Somehow the wasteland in Lingering Will's arena is more interesting to look at than the Savannah in Pride Lands

@Bizkit047

Жыл бұрын

100%. I probably didn't clarify that enough in the video, but the endless look in Pride Lands is definitely bland in comparison

@BigBossMan538

Жыл бұрын

@@Bizkit047 I understand why they did it that way, but did it have to be so large? And I get that maybe redesigning the area to be lush and verdant after the first visit wouldn't be easy, but it would've been neat. Something new and interesting to see for the return trip!

@nixuniverse5240

Жыл бұрын

Because t’s not all one color, and just one flat landscape with nothing in it. The the very least this fight has a nice sky box, obstructions, and a nice background to fill the draw distance.

@BigBossMan538

Жыл бұрын

@@nixuniverse5240 Those are all valid points. The Savannah has like a dead tree and some uneven terrain. But everything else is just a sickly green void. Could’ve made a more interesting color palette, add some more nooks and crannies to hide treasures, anything really

@ClairvoyantDreams358

Жыл бұрын

I mean yeah it’s the keyblade graveyard

One of my favorite things is how Lingering Wills Keyblade manifests into so many different shapes and weapons during his attacks. Really makes you feel like even tho we've used Sora for 3 games, there's still so much to the Keyblade we have yet to learn.

@M21cat

Жыл бұрын

I still want Sora to get Keyblade Armor, even if he doesn't "need" it.

@rxy3699

Жыл бұрын

@@M21cat That would be sick 👌👌

@kalenmarshall8692

Жыл бұрын

It just shows us that square can give us. Unique keyblade transformations and build on that concept for the next game instead of Disney attraction rides.

@TransDrummer1312

Жыл бұрын

@@M21cat it’s theorized that his Keyblade Armor will look similar to the final form Xion took on in the final fight against her at the end of Days.

Next video: Is Vanitas Remnant, No Heart, and Mysterious Figure as unfair as we thought?

@thewaterlord27

Жыл бұрын

Yes.

@roiitzkovich4545

Жыл бұрын

Vanitas Remnant is mostly managable but still kinda sucks. No Heart is honestly worse than Vanitas. MF is the worst boss in the series though.

@panduvandal

Жыл бұрын

Vanitas remnant is definitely the most tolerable out of all the 3 bosses (and the only one that has a cheese tactic )

@Bizkit047

Жыл бұрын

Would depend which version for these. If it's MF in original PSP version, then yes forever as bad as it gets.

@NinetyNineNo

Жыл бұрын

While they have massive design issues in and of themselves, it's also worth considering how BBS's system exacerbates those issues. They'd look a lot different in 2FM or 3:Re, I think.

the unreactable fisting is still something im more terrifyed then anything else in his moveset

@shibaswing

Жыл бұрын

unreactable fisting has now been added to my vocabulary. ty

@josephlebron4205

Жыл бұрын

Unreactable fisting sounds like a band name from the 90s.

@TheDiego908

Жыл бұрын

😩

@Duality333

Жыл бұрын

@@josephlebron4205i could see it

@ubermaster1

Жыл бұрын

You know, compared to the reactable fisting we experience in it every day lives 😂

I think the presentation is better than how you said. You're in a complete wasteland, intriguing exchange before the fight, a keyblade knight that's hollow on the inside, insane keyblade transformations and techniques, and don't forget the music. It's still mindblowing how well setup and interesting this boss fight is before it can show you any combat.

@thegreatdanish8781

Жыл бұрын

I also loved how, after beating him, Jiminy's Journal says (and I'm paraphrasing here) that LW wields the Keyblade with more skill and proficiency than Sora. The Keyblade transformations and techniques that you mention, LW seemed to hint at how Sora's own abilities might grow going forward. At least, seeing those moves got my speculation brain running, and seeing the Keyblade transformations in some of the first trailers for KH3 was pretty hype. :D

While in terms of mechanics it isn't the absolute best, it's still pretty great, and when you take into account the lore and presentation, it's worthy of being my second favorite boss ever (in and out of KH), only losing out to Yozora. I can only hope the devs keep outdoing themselves going forward!

The kind of Bizkit content that I subbed for!

bro carried me through 8 years of KH and still uploads great informative content all these years later ❤️

The only negative I have of LW lore wise is that he retroactively makes Terra look like an absolute wimp, wimpiness that carries over to the Terranort boss fight. It's definitely possible to make Terra feel fast and strong but half of doing that involves using the Ventus D-Link. You don't have D-Links as LW, so you actually feel weaker. The complete opposite of what the hype cutscene before suggests.

@demp11

Жыл бұрын

I mean if you think about it. lingering will was probably fighting for 10 years there.

@PixelHeroViish

Жыл бұрын

And then they ruined it so they can artificially hype up Nomura's special little boy Terranort

@joaoshiozo3618

Жыл бұрын

@@demp11 fighting who for 10 years? Theres nothing there its just empty

@Firenove

Жыл бұрын

@@joaoshiozo3618 himself :)

@SlyGuyMorad

Жыл бұрын

@@demp11 No, the armour didn’t. It was dormant (inactive) for 10 years. You could just say the armour’s will “manifested” power beyond Terra’s due to the intense anger and hatred associated towards Xehanort. Armour wasn’t fighting anybody, my guy.

Kh2 did something really well that wish more action rpgs utilized. Guard/defend. Most games treat it as a way to minimize damage but Kh2 made it behave like a counter which totally opened up more strategy instead of button mashing.

@Thisisthegreatestatofalltime

Жыл бұрын

Most games do that in the form of a parry which usually has much stricter timing.

@reddodeado301

Жыл бұрын

Future KH games also screwed guard up. In KH 2, you couldn't keep guard held up to continue guarding a combo, but it'd give you enough invincibility to let you dodge out or guard again, keeping you safe from other attacks that could potentially hit from behind while you're stuck in the guarding animation. Future games got rid of this invincibility, letting enemies cross you up and hit you from behind, potentially killing you unless you have Second Chance and Once More.

