"I want my bike to be an oasis of simplicity." Preach.

Some of the old Shimano derailleurs were available in both a low-normal and a high-normal version. The difference was in what direction the spring tension was applied. Rapid-Rise was the Shimano name for it IIRC.

Oasis of simplicity. 👍. Keep it coming pathless pedaled 🇬🇧🇬🇧

Good to hear that someone has been touring an is few as 6 speeds as I recently bought a mountain bike

I put a few hundred miles on their earlier Box Two-E 9-speed 11-50 drivetrain, and my overall experience basically mirrors yours. I love the lower maintenance of a 9-speed setup, and the wider gear jumps are great on a quick-accelerating ebike... until they aren't. Much like your experience, more than once I've found myself in the midst of a long climb that had me wishing I had another in-between gear in there somewhere. For ebike touring, I've drifted clear over to the opposite approach, with a Sunrace 11-speed cassette, the same Box Two-E 9-speed derailleur, and an Archer D1x electronic shifter to make it all play nice. When I'm done touring and back to high mileage flatland riding, I'll probably give Box's new 8-speed 11-42 cassette a try on my setup.

I think the actually range between gears is more important than the number of gears. Maybe in a racing situation you want to optimize it to your cadence and the terrain, but for general riding and maybe touring, having a nice wide range of fewer gears will work just fine. Over many years of riding, i've come to the conclusion that I only wear out 3 cogs on the cassette by the time i need to replace it which means i would get by just fine with maybe just 5-6 gears.

If my cadence is out, the bike usually slows down quick enough to "fix it".

@juniorcastiel952

3 жыл бұрын

i know I am kind of off topic but do anybody know a good place to watch new tv shows online ?

A stronger DR spring will help overcome any extra friction in the cable housing. It's the same principle as strong springs on old brakes.

awesome video as always btw ;) 11-50 in 9 speeds is ludicrous range. I sometimes wish for in-between gears on my 11-46t 11-speed. Still, if you need to get up and over the hill fully loaded and aren't in a hurry, 454% range is sure handy.

Here is an idea for your Cave of Bad Ideas. Box Components Prime 9 cassette with a triple chainring. Long ago 3x9 drivetrains were pretty common...

Excellent video as always. Cadence becomes more important as age, injury and arthritis take their toll. My knees like certain range of cadence and effort and readily let me know it. Thanks again for another great video

Thanks for this review. As someone who shifts 2+ gears every 90+% of the time I change gears on a more standard drivetrain, and who lives in a city where a mere 20% grade doesn't even make the top dozen steepest climbs, I was already leaning pretty heavily towards getting one of these in a year or three when I finish scraping the funds together for a custom build. But it's super helpful to know that they are questionable on drop bars.

@kevinjfeeney77

4 жыл бұрын

Microshift's Advent RD works with all their Advent line shifters... including their road drop brifters.. (left side you can pick between brake only or brake and dropper post remote)

I used to do friction shifting almost exclusively but I always do indexed on my gravel bike just because the elevation and grades can change so quickly. I wouldn't want to shift a friction shifter when the drivetrain is already under torque going up a hill.

I myself love 9speed own 3 bikes still rocking 9

I'm runnin on 3x8 in a gravel cro-mo bike. (30/39/50 x 11/30) It's a pretty heavy ratio for the terrain here in São Paulo, Brasil. I often think about moving to 2x9 gears, since I'm more into a higher range. But here I can only find 11-40 sunrace cogs and that still look too short for me. Guess I'd still have to wait for those megarange cogs to arrive here. Thanks for the video. Your channel is amazing.

Thanks for this review, and comments below. The Jones LWB Complete Version 3, switched to this drivetrain. I've never heard of it. Considering the inception in 2019 of Box Components, and the drivetrain starting out as e-Bike centric, I'm in "Run Away" mode. Happy trails!

ive recently built a gravel bike frame up with an old deore 9 speed deraillleur, tiagra brifters from the same bike, and an 11-40 cassette from ztto on aliexpress. its all working well together - and with a 40t chainring the setup has the same range as shimano grx. 9 speeds seems more than plenty to me!

I like it! I ride true retrogrouch: 7-speed! 2x7 (52 & 48? on the front, no idea on the back) on my '85 Cannondale zipper, and (50/48?46?) half-step-and-a-(28 tooth)granny with an 11-34 Shimano 'mega-range'-type rear cassette. Also: friction only, forever. I love the idea of a friction 1x (wide-range) 9. I hope you can get this to work satisfactorily!

