I have a counter point, anecdotal for sure, but true in my case. I swapped out the “old” oil from ALL the gear boxes in an old 1993 Land Cruiser TO brand new AMSOIL in the front diff, rear diff, transfer case, and Engine. The difference was significant and noticeable. The rig made less noise, and I did get approx 8% better economy. (As close as I could calculate). That rig went on to serve me another 100,000 miles of hard work without any drama. Got rid of it at 250,000 miles. And I regret it to this day.

@charlesb4267

Ай бұрын

You're comment reminds me of a slightly used 1982 Toyota 4x4 pickup I had bought long ago and it would have had the factory 80W-90 gear oils in both diffs as well as the manual trans and the transfer case, and probably a typical 10W-30 engine oil. Being that I live in northern Alberta that was a no go in our winter climate so I used synthetic 0W-30 engine oil and at that time 75W-90 part synthetic is what I could get easily. The products I used were Esso ( now Mobil ) but imagine the Amsoil or other brands of full synthetic some years later would have had better performance yet in cold weather but never the less it came down to higher performance oils that are thinner at low temps having a drastically improved lack of driveline drag in colder weather. There is a reason why for years now transfer cases use automatic trans oil, diff have gone to 75W-90 if not even 75W-85, and a thinner type of automatic trans oils ... and 0W-20 or even thinner engine oils ... it all adds up to less oil drag resistance.

One of the clearest explanation I have ever watched. Very good and very easy to understand. I used Amsoil on older engines especially to rejuvinate them and the results were good. Now I understand why.

The comparison is different, but the Amsoil selling point/philosophy is switching over to a premium, high detergent synthetic oil. They do recommend starting with a high detergent and quality synthetic for initial ownership in general in order to avoid this deposit build up.

Lake speed J.R. “The motor oil geek” just did a good video on this with vavloines new restore oil that cleans very aggressively.

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

Lake’s awesome - he’s actually part of my consulting network. I saw that video and yes, a lot of the “restoration” comes down to the detergent capability of the oil.

@miscellaneous5215

Ай бұрын

@@LubricationExplained i got the impression it was some new novel ingredient.

Well made video. I’m an Amsoil user as I believe they make great products and are more transparent than average. That being said, I always thought the fuel economy number of 8.2% seemed abnormally high. Now I know why. They still make great products, but that was not a good study imo.

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

Thanks! Yeah, I think the study did a good job of highlighting how to "rejuvenate" an old engine, and where some of the losses accrue. But it maybe could have been communicated more clearly.

@Papparratzi

Ай бұрын

Sounds like a fair and balanced answer. ✔️

Thanks for this very informative video. On the subject of HTHS, another you tuber, the Motor Oil Geek, says friction & wear are two different things. More AW additives will increase friction not decrease it, contrary to popular belief. Maybe in a future video you can expand on that, e. g. how HTHS affects wear vs. friction, & of course fuel economy. Thanks again for the great video!!

@TheDuckofDoom.

Ай бұрын

I can't speek to AW additives here because there are so many types with different modes of action, but it is true that friction and wear are not synonymous. A very high viscosity oil wil provide greater separation of parts and less wear while the shear resistance of the fluid creates more friction (Transfering macro shear forces and converting mechanical energy into heat.). Wear tends to come from high local (microscopic bits) shear forces when bits of metal impact due to inadequate separation. So two situations can have the same average macro shear force (friction) and massively different wear; one will be an evenly distributed force in a thick film, while the other is the average of extremes of very low shear force areas and very high spikes in force where bits of metal contact.

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

Lake’s awesome!! And he’s absolutely correct - they’re independent phenomena. The main problem with anti wear additives from a friction perspective is we don’t have much control over how the surface film is laid down, so the surface roughness is often higher, plus the material itself has higher friction. HTHS refers to the fluid friction of the lubricant itself, so it’s a slightly different thing.