@ethanclark640

7 ай бұрын

kh1 did this with counterattack as well

@TimothyGod

6 ай бұрын

​@@reddodeado301kh3 lets you escape a guard tho, although its not always helful

@reddodeado301

6 ай бұрын

@@TimothyGod KH 3 does not give you invincibility through Guard, I believe it gives you a 360 guardbox once you successful block something though? Not entirely sure. It does let you dodge out of your guard, which really is useful, but KH 2 gives you invincibility just by blocking something, and you have so much invincibility that you have about a second or two of full, free, invincible movement

All I got out of the negatives is that this fight was absolutely revolutionary, that it has some missteps as expected for something never really done before, and that the devs, maybe even the industry, learned a lot from it.

@Bizkit047

Жыл бұрын

You comprehended it correctly

@zigsynx5364

3 ай бұрын

@@Bizkit047 Could you make a review/critique video about Yozora, like what you did with Lingering will? Even though Yozora is a masterpiece, i still think he has a few flaws. These are my opinions: 1. The tractor beak attack: It's just boring to dodge. It's so easy to just glide away from it that a litteral 5 year old could deal with this move no joke. I am glad the beam only appears once in phase 2 compared to thrice in phase 1. Yes, the consequenses of being sucked in is huge, but once you know how to deal therewith, it easily becomes the least engaging move in the fight and almost ruins the pase of the fight. 2. The red magnet ball attack: This move is designed to be better off just being jumping into instead of actually deaing with it. Not only is the move unable to kill you, even if you aren't using secound chance, but surviving it is pointless anyways since you don't even get a punish for it. The only time when surviving it makes sense is if you're either doing an all pro codes or no damage run. Like, Data Ansem has a similar move which is far shorter and easier, and even he gives you a free punish you don't get sucked in. Yozoras DM already has too few openings, and having 3 openings instead of 2 wouldn't hurt the fight. He'd still have lots of HP for phase 2. 3. The lack of mix-ups: Idk, I just feel like this fight is a little too pattern based. I feel like he needed a few more combo mix ups in phase 1, though that just boils down to subjectivity. Like, imagine if he could do the "running and circle trapping" attack in the middle of another combo, before finishing his current combo. Depite this, Yozora is a 9.5/10 fight. He is in my top 3 favorite video game bosses of all time, and might even be nr1. Slave Knight Gael from DS3 comes close but I don't think he surpasses Yozora. Though I wanna hear your opinions. Do you think he is flawless, or do you have some critiques?

Bro back then Final Mix was never released in the US and some of us thought this was a mod or hack. KZread was still new back then and that’s how we know the lore. Damn time flies. Still epic

My first fight with Lingering Will was amazing. I died so many times but it pushed me to LEARN how to fight this guy. Fantastic. Shame later Super Bosses were awful. Vanitas Spirit or whatever is the worst one in my opinion.

@user-kp3es2bx9w

Жыл бұрын

Why cause the rest were easy?

@harmonicposting

Жыл бұрын

@@user-kp3es2bx9w BBS had very shitty designed AI (MF and Vanitas Remnant, also No Heart in Mirage Arena). Same issues plagued DDD with Julius. They prolly could be considered much easier than Lingering Will if their AI were fixed though. They got it together with KH3RM which is great, imo much harder than 2FM actually

@judyh3707

Жыл бұрын

@@user-kp3es2bx9w They were frustrating and annoying. I literally mashed dodge in BBS because it just wasn't fun.

@user-kp3es2bx9w

Жыл бұрын

@@judyh3707 skill issue

@PixelHeroViish

Жыл бұрын

​@@judyh3707 Also don't forget, your best option especially as Terra are Shotlocks and Super Vanitas is just immune to them all, it's ridiculous

So glad to see you coming out with new content again. I really do love your long form commentary/narrated videos going in depth about the KH series combat, and I know many people feel the same. Would love to see more of this from you if any ideas/opportunities for it arrive! Some other suggestions of combat in depth commentary I could see you excelling in are for Final Fantasy VII Remake Combat (and future parts when those release), Final Fantasy XVI (when it comes out), and maybe other games of similar genre like Nier, Bayonetta, and DMC (if you’ve played those games). Hope you’re doing good Biz!

Great video, Biz! You put into words exactly how I feel about this fight

Yeah I pretty much agree. I think the fight does hold up in many aspects, but KH3's superbosses have risen the bar much higher

@Christian-gr3gu

Жыл бұрын

Their surprisingly great with how mid the rest of the game is gameplay wise

You don't post too often, but your videos keep getting better, I was also pleasantly surprised you included story in there ! Lingering Will is my favorite boss in the series, you never forget the feeling of beating it for the first time. I beat the series to its entirety before but chickened out of the superbosses, but recently I've been going through the entire series again and fighting all of them, and it is a lot of fun... until I got to BBS, and now I'm really considering skipping those fights

What a nice surprise! I was just thinking about reliving some of my memories of KH, and your video popped up Glad to see you're still here, doing your thing!

Great vid idea. I hope this turns into a series. This is one of my favorite boss fights in gaming

Still, best boss fight I've ever played. Imagine when it was new and we didn't know as much about revenge values, desperation moves and how to counter properly, what a challenge. You would have to learn all the moves and their timing to beat it, and then you still can repeat the boss fight and try new strategies. Hours spent just on one boss. First time I beat it I abused final and limit forms, berserk charge and donald's limit attacks, still I would get hit, but as long as I could use a potion or curaga in time it was fine, and those last seconds waiting for berserk charge to end so you could attack with a finisher, man, the tension...

Yozora stole that #1 spot for me in KH3 Re:Mind,but Lingering Will still holds #2 in my heart.

Loved it! Thanks for the upload. I missed the classic reading the script thing from you lol

The man has finally uploaded once more, a true treat. And an other 2fm analysis/guide, excellent.

Love this video! We need a top 10 KH boss fights!

So happy to see more videos like these alongside your streams! This could be a really interesting potential video series, going back to previous series superbosses and seeing how well they’ve aged. A video comparing KH2FM vs KH3 data org would be interesting as well. Although I wonder if it would be too one sided like you mentioned with yozora vs LW, so a stand-alone review of KH2FM Data org could work too

This video just made me appreciate the banger fights we got with Limit Cut in 3 even more. Though I think that Lingering Will is still better than most fights in modern ARPGs.

@godawful5600

Жыл бұрын

My thoughts exactly

Your channel really is a time capsule. The fact I remember you making Action Replay videos of this boss 15 YEARS AGO is mind boggling.

glad you're still uploading kh content!

