OH and hey, I have a "creator code" for The First Descendant now [ Blunty#4877 ] If you use it, and you DO buy some MTX stuff, I get like... 2% kickback or something LOL! Have fun.

I dont care who you are or what anyone says, if a developer creates a problem in the game that requires money to fix, that's predatory.

Played for 6hr was having a good time. Saw someone running Gley with a skin. Went to the shop to check it out. Saw the price. Uninstalled.

@williamcrooksii9139

23 күн бұрын

I got to my first dungeon and there was three bunnies all maxed out and S tier I guess. They all ran super fast through it and rushed the snot out of it. I didn't even get a shot off. Really ruined the moment. The game hasn't even been out long at all. Kinda no point in grinding in this game.

@nexokami

22 күн бұрын

@@williamcrooksii9139 What you saw was Ultimate Bunny, that can be obtainable in the early game quite easily if you focus on getting that. Wallet is an alternative way of obtaining it.

@ltg8382

21 күн бұрын

Yeah man same.. i just won't do this

@xxboxofmuffinsxx4252

21 күн бұрын

@@williamcrooksii9139 ... Dungeons are grind spots. People who are much higher level than you are probably grinding for characters you can unlock in the first few zones. And there is no "maxing out" for Bunny to run fast. That's one of her skills and all her mechanics revolve around movement. Just set it to private, the difficulty goes down when you solo.

@tempo0225

14 күн бұрын

What you will do when you see a Ferrari outside 😂😂

I started playing the game and it became super fun... for the first few days, after away when I maxed out my character, I was still a good ways to the end of the story, but even though I'm no where close I'm still getting one shot everywhere. I've tried going for character like Ultimate Bunny, but the grind not just for the 3% chance of a single item, but requiring to grind out all the levels to get that chance is crazy, and this is coming from a person who was fine spending literally 5 months on a Minecraft Server 14 hours a day grinding the same boss over and over for a 0.0137% drop. If you want to make a drop rare, at least make the task fun, or make it so repetitive that it can be farmed.

$100 for an ultimate version of a character or $40 for Elden ring DLC.

@RIPPERwBFG

23 күн бұрын

A big Mac I choose the big mac

@TheScepticalThinker1

23 күн бұрын

​@@RIPPERwBFGbless you 😂

@Tzhz

21 күн бұрын

With insane luck and not trying I've managed to get 2/4 ultimate bunny parts which is about 2000hrs worth of grinding, and 5 of the 1% BIS drops. However I never get the item I want for a character unless I farm with one that doesnt need the item.

@BigBoyPudgy

20 күн бұрын

Build the ultimate version, don't buy anything

@OneTato

15 күн бұрын

Funny thing is, I have elden ring dlc, Even pre-ordered and killed a few bosses. But haven't played since first decendant came out because of how much more fun I'm having grappling around and shooting stuff with the bros 😂

That's what I get for falling for the trailer. (Again) Thank you for keeping me from getting Conaned. F.U. Funcom!

@RIPPERwBFG

23 күн бұрын

Conan p2w? Have you played it

And don't forget, it's Nexon...

Thanks for your time and enlightening point of view

once i saw a skin cost 300 and you can only buy 250 at a time i knew it wasnt a game for me

If the monetization is like warframe then the game will be amazing but since this is Nexon, people keep eyes for any scummy practice.

@MrBalrogos

24 күн бұрын

I'm gonna check it in descendant but Warframe have p2w mechanics too boosters, vaults early acces, u can grind 20h for something or just buy for plat not mention u can buy stuff like best mods from other players so Warframe is definitely p2w, u can buy stuff which are not obtainable in game loot anymore

@saintsaber8491

24 күн бұрын

It is like warframe most if not all is available in game.

@ZarousCurse

24 күн бұрын

@@MrBalrogoseverything is tradable and not pay to win, you can get any prime in a day. All mods are from baro, boosters are free go to any relay. All plat is essentially free since you can trade. So again not pay to win by any means

@g0blinslayr299

24 күн бұрын

The thing is that Warframe has trading and premium currency is tradable. So yes Warframe’s ingame market is predatory but there’s a legit way around it.

