Being somebody who is only recently getting into cycling as an adult, this sort of wide low double chainring setup is exactly what I've conceptually thought about and want to setup. Basically, just use as a 1x, with an extra super low climbing chainring. Thanks for pushing the more reasonable side of cycling friend :)

One day, about 30-40 years from now for most of you watching this channel, you will begin to realize why this is such a good idea. I’m 75 and it really doesn’t matter much here at my home in Florida, but when I travel to hilly states, I would appreciate some lower gear choices in a 2x. I could go to a 3x but a 2x geared for my ability would simplify things and save a few ounces.

Russ, this is why I love your channel. Well thought out practical solutions without trying to be NASA. Real world stuff, tried and tested with your own investment and your own legs. Thank You!

I ran a "mountain double" crankset (38/22) on my trail/all-mountain bike, and it worked great on almost every kind of terrain I encountered. The big ring was large enough to reach high speeds on flat ground or pedal comfortably on mild descents, and the small ring (combined with an 11-36 cassette) offered some very easy gears for climbing up steep gradients. This setup was kind of the extreme low end of wide-low gearing, but it was perfect for the type of riding I did at the time.

@johndef5075

2 жыл бұрын

22-36 low gear is like having a 32-51 1x low gear.

I have different views on the purpose behind the triple. For me it not only optimizes gearing range, but also (when used accordingly) optimizes chainline. If you only use the big front ring with the three smallest rear cogs, only use the small front ring with the three largest rear cogs, you avoid both overlap and save most riding for the middle chainring and middle cogs. Keep the chain parallel to the frame for longer life and fewer mis-shifts.

@deckyputra1281

2 жыл бұрын

Agree, i still use triple chainring on my MTB and Hybrid. Fun fact, in my country, its easier and cheaper to buy triple chainring MTB crank than dual chainring 😂 of course if you don't mind the look, weight and square taper BB 😁

@harlanjackson6112

2 жыл бұрын

@@deckyputra1281 I even use a triple on my favorite road bike. Which I have successfully done many century rides. Even the famous Death Ride, all 5 climbs, 3 different years. Triples rule. BTW, just curious. Which country are you in?

@stuartmcnamara9610

2 жыл бұрын

And, neatly you now have a 9 speed bike ! Mint.

@BrandonMeyer1641

2 жыл бұрын

I agree, I like the triple as well, but I think you can go a little further than that. Ur range is not that limited and 9 speed chains are cheap.

@harlanjackson6112

2 жыл бұрын

@@BrandonMeyer1641 You're right. With the road bike (10 spd rear) I shoot for 4 gears at each end before going to middle chainring. But my favorite MTB is 8 spd rear, where I shoot for 3 gears at each end. I find gear indicators helpful when trying to stick to this plan.

I'm in love with 9 speed system because of it's flexibility. You can combine any 9 speed cogs of any type of cassettes. You can have nice Shimano Sora drop bar shifters, nice steps and variation and still have triple chainrings. Also there is possibility to make some 14-52t cassette if you want lower gearing without sacrificing efficiency with some 9, 10 or 11t cogs. If you travel somewhere in remote area, you can slap any 9 speed rear derailleur and it will work (except very old dura-ace) also if you bend that thing that holds cable bolt of 6,7,8 or 10 speed derailleur, you can alter cable pull enough to get to next good bikeshop with having anywhere from 7 to 9 working gears.

@markachternaam5207

2 жыл бұрын

Agree, 9 speed is really good to work around with. Especially if you like to mix up MTB and road components. For Shimano parts I do feel there is quite a drop in build quality between 10 speed and 9 speed, which is a bit of a shame.

@analbumfromhell1842

2 жыл бұрын

@@markachternaam5207 But you can find old deore xt and tiagra rear derailleurs who have better materials and microshift have their rear derailleurs for 9 speed that are compatible with all 9 speed shifters.

@markachternaam5207

2 жыл бұрын

@@analbumfromhell1842 that’s true. Unfortunately it’s not only build quality, it is also spec. For example finding a Shimano 9 speed derailleur that supports a bigger sprocket than 36T is actually quite hard. Nonetheless, agree with your sentiment. 9 speed is cool, and probably easier to deal with for most.

@analbumfromhell1842

2 жыл бұрын

@@markachternaam5207 I was running shimano Sora that is only up to 32t with derailleur extender thingy in snowy winter months with 12t-42t 1x 42t setup and it was good together with 175mm long cranks it gave enough torque to plow through snow that was like 40cm+ deep. On a old USSR road bike with 700cx40 in the back and 29x2.00 in the front.

Fully agree. 2 x is the sweet spot for me, too. Personally I prefer the compact crankset layout 50/34 or 48/32, but the idea is the same and to my knowledge it never was out. Shimano's GRX offers just that. Or you just repurpose an old 5-arm 110mm BCD MTB crankset - there is all kind of rings available for this format.

@markifflander8508

2 жыл бұрын

But the larger ring as noted in the stream are not "shifting" outer rings. I will take a look at the shimano set you reference here. I would need an adapter for my FSA set up. Thanks

with my old 3x MTB I used to use the middle ring 95% of the time, then only drop down to the 24t small ring when things got really steep. So yeah I this wide low 2x idea.

@PathLessPedaledTV

2 жыл бұрын

That’s what I found too.

@Mark-f7o

2 жыл бұрын

I can relate to this.