Thank you for making another video. Love the content, and keep it up! 👍

lingering will will always have a special place in my heart for leading to my most memorable summer break. where i spent a few days trying to beat him and feeling insane satisfaction when i finally did. a lot has changed since then, but i'm still here watching ur vids. thx ✌️

Great concept. You should do this for each superboss in the series just for the lulz

finally content that makes me bizSmile :^)

Yo biz, this video was sick. Please do more videos like this boss retrospectives they're so sick. I think lingering will is still awesome but yeah compared to KH3 data fights and yozora it doesn't even come close

Fantastic video. I’d love to see further analyses from you.

Would love to see a tier list or ranking video about every superboss in the series. Personally I love me some KH2 Data Xemnas, KH2 Sephiroth, and KH3 Data Xigbar.

@harmonicposting

Жыл бұрын

I second this

I miss the times when KH2FM+ was coming out and learning about this secret boss in the interviews. Nomura called him the "strongest enemy", which got folks more hyped up. Then when KH2FM+ came out, we had to wait for someone to beat him and upload it to KZread (it was basically a race to see who could beat him first) so we could see the cutscene that happens after (plus, the new secret ending is unlocked by beating him). After so many videos of seeing him own people, someone finally did it. We finally got to see what happens after and also watch the new secret ending that blew our minds. That was a one of a kind experience. Can't be repeated.

Man, the way your heart starts racing when you get closer to defeating a super boss the first time 😅 I never get tired of that intense feeling of euphoria and accomplishment

Suuuper hype for these!

I'm glad you addressed the looping, that's always been what brings it down for me. If he opens up with the glider or stats using his command locking bow and arrow, that immediately makes the battle less interesting to me. It's why i think Sephiroth, while also loopable in his own right is the shining standard for boss design in KH2.

Good analysis. It's true that KH3 has better bosses which are fairer, more challenging and have more interesting attacks (heck, I even prefer Dark Inferno over Lingering Will), it's important to mention that I don't think it's an excuse for LW being the way he is even back than. You see... KH2, even the vanilla release, had Sephiroth, which to this day is still one of the best designed fights in the series (and THE best fight in KH2FM). Sure, it's one of the easiest superbosses in the series (almost on par with Dark Inferno as far as difficulty goes), but all of his moves are 100% fair and the flow is very kinetic. If vanilla KH2 managed to have such an excellent superboss to offer, there's no reason why LW, the extra superboss in the enhanced version of the game, won't be at least almost the same level of quality. For it's time, LW was appreciated for the challenge it offered. However, nowadays, when we have Zodiac Phantom Aqua, Dark Inferno, KH3's data ORGs and especially Yozora, it's easy to see the cracks in LW's design. Now we realize that, even for it's time, it wasn't the fairest fight out there when we also had Sephiroth, Larxene, Marluxia, Saix and Lexaeus. These fights, while arguably not AS challenging, still offered a decent challenge AND were fair and more fun. I can't wait for KH4 to give us a boss somehow even better than Yozora and than we'll realize that Yozora isn't as good as we initially thought😁😁😁😁😁😁😁

@artoria3000

Жыл бұрын

I wouldn't be too surprised if LW was supposed to be an even more souped up version of Sephiroth. As you say, Sephiroth is "more fairer" but perhaps that meant the devs wanted the ultimate superboss for KH2FM to be even more challenging, so they introduce more unfair mechanics. To me this makes KH3's superbosses more interesting design wise cause you can tell they went back to the KH2 superbosses to try to figure out what works and what didn't work.

@roiitzkovich4545

Жыл бұрын

​@@artoria3000 Zodiac Phantom Aqua feels like an analysis test of Osaka team studying what works and what doesn't with 2FM's superbosses. As a result, she became my favorite KH superboss at the time. On paper, Dark Inferno is just as well designed, but suffers from being too easy for a superboss standards. But little did we know back than, he was merely a warm-up to what's to come. With the exception of Luxord (and maybe Xigbar), each of the data ORGs in KH3 can be considered a LW tier difficulty fight, while also being better designed. Yozora is P much the perfect action humanoid boss fight. Even the mech phase in his DM has consistent ways to maneuver past.

@artoria3000

Жыл бұрын

@@roiitzkovich4545 totally agreed with Zodiac Phantom Aqua. As nebulous as "osaka team" is, it does seem like modern KH superbosses have slowly but surely getting better designed. I'd be interested to see if Dark Inferno was supposed to be a "tutorial superboss" that would introduce what the game expects out of their players. On the other hand, their story/heartless bosses tend to not really be great or fun in my experience. I wish they could do a better job at designing those heartless kaiju sized bosses.

@roiitzkovich4545

Жыл бұрын

@@artoria3000 I actually enjoyed some of them. I recommand checking out the KZreadr Beeboy, who made videos on beating every KH3 boss on crit LV1 with all pro codes on.

This is really awesome timing for this video to come out, as today was my first time fighting this guy on a critical playthrough. I gotta say from my fresh perspective, and given the age of the game, this fight feels like an absolute masterpiece of gaming history. Obviously it has its flaws, as were well pointed out in the video, but overall it is a really awesome end game challenge. Some of the somewhat bs RV's like the teleport whip can be really frustrating, but for the most part I just laugh them off and try again. It almost feels appropriate that he can sometimes just decide "fuck this, you're dead kid" and pull some insane combo of moves that just thrashes you. Definitly will never argue that that's good game design, but I think it's fine overall. The epic nature of the scenario, the culmination of all the skills you have learned on your way to him, figuring out his attack patterns and RV values, and of course the epic soundtrack, all combine beautifully to create a superboss that I think was entirely unmatched at the time of the games release, and one that still holds a high spot on the ranking even to this day. Awesome video! Really cool to have it come out right on the day my Lingering Will battle truly began.

Great video!

Some things I notice: During the final phase, LW actually does teleport away when you hit his RV. He also then goes into a variety of attack patterns which are pretty cool. Not so cool during the final phase: His Blizzard Bike move is ridiculous and nearly impossible to avoid without a limit. On the other hand though, he only rarely uses it so its not so bad. IMO, a better design would be for him to teleport away when he hits his HP gates, rather than whipping you out of nowhere.

