Most important takeway as usual. It doesn't matter how many hours you have flying, checklists are always of the utmost importance.

@mitseraffej5812

Жыл бұрын

I agree, but also not just giving lip service to the checklist. Actually look and verify that what you say or think matches reality.

@chipsawdust5816

Жыл бұрын

Even in my old 172 I always followed my checklist. In a twin, it's even more important, as there are many more systems involved. In an airplane carrying paying passengers, it's an unforgivable oversight.

@steinrich56

6 ай бұрын

Spot on.....!@@mitseraffej5812

Like this one, every disaster I've ever seen--as an anesthesiologist working in operating rooms--has been a combination of complacency and numerous safeguards ignored. It's never just ONE thing. Or, it's forgetting about weight and balance because it's rarely an issue: most anesthesiologists do NOT check the emergency oxygen tank each day (which is rarely used)...............and each has a different excuse for not performing this basic "pre-flight".

@danny-li6io

Жыл бұрын

Great analogy! When human lives are on the line, you don’t skip anything, even if it’s considered trivial or a formality.

@JavierBonillaC

Жыл бұрын

Doctor, you are scaring me! I’ve had 24 general anesthesia surgeries (big skydiving accident).😂😂

@AmandaCadorna

10 ай бұрын

Or there's the old stand-by scapegoat...nurses. Blame the nurses! 😬

@BruceLeigh-eu3wm

10 ай бұрын

Mac or Miller?

Mistakes of complacency or impatience are among the deadliest in the world of flight.

@montgomeryscot6623

Жыл бұрын

And yet so avoidable.

If you have to take your time to be sure everything is set right for takeoff, so be it. Time lost is better than lives lost!

@CuriousPilot90

2 жыл бұрын

Very True!

@haroldbrown1998

Жыл бұрын

So so so right. I flew back in the 70s and you just can't be to careful.

@anthonysmith3851

Жыл бұрын

It is required by regulation and common sense.

@waveman2952

Жыл бұрын

They should have done that and held it down longer to gain more speed since they were heavy. Pilot error too bad.

@chrispetty8587

Жыл бұрын

You are absolutely correct. After all what would you give to have the people back that you would kill if you missed something. Take your time and do everything and physically check items with a check mark. Which will require you to do it properly by slowing you down because a check mark is required for you to move on. And yes I use this system even though it is on a semi truck the results Will be the same. Take your one. The life you save could very well be your own. No to mention your wife and kids life if they are with you. I can assure you that you do not want to bury your child that unfortunately I know first hand how absolutely painful it is to bury your own child. It’s nothing you ever want to experience. So save your own life slow down and live. Dlying and preflight inspections ahoupd becwr be a rushed thing to do because I’d the potential cost you could pay is a cost I guaranteeyou I is not something you ever need any to do. Just because you chose to be in a rush slow down and be thorough. As I said the life you save may be your own or you wife’s or God forbid you child. No matter how their age. Mine as 31 and I was deveatatinf and I pray you never have to bury your child because it will break you permanently. Take my word for it.

So glad I found this channel, fantastic work so far!

@CuriousPilot90

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks 😁

@tommygun6866

2 жыл бұрын

Same

It’s been 30 years since I was flying King Airs but I’m sure with a bit of effort in the rudder department the airplane would have been controllable. This is why aircraft have rudder peddles and pilots have legs.

@henryarn

Жыл бұрын

Apparently due to the torque caused by the extreme trim setting created a loss of lift plus being overweight added to problem as stated in the video. Very tragic.

@Charon58

Жыл бұрын

I fly an E-90. Full rudder trim would be very difficult to overcome. However, if I was in this situation, I would assume I’d had a left (critical) engine failure. Push as hard as you can on the Rt rudder, get the damn gear up and pitch for VYSE. My next action would be turning in Rt rudder trim to ease the rudder forces. Those actions would have had a good chance of keeping the plane airborne. I don’t know why this pilot didn’t do these things but I’m betting (and it wasn’t talked about in the video) he hadn’t had recent recurrent training on emergencies.

@ozone7

Жыл бұрын

@@Charon58 "My next action would be turning in Rt rudder trim to ease the rudder forces. Those actions would have had a good chance of keeping the plane airborne" Absolutely! Because the moment the pilot touched the rudder-trim, the cause of the whole problem would immedeately become obvious...

@gnarthdarkanen7464

Жыл бұрын

@@ozone7 Well, obvious or not, the TRAINING is to "trim out" with extreme manipulations to the controls... It would become obvious TO THE PILOT however, when he "trimmed out" the rudder controls and had a nervous chance to glance down to the trim control, seeing it "centered" where it should've been before he took off... What Charon58's talking about, is primarily GET THE HELL UP... meaning, get AWAY from obstacles, ground, and stuff that will end the flight instantly. IF you can create the space to work it out, you can overcome quite a lot in the cockpit just with the basic controls... BUT right AT take-off, you just don't have altitude or speed to work with. There's nothing to trade and no room to maneuver. ;o)

@Brandis56

Жыл бұрын

my question would be why was the rudder full left in the first place. was he the last pilot to fly it did he have fuel transfer problems on the last flight .If that is an actual picture of the prop strikes that prop was in near flat pitch.

