I‘d like to have something explained. Let‘s suppose Magnus' reason isn‘t about cheating at all. Now he sees what is happening to Hans because of his tweet and all the wild accusations. Would he not - as a sportsman - go out and say something along the line of „Stop blaming Hans! He has nothing to do with it.“?

@gustavk3227

Жыл бұрын

100%. It reflects very poorly on him if he was misunderstood and he did not clarify. No matter what he meant, this is his responsibility

@dude157

Жыл бұрын

unless he doesn't like him

@mrio0

Жыл бұрын

this but i won't jump into conclusions

@dusangrujic7511

Жыл бұрын

He absolutely does not have any responsibility to clear anything he tweeted what he tweeted he did not fire any shots and people asume things based on Hans's past. Its right for Magnus to clear it up but its not wrong to just dont give a flying fuck

@btmillion2813

Жыл бұрын

It’s possible we guessed right though. Confirming it can fuel this fire. Maybe he’s hoping it dies down so he moves on.

Agree with Ben's reasoning. However, for argument's sake, if I were someone in Magnus' camp trying to sabotage the world champ, I wouldn't try to leak the prep to Fabi/Ian/Ding etc. because I worry these guys will refuse my offer and get myself in trouble. I would indeed look out for guys with a reputation like Hans.

@ericvosselmans5657

Жыл бұрын

that's my thought as well

@JamesV1

Жыл бұрын

Magnus has worked with these people for many years in a very small circle. There’s nothing to indicate anyone leaked.

@zada4a

Жыл бұрын

@@JamesV1 he probably got hacked by a hacker! no one talking about that

@barlin4972

Жыл бұрын

​@@zada4a Bro! You are living in a movie. Is it possible, yes, but how likely is it? You are suggesting that Hans hired a hacker to get his hands on Magnus prep. That is some super villain strategy.. stop it. It's no wonder nobody talks about it.

@junk7769

Жыл бұрын

@@JamesV1 true, and I'm sure they're all very happy with what they do. I doubt any amount of money would convince them to betray Magnus, and jeopardize their entire career/reputation.

Hikaru riled everyone up, then said “the whole things a circus…” Man, YOU sold the tickets!

@jurassicmurricorn7139

Жыл бұрын

Lol

@ryanjavierortega8513

Жыл бұрын

Haha

Magnus is on his Bobby Fischer arc

@papaoxd

Жыл бұрын

All I want is Magnus to go full rockstar mode

@ven11235

Жыл бұрын

@alt1337 bobby was just spitting the Truth

@zonoka9609

Жыл бұрын

Except bobby was always right

@jacobwatson3781

Жыл бұрын

Which topic was Bobby right about? I'm not familiar with his opinions.

@atomsam2676

Жыл бұрын

It's like the same mentality with people who jumps on Hans and blaming him of cheating. Without any proof you are just emotionally baised. So grow up and let the both party speak theirs reason first.

Even if Magnus Carlson’s prep was leaked, it was only 10-15 moves into the main line of the Catalan. There should be no move at black’s disposal that does anything other than equalize or give black a slight advantage at best. The world champion still had 60+ more moves to outplay his much lower rated opponent and he failed to do so.

@alex2005z

Жыл бұрын

The difference is that Hans would have known all the best engine moves and Magnus would have to work to find them

@rsmith31416

Жыл бұрын

I believe it was 22 first moves and the rest of the moves were all 1-3 top engine choices. When you think something fishy is going on, you cannot play as usual.

@unforeseenbeasts3607

Жыл бұрын

@@rsmith31416 This is true. But how does Wesley So play OVER 70 moves with 99 percent accuracy against Caruana? I don't think Wesley So cheated at all, but how can this line of argument be used against Hans when it can't be used against other GM's at the tournament? Also, NO GM at this tournament has played under 90 percent accuracy and won a game. Depending on which engine evaluation you use, Magnus played between 85 and 87 percent in this game, which explains why he lost (playing below 90 percent).

@gurgleblaster2282

Жыл бұрын

@@unforeseenbeasts3607 I think it depends on the lines being played. Some lines are very well known at a significant depth while other lines are not as deeply explored.

@dannygjk

Жыл бұрын

@@rsmith31416 Logically in order to accept that logic one would have to accept that Carlsen always plays the best engine moves.

Magnus: “ I can’t say anything.” The rest of the world: “We just can’t shut up.” Epic stunt. Welcome to 2022!!

@rehman1833

Жыл бұрын

The Mourinho clip that Magnus posted is a meme that means that there is cheating but he cant openly say it. All the speculation is Magnus' fault

@sharpvidtube

Жыл бұрын

@@rehman1833 I think Mourinho was complaining about the officials there, so there's a possibility that Magnus wanted them do take some action, or said he would withdraw, and they didn't do what he wanted? There's too many top players that are suspicious about Hans, I would be surprised if they're all wrong. Then there's the online cheating, that he admits to, but only after it was all over the internet. Can see Hans making excuses for his poor analysis, but surely after winning, you get a high, and don't feel tired until much later, so that didn't make sense to me. On the other hand, Mourinho often complained when the officials made the right call😂

@SavantGardeEX

Жыл бұрын

Magnus literally should've never withdrawn, tweeted that clip which insinuated shit... Magnus is definitely the bad guy here if hans is innocent.

@wolfgangdevries127

Жыл бұрын

"I robbed Hans". That's what he was saying.

@Jreaddy

Жыл бұрын

The video made me think about being arrested, like “I can’t say anything or I will get in trouble” i dont know why ppl thought cheating.

Magnus walked out confusing the audience.