@nova8352

24 күн бұрын

​@@MrBalrogosyour argument is nice but it all falls flat when you consider the fact you can earn this paid for currency for free via trading Warframe in the technical sense is far from P2W yes plat can be used to give you an edge but the only think locked behind a paywall is prime accessories but again you can earn play without spending a single penny if you're patient enough but I will admit it has a very predatory system with how much options there are to pay

For everyonw talking about "it doesn't have trading." Devs already confirmed they will add clans and trading to the game. Now if you can trade premium currency or not is the BIG thing. No idea but seeing as they said warframe was a huge inspiration I would be shocked if they didn't add premium currency trading.

As soon as a virtual currency is available in a game that allows you to complete research immediately, like in The First Descendant, it is called pay to progress, it is that simple. The game doesn't have to be out for years to see that Nexon is exploiting the players And they did that on purpose and will certainly not make any "price adjustments".. 85% of the game is monetized. Then you have a few minor veils like: "Yes, but you can farm it, you're free to do so, here you have item X, it only has a 3% drop chance or 0.4%" that alone is a disgrace.

Alright I got my write in for later this year.

Well spoken. Honest and not biased. Just, just. I also like the helmet behind you from fallout.

By October I guarantee this game will be an afterthought.

You nailed it. Well said. I see games made worse on purpose to incentivize swiping a credit card, I avoid funding that practice at all costs. I'll still play it, but they aren't getting my money, mostly out of spite for their greasiness.

I have learned my lesson from playing Lost Ark, where soon after reaching a certain point I realized that unless I swipe my card I was in for a horrible grind. Korean F2P games are draconic and should never be touched with a ten foot pole unless you like wasting your time and money.

Warframe made the wait work just fine honestly with building warframes and wait etc I'm worried about the buying mod slots to add more mods to frame

a general understanding of what pay to win is is very easy if you can get power or buy power with real-world money that is paid to win a lot of people say that Lost Ark isn't pay to win like what Asmongold said any game will you buy something and get an advantage that is paid to win regardless of its pvp or pve like he said pay for convenience is actually worse in some regards I recommend a KZread video what is pay to win

1-2 times a year i go back to warframe and my goal in that game is always the same, farm all frames that I'm still missing... Could I buy them? Sure, i have a few k plat on my account... I could even get the prime versions... but that would be me paying to not play the game... So "pay to skip" is a weird concept... you're literally giving the company money so you... don't have to play the game?

I don’t mind if a game has this model. I have money to spend on a game but I won’t. It’s not a big rush for me to have the latest and greatest. The fun to me is the grind and reward. I can appreciate a game to give me a choice to play without paying instead of paying a full price game just to try it. If I don’t like it, I can’t get my money back, anthem. If I enjoy a game after trying it, I will definitely support a game that I enjoy the game play loop. For an example warframe. This is just my opinion.

Paying for xp boosters or paying for stuff that adds power and skills to your ghameplay. Even if single player game has this it is p2 win mechanic.

You're 100% right. I've given up on this fight though... every p2w game that comes out has a legion of people defending the monetization saying that it isn't p2w for some reason or another. Pretty sure there will never be another cultural phenomenon game like WoW purely because even if the game is not p2w, people will ruin the integrity of the progress via RMT (the original p2w). At the end of the day, this stuff only exists because people pay for it. The only way to actually change it, is to recover our desire for integrity... to change the gaming culture back to mocking anyone buying progression in any form. Instead we're heading more and more toward the Korean and Chinese gamer outlook, where people actually look up to the whales.

@Doesnotmatter-uo7gd

23 күн бұрын

This is true, real and unfortunate.

You nailed it perfectly. We ought not ghet bogged down on what a literal "win" might mean. The spirit of th epay 2 win negative comment, is selling upgrade in general. It is a tight line to walk. in general, locking away chjaracters in a free game, with option to buy, seems totally fair. U have no right to the entire game if the entrence is free. but it oculd be done in a scummy way where th egame is built around making the base game suck, then sel the ghood stuff of make it too grindy.