Thanks for posting a review on this! I was intrigued when I first saw the wide range 9 from Box on Seth’s bike hacks channel. I think it would work well for my 15’ Honzo bikepacking/trail bike. It’s got a 1x10 right now and sometimes feel like 10 is too many when I constantly dumping 2-3 gears at a time. Which is also something to mention, the Box trigger shifters have different options in terms of how many shifts per throw, dependent on which level (1,2, or 3) I think, among other features.

Great, critical review. A thought apart: Biggest disadvantage of friction and/or thump shifters for me personally was the strain on my thump joints. Esp. longer rides led me to switch to STIs and I never looked back. Thanks to hanger extenders and gadgets like the Wolftooth Tanpan there are no real drawbacks for me. Still no existential need for wireless electronics... 😉

The other day I experiemented with my Soma Wolverine for a quick 1x10 conversion when a SS setup was not desirable. I put a late 80's Shimano downtube friction shifter from an old road bike on my downtube boss coupled with a Sram GX 10 speed MTB clutch derailleur with a 10 speed cassette and I thought it felt beautiful in the stand. Shifting was smooth and effortless and the shifter had no problem holding the extra heavy spring unlike in your video where you were moving the shifter and it was tring to move back. And because the Sram derailleur had a 1.3 (?) pull ratio this gave me more margin for error with a friction shifter and once I shifted it enough up and down in the stand I got a feel for it and trimming was negligible. That derailleur in this video must have a car coil spring in it! Seriously experiment with another derailleur and maybe get a downtube clamp for downtube shifters and try that. Velo Orange makes one that has a larger barrel for less pull and a ratchet mechanism. But my old Shimano Silver Arrow shifters did 10 speed with a Sram derailleur beautifully.

Thanks for doing that so I didn’t have to, I already have the Box two cassette 11/46 on my Cannondale SuperX with SRAM Force long cage derailleur and it works great so I had considered the new prime 9 for my Salsa Journeyman but now I’ll let you get it all sorted out before I decide.

On the shifting force issue, I have assembled an unusual 1x9 setup. I'm using an old XT rapid rise mech (sprung the opposite way) and I've mounted a suntour front friction shifter to a hacked up SRAM road lever, so the shifer still works in the same direction as a normal mech but the spring helps you going up to larger sprockets. It's not without its issues still but it does make swiping for lower gears much easier, you can dump the whole block in a single swipe. Plus it tick's several "retro" boxes the mech is probably knocking on for 20 years old, the shifter is probably well over 30...

9-speed is the best drivetrain for 1bys, no cross-chain issues and clicking sounds from chain rub.

I've tried all the Shimano MTB groupsets from 7-12 speed, and have concluded that dual-control XTR x9 was the best groupset that Shimano ever sold (both 2x9 and 3x9 work fine) -- I've been nabbing these NOS on Ebay and converting all my bikes! Dual-control shifting is so much easier on my thumbs, which can simply focus on gripping. Shifts are flawless, and the system doesn't go out of whack so easily as the 11x and 12x I've ridden. Needless to say, 3x9 gives a huge range of gears, and with dual-control it's seamless to drop a front ring as you're just starting to hammer a steep climb. One key benefit is that through 9x all Shimano cable pull was identical, so you can mix/match pretty much anything that you want and it will simply work, even choosing cool features like 'rapid rise', all with no fuss!

My steel adventure bike came with Sora components. 11-34 cassette and you can go up to 11-36. Crankset comes from FSA and is a Vero 48/32. It seems that you can go to 46/30. Unfortunately FSA is not as easy to get in Germany. Unfortunately one chainring is bend and replacement is not available immediately. One shop says over 15 weeks 🤨

Looks awesome. I love a thumb shifter on a drop bar.

Love your stuff man thanks

I'm sure bar end shifters been brought up, but I second (or 15th) that. Love to see another video with your different shifting solutions!

@charlesdostale508

4 жыл бұрын

V Garner or downtube shifters, the position of those gives great leverage shifting to larger cogs. Some of the Huret levers were extra long for even more leverage.

Thanks so much! This is exactly the quirky set-up that sits between my current super retro-grouch set-up with DT shifters, Triple up front and 6!!! in the back and going with a super modern set-up. I don't know mullets very well. Could this Box set work with a double up front? Not sure why I would avoid the single ring up front, but it might help with closer ratios? I really like making things simpler and I love this type of approach.