@zulzulkifli2461

Жыл бұрын

hahaha ... magnus did ' the ben finegold'.... yes .. you... you the audience are confused.... the truth hurts

@lymphhh

Жыл бұрын

@@zulzulkifli2461 u good bro?

Jan Gustafsson made a statement during his Banter Blitz yesterday. He quoted Laurent Fressinet who observed that Hans' post-game interview on Sunday (the Magnus game) was probably Hans being cagey because he didn't want to reveal his Catalan prep so he made some stuff up about the miraculous morning study of the infamous Carlsen - So game. So that's two of Carlsen's team who are basically convinced that Hans didn't cheat. Gustafsson also said there was nothing in the moves to suggest any outside assistance.

@japphan

Жыл бұрын

No. Just no. That is two in Carlsen's team who believes there is a possibility Hans didn't cheat. How high they deem that possibility, we don't know. It is possible he is hiding his Catalan prep, but it is also possible that [something else]. So, they are not convinced he cheated. There is a possible explanation for his post-game interview incongruencies. They are still incongruencies, and they are still suspicious. However, the observation is valid - there is a possibility Hans didn't cheat, and that he talked as if he was a 2400 player because he was cagey, rather than weak.

@PandaManOkay

Жыл бұрын

@@japphan in the german video jan says clear that he sees no indication for believing that hans would've cheated

@japphan

Жыл бұрын

@@PandaManOkay Yes, that is the information to which I responded.

The way I see it there are 3 possibilities: 1. Magnus believes Hans cheated and has some form or proof which he has not publicly revealed 2. Magnus believes Hans cheated but can not actually prove it 3. Magnus doesn't even believe Hans is cheating. If it is the 3rd, Magnus should really clarify it to get Hans out of the spotlight. It would be a dick move to not clarify this. However, since Magnus has not done this yet I think it is one of the first 2.

@theflabbygentleman9292

Жыл бұрын

1. seems unlikely because if he did have that proof then he surely would've given it to the tournament organizers and Hans wouldn't still be playing, right?

@frednimzowi9852

Жыл бұрын

It's clearly number 2. If it were 1 or 3 he would have reacted by now. Maybe he's gonna come with some crazy excuse and pretend it's 3 but I, for one, am not gonna believe him. Too late.

@rajsub3884

Жыл бұрын

He certainly not behaving like world champion for sure if he gave something no business in writing in twitter go to organiders and spit the fact as simple as that. What point of keeping everybody in suspense and causing stress

@leskfan1277

Жыл бұрын

A combination of #2 and #3. An objective observer can easily see there is 0 evidence Hans cheated, and Magnus can see this too. But I bet that Magnus' "team" (Magnus doesn't talk to ordinary Joes like you and me) is egging him on with the view that Hans cheated. His team is appealing to his vanity that he can't lose to an idiot like Hans in a fair game.

@timkom2289

Жыл бұрын

I guess it would be option 2, otherwise it would be resolved by now. Also considered, that magnus refuse to defend his title and now did this I am bit afraid he is switching to Fisher mode.

Ben is absolutely right. At this point, even if hans is guilty, magnus and hikaru have handled this very badly. If magnus has an accusation to make, he should make it, not hide behind that morinho video. Put up or shut up.

@andershepherd9637

Жыл бұрын

The way Magnus insinuated him without actually accusing him screams "scared of legal repercussions"

@frederik_9748

Жыл бұрын

I believe FIDE rules don't allow players to accuse other players of cheating so he should have handled his suspicions in private without resigning from the tournament.

@johnrichardson7629

Жыл бұрын

Incorrect. If you bring a misconduct charge against someone, you take it to the relevant officials and then say nothing publicly.

@dqreps

Жыл бұрын

He didn't cheat. He's not Hans Bond for Pete's sake. Over the board is extremely difficult to cheat. Not impossible but when they check every nook and cranny of your body and find nothing, pretty sure you ain't cheating.

@12jswilson

Жыл бұрын

As usual, Ben has the best take on chess drama. He's got a lot of experience

Why would anyone working for multi-millionaire Magnus Carlsen leak prep to a snotty 19 year old and not to Ian or Karjakin or Fabi?

@joakimquensel597

Жыл бұрын

I don't think that's what happened but more likely than a deliberate leak is if a friend of Hans somehow stole his prep (hacked his WiFi or whatever). Or someone accidently left some prep notes somewhere. But even more likely I think is that Magnus is paranoid. Wouldn't be the first time a chess genius goes a bit nutty, soon he'll grow a giant beard and move to Iceland.

@terryboland3816

Жыл бұрын

Because they wouldn't accept the info and they'd report the incident?

@MIDO44444

Жыл бұрын

@@joakimquensel597 if it was this easy to hack into magnus's prep it would have happened in more important tournament like world chess championship

@KrazyKrzysztof

Жыл бұрын

yea they'd be sued and never hired again by any chess player

@chesscrush

Жыл бұрын

Don't wanna throw out any names but I know a guy in Magnus' team who is very very close to Hans it would just require one WhatsApp message about a certain line and no one would ever be able to find evidence. Why would that particular person do that? Maybe because Hans asked, maybe because he wants Hans to win (they are friends after all), maybe because he is annoyed at Magnus maybe just a reason we don't know. Out of all the accusations this is the most likely one. Other alternatives are that he got hacked but Hans 100% didn't cheat with Stockfish during the game.

I know nothing but here’s what I think: FIDE, and Magnus’s sponsors, are furious that Magnus isn’t defending the WC title. That created a lot of tension between Magnus and the federation leadership. And something nefarious is happening involving that. The withdrawal from the tournament has nothing to do with Hans.