@davidhall5015

2 жыл бұрын

That was the design of the half-step with granny gearing in my optinion .... that last shift to the small granny to keep the show moving up a steep hill and to the big one for down hills and tail winds

I’m a pretty competitive long distance cyclist (mostly Ironmans) and I figured out that if you are going over 27 mph, that’s a great time to coast and recover. You don’t need gears higher than that because you will be faster in the end if you use that time to rest for the next hill

@chrisE815

Жыл бұрын

Hmmmmmm food for thought

@ZenEndurance

Жыл бұрын

@@sirensynapse5603 Right. The power required to go from 27 to 28 mph is exponentially more than going from 14 to 15. Best off enjoying the 27 mph and having a drink and snack instead.

The mountain bike that we here in the Philippines could afford, a month's salary, is the 3x7. We are used to change the chainwheel every 2 or 3 gear changes in the freewheel. The oldies taught us that. So it is not necessarily a 21 speed but still a 7 speed, especially for the people who wishes to make their chains last the longest. The most affordable chains here is the DID worth $4.

@thepandaman

2 жыл бұрын

I'm curious, what would be considered the go-to chain lube there? You can pay as much for lubes as you do for a chain, if not more.

@200447859

2 жыл бұрын

@@thepandaman old folks 2T oil, used engine oil you ask your neighbor who drives a diesel public utility vehicle, Singer machine oil works great too. Basically what you have and what you can afford. The modern ceramic spray on stuff are usually for those who can afford it.

I've been running a 40/26 with an 11-42 10 speed run with microshift thumbies for touring, bikecamping etc for the last 6 years and its always been amazing at everything. I've been building a stash of mtb doubles since

@markifflander8508

2 жыл бұрын

How did you set that up the 40/26? I am looking for something very similar. Thanks

@bshean72

2 жыл бұрын

@@markifflander8508 it is the stock XT 2× crankset with a 10sp XT cassette using Wolftooth 16t at 42t giant cog. I've setup Advent 9 speed 11-42 with 38/26 on a 110 BCD triple converted to 2x with great success

Really was not expecting to see an IXF crankset on this channel. I've been running these for years and it's insanely good value.

Ive been using a 1x for two year and just recently switched to a 3x7 bike. And i honestly love it. I use all three chainrings way more than i thought i would. I think the key is really good shifting to be able to dance between all the gears.

Lots of us built our first "gravel grinder"s with MTB doubles. Running 38-24 ane 39-26. I have a grinder with an old carbon FSA triple MTB crank with a 38-26 and a pant guard or caps. Light, cheap with rings available in any size from 44 to 36 and 30 to 22 small rings. Glad to see you bringing attention to these options.

I did similar recently with my 26-36-46. I removed the 46 and changed the 26 to a 22. On my first tour with it right now and love it

I've ran the same exact crankset, and in Asia we have quite the range of options for chainrings specifcally for these XT-modelled triples! Not sure if they're available in the US. But we got a brand called Deckas, Really affordable too! Ixf Cranks + BB : $20 shipped Deckas Chainrings : $5 Shipped

@TheSpaceBrosShow

2 жыл бұрын

Duckas is available via aliexpress. Its more expensive than 5$ but its still a great deal compared to most US available rings

Fun fact: The IXF crankset is one of the most popular cranksets in the Philippines. Usually it's the go-to brand for cyclists who want to upgrade their bikes for the first time. I personally run it on my fully rigid mountain bike and my touring bike.

i have a 22/36 crank and i'm loving it.

I built my New Albion Drake flat bar on/off road adventure bike with an FSA carbon crank, 39/27, and Sram XD 10-42 in the back. With 650b X 2.1 tires, I have 17-106 gear inches. Bam. An XT 11sp rear mech shifts flawlessly without a wolftooth adapter.

I hope your right, that some one in the bike industry sees and starts making more wide-low cranksets. I took my old SR Apex crankset , 1/2 step granny with 86mm BCD, and turned into exactly what you described. I now have a 42-28 setup. Love it. I think taking old triples and ditching the high gear is the way to go.

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

Yup! I like old mtb triple cranks. 24 granny with a 42 tooth 1x chainring is my set up for loaded offroad bike packing. Maybe a chainring guard or a rock ring on there for extra rough trails. 11-36 cassette. No front derailleur. I get off, catch my breath, shift by hand. Party pace! I'll probably switch to 20/38 on a 94mm bcd crank when I move to Colorado. Ive got some of those old SRs. Where do you find rings for that oddball bcd? Mine's set up singlespeed.

@ehounshell

2 жыл бұрын

If the high ring is 44 i still want it. But otherwise I agree.

@robertwyland7770

2 жыл бұрын

@@rollinrat4850 found the 42 on ebay..., and the 28 in England brand new. Stronglight made/ makes a crank with the 86BCD

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

@@robertwyland7770 Stonglite still makes very nice stuff. My favorite looking cranks of all time are the old Model 93 'star' cranks. They're from the '70s, off an old Motobecane. Problem is old French parts are weird. They hardly work on anything else. The 93s still on my old fixed gear 'cross bike. My SRs are just a few years younger. Theyre on a grocery getter bike. I think I still have the middle and granny rings squirrel away somewhere.

