord of the rings audiobooks are SO well done

@JJsims5504

4 жыл бұрын

Especially considering that not all authors will be musical. And they'd maybe even need to hire a seperate singer to sing them, if the narrator cannot, and someone to compose a melody. And there's the posibility that the composer could do a bad job of that. It would be interesting to see musicians adapt songs in books, though, but I don't think the audiobooks are the place to do that.

@ElrohirGuitar

4 жыл бұрын

I fully agree, that is if Robert Plant and Ann Wilson aren't going to do the singing. Also, who is going to be the backing band?

@mattpfarr6129

3 жыл бұрын

Depends on the narrator, a lot of them are very talented. Hunger Games I thought they did great incorporating the songs in the audio.

@thursoberwick1948

3 жыл бұрын

A lot of audiobooks do include music.

To the point with the singing of songs in audio books: i think they should be read in rithmic musical way. No need for singing but a clear distinction in the reading rythm.

Totally agree with you take at the end of the video. "Subverting expectations" has become a dirty term because so many writers have sacrificed the integrity of their story for cheap shock and to "beat" fan theories. A well-laid out path or twist in a story should be predictable to some degree, otherwise it may feel unearned or out of left field. The onus is on the author to then either deliver on that in a way that can still surprise the audience while remaining consistent with the story or to deliver a twist that, while predictable with respect to the high level concepts, surpasses the audience's own theories. Subversion can still be done well, but the key is in delivering something that people didn't realize they wanted and that makes the most sense within the bounds of the story. Side-note on this topic, because you mentioned Attack on Titan earlier in the video. Isayama (the author of the manga that the anime is based off of) is fantastic at setting up and delivering on plot twists.

Tolkien tried a few times to get the movies made before he died but he failed to do so. He also had some connection with Christopher Lee, and spoke to him about being Gandalf if ever he had control of the movie.

@Scortch-lo3xy

3 жыл бұрын

Really must have stung for Lee to get Sauroman instead...

I would love to see a video examining the weaknesses in the writing of various authors.

About great characters not needing arcs: Toph Beifong. She's a fan favorite, and she's a very static character.

@Nick-ob9ih

4 жыл бұрын

True, she might be a fan fav, but it still does not make her a well written character. For example, doom guy is a total badass, a fan fav, but not a well written or deep character.

@elenamarceline273

4 жыл бұрын

I would actually disagree. Her arc isn’t as intense as many of the other characters, but it exists. Throughout the series, she has to come to terms with the fact that she’s no longer alone and has to work with the team. She learns to rely on her friends and accept help from them. In my opinion, the best character in atla who doesn’t have an arc is Uncle Iroh.

@JayfroC

4 жыл бұрын

'Depth', besides being a hilariously overused buzzword, isn't really inherent to art. At least in my view. I can experience a piece of media and see nothing of value there, while another person can interpret it in a completely different way and take away some life-changing lessons from it. That's why I love to consume art.

@dsj1328

4 жыл бұрын

@@elenamarceline273 Iroh's arc has already happened prior to the story, it seems. Being a fierce warlord until losing his son, turning down the position of Fire Lord and then later finding peace with himself and a second 'son' in Prince Zuko.

@jordinagel1184

4 жыл бұрын

El Chourico more than Iro, I think the Fire Lord is the one without a character arc. Now, that’s not necessarily a bad thing, but he doesn’t really undergo any changes from what we can see, and we don’t see him much anymore once his powers are taken away (which would’ve been perfect breeding ground for introspection and development, having to come to terms with the fact that his powers can no longer do justice to his ambitions)

Loved the vid! About changing the ending I couldn't agree more! I even think that if the story's ending is supposed to be surprising but the reader isn't at all supposed to be able to figure it our by reading the rest of the book/series it's just an empty twist, imo the best surprises are the ones that are set up and/or make you go back and see how "it was here all along"

Rereading a book to better understand is a negative? We've been analyzing the Illiad & Odyssey for millennia!

@gut.6925

4 жыл бұрын

The sound and the fury is a great example of that. You can't fully understand in just one reading

@Parker8752

3 жыл бұрын

Hell, rereading the Wheel of Time and spotting things I didn't see in my previous 5 reads of the series is a pretty great experience.