Nice presentation and not long winded. Ignoring pre flight checks or doing them incorrectly leads to accidents. Good find on the local buildings being too high. 👍

@normancrawford1223

Жыл бұрын

Regardless of the type of aircraft you are flying you should always assume that there is a CVR on board. If I did something from memory I would always back it up with the checklist. It’s amazing how often you miss items.

@davecruz9893

Жыл бұрын

STUPID DOESNT TRUM BUILDING HEIGHT.....GET REAL...Lets blame something else why dont we....

what scary the most is the fact that the pilot has had thousands of hours on this equipment, yet overlooked a very simple step.

@Bartonovich52

Жыл бұрын

This is often more likely the case than not. It’s complacency that kills.

@Cazador60140

Жыл бұрын

He will know next time around

@dgriffin6074

Жыл бұрын

@@Bartonovich52 True enough. One wants just enough complacency to get by.

Great video. Thankyou. It seems that thousands of hours of experience did not help this pilot's reaction to the immediate problem on take-off (let alone creating it in the first place). Instead of thinking on his feet, he gave up and simply called 'Mayday' on the radio. I understand that pilots of large airlines regularly train for anomalies and hence a little more prepared to 'keep their heads' in an unexpected situation while flying. This is so important especially for twin and multiengined aircraft which are potentially more hazardous to fly if something goes wrong, particularly with asymmetry.

I hate to say it, being an old codger myself, but the main cause of this unfortunate tragedy could be the age of the pilot. You can be mentally sharp at that age but also prone to the simplest mistakes, and lapses of concentration - like checking the trim wheel to the right and left and then forgetting to center it again, or not properly calculating weight (hey only 4 passengers, why worry). Leaving the wheels down because it's not something he's ever had to practice and your reaction time at that age is slower and it's easy to miss steps you should have taken. I just did this on while setting up footage for a documentary I'm editing. Found a series of mistakes a day after I made them. Not a big deal because no one's life was on the line. The other thing at that age is that he might have developed some bad habits and didn't see the need for following the actual checklist each time, just going off memory. I'm curious - if you actually looked at everything with a keen eye during your walk around, wouldn't you be able to notice how the plane was trimmed? I mean, the trim tabs should be obvious on the flight surfaces - it's not some setting hidden behind the last passenger seat or something. He could have looked at it directly during his walk arounds and just missed it. Being 67, his age may have increased the likelihood of missing something like that.

@awittypilot8961

Жыл бұрын

Do you fly? I'm 67 and still very sharp. I personally would FAR rather fly behind a guy with many years experience than a young snot nosed know it all that thinks age is a handicap. I've seen young pilots make the most stupid mistakes you can imagine. And if you think putting the gear up in this case would have made enough difference to prevent this crash then you really have no idea what you're talking about. You do NOT put your gear in the wells until you have established a positive rate of climb. They obviously never got a positive rate. I also doubt rudder trim was the culprit because it never went fast enough that the trim would have made the yaw uncontrollable so much that the pedals could not have overcome the yaw. And 500lbs overweight for a King Air 200 is not so great that it would have caused this accident. I've been flying for more than 37 years and have more than 13k hours in many different aircraft including helicopter. My guess on this is more than likely a fuel filter causing a reduction in power but not enough to shut it down. It may have been running on impact but not making enough power to keep it in the air.

@boydmccollum692

Жыл бұрын

@@awittypilot8961 I'm 60 and very sharp, too. But I wouldn't say I was as sharp as when I was 20 or 25. Being an old guy, I've seen my share of young guys making stupid mistakes. I've seen older guys make stupid mistakes too. It's all individual, you should know that. An example of how sharp I am, without rewatching the video, I used the information from one viewing two weeks ago, and the accident came up as the 2nd result behind a King Air accident in 2000 flying out of Perth. Here are the actual results of the official investigation: "An investigation by the Australian Transport Safety Bureau determined the accident was a result of one of the flight control trim tabs being set incorrectly. Failure of the pilot to realise the rudder trim was set fully to the left caused a longer than normal takeoff, and caused the aircraft to slip and yaw to the left once airborne. Ultimately the uncorrected configuration caused a loss of control of the aircraft. The checklist used by the pilot did not contain a specific check for the trim tab position before takeoff. The investigation was hindered by the lack of data from the cockpit voice recorder, which had stopped working on a previous flight.[note 1] Furthermore, the weight of the aircraft at takeoff exceeded its maximum takeoff weight, but this factor was not determined to be a contributing factor to the crash.[1][15] In September 2021, it was reported that the pilot failed a proficiency test two years prior to the crash.[16]" You were correct on the weight being a non factor, as well as the landing gear. But fuel filter issues? Causing the slip and yaw? Either way, as he's approaching take off speed, the plane is essentially flying on the ground and he should have recognized whatever issue the plane was experiencing before he took off. The plane pulling strongly to the left? One engine not getting enough RPMs? He should've aborted the take-off. At least he had gravity keeping him in a somewhat straight line. Would've been a headache to his passengers, or whatever his reasoning was for not aborting, if had. But they'd be alive. That he failed a proficiency test two years prior? Not a good sign. Maybe he had a bad case of get-there-itis that overrode his judgment. So yeah, you may be doing well at 67, but the "don't stop me from being stupid, I know what I'm doing" isn't reserved for 25 year old hot shots. I still standby age being a big factor (just like it's a factor when a young pilot does stupid things). Experience doesn't make you better, good experience does. Otherwise you're just as likely developing bad habits with "experience".