@mercylessplayer

Жыл бұрын

Okay like. This makes more sense than any of the other possibilities

@jasondoe2596

Жыл бұрын

That's a completely insane, movie-like scenario, and it's *still* more plausible than the craziness we've been witnessing xD

@davidquinn9676

Жыл бұрын

Magnus' accuracy in the loss to Niemann was computer assessed at under 85%. That's not the old Magnus. He can't or doesn't care to play the way that got him to the WC and made him a great WC. I think he's stepping down because he expects he might lose the rematch with Nepo, and that's fair. What's not fair is taking out his frustration on a newcomer to the top circle of chess who had only the bad manners to beat him.

@taylorg8509

Жыл бұрын

Makes more sense than anything I can think of This is such a big mystery

@random9-548

Жыл бұрын

That's not reasonable because, if that's the case, Magnus would have clarified it already since it has been a lot of rage towards Hans and he is well aware of that. So this theory doesnt make any sense.

Magnus surely is alluding that Hans is cheating. The upping of security, the 15min delay in the stream after he withdraws from the tournament can’t just a coincidence

@answeris4217

Жыл бұрын

@@aa-fi9ks he is also playing in a tournament with the top players in the world. Maybe he is one to??? It's a maybe. He didn't play poorly with all the safety protocols in place ether

@cricfizzer4498

Жыл бұрын

@@aa-fi9ks magnus played like an 87 % percent accuracy game , its pretty easy for super gms to beat 87% accuracy magnus

@wolfgangdevries127

Жыл бұрын

@@aa-fi9ks Magnus made 6 mistakes, 4 small ones, 2 blunders during move 16-42. That's 73% accuracy, only counting the moves.

@novelay

Жыл бұрын

Yeaaaahhj gods bleed too

@Bradley_UA

Жыл бұрын

Magnus isn't in charge of security lol

Magnus has really been behaving like a diva as of late. And to have Hikaru leading this witch-hunt really proves that Hans was right when he said these Top 10 players are gatekeeping and they don't want to be embarrassed, like many of them did with Uzbekistan.

@rasputozen

Жыл бұрын

magnus is innocent

@KrazyKrzysztof

Жыл бұрын

@@rasputozen no

@Morphysince94

Жыл бұрын

if someone is gatekeeping in chess, its the idiots/trolls from twitch and KZread ... Not the top chess players, who doesn't give a sht about anything except their own chess.

@smashergrilla954

Жыл бұрын

@@Morphysince94 no you are def wrong if u dont think that these top 5 forgot 10 are not gate keeping and try to always write the narrative.

@carlix20

Жыл бұрын

@@Morphysince94 Exactly!

This stream, chat and the green hair all of them are fine gold. Hilarious chat. Some1 said "Magnus cheated". 🤣🤣

@mdfauwadulislam2632

Жыл бұрын

,🤣🤣🤣

@Cursein

Жыл бұрын

Wow so funny grandpa

Dude if it wasn’t a cheating allegation magnus would have cleared the air by now. His silence says it all.

@radscorpion8

Жыл бұрын

well we can't be 100% sure. Maybe he can't even clarify the reasons. Could be his team felt something was suspect and decided to pull him and maybe he is contractually obligated to silence, so its not really him making the decision but the team. Not sure if that's how it works or not but I just feel like there could be reasons we haven't thought of, and we should wait to hear Magnus before making any firm conclusions

@Counterplexity

Жыл бұрын

@@radscorpion8 He could at least say that it doesn't have to do with Hans cheating

@FrenkieWest32

Жыл бұрын

@@Counterplexity the comment youre replying to literally says that maybe he could not...

@thatrespectablehuman1884

Жыл бұрын

@@FrenkieWest32 why? You can’t get in legal trouble over specifically not slandering someone

@FrenkieWest32

Жыл бұрын

@@thatrespectablehuman1884 isn't it beyond obvious? If they have suspicions, of course they're not gonna make Magnus say that Hans didn't cheat.

Ben does the best chess impro stand-up, period.

Hikaru needs to apologize

@vagnerwanilla785

Жыл бұрын

Actually as funny as it looks in my opinion if there's anyone whom Hikaru should apologize to, that's Magnus himself because the only thing that Hikaru accused in that stream was accusing Magnus to leaving the tournament because he thinks Hans cheated other than that it was all facts

For the past 2 days the whole internet has been saying that magnus thinks hans cheated, if thats not the case why hasnt magnus said anything yet?

@mikebarker9187

Жыл бұрын

lawyers

Magnus left to support Ruud at US open

Magnus lost to someone he feels isn't on his level, knows he cheated online once or twice when he was a kid, and let his imagination take hold. It wasn't that Hans played spectacularly, he played very well and Magnus played a sub optimal endgame.

@mbealhighjump

Жыл бұрын

"was a kid" aka 2yrs ago lol

@lizardi1037

Жыл бұрын

@@mbealhighjump tell me you didn’t do something immensely stupid at 16 years old that you would never have done 3 years later

@GangsterGumbo

Жыл бұрын

@@lizardi1037 Tell me you were in no way the same person 2 years after any point in your life.

@alonsoACR

Жыл бұрын

@@lizardi1037 I cant think of anything

@jamesjennings1389

Жыл бұрын

This is an excellent post and likely totally correct. I doubt Magnus will reflect honestly on that. Likely he’s is denial about his failures in this game.

I’m so glad you do streaming and KZread. Ever since going to camps in the 90s where you were teaching (and Spencer was tagging along) you’ve been one of my favorite chess personalities.

