Hi guys! I arrived in Chicago after a long trip to go to MRRF! I haven't gotten the time yet to respond to your questions and suggestions, but I soon will. Maybe meet you there!

@RegularOldDan

2 жыл бұрын

Aw, man. I couldn't make it this year. 😢 I hope I get the opportunity at a future MRRF. Have a good time there! Awesome work on this - I can't wait to see what comes of it.

@xander7462

2 жыл бұрын

Welcome to 🇺🇸, swing by Denver, I'll buy that coffee I owe you!

@gillou4382

2 жыл бұрын

You don’t have the squish of SLA and you are not doing small cross section free form print so To counter balance the tiny surface tension effect. Start by printing the inside wall and apply a Z shift at each layer. That should do the trick and allow you to use low viscosity resin which would be the easiest to prevent leaks

@mr_voron

2 жыл бұрын

Absolute pleasure to meet you at MRRF. You’re the best kind of a mad scientist!

@and3d633

Жыл бұрын

Awesome experiments. Great note on safety for the lasers, but you missed a very important warning with this type of work. Photopolymer resins give off heat when curing. If you have some on your hands (even with gloves) it can burn you if it starts curing - if too much uv light hits the spot. Be careful, even a smudge can burn you to blistering level.

Hands down one of the best printing youtubers a lot of people don't know about.

@groggynod

2 жыл бұрын

Hands down thumbs up

@danmurphy5660

Жыл бұрын

Just found out about him and he got a sub about 2 mins into this vid.

@mads6103

Жыл бұрын

Yup, very high quality video too, camera wise

The worst part about your videos is that they end. I need to see this succeed now, i'm invested! :D

@maxbanner4536

2 жыл бұрын

Thin the mix. Add a tiny spray head of resin, like spray painting, the laser cures the "paint". Attach a standard 3d print head to your rig. Precise controlled color depths for 3d prints. This way its lack of layering is a benefit. Easy to scale up to full color printing. You could also combine it with a 3d scanner and make an automated 3d coloring device for existing 3d prints.

@properprinting

Жыл бұрын

We're going to get this to succeed!

@chrisBruner

Жыл бұрын

@@properprinting Why are you curing the resin right near the print head. Put a shade system so that what you are actually printing doesn't get cured until it moves outside of the print area. Also the fibre optics. make a loop, and sand it. The light will come out the sides instead of the end.

This was the toughest video I've made so far. I badly underestimated FDM printing with resin, but I'm happy with the result. The pump on itself already enables some interesting possibilities for the extruder series! If you've got suggestions on how to FDM print resin, than let us know in the comments!

@SilvioTisato

2 жыл бұрын

What about turning off the laser on travel moves? If you are controlling it with the fan output, you can just wrap all G0 moves in M107 - M106. Then even if it leaks resin it will stay liquid. Also in DIW adding a filler to change the rheology is very common (eg SiO2 or TiO2). PS is the pump design uploaded somewhere? Kinda want to try it out

@daliasprints9798

2 жыл бұрын

@@SilvioTisato You could even program firmware retract to do that.

@SilvioTisato

2 жыл бұрын

@@daliasprints9798 Yep, although that depends on the firmware you're running. I know for sure you can do it with duet, but I haven't had to do it with others. Also you might want retract to lower pressure in the needle, though that quickly result in air bubbles. The M106-107 is just a regex substitution

@vladl990

2 жыл бұрын

Interesting idea, love it! On a topic of predictable flow I would suggest trying a system with a reservoir residing above the printer(maybe on a shelf) such that it can introduce a manageable pressure in the tube. Pump may add the resin to the reservoir at a predictable pace and reservoir will act a a buffer to have enough resin to keep needed pressure. Then the two challenges still left: a) stop the flow and b) control the flow intensity. To be able to stop the flow I would add a small solenoid to close the resin output right at the print head; just before the nozzle. And to be able to control the flow I would try to have a prolonged/rectangular shaped reservoir, such that when rotated/tilted the height of the resin change and pressure change with it. Idea with tilting resin reservoir will require a motor of some kind. This whole idea is very dependent on ether ton of experiment or a mode to predict its physical behavior. Anyway, good luck with the project!