@awittypilot8961

Жыл бұрын

Rudder trim set to full deflection would be very hard to miss.....Plus...trim would be off to the right if anything for a =normal take off. Either way, unless he had super weak legs, he should have been able to overcome with pedals. I would not be surprised one bit to find a partially plugged fuel filter that REDUCED the power of the left motor. Still running but not making enough power to overcome the yaw. It was only 12 seconds....one little mistake can easily be deadly. Also notice...the pilot was not the guy that trimmed the rudder to full deflection. I would guess that was done in maintenance and not set back to center and the pilot missed it. No one looks at rudder trim if you're the last guy flying the plane. My bet is on fuel partial starvation/loss of power. He was heavy but no so heavy it shouldn't have flown...but on one motor? Heavy made it slow to take off and he had no runway left to abort. Pilot error? probably but I do NOT believe age was a factor

I've discovered and watched a couple of your videos today. Love them so far. I'm just learning to fly (too late for the RAF for me but at least I can fly for fun). I'm not completely fearless but watching your crash and turbulence videos are really good for understanding and minimising risk - Who'd have thought a simple rudder trim error and being slight overweight could be so catastrophic. Keep up the good work. And good luck with your career

@CuriousPilot90

Жыл бұрын

Thank you so much Hannah, and good luck too! 🙂 I was thinking earlier about this, but this incident in particular always reminds me to double/triple check the trim before takeoff. It’s one of the sad but amazing things about aviation that everyone should be learning from everyone’s mistakes and something good still comes out of something tragic.

@anthonysmith3851

Жыл бұрын

Likely it was the overweight situation that prevented the pilot from overcoming the trim tab error which induced a "slip" condition. A slip causes a drastic loss of airspeed and an airplane then stops flying. I am a retired Captain and that is my guess. BTW Curious Pilot you are to be commended on the great photorealistic CG work. It is nothing less than spectacular.

@MrZeissOne

Жыл бұрын

Actually, 240 kg over gross can't really be called "slightly" Overweight. That's nearly 500lbs over, and the pilot had to have known that. Sorry to say it, but I'm not seeing anything here but pilot error/negligence. One wonders If the pilot was coerced into accepting the weight, As well as, possibly a balance violation.

@moiraatkinson

Жыл бұрын

@@MrZeissOne agreed. I was about to say more or less the same thing. I wonder if 7,000+ hours in general aviation (or is this classed as commercial?) can make someone complacent? It shows the value of checklists (as long as you do them!). I’ve watched a lot of large aircraft disasters where experienced pilots forgot to extend the flaps or crashed into a mountain when EGPWS warnings started because they didn’t stow the speed brakes. You wouldn’t believe anyone could do these things but it’s happened more than once.

@MrZeissOne

Жыл бұрын

@@moiraatkinson I think often it's a lot like sex. The pressure of unreason expectations, especially with time constraints leads to failure to perform and inability to keep the equipment aloft. Here, the failure to get it up and keep it aloft is catastrophic, not simply embarrassing and disappointing. 🥺

Great content! Thank you.

Finishing up on my PPL, one thing I learned, is a good pilot is always learning..great insructual video, extremely tragic. Which is why the preflight is so important, this could have easily been avoided

Very sad about the loss of life and the drama caused to family and friends, I have learned from this to take your time to go thru all the necessary checklists and inspections outside and inside the aircraft, sad to learn this from a tragedy!

Excellent video. All facts, no rambling. Very professional. Sorry for the loss of life that day. 😔

Thanks for that 🤙🏻

Just found you, subscribed!

Keep up the good work😀👍

@CuriousPilot90

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks 😁

This King Air crash is remarkably similar to the King Air crash at Addison Texas airport that l saw recently. Thanks, great job on your video. Subscribed !

I fly a King Air 350 and even with the more powerful engines it doesn’t require anywhere near full rudder trim to trim out the forces. Pushing the rudder yourself takes a lot of force. That means with full deflection… the rudder forces are probably close to double that of single engine. Always check your trims. I run mine through all the way and then centralize them during the preflight.. and check them again during after starts. There are three detents on the scales. They should be at 9, 12, and 3 o’clock. You can even check this at night with no lights.

This looks like an almost duplicate of the Kings Air crash in Adison, Tx. How peculiar. But a very good and precise presentation! I think I'll subscribe. (forgive the sneeze) LoL.

@CuriousPilot90

Жыл бұрын

Thanks! I guess it shows how easily it can be done when you’re not giving it your full attention.