Happy Birthday GM Ben Finegold 🎂🎉🎈

HAPPY BIRTHDAY BEN

It's so funny that Magnus is the one who went spastic and ragequit and everyone is focusing on Hans.

@michaelbauers8800

Жыл бұрын

An interesting point

@chungboislim2061

Жыл бұрын

Magnus fanboys are the worst. Also Magnus is losing it. Lost all respect for him after not defending the title, but now this.

@tommymc7535

Жыл бұрын

@@chungboislim2061 So there’s no chance Hans cheated lol?

@chungboislim2061

Жыл бұрын

@@tommymc7535 What? Of course there's a chance. And he has cheated in the past. Not sure what compelled you to ask that or why you think it's funny.

@tommymc7535

Жыл бұрын

@@chungboislim2061 Just not sure how he’s losing it if you do agree there is a possibility that Hans cheated. I would probably withdraw to if I knew or strongly suspected someone cheated me.

the point of saying you got covid is to warn all the people you've been in contact with in order to stop the spread. All other GMs in the tournament would know.

@daveshif2514

Жыл бұрын

No he means the people Who brag that they didnt die, because faux news says that covid isnt dangerous so if you get it and literaly Survive, they see it as evidence against the very real dangers of covid, some sick faux news worship trophy

@jamessales9047

Жыл бұрын

No one GAF about it anymore

@thatrespectablehuman1884

Жыл бұрын

@@jamessales9047 I mean even if you have a stomach virus or the flu, anything, I'd consider it pretty good to tell people you were around or will be around that

@codeaccuna

Жыл бұрын

@@jamessales9047 Internationally people do

@9e7exkbzvwpf7c

Жыл бұрын

@@jamessales9047 I'm not sure if you're aware of this James but it's good practice if you ever come down with any contagious disease to let people know who might have been exposed. If you get the flu you should tell people you were with the day prior so they don't go visit their gma in the old folks home you weirdo.

I think there is also the possibility that being outplayed in the endgame by Neiman ( a player that he doesn't think much off) , didn't set well with Carlsen , and he didn't feel like acknowledging the Big Upset win as being a legitimate one .

After almost every single chess entity was jumping on the anti-Hans bandwagon it’s nice to see an unbiased opinion

Thanks for being the voice of reason, Ben.

Does seriously no one notice how immature Magnus can be when he loses against someone who he thinks he should never lose against? We've seen him storm away like an upset toddler on numerous occasions. He 100% overreacted to a loss and everyone on the internet made this into what it is.

@davidquinn9676

Жыл бұрын

Being very upset by a loss is normal. Sending a vague damning tweet and not fixing it yet, days later, is not. Magnus has never to my knowledge been bad like this before.

@songokulul

Жыл бұрын

It's entirely possible Hans cheated, I'm just trying to offer an alternate explanation that I've not seen thus far.

@majormononoke8958

Жыл бұрын

@@davidquinn9676 How about stating he may not play the next world championship, only to say after the candidates that he will not play, definitly not...

@alex2005z

Жыл бұрын

He always reacts ok to losing against someone lower rated. He is upset, but with himself, not the other player. Its called being competitive.

@EpicVideoMaster11

Жыл бұрын

@@majormononoke8958 You don't need to play in the World Chess Championship if you do not want to that's not a bad thing

Happy Birthday Benjamin!

First video I’ve seen, love your perspective on this! Keep talking about it

Thanks for a forthright opinion on this - I agree! If Magnus has another less nefarious sounding reason for withdrawing he should say so because it seems he intended to cast a dispersion over Hans. Hikaru's laughing session went even farther and basically amounted to a direct accusation.

@kevinscottbailey8335

Жыл бұрын

No Hikaru just accurately pointed out that Hans has a history of cheating online. He was very careful not to accuse him directly of cheating in the tournament since that is almost impossible to prove even though everyone pretty much suspects that he was.

@Dextline

Жыл бұрын

That's just a coward's way of accusing someone, Kevin. I get that part of Hikaru's fulltime job is peddling drama for views and money, but spending a good part of his stream leading people to assume Hans cheated with his insuations and maliciously worded information is ethically the same as outright claiming it.

@MrSyntheticSmile

Жыл бұрын

@@kevinscottbailey8335 Insinuations are a coward's version of accusation.

Thanks Ben... and not because I neccessarily agree with you and not because you are always right... but... because you have the GUTS to stand up and press Magnus to put up or shut up. No other of all the people that make a living off of chess DARE to challenge Magnus. They may not condemn Hans, but they won't press the issue with the World Champion. They don't want to risk the ire of the Big Boy. Only BEN is dumb enough and brave enough. Good for you (and I'll miss your stream when Magnus gets you kicked off.)

@crabcrab2024

Жыл бұрын

Log in again, Magnus!

@mikesmith2315

Жыл бұрын

maybe MC is afraid of defamation lawsuits if he cant prove anything

@priyanshukumawat4142

Жыл бұрын

Ben can say this because he is no longer need to join any such online tournament and he also does not play for money there .So he can say this.In most of the online chess companies event handlers Magnus had a decent amount of share so nobody dares to talk against him

@matterickson503

Жыл бұрын

So you think Magnus Carlsen a measley Chess Player in the grand scheme of things holds enough power to shut down a KZread channel? LOL 😆! Also you must be so delusional to think chess is even relevant. Don't get me wrong I enjoy and follow it but a vast majority of people which might still be an understatment dont even know how chess pieces move let alone who some dork and World Champion Magnus Carlsen is.