I still love riding my 1 x 8 with down tube friction shifters. Simple and reliable.

Russ, I know I'm a little late to the party and I didn't read through all 200+ comments so I apologize if this has already been brought up. You may be able to adjust the clutch and/or the spring tension. Both are adjustable on shimano derailleurs.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Yes its been brought up. No you cannot adjust the clutch on the Box 2 derailleur.

Great work! I'm pretty happy with my box 9 setup. I'd say if you have a bar-end mount for the microshift, that works pretty well. You get to use your whole arm to get into the larger gears. I attributed the stiffness in climbing into the larger gears to the spring. I'm curious what makes you say it is the clutch that adds friction? Not sure I'm right so I'd like to hear your opinion. I'll add that I tried a Microshift shifter designed for a 3x9 speed shimano/sram derailleur and it did not work. There was not enough throw, so I could only get it into the 7/8th gear, and the indexing wouldn't match up past the second gear. I'd say a 9 speed brifter designed for sram/shimano most likely won't work.

Sounds like a pretty good work out! Did you ever make a vid about your dynamo light set-up?

I wonder if installing the shifter on the left side of the bars would even out forearm stress. The right hand/arm does most of the work in braking and all of the work in shifting with 1x setups assuming your rear brake is also on the right side.

Well, it’s specifically meant for MTB trail/enduro/freeride where frequent sudden climbs and descents wreak havoc on 1x12 chains being dumped up and down the cassette three cogs at a time. XCO, CX, Gravel, and Road cycling are vastly different in terms of how the drive train is engaged. There’s no one drive train for everyone.

Oasis of simplicity!

I think 8 speed was also an option which I was checking out for a commuter rebuild of an old frame. Didn't need to though. Hg never die.

I mostly run a 1x10 with friction thumb shifters, I tend to turn off the clutches on the mostly XT derailleurs. I also run ovals & very rarely drop a chain.

@highwayvagabonds474

4 жыл бұрын

I'm running the new GRX and keep the clutch turned off as well. It's STUPID tight and I can't hardly shift it with it turned on!!

I just got 7 soeed Vitus dee 2021 and is enough gears for local gravel routes the tourney 7 speed does excelent job

try the IRD power ratchtet levers. I use them matched with Shimano 9 speed Ultegra barons. No problem with shifting gears, but it might be mostly about the derailleur.

I still run 9 speed XT on most of my bikes. (3*9, but it works!!!!)

Maybe you need one of those old school Schwinn Stingray stick shifts on the top tube!

I would love to see if it would work with a bar end shifter better. The Box drivetrain is one I was considering for a gravel build (or a 1x10 using the Sunrace 11-46t cassette with Shimano bits). I ride single speed a decent amount so I don't really care about cadence much.

They have an 11-42t as well. Smaller low gear, but slightly different range. Also, the box 3 & 4 derailleurs have a different clutch from the Box 2, which might offer a bit less resistance.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

box one is adjustable, and objectively the best system ever.

They make 11-40/42 8 speed cassettes now. I have learned that 10/11 speed clutch derailleurs will work fine with 8 speed chains and friction shifters. Try it out if you want! Nothing more retrogrouch than my 3x8 clutch mtb friction shift drivetrain. The only issue I have run into is the shifter not having enough cable pull, but there are work arounds.

I have 4 bikes running 9 speed Shimano but they are all 2x up front. I’m happy with it on all my bikes and have 11-36 on the gravel bike. I don’t think I would like 9 in 1x though.

First, it’s great to have an honest review. That leads to an obvious question. Considering the high quality of most components out there, why compromise? Sure, they may be more pedestrian, but MicroShift Advent or even Deore 1x10 are great, modestly-priced options. And, yeah... you can run them friction, if you want.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

There fine but no 50t.

I was about to go buy a 12 speed SRAM Cassette off marketplace but the box three groupset is currently 20 bucks more for a whole ass groupset including a chain.

So I’m slowly moving into the “gravel casual” phase of my riding... or maybe I’ve just always been there. What are your recommendations for shorts!

@nikveldkamp8630

4 жыл бұрын

Still a sucker for perfectly fitting bibshorts. Never mind the looks in others' faces, it's your bum having to feel fine. As a compromise: There is underwear with chamois pads out there.