@georgeburns7251

Ай бұрын

Great comments

Amsoil and k&n are the best marketing companies. The internet raves about them with very little (or none) data to confirm anyone’s claims.

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

To be honest I don’t have much experience with either. Amsoil’s business model of having a wide reseller network has definitely given them a big leg up, especially on social media where a lot of the resellers are very active.

@miscellaneous5215

Ай бұрын

Their marketing is not the greatest, but they do make some of the best lubricants on the market in my opinion. They provide a lot of good data based on industry standard testing on their website.

@oneninerniner3427

Ай бұрын

I will say in my own experience, K&N air filters seem to flow well when clean. But I wouldn't say Amsoil has no data, as they do use many of the ASTM and other third party vehicle and equipment manufacturers test methods and parameters for their test comparisons, don't they? I mean that should count for something shouldn't it? That 8% gain probably was very optimistic, and probably did have much to do with cleaning up that well used engine. However, I don't think they implied that everyone would see those kinds of gains either. I'm just a lowly life long mechanic by trade and retired amateur racer and have used and sold as a small dealer some of their products for a very long time. I personally have had excellent results with them. But Hey, at least they don't claim their products contain magic wands, (mine is broken by the way) pixie dust and unicorn horns huh? LOL

@malcolmwhite6588

Ай бұрын

@@LubricationExplained I think you are looking at your percentages to simplistically. Let’s just assume you have some money $100 is a dollar for each percent and you have some children you going to give some of the money to little Miss lubrication - this kid gets 8% eight dollars, so when you say can’t possibly improve 8% you are thinking of the total, however if you gave little Miss lubrication another eight dollars, that wouldn’t be 8% that would be 100% so 8% of the 8% is .064%, totally achievable thing a bit of clever marketing, but I’m suggesting that that’s probably what they’ve done

@PSA78

11 күн бұрын

They are marketing companies making products. 😄

Lake Speed Jr did a seminar on Porsche Club of America's KZread and said there's only 3 manufacturers of base oil and only 3 manufacturers of oil additives. He basically said oil marketing is trash. Buy for spec before brand. There's so many factors in fuel economy in the real world.

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

That's mostly correct - like a lot of industries (think accounting, banks etc) there's been a lot of consolidation so there's a "big 3" base oil companies (Chevron, ExxonMobil, Shell) and a "big 4" additive companies (Lubrizol, Oronite, Afton, Infineum). But there's a pretty vibrant ecosystem of mid-to-smaller companies out there that are doing some great work. Yes, there is a lot of marketing fluff (particularly in the consumer categories) but there's also plenty of real technology.

@miscellaneous5215

12 күн бұрын

Mostly true, but the smaller, more expensive brands (HPL, Amsoil, Red Line) up the treat rate and overbuild their oils. How much better they are really depends, and to some degree can't be determined unless you were to test them all against industry standard tests.

@PSA78

11 күн бұрын

He's not wrong in any of it, it's just that like a baker is using the same ingredients they can be combined differently to get different results. 🙂

In the Amsoil case study, they changed every single driveline fluid, including the wheel-bearing grease. What I understand, not even Amsoil was expecting more than 3% or so, it was a shocking result.

I was expecting the answer was going to be more along the line of 8% of the stand alone engine efficiency, rather than 8% of the complete vehicle driving economy. But it seems even that narrow measure would be excessively optimistic.

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

Yeah I believe that even Mobil's 2% number was complete vehicle driving economy because they tested trucks on a standardized circuit in the UK.

