This is just reminding me of the Heavensward days when DRK first came out and everyone was rushing to play it..... including those who had no business tanking. Will never forget that brayflox run where i had a fresh DRK tank in level 12 dps gear while i was trying out AST....

@XTheBlackSoulX

2 жыл бұрын

You're a nicer person than me, I wouldn't have even tried.

@RangerRobin0404

2 жыл бұрын

When I'm struggling to heal a paper tank, I examine them to make sure it's not me. If they want to meme with low level gear or no Job Crystal: I'm out. It's faster to wait in cue than carry someone who obviously isn't trying to learn.

@cattysplat

2 жыл бұрын

Did they not start the class with gear? It starts with a full green set atm.

@InarusLynx

2 жыл бұрын

Oof

@akritos546

2 жыл бұрын

@@cattysplat back then they just gave you the weapon and a piece or two of armor if memory serves. I directed the guy to a vendor to buy some tank gear from after the run. I'm not sure if he took my advice or not. The whole thing was kind of a blur beyond the internal screaming of seeing 75% of his hp get sneezed off every time i blinked (give or take some hyperbole).

Never had any issue healing DRK or playing. Unfortunately one thing you notice when you start playing both roles is how often in these situations its just either the tank or healer is bad and they’re blaming the other one. Met too many Tanks as a healer who dont pop mitigation then flame me for not healing. Also met many Healers who flame me for going too fast as a Tank when all they do is spam cure one and dont seem to have regen even attached to their hotbar.

@crittomato7043

Ай бұрын

I had this one Tank who on search info had German marked, so I said in German during mid dungeon via google "use mitis" since they rarely used any mitis during mob pulls nor even bosses, i didnt know if there is a autotranslation version of it in game, but they ended up using few mitis in the end at least

I've noticed a few DRKs not using oblation, or at least fairly infrequently, and it certainly makes healing them tougher, but never insurmountable. I don't think I've wiped a dungeon tanking as a DRK either, but I've had more close calls than the other 3. It's a lot like ShB scholar to me; it's far from bad but the effort to efficiency ratio is notably higher, so low skilled players stand out moreso than other jobs.

@romdog1818

2 жыл бұрын

Probably due to Oblation feeling like half of a skill, and not at all fun to press. ...And it isnt the only skill like that on DRK.

@irogt

2 жыл бұрын

I healed a dark knight who would swap between oblation and tbn. Those were the only 2 they'd use. When we got to the first boss and I had a moment, I had to demand more CDs. Also, in what world are those supposed to be used seperately? Also, in what world are those the only things used in W2W pulls? Also ran into a War who only used Bloodwhetting on bosses.

@scottishboy112

2 жыл бұрын

I’ll certainly admit to forgetting Oblation. Then again, I don’t tank in dungeons with other people often. It’s only recently that I’ve started doing Experts with DRK. I do big pulls but I’m a novice at tanking pretty much. Only had 1 death where I’ll admit, I could’ve done a little more and not forgot Oblation but the Healer admitted to making a mistake too. But... DRK is fun in dungeons, it’s not as safe and so feels more fun to play.

@danielmantell8751

2 жыл бұрын

@@romdog1818 Super true, like we we need 2 more off GCDs just to get 1 skill. It's filler, but the rotation is already filled up.

@andrewtimothy9792

2 жыл бұрын

The thing is, is DRK that "weak" in dungeons? Not really, its "ok". But just because it's "ok". Doesnt mean that it should only stop at "ok". And im not saying it should be as ridiculous as warrior. Paladin (not counting clemency) imo has pretty decent sustain from holy sheltron and holyspirit/circle. It wont really make the paladin becomes invincibile. In fact if you only depend on it, you will die. But it is enough sustain so that the healers wont have a rough time healing you

As a SCH main I don't see the problem at all. I just heal them. That being said I'll always take a Warrior over a Dark Knight any day in the week, since I don't have to heal Warriors, I can just keep dealing damage.

doing roulette, you'll see some bad tanks. When I was leveling my ast to 90, I've seen a war who used raw intuition every minute or so and nothing else. I had a hard time healing, but he did not die. I had to tell him that he was not using cool downs before he started using them. Another one is a pld who was allergic to holy sheltron for some reason, hardly used it even during bosses where they started using more cool downs. I can confidently say i'm good enough to keep almost any tank alive. A drk is harder to heal than the other three, but a crap tank, no matter the job, is the hardest.

@johernandez266

2 жыл бұрын

I love holy sheltron.. wish it had no cd. Main reason I have PLD.

@bionicoath8651

2 жыл бұрын

As a warrior main, I'm so sorry you had to deal with that kind of axe user. They're no brethren of mine. We cool down for days!

@msking9553

2 жыл бұрын

If your a WHM... im sorry in advance but i dont use my CD besides shelltron/raw instituiton/heart of stone/TBN until you cast 2 holy gcd ;) , only after that 2 holy i start rolling cds

@cormeaga

2 жыл бұрын

@@bionicoath8651 At the very least, he started to use his cool downs after the first boss, so the rest of the run was smooth.

@cormeaga

2 жыл бұрын

@@msking9553 I'm an ast main. Those were not even the worst of the tanks. There was this dark who didn't use much beyond TBN and when we got to the first boss, he purposely ran into Mouth Off. I rescued him from it only for him to run back into it, and no, he wasn't using TBN. When I called him out on that he said "Dude shut up". So, one of the dps initiated a kick, we had him replaced with a much better WAR.

If you want to survive dungeons as Dark Knight, just combine a big mit with tbn, burst the mobs with your aoe, saving 3k mana and pop oblation then a new tbn when your big mitigation runs out. Hold abyssal drain in case you need it. Always use oblation then tbn after big mits run out. If there's still too much, combine reprisal with arms length after oblation runs out. if there's still too many mobs to handle after all that your group dps is bad.

@celuiquipeut6527

2 жыл бұрын

Then when you realise your group dps is bad you pop Living dead, bloodweapons, and you pray your Healer can top you off.

@eternalinsignia

2 жыл бұрын

@Celui Quipeut funny thing, I don't ming because LD on dungeon is the last CD for DRK. If you force DRK to LD, then your party sucks (really rare they use it out of the blue before their all defensive CD gone). That is all.

@ZeroScope100

2 жыл бұрын

Yup, this is exactly what I do as DRK and dungeon pulls have been a breeze for me.

@Ntwolf1220

2 жыл бұрын

*equips sword and shield instead* That’s a lot more buttons than pressing holy sheltron and rampart

@Rycotta

2 жыл бұрын

Honestly took the words out of my mouth. This is really the basic idea on how to use drk in dungeons.

i pull wall to wall as dark knight and everything going smooth with all type of healers

as someone who plays all 4 tanks, DRK have effectively like half as many % damage reduction cooldowns as all the other tanks since they have the magic reduction CDs and almost nothing in dungeon trash pulls deals magic damage, and below 82 they dont have oblation either. the protection from TBN lasts roughly 2-3 seconds max in a wall to wall pull situation, often only 1 second, so although its up more often, its actually mitigating a lot less than say bloodwhetting or heart of corrundum, and doesnt provide the additional healing of those skills either. TBN mitigates 25% of your health bar, but in wall to wall situations something like bloodwhetting or heart is probably mitigating closer to 50-75% of a health bar over its duration. also apparently theres some fucky interactions between TBN and shield healers with TBN preventing shields from popping which is causing them to heal less. i dont play healers, so i cant weigh in there, but out of all the tanks ive played in a dungeon setting, DRK feels the squishiest by a mile and a half

The problem is DRKs (and to a lesser extent GNB) is that they're difficult to carry. A bad WAR unga bunga heals themselves. A bad PLD will smash Clemency. A bad DRK has 0 crutch to fall back on. If you have a bad DRK, you will absolutely know.

@soldierorsomething

2 жыл бұрын

Haha i guess they just have to invest heavily on tenacity since they already have the top damage :P

I've got DRK, WAR and GNB to cap and run dungeons on DRK everyday. DRK absolutely feels more squishy than every other tank by far. WAR and GNB I can pretty much pay go on autopilot. DRK I need to make sure my healer is awake and actually casting heals here and there.

@BlanchetFlaurian

2 жыл бұрын

I don't know if I encountered bad GNB players, but I have such a hard time maintaining them alive! I'm a main AST, but even when I play Sage or SCH they go low very quickly. I saw them using mitigations, and still I have to GCD heal constantly :( While when I play DRK the healer is DPSing a lot, or when I'm with a DRK I don't spend much time healing them (oGCD healing is sufficient). Is there any trick to know when playing GNB? I still have to play mine, I only unlocked the job recently.