@wizardOfRobots

2 жыл бұрын

How about spraying the resin, that way you could get higher resolution as well.

When people are amazed by engineers they think it’s just because of how smart they are. In reality it’s often the dedication and patience that makes them uniquely capable.

@funx24X7

Жыл бұрын

Very true. Most people see just the finished product, not the (sometimes many) iterations to get to that point.

@glennedward2201

Жыл бұрын

All it takes is an ambitious person who is mechanically inclined. Anyone 3d printing should already be mechanically inclined.

The pulsation can be solved by using 2 tubes. Both tubes run on the same set of rollers but the outside housing has a phase shift for both tubes. This way the pulse of 1 tube falls in the dead period of the other. Watson Marlow (Dutch peristaltic pump manufacturer) has a few model doing this running in the lab here.

@properprinting

Жыл бұрын

Thanks for the info! As it looks for now it seems not to be pulsating too much with this design. One tube makes it easier to work with, so I hope I can stick to it.

@rafsh1846

Жыл бұрын

And we have car engine

You sir are a mad scientist and I love it!

@michaelramos4482

Жыл бұрын

What’s up Uncle Jessy! Fancy seeing you here!

you need gel instead of liquid, liquids will move on you before curing and it retracts unpredictably. I would like to see some trace testing to tune every parameters, you can't use standard fdm parameters. You need to cover a wide spectrum of values because you're into unknown territory. We don't know if the fluctuation in extrusion is causing real issues. When the first layer is nice, then test to stack them and succeed to have consistent height. I would try pointing the laser on the nozzle and use high speed printing to avoid clogging. Considering each layer will cure more previously laid ones, the power of the laser needs to be tuned to barely solidify the resin with one pass, this will reduce clogging. We can check if the layers need to be thinner than the nozzle diameter and if prefers over or under extrusion. if the resulting parts are tacky, it's not an issue you can cure them after.

16:48 - So the resin itself is acting as a light pipe, allowing the reflected UV light to travel up the nozzle and prematurely cure the material. I didn't see that coming.

@puerlatinophilus3037

2 жыл бұрын

So kinda "upstream contamination" but with light. Maybe printing with dark / black resin could prevent it? Or maybe just adding some coal powder / dark pigment to existing resin could do the trick?

@adamrak7560

2 жыл бұрын

@@puerlatinophilus3037 TiO2 works too (white pigment), it absorbs UV really well. But dialing in the amount of pigment is not easy.

@puerlatinophilus3037

2 жыл бұрын

@@adamrak7560 Sad that this means another limitation but depending on the resin's thermal resistance, it is a possible upgrade in some context

@sumduma55

Жыл бұрын

@@puerlatinophilus3037 the resin itself needs this light pipe type of process (penatrating) in order for any curing past the surface level of the print regardless of the method used to print. I think what we are seeing here is actually seeing. How we know an object is somewhere generally relies on light waves reflecting from its surface or the absence of that. This is no different. The laser light is reflecting from the surfaces and penatrating the nozel. Either controlling the light or shielding the actual nozzle or both is what will be needed. But I guess if it was that easy, they would be mass produced and on the market by now. So what do I know.

@evuroinc

Жыл бұрын

I think I did this manually many times in the lab from 1999 to 2007.

Have you tried/considered a non translucent resin? I think ideally something dark like black. I think the issue is that the resin refracts some of the laser internally, and funnels it up the nozzle opening like an optic fibre. Perhaps a less translucent resin would prevent this. It would be a lot slower but you could also try doing dropwise extrusion (and retract to break the physical connection between the resin in nozzle and the print, possibly mitigating the optic fibre like effect)? or print a layer then cure it?

@durandalgmx7633

Жыл бұрын

The resin needs to be translucent else the UV won't reach and cures the inside.