Amsoil engine with 530k and still looked new under the valve cover, SPOTLESS 🤘🏼

Great video, Rafe! Would you see it is recommended to switch from a high HTHS engine oil +3.5 cP to a low HTHS

Hello Rafe, Good video. However, is not cleaning the deposits "restoring" the performance as opposed to improving the performance. Is not the performance of a new engine distinctly different than the performance of an old engine? apples to apples/oranges to oranges

I started using synthetic oil in 1988 in Germany as a young automotive technician aprentice. I never found much improvment in fuel ecconomy until all drive line lubricants where synthetic. So once engine oil, ATF/Gear Lube and bearing grease where all synthetic I noticed a very significant improvement in fuel ecconomy. I noticed this in everything from N/A I4, V6, V8, forded induction, fuel injection, carburated, automatic and manual transmission vechiles. I would often see 2-3mpg improvment consistently in my vechiles and clients vechiles in Germany and in USA. I have lived int he USA since 1992. In almost all cases I was going from a 15W40 or 20W50 mineral oil to a 5W40/10W30 or 5W30 synthetic and often gear lubes where where going from 90W to 140W Mineral Oil to 75W90 or 70W80 synthetic.

Sure, lowering the viscosity of your oil will give you minimal fuel efficiency gains, but my question is, will the lower viscosities create more engine wear and in turn higher repair costs which will offset any savings in fuel costs? I really dont see how these new 0w8 and 0w16 oils can protect as well as a 5w30 with the same additive package. Is there something I'm missing?

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

Great point - so there's definitely tradeoffs, and in general is not going to be possible to simply use the same additive packages in these lower viscosity engine oils. Most of the time, it's a combination of uprating the base oil (so in the case of 0W-8 and 0W-16 they're likely to be full PAOs), and improving the additive package (you'll start to see more Boron, Moly, ashless phosphorous etc). On top of that, the engines need to be built with a lower viscosity in mind. In a lot of cases, it's the tighter machining tolerance and improved surface finishes that are allowing the lower viscosities.

@100pyatt

Ай бұрын

The oil geek has a great video explaining this exact question... The heavier oil viscosity does protect against wear better than the 5-20 water thin stuff

@PSA78

11 күн бұрын

​@@100pyattLake also talked about in a video how they reduced wear with an oil that had lower viscosity, something other tribologist talk about as well. Viscosity can work against the additives in mixed and boundary lubrication. So we should mostly compare to the specific oil (which include additive package) and if it can do the job it was engineered to do (or how it degrade with reduced viscosity). 🙂

You are forgetting about the most important contributor to fuel efficiency, and that is temperature control. We gained 18% in petrol and 27% on LPG on a EB Falcon bacck in about 93/94 with a test vehicle supplied by RACV when we fitted components to correct the coolant temperature on the 4.0 Liter 6 cylinder engine dual fuel.

What is your opinion of Amsoil engine oils?

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

Good question - to which I don't have a good answer. Amsoil isn't particularly popular down here in Australia, so I've never actually used it myself. And I haven't seen it used in any of my fleet customers. From everything I've seen they seem to make a good product.

@bradhuffjr777

Ай бұрын

In the USA, Redline Oil from b1320 is a good choice at a good price.

@fifiandmax

Ай бұрын

I've used Amsoil in Australia in a a turbo diesel 4wd for past decade keeping used oil analysis every 5000klms drain intervals. Imo im very satisfied with their high ZDDP high TBN diesel oils except the price.

@DeusKDuo

Ай бұрын

I would say amsoil is very good oil but is it worth the price premium you pay is the real question. Paying slightly more for a premium off the shelf oil like a pennzoil ultra is better then paying more then double for amsoil for me personally is not worth the price premium of amsoil. For the same price of amsoil I can get something even better from a small boutique oil company like advlubrication.

@oneninerniner3427

Ай бұрын

​@@DeusKDuo never heard of them! you think they are better? How about High Performance Lubricants? Have you priced them? I still think there is merit in the old adage, you get what you pay for...

The she stability of almost 100% PAO or Diester's allowed you to have multi-grade synthetics with zero viscosity improvers this allowed you to radicaly lower the minimum hths required to have low wear and less frictionc ompared to ancient group 1 oils that had to be very viscous and needed lots of VII's. So depending on when this Amsoil study happened it could have been a HUGE difference!