@thursoberwick1948

3 жыл бұрын

Or their offspring Ulysses. I still find stuff in therr.

This man just threw the Joker under the bus. Damn Daniel.

@frodoswaggins3132

3 жыл бұрын

I think you mean Damniel

Ever watched One Piece? It’s still ongoing (930+ episodes in) the Manga is also fantastic. I absolutely enjoy it, but I also loves pirates. I’m a big Tolkien fan and believe a person can enjoy classic literature, modern fantasy, cinema, manga/anime, etc.. we don’t have to label ourselves so strictly as a fan of just one genre/medium/etc, we can be fans of multiple.

I remember reading that Christopher (in particular) was not going to see the movies; I wonder if he changed his mind. I think JRR would have liked some parts of the movies; but would have hated other parts - Faramir having Gollum beat up and his treatment of Frodo; a burning Denethor taking the dive off of Minas Tirith and the extended editions the death of Sauraman. [edit added here] And of course JRR would have hated Hobbit movies (yes, that is reading into an authors dead mind, which is unfair), but a simple episodic children's book was turned into a bloated, bombastic, including a "man of the people" character arc would probably be despised.

@Nimroc

4 жыл бұрын

The change to Faramir was probably my single biggest complaint of the movies, largely because it didn't even seem necessary in any way to butcher the character that way.

@mattpfarr6129

3 жыл бұрын

The Hobbit movies weren't really even The Hobbit. At best they were inspired by.

@tacitus7797

3 жыл бұрын

@@mattpfarr6129 The hobbit movies were horrible; they are tonally disjoint from the books and bloated in the dumbest ways imaginable. I was referring to theLOTR. movies.

Mistborn is one of my favourite trilogies but in Stormlight I really see the mechanical nature of Sanderson's writing coming through, I will always read his stuff but it stops me from really investing in his stuff. One of my favourite audiobooks growing up was a fully dramatised The Hobbit with music and singing and it's the reason I love LotR, by I think that singing etc should be reserved for dramatisations rather than unabridged versions. Really recommend that 1968 BBC dramatisation! Just looking to provide a twist totally ruined season 8 of GoT

@h.walker1332

4 жыл бұрын

I think I had that on tape, the hobbit I mean. There was lots of singing and depending on who it was changed if it was good or not. I really did love to listen to it.

@revan0890

4 жыл бұрын

I will have to look that up. I love dramtizations.

@CatrionaReads

4 жыл бұрын

@@revan0890 I have it on cassette tape but it's on audible too!

@CatrionaReads

4 жыл бұрын

@@h.walker1332 I really love a dramatisation

2:32 Daniel: Itchy eye itchy eye itchy eye CC's: HEI HEI HEI! Me:....Yeah that's about right.

I would love to see more spoiler filled reviews. I strongly believe that knowing the way something ends doesn't mean that you can`t enjoy it when you read/watch it. Any story it's not only plot and character arc, it's also how it comes alive with every word.

I would love to see a video were you break down popular authors' strengths and weaknesses. That would make for a super interesting conversation I think

For what it’s worth, Tolkien’s grandson Simon Tolkien has given interviews in which he says his grandfather likely would not have liked the movies. Hard to say for sure, of course. Personally, I love the movies, but not nearly as much as the books!

@thuglifebear5256

4 жыл бұрын

He had higher aspirations for his books.The religious angle has been watered down, for instance. As well as the historical angle.

@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy

4 жыл бұрын

Thug Life Bear I agree with you, though, to be fair, it would be hard in a film to duplicate the reverence and historical depth Tolkien put into LOTR.

@ThomasAnderson1111

4 жыл бұрын

Additionally, Christopher Tolkien hated the movies, and J.R.R.'s letter in which he critiques a script he was sent for a potential animated adaptation of LotR contains many disparaging comments that seem, in hindsight, to apply to the Peter Jackson movies as well.

@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy

4 жыл бұрын

ThomasAnderson1111 I’ll have to check out that letter. Tolkien’s letters are so illuminating and, in general, a pleasure to read.