As someone who almost never finishes a game or fully grind a seasonal or anything... i don't aim to win, but enjoy the gameplay. If the gameplay doesn't force me to spend, I'm still enjoying my time spent in the game. So, imho, i don't really care about their shop or pass systems. I don't see the issue at all since I don't plan to use those systems anyway. If the craft timers become too much, I just move to another game :)

The First Decsedant is not pay to win. That is what I thought until I came across an in game item called an energy activator. The game uses a mod system and the more points you can put into them the better you do, the farther you can progress. Energy activators are $24 a piece and you will need one per descendant and one per weapon. Without it, you are at such a horrible disadvantage that there will be content you can't do. That is just one small problem that is an indicator of a much bigger one. The big problem is that the First Descendant isn't a game at all. It's a grief treadmill in the form of a game.

@nexokami

22 күн бұрын

I'm F2P and I already reached level 100 couple hours ago and I can tell you that Energy Activator isn't necessarily if you know what modules to put on. Even without, it still pretty easy to breeze through the entire story mode and still haven't used any. You get 1 free Energy Activator at early game, and another free one at late game. You can also grind for them which can be tedious but not practically impossible.

#Nexon are savage when it comes to pay to win. I honestly hope I'm wrong about this. But time will tell

the real issue here tends to be people either choose to seperate pay to progress faster. and pay to win. or combine them. in my opinion pay to win is buying an advantage you cant get for free. for instance here inventory space is a good example, however after reaching near endgame now inventory isnt really needed so I dont mind. but I would argue that could be considered ptw still. the cosmetics and descendants and such are pay for convienience as you said which is different. however, its all personal opinion in the end.

to experience convenience IS TO WIN

Also 8:15 dunno where you got 12 hours from? My 3 Valby parts took 8 hours each in about 40 minutes I can start the full build which will take 18 hours. Way too long. Bunni base took what 10 minutes to craft? ALL DESCENDANTS should *ONLY* take 10 minutes to craft. I WANT TO PLAY THIS GAME!!!! I HAVE BEING TOLD TO WAIT A DAY AND A HALF JUST TO *TRY* my new character. This waiting crap is what killed warframe for me and although it’s much better times on first descendants it’s still terrible and way to slow. Weapons being 4 hours after the initial hour or two for the weapon parts feels awful as well. The final craft of all items should only be 10 minutes. Keep the part crafting time as is if you must but final craft taking quadruple the time is very frustrating and a metaphorical slap on the wrist for having giving my time and efforts.

Its 100% pay to progress/ skip mobile length upgrades. Its very predatory as every F2P player will hit a currency wall.

I did the boss mission in the second zone, went in with weapon's empty inventory... by the end of the boss fight I had to manually go and delete some items to be able to loot because inventory was full.

From all the betas I played. All characters were viable and had their strengths and weaknesses. Its also not always about DPS because you can be a glass cannon and not get far or be too much of a tank and not be able to kill anything. It is pay for convenience though.

@oFiGuReZo

24 күн бұрын

Pay for convenience is just a cope term. It’s ptw.

@XiLock_Alotx

24 күн бұрын

Cope Harder…this game will devolve into a scummy, insidious money grab. Like ALL of Nexon’s prior titles. History doesn’t lie.

@complete_newb1718

24 күн бұрын

​@@oFiGuReZoNo... Pay for convenience is far different from p2w.. Warframe is pay for convenience and if you going to call Warframe equal to pay to win then you are wrong. Descendants seems to be between both but leans towards a scummy pay to progress

@Raydr62

24 күн бұрын

@@oFiGuReZo Nah, pay for convenience does have a different meaning. I wouldn't call warframe p2w at all

@Fibulator

24 күн бұрын

​@@complete_newb1718 I can make a brand new account on Warframe and purchase all maxed out end game mods with cash. You can quite literally beat every piece of gameplay far FAR faster and easier by spending money. Can you do it for free? Absolutely. But just because you can do something for free, does not make the game "not pay to win". This is the hardest cope of the century.

I don’t mind buying a game or paying for content. I just don’t want to feel like I have to constantly spend to play the thing. Like helldivers is borderline but you can do ftp just grinding the game. Crafting though is where I draw the line

To research for 10 min. Is fine but 16h is ridiculous. So i has to pay to play with new character that i finally found materials for

I'm fine with the ability to buy whatever, as long as you can unlock it through a grind. As long as there isn't a point in the game that you can't get past without spending money, I'm cool. Basically, if they follow Warframes model im good to go.