We had a similar King Air crash in Texas a few years ago. Engine failure then rollover crash within seconds.

The rudder trim tab should have been overcome by pilot input on the pedals and the yaw damper. Considering the rudder trim tab input was not overcome by the pilots and yaw damper - it seems the pilots might try to overcome the rudder with the ailerons. This would create “ slip “. Slip effect would create loss of altitude along with drag from the gear being down not allowing the aircraft to lift from acceleration.

@pietervaness3229

Жыл бұрын

WELL STATED ... GOOD POINT X THANK YOU. X CAPT. van ESS.

@Bartonovich52

Жыл бұрын

That’s not how a yaw damper works… and if the gear wasn’t pulled up you can be sure the yaw damper wasn’t engaged (usually it’s done through 400 feet). A yaw damper dampens yaw.. it doesn’t prevent it. You can’t just have an engine failure and expect the yaw damper to apply the correct rudder inputs… it only applies inputs to prevent Dutch roll. Also you can’t just overcome the rudder trim. Full rudder trim would likely be double the forces you’d encounter with an engine out.

@m.f.m.67

Жыл бұрын

Yep. More rudder, less aleron. Easier said than done as any sim flight will show.

@chrisgrose1878

Жыл бұрын

Being cross-controlled induces a lot a drag. He may have been using ailerons to correct for the yaw. As stated in the other comments, loss of energy from being cross-controlled, gear down, overweight, plus maybe density altitude, left too little energy left to fly.

Why was the rudder trim set full left? Obviously the aircraft was okay during previous flight. Was that investigated. However the pilot should have checked. But it's odd that trim was left in that condition?

@gusmc01

Жыл бұрын

That's my question too If it was from a previous flight, what would have happened for them to have to set the trim all the way in one direction? I wondered if it was possible it got bumped by a passenger's leg?

It’s hard to imagine that the high time pilot did not pick up on the rudder pressure the second the plane started down the runway ??? Both my feet are pushing on the pedals constantly just to my little 172 straight !! ??? And left hand on the yoke is going to tell me exactly where the elevator trim is !!

Terrible loss of life. I am learning safety lessons from these videos.

I knew one of the passengers aboard this flight… His name was Glenn Garland, former CEO of the company I worked for in the US called CLEAResult. Although I only met and spoke with him on one occasion. It was clear he was a keen listener.

@davecruz9893

Жыл бұрын

Whats your point... ?

@flyonbyya

Жыл бұрын

Point of recognition What’s your point pin Dick ?

@flyonbyya

Жыл бұрын

Pin Dick Cruz !

@Bartonovich52

Жыл бұрын

His point is that he knew one of the passengers aboard this flight… His name was Glenn Garland, former CEO of the company he worked for in the US called CLEAResult. Although he only met and spoke with him on one occasion. It was clear he was a keen listener.

@Heart2HeartBooks

Жыл бұрын

@@davecruz9893 Maybe he should have been a Keen talker and told that pilot that his trim needed adjusting?

Great video, well presented. One note, don’t think the Swiss cheese model applies. The rudder trim was set incorrectly, and further missed three times during normal checklist execution. Correcting this one error would most likely have prevented this accident. Being overweight was also an issue, but likely the aircraft would have flown, but not performed as expected. Normally, the Swiss cheese model implies a series of correct decisions that collectively produce disaster.

So sad that the passengers lost their lives over the pilot not going through his check list.

@jerryeinstandig7996

Жыл бұрын

her should be fired forthwith

@MrStringybark

Жыл бұрын

As soon as I heard the pilot's age was 67 I shook my head.

@trungson6604

Жыл бұрын

Agree. Furthermore, this pilot is completely incompetent in another aspect, because he should have aborted the takeoff when he should have detected the strong out-of-trim condition on the yaw axis. He no doubt had to apply a lot of input into the rudder pedals to keep the plane on the runway, so the unavoidable thing to do would be to stop the takeoff run in order to re-trim the aircraft or to investigate the cause of severe out-of-trim condition before taking-off again. This should be an instinctive reflex that requires no thinking at all. If the aircraft doesn't feel normal...abort the takeoff.

@awittypilot8961

Жыл бұрын

@@MrStringybark Ok genius....you ever fly with a young snot nosed pilot that thought he knew everything? I'm 67 and flying jets and helicopters....would you rather fly with someone that knows wtf he's doing or someone that THINKS they know?

@awittypilot8961

Жыл бұрын

@@trungson6604 Were you there? Were you the guy in the right seat? You have NO ide what you're talking about. The pilot had 2500 hrs in that airplane...he was NOT incompetent. Do you have aby idea how long the runway was or if there was time to stop and abort? Oh that's right...I forgot...God took a break today and left his responsibilities with you....always an expert right there flying an armchair thinking they have all the answers

A very good video! I’m pleased to find this channel again. It makes a change to hear about accidents in smaller planes - in fact sadly, you should never run out of material because accidents in GA planes are increasing, unlike commercial flying which keeps getting safer. Would a trim all the way to the left have been visible on a walk around? Just wondering.