Would love to see a similar video on yozora by you. Video was fun and made me want to refight lingering will

Would love to see your analysis/critiques of the rest of the KH super bosses. Especially how we went from mysterious figure to re:mind data bosses.

This is probably the best video that's ever gonna be made on this boss, nice job man

I think the two things that make a superboss good to me are 1. The fight demonstrates the best aspects of the games systems 2. The fight is beatable with practice and skill, and not just looking up the "solution" online somewhere. Or, as MoogleFTW once put it: You can tell how good a game's gameplay is by fighting the intended hardest boss at your weakest possible state, and seeing whether or not you winning is based on 'avatar strength' or how well you can play the game. KH2 overall has the best combat system in the series - if not then second palce - and LW puts it to the test with a variety of attacks that press your ability to dodge, block, move, and counter with precision. On top of this, the fight almost demands a more aggressive playstyle, since the boss can punish you severely for hesitation or running away by just closing the gap in an instant and dragging you back down to earth with that whip. You have to be confident in your ability to play in order to come out of this victorious. But that isn't to say that the fight is impossible either. I, for one, love that there are so many different ways of approaching this boss with the variety of abilities and keys available to the player. Sure, you could Fenrir spam, but I see that more as a reward for a player who not only considered that, but also can pull off the timing well enough to bring him down. Some people use Stitch to keep up their mp, stunlock him, and buy some breathing time with the invulnv phase. Others utilize the old reliable Limit Form, and some just duke it out the old fashioned way, with nothing more than the four face buttons and their trusty Kingdom Key. The possibilities are vast, and it feels like the game is giving you any options for how to approach this, so long as you take the boss' actions into account as well. I do recognize that the fight itself has some design downsides - my winning run of this guy had Bike Spam for phases 1 AND 2 - but I absolutely think that this is one of the franchise's best examples of how to execute a fun and fair final endgame challenge that isn't just "pray that the never-ending silo of munitions tossed your way miss, and hope you can get a single combo in in the 0.0036 second window before the boss throws and instant-death mechanic at your face. Also, the intro to the fight, the music, atmosphere, and the boss' overall design is cool as hell, and I will in fact grant bonus points for all of that.

I died so many times to lingering will that by the time I did beat him for the first time, I had a really good understanding of his mechanics, and I barely made any mistakes, it was very satisfying. I remember my mom was next to me on the couch and shot got scared when I screamed “YES” as I finally did it. (Btw I used your guide that you made back when 2.5 came out to beat him so thanks for that)

This is a very good video series on secret battles in KH games. I would like to see your opinion on Yozora and KH1 Unknown and if they still hold up as hard but fair secret battle after so many years later

One counterpoint I want to bring up in regards to Fenrir strats: The fact that he has an easy loop is fantastic when it comes to grinding Manifest Illusions for Lucky Rings or Full Bloom+s.

This fight is just clean. No bullshit visual effects cluttering the screen, no random projectiles. Just action and your reaction to it.

It took me at least a dozen tries to beat Lingering Will for the first time and I felt so accomplished afterwards. Whenever I go back to 2FM, I'm always excited to get to this fight again. Even after knowing all his moves and patterns and RV, it's still a welcome challenge cause it makes you concentrate a little more than you normally would with other bosses. It's an engaging fight and I always enjoy attempting it.

I think my least favorite part of lingering will is that rising sun and bike feel functionally very similar. I wish they did more to distinct them instead of both being a guard/dodge/parry 3 times until an opening or the next attack. Yozora took off my blinders a bit and showed me some of the cracks in the lingering will fight since his moveset has a lot of variety with little overlap. I still like lingering will a lot though, but I’m not as starry eyed about it anymore.

Dude. I reached the data fights on CM Lv 1 - Lingering Will is no joke. Even when you have a plan for his phases and patterns, this guy is gnarly hard. I would argue that the nobody fight before GoA is probably harder to pull off, but this guy is the goat imo. It was so rewarding managing to finally defeat him and take the W. I'd happily pull a 'Let me solo her' on this guy just to help people through. Good fight for a GOAT game

This fight is still one of my favorite fights in the series in terms of setting and music.

I really enjoy this fight and it was really satisfying to learn and overcome. While I still like KH3's Data Battles and Yozora more, this is still a really solid fight for me that really tests your knowledge of the game's mechanics and your overall skill.

Looking back at it, everything is right. Of course, I think it has something to do with standards, but regardless of circumstances, a very spot on re-review. Edit: I do wanna ask. What prompted you to do this video? If you don't mind me asking

I'm honestly just still blown away that ReMind managed to give KH2FM a run for its money and even outclassing its superbosses in so many aspects, given the quality of the vanilla games that came before those

Nice, this is something that I've been wanting to see on KZread. Some kind of a review or retrospective look on KH bosses. I definitely agree with you on the Lingering Will's design. Honestly speaking, the fight was "revolutionary" when it first came out. It introduces new mechanics to the game and forces the player to really learn the fight (aside from the Fenrir loop exploit). Unfortunately, the negatives that you mentioned in the video are undeniably true and it really brought the quality of the fight down especially after all these years. Still one of the best boss fights in KH2FM but not _the_ best. For me, Sephiroth is still the best in KH2FM. It'd be nice if you do more videos on other bosses that are worth to look at and discuss. Maybe other KH2FM bosses like Roxas or KHFM bosses (or BBSFM bosses *shudder*).

Was never the biggest Lingering Will fan, even before KH3 and those Data fights, I found a lot of the fight frustrating. In particular him locking into specific patterns in each phase meant the difficulty could vary wildly. Still, I feel like there's a very clear lineage between KH2's and KH3's superbosses and without Lingering Will, we probably wouldn't have gotten the amazing fights we now have.

I love this fight cause like many others, this was the “Wow this games combat is deeper than I thought” moment for me. I legit mashed my way through EVERYTHING as a child, but when me and my sister got the remaster on PS3 and reached LW, it was a humbling experience, we somehow mashed through the data fights but LW? Absolutely made us cry. But it was damn satisfying when we beat him after hours of remembering his moves.

This is honestly a contentious topic in the community.