9:55 A very good point Rafe. Years and years ago when Mobil 1 was brand new in Australia, my father and brother in law both had a Daihatsu Charade Turbo each. They saw ads for Mobil 1 showing the benefits of cleaner engines and new synthetic technology, so they both changed to it from the good quality mineral oil they'd be on. Both cars failed a turbo within a week of each other when all the deposits started to move. Not the oil's fault, and both cars gave long lives after the change.

I have used Amsoil for decades because of the great results I get with it. I can absolutely tell you that I see a MPG increase switching to it. The way I know this is when I'm breaking in a new vehicle over the first 5,000km or so I will run a cheap API licensed engine oil because I dump it quite frequently while I'm rinsing the engine internals of all wear metals. Then I'll switch over to my premium brand Amsoil for its first Extended Oil Changer interval and I can immediately see the MPG increase in this one oil change, and by the second oil change where the PCM has modified the long term fuel trim information it gets slightly better and levels off. It's not why I use this brand, but I can absolutely say their claims are not B.S. like most oil companies claims are.

@bwatt1383

Ай бұрын

Thats some serious dedication, you do heavy towing for work or something?

@LubricationExplained

Ай бұрын

I don't doubt their numbers - after all it was measured by an independent testing facility. But where the baseline is set matters a lot - so if you're comparing against a new (albeit broken-in) engine it's impossible to get 8%. But if you're comparing against an in-use engine, then I can absolutely see how it would happen.

@CedroCron

Ай бұрын

@@bwatt1383 No just an enthusiast. My dad was a mechanic for 50 years and I worked in his 3 different shop as an unlicensed mechanic so repairing vehicles is in my wheelhouse. I took an interest in all things automotive and have seen first hand the benefits of running quality lubricants like Amsoil. It always returned good wear rates, extended oil change intervals and clean engine internals so I just kept using it.

@CedroCron

Ай бұрын

@@LubricationExplained No i totally understand what you said in the video about it being Apple to Steak comparison and I can confirm it’s not the big numbers which is marketing hype but at the same time there is definitely a measurable increase in mileage in my testing trying to be as scientific as possible tracking it through fuel used driving the same patterns using the same ambient temperatures and all other variables I could control. I could also see the decrease in fuel consumption using the long term fuel trim data reported by the PCM. I use it because of extended oil change intervals and excellent engine cleanliness and wear rates but the fuel economy boost is just a bonus for me!

@georgeburns7251

Ай бұрын

Have you tried keeping a rabbit’s foot in your glove compartment. I believe this will also have a positive result

In real life, it is possible to get high gain because: - the manufacturer viscosity recommendation is too thin. Using correct oil viscosity will reduce engine friction a lot. - previous very low quality full synthetic oil (obviously without API logo) cause sludge and poor performance

Brak możliwości tłumaczenia na język polski. Czy możesz dodać język polski? Pozdrawiam z Polski

27% Work factor !!!!!!!!!!

Amsoil is a great motor oil. No doubt. BUT the price they charge is extravagant. Pennzoil Ultra, Valvoline Advanced & even Walmart's Super Tech & COSTCO's [Kirkland] brands are excelent synthetic oils. What truly matters is the miles you allow between changes.

Amsoil has allowed their marketing dept and greed take over their products. I changed over to Redline 8 years ago and will never go back to Amsoil.

@oneninerniner3427

Ай бұрын

Why what do you mean? Is Red Line cheaper after Phillips 66 bought them? It used to be an ester base. Esters are used primarily in jet engines and some race applications. It is hard on conventional seals, especially old ones I believe.

I use whatever is on sale at Costco and change every 5,000 km.

@HiTechOilCo

Ай бұрын

Use the cheapest oil possible in an engine worth thousands of dollars? What's wrong with that picture?

@oneninerniner3427

Ай бұрын

​@@HiTechOilCo 👍👍👍👍👍

The bottom line is, unless your a driving jet engine or a super car. Any proper grade& API oil will work just fine!!