Looking at this to replace a flogged out 3x8 drive train, I just don't want to go through the faff (and $$) of replacing everything on the handlebars :)

I have been watching Box prime 9 for a while and was chatting with BOX on their website, yeah, they could be 98% compatible with shimano 9 speed shift pods but ideal with their proprietary shift pod. I was trying to pry them to see if i could buy on the cheap without getting their pod.

Did you try adjusting the clutch mechanism on the derailleur? You could lighten it up a bit to require less force to shift? Also, Box has a clamp that will mount their indexed 9 speed shifter to drop bars.

Thanks for reviewing this. I've been eyeing the 1x9 Box two and the Microshift Advent for my MTB. But the Advent has both flat bar and drop bar sti shifters so I may get that. If you get the chance it would be great to see you review the Microshift Advent. I know you have a pair of cable actuated hydro calipers. I've been thinking of the Advent drivetrain with cable hydro brakes so I could easily swap between flats and drops on a MTB/montercross bike.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Tried the Advent in our Nicasio review. Worked great. Wish they had something larger than 42t.

the box 1 prime 9 has an adjustable clutch. MIne was tough at first too, but it broke in after a while

@PathLessPedaledTV

3 жыл бұрын

Box 2 does not have an adjustable clutch.

Interesting. My gravel bike is a light mountain bike so the placement of a Box shifter or ratchet type would not be a real issue. And two weird ice crashes this winter took out my old school triple. Following this topic.

Nice Review Russ! How do you think this 9speed compares to the MicroShift Advent 9speed that's on the Marin Nicasio+?

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

The Advent works great. This has better range but the shifting experience is compromised.

I am looking at a gravel bike now and its a 1x9 but its 11-36 with option of 38 or 40 up front. To go to the box i would definitely need a longer chain, But curious as to how the box works out for you.

I have a 3x9 on my tour bike and TBH a 2x would be enough for me as I rarely use the big chain ring, but that setup of 1x9 has much potential for me, there is much to say about its simplicity primarily fewer things to go wrong. When it comes time to replace components I will be changing, the question is 1x or 2x?? If I could afford it I would love to go to an 18 speed pinion and Gates belt bike.

The box one derailleur has an adjustable clutch. I wonder if getting that and turning down the clutch tension would help your friction shifting.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

I have a box one P9, it doesn't skip.

My bike is a 3x9 shimano on specialized stout 29er wheels with a bb52.

Currently i using 11-50t 10speed with 42t narrow wide chain ring.and it suit perfect for slow rider like me.i ride gravel bike but use as a touring bike,equipped with pannier and bag.work for me.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

What rear derailleur?

@knizama3534

4 жыл бұрын

@@PathLessPedaledTV i use sram gx, come with mechanical clutch..sram lever..and i rarely use the top 50t. I used carbon mtb rimset 700c 27witdh, to get light benefit while stable and robust for cary load.i use marin gestalt x10 bike.

Need some friendly advice. I'm thinking of turning my old Fuji fitness bike into something a bit more gravel friendly. It currently has a 2X Shimano Sora drivetrain. I want to go with Box Prime 2. But what of the crankset? The Fuji currently has the stock Shimano Sora, 50/34T. Any recommendations on what to switch to that will work nicely with the Box 2 Prime 9? Thanks! Or... nevermind Box 9, go with Microshift Advent???

Box One Prime 9 is listed as adjustable clutch might fix the problem but more $$$. I ride a deore 10s, narrow wide chain ring and microshift bar end shifter. Had to turn the clutch off otherwise i had the same problem . Haven't dropped a chain in two years with clutch off, but do get a little chain slap.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

“Adjustable” is relative. You have to take the dang thing apart to do it.

@krodhcs4393

4 жыл бұрын

I was wondering about that after looking at it thanks Russ. Would be a perfect budget wide range if it had a engagement switch.

@Path Less Pedaled, how does the spacing between cogs feel when shifting?

I wanted to ask, what kind of shifters do you normally use on your set up?? I have some bar ends, but I'm thinking of going to integrated shifters for my bike, just not sure if they'd be good for bikepacking/touring. I'm also bad on terminology haha. What's a brifter??

How many links did the box chain have? I guess it comes as the correct length?

Thinking on build a gravel bike. I use a fixed gear. 9 speed sounds like a thing from future for me

Do you know if the Specialized Hover Flare alloy handle bar accepts end shifters?