@Bizkit047

Жыл бұрын

It gets brought up sometimes, usually when I see people try to drag Yozora down for some reason

I really like the negatives you pointed out in this. I definitely abused the looping completely for my first clear (phase 1 and 2 loops and DM loops), but it still provided enough of a challenge to learn :)

Took me so long to beat him but it was super satisfying when I finally got his HP to 0. It was also cool seeing some of his more rare patterns (like blizzaga) throughout my numerous attempts. Definitely agree with the negatives regarding revenge value attacks and auto-counter attacks. If 2FM had a meter (maybe like FF7R) to show the RV threshold of bosses, that would help with the issue a lot.

I actually only fought Lingering Will for my first time a month ago. I haven't played KH3 yet (let alone the DLC) so it's my favorite fight in the series right now probably. Your thoughts on the fight (minus having KH3 to compare it to) pretty much are the same as the conclusions I came to myself after beating it semi-blind (having seen videos a long while ago but not really knowing the actual mechanics of the fight) and then looking up more info about the fight. Before looking it up i thought he had variable revenge value somehow, the weirdly specific hp gates combined with the fact that its usually unreactable if you don't notice you're about to hit them is definitely this fights biggest flaw. I'm also mixed on the way his attack patterns work. On one hand I think its kinda neat to have something like that because I actually noticed it without having read about it before, and it felt cool to realize that and act upon it. On the other hand, it felt like my first time beating him was just being lucky getting every easy pattern and having the bare minimum amount of knowledge to get through the fight spamming megalixers. I think it'd be better designed if the patterns changed more often, maybe for hitting RV or just after any combo finisher at all even. Aside from that though, this fight was extremely fun, there's a lot of subtlety that goes into fighting him that you don't understand just watching someone beat him, and its a really fun time to learn to deal with everything he can throw at you.

Yeah, I won't sugarcoat it. I discovered his HP barriers on my own since I was ranging how my damage did per interval and found that as long as I mixed in 2 air punishes from his shot lock, I could always use the explosion finish which would force him into sonic blade 2nd phase 90% of the time. The 2nd HP barrier I never had to worry about since once I see his lasers I knew to fly as far away and use the pillars to block and destroy them, resetting the blast attack long enough for him to go into his DM. The lasers respawning also helped me pinpoint where he would warp so I could prep for his DM. I never did the combo cancel after his DM and would always do 3 explosions so what he did after was fair game, And it was a mix between his punch, his whip, or his seal attack. You are also correct, Screw bike phase 2.

I cant believe you didn't mention how much of a banger Rage Awakened was

@Bizkit047

Жыл бұрын

Probably could have added that in there, though I really feel like nearly all KH superbosses across the series have bangers without exception, so probably not a LW highlight more than a Yoko being too good at being a composer.

Good summary. After a weekend of attempts I used the fenrir spam and moved on. One of those things I wamt to go back to but as age goes up time for gaming seems to go down.

I remember fighting him on level 1 back in 2018 on live stream & no damaging his fight which was super fun. This fight still has it because I loved going through a mysterious portal in a normal level only for it to take you somewhere to fight to the death. I miss those days & hope KH4 will do something like that & not lock it behind DLCs & allow them to be in the main game like 1FM & 2FM did but I don't see that happening but a guy can dream though.

@1BadAssArchAngelvs14

Жыл бұрын

DLC's are not an issue if its a one time purchese just look at xenoblade chronicles 1,xenoblade chronicles 2,and xenoblade chronicles 3 DLC's are needed to get the true endings and you only need buy the DLC' expansions for those games once. In the year 2002 for the plasystation 2 people around the world except Japan did not get the kingdom hearts 1FM and 2 FM games until years later. kingdom hearts FM's 1 and 2 for PS3 are just basic DLC's for base kingdom hearts 1 kingdom hearts 2 ,but at 60 bucks.the only time DLC is bad if they force you to buy Multipul DLC's for the full Game. You should never complain about single purchase DLC's when "LIve Service games" and "Microtransations" and "Loot Boxes" are way worse!

@keybladewar22

Жыл бұрын

@@1BadAssArchAngelvs14 That is very true for sure. I forgot about that 😂

The dodge roll swag to evade his DM 🖤🤍

I'll admit I did use the rv looping strat to beat him my first time. I was also completing the journal for the first time so I guess I was just rushing to finish everything. It did feel good back then, but now I actually wanna give LW a more fair fight where I actually try to learn his patterns.

Vid is on par with what I expect when talking about the KH series, however I do feel the question in the title is pretty questionable. It should come to no surprise that the answer is a resounding HELL YEA

So I played KH2 (Not Final Mix) as a kid so I hadn't ever even beat the super bosses of 2 or knew they existed till later, but about a month ago some of your old KH2FM videos got me inspired to play through the entire series again and I fell in love with KH2's Combat. But after now playing through it all on LVL1 again, some of the unfair things that Lingering will can pull out is a little dated, but I also kind of like having to learn how to deal with some of it, like by design Yozora is almost 100% fair and reactable, yet some things about lingering will are still fun to work around, even if some things make the fight way easier like Force DM looping and what not. I still like the sheer number of ways you can fight Lingering Will, Drive forms, Summons, Loops. No block/glide, Etc. The amount of variety still has me enjoying the fight. My brother still laughs anytime I open up the fight and I see him open with frame 1 of punch attack and I just say "I'm dead" before it even connects to me. - Side note for another negative: Graveyard is super cool ascetically, but also can screw up certain parts of his attacks, like getting caught on rocks, or breaking out of an attack because he got stuck and what not. Though these are rather rare, it's still something to note. - Side note 2: I don't know if I would've had the full patience to learn him as much as I did if I played on the ENG PS3 version because of the load times to get back into the fight and having to pause buffer. I played on the PS4 Collection, so I didn't have any load issues, but it's worth thinking about. - Side note 3: BEES/Blasters, They can make a break a fight against him if you are unlucky, and the fact that running into them can stagger you sucks. Data Marluxia's bees in 3 were handled a lot better than these ones.