You can run a 1x chainring for chain retention. Keep the granny on there for extra steep climbs. No 'need' for a front derailleur. Remember, PARTY PACE! Just get off, catch your breath, enjoy the views, smell the flowers! Move the chain down or back up by hand. Its not a big deal. Running sans front derailleur might force you to pedal a bit harder to avoid stopping. You can also use a cassette with narrower range and smaller gaps for better cadence control. I like 24/38,40 or 42 chainrings, anything from 12-25 freewheels to 11-36 cassettes covers flat rides to big mountain, backcountry trails bikepacking. I run a couple 2x set ups this way and enjoy ultra low gears for overloaded climbing and high gears enough to pedal over 30mph. Faster descents than that I just coast and rest! PARTY PACE!

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

@@eggplant9277 I don't use front derailleur or a front shifter. You can't use a derailleur with a 1x chainring anyways. It doesn't make any sense. No offense, but You missed the entire point! Hear me out.... K. I. S. S. (Again, no offense!) Its a 1x! (Sort of) With a hand shifted granny! I use one friction shifter. Brifters suck! They're complex, they're prone to damage in a crash or dirt ingestion, they're like clockwork inside and very expensive to replace. Once damaged, or worn, they are next to impossible to service. Ever get a broken piece of cable stuck in a brifter? Its a pain in the ass! They break cables often. There is nothing simple about brifters in the least. They are job security for me, a mechanic. NEVER disassemble one unless you have lots of patience and perhaps an ME degree. Who would want to ride the hoods on two different shaped levers? That would be awkward I'd imagine. But to each, his own.... I got some used brifters for free. They were on my bike for one ride. Then I sold them.... Unreliable junk that can't handle an innocent little crash. Gravel bikes are dirt bikes. They get USED. A friction shifter still shifts fine WHEN (not if) you bend your hanger or bang up your derailleur and tweak it. Out in the middle of nowhere on a long ride. It keeps shifting fine until you tear the derailleur off the freakin frame or break the cable! Index shifting goes all haywire if anything is damaged just a little. The more gears you use, the worse it gets. A brifter is proprietary. It works with one derailleur and a specific number of gears. Making replacement parts an issue. A friction shifter works with any derailleur and any speed cassette. So if something breaks out on tour, you can 'jerry rig' with whatever is available out in some 3rd world country or almost anything found in a pile of old free junk. Been there, done that. My bikepacking bikes are designed around reliability and simplicity #1. Ease of the most minimal maintence. They'll tolerate abuse and even ignorance! Leave nothing to chance. Bikepacking and touring offroad is a rough and tumble world. It's dirty and we're fun hogs who ignore our junk! Shit definately always happens! I ride in places with no cell service or help for days. Walking out nor that call of shame are an option! Been there, done that too. I learn from my mistakes! I wish to meet my grandchildren one day!! Friction shifters never die! Mine are all 30 years old or so. I use either a bar end or thumbie of some sort. Even a downtube shifter could be used for the shortest possible cable. That would give ultra precise, quick shifting. Friction shifting is also an option on some indexed bar end shifters, thumbies or downtube shifters. So you can have the clicky bits, but switch to friction if needed. My Sun Tour is a really old 7 speed indexed thumb shifter. My bar ends are worn out 9 speed Dura Ace. The indexing stopped working a few years ago. I use anything from a 6 speed freewheel on a really old vintage wheel to 10 speed cassettes on more modern wheels. Ive got lots of wheels. I build custom wheels as a business. I'm also a pro mechanic. I can have all the newest gear at cost. I want none of it because it doesn't last. New bike junk is a poor value. Bikes are supposed to be simple. Its also supposed to be a'green sport'!! Brifters last maybe 10 years if you're lucky and never crash. Riding serious technical terrain on top of the hoods on a serious dirt ridden rigid bike is just a bad idea anyways. In rough terrain, it's a good way to crash and go over the bars. Your weight is up too high and over the front end For my latest bikepacker monster cross 29er, I took a sweet vintage Sun Tour XC Pro left thumb shifter, modified the clamp and mounted it right under the hoods on my dirt drops h'bar. I use a very high stem, so I can ride in the hooks most always, just like dirt drops are designed to be ridden. Riding in the hooks, your weight is more evenly distributed on both wheels, so you get much better traction and have a lower center of gravity. This is great for cornering and bike control. You have a much better grip on the bars for rough terrain. You can wrap your hands all around the bars! Your hands are in a more natural, powerful position than even an mtb and you can still put your hands on the hoods or tops of the bars to move around a bit and rest. Those positions are no a longer primary position. Theyre just for comfort and to change position a bit. The serious business happens in the hooks. Its what they're there for! I always ask people, why have hooks if you never use them? For vanity's sake? You're much more in control when your hands are in a neutral position where you can hold on for dear life! All this stuff makes a huge difference in how your bike handles and corners. Its a weight distribution thing. Most people have the wrong idea riding on drop bars. But it just requires a shift in thinking and a different stem. Getting that high stem is the key to using dirt drops. Lots of riders completely miss this. If you want to ride hard and spend lots of time on the bike, I can't stress simplicity and reliability enough. This is just my two cents and a bit more. I realize everyone can ride whatever and however they want. My particular usage may seem a little extreme, but my machinery is simple, practical and reliable. Bikes should be very simple machines! Its definately your money and your ride. I simply try to use logic and reason.