@ThomasAnderson1111

4 жыл бұрын

@@PhilipChaseTheBestofFantasy Indeed! The letter in question is #210 in the book of his collected letters.

"People say you need to read it twice to fully understand it" I recently made this point when discussing Elliott Brooks short review of "Hyperion" (I argued that describing "Hyperion" as a collection of short stories was a little too obvious and missing the grand scheme of things in the overall story). There is a lot going on in that book and you're not going to get it all on the first read. But it's a great work and is well worth the time spent fully understanding all the concepts that Simmons presents the reader.

@ChristmasLore

2 жыл бұрын

Well, she's pretty basic, so it doesn't surprise me. Also, she's a devote christian, so Simmons views and sometimes critics of religion would have displeased her quite a great deal, and skewed her review of the serie.

💯 agree on all Daniel’s remarks about the Sanderson comment. Great to see a resonant voice in the reading community addressing exactly what’s troubled me about the Sanderson hype for the last year or two.

I think it's great to have ranking videos based on different criteria (respect, vs enjoyment, etc) as long as it's clear and consistent throughout the individual video

Daniel keep the debates going

Daniel should put the title question at the front like fantano does. Putting it near the end for watch time is understandable, but most people would watch the whole thing anyway and are eager to get the answer to the title question right away

@MR-YoutubeChangedMyHandle

4 жыл бұрын

Daniel does tend to do a lot of clickbait cliche KZread nonos. It's the only issue with his channel.

@meurer13daniel

2 жыл бұрын

@@MR-KZreadChangedMyHandle It's not clickbait if it's not misleading and/or false

I highly doubt Tolkien would be upset about the lotr books becoming movies as he actually gave Christopher Lee his blessing to play Gandalf if there ever were to be movies. I more so think he would be upset about things like Tom Bombadil being left out.

@jojohairee9987

2 жыл бұрын

isn't that a myth tho? cus in an interview by Christopher Lee ,Lee by his own admission said that he only met Tolkien once by chance when he was in Tolkien's local pub and Lee being starstruck could only say the most British "how do you do" to tolkien

OMG I laughed so much with the beaver part xD Thanks Daniel for your videos :D

I think you can only judge Tolkien's appreciation for the movies in a speculative sense. If he was a modern man, he would see everything in a modern light...if he was still alive, like 120 or whatever, he would see the fluff and humor as unnecessary...and he would have issues with movie goers not understanding the themes and meanings behind his work

@chocolatebunnies6376

4 жыл бұрын

Julian Henderson Fluff and humour? The book has about five hundred pages of fluff and plenty of humour, not all of which made it to the screen.

@julianhenderson7628

4 жыл бұрын

@@chocolatebunnies6376 five hundred pages of fluff?? Are you serious?? Haha, you must not be a Tolkien fan...haha...to each their own...

@chocolatebunnies6376

4 жыл бұрын

Julian Henderson I do exaggerate, but wouldn’t you rather adress my point, instead of drawing premature conclusions about my literary preferences?

@julianhenderson7628

4 жыл бұрын

@@chocolatebunnies6376 I've just run into the whole "fluff" argument so many times ..it's tedious. I don't find a single page of LoTR or the Silmarillion to be fluffy...it's all worldbuilding to me...as far as your point...I find the humorous aspects of Tolkien's work to be on a level separate from the movies...like, for instance. In the movies, pipe smoking is always followed by boisterous laughter, making it look more like pot than pipe weed...when, in actuality, pipe smoking was just a hobby of the Professor's, thus giving smoking a large role in the story...I love the movies, don't get me wrong...though I do feel that the movies were made out to be more humorous than it should have been...similar to the MCU...though, I do think Tolkien would have enjoyed the films

@chocolatebunnies6376

4 жыл бұрын

Julian Henderson But how are the movies fluffed? There’s maybe the Arwen-additions, but at least they grant some elvish. Though only a tiny bit. But would you have the movies be shorter, or just focus on other elements of the material?

Sirius never was serious.

@Pajali

4 жыл бұрын

Buh-dum-CHHHH! 🥁

Yes, video on authors' weaknesses! That would be awesome!