There's something comfortingly nostalgic to hear you complain about the PS3 re release one again after all this time lol I've had a few critics of the Lingering Will fight, but on the whole I feel that it has aged surprisingly well. Not that there isn't some issues with it that people didn't think about until something better came along eventually. But I think it's a testament to the fight (or at the very least it's kind of a condemnation against the super bosses that came after kh2) that it had remained the premier example of a KH superboss for over 10 years and for a while it was even frequently used as an example of brutally hard but fair super bosses in games in general. It really wasn't until KH3 Remind's Super Bosses arrived that showed some form of improvement on the boss design. I think my two biggest issues with the fight back when I was playing this game over and over again was LW's bike mode attack and his floating turrets. Bike mode was without a doubt the biggest mood killer for me while doing the fight and often times I would wonder if I should just purposefully let myself die rather than try to keep fighting him in this mode. I simply feel that bike mode goes on for much too long, and then when he is finished with the attack it's a kind of a gamble that he'll even be close enough to Sora for me to counter attack, and if I'm too far away to counter attack? He goes back into bike mode, thus continuing the long arduous pattern again. Plus, I feel like LW's bike mode is one of the more janky looking attacks phases he has. It doesn't often feel like a person is using the controls of the thing to rear back and then ram into Sora, you can very much feel it's just an AI moving it's set distance before coming back and often it'll be kind of weirdly off target and I just found it unnecessarily hard and unfun to deal with. There are ways to mitigate bike mode ending too far from you however, what I would eventually start doing in general when I was out of position to counter-attack would be to cast thunder and then try to make my way back to him using quick run or glide/aerial dodge. Trouble is, bike mode is the move that would by far leave him the furthest away, and while I don't recall exactly how much revenge value thunder would give I'm pretty sure it was one of the spells that did the most so I would always cut my eventual combo short to prevent getting counter combo'd in the middle of my combo. It's a shame, because I feel like the Blizzard spell LW will cast towards the tail end of the fight is visually unique and a fun sudden change up to the attack phase. But maybe in the long run, maybe the bike mode would've been better as a final hit variation to LW's Rising Sun attacks. Secondly is LW's floating turrets. His turrets weren't thought all the way through in my opinion. A lot of KH2's superbosses get away with some absurdly long combos that many players would never get to see the end of without abilities like Once More or Second Chance. The turrets however break this rule. LW can summon his turrets during other phases he's in or LW will vanish for an extended period of time and send out turrets to bother Sora. When Sora is being shot at and he fails to block or avoid the turrets he obviously becomes a sitting duck. However the issue with the turrets is that the body of them have a small non-damaging but stagger-able hitbox around them. And if Sora should bump into them while he is being combo'd, the game will see that as LW's combo being interrupted and will turn off Once More and Second Chance from protecting Sora. So if you make a mistake while turrets are on the field, not only are you trying to defend against LW's onslaught, but you will also have to try to find a way to guard against shots that will open up your defenses, and if you do fail to guard yourself against an attack then there is a strong chance you won't be able to ride out the combo you're stuck in if a turret gets a little too close to Sora, bumps him, interrupts LW's combo but still has Sora too stun locked to try and heal himself, and if Sora is at 1 HP when he got bumped then Second Chance and Once More will not activate to protect him anymore. It's a shame that the turrets seem to be infinitely spawning for a period of time, because I thought I had discovered something clever by gliding away and hugging the rock formations within the battle areana. The turrets colliding with the walls or with one of Sora's attacks will destroy the turret. So I thought I had something by doing that, even if that meant leaving myself a bit more open to LW, but sadly it's kind of a nothing burger as no matter how many turrets are destroyed more will respawn until LW decide they've been out long enough. Those were the main big things I remember having the largest issue with back when I was learning the fight and refighting LW back in the day. Always good seeing another video from you Biz!

My first time properly learning this fight was on stream during a KH marathon that I did last year. Prior to that, I only had done the PS3 English version, and I was only on Standard at the time. I remember that being not too bad. Crit is a different story. I still was level 50, cause I'll admit, I'm only mid level skill at this game, I would say. I did what I could to remember the strats you, Jhobs, and Spike were giving during your RPGLB level 1 run a few years back, but other than that, I had to learn to react and respond, and learn his attack patterns on my own. What followed was 2 hours of frustration, cause I assumed the whip was reactable, and I didnt have a clue about the auto counter element. Thankfully, my chat kept me motivated, and we eventually beat it. At the time, I felt frustrated, and a bit beat down, so I probably wouldn't have given a glowing review back then. But looking back, I think this fight really is baseline designed like a super boss should be designed. Its testing your knowledge, skill, reaction time, and how well you can adapt between phases. I even would say the janky, unreactable stuff is perfectly fine to mix up the fight a little bit. That's just my opinion though, cause if its poorly designed, its poorly designed. Personally, I think Luxord is still my favorite fight in the game (random bullshit I know, but I just enjoy the mechanics, personally), but this fight is much better than i initially assumed it was after that stream. I think Critical, level 50-99 is the best way to experience it if you're seeking a proper challenge that won't take forever. So yeah, good fight in retrospect.

I remember playing this on my PS2 when i was a kid couple of months after finishing KH2. Played the game on critical mode and then did the crit mode lvl1 challenge. I don't think i ever had that much fun with a KH game. When i fought lingering will for the first time i freakin loved it and i still think it is my favorite boss fight alongside larxene data. Good ol' times

One of the best fights ever!!

Learning how to time dodge rolls for dm into drive>limit form>menued ether>3 unfinished ars with the help of slapshot was most satisfying combo to end this fight.

Technically speaking, Yozora is the new gold standard of boss battles. Lingering Will though remains fantastic in terms of presentation, vibes, and what the future of the series could be. Even though you fought Roxas, you still have never really battled other Keyblade Wielders before and this one came out with powers that felt even stronger than Xemnas. Would Sora get powers and armor like that? were there evil Keyblade Wielders out there? you felt so unnerved and full of questions and that's exactly how a secret boss should be

Nice video, I will say I still overall prefer how this fight works to many of the KH3 superboss fights as I think overall the openings are much more fair to casual players, plus I hate the HP lowering mechanics some bosses had, it nullifies a lot of the RPG aspect to me. LW still could be better obviously, like you said if he didn't loop as easy and had less punishing forced revenge he would be much better. KH3 Remind was a great step in the right direction in terms of boss design so I can't wait to see some KH4 superbosses.