@edsilver

Жыл бұрын

I'd print an entire layer and then move the nozzle out of the way and blast the build plate with uv

@bryanst.martin7134

Жыл бұрын

@@durandalgmx7633 Don't forget that even visually opaque resins could be translucent to the UV.

@durandalgmx7633

Жыл бұрын

@@bryanst.martin7134 That's true

@Embusque

Жыл бұрын

I was thinking along that line as well, when you watch Joel's video the resin used is an opaque white. A different resin should do the trick, hope it gets resolved it would be an awesome addition to the tool box.

One note on the optical fibers, they can actually fail to reflect the light along the fiber if the bend radius is to small, maybe that was also a reason why the first design failed

@aaronleiter9009

2 жыл бұрын

Bingo.

@alexscarbro796

2 жыл бұрын

Whilst we can see “some light” at the end of the fibres, some materials have much lower transmission at UV wavelengths. For example Germicidal 250nm fluorescent tubes have to be made with quartz as glass filters a lot of the energy at this wavelength. I suspect end polishing of the fibres also has an impact.

@guillermomarturetfendt9037

2 жыл бұрын

In this case it was because of the fucked up surface. One cannot cut fibre optic cable with a kitchen knife and expect it to transmit light perfectly. The cables must be cut with a special tool that makes sure the surfice is perpendicular and doesn't have defects. You also need to align very well the start of the fibre to the laser beam making sure it also is parallel to the beam. If the laser is coming at an angle, there will be huge reflections at the beginning. I liked his idea don't get me wrong, but it is pretty clear he didn't research how fibre optics cables work

Maybe more like an ink jet and pulsing the laser… But bravo again. Every issue I wanted to make a suggestion and each time you made the same conclusion. Love it

@Slot1Gamer

Жыл бұрын

thats how the commercial FDM uv gel printer works

Your zero-pulse pump solution surprised me, very cool and elegant. I thought you'd need two running out of phase into a Y-adapter.

@ColinMacKenzieRobots

Жыл бұрын

I think this would work. You can use the same motor and just use a stacked design but with offsets. Y's on the ins and outs.

@glennedward2201

Жыл бұрын

Having an oblong or egg shape may reduce the pulsing and improve consistent flow.

I have made some projects similiar to yours, i like finding someone with similiar problems and stuff (but you are way better i'd say) i can't find anyone like you you are severely underrated

Absolutely love your videos! The thing I love most is watching you work through issues and roadblocks. Not only have I learned a ton from watching your videos, but you've inspired me to be more experimental. Some of my experiments work out, some don't, but the most important thing is I learn from each and every one.

@properprinting

Жыл бұрын

Awesome, I'm so glad to read this!

I like this guy. I just found this video and he seems to not pretend to know what he's doing but at the same time knows how to make things work. Very fun to watch.

Edison would have been proud of you as this is a perfect example of his theory of repetitive experiments where creative failure leads to progressive knowledge accumulation. Good Work.

I love that you don't back down from a challenge. That is the attitude!!!!

Man, you do the coolest experiments!

a highly underrated channel, I want to come back to you have a million+ subscribers... keep up the fine work

Bro! You are just Nikola Tesla of 3D printing! Never give up and keep going!!!! We all love you ❤️❤️❤️❤️❤️

Best music of any 3D-printing KZread channel for sure.

You are the most Swedish person I have ever seen. You are the literal stereotype of a Swede. I have a Swedish friend and he agrees. So I can’t be wrong. 😁

This is actually a really brilliant idea. Way less messy than a normal resin printer.

Whether you get this working or not, this project and several other videos on your channel are truly inspirational! I don't have anywhere near your level of design skills or engineering knowledge, hell, I don't even own a 3D printer but I can't wait to see what you come up with next! Goed bezig kerel! 👍

Mate you have the best 3D printing channel by far.

Jon, you truly are a madman. And we all love it. Keep doing what you're doing

I had this idea a long time ago back when there was a kickstarter for a UV resin pen. I forgot about it entirely and I'm glad you have taken the time to work on this.

Your ingenuity is really astonishing! keep up the great work an videos!