It's unfortunate it was delayed that much. Ended up going with Microshift on everything.

Would be awesome if you could get a microshift Advent and compare, then attempt to use box cassette with advent derailleur and brifter.

Wish I had enough money to get you to compare with the Microhift Advent

@Slow.Smooth

4 жыл бұрын

Advent is the truth. Dont fall for the hype.

Yeah I tried the box components e bike group set but had to send it back because its not fit for purpose 5 people had a go at setting/indexing it 3 of which were bike mechanics no joy and also damaged my bike..

Using 9 speed Deore 11-34 a with triple 46/36/26 on two different Surlys. Friction sift front and indexed rear. Huge gear range and as dependable as the sunrise. 60,000 miles on the two bikes. Can't understand the infatuation with 1X systems for touring/non racing gravel.

If I recall correctly SRAM never made 9 speed brifters as they entered the drop bar bike market with 10 speed Rival.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

They had 9 speed brifters.

I just tried the Box 3 with Shimano Tiagra Brifters, no go. No amount of adjustment could get it to travel more than 7 cogs.

Hope you could try a hacked 9 speed RD with clutch. I was browsing through the interwebs and saw a hacked 9 speed XT RD with a 10 speed XT lower cage (clutch and cage).

Did you consider the very similar Microshift Advent system? They do offer it with drop bar brifters!

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah but no 11-50.

Can you run a 2x stsytem with the box one group set

Fewer gears with a wider range friction shift setup is kinda similar to a single speeders mentality. Don't get me wrong you have gears, you can pedal at 30mph and still climb a 20 percent grade, but your cadence is based on the gear you're in, not the other way around. Also sometimes, because its hard to move the shifter when you're out of the saddle, you end up in a gear that wouldn't be ideal for the climb or downhill, but you make it work anyway. Personally I think this all makes you a better cyclist, you vary your cadence a lot more, you learn how to do crazy high rpm bmxer type sprints, as well as mash at low rpms.

i have the box two rear derailleur and 11-50 with shimano Sora 9-speed and it work great!

If you had a flat bar it would perfectly. I have had it on my fat bike for the past 2 years and have zero issues. I think if you get that adapter clamp and use it with their shifter you will probably find that it is a dream and the only issue you will probably have is the cadence issue.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

I used it with their adaptor. Still too stiff.

I wonder if that derailleur would work with mtb indexed shifters. I'd love to use this on my recumbent and convert it to 1x, but I don't want to give up my rapid fire shifters.

@jasonsebikes8716

4 жыл бұрын

Box has their own MTB trigger shifters that work with their derailleurs, but to my knowledge they're generally incompatible with existing Shimano/SRAM-compatible shifters.

@whitepawrolls

4 жыл бұрын

@@jasonsebikes8716 Well if the cassette is standard 9 speed spacing I'll just use what I have already. I'm rather fortunate my recumbent has a 2ndary tensioner on top of the derailleur, so I can use combinations normally not possible with shorter derailleurs.

Hey Russ, kind of related. I've got the 10 spd GRX brifters and rear derailleur. I could definitely use a cassette with wider range (currently have 11-34)to get up some of those climbs. Whats the 10 speed GRX capable of? Is an older 10 speed XT rear derailleur compatable with the brifters? so many questions.. Thanks!

@arifazhari7598

4 жыл бұрын

Hi, might give some advice. According to some articles the newer shimano Mountain and Road/Gravel aren't cross compatible except 9 speed and below.if you're using 10 spd GRX perhaps youcould use the 11 spd GRX because according to some articles and videos on KZread it works. Might want to check on that.

I work at an LBS and when people ask me if they should spend more money on a bigger speed drive train I ask them to keep track of all the speeds they use on an hr ride and 8/10 times they say 4 to five especially where we live.

@stormeporm

4 жыл бұрын

I have a saying that you only need 3 speed 1 for headwinds, 1 for no wind and 1 for tailwinds but I live in the Netherlands :)

Can't you adjust the clutch on box one derailleurs like on shimano ones? That would probably help with changing gears.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Yeah. But have the Box 2. Also adjustment is a PITA.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

box one is fully adjustable.

very relevant review for this channel: a product designed for utility and whose development is not necessarily driven by race or for tech's sake. You mentioned that the derailleur does not perfectly match with microshift, but is the gear spacing itself comparable to shimano and sram 9 speed cassettes? - for use with say a shimano 9-speed derailleur with a wolftooth. (btw from my memory, I think microshift wide range 9 speeds cassettes and derailleurs are proprietary and dont match shimano spacing or pull ratio so microshift might be an inadequate litmus)

@robertcoates2752

4 жыл бұрын

I doubt even with a WolfTooth part you could get a Shimano derailleur to work that seems like a bit stretch to go from 36t to 50t even with one of those links.