This fight is so rad but even when I was young I didn’t like it mechanically speaking. And it isn’t exactly a fault that’s exclusive to the fight but KH2 as a whole. As you said in your video the theme, music and story are all amazing. But I feel like KH2 does this thing where it really wants you to fight in the air but you really don’t have much answers for that whilst in the air. Granted this was before the ability to block in the air, shotlock etc. but after beating Yozora on critical and trying my hand yet again on Lingering Will I just can’t get over the fact that if you’re in the air you may as well be a sitting duck. I may also just not know enough since I didn’t really dedicate myself to the fight like I did Yozora. That’s just me tho, as you said some people find this fight trivial with the right amount of tenacity. Great video btw

Man i remember the 1st time i used to hate this fight but after eventually being able to react to his moves and build muscle memory to counter etc... i started to enjoy fighting lw over and over again.

I haven't gotten to birth by sleep yet because I like to fully finish the games in a way, but it does feel like a boss that only get's better once you know all the patterns for players on lower difficulties to figure it out, meanwhile that's what holds the fight back for hardcore level 1 players. I could not ever beat it without knowing how to deal with his last phase attack as it actually seemed impossible to avoid even a single attack from it, because when you get hit by it you are stuck for a full ten seconds of high damage. One thing I find impressive is how some of his attacks are his own variation of Kingdom Hearts 1's mp abilities. Ars archanium with his last phase attack, Sonic Blade with the hoverbike and the looping air attack.

If you made a kh superbosses tier list, where would you rank LW? Also, are you planning on doing a KH superbosses tier list video one day?

I'll try to describe why this fight is my favorite video game fight of all time as best I can. There are things about KH3's superbosses that are objectively better, sure, but I just can't choose any of them over LW for the best superboss. Don't get me wrong, fights like Yozora and Young Xehanort (personal bias) come dangerously close to topping the list, but LW stands out completely in my mind. You already touched on the story and aesthetic, and I think those play a major role here. You find a random portal in Disney Castle of all places, and you get a warning that whatever's behind it is not gonna play nice and that you damn well better be ready. You're dumped into a cutscene with some mysterious badass-looking armored person who mentions the keyblade, Xehanort, Aqua, and Ven. At the time these were all names we were guessing had something to do with the secret trailer but the speculation alone was super exciting. I also feel like you missed a big part of what sets LW apart: it was our first look at what a true keyblade master can do. Whoever this guy is, you could just tell that Sora is out of his league. His attacks with the keyblade are just... damn cool. Everything he does looks badass. Then you get dumped in the fight and completely annihilated. Yes, Yozora is kind of the same way, but this is the big reason LW comes out on top to me: Yozora is built like other bosses in KH3. He's massively upscaled in difficulty and he demands perfection, but it still feels like a "KH3 superboss." Not Lingering Will. LW feels like nothing else in KH2. From the final boss, to Sephiroth, to the nobody hallway, to the data fights. He is clearly, fundamentally different from anything else in the game, and it becomes painfully obvious that whatever methods you've used to make it through everything else aren't gonna cut it here. Again, I love KH3's superbosses. I think they truly made fantastic fights and raised the bar as a whole, and they obviously know how to make fun, challenging fights that do the characters justice. LW just hits all the right notes for me, in spite of its flaws. Great video as always Biz!

@-mothman-

Жыл бұрын

I dunno, I think that's a little unfair to Yozora. I do enjoy Lingering Will but I feel like Yozora was more impressive. With design flaws pointed out in this video, his strategies can be either too easy or too unfair. (With revenge value and RNG deciding his attack pattern, and with inescapable combo nonsense.) But Yozora was designed perfectly to me, being a boss fight with attacks that can feel unfair and ridiculous, but are designed in a way that it is still fair and possible to beat. (Unlike most BBS secret bosses.) As far as the story setup goes, it was an absolute shock seeing Yozora in the 'real world' as we'd only seen him in Toybox, previously viewed as a fictional character that just happens to be similar to Sora and Riku. But seeing him in The Final World, then getting to fight him? The confirmation that he's real was mindblowing. It makes you question everything about his design and purpose instead of brushing it off as "oh haha that guy kinda looks like riku" to "WHY DOES HE LOOK LIKE RIKU???" The fact that at the time we still don't have an answer to these questions makes it even more fun to theorize about. All we know is that he's from Quadratum, has a connection to the Nameless Star and was told to "Save Sora." Feels like more than what Lingering Will told us and yet all the more confusing. Currently people are theorizing the Nameless Star's name could be Sora, but even that answer is confusing as if he knew about her, why would she say he doesn't remember her? Nobody seems to have any solid answer about his appearance either, especially with the line "But this isn't what I look like." Implying it's not his real appearance. Who told him to save Sora? Some people guess the Master of Masters but we still don't have a solid answer as Nomura won't even reveal who the two cloaked figures were in KH4 trailer. (My guess is MoM and Yozora though.) That and there's plenty to analyze about him and his strength within his attacks. The two most notable to me being his ability to steal Sora's keyblade, and combine it with his own weapon, and the fact that the Void he sends you to with his DM (Distress Move) where he attacks you with clones of himself or Gigas.. That void looks almost exactly like the void you fought Xemnas in KH2. Although I have to agree Yozora gives you more familiarity than Lingering Will's fight does, I still think it's more than you give it credit for. A lot of Yozora's attacks can be similar to (and dodged in a similar method) to some other data fights, but I still think learning the pattern is a lot more difficult than it is for other bosses. For most Data Bosses you kinda just need to learn the specific attacks you struggle with, or level up and power through it. While they're difficult, if you're leveled properly the majority of them don't take very long to learn well enough to win. (At least in my experience.) Though I'd say Xemnas and Ansem are a bit of an exception, as in my experience they're way more difficult and punishing than the rest of the data fights. Xehanort is similar, but since his attacks are so similar to every other Data fight, and since you're required to beat the other data fights.. it's not as challenging as it feels too familiar and not as 'new.' Yozora though? You really only realize some of the similarities after you've gotten good enough to begin to learn his mechanics. Because of the way his fight was designed vs. LW, it requires a LOT more learning to master it. Lingering Will has a clear opening after basically any attack, and is invincible during most, so it's clear when you're intended to attack. Yozora though? He can be attacked mid-combo during the majority of his attacks, but can't be staggered. You either have to look up a guide or learn the fight well enough to figure out which specific attacks (and the timing inbetween) give you the best opportunity to attack and stagger him. That's most of the difficulty I find, figuring out the best opportunity to attack to avoid getting reckless. Since you're able to attack almost anytime, there isn't too much to discourage you and redirect you to looking for a specific opportunity, whereas LW is invincible during most combos, making it clear you're better off looking for his opening. (Doesn't help that he has more safe openings than Yozora does.) I feel like he's fundementally different from the Data fights too in that even though he has some similar attacks, (For example the blue lazers depleting your max HP, like Xion's attacks can do.) they give you a similar effect, but it's not really a similar attack. To continue using Xion's attack as an example, her blue lazer attacks come from her and slowly make their way towards you, giving you time to dodge and predict their path. Yozora's are targetted shots, meaning you can't see where they're coming from ahead of time and simply have to time your dodge (or block) in a different way. It also doesn't help that further into the fight those attacks become unblockable, AND deplete Max HP (if I remmeber correctly.) Not typing all this to say "Nope, you're wrong, Yozora is a better fight" but to show why I think he's at least deserving. Obviously everyone's got personal opinions about which fights they enjoy more, both on a gameplay level and presentation, but I feel like a lot of Yozora's similarities were brushed off, I think Yozora does also show the qualities you praise Lingering Will for. Obviously you're not gonna talk a lot about Yozora when explaining why you like Lingering Will, but I wanted to point out Yozora's strengths too as I feel like he deserves a little more credit than your comment comes across to giving him.