Admittedly I'm not a great tank. I'm still learning DRK and ran a somewhat low level dungeon the other day (Stone Vigil) while a friend was leveling their MCH. We had a random SCH join us. While I am still learning an optimal mitigation and CD rotation, I was taking a LOT of damage from mobs and the heals just weren't coming. Died twice before we even hit the first boss. Again, not a great tank, but that seemed excessive even for my skill level. SCH went off in chat about using my CDs and then bounced. While we waited for a new healer, I reviewed the logs and saw that our SCH was relying entirely on Eos to heal me while they focused DPS. Not one heal skill was directed my way from the start to when they left. Dungeons, to me, have always been a partnership between the healer and the tank, and how well they work together to keep everyone alive determines how good the run is. Our new healer (another SCH, interestingly enough) popped in and we went the rest of the run without any deaths. Sometimes it's not entirely on the DRK and their skill level. Sometimes you're just a bad healer.

@mypurpletie

2 жыл бұрын

That first SCH you mentioned was either new to healing and relied too much on Eos, or he/she is just plain trash. The tank and healer need to work together to keep the rest of the team alive. It's especially true when it comes to a group of mobs, which will kill you faster than any boss.

@darkdeath5550

2 жыл бұрын

yeah, saw a SCH not use their mitigation at all, none of the increased healing, and another who only used physick at lvl 50 and did none of their class quests. I died, so much and relied on my soulstealer cure potency more than anything. which was baffling. there has been a strong of bad healers lately and new players not reading their class skills, never learning that healing takes prio when shit hits the fan. tho that problem gets worse when the tank and healer both suck and argue for the whole dungeon, or you get the "you pull it, you tank it," or "i set the pace, don't pull more mobs," like, mf, you a tank, pull the whole dungeon idgaf, it'll died all the same, you a warrior, you're good.

@metallicolor

Жыл бұрын

Dungeon mob around that lvl range hits hard tho

@rejeanthomas0324

Жыл бұрын

Hey im a sch main and I hate when other sch screw it up. I keep my parties topped up and shielded constantly so I can dps. But keeping everyone alive is the first priority. I don't see how others don't get it. Sry for your experience with that individual.

I play DRK on my alt primarily, people have been pretty fricken toxic toward me just because I play DRK and I play pretty well too, juggling mitigation and all but nope I'll get healers that just let me die to boss auto attacks, I've been griefed by some players and vote kicked, even been told in a normal raid not to MT or else I won't get healed, like WTF. I've reported the more egregious cases but seriously calm yo tits folks.

@aarongeorge4885

Жыл бұрын

DRK is ok in dungeons once you mitigate properly. The healers that were giving you shit probably didn’t know there kit.

Tanks got so busted in dungeons (except for DRK) that DRK is now considered hard, when its the same difficulty as before. But yeah in that new dungeon braindead meta we ended up with a balance problem. Eazy fix would be to reduce Abyssal Drain CD to 15 secs and remove its sharing to Carve and Split.

@Zibi21

2 жыл бұрын

Or have the shadows attacks heal you up, would also help a lot ^^

@dolphinboi-playmonsterranc9668

2 жыл бұрын

@@Zibi21 Or instead of putting up a shadow who doesn't do shit for you(You don't think about Shadow DPS) you could empower the character themselves, with a dark aura or some shit.

Did an 83 dungeon as SCH with DRK tank and some really really bad dps players (everyone was geared, BLM was lv90(!), I was still top dps), and it's a real struggle. The DRK died on the final pull because both of us were out of resources, and resource-less SCH can't do shit about Living Dead. Probably any other tank could continue tanking, and maybe any other healer could continue healing, but if double/triple pulls are lasting that long, the real culprits are the dps

@kolz4ever1980

Жыл бұрын

Absolutely wrong. The culprit is the dumb ass tank pulling too much seeing that the healer is absolute garbage and can't keep up. The dps can't back up the lack of common sense from that situation since the tank should first read how good the healer is before going ape shit on mob pulls.

They should've given DRK an "enhanced" TBN trait in EW that made it work like sage's Haima. Instead of just one shield, get multiple stacks, maybe 2 or 3, and each time it breaks you lose a stack and get a new shield. And any remaining stacks when TBN wears off can proc a heal just like Haima. Each shield break proccing a free edge/flood would also feel pretty satisfying.

@gcook725

2 жыл бұрын

that sounds like overkill, honestly

@OrionXIXI

2 жыл бұрын

@@gcook725 I'd say it puts it right in line with Bloodwhetting, Holy Sheltron, and Corundum. You could argue those are overkill too, but they're in the game anyway.

@mahuk.

2 жыл бұрын

Bad because you're saying tbn breaking would proc an edge, so now not only you have a shield that you cannot use as frequently as the other tank shields because you need to get a 100% out of it so it doesn't become a dps loss, now you even have charges so you'll overstack them by not being able to use TBN as frequently. Your idea works for dungeons but it makes the problem of having TBN linked to a dmg skill even worse.

@OrionXIXI

2 жыл бұрын

@@mahuk. Not sure what you're talking about with "overstacking". If you mean losing a free proc after the first one from not using it before a second shield breaks, they can just make it a stacking buff like a million other ones in the game already. Literally change nothing about the shield/proc interaction except giving you potentially multiple shields, 2 would be plenty, and in turn potentially 2 edges if you get full value from it. No increase to mana cost. Meaning it's functionally identical to how it is now, in terms of damage loss when not breaking at all, but if you do expend it fully, you actually get a legitimately free edge or flood, in comparison to the one "free" proc you get from tbn breaking right now. All that being said, it proccing a free edge/flood is by far the least important part of what I'm suggesting. I'd be 100% fine with them removing that aspect of the ability completely.

DRKs are in a rough spot due to the heavy ogcd openers and lack of self healing. Just add a small cure to blood weapon and give it 5 stacks. And drk will be in a much better position. And make the shadowbringer type skill just replace your normal mp skills with more powerful versions during your shadow clone phase to remove the bloat and open up some ogcds.

@CauseImDuncan

2 жыл бұрын

I thought they were in a pretty decent spot, highest sav usage cause of the big damage, in dungeons they just require some brain power to actually pay attention to mitis which so many don't manage it well at all

@boonetolbert9539

2 жыл бұрын

@@CauseImDuncan yah their high damage helps alot with dps checks. Just the skill floor with Drk is higher than like War. War I use bloodwhetting when im almost dead and Im fine. 15secs later might pop a rampart if the healer is lazy but thats it. DRK gotta use all the CDs to be good in dungeons. With this Savage type players that know and understand the kit wont have issues. The normal players you run into roulettes might not be that good. I think minor improvement will allow drk to keep its high ceiling heavy double weave ogcd play style while lowering the skill floor. Just my thoughts. Drks not broken or unplayable but could be better.

@jellydamgood

2 жыл бұрын

Tanks need parity in self healing. GNB DPS is quite close to drk yes? But their self healing is no joke either. 2 charges of HoT and corundrum. Holy shit. Blood weapon life leech will be the dream. Makes a lot of sense, lore and gameplay wise. A nice burst heal to help with LD too. But will it be too op for the balancing team to implement? I think an HoT on oblation will be the baby steps needed to bring drk more in like with the other tanks. It will help mitigate their dungeon struggle while not making them too strong by having supreme dps AND self healing. It feels like something the xiv balance team is more likely to implement as a bandaid fix. Both will he the best.

@tinyblackmage

2 жыл бұрын

I also feel that blood weapon warrants a small HP drain (maybe a passive trait upgrade >lv 70)

@Zibi21

2 жыл бұрын

If they lowered the CD on abysmal drain it would be ok but lost of the time you are going to pop shields

Its not hard to heal dark knight. Healers are just spoiled because every other tank can take care of themselves

@sweetlittlelies7317

2 жыл бұрын

true

@bismarck2537

2 жыл бұрын

Me looking at the astrologians who don’t use synastry to heal wall to walls

@luicifiero

2 жыл бұрын

Someone finally said it.

@redgeoblaze3752

2 жыл бұрын

so in other words, It's not hard to heal a Dark Knight, it's just hard to heal a dark knight while also dealing decent damage.

@HamsterPants522

2 жыл бұрын

@@redgeoblaze3752 On paper, though, since Dark Knights do more DPS than other tanks, it should compensate for that.