Oh shit first descendants launches today, this sounds normal.

And then there Riot Games with $500 skin. What happen to gaming.

U can also buy xp boosters

@dsshocktrooper7523

24 күн бұрын

So does Warframe

@omar.a5209

24 күн бұрын

@@dsshocktrooper7523 atleast you can trade for platinum in warframe to buy the xp boosters

@gabrielripw0lf293

23 күн бұрын

@@dsshocktrooper7523 but you can get pretty much for free in warframe

This monetization scheme is so predatory. I might try playing if you stream it so you'll have backup, but that will be about it

@kawkawbetch8795

24 күн бұрын

It's nexon... ofc it's p2w one of the worst companies on the market.

@gabrielripw0lf293

23 күн бұрын

@@kawkawbetch8795 what about ncsoft ? throne and liberty cash shop coming boys in europe soon

I'm having second thoughts now. Just like Warframe.

Bunny took 60 seconds to be created. They’re definitely catering to all the free to play players early but hey it could be a lot worse

@KyuzoGM

23 күн бұрын

Yeah, couse Bunny was a part of a side mission, which was a really easy walk in the park to get, now try getting AJAX which is one of the first picks when starting the game...

Its like warframe everything is available in game that hasn't changed since beta Ultimate Descendants are like primes yes you can grind them or you can get "prime access" which for the first descendant seems kinda lacking.... from what ive seen you get the character 2/4 cosmetics, character slot, for the full thing you get 2 materials? you dont get "platinum" like in warframe which is currency though i guess there is a bit of a price difference not sure if the materials are worth the extra money really i feel sure maybe the Ult Des and skins if you really like them but the materials idk...rather have currency to get other cosmetics or other stuff as a beta player i already know my favorite characters are Gley and Frey

@OGdank

23 күн бұрын

The problem I think is how long it would take you if you want to obtain all the ultimate descendants. Someone did the math and it was a stupid amount of time. I don’t have the link to the Reddit post tho I seemed to have lost it.

@ben_souls_challenger

23 күн бұрын

I agree Warframe hit the nail on the head with their prime access it’s just a bit ridiculous spending that amount for a ultimate character with 2 skins whereas in Warframe if you buy the access you get the prime Warframe a lot of platinum and weapons

@gabrielripw0lf293

23 күн бұрын

@@ben_souls_challenger and accessories as well. here is nexon after all, nothing gonna change. same is would be when throne and liberty gonna come in Europe, pay to win all over.

@chantevlogs384

19 күн бұрын

@@ben_souls_challenger crazy thing is you can get a full on prime warframe for about 30-50 plat because of the trade system. I don’t have to spend a single dollar I can just play the game and trade for plat if I need too. This game on the other hand it is grind your life away or spend money there is no middle ground.

Yeah and all the skins and colors are behind paywalls , you can’t grind to get a skin or color you have to buy it, they didn’t show that in the trailer or even talk about having to buy everything to make your character look cool

Bit you can buy everything with cash in Warframe, and the large majority doesn't consider it pay 2 win lol.

@shirokku3279

24 күн бұрын

There's a very important aspect to Warframe to take into account with that: The premium currency is tradeable. Players trade everything for the premium currency. There's an entire in-game economy that you can access from the moment you're able to do player trades, which is fairly early into the game, and nothing is stopping you from grinding to get your hands on the currency to buy those things. The value of tradeable items in premium currency is also entirely decided by the player-run in-game economy. Which means that how easy or difficult it is to obtain something the devs are selling for their premium currency is up to the community. Does that mean it's not P2W? I'll leave that up to each person's interpretation. However, the premium currency being tradeable is a massive thing to take into account, and is conveniently left out of arguments too often when they come up.

@Pregameallday3

24 күн бұрын

@@shirokku3279 I'm glad someone mentioned this because, The First Descendant will not have player trading. I think that is a huge mistake. There are two types of people; some with more time and some with more money. The people with more time for grinding to trade with people that have more money than time. I don't think the model will work very well without player trading.

sounds like how Warframe have been doing things for years which I don't really like. I spent money on currency to buy from other players such as upgraded cards and such but soon got fed up with it. game is fun but the grind is boring

I haven’t played an honest/genuine Korean Game. Sure NA has bad apples, but Japan has been more consistent and reliable for not wasting the players time and money. Everyone should do their due diligence on these Korean companies before supporting their games.