@jackm4457

Жыл бұрын

@@matterickson503 Ha ha.... look, some goober who has no idea when someone is obviously making a joke! LOL

yayy! cant wait to hear your input on this thanks man

If Magnus really withdrew for reasons not related to issues with Hans, then he'd surely come to Hans' defense and dispel the rumors.

@CastorFurieux

Жыл бұрын

If he's lossed someone close to him then maybe he's decided to stop using social media for a while

@farazsiddiqui1312

Жыл бұрын

@@CastorFurieux maybe his sister I really hope not she is the reason what magnus is today

@SavantGardeEX

Жыл бұрын

@@CastorFurieux The clip he posted on twt clearly indicated some drama, if some personal stuff happend he wouldin't be such a sour bitch and just say it.

@rosalind1635

Жыл бұрын

@@CastorFurieux Yeah, no. There is no way in hell he hasn't heard about this drama. Unless he is accusing Hans and has tangible evidence of the fact he's a little bish for not putting out a statement. Regardless of the circumstances.

@allanshpeley4284

Жыл бұрын

@@CastorFurieux Unlikely bordering on impossible. Not only would that be monumentally coincidental given he lost to Hans the day before (and Hans' record of cheating), but he has plenty of close friends in the chess community with access to social media who would tell him to make a quick statement because the whole world, including Elon Musk thinks Hans is being accused of cheating.

Thank you for the upload I was really waiting for your opinion!

Man i was waiting for the legend to speak about this

I think Magnus is struggling with mental health and his team doesn't want him to talk about depression.

I was impatiently waiting for Ben's take on this issue. Not disappointed at all!

“Well, what are you gonna do I guess” 😂 perfect summary at the end there

I could listen to Ben all day 😂😂😂

@arnislapsa1619

Жыл бұрын

I do

@ericshoemaker9140

Жыл бұрын

He has a good radio voice, and his logic is not far out there. Personally, I think Hans cheated. But I can see Ben's point here.

Happy Birthday GM Ben

Hans needs to be given a cavity search to compete.

Imagine if he didn't cheat and he just got this incredible accomplishment and everyone calls you a cheater?

@user-zb8tq5pr4x

Жыл бұрын

@Superfluous Irrelevant. Either ban him from chess forever or he is innocent until proven guilty. If magnus hadn't withdrawn, NOBODY would suspect him of anything. And just because magnus quit, that doesn't make him right

@ElectricLadyland87

Жыл бұрын

@@user-zb8tq5pr4x how is it irrelevant? If you're at the highest level and get caught cheating, it unfortunately casts doubt on your entire career and any games after. It's a blemish on the record and will always be on people's minds. Whether it's fair or not, that's what it is.

@user-zb8tq5pr4x

Жыл бұрын

@@ElectricLadyland87 Never said it can't be on your mind. I said this case still needs to be proven on its own.

@FrenkieWest32

Жыл бұрын

@@user-zb8tq5pr4x of course it's not irrelevant... The comment is not about a court case; it's about what some people are thinking about.

@JimBalter

Жыл бұрын

@@ElectricLadyland87 " how is it irrelevant? If you're at the highest level and get caught cheating" He wasn't "at the highest level" when he cheated online at ages 12 and 16. Its only relevance is that profoundly stupid people infer from it that he cheated in his OTB game with Magnus.

Magnus and Hikaru, like everyone, should be able to say whatever is on their minds, but Hans shouldn't be punished based on a suspicion, so no one should be banning Hans from any platform without hard proof.

@davidquinn9676

Жыл бұрын

What you say isn't legally true, but I am not saying Magnus or Hikaru broke the law. But for sure, Magnus didn't behave in a way befitting his previously wonderful career and tenure as an available, informative WC who did great honest interviews. It's like a different person now. Also disappointed in Hikaru for the same sort of reason. When you're going to make such accusations, you'd better be right.

@henrikpettersson2886

Жыл бұрын

Proof is needed. I cant play chess so I wonder how GM:s in general would judge the game. Is there any obvious moves that doesn't make sense or can be explained?

@user-zb8tq5pr4x

Жыл бұрын

afaik Magnus never accused anyone of anything, so idk waht you on about

@alex2005z

Жыл бұрын

@@henrikpettersson2886 he knew the engines moves for a line Magnus had never played before and, when asked about it, claimed he had prepared and cited a game that never happened (not how he claims it went anyways). He also couldnt properly explain his moves. On top of that 2 years ago he was caught cheating (and that one was proven). See how this adds up to a potential cheating situation? (Not saying he did, but there is certainly reason to explore further to try to find profe on the subject)

@garethdewhurst1499

Жыл бұрын

@@alex2005z sure, that all seems a bit suspect, but on the other hand Hans is only 19 and has said he spends most of his time over the past few years studying or playing chess, so I wouldn't naturally assume that he should be super eloquent when giving interviews and an expert at explaining his thought processes, dude might just be a bit awkward when it comes to communicating...so that just leaves the prep...which is slightly odd but hardly proof of anything

Finegold is Hans' accomplice confirmed

Was waiting for your analysis

Hans said magnus was embarrassing to lose to somebody like himself and magnus cried and quit.

@sijenkai3928

Жыл бұрын

Lmaoo

If Magnus thinks Hans cheated he needs to wake up and apologize

@joeymurdazalotmore6355

Жыл бұрын

He's in his Viking feelings that Hans splacked em again

happy birthday Ben!🍟

Like his play OTB, Fischer always made it crystal clear why he withdrew from tournaments or refused to play.