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

@@eggplant9277 Right on. Just get out there and ride. That's the important part. Ride what you've got until it dies. Then replace it with something else that gets you there!

its funny, I was watching this and thinking, "huh, 40/22 sounds familiar". my mountain bike is set up 2x10 with 40/22 and 11-36 with standard deore xt components from about 2012. I bet if you found a more mountain-specific front derailleur from the period it would shift just as awesome as mine does.

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

That's a great set up. I run 24/42 and same cassette. My rig has a 1x big ring for rough descents and a hand shifted granny. I don't use a front derailleur. I'll hammer the big ring as long as I possibly can, then get off, catch my breath and change gears. No biggy. This is party pace!

I run a triple but I think it's helped by the fact it's also on our tandem, so I'm just always in the mindset of using a triple when switching between the two. Can live in the big ring for rolling tarmac, dropping in and out of middle for climbs, and just stay in middle for gravel or hillier roads, and then have the granny for horrible climbs / tired legs. I know it's an antiquated way of thinking these days, but i like having a cheapo 9 speed cassette on the back with smallish range and small jumps, with the front providing the range.

Just swapped out GRX 46/31 with the White Industries G30 cranks and 26/42 VBC chainrings - works like a charm. Great set-up and I'm still using the GRX derailleurs with 11-speed cassette.

Great video. I have been using an early nineties Suntour Micro-Drive triple as a double on my '94 Bridgestone XO-3 for over 20 years. It is currently set up as a 30-42 with a 11-34 9speed cassette. As you point out Russ, this lets you stay in the big ring most of the time.

This seems like a great option! With others here I have generally run a 110/74 triple as a wide-low double. I’m sold on square taper so that limits what modern options I can get. Great video!

I never got rid of all my 5arm cranks, having turned them all into 2x, I use them in all my uses and I always tour on square tapers for dependability; worry free in world locales. In looking back you will find a multitude of solutions already banged out and working perfectly, and time proven. Thanks Russ for reminding and enlightening everybody!

Makes a lot of sense. Just went 1x this year, and although it simplifies maintenance, I’m afraid I won’t have enough climbing gear without big gaps in the middle rang where I ride most of the time. Thanks. Great option

I absolutely love this. I have a 3x9 currently, but I don't like my triple crankset for the same reasons you mentioned. With the lack of wide low cranksets, I was going to use a 46/30 with a wide range cassette, but now you have opened my eyes up to more options. Thank you Russ!

Excellent, Russ! I went down the 1x route too, and while it is okay for trail riding (still miss that instant dump onto a small chainring), 1x stinks for road/gravel/touring. I've been living with 3x for years, and still won't spend $$$ while I have a working 3x system, but I do long for a well designed 2x system. I think 26/40 x 11/42 would be just about perfect, even with 29x2.5 tires.

Had a 26-42 wide low on my 26er, worked like a dream. Sram x9 11-36t on griphift

I have been doing this is since 2012. I first ran a 44/30 using a triple as a double. I later Used an IXF crank to run 38/22 on 10 speed setup. Basically I find it best to have the big ring do 90-98% as if it was a 1x then have the small for hills or loaded riding. This is why it was called Dual Range (I think the late Sheldon Brown coined that name). I also run a 44/26 using a TA chain rings (50.4 bcd crank = TA/SunXcd/VO). Soma Fab now have a 94bcd crank to run46/30 too

I've realized I don't miss the 50x11 when I don't have it but I do use it on my gravel bike that has 700cx42mm - which is now basically my road bike these days. I'm really happy with the Velo Orange 46x30 I put on my 90s MTB.

Lots a good creative ideas here, trouble is always the front derailleur, lots don’t do well with bigger than about a 12 tooth jump and still be smoothish

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

Plenty of older clamp on derailleurs handle a 16t difference. You can even surpass the recommended spec if you know what you're doing. I will admit, front derailleurs are often very specific for odd shaped frames and uncommon mounts. Its often not as simple to find such a simple part. Some derailleurs are very specific, even proprietary to certain frames. We can thank the silly bike industry to make such a simple machine often so damned complicated.

you can do the same with a 110/74 BCD triple and rings from Specialités TA. smallest ring you can get is 24t. just mount a slightly wider square-taper BB and you're golden. chainguard in the outer position for aesthetics optional.

@skatetron1798

2 жыл бұрын

that looks like a triple ring with the big ring removed.. it is the first thing i thought.

@carlosgaspar8447

2 жыл бұрын

chainguard is not just aesthetics but helps to keep chain in place, shoe laces from getting caught, and the need to find shorter chain ring bolts now that the big ring is removed.

@ehounshell

2 жыл бұрын

@@carlosgaspar8447 good point.

@rollinrat4850

2 жыл бұрын

Instead of finding shorter bolts you can hacksaw off the bolt tabs of chainrings that bolt to the crank arms Then sand, grind or file them to match. Just use an old worn out chainring. You can also get thicker chainring guards that are known as 'rock rings'. They'll allow you to slam into and ride over pretty big rocks and logs. Ive even machined some of my own rock rings out of 7075 aluminum or Lexan (polycarbonate) A bulletproof plastic. You can even drill them out to save weight and look cool. You can also make a guard out of an old chainring or even two. Just use a belt sander to grind all the teeth off a worn out big ring. You might even be able to get a worn out ring from a shop. I hate waste. I love to repurpose things. Cycling is supposed to be a 'green sport'. Don't tell that to China making cheap junk out of sub par materials. Boycott Chinese products. There are (not so) common sense reasons you can buy it so damned cheap.