I don’t understand how people are having issues with healing darks… unless darks aren’t popping cds per pill

@kolz4ever1980

Жыл бұрын

Garbage healer's plain and simple. Plus you get morons wanting to dps more than heal then comically cry about using all their mp..

I really think the main issue (if the tanks in question are of equal skill level) is that while DRKs are not getting any use out of Dark Mind, other tanks are using Thrill and Camouflage. Abyssal drain is generally a less reliable source of healing compared to others and i don't need to go into the Invuln situation. DRK just seems to have less CD's to rotate through before they're dry and their other resources are just too gimmicky compared to their counterparts.

I haven't had a lot of problems on my Sage with this. I do have trouble with Tanks not using mitigation at times. I've had two bad experiences, where I either spam all heals I have. Or the tanks dies. It was like he was made out of paper. It took all my CD and GCDs to keep him up. I could -not- do damage. The heal from Kardia would've not been enough. But if they use their own CD's well. I can dps without issues :)

@alv1561

2 жыл бұрын

Honestly had the same problem with Sage. I learned to use Soteria off the bat, Zoe for a big heal, one of the haimas per pull, then learned to space out Durochole-Taorochole, Kerachole-Holos between pulls because they all grant additional 10% mitigation, pair one after the other runs out.

@mariaveenema4337

2 жыл бұрын

@@alv1561 I do not use Druochole, instead I opt to use Addersgall for the damage mitigation spells, rotating them. Only in the most dire circumstances do I use Druochole.

@PT-qe2rb

2 жыл бұрын

This is my problem with xeno’s takes in this video. There are clearly healers in that reddit thread saying it’s a skill issue, not a job issue, and xeno is saying they are wrong and the job sucks despite him clearly being ignorant of what it’s like to play certain healers. I am a main healer and I can say that DRKs a can be easy in dungeons, or difficult in dungeons, and the only thing I can attribute to that is the tanks skill, not my own, because I am clearly not playing so much better that DRKs magically become easier to play with in dungeons. I have run tower of zot with DRKs that are way easier than when I’ve run with some WARs. A DRK is not bad in a dungeon if it is being played properly.

@dante8506

2 жыл бұрын

This is exactly how i feel, healing dungeons on sage is awesome except from stupid gunbreakers that dont even know what mitigation is idk why but my bad luck is always with gunbreakers. Not even dark knights are hard to heal when they use their mitigation properly.

@vanyel_etc8695

2 жыл бұрын

@@PT-qe2rb it's because he's comparing drk to the other tanks, which is how they shpild be compared. Why would a tank main run drk when all the other tanks exist? That's not the case wirh all the other jobs, as a healer main myself I feel all 4 healers are in a great spot,but that feeling is clearly not shared amongst tank mains.

Running a dungeon last night the DK tank was almost always near dead. I wondered if the problem was him or the healer so I watched the healer for a bit and they were definitely the issue. They threw out maybe three different heal abilities, that's it, they were spamming them and not using anything else.

@jasoncarnelian3325

2 жыл бұрын

Devils advocate: the only hit point that matters is the last point. But yeah a bad healer can be stressful af

@methalor8915

2 жыл бұрын

It's because in content where drks are a "pain to heal" healers are so used to tanks just not dying every trash pull, without any effort from healers. So when they suddenly get a drk tanking, their brains just go "man I'm sure this drk will have its own bloodwhetting! And just expect them to full heal every 2 seconds

@Verpal

2 жыл бұрын

Emm... what? Almost nearly dead tank mean optimal healer gameplay, minimal heal, and tank didn't die. Of course, if you are talking about healer using GCD heal then yeah they played poorly.

@celuiquipeut6527

2 жыл бұрын

Well, as a drk tnk, i often get healers who either drop ke or keep me too low on life. Thats not optimal healing, sorry, its playing with fire. Compared to other tanks, i had to use everything i got to get here. There is no room for mistake. Dps less, heal me more.

@yScribblezHD

2 жыл бұрын

I've never seen more gcd clipping than on noob healers. It's crazy to see sometimes how little a healer player is actually casting, and how much they're standing around. Ofc good healers are pretty common as well, if you've ever spammed the same DG a few times in a row you'll experience it being really sketchy some times, or really clean other times.

Funny enough. A short of you was recommended of your first vlog to fanfest. Time flies.

The sage has so many OGCD abilities even if your tank doesn't mitigate at all it shouldn't matter. You've got mit with regen to follow up your Haima or Panhaima shield. So they regen during the section the shield takes hits while taking advantage of the Mit + Shield. It could also probably be people forgetting the AoEs do mitigation or boost healing as well. Um the suggestions would just read the skills I guess...

you know i changed mains to PLD this expansion (just wanna throw swords, ya know) and some things i learned were confirmed in here. I've never played a tank before in XIV and I didn't do anything difficult outside of a few raids towards the end of ShB. I mostly just level my jobs. 1) low dps kind of messes up big pulls. i don't think there's any dungeon (certainly no expert dungeon) that lets you pull more than 2 groups but even when the dps is low it gets spicy. This more often happens in leveling dungeons than Expert roulettes though. 2) on those big pulls i use 2/3 mits usually. Don't know if this is 100% optimal but i do one of two things depending on what I did the pull before. - pop rampart + holy shelltron and get my magic mode buff up. Look at how im being healed then either add reprisal or if its a larger pull, use arms length (or whatever that is for tanks. i'm not great at ability names). if rampart is on CD i replace it with Sentinal. and follow the same general rules. I haven't had a healer have a problem healing me until all my CDs are out because of DPS is low. I do add in hollowed ground if its a big pull and the mobs are hard to gather up and i want to concentrate on getting the mobs situated before i go into the normal mitigaion. (like the 2nd double pull in the 2nd section of Dead Ends. seems to always be spicy at first) I do pop another shelltron if needed while the group is getting dps'd down once my 2 earlier mits are gone. Was such a good change to give us full energy at the start of a dungeon. 3) If I die i let the healer tell me to slow down or I ask. It's ok to not be able to keep up but I just want feedback. Either say "hey sorry I missed a button" or "hey you suck at using defensive cooldowns do better" idc either way just give me input if necessary. I just go off the assuption you fucked up and I died (or i ran out of defensive's because dps low but that's much rarer) There is of course Clemency which I don't use outside of healer dying on a boss fight. I use my magic mode very early on in a pull to do the highest aoe damage in the early stages. I try to wait until I've taken some damage but I just wanna throw dam sometimes. I used to hate scholar when i was leveling my jobs late in ShB as it more often than the others was going to be bumpy, but so far in EW I have more issues with AST than I do the others. Though the vast majority of the time it's fine. Sage and WHM are the ones i trust the most now. TL;DR video confirmed a lot I was unsure of. I wonder if im tanking right but it seems im not the worst. hopefully DRK can get some help in the future. Look forward to leveling my other tanks who are all at 71.

I've been playing as Sage a lot, haven't done extreme or savage yet but have noticed DRK taking a bit more damage but not to the point where I can't keep them alive But I have also noticed that a lot of tanks seem to not use CDs effectively, even see WARs not self healing

@vanyel_etc8695

2 жыл бұрын

Drks really only suffer in dungeons, in ex and savage they're not too bad. Living dead sucks ass tho, that invuln needs a rework

Every time i enter a dungeon as drk i apologize in chat for not being warrior 😢

As a DRK and SGE main, I have had no issues with any dungeons healing other DRKs. As a DRK, I know what they mean by always feeling like you are cutting it close. It feels like if you pop a TBN or Mit one second too late during a w2w pull, your health just drops like a fly with no safety net other than trusting your healer. Always dancing at death's door. That being said, I guess I have just had competent healers thus far. I am naturally inclined to just not bother with expert dungeons as a DRK for the most part though. It's just not as fun when you are worried about being near perfect constantly. Dungeons are suppose to feel casual and sometimes I just want casual fun. If I want a challenge, I do Savage content or go play other games with realistic staggering and dodge mechanics.

@theultimateevil3430

2 жыл бұрын

Leveling all healer jobs made me a psychopath. I enjoy making tanks panic. PAL using Clemency, tanks pressing invul and not needing it. I won't let you die but I will make you press all your buttons because you should. I didn't come to bring comfort, I crave efficiency, speed and occasionally suffering. So, forgive me, tanks, and learn your kit already ffs.

As a DRK Main, and someone who levels AST, here is my take: I notice at least on my datacenter that a lot of people take "green dps" to the absolute limit. Many healers I encountered are rather cocky thinking, that they can instaheal me fulll no prob. They forget server ticks, or how in this game you usually take a too many dmg in all at once, (I'm always pressing my CD's, mitigation) Truth be told out of all the healers, when I see Sage I never go above 2 group of pulls. Everytime I tried the only thing I'm tanking is the floor.