I love your ingenuity in making stuff. So happy to have found you.

Great vid! Seeing the whole process and all the things that didn’t work is super-valuable. Whatever you’re showing may not be immediately or directly applicable to any specific project I’m working on, but I get a tremendous amount of learning and understanding from watching your vids! 👍👍👍

I absolutely cannot wait for the follow up on this. I thought of doing this the other day, but you've gone and done it! Good work getting so close! I want to see this become possible!

I just love your perseverance and patience! With your ingenuity, you will get this done I am certain. What a process! But, what a great idea!! Keep going ...

Super inspiring to see someone beyond a large company is finally experimenting with this.

You Sir, have patients of steel! Ingenious problem solving here, keep going!! I wish you all the success with your creations!!!

Love the clean editing and montage coupled with a quiet chaotic energy seeping through. Keep up the good work!

Loved it. I've been meaning to test this same thing for years now, you gave me a lot of answers and I enjoyed the process! Thanks, subscribed!

You tried the idea that I have been thinking of for about a year, great job! I would use multiple UV LED's in a circle pointing at just below the nozzle. The point is you don't need to fully cure the model during printing, so you won't need that much power delivered by a UV laser. The model can be fully cured later in a UV chamber, we just want this to get the proper model shape in the first place.

I love your engineering approach, great results, keep it up.

That was completely epic. I felt every fail, and rebuild. You have such amazing ideas.

Haven't been this captivated by a video in awhile, truly great content.

I work with lab instruments that use peri-pumps. They have a lot of advantages, such as easily adjusting flow and volume by changing the ID of the pump tubing. You can eliminate the pulsing by using the flexibility of the tubing between the pump and nozzle as a pressure receiver. If the flow from the pump is slightly higher than the nozzle size can handle, the tubing between the pump and nozzle will pressurise and expand slightly , acting like bellows to absorb the pressure pulses. Also, having more rollers reduces the volume of the tubing between rollers and therefore the volume that is pumped with each revolution. Most commercial peri-pumps use only 2 or 3 rollers.

@RocketMagnetUK

2 жыл бұрын

I used to use peristaltic pumps. I also recall them only having about 3 rollers and they definitely delivered continuous flow to lab instruments. I remember calibrating the flow and we used special tubing in the actual pump section with coloured tags on each end which indicated the flow range based on ID, these tags locked in place to stop tube movement and put the tube in the pump under slight tension.. helps with pulsing and stops tube feed. Main issue with a peristaltic is over time it damages the tube changing the flow or even wearing through completely. So another reason for the short section in the pump as you just replace that small length each time. Overall I think he should take a quick look at lab grade peristaltic pumps as they solved all these issues decades ago.

@paulg3336

Жыл бұрын

@@RocketMagnetUK I agree . There are many different designs. I have even seen hospital infusion pumps that used many flat plates operated by a helical cam to pinch the tubing in a continuous wave. A company like Watson Marlowe would be able to give him all the information he needs

Love it, I understand you pain always have more material on hand as the first time you don't succeed try, try, try, and then try once again thank you for showing your struggles 😊

Absolutely awesome work , the design you have made is cool. And as usual your video is entertaining and teaches us allot. Thank you Jon.

Great video - really interesting to see the difficulties in practice, showing it's far from trivial to engineer.

Watching you be frustrated is more satisfying than when I actually get something to work.

Simply amazing, you are a hell of an engineer! Congrats man

Great video. I love your approach to developing the process.

It's always a good day when there's a new Proper Printing video.

Hi really nice project. I have worked in a lab for uv curable resins but I have no experience with 3d resis. There are basically two kinds of catalyst for this typ of stuff. Radical and Kationic catalysts. The radical ones have the advantage that they stop working when Light is emited which is super important for high res., while the Kationic once continue after the UV is gone but they are way slower. So you actually could use a really thick resin with a cationic catalyst. It would allow the resin to cure after it has left the nozzle. But you would need rather thick layers and would have low resolution, but you actually might be able to get super fast printing speeds. If you do not care about colours curcumin is actually a pretty good kationic catalyst. Greetings from Germany

Brilliant!!! Very Cool 😎 You always impresses me with new technology/idea in very practical home brewing approach.