On the retconning subject I'd like to add that writers who do this do a great disservice to their readers (who figured it out). Sitting with a theory for years or months to see it come true feels so great, I don't get why a writer would want to deny their readers that feeling.

Not nearly enough singing or poetry for Tolkien to have appreciated the movies!

@seb24789

4 жыл бұрын

That's the one thing the Hobbit movies did better than the old ones.

3:20 - That is a good point, thanks for making it Daniel! 😃

Yep that last question defines the new Star Wars movies

@thursoberwick1948

3 жыл бұрын

Including the prequels.

This is totally unrelated to this video. Upon your recommendation I went and bought a pint of Graeter's black raspberry chocolate chip ice cream and THANK YOU. It is one great flavor ice cream. Though I can enjoy it without the chocolate chips they do not take away from that rich black raspberry flavor. Again thanks it is awesome.

I really appreciate your thoughts on not hate keeping Fantasy with required readings, like I love the genre but I actually hatted reading LOTR, I just couldn’t get into Tolkien’s writing. I think I may have a different opinion if I tried read them again now I’m older bu t just the obligation to do so sours me on the prospect. Nothing can so easily make a person hate a book as forcing them to read it’s if you love a book the worst thing you can do is force it on someone and ruin their chances for liking it…

Wow, I'm early recently. I'd just like to say I love your videos.

On the topic of graphic novels, i love them and i think they're beautiful and super creative, but I think they are different from just reading a book, and you can get different things out of these different mediums. Ex:you really don't get a lot of description in a graphic novel because it's visual. What bothers me is that while there are some books that would work really well as graphic novels, not all books work in that form. I feel like having a graphic novel of The Giver ruins how well the twist about color was done, and A Wrinkle in Time graphic novel takes away some of the imagination involved in reading it.

I just wish the movies portrayed the elves more accurately to the books.

One of my biggest nightmares is that you'll lose some of your books in the move somehow or they'll get damaged. I've heard about that happening so many times before :( But I know you'll be careful with them!

Let me just say that I love your channel, and you're generally the first thing I want to watch every morning. With that said... I don't know if it's KZread being evil, something about channel popularity, or what, but in a 17-minute video it popped up to interrupt you with commercials four times! I just find it interesting because I watched the recording of The Dusty Wheel's livecast late last night and got no commercials in an hour and a half. Why does KZread hate you and want to interrupt you? :D

@jonnywaldis8275

4 жыл бұрын

Pretty sure he determines how many adbreaks there are during a video. Its not evil youtube interrupting him, its him making money from his work.

16:03 Do you wanna know something messed up? The ending where the Earth opened up and killed everyone is literally the ending to "The Cabin in the Woods," and it was magnificent!

That’s makes a lot of sense. I agree that people do in fact change, in fact I change my favorite day to day. Thanks for the response. Love the vids.

The idea that Tolkien wouldn’t like the LotR movies because he didn’t like plays seems a bit presumptive. I mean, can you imagine what a LotR stage play would be like?? (I’m picturing the Fire Nation theatre from A:tLA.😂) The experience of watching of movie is significantly different even without considering what VFX can offer. Anyway, I would hope Tolkien would judge the LotR movies on their execution rather than the fact that they’re movies. He might not have liked them for other completely valid reasons, but I’d hope the medium wouldn’t be at the top of that list.

The Sirius question, Daniel had it pretty on point. Harry saw him as a father figure, but Sirius saw Harry as a friend, like getting James back. (Sorry I dont remember if its quoted directly in the book) but the movie atleast clearly shows this when hes fighting in book 5 and calls Harry James. He was never supposed to be a father figure, I believe that was the intention. (Lupin actually came off more as a father figure than James. I think he's underrated in this role.)

Another good point against singing in audiobooks is the lack of notes for the songs. Most authors probably don't have a tune in their had when writing the songs in their books, so you additionally need someone composing a melody that works for the text.

Hey there Daniel. Thanks for another great video. Is Grapic Audio a really good quality app. I am legally blind, and the print quality on a few of the graphic novels that I have tried to read was way too small. I was wondering if this app will make that process easier. Thanks. Also, I started listening to the Shadow Rising by Robert Jordan today.