On move 6 Magnus plays a3, good move -.09 black. Move 11, Nieman plays… e5 games is now drawn 0.0. 13. Rfd1 by Magnus -.22 on engine. After all the trades move 17, kf1 protecting hangin pawn by Magnus, innacuracy -.67 evaluated by engine. 18… Na5 by niemann, innacuracy, -.3. 21. C4 innacuracy by Magnus -.8 … Bxc4 innacuracy by niemann -.36. I could do the whole game. My point is *Both* players made mistakes. One didn’t take the other serious, and got outplayed. And if I’m wrong so be it. At least I’m not assuming.

@user-zb8tq5pr4x

Жыл бұрын

Your point is what exactly? You know how to use stockfish? Congrats. A difference of a few .1 is not a mistake. Lots of prepped computer lines make players go into "worse" positions that make the opponent make bad moves since they can't figure out the position. That's exactly what this game looked like.

@wateredmilk6089

Жыл бұрын

@@user-zb8tq5pr4x yeah exactly; that is literally the whole point of prep. The position might be objectively better for the opponent; but if the opponent is forced to find "only moves" while you blitz the moves out its likely they'll get in time trouble or miss one of the only moves. Fabiano is perfect at this.

@CastroMKE

Жыл бұрын

You guys all talk but I bet none of you have gone and looked at the game yourself. He was objectively losing early on in the game because he played a move that isn’t the best move. And then continued to do so. Because again, he underestimated his opponent. A lot of his last games he’s been trying to play out of the box and still win to prove he is so dominant (at least I think that’s why) and it did not workout in his favor this time.

@CastroMKE

Жыл бұрын

@@wateredmilk6089 this is a classical tournament no? We really using time trouble for the 2850 computer brain Magnus being unable to find the best move? He’s done it how many countless times? He’s literally beaten cheaters using stock fish online. (Or drawer them) so I think saying Magnus is unable to find the best moves is like saying he deserved to lose. 🤷🏽‍♂️

@CastroMKE

Жыл бұрын

Again go an analyze the game yourself and turn of the lines and evaluation and look at the review on the green site. When it says innacuracy, you look for a stronger move and I guarantee you will see them. These weren’t “only move” positions.

When Ben sticks to chess his content is always excellent. Here although no games were shown his content is still excellent because if there's anything Ben knows extremely well, it is how things work in the chess world. He's not the only one that is so well informed about the chess world of course. But no one else can do this in Ben's inimitable style. Well done Ben!

@nugsnothugs

Жыл бұрын

Yeah I just can't stand his inability go 4 minutes without forcing in his political and religious views. I'm trying to watch chess, not CNN

@YungElf

Жыл бұрын

@@nugsnothugs so don't watch him lmao?

@georgewbushcenterforintell147

Жыл бұрын

@@nugsnothugs that's just a silly statement. I deem you a silly goose.

Happy Birthday!

Happy birthday!!!

Most of HIkaru's stream is him showing other people commenting, interviewing Hans, etc., and being very amused that they clearly suspect Hans of something.

@Brandon-a-writer

Жыл бұрын

annnd Hikaru talking shit about Hans' past, suggesting he doesn't know what he's talking about in the interview "this is not 2700 level analysis" -- after a super long game against Alireza. Hikaru didn't equivocate, he outright said as much in that stream.

@mehloser880

Жыл бұрын

Hikaru is another dick who is insinuating all the time with extra stupid comments and trying to be Sherlock. What a Magnus brown noser! Hans's analysis is not 2700 level so .... he must be ... connect the dots ... All from a guy who played that Bd8 lemon against Ding. And then he has the temerity to say he did not accuse Hans. Stick to your stupid stream .. beating up on 1200 ELOs

@koho

Жыл бұрын

@@Brandon-a-writer Well, that same comment about Han's commentary was made by many GMs. Very odd. It's bizarre to watch. And Alireza and Nepo both alluded to Hans' strange play. I still think he probably didn't cheat, but Hikaru's observations are not unfair.

@bobon123

Жыл бұрын

@@Brandon-a-writer apparently Hikaru and Magnus (and Nepo, and Alireza) can't comment on the level of understanding of the game of chess shown by someone in a discussion (someone that was _caught_ cheating two or three times in the past six years), but plenty of random people can be sure everything is normal.

@Brandon-a-writer

Жыл бұрын

@@bobon123 there's a difference between being suspicious and accusing someone in an over the board tournament. Without evidence to suggest he has done anything wrong people seem to be willing to absolutely ruin this man's career despite him being man enough to admit his wrong doing. His past transactions do not make him guilty of this, and to treat him as such because of Carlsen's silence and Hikaru's direct accusations assumes two things: no one should be given a chance to better themselves and redeem themselves for past mistakes and two: he actually did something wrong. Everyone is being put on the spot and are nervous, they're chess players, not public speakers. MVL and Nepo have both spoken on behalf of Hans', does that mean nothing? Hikaru using his platform to direct this kind of hate and suspicion at Hans is deplorable --even if he has cheated. Yes, even if he has cheated there are ways of sportsmanship and dignity. If he has cheated, show that, show the evidence for it. But you must recognize the level of trauma this must inflict on someone who has not, as yet, been shown to have done anything wrong. He owned up to his past mistakes. That takes courage. That takes character. To admit to that in this world, amid all the speculation, is a demonstration of character. If there is evidence to suggest he cheated, beyond nitpicking his analysis after he's just spent 5 or 6 hours playing a long, draining game, listening to innuendo and suggesting he is guilty until proven innocent is a dangerous precedent and unbecoming of this sport. Everyone who plays in St. Louis is checked by way of the same means. Did you know that in a court of law, you cannot bring past acts into a criminal case to suggest guilt in a present indictment? That's correct: if a person has robbed 10 banks and is standing trial for bank robbery, those other 10 bank robberies will *not be allowed into evidence*. Why? Because that doesn't *actually prove* the person guilty of the specific indictment. He was charged with cheating on the internet, he pled guilty. He has now faced no charges, but has already been found guilty, and oh why the fuck do I bother? If he is found to be a cheater I will *eat my words* -- if he is found to be completely honest and forthcoming, are you and everyone else who have accused him prepared to eat yours? I want you to think about this. What would be the right thing to do, then? Should we not have the decency of character to actually wait before we bring further trauma to a potentially innocent individual who has admitted their past mistakes? Should we, as a community, be so without empathy that we say no one can atone for their sins, should we be so callous that we allow rumor and innuendo turn us into an unthinking, unfeeling mob? This kind of behavior is unwarranted without anything but the past infractions of a man who has admitted their error. This kind of behavior is uncalled for even if he's guilty. If he has cheated, let him be stripped of his GM title, fined, suspended, etc. Until then they are *innocent until proven otherwise.* Have the courage to stand up for something, even if it's just basic fucking human decency.