You're completely MAD ! I love it !

You’re such a brilliant young man.

So cool that you are working on this.. I had thought about doing this for a while but you are doing it! I wish I could work with you man.. Love your vids. You crack me up somtimes.. Peace brother Rolfie

Hey man.... greetings from Brazil. Long time no talk!!! I told you your channel would bem twice as mine in no time didn't I? Congrats your videos are awesome as always!!! The Karmeliet in the end is just the cherry on top!!! Best Beer ever!!!

@properprinting

Жыл бұрын

You did! Thanks man :D

The beer seemed to be the most satisfying for you! Never give up!

Really cool solution to reduce pulsations in the peristaltic pump! I've only ever seen pulsation dampeners used before...

This is so cool man. Great perseverance!

OMG... that video was amazing! I love to see the progress in that

Amazing, as always! Have your sponsor make you a custom resin that is more cohesive like silicone sealant texture or toothpaste so there is no surface tension trying to form drops. I believe that is why your nozzle ends up scraping. The trick will be to balance thickness vs 'pumpability'

excellent attempt - really enjoyed the process

So good! I love the fails as I love the results.

Maybe the metal build plate was reflecting the uv into the nozzle. A solution would be to do two passes. Extrusion pass and curing pass for each layer

@specialingu

2 жыл бұрын

it might be the resin reflects the light too, could use black resin and big retractions maybe ?

Wow, what a cool video and idea! I've seen some great suggestions in the comment section about pulsing the lasers. I am not an engineer by any means, but perhaps a "simpler" first attempt would be to extrude the resin with the laser off, then run the same path (without extruding the resin) with the laser on to cure the resin. The higher viscosity resin would probably be more ideal, since it better resists flowing away from the previously deposited layer. Yes, you are running the same print moves twice which will greatly increase the "print time", but I don't know that speed is necessary concern at this stage. Just an idea (maybe others had it in the comments too). I am looking forward to your next video!

brilliant man ive been thinking of doing the same thing for some time. glad the lazer is working like i thought it would

I love it! I had this idea that was "kinda" like this, but instead it was using a "Flatbed UV Printer" but still print in 3D. I cant wait for the future!

I totally had a similar heat related issue when playing with the plastic optical fibers on a project. Even got glue would partially melt the fibers, and be responsible for blocking the proper light transmission. I felt your pain my friend.

this open another level of 3d printing

You do a very clean job !

this is the future keep the work !!!!

This was amazing! Nice print!

I love the idea for the pump design. I'm designing a powder binding 3d printer, the pump and the printhead is basically what I'm looking for to improve the design. Thanks

I watched the same KZread video and thought the process would be the end all in 3D printing. I have two suggestions. Lose the laser. Go with what we know already works, UV leds. Cheaper and easier to work with. you'll still need some way the shield people from the light. Second use a tank to store the resin and air pressure to pump it. You can control the pressure very precisely and electronic valve to turn the flow on and off. Good luck and I'd love to see you make this work.

No words, just awesome!

I think your on the right track using a standard Nozzle shape, the V angles down towards the tip so no matter which direction the nozzle goes any oozing will flow back to the tip. With normal fdm the plastic is always soft and will be wiped off when the direction changes and gets 'run over' in the part when the nozzle returns thus it doesn't accumulate but with resin it needs to get cleared asap. the standard nozzle looked the best if you can sort the leaks.....hope this is some help, Andrew. love watching you work ....it's FUN

Inkjet printing has had similar flow issues with nozzles, one of the ones that worked well there was with a piezoelectric crystal for a drop on demand printhead. This was used to control droplet size and speed of droplet ejection from a reservoir. Very exciting to see this, looking forward to more updates.

This is great. Love your work!

Printing is looking great, very confident you will get this right. If you wish to steady the flow from your pump fit an accumulator. They are used to even the pulses created from a pump system easy install.