@mikikaoru7111

2 жыл бұрын

As a healer main, I don’t have issues keeping other tanks up with normal CD rotations except DRk. They need babying that the others don’t

@Qazqi

2 жыл бұрын

Sage does quite well with big pulls though. The (krasis)+physis+kera+haima combo does hella work just on its own and that's up every pull. Kardia is way more powerful than people give it credit for. Sage's problems start when it runs out of cooldowns later in the pull because the sage is putting out more damage than both of the dps. Apart from that, it's designed to be dpsing nonstop throughout the pull while comfortably healing. Most of the lower levels are fairly comfy as well. For example, I had a tank in Shisui not use any defensive whatsoever for the entire crab+pack pull despite shadow wall and reprisal and arms being available the whole time (rampart was used late on the boss). It cost me a total of 1 gcd heal toward the end of the pull.

@annetteantenna8815

2 жыл бұрын

Sage is amazing at dungeons. They just don't have any burst healing for LD. But LD shouldn't happen in the first place because Sage has enough tool kits to prevent your hp drop below 50%.

@albertobarberacampos451

2 жыл бұрын

ngl as a SGE you've got so many cd's to keep your tank up that it's kinda baffling to see people struggle healing a DRK.

@Cervarius_K

2 жыл бұрын

I've got literally thousands of hours on AST, WHM, & DRK each. Shit healers are super common, but I have a hard time believing that you're never able to go past just 2 groups without death when running alongside a SGE. Sounds far too unlikely that you just literally never get mediocre healers rather than a potential issue with your tanking as leading to these wipes as well.

Tanks and healers are so op in their role that if something is a struggle either one or both of them suck.

@Hahahahaaahaahaa

2 жыл бұрын

Sage + DK is the worst tho, so if even one of them sucks it can be a struggle. War don't and PLD barely need a healer at all.

@Syllaren

2 жыл бұрын

@@Hahahahaaahaahaa but don't forget despite that reality it's not warranted for dark to have higher damage, or the sure survival tank to have less damage.

@melb3mel

2 жыл бұрын

in DF, it's very often the case that either the healer or tank sucks ass

@Reous

2 жыл бұрын

I would have to say the only tank i have experienced trouble with is the dark, Being minus a tank CD because DM is usless in dungeons is a problem, when they run out of CD's and only have TBN for awhile you can always tell and its sad. Oblation is not good enough on its own, they need sustain or something.

@totallynottrademarked5279

2 жыл бұрын

Lol I play all of the tanks and healers. DRK is trash for running dungeons. It requires literally the kitchen sink thrown at it every wall to wall. Compared to maybe 2 o Gcds for all of the other tanks.

Played with a really bad DRK recently. He didn't use CDs virtually at all except for using living dead on CD(when at full health). I still had no issues keeping him up on SGE, it reduced my DPS a bit with having to do some GCD heals but played with plenty of DRK that pushed their mitigation and never had to touch a GCD heal.

Here's a take from a SMN main that used to main DRK and secondary WAR in ShB: I personally do see flaws in DRK, but I don't agree that they should change them to have more healing (I don't remember if this was an argument that was said, but it is the one I hear the most) For sure, Dark mind should be a normal mitigation, I get why the AOE one is magic, same for GNB, but self mitigation should at least be usable in dungeon, maybe something like addle if they really want to keep the magic part. As for the healing argument, I don't want more healing, but I do want them to be on par with other tanks on that front, maybe something like "mitigation based on missing health at the moment TBN breaks" for a few seconds after TBN breaking? I don't know, I'm not a game dev, but obvious tweaking would be needed for it to be not OP in raids/trials, but usable in dungeon In all cases, I still love DRK and even through the glaring weakness of the class, it's still really fun to play in any content. Play what you like and have fun doing the content you like, THAT is the only true way to play any games... *I do not condone being an asshole over it, do NOT ruin others experience over your own, but do make the best of it, it's multiplayer and it is made for players of all ranges of skill and mentality to enjoy* Edit 1: added "*at the moment TBN breaks*" to the ability proposition

@Reous

2 жыл бұрын

You don't make any sense, there is no way to bring the DRK to the other tanks level even doing what you suggest. A tank that can heal to almost full health from the brink and pop a mitigation is infinitely more useful than a tank who gets 10% more mitigation because their health is low. The problem being that even with that 10% more mitigation you aren't assisting your healer in keeping you alive because the damage from 13 mobs is still ludicrously high. A tank at 20% with 10% more mitigation is still going to die if it can't recover health or the healer is struggling from the get-go, that's why Oblation is basically worthless by itself. in order for that to work they would have to make their mitigation lower the damage they take to such a point that it would be recommended to just leave them at low health entirely, which is dangerous for obvious reasons. It would actively discourage people from wanting to even heal the tank because it's a better tank when almost dead. That doesn't even sound right. DRK needs self-sustain period, it's not going to ruin the tank it already could drain MP before, since that mechanic doesn't matter, it makes no sense to not transfer that drain effect to HP via the same means. DA Abyssal drain was amazing since DRK got a lot of it could have been cut when it became a tank. The fact that it was taken away from DRK and give to the other tanks in Endwalker via a BW, HS, and HoC, is an insult.

@ironer100

2 жыл бұрын

@@Reous You don't make any sense, your point is completely off the mark with what I wrote, I specifically never wrote % so i have no clue where your 10% comes from, secondly, i also never gave HP numbers, if you look closely again, the only thing i specified was a potential mechanic they could have to avoid adding healing to their kit if you want numbers: from 10% at max HP to 80% at 50% HP, how does that sound? so make sure you are actually writing in accordance to the comment you are replying next time On an other note, YES i did mess up 1 part of my post, i should have said "HP value WHEN the TBN pop" and not with "CURRENT HP", so the mit would not scale based of if you heal or not, but simply based on the TBN activation time After a re-read, you can't let them be low, TBN would blow up and the timer would NOT let them be low in the way i see it, TBN would also need to have higher CD, that is a given, but that is just making it be on the same timer as other low CD mit from the others, also given the WAR healing timing, giving them a similar timer, could work. And yes, obviously letting them be low would be "technically" better, but that can be tweeked so that TBN could be used as a bloodwetting/clemency button where you use it when you get low, This is literally the current mentality with the 25s CD's, but you need to get healed rather then "Erp derp i'm full" (this is an obvious exaggeration... except for WAR)

@Reous

2 жыл бұрын

@@ironer100 You apparently don't understand what an example is. you don't have to give numbers for me to give you an example of how the mechanic might actually work from where I understand it. You are so focused on being upset that you can't even process, that you literally repeated what I said as an example in your argument, and just giving more numbers and %'s that weren't even needed to understand it, and then told me I didn't understand what you said all because you didn't give numbers first, lmao? Next you are going to tell me I should have said "For example" just so you can clarify I was talking about what you said in the comment that you posted, while being the only person to comment about it, holy hell dude get real. Secondly 80% damage reduction at 50% health, just because you are taking damage.... you are unbelievably high and really smoking opioids if you think such a broken mechanic will ever be in the game. 10% (as what was said in my initial comment as an example) is likely what you would get. Do you know why? because when extra damage reduction was in the tank stance it was either 10 or 20%. I'm not even going to bother to go any further than that, seeing as you already struggled with processing the example the first time because "I didn't give numbers" seriously wth. As for the rest of your post, that shit is gibberish that basically amounts to you wanting DRK to be untouchable@ 50% just to avoid giving it Self-sustain that the class ALREADY had once before. What you are suggesting would make DRK the highest DPS and the Tankiest Tank out of the tanks bar none. You basically want to be a God, and seeing as you can't comprehend how silly you sound its best to let you keep coping with what's wrong with the Job, and dreaming up absolute garbage as a counter argument. Having mained DRK since HW Not a single person with any sense would disagree with what I said, seeing as you know, DRK initially had Self-sustain in its kit. wtf are you on about.