@CoreyHowardPowerHour

4 жыл бұрын

@@robertcoates2752 thanks for the clarification but not the point im trying to make. more interested in the gear spacing.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

@@CoreyHowardPowerHour box has so much literature on their drive trains available on their site, and the guys there are super nice and will answer questions all day.

Would the shifting issue be less of a problem (or no problem at all) if you opted for a flat bar with the Box 2 Prime 9 shifter? I just can't tell if the problem is the Box components or components from two different manufacturers that's preventing optimum performance.

@PathLessPedaledTV

9 ай бұрын

The box 2 shifter I tried was way too stiff. They’ve since adjusted the clutch on the 2 level derailleurs.

Would take your garbaruk setup over this for sure.

I'm running an 11-42, 9 speed cassette on my Hardtail mtb and it works fine most of the time, however there is one gap between the gears which is pretty akwardly big. I've found that the gap between the gear you need on flat terrain matter most. When climbing bigger gaps are not such a big issue. I'm actually running a non clutch derailleur and have suprisingly never dropped a chain on that bike. I guess it's due to a really good chainline and of course the narrow wide chainring. Maybe it would be worth a try to turn the clutch off to help with shifting?

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Can’t turn off the clutch on the Box.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

maybe learn to shift? and box one is adjustable.

Been wanting to put this on my Straggler. Currently have an old, beat up 10 speed Zee with a 11-42 casette. I like the "retro grouch" aspect of it 🤣👍 What online stores are these available on?

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Direct from Box.

@prancisfena

4 жыл бұрын

@@PathLessPedaledTV OH right. Will wait for all this COVID madness to settle before I order. I think this video was the last push i needed hahahaha

As usual, great review Russ. Thanks for going through all that headache to figure out what worked and didn't. 11-50 is CRAZY though! What's the industry's hang-up with 2-by drive trains these days? I guess I fall in the retro-grouch category. I'm running 36/22 up front and 11-36 9-speed in the rear, BOTH set up as friction (old DA 9-speed bar ends), and I can practically climb a wall with that gearing. I love it for the simplicity and really nothing can go wrong.

@kevinjfeeney77

4 жыл бұрын

@@cjohnson3836 the advent has a road brifters....and you can choose just brake or brake with dropper control.

@BangTheRocksTogether

4 жыл бұрын

Going to 1x costs you a pile of range. I'm getting old and I'm none too healthy, but I still want taller gears when I feel like it. I'll stick with 2x but I wouldn't mind being able to buy something better that Sora and cheaper than GRX without jugging parts. Without juggling parts too much. 3x is just a pain, though. I'm in the process of banishing my granny ring. Just not sure how yet.

@tve1964

4 жыл бұрын

​@@cjohnson3836 Thanks for a thorough and thoughtful reply. Yet I don't agree with you. People are highly influenced by marketing hype and they want what they think is cool or will make them faster. They seldom have the means to check wether it is better or not. Just one example: back only 6 or 7 years ago, one could not find good road tires above 25 mm. Road bike frames are able to fit 28 mm tires only since a few years back. "People" wanted narrow tires on their bikes because everyone starting from the industry said narrow tires have lower rolling resistance, needed to be pumped up above 8 bars etc. We now know it's completely untrue. 1 x drive trains are exactly the same. They are now considered THE thing to have. But the're simply not better suited to gravel! There is no reason that a gravel tire should be so large that one cannot fit a 2x drivetrain on a gravel bike. The technology works, it's actually lighter, more progressive, more range. I read all the time that 1x is simpler but it isn't! When you look at all what is needed to make 1x work! There are many people who were very quick to embrace 1x that now quietly return to 2x. Very few people dare to say it now but just wait; it'll come back as soon as efficient and light suspension systems will come to gravel bikes. That's just pure common sense. If one rides terrain that requires a size tire so big that a carbon frame cannot be built to accommodate it, then it's time to ride your MTB or buy a gravel bike with a suspension to keep the tire smaller, lighter, better on road etc. Just listen to Josh in the previous video if you don't believe me. He says it explicitly. When I say it, folks troll me, but when it's an "expert" (which he definitely is) it's got WAY more credibility. Vendors spend their marketing dollars not on on classic advertising anymore but on ways to spread messages that make folks believe the next big thing is *this* or *that*. It's called "influencers" for a good reason. It took Jan Heine and his no nonsense + scientific approach to change the course of this industry that had nothing else in mind than making people want "the next thing". To achieve this they make up arguments that looks like science but isn't (just plain "intuitivity" which they tried to justify as science ie "small tires have less rolling resistance"). And it worked because in the consumer society people don't buy what's best they buy what they THINK is best. Whether it really is seems an added bonus but not so important.