Awesome project and progress, as always!

Commenting before finishing the video, I just had to say that the water printing part had me genuinely laughing, thank you for this great video and all your efforts.

Really nice, maybe instead of trying to cure full cure the resin while printing you can add a UV lamp and after every layer the nozzle go to a light protected place, turn on the Light for a couple of second and then continue printing

@Karavusk

2 жыл бұрын

It won't stay it place this way. The resin is still a liquid that would flow down while you are printing one layer. You need to constantly cure resin that was just extruded.

@MaxFenix8k

2 жыл бұрын

@@Karavusk it depends on the layer thickness, the surface tension of the resin and the nozzle diameter, you can add something to the resin so it get thicker, like baby powder, the video you quote use a thicker resin more like a gel

Haha that's so awesome man. I love your videos soo much. You are an inspiration. Keep them coming

wat een video zo cool dat je gewoon het probeert en niet opgeeft als het een keer mis gaat super goede video

@properprinting

Жыл бұрын

Bedankt Thomas!

I wish more 3d printing channels were like your's and Ivan Miranda's you guys push 3d printing to its limit and have fun with it. Ps: if you get this working I would love to see you revisit the car rim idea again with tough resin.

Great video despite the fall

super amazing! very cool stuff man!

I am not an engineer, and i respect you for all of this, i don't really know some things that you are talking about, and i laughed a bit too much in some parts( you are funny :D). Keep up the good job of doing what you like .

Love the idea of this video. Look forward to more content on this idea!

tremendous challenge, that effort was titanic, a lot of desperation, but science is like that, success and error, greetings from Mexico, I am attentive to your videos.

Ive definitely thought about this from time to time. Love to see someone doing it! I have also wondered about using lasers as an active post processing process on an fdm printer too. Maybe the next project?

Hi Adam, I tested this solution last year and my best results were on my old coreXY by reversing my bed plate and axles. print upwards, the resin holds better to the plate and the prints are clean!

Great video, even with nordic accent you make it look good. Well done.

I genuinely don't understand why you don't have more subscribers Also, the fact that you could see the light coming from the sides of the fiber probably means you weren't getting proper total internal reflection

no suggestions just a wow for even doing this.

Great video! I would use an air pump inside the bottle, and a valve on the nozzle instead of a pump, like the system used in the m3 max to top up the tank. Also i would try to print at very low temperature to have a viscous resin, much more like the gel in noel's video. That would allow to increase distance of the laser light from the nozzle and prevent clogging. Just my 2 cents here.

@FedericoAlbano83

Жыл бұрын

@Arpad Toth you just need to build enough pressure. Anycubic use the very same method to automatically top up the vat in the m3 plus and max printers: a sealed cap on the resin bottle and a small air pump that just pumps air into the bottle which then sends out resin to the vat.

@filanfyretracker

Жыл бұрын

@Arpad Toth just need to have enough pressure, people who have a well for their domestic water supply the water is pumped into a tank with an air bladder which then pushes into the house. Our old house had that and it kept a steady 60PSI. In theory a hybrid system would work to eliminate the issues of pulsing, a pressurized tank and the pump constantly pushes resin into this tank while an pressurized air pocket moves the water along. Just like how the well pump pushes water into the storage tank but the air bladder pushes it up into the home.

Sugesstion, paint the printning surface mate black, and use black resin to prevent ligth leaks, use a weaker lazer or dim it out, you tecnically can shine a weak lazer directly to the center, but, weaker so it doesnt solidify instantly, more like a flash ligth, that wen the center of the lazer gets away from the printnted point a second ago its solid enough to hold it self up, untill the next layer goes over

Amazing man! You should definitely keep working on this! Maybe try with pulsing the lasers? More like when laser engraving something grayscale. But that could be quite tricky on the gcode side. Great work!

you sir, are amazing. thank you for your work

OK that's the first time a subscribe prompt has been so epic it made me immediately subscribe.

I love the range of emotions that goes on in the video, from happy exictied that laser will cure the resin to English isnt spoken and just pure dissappointment