@ironer100

2 жыл бұрын

@@Reous Ok, buddy, 1: YES, you should specify it is an example, I don't live in that brain of yours and cannot guess it, it made it sound as if i had said those 2: You clearly are the one upset at my comment ("holy hell dude get real", "you are unbelievably high and really smoking opioids"), anything can be balance, it just needs time and work to adjust the numbers, it is basic game design, if you can't accept that, well, i guess there is no point entertaining ideas other then the ones found in that almighty brain that is yours 3: Yes 80% is clearly overtuned, but you just proved my point that it is a number's game, anything can be broken, good or bad depending on the numbers it has, always been that way, always will be that way 4: "You basically want to be a God", clearly not as I do not play DRK in this expansion 5: "wtf are you on about.", Well, the way i look at it, i seem to understand that the dev's intention with DRK is to have a high DPS, low sustain tank and so i am trying to think of alternate ways to make the class feel right without adding sustain to it Lastly, if you are going to start attacking me due to a youtube comment, i suggest you go take a breather and leave it at that, there is no point in it. You may not have seen your words that way, but it is on the verge of turning that way

@Reous

2 жыл бұрын

@@ironer100 lol okay man, whatever floats your boat! Go have fun or something!

what I learned from playing this game that most of people who complain about jobs have no idea what they are talking about and just parroting what they heard from someone else who 90% also doesn't know what they talked about

@bismarck2537

2 жыл бұрын

Like how people are saying that drk works poorly with shield healers. Drk and shield healers are strong together. The only really downside is LD, but if you synergies shields and heals, then LD doesn’t ever need to be used

played an expert dungeon as healer where the tank didnt use any cd at all, it was impossible to keep him alive, at a certain point i had to tell him to use them cause elseway we wouldnt have complete the dungeon. He was a gunbreaker, i still wonder how can u make it from level 60 to level 90 with no clue at all on how to play a class or what are the basic of what you should do in your role

@HeavyMetalLink05

2 жыл бұрын

Oh that's easy, they bought the class Once they bought it they went and leveled in Zadnor or PvP. Never played the class for real a single time. Just how to hit things while a mob of people do most of the work for you Zadnor was how I leveled my SAM, by the time I went from 80 to 90 I hadn't used a single ability learned there a single time until I was 90. This happens alot, esp right after a new expansion drops, where tons of people buy story and level skips and jump in with no knowledge or attempt to learn

@pniedbalski08

2 жыл бұрын

This happens way to often

@garitobee7541

2 жыл бұрын

I main Healer and there are a lot of Tanks that do Wall-to-Wall pulls and don’t use Defensive cooldowns. The only time they think about it is when there life gets below 50% and they’ll use Rampart. When Rampart ends in 20 seconds, that’s it - they don’t use another one. Their HP drops so fucking fast. They go from 100% HP down to 40% in less than 2 seconds and I’m like what the fuuuuuuuck!? Use your cooldowns bro! Some dungeons it’s easier to deal with because the wall-to-wall pulls aren’t that bad, but Tower of Zot is a nightmare to heal when you have a derp tank.

@johernandez266

2 жыл бұрын

@@garitobee7541 So new to healing. How are you meant to dps when you stop spamming heals. The tank dies? Main issue I'm having atm. Wall to wall lack of CD's tank uses. Yet I am meant to dps?

@adamm1117

2 жыл бұрын

Its insane how many tanks just flat out dont use ANY defensive cds and so i have to drop everything and carry as healer. PLEASE dude use your buttons

You know who cares about damge? The tanks and healers. This hits so hard. I even hear it straight from the horses mouths. Every time I hear someone in the game say "it's ok let's worry about melds/food/pots if we get there", it's always coming from a dps job. I don't get it. Damage is your only responsibility and you can't even be assed to bring your best to the table? Really no respect for DPS roles. Tanks and healers, I love you, keep it up.

@leatherDarkhorse

2 жыл бұрын

Worst part you know their dps are shit, still blame your shit tanking or healing. I seen worst are 100-200dps flat on vaspanati

@jellydamgood

2 жыл бұрын

@@leatherDarkhorse I remember watching one of the xiv streamers who plays brd saying that brds worrying about doing big dps is stupid, while whinging about how bad the job was. Sthal or some such. When casuals hear that, they are just gonna listen to that one part and roll with it, big strummer says ranged dps don't have to do dmg + you don't pay my sub. And we wonder why average player skill is so low in this game lol....

@swamp-puppy14

2 жыл бұрын

I consider myself a pretty solid healer that dishes out good damage in dungeons and raids. The amount of times I am out-damaging at least 1, often times both of the dps in trash pulls is disappointing tbh.

@Cervarius_K

2 жыл бұрын

Anyone who says they're gonna worry about melds later can get the fuck outta my party- unless they're lead anyways, in which case I'm getting the fuck out.

@sola4393

2 жыл бұрын

@@jellydamgood I am certain the gaming experience had gone down the drain because too many below average skill players in game. Other than the new content releases, I have never witness so many party wipes since I came back to play this game after a few years.

I main DRK in savage... but whenever I dip into dungeons... I will use ANY other tank, warrior most likely, since I've had some pretty busted healers lately.

Most dungeons are 2 packs - Boss - 2 packs - Boss etc. So Rampart , TBN then Reprise 2nd pack Shadow wall, TBN then arms length. Using TBN on cooldown throughout and the aoe self heal attack (forgot the name) and the new 10% mit if things get rough. Works fine for me.

@khash6419

2 жыл бұрын

what does arms length used for? to slow the mobs while running to second pack?

@billbobaggins945

2 жыл бұрын

@@khash6419 Nah, it slows the mob attacks speed, so its a considerable mitigation. Think its 20% for 12 seconds

To be fair, as a healer main I never had any problems healing drk. It's true that DRK has a ton of issues, but most of the time it's either the healer's fault, the tank's fault or both.

@supercala332

2 жыл бұрын

The level of the dungeon is relative here, as is the job you're using for healing. White mage works well within all the new dungeons. However, and I just don't get whatever it is, but healing Dark Knight in Vanaspati as a Sage or Scholar is a lot more difficult compared to White Mage (haven't leveled Astro that far just yet.) Ex roulettes can be spicy at times to, if the Dark Knight is still in their artifact gear set. I've also come across quite a few Dark Knights that don't use TBN very often, opting for Dark Mind instead. Yes. You read that right. Dark. Mind. With not a single incoming magic attack from enemies within sight.

@ramenjd6239

2 жыл бұрын

If your party’s dps is low, which makes a trash pull longer, the tank start to running out of CDs (and so does the healer). Then DRK is gonna suffer the most compared with other 3 tanks due to not enough survival kits

@supercala332

2 жыл бұрын

@@ramenjd6239 Very true. Unless it's a Warrior. Bloodwhetting has such a short CD timer that you can use it at the end of a big pull and still have it again for the start of the next (speaking from personal experience.) Rarely do I even find the need to use Vengeance just because of how quickly Bloodwhetting comes off CD to the point that It's rare to see the HP bar hit sub 50%. Still haven't had an opportunity to use Holmgang in dungeons.

@supercala332

2 жыл бұрын

@@ramenjd6239 Also...way to steal someone else's words from the video we just watched! 😆 But those words are 100% true.

Dark Knight is fine for raids, but lacks self sustain in dungeons, so it would make sense to change an ability that is primarily used in dungeons, their aoe skills. Would be cool if using TBN gave them an 8 second buff that made their aoe combo skills heal 50-100 potency per hit (no need to make it as strong as warriors heal)

@90Rush

2 жыл бұрын

Or just make TBN explode on popping, dealing AOE damage.

@vasylpark2149

2 жыл бұрын

Their heal is on the third part of their basic combo and not the second that makes a huge difference along with not having a good dedicated healing button.

@dolphinboi-playmonsterranc9668

2 жыл бұрын

@@90Rush That'd be fucking sick. I would love that.

@kugelschreiber5678

2 жыл бұрын

@@90Rush fuckin hell. That's a really cool idea. Would be fitting with the theme of DRK too

I've been saying, I really wish they'd add a cure potency to quietus or rework abyssal drain to work like flood/edge, where you spend mana for an OGCD sustain skill.

@dolphinboi-playmonsterranc9668

2 жыл бұрын

You can't do that, that's a good idea

That Scholar, I had those exact thoughts healing my friend who was playing a Dark Knight. I kept him alive but it was miserable to spam heals when you don't expect it.

What would yall say is the best tank to pair with scholar? As which has the most synergy?

It definitely feels like DRK is missing a button. Especially since the other tanks all have an extra CD. Idk what would fix the issue, but maybe a Single target GCD similar to Clemency that does damage (Call it blood drain or some shit) that uses half the MP of the OGCDs would help the issue. Another idea would be making TBN a charge move and giving it two charges? Extending the length of Living dead would also be good, to make it at least a bit closer in utility to the other invulns.