One of the most appropriate times to say:"The truth hurts."

@hrvojelasic5794

Жыл бұрын

and what is the truth?

You can't "think" something is a rumour. You know it or it is.

Thank you! Thank you for summing this up the correct way! x

Magnus had every right to withdraw. He accused nobody of anything. Let's just leave him alone.

It is obvious that Magnus insinuated, at the very least, to the officials that Hans cheated. The extra electronic security says it all! He withdrew to nullify Hans' victory against him. The dude gotta be punished, world champion or not. Everyone should be treated the same.

@terryboland3816

Жыл бұрын

You're making a serious allegation. Can you prove it?

@smartfck4

Жыл бұрын

@@terryboland3816 there's nothing to prove, magnus is acting like a spoiled brat

@dude157

Жыл бұрын

@@terryboland3816 He definitely told the promoters he was cheating. The promoters put a delay on the stream and also broadcast footage of them screening Hans for an extended period. I don't think the promoters were suspicious, they just did it to prove a point publicly (mainly to magnus) that the tournament is secure from cheating. They wouldn't do all that if he told them he was sick, or even if that Hans had his opening prep. They probably told Magnus it's best not to say anything public, and to just carry on as normal. It's more than possible he demanded something and when they refused he quit the tournament and posted the Jose clip.

@nicholas930

Жыл бұрын

@@terryboland3816 Magnus took a very serious action and he must justify the action taken. It is up to Magnus to accept punishment or explain what happened.

@Fddlstxx

Жыл бұрын

The man organizing the tournament said at the end of the day when Magnus had left that he'd spent the last ~12hrs behind closed doors trying to avoid that outcome. Just toddler level meltdown by Magnus. Shameful that they went & metal detector wanded Hans

Happy birthday!

Thanks again for the signing of my board at the chicago open. Been waiting for the opinion from Ben. Same bday as you love ya Ben! Thanks for this.

I have a wild theory. Hans won because he played better.

@bobdrooples

Жыл бұрын

Then trolled the eff out of mags. Well played

@atanasangelov4943

Жыл бұрын

Chess speaks for itself!

@farazsiddiqui1312

Жыл бұрын

I have a better one magnus left tournament maybe becuz of some emergency like ben said maybe I hope not maybe his family member is really sick and magnus was psychologically not feeling well played poorly and lost to hans fair and square..

@tomsnow2872

Жыл бұрын

@@egilelg9391 He peaked stockfish in the washroom.

@phaque3115

Жыл бұрын

Smashed Magnus soo hard he withdrew from the entire tournament.. what an absolute Legend..

Even if his prep was released come prepared to counter whatever he throws at you.

This incident leads me to your channel for the first time in years.

I have always admired Magnus, but I think the way he handled this is cowardly and an abuse of his power. He had no evidence so he just hurled an accusation at Hans and pretended he didn't. I say shame on him and Hikaru. No evidence, just a public lynching.

@elg7365

Жыл бұрын

To be honest magnus said nothing. After that they upped the security, and they had a 2 minute clip of them searching hans. So we assumed everything. Hikaru said he was caught cheating and that we can't know But if you get cheating noone believes you after that

@housey_

Жыл бұрын

@@elg7365 You'd have to think Magnus was an idiot to not know exactly what kind of speculation that tweet would cause

@knighterrant5772

Жыл бұрын

@@elg7365 Technically. But come on. Everyone knows what the Mourinho clip means.

@rxw5520

Жыл бұрын

Lmaoooo “accusation.” Y’all are fools and babies.

@Zainiology

Жыл бұрын

@@elg7365 Magnus did not say "nothing". He tweeted an extremely provocative insinuation with the Mourinho clip. He has to take responsibility for the consequences of his decision to leave and kill the tourney as well as the decision to post that stupid tweet. He should apologize

Isn't one of the issues that Han's moves don't seem to make sense yet were the top engine move and then he was unable to explain why he decided on the move? I'm pretty novice so I have no clue but a lot of top players being suspicious definitely raises a yellow flag.

@kristinadjurovic

Жыл бұрын

If Hans wanted to make up a reason, that wouldn't be hard. He just didn't want to talk about it since everyone is unfairly looking at him for cheating on a tablet as a 12 year-old.

@silymorn2240

Жыл бұрын

@@kristinadjurovic He cheated 3 years ago, also.