@fugginrambo

Жыл бұрын

Yes you'd definitely be able to see that

@moiraatkinson

Жыл бұрын

@@fugginrambo many thanks

@davidpoulin6961

Жыл бұрын

Great question. It’s possible it was neutral during the walk around and only became deflected during the checklist procedure performed afterwards. We will never know what actually happened but perhaps the pilot became distracted by a px or radio call while performing the checklist. I believe some carriers require a checklist to be restarted from the top if there is an interruption.

@moiraatkinson

Жыл бұрын

@@davidpoulin6961 thank you! Yes I’ve heard about restarting checklists from the beginning after an interruption as well.

@petewerner4597

7 ай бұрын

Commercial pilots are required to restart checklists if interrupted. The checklists are also broken into sections so a restart from beginning is not required.

Surely, this is an example of why checklists exist and why aircraft types have maximum take-off weights.

That almost same incident occurred in Addison Airport about 3 years ago, but they lost the left engine on takeoff. Not enough single engine technique was used in time to correct it and it crashed and 10 people died that day. One was a kid in school my son knew. Just going on a family vacation and was heavy as well. Terrible as I used to fly a King Air 200 in the recent past.

@ticenits1926

Жыл бұрын

This is actually one of the reasons I dislike twins, during the most critical phases of flight such as take off and landing an engine failure is almost certain to result in catastrophe, they are running at maximum power producing maximum torque and maximum asymmetric thrust. It's just too much to overcome. The only value they offer is when flying over hazardous terrain which is easily mitigated by not flying over hazardous terrain

@MikeM275

Жыл бұрын

@@ticenits1926 When training for my multi I flew a King Air....including single engine. A King Air takes a LOT of leg muscle to fly single engine! My instructor was giggling as I was struggling...lol

@Vladdy89

9 ай бұрын

@@MikeM275 Did you turn off one of the engines right on takeoff?

@MikeM275

9 ай бұрын

@@Vladdy89 No you would never do that in training! ALL twins are certified for single engine takeoff though. It is harder to control obviously, but all twins can take off on one engine. If you have at least medium skill level.

@MikeM275

9 ай бұрын

@@ticenits1926 Pretty much everything you said here is incorrect. Twin engine taking off and landing single engine does NOT almost "certain to result in catastrophe" that is an absurd statement. ALL twins are certified to take off (and land) single engine. Yes the pilot must have at least medium skill level but s/e does NOT mean catastrophe! As to your ridiculous statement of the "The only value they offer is when flying over hazardous terrain which is easily mitigated by not flying over hazardous terrain" .... too stupid to respond to. You do realize large cities and outlying areas as you vector in, go to hold at times, or get into the pattern you can be over populated areas sometimes 15-30 minutes. Sometimes it's better to say nothing....

GenAv VFR pilot here and I watch a lot of aviation vids. Content aside, I like this vid because its narrated but an actual human and not some monotonous AI voice.

Didnt he notice left pull as he was gathering speed down the RW?

@wattage2007

Жыл бұрын

My thoughts exactly. I'm not convinced by the explanation.

Without doubt the initial part of the take of on a propellor drive twin is a critical time. It seems likely to me that the problem here, despite being overweight and badly our of trim, was pilot incapacitation. It would be interesting to know what the accident repot said.

@flyingwithsol

Жыл бұрын

Hi Tom. I read the report and there was no evidence of any medical issue (not already identified and rectified) or other incapacitation. Hopefully this link to the report works www.atsb.gov.au/publications/investigation_reports/2017/aair/ao-2017-024

How did the Beechcraft B200 King Air become overloaded when there were only 4 passengers? The Beechcraft B200 King Air has the capability of 13 passengers and 2 air crew.

@jeffgarmon1

9 ай бұрын

Not sure. If they all brought their golf clubs, that would account for extra weight.. but certainly not overloaded. Good question though.

I haven't flown the KingAir for over 30 years, but I do remember that if this pilot exceeded maximum takeoff weight with 4 passengers then that's no mean feat!! For the love of God I've no idea why the rudder trim would be wound to full deflection! The B200 KingAir I flew in the early 1990's even had rudder boost (to reduce rudder forces needed in case of an engine failure). The rudder boost was checked before first flight each day and a full rudder trim setting would have been apparent. Also the rudder trim is easily visible, so coupled with blatantly sloppy or non existent checklist procedures I'm not surprised at the tragedy this flight became.

@Bartonovich52

Жыл бұрын

Rudder boost is independent of rudder trim. You’re doing your runup static and you’re feeling for the rudder to be pulled to one side or the other as you reduce engine power on the same side. The trim has little to no forces on it because the plane isn’t moving.

Would you notice an offset trim during the 'walk-around'?

@Heart2HeartBooks

Жыл бұрын

that is what I was thinking. He did 2 walkarounds yet he was in a hurry to take off and missed that.