Hey Blunty, I have a fun debunking fact about the boiling frog thing. It has been debunked, completely not reue. But as an expression, it does really illustrate a very good point about many situations, as if it were true, these situations are analogous.

@BluntyTV

24 күн бұрын

It was never meant to be true, it's a metaphor & I feel sick at the thought someone was so pointlessly cruel that they might've tested it with a real frog.

People who get stuck on the word "win" or don't get the simple concept of pay to win reveal they have low IQ. To "win" doesn't just mean beat the game or kill a final boss like their simpleton little heads conclude lol. As you said, it's more like a vague metaphor, win has many meanings, win quality of life, win time, win clear advantages over others, etc. the list goes on and on. So yeah pay to win is pretty simple, happens whenever someone spends real money to get an advantage over other players, period. Something this simple, and some ppl still don't get it lol smh.

@user-so9dp8qw2w

19 күн бұрын

OMG a person who understands it

just compare warframe with this game - a prime package cost 129$ and you get the prime - do i need to say more? same concept - you can buy early without research or farm

its ridiculous how much they charge their customers for all the stuff in the store. just completely crazy monetization... so high prices... and also the worth of the premium currency... its half of what you pay. you pay 100 and get 50% worth in premium currency. people are really falling for this criminal strategy already. saw someone already dropping 100€ for the bunny pack. insane. and if you look into the store and dont instantly see its p2w in the first seconds... you are lost.

It's just putting real life advantages in a video game.

$20 for a base character is ridiculous.. $100 for a prime variant??? wtf not even warframe is that greedy and on top of that warframe has trade chat so if you get a duplicate skill mod you could trade to a friend rather than scraping it… this game is hitting a lot of Ls and I bet even the whales don’t stick around very long.

(Insert insightful comment about MTX P2W here)

It’s 100% pay to win. If people weren’t so worried about doing better than others and paying money to do so it wouldn’t be but that’s exactly what people are like , else they would just go play single player games 😂 I will not play this game , the beta was pretty fun seems a little low budget for this day and age. But pay to win couldn’t be me

Yes it is

I would not say it is pay to win when the game is only PvE and no leaderboards😊

Trying out the game... it's so so .. but holy fuck is it pay to win.. 😂 So for me it's goodbye

i guess warframe is new then ? i dont mind the thing warframe already did.

@BluntyTV

24 күн бұрын

Mate, no one here, least of all me, is pretending this is "new", infact I flat out frame it as the opposite of that. That's not the point here.

I completely agree. Every conversation about game monetization turn in to a philosophical debate about the definition of winning. People get too hung up on the term, instead of the question - Is this game Pay To Enjoy?

Free players grind for years and reach a certain level, then a newcomer comes with 1000$ in their credit card, creates a 10 times more powerful character and within a few hours killing bosses which took us weeks to kill ( because grinding to make our character powerful enough to kill those bosses )

well that mean WOW also pay2win

@Sgt_RED

23 күн бұрын

cause it is? huh?

@c-tothefourth4879

20 күн бұрын

Obviously

Just like Warframe it will fail within months of release... Ohh wait

Lets hope theres no pvp😂

You know I think players do need to realize a game can have pay to win aspects to it and still be an absolutely amazing game, I think players attach this notion that if a game is pay to win it automatically equals bad game. I mean look at warframe it 100% has pay to win aspects to is but is still an amazing game, Lost ark absolutely has pay to win aspects to it but isn't super great, So rather than players attaching negativity to this notion just accept that it is and say true but it is amazing. Because remember Anthem wasn't pay to win and was a complete dog shit game.

Warframe uses all of these systems and is considered one of the most free to play friendly games on the market. Not saying that's the case here since it's nexon, but it's worth pointing out

@peddypeoples941

24 күн бұрын

the premium currency is tradable in warframe, makes all the difference...

@Sgt_RED

23 күн бұрын

@@peddypeoples941 exactly.