Singing in audio books: you also didn’t mention that songs in books rarely come with sheet music. What’s the tune? How do you know? Which instruments are used? If any? There’s a lot more to music than just words, and words is usually all you get.

Books that motivate me to read them many times, and learn something new everytime i do that is very unique trait i mean in eny medium not just books .. lol Even in games, having replay value is sooo important

I can't wait for the Discworld videos! But it seems I must [= good luck with the move! Discworld is a favorite series of mine and I've reread all of them a few times at least so I eagerly await any and all videos you may do on them! Terry Pratchett was a treasure. Pretty much every one of his books I have read has made me laugh and think. The best ones can make me cry. I hope you dive all the way down the Disc's rabbit hole because much like the Dresden Files one of the best parts is enjoying seeing the series grow into itself and watch an author really grow. Keep up the good work!

Two years late, this is the first of your videos I've ever seen. I was impressed at "because I took it in good faith that people would vote the hottest of takes and the things they wanted to see me respond to because it says to do that in the post and not just what they agreed with but I should have realized that". I got to "when people say you need to read it twice to fully enjoy it and understand it that's a negative criticism of a book absolutely not this is completely and utterly wrong" and smacked the Like. I got to "to the eight people that agreed with you you rot in hell and you die" and even though you followed it immediately with "no", I smacked the Subscribe and wished there was a "Love and I hope you have an awesome weekend" button. ... but there is no "e" in the word "spicy". Dang, I hope the remaining 15m24s of this video is this good. EDIT: > when I don't think there is anyone who is required reading for modern fantasy Whoop. Nope. No no no no no. I'm not going to specify a name, because that's not the point here, but the last 20 years have taught us that this is a harmful incorrect statement. > I won't put anything for it as that because it's not fair because it implies that a person who picks up this required thing and doesn't like and appreciate it they're not like good at fantasy which is there's a level of gatekeeping I'm not ever gonna be in Then you are harming fantasy. I will take this explanation OUTSIDE fantasy to even take the sting out of it. I read Isaac Asimov's "Foundation" over 35 years ago while I was still high school. I watched David Goyer's AppleTV "Foundation". The two are diametrically opposed in everything that mattered. The book was a landmark classic not only using historical themes, but the book was a historical event of itself talking about the interplay of social forces, the rush of history, changes in the human condition and the magnifying influence of science and technology. The author earned a Bachelor's in Science, a Master's and a PhD in Chemistry, while learning French and German, working during WWII in a Naval air experiments station, worked as an associate professor of biochemistry. The television series had a room full of scientists debating a point and the choice was made on the basis of "what if you decide to settle a planet where there's no water". Something which I believe even you Americans are taught in the what, third grade? The critical necessity of water for human existence. And the actors, camera crew, stage crew, directors, editors, producers, executives and let me say it explicitly: stupid retarded braindead writers undeserving of payment or oxygen... let this line through. If you don't gatekeep, boundaries and standards drift until you end up standing for the very opposite of everything it all originally meant. Don't give me "change and evolution are important" because even so, you don't end up letting value-drifters destroy the very basis of everything you hold dear. You have foundational classic works, especially in fantasy. To not use them as AT LEAST an origin point, a defining MINIMUM QUALITY standard... I've seen "Doctor Who", "Star Trek", "Star Wars", the settings that made D&D beloved, Asimov and TOLKIEN destroyed. No damn more. If people are willing to step up and learn about, let's say, Fantasy, properly? Then they can explore and love it and develop it. If they're going to walk in, up-end it, set it on fire, *they* need to be set on fire. The people who complain the most about gatekeepers are INVADERS. I'm going to go look at a few more of your videos to take in more of your debate opinions but until I get a better picture, please consider my over-eager instant subscription ended.

Please, did Daniel made some review/reaction/comments on the Tolkien movie (2019), the one about his life, played by Nicholas Hoult and Lily Collins?

Congrats on the move!

Generally, the older a work is the more times you will need to read or watch it to understand and appreciate it. IMHO

ya to fully appreciate my novels you got to read each at least 15 times...and purchase a brand new copy each time. its the only way.