Checklist problem. The pilot is fully at fault for this incident. Even being overweight by 1,000 lb. The plane is more than capable taking off and flying correctly but it must be trimmed properly especially on takeoff. Or at Landing. The two most dangerous times is the transition from ground-to-air and from air-to-ground. He had to have been suffering a lot of issues trying to keep the plane straight going down the runway. So why he even rotated the aircraft is still beyond me.

I agree with viewer, pilot would've noticed rudder trim during take off itself while on the ground roll. 2nd, 5 feet off the ground pulls hand you push nose down, reduce throttle and land immediately even if 3/4 down runways. Taking it to the air with flaps set & Gear down & extended is crazy. If he decides to continue the Drill is mixture, props & throttle set full then flaps up/ gear up. Bank into good engine then adjust rudder & airleron trim as needed to relieve pressure etc Or reduce throttle on right engine a bit to relieve of servere yawing effect. Identify & verify to feather engine only if you see engine gauges showing one engine not producing theust

whether or not the pilot "did the hecklist" is irrelevant.. we don't know really if they did or did not do a check list. Regardless the first step in the event of an engine failure, this instance the airplane yawed to the left as if the left engine failed, (I'm not buying the rudder trim setting either) the first step in the appearance of a yaw to the left or right indicating loss of power on that side is "positive rate gear up, maintain directional control", of which is rudder input! If your stepping on a rudder is not enough then rudder trim is appropriate, we don't know the pilots may have turned the rudder trim the wrong way. the 528 lbs over wt is also irrelevant, it is 4% of gross wt, for a King Air 200. Why is the pilot uttering over the radio mayday..? What is that going to do.? Fly the damn airplane. The airplane was flyable if he had maintained directional control and raised the landing gear... the first two memory items for just such an instance. There are no less than 4 similar King Air crashes around the time of this crash. Wichita KS, King Air 200; 5 fatal. Long Beach CA King Air 200; 5 fatal and the Addison TX King Air 350 crash, 10 fatal. All of these crashes the airplane yawed to the left, ultimately stalled and crashed either into a building or on airport property. All 4 of these cases the landing gear was extended at impact. All of these cases the airplane was flyable regardless of 4-5% over gross in this case and the Addison TX crash and this crash. All of these cases the airplane could have landed strait ahead with remaining runway and a crippled airplane. The real question is why did the trained experienced pilots (Long Beach is the exception the pilot fabricated his experience to get the insurance policy) in all of these cases did not do ANYTHING after rotation, which is also a problem, lets say got the airplane into the air and did nothing to resolve what was going on with the airplane..? I read the report from the Aussie version of NTSB and they pointed to the broken rudder trim cable as evidence of rudder trim out of place. Even if the rudder trim was all the way over one way or the other, a glance will tell you the engines power output, if they are both running and you step on the rudder to no avail the next action is start twisting the rudder trim knob (not on the checklist), of which this individual could have done and in the wrong direction, maybe this individual was dyslexic. We don't know. The airplane flew in the night before, he was the only guy flying it. There is no reason for rudder trim to be all the way over one way or the other. This speaks to training and it also speaks to overly checklist centric direction in the cockpit being pushed so hard by the FAA EASA and the Aussies. You can't do anything without a checklist telling you what to do. I would submit, you need to flow a King Air, they are simple machines. Then use the check list to review after completion of the flow The problem is you are probably never going to have a text book emergency, so the check list won't tell you what to do. you have to have enough experience and knowledge to react to what you have and solve the problem. Use the checklist to learn the machine, flow it after and the checklist to verify things were done. I know this sounds like blasphemy. I can do a complete run up on King Air 350, 200, 100, 90 by flowing it and know everything is done and set properly and not pick up a checklist. I'll need the check list (QRH) for speed bug settings and balance field length had other abnormalities that might come along. THat's it. Fly the damn airplane.

My question is: Why was the rudder trim set all the way to the right prior to takeoff? Was it due to conditions on the previous flight? Was it a maintenance issue? Did an unauthorized person enter the aircraft on the ground prior to flight? All these questions could be answered and negated simply by using the checklist. There is no need to rush it.

😢checklist,checklist,checklist!!

Surely the left trimmed rudder problem would've been noticed during the takeoff roll?

Wow it sounded like the little things brought this aircraft to a sad end.

Yeah I was on qf1 crash and survived I was on the double deck and we thought it could blow up

Excellent analysis. Clearly explained. Thanks for this video. Basically the pilot failed in his pre-flight checks. Fully culpable.

The crispest, brightest graphics I've seen in a flight video~!

even so the trim was set incorrectly. full right rudder should have been enough to maintain a flyable aircraft if it had the correct weight ?

@grantofat6438

Жыл бұрын

If you manage to realize within 12 seconds that this is the problem.

I understand how the full rudder trim caused the Yaw and likely the crash. What I don't understand and scratching my head over is that Kingair with full fuel and only five people onboard should have been well under gross weight?

I would have thought the extended takeoff roll would have been warning to abort the takeoff.

Just subscribed but please try to make your videos a little longer because not every accident can be fully covered in ten or twelve minutes. Well done!

It probably took him longer than he was in the air to diagnose the trim problem.