@Aubreykun

2 жыл бұрын

@@carlosgaspar8447 For the shoelace problem you can tie them behind the tongue and tuck the laces into the sides of the shoe. Some running shoes are shown in the product pages tied this way.

I think it's great that you're showing us some good options for wide gear ranges. Especially reasonably priced ones. But I'm personally really really happy with my GRX setup. It gives close to 100 gear inch range out of the box with really really nice shifting and no hunting around for odd parts. And it seems to hit my (ymmv) perfect sweet spot of gear range on my bike with my preferred 40mm tires.

I'm back to 2x. 3x range was great without needing huge expensive cassettes and bad chainline, but keeping the rings clean was a pain, and I'm kind of sensitivie to Q. Plus, it was easier to cross-chain to the point of it being a problem. 1x was easy, but chainline was awful and the cassettes are huge and crazy expensive. 2x lets me get the range I want, and good chainline in both ranges with reasonable cassettes. Another thing is that efficiency in big gears is better with big/big than with small/small. I can feel it on my "go fast" bikes.

You talk great sense for the majority of riders. I myself have arthritic knees, I am heavy and live in WV. The climbs are short and steep here. I have been messing with gearing trying to get the sweet spot and the 2X 10 speed does it. A GRX 30-46 with a 11-42 cassette on my Crosshairs. Gives me a nice range and I have to admit I lost some performance due to chain length. I installed a road link and run a 105 rear. This gets me up the climbs without standing since I cannot stand and pedal anymore because of the knees. You do good analysis for us that just enjoy riding.

I run Deore 10 speed - 11 to 36 rear and 38/28 front. Suits me very well but I guess would need a little lower for bikepacking etc. Cheers Russ, keeping it Party Pace 👍

Agree totally!!!! Been dealing with this for the past six months...no chainring selection. I have an '87 Rockhopper with an 11/42t 11 speed and am running a 44/28t front 104bcd. It does everything you say in your video. Be careful of the rear mech tho', was running a Shimano M5100 and the shifting wasn't horrible but it did have problems. Switched to the M5120 and all problems resolved! Keep up the good work!

@Temporalplace

Жыл бұрын

Does Origin8 Chainrings work with 11 speed chain and drivetrain ? I thought they are for 9 or max 10 speed chains

Spa cycles in UK sells a Super compact double by replacing outer ring of a triple with aluminium chain guard. They do many combinations (46/30, 44/28, 42/26, 40/24). New Albion do something similar with their 42/26.

Thanks so much for making this video. I love these wide/low cranksets, and I really don't understand nobody is making these. Your hack of that triple is supersmart, and relatively cheap. I still have one of those Alivo triple cranks, so I am going to try that out. My setup at the moment is a Ultegra 10 speed triple crank, with 39x26 chainrings. This works very well. I think the 22t inner chainring is way too small, a 26t or 28t inner ring makes more sense to me. Russ, thanks again for sharing!!

Totally agree. I'm a newbie and thought the same, even going so far as to ask my bike shop mechanic as well as posting a question on an adventure cycling bulletin board. I have a three on the front and wanted to get a wide two or even just a one and asked why not. The best that I got was a shrug, an "I dunno," or on the bulletin board, being talked down to with a condescending reply telling me that I don't know what I'm saying. Path Less Pedaled guy always tells it like it is with solid practical advice and solutions. Many thanks.

TA Spécialités from France have a 104BCD 40T & 42T option with their chinook 10/11-speed chainrings. Not sure about the availability over the pond, but they do exist. Have mixed a Sram road crank with an old 104/64BCD MTB spider, which share the Sram 3-bolt interface. Built it up with 42/26T rings. So basically a DIY, weight wheenie setup of your crank.

I love the idea of a Rene Herse-style super/subcompact, like you say, 40Tish-26Tish, and use it mostly in the big ring with a bailout option.

Setup a 3x crank 104 bcd to a 2x 44t 28t with 9 speed 11-40 cassette... cheaper chainrings, casette, crank, brifters, rds, chain, better durability due to better chainline, note that most of those i mentioned are wear and tear parts meant to be replaced after certain amount of use, so upkeep is low... i was able to tune the 3x fd to shift between the 2x chainrings... all in all, this is the most practical approach... thanks Russ for sharing this to more people...

3x has overlap, but it’s still the best in terms of lowest friction/less grinding/more silent drivetrains… and we’re talking 90’s steel mtb frames here, the weight penalty of a 3x is negligible… plus 3x just look right on these bikes 😁

@NotaRobot_gif

2 жыл бұрын

I like 3x. it's makes for a quick 3 speed for downhill/flat/uphill shifting.

My bikes: Salsa Vaya (tour) 40/22, 10-34 Salsa Fargo (rough tour) 36/22, 10-36 Otso Warakin (gravel) 38/26, 10-42 Kona Unit (rigid MTB) with 34/24, 10-42

Damn you! You've now got me thinking of converting my Campagnolo Record Triple into a 2x sub compact by grinding off the teeth of the 50T outer chain ring to create a chainguard.

I have several of those IXF cranks and like them as a cheap option for 1x and the 2x as in the video. One bent a crank arm when I caught a pedal on the side of a rut at a slow speed last year. Just a cautionary tale that they may not be the strongest crank out there.

@PathLessPedaledTV

2 жыл бұрын

Yes. That's why I show options and don't say you MUST buy the IXF.