@Fantoohot

23 күн бұрын

I got 17k of the ingame premium currency as free to play try to do that with first descendant's premium currency. While your ass is playing so much trying to catch up to p2w anyway lol.

If you want to see real pay to win go play Infinite warfare, its more of a convince. If this game is pay to win then owning a car is also pay to win. The developers are not forcing you to open your wallet, you just lack self control and patience.

Warframe does the same thing with locking new players out of content & making it boring for the players to continue playing, they all mostly just Quit an move on..

@marclucid8884

23 күн бұрын

I had a feeling they would take this route to make money😢💰

This is the scourge that is fre to playgames. There is too much incentive to unbalance and crank up the grindyness and rarities so much that it efectively is nto free but at the same time, a worse game.

its pay2 win

Tried it. Uninstalled it after about 30 sec in, upon seeing the NEXON splash screen. Already know what it is

If there's something that does really confuses me, is how is people thinks that it is acceptable and actually healthy for the game when Warframe releases new prime frames you can immediately get access to with real life currency instead of grinding for them in game, but then they suddenly change idea when another game does the same thing while screaming to the p2w out of their lungs?

@BluntyTV

23 күн бұрын

Please tell me at what point I have EVER, even ONCE, ever said I think Warframe is a "good" example? (HINT; I never have, please stop IMAGINING things so you can have a tantrum about it, it makes you look FUUUCKIIN CRAAAZY)

Sigh the key word in pay to win is the WIN, your not winning anything by progressing faster, I find if you work hard and have little time to play paying to progress is fine and if you don't work alot you have time to earn it by playing more

@BluntyTV

23 күн бұрын

"sigh" I already dismantled that "argument" in the video you're commenting on. It's kinda dopey you commented on the topic without even the courtly of LISTENING to it first.

@c-tothefourth4879

20 күн бұрын

Cope

This game dounds hella toxic by the way you describe it

@BluntyTV

23 күн бұрын

The monetization could be called "toxic"... BUT, I genuinely am having a lot of fun with it so far (and haven't spent a cent).

Paying to alter gameplay mechanic means two things: competitive unfairness and/or developer incentive to create bad content that is skippable. Even if you argue PvE can't be pay to win (narrowly construing the definition and making this a semantic issue), what is the purpose of putting in content into a game that you want to pay to skip? That is bad game design. The problem is, there are people who want advantages over others. Some are willing to pay money for it. This is what I have come to realize, and this is the answer. These game mechanics will always exist because there is a demand for it. People who enjoy competitive integrity or good game design will have to choose the games that don't do this as part of their monetization model.

@c-tothefourth4879

20 күн бұрын

"what is the purpose of putting in content into a game that you want to pay to skip? That is bad game design." Not when your aim is for people to pay to skip it.

There is TIMERS in this? Like a proper mobile game? Lololololol. HAAAAARD PAAAAASS.

I don't care its dam fun to play.

So it's literally no different from warframes pay model. Big deal

@BluntyTV

25 күн бұрын

So... If someone kicks you in the teeth, it then makes it "No big deal" for someone ELSE to also kick you in the teeth? That's some ~CURIOUS~ "LoGiC" you're working with there mate.

@einsUNDcolt

25 күн бұрын

This is why I dislike Warframe and don't play very often

@Mayhemtheone117

25 күн бұрын

​@BluntyTV The game has to dangle that carrot in front of you to get you to possibly spend the money. It's business. You don't have to buy it but if you do then that's your decision. Believe me, I hate waiting to unlock something but you have to create a system that does create an incentive to spend money for a free to play game. Then no one would spend money and then the studio shuts down the game. Cosmetics would not be enough for a free to play. I don't buy cosmetics and if the games prices get ridiculous then I stop playing just like I did warframe.

@ForeignFabric

25 күн бұрын

@@BluntyTV yoooo lml I mean you are right high key.

@lip124

24 күн бұрын

If the monetization is like warframe then it will be good BUT if first descendant charge a 100$ for a ult bundle then it's greedy cause your competition is not doing that. And yes this companies are competitive for YOUR time and money, it's all about value jere.

Eh it's free to play , imma spend $70 .