In what flight configuration would you use that much rudder trim?....assuming it was left in that position from the previous flight.

@wattage2007

Жыл бұрын

Wouldn't they have noticed the plane pulling to the left all the way through their takeoff roll?

Who set max rudder trim ? Such a terrible accident and perhaps we can put it down to human factors. It shows why the check list is so important to adhere to.

6:30 There is also a confusion factor. When the airplane does something unexpected there is a moment when the pilot is startled, then he startles trying to figure out what is going on. Why is the plane not doing what is expected. The first problem the pilot would have considered was engine failure. He may or may not have realized his engine was fine, but what to consider after that? This pilot reacted like someone who was unpracticed dealing with emergencies.

I think high time pilots tend to get complacent, they get too comfortable and let their guard down.

@jszlauko

Жыл бұрын

I think it's an example where having some degree of nervousness comes in handy. As a student pilot flying solo, I felt that the small amount of nervousness I had kept me on top of things and forced me to adhere to the checklists and be super aware of what's going on.

@ianchandley

Жыл бұрын

I call it “The Arrogance of Experience….”

Do we know for sure when the trim was set? (I.e. via onboard data) Perhaps he set it to counteract something else he was was dealing with in the heat of the moment

This is not the only King Air that crashed because of this.

It's rarely one thing.... I see a few things going on here. Trim fully deflected and overweight are indeed fatal. But..there are warnings during the ground roll that should have caused a competent Pilot to abort the takeoff. The old saying they taught me at Ft Rucker: "if it ain't right on the ground...it rarely gets better in the air". Takeoffs are optional...but landings are mandatory.

Good vids

@CuriousPilot90

2 жыл бұрын

Thanks 👍🏼😁

Interesting

I have flown upon a King Air on more occasions than I can count and it is a wonderful aircraft. That being said, when and if you are not personally behind the controls, you are always at the mercy of whomever is and in this case it appears that the pilot failed to perform his essential duties

I figured she was over-grossed in weight... never considered trim. Interesting coverage. I would like to see more nonfatal accidents, too.

You would have thought there would have been some sort of alert or alarm indicating the severely yawed control.

Even with 7,000 hours, thinking you've seen it all and know it all... ALWAYS perform checklist.

Overweight with 4 passengers and 1 pilot? Damn, those golf bags were heavy.

I can't see how a King Air could be classified as "overweight" with only pilot and 4 x passengers. These planes are registered as up to a 12 seater (11 in the cabin plus one in co-pilot seat). I used to fly in them regularly out of Alice Springs with full passenger load plus freight and a decent fuel load given the distance to the mine site was approx. 550km and the plane was not re-fuelled on site for the return leg. Essendon to King Island is a much shorter distance (about 250km) so a much smaller fuel load would be required. A good report though, even if I disagree with you on the "overloaded" status.

Beechcraft 390 has a crash on Elmina,Malaysia 6 passanger and 2 crew from Langkawi,malaysia to Subang airport,malaysia and 6 passanger and 2 Crew crash and 1 car drivers and motorcycle died 😢

Who left it full left trim? What possible scenario would justify leaving it like that?

Tasmania is part of Australia.The flight was from Victoria to Tasmania.

That plane was King Air B200 not a King Air 350I which is shown in the video.

Major issues with private fights some pilots neglect weight distribution, max acceptable placement of cargo items, very critical mistakes

Wow!

I live just around the corner from this airport, I believe I was at school this day and I remember my dad telling me about how he was in the kitchen and a bang shook the whole house. Then he saw black smoke

They should put some kind of device on the rudder trim so when the aircraft lands and everything is shut down the rudder trim goes into a safe default setting.

It seems like the design engineers would have a trim tab light on the panel like most aircraft, even LSAs and experimentals have those indicators.

So many accidents just bring us back to the basics. A weight and balance for each flight is mandatory, and checklists minimize our human flaws. I doubt that in low, slow, and dirty configuration that full right rudder inputs on a King Air can counter full left trim rudder. We tend to be more relaxed with take-offs than landings; we shouldn't be.

@jszlauko

Жыл бұрын

And if anything, the takeoff is more critical than the landing, as a proper landing would have you high enough where if the engine(s) quit, you could still make it to the runway. But in taking off, you've got low altitude and the runway is behind you!

Man u r doing great. Plz make a detailed video on the communication system. What freq. Are used and how to use the radios. I have so many questions that I just do not know how to ask. Thanks my friend.

@CuriousPilot90

2 жыл бұрын

Interesting thank you. I could look into doing 'How to' videos as a side series, maybe coming in the future!

@kg-Whatthehelliseventhat

2 жыл бұрын

@@CuriousPilot90 Just an idea... it would be great if you could get people ( I know I would) to all play a flight sim at the same time and teach us how to "fly" using the sim. You could record everything and post our learning and mistakes as we go. I know of a YT'er who plays a sim with other people but it is silly and they are messing around. I believe there are people who would appreciate the content and who want to learn but may not be able. I live in Japan now and Komatsu airport is 1 hour away. I do not drive yet so it is not an option for me to go to school or work there at this time. I could imagine a flight sim school and if it created content for you that would be amazing!!!