I think Tolkien would appreciate the amount a passion that was put into the movies regardless of his opinion of them as a whole.

I hope you do a DF one after Battle Grounds! That would be an awesome hour video!

Tolkien had stated that he would want Christopher Lee to play Saruman. Christopher Lee played Saruman. Tolkien's shade in the halls of Mandos is satisfied.

I spent 70+ episodes setting up a twist villain for my podcast. A few people were suspicious of the character before the reveal, and that made me really happy. Because it meant that they were picking up on the little narrative crumbs I'd been so careful to drop. A lot of people were both surprised and devastated. But I wasn't about to change who the character really was because some had guessed that they weren't who they said they were. It's GOOD storytelling if readers/listeners who are paying attention can guess the ending or the twist. A twist that comes out of nowhere is lazy.

I always read Sirius as seeing Harry as a replacement for James in a weird mentor way.

Brandon Sanderson's writing style sometimes drives me nuts. I just started reading the Well of Ascension and realized that on the first page of the third chapter, 7/8 sentences began with the word "he". Five of those were in a row

what are the star wars esk huge list of names about at the end of the video?

Good luck with the move Daniel!

I haven't watched the video yet but Sir Christopher Lee actually met Tolkien in person told him that he would have loved to see him as Gandalf in an adaptation of his books only when auditioning the role of Gandalf had already been taken so he instead played Saruman(Although I may be wrong).

@leahvolmer9210

4 жыл бұрын

I believe the reason Christopher Lee played Saruman instead was because Gandalf had more physical stuff in the role (sword fighting and horse riding, etc) that he was a bit too old to be able to do well enough.

I'm always disheartened when I see things about "My lit/English teacher said x isn't real literature." Reading a story is reading a story, regardless of medium! My despair at those comments is probably why I became a lit/English teacher myself - so I could encourage the reading of stories of any genre/medium within my classroom unlike I was as a student. Granted, I do enjoy the classics alongside fantasy so, there's that. But, I got into arguments with my English teachers and even literature professors that fantasy stories aren't 'good' stories. For some of them that included LOTR - like I was discouraged from continuing the trilogy after reading The Fellowship of the Ring and that is still a bit of a mental block for me - she put a lense on the remainder of the series in a way that I have yet to finish it (it's on the list, along with thousands of others). Anywho, there are few fantasy stories I DNR'd (Inheritance cycle being one, and SoT extended...) and MANY classics that I DNR'd because....ooph.

@joris2982

4 жыл бұрын

that's relatable

@McClintonforThree

4 жыл бұрын

Any English teacher who advised against reading the Lord of the Rings is a fraud. Tolkien is literally a master of English and languages in general. That makes me so mad for you.

@mancubwwa

3 жыл бұрын

Well... With graphic novels I can somewhat agree with 'it's not literature' as in 'it is a different medium that use different technique to tell a story'. there has been novels and short stories adapted to graphic novels, and I think vice-versa? I don't know any instances, so I can't be sure. Which would be pointles if they were the same medium. But as 'it's inferior because of it's form' I don't agree at all.

Love that you call this a "debate". I've learned that arguing a creator never works no matter how right or pervasive you are because on person has a keyboard and the other has a microphone

As someone with a Master's Degree in English Literature, the dude who made the comment about having to read a book twice could not have been more wrong. The greatest literary works are gifts that keep giving long after the initial read. Yikes.

As an artist, graphic novels and their illustrations are a great inspiration and a source of new ideas for me. So not only the story can be really good, the artwork also deserves a lot of respect. I hit two birds with one stone whenever I read a graphic novel.

I think this is a fun topic to think about. I have a few questions to help us think about it. First of all, did Tolkien like movies to begin with? I haven't read up enough to know his thoughts about this topic. Secondly, how does Tolkien think about adaptation? Would he be a stickler to the subject matter? Without knowing these two facts I can not say whether he would have or wouldn't have liked the movies. One last question... Did Tolkien believe that reading was a way to unlock a person's imagination? That has always been why I think books are better than movies, because they make you imagine what you are reading instead of showing one person's imagination based on that book.