I'm in the middle of a drivetrain replacement, swapping a 3-speed hub for a 1x11 configuration. I was initially keen on adding an extreme wide/low on the front, leaving the hub and brake on place. My shop talked me out of it, and I think he was right. Reasons were that 1x is less of a reliability/maintenance headache, that the price of the two conversion routes isn't vastly different, and that extremely wide ranges on the rear are now available. Ended up going with 38T on the front and 11-51 on the back. So a little short of a 40T at the top end, and not quite cargo-bike gears at the bottom. When it's done I'll take it on a short tour and ... see what happens!

@biercenator

3 ай бұрын

(That's not meant as an argument against your points in the video, BTW; I was just walking through my own flirtation with a wide/low crankset in this specific weird context.)

A triple is awesome when one is going down hill, or have a motor to where it allows a heavier gear to be used efficiently. However if you do not plan on adding a motor a wide-Low is better than a 1by as it saves the strain the entire crankset will need to go through on a by as there is no other option, but to be more out of alignment, and doesn’t’ provide what could be a piece of leg power/leverage a High/Low will give you without having to think do I need something custom, or search out if there even is available 60+ tooth in the back to get the highest high to the lowest low. Great vid, sir. I’m subbing.

I echo your comment about trying to find chain rings. I took a 3X crank set (Amazon 39.99) and dumped the small 22T ring and just run with the 44/32. Gives me everything I want in an area that is relatively flat but does have some inclines and very strong winds that make the 32T very useful. And yes, cycling industry, listen to us in the party pace crowd.

I just stumbled on this and I think it has pushed me over the edge to try 2x for an upcoming build. I mostly ride dirt, but I'm looking at a bike that can do dirt as well as gravel and pavement with touring loads. Your frank discussion of the benefits of gear range were super helpful in thinking about my use case. Thanks!

I did this on an old touring bike that I restored into a casual gravel cruiser. Originally it had a triple with something like 48-38-24 rings. I took off the 48t ring and put a 40t in the middle position (with shorter chainring bolts) with a 11-32t in the back. Great range, simple setup, and a cheap mod. Works fine with friction thumb shifters. The Q factor is a little wider and it doesn't look amazing (you can put a chainguard in the place of the big ring), but it works great. There are plenty of old triple cranksets out there with 110/74 bcd rings just waiting to be turned into super compact doubles.

I came to literally the exact same conclusion for my touring bike. I also had the same problem trying to find a 40 tooth chainring, so I'm running a 38/26 with an 11-42 in the back.

I've been running a 9 speed set up on my commuter/errand bike, a 28/44 crank rings with a 11-34 cassette. I also run a 10 speed drive train with a 30/46 and a 11-36 on another bike. My 11 speed set up has a 40 tooth chain ring with an 11-46 cassette on still another bike. I have an 11 speed 11-42 cassette and shifter that I am going to run with 34/46 chain rings. I like to have enough high gears to bomb down hills - I love speed! I like the wide range because there are a lot of hills in my area, and I am an old man.

Amazing!! As simple as taking a square axle 42-32-22 crankset, taking off that 32 chainring, and move the 42. Thanks!!

I run a 11-46 rear 11sp, with a 34/24 front. I think the 24 is perfect for the low gearing. I think that if I had to do it again I would have done a 36 or a 38 for the bigger chainring, and I probably will still move to it in the future.

@spektrumB

2 жыл бұрын

Agree for bike touring, I think a 38T, instead of 42T like Russ mentions, would be plenty. A 24 or 26T granny feels right for some big long climb.

@Ace-sv4tu

2 жыл бұрын

Can I ask what rear derailleur you use? I just got 36/26 chainrings to replace a 34t 1x setup, and would like to keep my 11-46 cassette but my derailleur has a max 11-42 when in 2x mode. Maybe just make sure I never crosschain, the only difference between the 11-42 and the 11-46 is the top end of the cassette

@teddgram

2 жыл бұрын

@@Ace-sv4tu Deore XT with a Goatlink.

@Ace-sv4tu

2 жыл бұрын

@@teddgram thanks mate, I’ve got the xt rear Mech too, but with no Goat link, have been trying it with the setup I described above, and it’s been good. Just wanted to see what you were using and if you had any issues. The 36 is sweet spot in my case, and the front shifting is super slick, might have something to do with sticking with the 10t difference

@johndef5075

2 жыл бұрын

24-46 low gear is like a 32-66? low gear. Imagine that cassette on a 1x😅

I’ve been using a gx 24/36 double for a few years without a front derailleur. It isn’t ideal ease performance but I just get off and put the chain down w my hand when I need the little 24 for a big climby zone.