Did you reboot, before the crash?

Any high-time King-Air pilots out there? I only have a few hundred hours in the King Air but many thousands in various jets. I was Flight Safety trained in the King Air but don't remember the rudder forces. I do know that in light to medium jets, when I suspected an engine failure I jammed in full rudder and that was enough. My question is whether full opposite rudder with the pedal would overcome the trim setting in this case. I just don't remember the rudder forces of my training. Another thing is that while over the years I did a lot of training on runaway elevator trim which would end with full nose up elevator trim (and sometimes my knee pushing on the yoke to keep the nose down until I got slowed down and found the circuit breaker) I never trained in the sim with full rudder trim. Any ideas out there?

My question would be who would have trimmed the rudder fully left ?

@m.f.m.67

Жыл бұрын

Exactly! Can think of no scenario where the trim would be set all the way over. Somebody screwing around in the cockpit before flight?

@kickedinthecalfbyacow7549

Жыл бұрын

If they were practicing engine failure on the previous flight

Why was trim set full rudder?

I think the weight was the main issue, rudder trim, even if fully to one direction, can be countered by adding opposite rudder.

@Bartonovich52

Жыл бұрын

Unlikely. If you’ve ever flown a King Air single engine you know that the rudder input required is considerable.. but the rudder trim needed to trim out the forces is nowhere near full deflection. Fighting against a miss trimmed rudder is likely double the forces of single engine… with an older pilot who’s likely out of shape with poor joints.

I was driving on the adjacent freeway when the KingAir crashed...huge mushroon plume and fireball on impact. All on board had no chance of survival. The passengers died because the pilot was complacent...unforgivable 😡

I can't imagine why the rudder trim was set that way anyway. I've never ever needed full trim on any aircraft in any situation.

@jszlauko

Жыл бұрын

I was thinking the same thing! But, is it possible on a previous landing, there was so much crosswind that a full rudder trim in one direction was needed to overcome it? I'm just guessing here, as I've never flown a twin-engine plane before.

Why was the trim wheel fully deflected in the first place ??

@rws0010

Жыл бұрын

Exactly.

@andyb.1026

Жыл бұрын

Because the previous pilot hadn't reset it , during after flight shutdown !

@ki8um119

Жыл бұрын

Preflight check failures

I'm not a pilot but have some experience. Someone correct me but It would seem to me that with trim offset so much it could still be overcome by use of opposite Rudder, at least long enough to gain flight speed and figure trim out?

@grantofat6438

Жыл бұрын

That requires him to instantly realize that the problem is a full left rudder trim. He didn't even have 12 seconds to figure that out. He had enough trouble trying to get the thing off the ground.

Which simulator are you using?

I don't have King Air time, but I'm surprised that the pilot couldn't overcome the full left trim with his leg. Also, he was 500 lb over gross. This would have resulted in diminished climb performance. With the landing gear still extended it would also effect climb. I wonder if the outcome would have been different if the plane wasn't overloaded and if the pilot had pulled the gear up?

@Bartonovich52

Жыл бұрын

I have King Air time. About 3500 hours of it. Single engine in a King Air requires a ton of force. Something that lots of pilots struggle with (see Addison TX crash). The amount of rudder trim needed to trim out those forces is around half deflection. So with full deflection… you’re looking at probably double the force required for single engine. Few people are able to do that.

That's just bizarre. Why would the rudder trim be pegged all the way to the left? There would be no reason for that. Maybe maintenance personnel did some flight control checks and didn't put it back into neutral. The pilot had ample opportunity to confirm all this with the checklist, and also with the TWO walk arounds that he did, but he failed to discover it. I wonder if the pilot could've noticed the trim tab on the rudder deflected and not in its neutral position during his walk arounds. Sometimes, pilots just go through these walk arounds as routines and don't really pay careful attention to what they're really seeing. Complacency kills.

There was a similar crash and result at Marine City, Michigan. A skydive operation. The only cause that remained unresolved in that crash that I know of was , I believe,, (I could be wrong) one of the prop blades was never accounted for. To this day, it , the blade, may be stuck in a bog in the forest in the surrounding areas. What was the final determination,,? was the missing blade finally accounted for?

Man, CGI has some real eye candy nowadays. And, yes, it's never just one thing that leads to a disaster.

Nearly identical aircraft and circumstances as N534FF, a King Air 350 that crashed at KADS.

We flew a little Champ. Always used the check list. One of group was an ex RCAF instructor pilot He always used the check list also

could the overweight condition also affect the moment of the aircraft?

My family owned a 350i. The most reliable and comfortable turboprop plane out there. This pilot really screwed up a plane that is hard to screw up.

Wow, you'd think there would be some system that could warn you at startup that the trim is engaged. My car sure lets me know when my seat belt is not fastened or if a door is ajar.

Eerily similar to the King Air crash in Texas in 2019

So many ask why there isn't some system or protocol to prevent an aircraft from taking off with improper trim. Well, there IS such a system. It's called a preflight checklist.