It's a mixed bag. Some healers want be a 3rd dps and try to push the tanks hp down as low as possible before healing, some drk don't know what mitigation is outside of managing tank busters. As for TBN on wall-to-wall I disagree that shields are bad on multiple hits, maybe for bosses with slow autos but not packs of 12+ mobs. I think TBN should be used on cooldown for big pulls. It's gonna go 1 of 2 ways. You're either going to have 7 seconds when the worst happens and your TBN doesn't break, meaning 3 gcds for a healer to recover the tanks hp. Or your TBN is going to pop in those 7 seconds meaning that every point of mitigation is used. As for living dead, the rework actually makes it a decent invuln for pack pulls the problem is you don't have control of off the effect pops or not. You can communicate it in advance and still have a healer try to struggle and keep you alive only to drop mid pull instead once you miss the timing. How to fix drk.... I'd say take a page or two from the pvp skill set for drk. Drk is great for bosses and only needs help sustaining for pack pulls so let's have quietus have a small heal for each enemy hit, say potency 50 per hit. Also in the next expansion let's give drks an ability like the drk pvp limit break that let's them purposefully put their hp at 1 for a burst of damage. This would fix living dead because the drk could force it to trigger and generate high aggro so they can wait the duration of the invul before healing themselves with the walking dead.

I said this on another video, but the other day I was doing roulettes as a sage with a DK. Pre shield and Kardia, but this dude wasn't using any cd's. Aside from living dead or whatever their big invulnerability is called. After ive had to dump everything cause they weren't using anything. Then wanted to ask me if I was okay with big pulls. Like yeah dude, but what the fuck. Pop a rampart or something...

Chiming in: All healers are really good in dungeons, moreso than last expansion, but I personally find AST to be the best if your group is competent. If your DPS are not competent, then SGE is the next best because they have so much free healing.

@inuclearpickle8628

2 жыл бұрын

Yeah as an Astro for my go to healer if the dps suck it’s pain. Idk how I managed but the reaper players I get somehow really suck when that dps is so damn easy. Another complaint for Astro probably is my 2 minute bursts it’s really hard to do while healing the the tank and MA is just too inconsistent I wish it was shb ma at least it adds consistent damage

DRK tanking feels bad if: You're not always making sure to keep around 3k mana for TBN (IN DUNGEONS) and/or group DPS is low.

As a DRK main.... Thank you for this video. You cover my complaints in dungeons perfectly.

The most difficult dungeon I ever healed as SGE was Dzemael Darkhold with a DRK tank. Tank was doing wall pulls and I was using every OGCD and spamming Diagnosis just to keep them up. After a wipe before the first boss (most of my kit was still on CD) and just barely surviving pulls before the 2nd boss I tried to figure out what was up. First, mechanics were ignored. Tanking 4 or more enemies while standing in the yellow crystal AOEs didn't help. Tanking groups of enemies outside the purple crystal glow with the routine boss AOE didn't help. Second, mitigation buttons must have had a nice layer of dust on them because they were never used. The only mitigation I saw used was rampart on the last boss with about 5% health. What makes it worse is the tank didn't have a sprout icon...

Idk why YT is showing me this but I hope Dawntrail removes alll remaining DRK self-healing and instead, whenever I mess up my mit rotation, I take quadripple damage from everything for the next 24 hours and my wife files for a divorce

I’ve had 6 non-tank DC related tank deaths while healing EW dungeons (mainly played Sage). One was due to none of my AoE skills effecting the tank (it was weird, Holos, Panhaima, and Pneuma just didn’t land I had trouble using my single target on them). I had a death due to screwing up my Scholar heals in Zot, a death due to an extremely undergeared tank, a death to cleanseable doom in the 90 story dungeon, and 2 deaths due to slow dps plus Dark Knight. With slow dps, a Dark Knight’s defensive kit runs out much faster than the rest, and Living Dead after having burned all my oGCDs on Sage is extremely difficult to save, especially before getting Pneuma. I’ve also needed to put a lot more effort more often on healing Dark Knights than any other job, though I have had quite a few bad Paladins and a couple of bad Warriors and Gunbreakers.

I haven’t gotten to Endwalker yet but is Endwalker content pretty easy to wall to wall pull? I get people saying for the game in general that wall to wall is a standard and others that say 2 pack pulls are standard. Any hard-hitting surprises like Stone Vigil normal or Aurum Vale?

One situation that confused the hell out of me was when I decided to stop grinding with trusts and queue for the final story dungeon with people for the 1st time and we didn’t even get to the 1st boss. I died on a double pull, so I slowed it down to a single pull and still died. I’m DRK and they were a WHM, was it a case of they don’t usually have to heal that much for other tanks? I’ve also heard WHM isn’t too good right now either. If I can survive double pulls with trusts a person should be able to keep me alive on a single pull (also haven’t died in the 2 non trust lvl90 dungeons)

@SoulReaperIsHere

2 жыл бұрын

As a WHM main since late ARR, it's as strong as ever when it comes to stubbornly keeping people alive IMO. You just need to be willing to use your GCDs if the pull is slow (low DPS) or tank is taking a lot of damage. Granted the first big pull can always feel a bit on edge for a WHM as we don't have any lilies at the start of a duty. Though yes, DRKs do need more healing than other tanks in my experience of playing on both ends of the tank-healer equation.

Okay, I main DRK and recently started to level my last healer I didnt touch, the WHM. I had the urge to cry every time I encounterred a DRK as the tank. Beeing worried, that my main is so trashy, a healer would rather hang themself than heal me worried me. I grabbed two people out of my FC that "main" healer (one savage raider AST and a casual WHM), asked my girlfriend to try out SCL first time and talked with them first, then did a few dungeons with each to try it out.... The following turned out: Most DRK in dungeons suck mad balls. In this case its not the jobs fault, but the players. People dont take time to understand their classes but simply try to "wing it".

@zlonewolf

2 жыл бұрын

@neko yea must be hard as tank pushing 1-2-3 combos and throwing rampart and tank stance on. Give me a break. DRK just sucks for sustain. Only reason you survive is becos healers saved you. Try soloing dungeons as any other tanks. Its possible. As DRK soloing dungeons....good luck! Lol.

Desperius FFXIV dropped a video about how to heal just before this. Coincidence? 🤔

@xehant7319

2 жыл бұрын

Concern Strummer

As Sage i enjoy healing DRK bc they take more dmg in pulls then any other tank but Sage has as many off global cooldown to heal and mitigate with and on such short timers

My one singular accomplishment that I'm most proud of is keeping a chain pulling non-mitigating Dark Knight alive in Stone Vigil as Sage. (I'm ready for ultimate now, right?)

during my burst I'm hitting TBN and a prayer brother , good luck

The general consensus for DRK is don't pop tbn if you don't think it's gonna break...

The way I see it (have leveled every job to 90) is, that the other tanks now have the same op balance "problems" DRK had in Strormblood, except for it being mainly in one push of a button. With the big mitigation now comes the passive ability of self heal, strong ones at that, which makes them less heal hungry. On top of that the cooldown is really low (except PLD which relies on gauge resource). This strong self sustain is it what made DRK op in dungeons back in Stormblood, when you had TBN (strong shield and low cooldown) and on top the spammable!!!! Dark Arts + Abyssal Drain combo so long you had mp left (where Blood Price came in for mp recovery), while WAR for example were limited with the heal effect of Steel Cyclone to the Gauge. If DRK wants to keep up with the self sustain of the other tanks AGAIN, Abyssal Drain needs to get off the shared cooldown with Carve and Spit + cost mana again while we maybe even get Blood Price back.

I think I had a case of bad player more than bad tank They were playing as DRK in the dungeon “The Lost City of Amdapor” and we had many wipes in that run. I was playing as healer and more than struggling to heal, I was struggling to follow tank because they decided they should pull all mobs (like 5 + groups worth) At the final boss everyone got wiped first except the tank like twice I wont completely shift the blame to tank as I could have been terrible in my role but there were at least two other players telling the tank to do his part properly 😅

@DocDarkAngelo

19 күн бұрын

Ah the infamous "DRK sprint to mitigate damage" but can't remember he is made of paper when every monster of the area is on him. The main problem of DRK, they like to speedrun 100-0.

That sch at the end hit home. Cant stand em cant even count how many Sch's let me die to Autos in Exs and Savages (zero vulns). Like hello im running out of mitigations, plz?