@scottlynch5804

4 жыл бұрын

@@cjohnson3836 Thanks for the great reply. Again, I may be squarely in the retro-grouch camp, but some of these tire widths, IMHO, are getting crazy. I run either a 2.0 for road/commuting/touring and a 2.2 for gravel/dirt. There has to be a huge compromise in efficiency with some of the wider width tires. Regarding my friction DA 9-speed bar end shifters, I'm running a flat (well, riser) bar with Paul's Thumbies. It suits me well and has been flawlessly reliable for many years. Again, I appreciate the thoughtful reply. Cheers! also @tve1964

@scottlynch5804

4 жыл бұрын

@@cjohnson3836 Haha! Great point! When I truly think about your comment, you're absolutely right. I shouldn't even begin to talk about efficiency. My rig is heavy, loaded down with racks and I carry way too much (not to mention I'm overweight) :-) I guess efficiency is for those who get paid to race.

It seems to me that the Oval ring is increasing the spring tension of the rear mech, something like twice during one full rotation of the pedals. While your pedaling and shifting, doesn't this increase the force needed to push the chain to the next cog? Also, why not just use a Shimano non-clutch rear mech? Yes you may get chain slap but, you could go back to using chain slap/chain stay protectors. You may also have the concern that you'll drop the chain at some point during bumpy rides but, a 10 speed chain on a narrow-wide chain ring would also help keep the chain on... right? asking for a friend.

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

1)Oval ring is not the problem. Have used it with other rear mechs in the past. 2) Because this is a video about the Box 9 group set not Shimano. Also the cassette is 11-50. What Shimano mech clears that and has room for a 9spd chain?

If i go from 11-36 to 11-42/44 both being 9 speed do i need a longer chain?

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

Yes.

I really like the wide range rear cassettes, but for long rides I get tired of not being able to tweak the cadence. I'd rather see a 2X. I really don't mind a front shift. I even had a bike with half step gearing once and it worked fine.

I do a 10 mile commute on a wide-ish range 1x7 speed. So, yeah

haven't seen the whole video yet, but yes of course 9 is plenty. People have been traveling all over the world in many less gears than 9. I've never yet had a bike with more than 9 gear cassettes.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

less movement is less wear on the chain and rail and cassette, less gears with more range just makes sense. and anyone crazy enough to go against the big two has my respect.

Would this make a good upgrade from a 3x9 budget commuter drivetrain? I’ve thought about making my commuter 1x but I always wonder if these wide range cassettes would work with my acera derailleur and Alivio shifter...

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

I personally think so.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

acera is a trash rail, it will not be able to go this wide.

Thumbs up for the excellent video as always, BUT, THUMBS DOWN ON THE BOX DRIVETRAIN. I was interested till I watched further. Too heavy, to limited. Russ I'm currently LOVING a XTR 11-40 cassette paired to GRX long cage derailure and Ultegra hydraulic brifters, running a Easton EC90SL crank, ceramic bottom bracket, and Absolute Black 44 tooth oval on my Cervelo C2!! Light, efficient, and tons of range. I did have a 40t on, but it's pretty flat in Oklahoma. I'll change based on needs. PS....I keep the clutch turned OFF on the GRX, can't hardly shift it with it turned on!

i have a question if i have a 9 speed derailleur that worked fine with 11-42 theeth will it be fine with a 11-50 9 speed cassette ? or do i need a different derailleur ?

@PathLessPedaledTV

4 жыл бұрын

No. That is a big jump.

@greedfox7842

4 жыл бұрын

box one is a better derailleur than anything you can find elsewhere.