I have the similar set up. 28/48 front 12-32rear. I have all the gears i need without all the problems that come with 1x. The peace of mind that comes with knowing that i have the easiest gear for me during climbs and still not losing the hardest gear for the road is so satisfying. Oh and one of the reasons people get BIG PLATE CHAINRING is to have the best chainline possible when you are in your fast cruising speed on the road, the difference between being in your last cog at the back vs being in a cog that is inline with your chainring when in fast cruising speed is worlds apart. At least for me that is one of the reasons i have that 48 and maybe get 50 in the future. And of course with big chainring you get the best fast cruising speed chainline and still have that last cog for the occasional/ fun/when boredom strike sprinting, because sprinting with a very fast cadence like spinning a small gear is not fun at all. 😂

I put my old mtb 3x9 drivetrain on my commuter and bikepacking bike as an upgrade to the old 3x7. I love it. For someone who likes cheap replacement parts and a massive range it's perfect

I have been running this setup for years, I had 40/25 and 36T cassette on my gravel bike - for two reasons I am old and I have big hills on my neighborhood fitness loop. Now I am even older and run 40/22 and 50T cassette on a full suspension recumbent trike. I need the extra gears because the trike weighs 50lbs - but rides like a Cadillac. Getting it to shift correctly was actual rocket science.😁

For a gravel build, I bought a deore m6000 triple that was 22-30-40 and simply removed the 22. Picked up a 28t ring in case I need more bottom end. Running a deore triple front derailleur which can handle 17 tooth gaps. 11-42 rear and a long cage XT der. On my backpacking bike I run a 24-34 double with a 11-50 in back for 14 low end gear inches and I definitely use the ultra granny in the high Rockies. I saw this crankset but with the need to buy rings, the Deore was about the same price. Plus Shimano.

On my MTB I have 11-36 10 speed and 28-40 on the front. Works great. Plus cassettes and chains are cheap and available!

@johndef5075

2 жыл бұрын

I have the same rear set but a 32-22 front. Gives my old legs a nice low gear plus the tight ratios. Low gear same as a 1x with a 51 tooth cassette. If I use my 11-42 cassette I have the same as a 61 tooth 1x!

I cannot believe you just posted this. I am looking for exactly this. I currently run a 46/30 FSA 30mm megaevo crankset. After tons of research (for touring and bike packing) I concluded that a 28x42 double with a 11-36 rear cassette 9 speed would be near perfect. I could not find this double. I am yes, an older rider looking to still cycle tour. But even 10 -20 years ago, you do not use the 11-12 13, etc to the extend you use the upper gears if you are in the 80-90 cadence range. Thanks so much. I will take a look at your ideas and the other comments below.

Excellent 👌. I'm glad to see that others landed on this setup too. I learned about the 1/2 gear with a granny from Sheldon Brown's website. My bikepacking setup is the Amazon crank with a (22,38,42) and Microshift 9 speed Advent paired with a 11-36 Bibibike (Amazon) cassette. I'm totally in line with these ratios but just love the "Just right" the half gear offers (shifts really sweet too with the two large rings so close). I call it the "Alpine Zipper". Keep an eye out at your local COOP for chainrings and you can have hollowtech 2, a clutch, and sweet ratios for less than 300$!

I just love that old mtb you got there and love what you've done with it. All the best from Australia 👍

For some time I've been running the SRAM GX 2x11 setup on my bikepacking rig. The cranks have 38 and 24 chain rings and since I've switched to the SRAM XD drive, I'm running a 10-42 cassette, giving me almost exactly the range Russ is trying to achieve. This is, however, on a flat bar bike. There are some after market products, that I think Russ has previously covered, that would allow using drops and this group set. My SRAM GX has proven to be reliable and easy shifting after several years of heavy usage. This bike came with a 1x setup and I just didn't feel like it had the range I wanted for bikepacking. Enough low to grind up steep grades with a load. And enough high to spin along on long flats and downhills.

Sounds good to me! I'm 72 and hardly ever use the big ring on the front, all I want are some lower gears. I ride with my daughters up and down hills here in Beaverton, and they stay in one gear of the whole time. Meanwhile I'm using all the gears in low and middle and wishing for a lower one... I do pass them going down hills though.

Seems like Sugino is quietly making some options for wide/low gearing on the 24mm hollowtech spindle, which is encouraging, though it is nice that Shimano is offering the 46/30 GRX setup, too. Hopefully in not to much time, there will be lots more replacement rings popping up for these setups!

Thank you so much for promoting low gear options. They really are better for the vast majority of normal, non-competitive cyclists.

I’ve been building ebikes with 48T chain rings, but love these videos! You remind me it’s ok to slow my roll.

I live in a pure flat area, I usually try to do just like you for a very occasional climb (once/twice a year on this bike), I don't even put front derailleur on, I do change front gear pure manually （use my hand and a leaf). That really works. And even I use a regularly chain ring (non-narrow wide), also no problem on lose chain.

i have 3 bikes all with triple, def tend to stay in the big ring...but im more of a masher than a spinner. Yet I have learned the middle ring is more for the spinners and at the end of the day spinners are more efficient and cause less long term leg tiredness. The 22t is just for going zen on a climb on a steep climb which I love to do, when its long and steep. Gotta love the leverage.

Surprisingly i came to the same conclusion after a 3k km tour through europe. I used 26-36-44 crankset, but i kept oscilating between the 2 big rings, and found that i actually need a chainring exactly in the middle = 40. It can be converted from 104+64 bcd triple, i ordered a shimano 40t 104bcd. Your suggestion of converting 96+64 bcd triple (22-30-40) is even better, because one only needs to buy the 26t chainring which is usually much cheaper than the 40t.

I use a 11 to 20 tooth rear cassete with 5 sprockets mounted on the outside of a shimano 7 speed freehub body and a 20 and 44 tooth dual chainring. I therefore get everything from a 1:1 to a 4:1 ratio with no superfluous overlapping duplicated gears. It's light and has worked perfectly for 3 years now. I cycle about 80 miles per week on average.