As war main, i know its great for now. For dungeon pulls i do 2 rotations for wall to wall pulls. Since there are usually 2 wall to walls between bosses. 1st pull, pre-agro pop sprint, grab all mobs, pop infuriate while running, clump mobs, hit bloodwhetting, full health for 4 gcds, afterwards pop reprisal, rampart, and equilibrium, stay alive long enough for bloodwhetting again... mobs should easily be dead and i have full health. 2nd pull, repeat opener, and pop vengeance, then thrill, shake it off, and any other cooldown if needed before bloodwhetting is back up... get cooldowns while beating snoozefest dungeon bosses.

I main PLD, but play quite a bit as whm and sage as well. I think the worst for healing for me isn't necessarily a drk specific thing, but WHEN tanks use mits. Often times I won't see the tank pop a mitigation until they are already 50% or lower HP. When I play whm, that's not as much of an issue with all the raw heals I can do, but I feel like when I play sage, it's more about mitigating that damage and keeping you from getting that low to begin with, since they don't have as many tools for big recovery heals. Where this DOES become a drk specific problem is when they have plans to use LD without saying anything and stop mitigating/run out of mits. I start blowing my cooldowns to keep them up and then when they fail to proc it (as is usually the case cause I either don't see the buff icon or it just times out before they get low enough) I struggle to bring them back up. LD is the worst invuln by far, in my opinion, and even worse trying to recover it with sage, lol.

I'm a bad tank and I still haven't issues staying alive as DRK even with healers who aren't healing. God forbid you have to think a little bit and push some buttons. Now I will admit to being a much better healer than a tank, again, no issues. I wish that I could heal more. I hate getting into dungeons where I don't heal at all. I rolled the healer to heal, not push one button. DRK skills and abilities are a bit disjointed but as far as surviving it's fine.

@dolphinboi-playmonsterranc9668

2 жыл бұрын

Don't fucking defend a tank with shit sustain when all of the other jobs can fucking manage themselves a million times better than it.

@nicholasaragon4126

2 жыл бұрын

right. All tanks should need absolutely no healing whatsoever. In fact, they should delete all the healers in the game. I play all the other tanks too, DRK's gameplay needs work, but if you have half a brain you won't die. I haven't died on DRK in a casual mode dungeon all expansion.

@draylexdoom9243

2 жыл бұрын

@@nicholasaragon4126 you're being dishonest. The fact is that the other three tanks allow you to have error and not die. DRK doesn't and because it doesn't it falls behind the other tanks.

@nicholasaragon4126

2 жыл бұрын

@@draylexdoom9243 welp, I guess I got caught in a lie. Yep you're right, I've never completed a casual mode dungeon pull on DRK without dying.

Like you said DRK just sucks on dungeons compared to the other tanks, because it´s the only tank that fully relies on healers for healing. Personally i just use Warrior for Ex Dungeons to get them over with.

@Syllaren

2 жыл бұрын

Yup but he still needs a nerf and the total self sustain tank needs a buff cuz reasons.

@MarcosBurgosR

2 жыл бұрын

@@Syllaren i just need DRK to feel better defensively.

@Syllaren

2 жыл бұрын

@@MarcosBurgosR sure that's fine. If they did that they could reduce the damage a bit, but until then maybe it SHOULD outdamage a paladin that can make it through even if the healer is a bot.

Tbh I don't have a hard time healing Dark Knight. But I do appreciate them letting me know when they will use Living Dead. For that sage it sounds like they should also use some of their other skills. Panhaima is just as good as haima in dungeons for keeping the tank alive. Krasis + Soteria is also a really powerful combination along with Holos and Zoe + Pnuema. If you rotate through those, you should have very little trouble keeping tanks alive in wall to walls.

Scholar and sage are the best dungeon healers because you can force a shitload of mitigation on the tank, so even a shitty tank can handle 2-3 packs if the SCH/SGE is good. Like for example, SGE can have regen + 10% mit on for 45s straight while giving barriers that renew themselves, all on oGCD. Layer the stuff correctly and the tank will never be even close to death while you can keep rolling your oGCDS for a long time.

The only time I've had an issue with DRK (or any tank for that matter) in a dungeon is when they weren't managing their CDs correctly and I'm not the best at healing I'm usually the hands off type. With SGE it's Eukrasian > Haima on end of pull, spam DPS until Tank is at 50% HP then its Taurochole > Eukrasian with a thrown in Druochole > Kerachole if any other top off or MIT is needed. Otherwise, I just keep my DPS up. That usually will carry me through fairly well without having to drop anything extra on top I.E using Pneuma to get in some cheeky DPS while healing the group when needed or even having to use Rhizomata. That said (and feel free to correct me if im wrong. I've played tanks but I'm definitely not a Tank main.) I've always found DRK to be strong DPS wise but weak in its sustain. Most of DRKs abilities is geared to supplement its MP in order to fuel its other DPS abilities and its best MIT TBN. Meanwhile, GNB has its Aurora & Heart of Corundum, PLD has Clemecy & Holy Sheltron, & War has Bloodwhetting & Equilibrium. What does DRK have as far as helping with health regen? Abyssal Drain. And it's cure potency is very weak in comparison to others. Idk, it's highly possible I'm wrong but it always felt like that to me.

Tanks don't forget about Arms length in dungeons

just always save your 3 Aetherflow gauge charges for 3 lustrates 5Head

Reasonably competent Sage here I don't really struggle to heal Dark Knights, but I actually have to occasionally pay attention to them whereas I don't have to pay attention to any of the others. I don't even have to use OGCDs on competent warriors.

That last comment about the SCH letting the DRK die from Living Dead. Reminded me of Elmo tornado where my Astro didn't hit me with a single heal and my co tank War and Sage had to burn stuff to "attempt" to save my life and i just died anyway. 2ED2EZ

I am not a tank main nor a drk main, but this video actually makes me thinking of what I might be doing wrong in dungs as Healer and DPS. I have one question that I really want it to be answered here, do you actually need to save your cooldown/opener facing a 4 man dung boss? Like for example as SAM do you need to save your Iki/Namikiri/Meikyo or Kenki for the boss or you would actually pop all of those during the wall to wall pull to kill the mobs faster? I think I am always saving it for boss and that might slow the speed my group killing trashes which probably make Healer and Tank's life harder. If I am doing wrong please let me know because I really don't want to hold my partys back and improve my gameplay. BTW Strummer I love you! Please keep uploading, I learned a lot and had so much fun watching your videos

@innerdescent8210

Жыл бұрын

I'm not the poster but you should be expending your resources during wall to wall pulls, those trash mobs can put a lot of strain on the tank and healer if they're not being burned fast, hope this helps!

I've encountered quite a few bad healers lately. Even running as PLD and using all of my CDs (including hallowed) I've still had healers that couldn't manage to keep me alive. There's absolutely no way my DRK would stand a chance.

@theultimateevil3430

2 жыл бұрын

Try Tenacity :^)

TBH in terms of dungeons it really doesn’t matter what healer you use. None of them are better then the other it comes down to the player themselfs. Also dungeon knowledge is a huge bonus. Knowing when big damage is inc gives you an edge interms of what spells to prioritize as a healer. As my white mage I’ve healed tank that don’t use any mitigation abilities at all as long as you use lucid dreaming off cd it shouldn’t be a big issue in terms of resources.

Salted Earth should give lifesteal as long the DrK is in the bubble. or maybe Delirium also gives it to the DrK but i think salted earth having a life steal effect would be fun because you'd have to position correctly in order to use it. :> Every tank class has a 'lifesteal' ability aside from DrK and Gunbreaker. PLD now has the passive HP recovery from magic attacks. I actually hope DrK and Gunbreaker gets some stuff like that.

I just adjust my expectations when I get a DRK in roulettes. I'll typically throw in an adlo every 2 or 3 GCDs between my Art of War spam to keep them up. I have gotten really bad DRKs though which need more or less full healing uptime from me to keep them alive.

I thought i was the only warrior who forgets rampart and arms length are a thing. Wall to walls are usually close to dead by the time bloodwhetting is ready again.

DRK is actually okay tank, it just force healers to actually heal and not just throw an OGCD or 2 (the mentality which is rare among healers nowadays). Having been spoiled with the other 3 self-healing tanks, of course DRK becomes the blacksheep

Now im craving a bud light next, zero carbs super crisp light beer

DEVS to TANKS: GNB: Let's give you a personal excog on your HoC, give you two charges of regen, as well as strengthening your personal shield you get on your 1 2 3 combo WAR: Let's give you more heals. ALL THE HEALS. JUST HEALS! HEALS!!! HEALS!!!!! PLD: All your magic combos heal you. lol. sheltron also heals you. DRK: Uhm...two charges of a 10% damage mit.. DARKKNIGHTS: What???? DEVS: Did we stutter

I freaking hate the dead end dungeon or whatever is call with my DRK because of the level sync. It affect DRK a lot.