would like a video on why the yozora fight is so good, or top 5 KH3 bosses from a battle design perspective

i'm a newer kh fan, but I will say that Lingering Will fight is one of the funnest fights ive ever fought. There are some stuff I found a bit unfair, such as some stuff with the menu, but other then that I felt like I was in control when it was just me and him (plus the drive foods next to me), after watching and learning the fight I got closer and closer to winning until I finally did. So yeah, I'd say hes a pretty darn good boss fight.

Oh my god a Bizkit047 video in 2023

have you covered what your favorite kh3 fights are? maybe a tier list?

When i fought him, i did use your old looping strat for farming the crystals. It still took me hours if not days though.

Ok , you’ve mastered all the game mechanics and combat shenanegans , RDY TO GET SLAPPED ?!

Other than his bike phase, hell yes. I haven’t played a fantastic superboss since until I fought the Valkyries in GOW.

I saw the Fenrir cheese when I was desperately trying to beat him but decided not to use it. Glad I got it done the regular way

First time I tried to fight lingering will was on a proud playthrough. I was level 99 with Ultima weapon and other great items, and I had actually beaten the Org13 data fights with this setup as well. Some fights like Marluxia were great because I couldn't rely on my build too much and had to learn the boss's attacks and plan my strategy and use skill to execute it, but others I could just rely on cure + Ultimas MP haste + limit form to heal + items + second chance + once more and never feel in danger and win those boss fights without properly learning them or using that much skill. This was not the case with lingering will, and it made the experience much more enjoyable for me. In fact, I think if I now try to play through the game on critical or use a less ideal build, I feel more confident tackling lingering will than other bosses like larxene and lexaeus and vexen, because I had to properly learn the former but not the latter.

Considering this game was released 15+ years ago, this boss battle is timeless and still holds up. I just beat Lingering Will last year and it was harder than any Sekiro Boss, giving me a challenge for days. While it is true that this boss is infamously loopable, its not as bad considering that in order to consistently reach Phase 2, you have to learn how to counter all, if not most, of his phase 1 moves. If there is a move that you don't know how to overcome, you might as well consider that run pointless as LW will just spam it until you die. So when fighting him, if doesn't just feel like you're learning LW, it feels like you're mastering him. Proud to say that I beat him in Lvl 1, and I consider it one of my greatest gaming achievements until I play ReMind.

I doubt anything will ever top him for me personally. Waiting ten years to get my hands on 2.5HD and tackle 100% completion on Critical Mode only made the experience of feeling out the data fights and LW much more enjoyable. The theme, the mechanics, the way he has several patterns that change every time you challenge him and the way the fight made me use both dodge roll and the slide for different moves all added up to an exceptional fight that got my heart beating like a drum when I finally overcame it. Then KH3's epilogue world happened. Easily my favorite moment in the entire series, had me shaking in my chair as I went into it completely blind.

The thing with the patterns is so true tho i love how yozora is different each time sometimes he introduces the unblockable attacks early on or way later in the fight and for me he sometimes did that attack where he makes the whole arena white right after my 1st combo 😂

I never understood why KH never featured an ability like "Scan" for Revenge Values. It would be such an easy solution to convey that the mechanic exists while also alerting players to when it will happen. Maybe if RVs immediately reset every time a boss was able to attack, it wouldn't be so necessary. But I remember finding out that RV of bosses decreases incrementally after it's been filled up, not all at once. So, if you took advantage of too many of a boss' openings within too narrow a period of time, you may end up hitting the cap sooner on a later combo than you did in the initial one because you didn't give it enough time to cool down. This really screwed me over with the story fight against Demyx; I got into a rhythm where I was able to catch him in a combo every time he finished an attack, which earned me several deaths because he just randomly broke out of my combos just before I could finish them. I figured out that I needed to wait for him to attack a couple times if he used moves of a shorter duration before the game stopped punishing me like that.

@Bizkit047

Жыл бұрын

An RV meter is on my wishlist for KH, but probably will never be implemented

@KotR9001

Жыл бұрын

@@Bizkit047 That would be one possible solution, but I think even a more subtle approach could work as well. Basically, having bosses leap back/teleport before retaliating or having them take a defensive stance when you’re one hit away from triggering their counters for bosses with unreactable counters would be the most ideal solution.

I feel the one thing that sets LW apart from other superbosses even today is him only being vulnerable after his moves. It makes it feel like it's super fair as a fight, like it's hard as heck, but we'll give you your turn so you don't feel lost, while kh3 specifically wants you to find openings. I probably would rather have the latter as a standard, but that always made feel like LW was approachable, while kh3 feels like you can't do anything against them for a while (in a good way they're dope)

one of the worst thing to get hit by is lingering will's arrow, that sh*t can cause panic, and literally you need one eye to get back the commands, and another to dodge