Russ. You rock man! Your channel stands apart, above, unique in the YTube realm. Love it!

I love my triple ring for my touring bike. I don't use the big often but when I need it I have it

For me the analysis goes thus: 1. 1x systems have too small a range. Therefore a front derailleur is necessary. 2. Once you have a front derailleur you might as well have three rings to have a good range while avoiding huge steps. 3. if you have a 2:1 ratio big/small at the front, a 3:1 ratio at the rear is enought to give a 6 ratio overall. 11:34 does that without an extreme derailleur. 4. As per another post you use the big and small chainrings only with the 3 extreme cogs, so keeping chainline straightish. 5. 9 speeds at the rear is a good number. 9 speed gear is easy to find. 3x9 triples are the sweet spot for me. Inexpensive with easy to get parts, and easy to use. So good it is very hard to improve upon.

Running a 44/30 now on a Sugino crankset, and it's awesome. Perfect mate for me with an 11-34 cassette. I'm sur la plate for the entire ride except for the steep climbs, which is where the 30T chainring comes into play.

Wholeheartediy agree. Just converted my road bike to the IRD 5 bolt(96bcd)46×30. Perfect for almost everything and keeps the q narrow like a proper roadbike. Soma sells the ird stuff. Highly recommended

@sadhu6740

2 жыл бұрын

Oops, didn't mean to sound roadieccentric. It's just what I've been riding lately. Grew up riding the 80s 90s mtbs and still consider the bridgestone XO a wonderful thing

I also realized that triple chainrings bring little to the table (mechanically speaking) and just add more weight. My current ride is a steel fast touring bike with an older 2x9 setup. I don't need extreme high or low gears for my style of riding, so that helps. My current setup is a Shimano 500LX square taper crankset, alloy 46t and 33t chainrings, and a 9 speed 11-36t cassette at the rear. It's super reliable and lightweight. To top it off, I swapped out the indexed front shifter for an old Deore DX thumbie which allows infinite adjustability. I love it.

@-RM-

2 жыл бұрын

Forgot to add: my bike is the flat black 58cm Handsome Devil on Pedal Room (with swept back bars).

At least a year of running a 2x10 22/32;11-46......geared for low and slow, definitely not for the Sat afternoon 20 mile group ride......used up 3 chains in the meantime....hill and mountain terrain....100km/60mi is a good day and 200km/120 is a super good day. I get more out of this video the more I ride.👍👍Party Pace

on my Trek 520: Sugino XD triple crank, 44 t in the middle position, 28 t in the small position. 11-36 in the rear, 10 speed, works great.

After two years of tweaking I've ended up on a 40/22 with custom 12-28 cassette. 10sp cassette is 12,14,15,16,17,18,19,21,24,28. Love the spread of 1t jumps when on the flats and slight inclines. Similar to what U mentioned, I dump it into the small ring when finding something steep to hit. Crank is the Easton EA with the narrow Q, with RaceFace cinch spider and TA Chinook 2x rings. 10sp Sram road shifters with Sram mtb EA derailleurs plus clutch. Can always tweak the low end of the cassette if required.

Currently riding a triple and looking forward to my next build being a wide low set up! Thank you for the information and sharing !

On my 29er MTB I've converted a triple 22-32-42 to a 22-36 double plus a bash ring. In the rear 8-speed 11-32 (11-13-15-18-21-24-28-32). There is no terrain I can't cover, 99% of the time I'm on the 36 tooth ring but it's nice to have the 22 tooth for bigger hills. With a triple I found myself shifting too much between the middle and big ring. Although I have a retro 26er MTB with a triple and it's fine.

Oh dang, I remember that mountain double video! Gravel cycling has come a long way for sure.

Yes, and a wide range double can use a narrow spindle for closer pedal spacing, If one wants.

Stronglight 100lx 42 / 28 was there like 30 years ago. Great content! Thank you so much!

Thank you for this encouragement. Mine is a diy project. 38-19

Big IXF fan here, incredible value for money.

This! One million times. I recently built my custom touring/gravel/monster cross bike using a Surly Ogre frame (73mm bottom bracket) and the biggest annoyance has been settling with 38-26 MTB front chainrings. I've been searching for 40 or 42 large chainring options for forever but haven't found anything I'd actually really want to try.

Absolutly agree, I run a 39/26 in front and a (I think) 11/42 10 Speed in the back... enough speed on flat and more than enough for really steep climbs .....

I have a similar setup: 2x9 geared road bike with 50+34 teeth chain wheel. Perfect for city and touring.

I've been contemplating an index shifter for the rear with a friction shifter double on the front for a touring bike. Still prefer a 1x for rough gravel / light mtb. But I think a touring could beneficent from a friction / index double.

@ehounshell

2 жыл бұрын

Totes. Friction for the FD is better.

@ForeverDownByLaw

2 жыл бұрын

My revived 85 Nishiki is setup with an index rear, friction front. Works perfectly and simplifies things a bunch. Even my Masi Giramoto came with an indexed 10 speed and a triple friction. It's a joy to shift and far less fiddly than a indexed front.

Once you mentioned gear inches, I was waiting for the Eddie Merckx reference, and was not disappointed.

I set up a 28-48 front rings with a 11-42 rear. On 26 x 2.2 maxis ikons. Great range and shifts decent up front.

Agree. This is pretty much what I run. Specialties TA make lots of chainrings that work for this. They are a French company I think