@hansguckinger5980

Жыл бұрын

@@silymorn2240 Online and not in tournaments.

@sharpvidtube

Жыл бұрын

@@hansguckinger5980 If someone has the cheating mindset online, why wouldn't they have the same mindset in tournaments? While cheating in real life is more difficult, there are obvious ways to do it, like getting hold of your opponents prep.

@JimBalter

Жыл бұрын

His moves make sense to people who aren't stupid fish.

Happy birthday brother!

don`t go fisher never go full fisher

Lot of relationship drama in chess. I didn't even know Hans and Magnus were dating

@threethrushes

Жыл бұрын

Relationship speaks for itself.

@cricfizzer4498

Жыл бұрын

Goddamn you redditorw

A very entertaining speculation at 5:19.

Was waiting for Ben lol

7 months later and we still don't know what exactly happened.

The most important question of all is: Why does Ben look like he's staring directly at the sun during this entire video?

@jocasd96miric

Жыл бұрын

i would like to know this as well. i hope he's fine

@koalabandit9166

Жыл бұрын

It's pain. The truth hurts.

@RC-xl2fj

Жыл бұрын

@@koalabandit9166 More like the tooth hurts. He just got back from the dentist.

Lots of theories flying around. Has it occurred to anyone that Magnus just lost, has a giant ego and is a sore loser and quit?

@James-zy8nh

Жыл бұрын

Why would he post that meme then?

@andrewkoines6389

Жыл бұрын

@@James-zy8nh Because it's better to lay the blame on someone else than to admit that he has a giant ego and is a sore loser and quit.

It’s best to be on team “I don’t know”, as Rozman said.

Happy Birthday Ben! Have a great rest of your evening

I think Carlsen is just continuing on his own personal Fisher-trip now. People forget that he was always kind of a sore loser and had a pretty arrogant attitude towards other players.

..Ben has a very strong sense of what’s right and logical, Rock solid analysis, well done Ben 👍

@googooboyy

Жыл бұрын

Yeah, but Ben doesn’t do psychoanalysis and if he had, he would certainly caught Hans cheating from his gestures and demeanours.

@benjaminghazi787

Жыл бұрын

Ben is a slob of a clown and a major idiot, he should stick to marginally decent chess analysis and shut the fuck up about things he as well as almost everyone has no clue about and claims them as fact, then demand an apology for.

@joshuasnell7942

Жыл бұрын

@@googooboyy psychoanalysis is pseudoscience. As a cognitive neuroscientist, I can confirm we have moved on 100 years after Freud

@pigs6486

Жыл бұрын

@@joshuasnell7942 Cool story bro!

Magnus is cracking up like Fischer. He's 2 years from being tortured in a Pasadena jailhouse.

Or Magnus is playing chess with us and we are the pawns.

If you're going to yoink his prep, you do it in a match that matters 50x more. You give it to Nepo in the world championship, doing it now at Sinquefield with Hans would be moronic.

@CharlesXVll

Жыл бұрын

All other GM's would decline. They don’t want cheap wins. Especially not in such an important tournament like WCC.

@sharpvidtube

Жыл бұрын

Depends how Hans managed to get hold of it. I wonder how good he is at hacking😂

Magnus has a terribly inflated ego. I tend to be rather of the opinion, that he could not accept his failure and was more willing to accuse Hans of cheating rather than not to be a sore loser.

@NJ-wb1cz

Жыл бұрын

Hans also trolled Magnus in his post game interview, this was the first time it happened

Be Magnus, make a vague statement on twitter and don't follow it up leaving everyone questioning what's going on.

@timkom2289

Жыл бұрын

Unless he is blackmailed by mafia he makes major dick move.

Happy Birthday sir!

They stop strangers on the street, "I GOT COVID",...........slap 🤣🤣 3:00

Maybe Magnus was accused of cheating and felt insulted and decided to withdraw. It’s the only thing that makes sense with his cryptic message and the anti cheating measures implemented the next day.

happy bday finegold🥳🥳🥳🥳

BEN,Your colour coordination is so sweet lol🤟🤟🤟 Finegold is bang on point,I bloody love this guy

Finally someone talking some sense - Thank you Ben My theory is Magnus is frustrated and/or bored of chess (see: declining to defend World title) and is withdrawing as a tantrum

@vagnerwanilla785

Жыл бұрын

In my opinion there's no relevancy whatsoever between Magnus giving his title up & him withdrawing the tournament

@smrtfasizmu6161

Жыл бұрын

My exact thoughts.

@vkvk7113

Жыл бұрын

Or he's withdrawing because he doesn't want to play with a cheater in the tournament. Truly astounding that how hard this is to grasp for some people.

@gsg6372

Жыл бұрын

@@vagnerwanilla785 I agree, there is no evident correlation between Magnus not defending his World title and withdrawing from this tournament. It's simply not known why Magnus withdrew.

@smrtfasizmu6161

Жыл бұрын

@@vkvk7113 He already played against Hans. The rest of the tournament he would play against players he doesn't view as cheaters. If your reason is true than Carlsen behaves like a toddler.

Lmao Ben getting the twofer being right on Hans and Hikaru. And on his birthday to boot! Go Ben!!!

Thank you Fen Binegold

Happy birthday

"maybe Magnus cheated" lmao

@dwightPhoenix

Жыл бұрын

Wow....Very interesting point!!

Why is ben making weird faces

Now everything is clear. Hans stole Carlsen's prep, he ate a Stockfish before the game and he gave Magnus Covid.

Hans is like the kid at school that wants to shoot everyone, but he found chess.

Thanks!