@Cervarius_K

2 жыл бұрын

As a Healer/DRK main, I promise you that it really doesn't cause issues for DRK. There isn't presently an Endwalker dungeon or really any content this xpac that DRK is noticeably worse at than the other tanks

The job is fine. With the influx of players coming in and "probably" tanking or even healing for the first time, youre gonna encounter different skills. Everyone wants to blame the job or the player but it's never their fault. Ure a healer and notice your tanks hp is dropping a bit? Communicate and heal more. You're a tank and your healer is having trouble healing u up? Communicate and pull less. Ure a tank and your buddy is a healer, and you both notice the dps players are lacking? Communicate and move along.

DRK is very seat of your pants for big pull. In the 90 dungeon, for wall to wall, I'm doing TBN, followed by Oblation + standard Tank mit after it pops, followed by TBN again once it cools down. I'm also having to use the lifedrain aoe a lot. Certainly it's not as easy as PLD and mobs do die quicker cause of all that extra damage, but having a invuln that screws the shield healers is pretty bad. When I pop living dead, I'm not doing it to invuln, I'm doing it because I know I'm dead and I want to do 20 more seconds worth of damage to the mob in the hopes that it contributes enough to thin it out for the other three players when I go down.

I have all healers 80+, Scholar isn't necessarily the strongest dungeon healer in general, but they DO synergize the best with Dark Knight. Sage has the highest aoe dps by far....except with Dark Knight, because they essentially fight each other for dps resources via shield pops on both. This is demonstrated if you look into dungeon speedruns. Now, the actual fastest are unconventional roles with War + 3dps, which is ridiculous, but for actual one tank, one healer, 2 dps, the fastest runs are Drk + Sch, and it has to do with the amount of damage they can pump out with that combo in particular. As Sch, you put Exocognition on the drk (high potency heal that auto goes off when they reach 50% health, aka until it goes off you can ignore them, sacred soil at the end of pull, and then just Art of War spam while fairy auto heals every 3 seconds without even pressing anything. Art of War does more damage than any other spammable healer aoe, Sage's higher potency ones are either on higher CD, or depending on shield pops and placing said shields for Sage is an entire 2 gcds that they aren't dps'ing. Holy stuns don't matter if everything can be dead before they can kill you anyway. Anyway, Sage is the best dungeon healer with any tank that ISN'T drk, Scholar is the strongest WITH drk, both for just pure dps reasons - mobs die faster, full stop. No better mitigation than enemies being dead.

Neglecting drk sure made it a better class /s Thanks yoshi

When he talks about what he's doing as SGE, he's doing too much up-front. Just spamming E.Diagnosis is enough for everything on-the-run, including the double-pulls you're limited to in experts. Once you stop, then you kitchen sink just a little bit: krasis, physis II, kerachole - in that order, to stack both healing buffs and "trap" them into your shield along with 2 regens. As that's falling off, you may need to reapply a gentler kit like taurochole+panhaima, and if the pull drags on, haima. With those slow (and supposedly challenging) w2w pulls, everything's back up in 2 mins for the next pull. Sage needs to think like a tank and rotate mitigations out over time, stacking the most heavily early pull.

Absolutely so true about healers dpsing. Best runs I've had are where the healers are blasting.

Last week i was in Tam Tara (normal) as a DRK, with a CNJ, PGL and a ARC... All Sprouts, so I decided to make small pulls, then I didn't used mits, only on the final boss, but at the end the CNJ said that I should learn how to use my mits... I was like _In Tam Tara with small pulls? LOL"_ He wasn't healing me, only when I was with low hp... He thought that he was a "green dps"

Great attitude, must be loved irl, i mean, behind 75k*ish subs. Good Lad .

Ive gotten a ton of drk's recently leveling in 70s-80s dungeon because it seems everyone is leveling them up atm.

I don't get the thing with shields being bad on multiple hits? I get that shields "enlarge the max hp pool" temporarily, but for (for instance) 7 small hits, how is it different getting that damage soaked by a healing or a shielding effect?

@XenosysVex

6 ай бұрын

Because shield is capped in the absorption, mitigation like rampart being 20% is not capped. Meaning that every hit is 20% less where once a shield is gone you are taking full damage. this will matter on multiple hits.

@5daydreams

6 ай бұрын

Ohhhhhh Okay, right - I was thinking from the healer perspective that "well it just means applying a shield over and over again", but yeah, that means you have to re apply the shield in the end, so a mit% and healing ends up being less resources spent to deal with the same damage over the course of the many hits to be taken Cheers, Xenuwu sempai!

It's like this, as a healer that is what we do! I thought it was just me until the d-head came after my healing skills and I been playing the game since before day one lol. Until this gets help I am leaving any instances with DRK tanks.

I was so happy as I got DRK to 90! Because I don't have to play it for another 2 years! I was leveling it trough Dungeons with 2 of my static members, one of them, was leveling his WHM as I sufferd trough my DRK. I was sweating blood and tears as I got beaten to a pulp by Dungeon Pulls, I actually died a couple of times. My healer was suffering and he hated healing me, as I was leveling my PLD next, he had 0 problems healing me at all with AST. He even ignored me during pulls and it all went well.

Healer main here. I ran ARR-SB as a White Mage and power leveled Sage when it came out. Honestly I'm surprised the OP hasn't been having a harder time keeping any tank alive with the rotation they said they use. Here is what I use and, regardless what class, it keeps the tank alive without issue in w2w pulls *Kardia on tank as soon as dungeon starts* *Prepull/grabbing mobs* -Eukrasian Diagnosis on tank -DoT enemies while tank is gathering up mobs *When tank stops pull/hits the wall* -KRASIS ON TANK BEFORE ANYTHING ELSE. This is an absolute necessity once you have it. It increases all healing done to the target of Krasis by 20% for 10 seconds. That includes healing from the Sage who cast it, Kardia trickle heal from Sage, tank self-healing abilities.... everything is buffed by this ability. -Physis II and then immediately Kerachole. Both of these give a HoT to the party and Physis also increases HP recovered via healing actions by another 10% for 10 seconds. Kerachole reduces incoming damage by 10% as well. Because of Krasis, the healing of the HoTs are increased by 20% which is huge. -Haima on tank. Gives 5 shields on top of the mitigation and HoTs from the previous abilities. -Go ham with Phlegma and Dykrasia for DPS. -Before Krasis buff wears off, cast Taurochole on tank. Overwrites the 1-2 seconds left on Taurochole and gives another 10% mitigation and a 700 potency heal that is buffed by 20% by Krasis. Rinse and repeat on next pull. Only difference is Haima won't be up yet so use Panhaima in its place. If pulls are still going on after Taurochole is wearing off; Holos for an AoE heal and 10% more mitigation, or Soteria to pump Kardia heals on tank by 50%, or a Zoe buffed Eukrasian Diagnosis on tank for a 450 potency heal plus a shield of 180% of the heal you just did....or a Zoe buffed Pnuema which is a 900 potency heal to the team PLUS a 255 potency heal to your tank via Kardia. I rotate Zoe between the last 2 based on Pnuema cooldown. This rotation keeps the tank healthy and gives 3 or 4 outs to "oh shit" moments like if the tank drops way low/uses invuln to get them back up to a healthy range. I've def done Holos immediately into Zoe buffed Pnuema on a few shaky occasions to bring tank/party from almost dead to full HP.

If you want to go as a tank as a secondary I'd say have practice with the trust system through the dungeons. It will make for better practice. Before going with regular players so no one is getting toxic.

Sounds like NA healers forgot how to heal because of the healer killing buffs they gave the other tanks lol.

I'm probably the worst PLD EU but at least with Endwalker I started using abilities I ignored before (because I also changed my hotbars and stuff). But anyways.. so for dungeons I use my CD's for trash and save them during boss fights (unless it's the last boss) so they are ready for the next trash packs. On Bosses except the last I usually only use shelltron. Is that "ok"? On normal Raid I try to combine shelltron with one big CD on red markers (tankbusters?).

TBN, I think if the shield pops, they should add sth like 10% mitigation for X seconds

tbh when ppl say DRK is bad in dungeons I feel like it's more because the better tanks realized that there's totally no reason for not using WAR for dungeons, leaving only the not-so-good tanks who can't do WAR to go to dungeons as DRK.