Just wanna add that sometimes it's also not possible for songs to be sung in audiobooks due to copyright issues. So they have to be read instead.

2:19 had me in tears hahahaha crack up

Specifically to Dresden spoiler reviews. You can put it into 5 book arc chunks. Dresden has 4 arcs each 5 books long. That would work.

There are book, that when you read them the second time, you go: "Oooooooh! I didn't realize that was hinted at already heeere!" And such things. I think that's pretty cool.

I think that Rick Higgins was talking about people who say that about books/movies that don't make any sense the first time around, if a work is improved on second reading/watching, that's a good thing, if you have to watch/read it twice to even understand what happened that is either poor storytelling or a failure on the part of the editors (edit: basically, if it's improved by a second read/watch, that's fine or even good; if nothing makes sense unless you read/watch it a second time, that is not a good thing)

1:05 The Hot Takes Must Flow.

Hey Daniel, love your channel. Please read The Chronicles of Amber.

The only book that you should ever be able to fully understand after only reading it once it the phone book. Or the Yellow Pages, as it's better known in some parts of the world.

7:00 yeah that english teacher is wrong in general, but I have specific experience with 3 different colleges requiring me to read Persepolis which is a graphic novel.

I think Rob Ingles sort of proves that singing in audio books can be done well. He’s not a fantastic singer, but he does give it his best. There’s a “realness” that makes it feel special, like a father reading to his kids.

Fantasy Power Ranking Ep. 3

You just keep getting better, cuter and more confident! This man is unstoppable!!!

On Graphic novels/comics/manga being literature, I can understand it being framed as literature is only words, pictures make it technically something else. As long as the person saying so is acknowledging it as credible art. I'm really OCD on categories and so if the arguement is only based on the technical definition of literture, I'm fine as long as the make some new word like Literart for word/picture combos.

Roy Dotrice sings all the ASOIAF songs as Christmas carols and it kills me

9:04 Oof, I just listened to A Wizard of Earthsea narrated by Harlan Ellison. I really fell in love with Le Guin's writing, and Ellison's naturalistic delivery really helped to sell the feeling of being told an ancient legend. But holy shit, when he tried to sing the songs in the book it was AWFUL. Painful. No real attempt to pick out a tune, it was just distracting. If you're going to try to sing the songs in an audiobook, PLEASE actually have songs to sing! Also, regarding trying to guess what authors would think of adaptations, I disagree. At least in part. Certainly with some adaptations, like the LOTR movies, you're right that we just can't know. But there are some authors that were quite vocal about their distaste for certain approaches to adaptation, and I don't think it's arrogant to point out that the author would hate adaptations that use similar approaches. Le Guin is an excellent example, actually. I think it's fair to say any adaptation of Earthsea that whitewashes Ged would piss her the hell off, and that yet another adaptation that is Earthsea in name only would disappoint her. Those are subjects she was *very* vocal about while alive, so I don't see it as overreaching to state the obvious there.

13:45 Yeah, but you need to find that place between: a) enjoyment, and: b) how good it is. If you're always going by enjoyment, something such as Dresden Files could be number one on a lot more lists, because it is a lot of fun, while perhaps (subjectively) not being as 'good' (whatever good means to you) as some other series, such as the Gentleman Bastard Sequence. And if you only go by how good it is, you can place ASoIaF at number one despite not actually enjoying yourself at all, because it's (subjectively) good. And then you have to wonder if being good and being enjoyable are actually the same thing.

As much as I can enjoy a cool magic system, that's never been in the same stratosphere as my favorite things about any of his books. That person just doesn't like him, which is fine, but it's not because they're not frothing over the magic systems. I didn't care for allomancy at all but Mistborn is amazing.

Dang, does one else enjoy it when they figure out what's going to happen in a story before it does? It feels like a story has achieved its narrative destiny. If knowing the ending of the story was a detriment to the enjoyment of a text for most people, the entire multi-million dollar romance publishing industry would not exist.

Brandon Sanderson (and all of the others mentioned by Daniel) are required reading only for someone who wants to write high fantasy and/or other genres of fiction. And required only if you want a sort of head start on writing these genres.